Sexual Compromise & Support

[Laughmore]

1 hour ago, EmeraldIce said:

There's no need to be ashamed of desiring her, and even if she doesn't desire you in the same way, it doesn't mean that she doesn't desire you in other ways. Desire can mean wanting to spend time together, wanting to cuddle, wanting to come to you for comfort. To a lot of people, those things are very real emotional needs and build connection way more intimately than sex does.

I appreciate you for sharing this. I'm not remembering this often or well enough, at least when we're not with each other. There's still a major chunk of conversation we haven't had yet, mostly me being transparent about the frequency of my frustration and how it has recently seeped into every corner of my mind. I'll sometimes look at her while my soul just lurches with rejection while she's aloof and safe from that sort of thing, and I think to myself... "That must be nice." I remember being with partners I wasn't quite so attracted to, and lived that comfortable neutrality towards sex. I would turn myself off now if I could. We both are starting individual therapy soonish and hopefully I can learn to attenuate this at least a bit.

 

I think she sees me as sex-obsessed but it's not like this for me when I'm with another sexual partner with whom we're both welcome to initiate. I'm trying not to let the frustration make me weird (seeing everything through a perv lens) and it's taking a stupid amount of energy just to fake it. I'm not acting like the person she initially fell in love with, and while we were sexually active. I don't know how to impress on her how much the acceptance I felt at the time mattered. Too much is assumed to be fixable with incoming therapy.

So much of this feels like dead-relationship-heartbreak, and I'm supposed to be faithfully waiting. Maybe she'll desire me sexually someday. I sound stupider the more I talk about it.

Edited August 22, 2022 by Laughmore
grammar

[learning2bme]

3 hours ago, Laughmore said:

I'm working through this thread and I'm glad its here. My partner is demi, I'm stupidly sexual. We moved in together extremely fast during our sexually active honeymoon phase. I find myself ashamed of how often I'm aroused and desire her, and maybe she'll see me little bit like that that someday.

 

It's simpler in my head if I assume things will be as they are, and the hope + frustration is not an experience I would recommend to anyone. I don't know if I'm in a courting phase or if we're slowly distilling sexual acceptance. God, the maybe. Being single is way easier. I love her though. F.

I am the asexual partner. Just discovered this a few months ago I always just thought I was "broken". My husband and I have discussed my asexuality. I gave him several of the FAQ to help him understand better. We are working on compromise and I do think we will figure out the sex part. I love him and show affection but I have never and never will experience sexual desire for him. I told him that. I told him he deserves to be with someone who will find him hot and want to jump him...lol. But seriously, I am the one worried about him never having that. My biggest fear is that he will eventually grow to resent me for being asexual. Being single might be easier?? 

[Guest]

On 8/22/2022 at 3:46 PM, Laughmore said:

Maybe she'll desire me sexually someday. I sound stupider the more I talk about it.

Uhhh… well… you said it, not me 😉

 

I’m sorry if I missed this in one of your other posts, but are the two of you married? The post before this one didn’t sound like that was the case. 

[Laughmore]

@HiddenKS hah no we've been together a few months, mostly living together. If I could do it all over, things wouldn't have moved so fast. We were both pretty keen on making sure we'd completely attracted the other and compromised transparency about needs and the nature of our sexualitites, and how each of our trauma plays into it. But here we are. It's been a pressure cooker that has taught us a lot about ourselves. Two dummies in love.

[Guest]

11 hours ago, Laughmore said:

@HiddenKS hah no we've been together a few months, mostly living together. If I could do it all over, things wouldn't have moved so fast. We were both pretty keen on making sure we'd completely attracted the other and compromised transparency about needs and the nature of our sexualitites, and how each of our trauma plays into it. But here we are. It's been a pressure cooker that has taught us a lot about ourselves. Two dummies in love.

Oh man… I can’t tell annoying how yo love their lives, but man if I could rewind all the years back, no matter how much I love my wife, if I knew of the asexuality dynamic back then, I’d hope I’d say ‘Let’s just be great friends.’ 
 

Though it at least sounds like the two of you are going the open relationship/ENM/Poly path from the start? 

[intheshadowoferos]

On 8/24/2022 at 7:40 AM, HiddenKS said:

Oh man… I can’t tell annoying how yo love their lives, but man if I could rewind all the years back, no matter how much I love my wife, if I knew of the asexuality dynamic back then, I’d hope I’d say ‘Let’s just be great friends.’ 
 

Though it at least sounds like the two of you are going the open relationship/ENM/Poly path from the start? 

I agree, if I knew that intimacy had an expiration date for my marriage I’d have $aved a ton in lingerie, self help books, and therapy. I’d have still chosen to be his friend, maybe even friends with benefits for a while, but I would not have invested my life in a marriage with him. 

[Laughmore]

@HiddenKS I hear you and I don't want to suffer only to end up with a pile of regret... The barriers to intimacy between my partner and I go beyond the physical and it's tangled up in trauma pretty terribly.
 

If I state, "Long term, I'm going to be unhappy if we're having some (literally any) sort of physical intimacy less than once a week," I'm going to trigger the shit out of them: "I don't want to be valued only for sex." The trauma response is always hyperbolic and in black or white terms. We can't even really have a proper discussion about it before massive healing.

 

When we are having a rare sexually charged moment, it seems like we're on the same page. Outside that while talking about those times, it's like we're from different planets. I'm in love and they are also the object of my desire. If I stated that as such, the term "object" would make them distant for a week at least, though I doubt they'd want me to desire them any less than I do. But also my expressed desire for intimacy is annoying to them. WTF is going on.

[NormalGuy]

 If I searched the world for a new partner all I would want is someone exactly like her but sexual.  I love her. 
 

I thought that I could fix her.  I thought I could get to the root cause of the problem and fix it. I thought I could plan perfect moments and make her desire me again.  I thought if I improved myself things could change.  I thought being my most kind and thoughtful would fix things.  
 

I am so defeated.   I’m now broken too.  Left with scares of rejection.  
 

I want a new start and don’t know how.  

 

[Guest]

I follow Esther Perrel's newsletters. Her advice on how to be erotic, alive, interested has me in tears. She talks to sexuals and sexual couples of course. They too need help. Yet us in mixed relationships, we're in some sort of Dante's inferno or purgatory. I don't know which circle we're in. Our only respite/ relief is that we'll have done our penitence on earth. Shame I'm a non believer.

[Guest]

18 hours ago, NormalGuy said:

 If I searched the world for a new partner all I would want is someone exactly like her but sexual.  I love her. 
 

I thought that I could fix her.  I thought I could get to the root cause of the problem and fix it. I thought I could plan perfect moments and make her desire me again.  I thought if I improved myself things could change.  I thought being my most kind and thoughtful would fix things.  
 

I am so defeated.   I’m now broken too.  Left with scares of rejection.  
 

I want a new start and don’t know how.  

 

@NormalGuy - welcome to this forum, though I’m sorry you’ve had to find us here. There’s a lot of great people going through similar things. 
 

I’d encourage you to make your own thread in addition to this post to share more of your story, 

 

All the best!

[Ceebs]

On 9/7/2022 at 2:31 PM, NormalGuy said:

 I thought I could plan perfect moments and make her desire me again.  

Can I ask... did she feel sexual desire at one point? Or do you think she was pretending, trying to be someone she wasn't?

[Latestarter]

On 8/26/2022 at 12:21 AM, intheshadowoferos said:

I agree, if I knew that intimacy had an expiration date for my marriage I’d have $aved a ton in lingerie, self help books, and therapy. I’d have still chosen to be his friend, maybe even friends with benefits for a while, but I would not have invested my life in a marriage with him. 

I think my husband would probably agree.

[NormalGuy]

On 9/9/2022 at 9:25 AM, Ceebs said:

Can I ask... did she feel sexual desire at one point? Or do you think she was pretending, trying to be someone she wasn't?

During the honeymoon stage of our relationship, I thought she had desire.  Maybe she didn’t.   I was fooled because we had lots of sex for several months.  Then we had kids and intimacy stopped  unless I had to created a magical moment with no kids around.  

 

On 9/9/2022 at 9:25 AM, Ceebs said:

Can I ask... did she feel sexual desire at one point? Or do you think she was pretending, trying to be someone she wasn't?

 

[BeADreamer]

On 8/22/2022 at 3:56 PM, Laughmore said:

I'm working through this thread and I'm glad its here. My partner is demi, I'm stupidly sexual. We moved in together extremely fast during our sexually active honeymoon phase. I find myself ashamed of how often I'm aroused and desire her, and maybe she'll see me little bit like that that someday.

 

It's simpler in my head if I assume things will be as they are, and the hope + frustration is not an experience I would recommend to anyone. I don't know if I'm in a courting phase or if we're slowly distilling sexual acceptance. God, the maybe. Being single is way easier. I love her though. F.

No need to be ashamed. As the ace in a mixed relationship, it still makes me feel good when my partner expresses his desire to me. I’m sex-indifferent (basically, I could take sex or leave it), but I do enjoy myself when my partner wants it. And I feel more inclined to give him that not because I necessarily want or need it myself, but because I sincerely care that his needs are met. While I’m incapable of desiring him sexually, I still deeply desire to make him feel loved. To me, making sure he is getting what he needs is part of that. So yes, he has to initiate (because it won’t cross my mind), but if he does, I do make an effort (without, of course, crossing my personal boundaries). Ironically, he told me he never particularly cared for sex until he met me. But I hope my ace perspective helps you a bit in coming to terms with the reality of who you love. Because I do very much desire and value my partner, just in a different way than most people.

[learning2bme]

On 9/7/2022 at 2:31 PM, NormalGuy said:

 If I searched the world for a new partner all I would want is someone exactly like her but sexual.  I love her. 
 

I thought that I could fix her.  I thought I could get to the root cause of the problem and fix it. I thought I could plan perfect moments and make her desire me again.  I thought if I improved myself things could change.  I thought being my most kind and thoughtful would fix things.  
 

I am so defeated.   I’m now broken too.  Left with scares of rejection.  
 

I want a new start and don’t know how.  

 

I am the asexual in a 33 yr. marriage. I think if both my husband and I were looking for new partners we would chose each other except for the sex!  I tried to fix me going to therapist after therapist. We thought I could be fixed. I am so defeated. We are so defeated. I don't know if he feels broken, but I do know he has felt rejection over and over. I tell him I am not rejecting him, its the sex/intimacy but how do you separate that? I hate that I have hurt him. I want a new start. I don't think he does. I think deep down he wants this to pass. It wont pass. This whole thing sucks. I am sorry you are going through this. I bet she hates it, too. Perhaps feels guilty. Less than. It sucks. We have talked about compromise...but that is tough when we are polar opposites. I hope you find peace!

[Guest]

5 hours ago, learning2bme said:

I want a new start.

@learning2bme - You know your options (from other threads you posted on), so if you want a new start, what do you feel is holding you back from taking it? 
 

Steps to change are definitely difficult whichever option you are trying. What do you feel are the obstacles to do what you would like? 

[learning2bme]

16 hours ago, HiddenKS said:

@learning2bme - You know your options (from other threads you posted on), so if you want a new start, what do you feel is holding you back from taking it? 
 

Steps to change are definitely difficult whichever option you are trying. What do you feel are the obstacles to do what you would like? 

Thank you for these 2 questions. Seems like when I am neck deep in a situation it is so hard to break down the steps and especially to see the barriers. So, your question helped me to take time to reflect. What is holding me back...my first thought is that I do not want to hurt my husband. And that is true. But I thought some more. My husband and I have collaborated on decisions (especially big ones) for decades. I am so used to presenting my idea and then together we discuss and devise a plan to either move forward or not.  I did present my idea (trial separation) to him on Friday. I have an apartment selected and $ to pay. I think I was hoping that he would be ok and maybe even a little relieved. He was very shocked but not upset. He asked me to wait until after the holidays which I feel is fair. 

Obstacles 1) I want him to be OK with my decision. 🤔 2) Fear/shame that I am unwilling to compromise and maybe I am running away by suggesting trial separation.

What I want...I want the wisest person to just tell me what to do...LOL!! 

[Mountain House]

1 hour ago, learning2bme said:

suggesting trial separation.

What are you hoping to learn from the trial?

What are you imagining your husband will learn from the trial?

[anisotrophic]

1 hour ago, learning2bme said:

Obstacles 1) I want him to be OK with my decision. 🤔 2) Fear/shame that I am unwilling to compromise and maybe I am running away by suggesting trial separation.

For the first one I'd say: that's understandable, and sometimes one needs to accept that it's unavoidable. That doesn't mean it isn't painful.

For the second, it's usually better to push yourself towards feeling "guilt" rather than "shame". (Psychology distinguishes between these, and "guilt" tends to be seen as having "healthier" consequences in both individual and interpersonal respects.) What are YOUR values? What did you do, what can you do? If potential actions involve some sacrifice or risk for you, is it reasonable, justified, fair to you as well? Judging your actions rather than your "self". Judging them by your own values, not the judgement of others. There may be multiple values, and they may be at odds (that's often the case when one feels torn between two undesirable paths).

I don't know if that helps, but fear/shame is not a healthy place to be. If you're fearing consequences other than shame, it's valuable to examine those too.

[Guest]

5 hours ago, learning2bme said:

Seems like when I am neck deep in a situation it is so hard to break down the steps and especially to see the barriers.

I hear that! 
 

5 hours ago, learning2bme said:

I want him to be OK with my decision.

What does this mean or look like to you? Is it that he simply accepts the decision you have made? 
 

More importantly though, if he is not okay with it should that actually alter your choice? 

 

5 hours ago, learning2bme said:

Fear/shame that I am unwilling to compromise and maybe I am running away by suggesting trial separation

Do you desire to compromise? When you say ‘trial’ separation, what exactly are you trying? Are you trying divorce on for size or proposing some other arrangement? 

 

In the post I replied to you said you want a new start. I guess I probably should’ve first asked what you meant by a ‘new’ start?
 

I interpreted a new start to be your own clean slate, on your own, but now I’m not so sure. 

 

My apologies that I may have misunderstood your message. I understand these are all difficult topics to bring up, and even more difficult to act on. 
 

All the best. 
 

 

[TheWife11]

@learning2bme Please check out inclusivetherapists.com. I was sorry to read that you had a bad experience with your most recent therapist, but I think a therapist who accepts and validates asexuality could be invaluable for you. 
   Compromise is a part of healthy relationships of course, but you should never have to compromise who you are. If you are asexual and wish to never engage in sex, that’s simply the way it is. You are absolutely allowed to honor that, and your husband is also allowed to desire that. This may mean an incompatibility for the relationship to continue.

  Just know that whatever you decide, you are not the villain. There are no bad guys in your story. Sometimes things just don’t work out, but can still be okay in the end. 

[Guest]

I spent 10 years abroad seeing my husband off and on, but still very much in a supportive relationship. I didn't know about asexuality at the time. And no, it wasn't a trial separation. ( Been married for approx 30 years).

During that time, I was still looking for answers. 

What was glaringly obvious is that we loved each very much and without a suitable replacement it was a lose, lose situation. ( i.e not being fulfilled sexually while losing the best person in my life).

By suitable replacement, I mean having the head space to be open to another deep relationship or a flimsy love affair (I'm the sexual partner).

 

Did being away help? Not sure? 

In a way it made me feel less free.

My husband ached at the thought of loosing me and that in itself was a double edged sword. i.e I cherished the love, security, trustworthiness but it also lay bare the fact that if I had chosen to cut things off that's what I'd be loosing.

And yes, he would have accepted my choice, but oh the angst and turmoil it would have given me.

Beside the knowledge of having thrown away the baby with the bathwater.

 

No advice from me, I'm afraid, just my story.

[learning2bme]

On 10/19/2022 at 9:41 PM, TheWife11 said:

@learning2bme Please check out inclusivetherapists.com. I was sorry to read that you had a bad experience with your most recent therapist, but I think a therapist who accepts and validates asexuality could be invaluable for you. 
   Compromise is a part of healthy relationships of course, but you should never have to compromise who you are. If you are asexual and wish to never engage in sex, that’s simply the way it is. You are absolutely allowed to honor that, and your husband is also allowed to desire that. This may mean an incompatibility for the relationship to continue.

  Just know that whatever you decide, you are not the villain. There are no bad guys in your story. Sometimes things just don’t work out, but can still be okay in the end. 

Thank you so very much for this reply!! I do feel like a villain and know that that is something I need to address. I can't hardly look my husband in the eye. I will check out the therapy option you provided...thank you!!

[learning2bme]

On 10/20/2022 at 4:11 AM, Astutusdomina said:

I spent 10 years abroad seeing my husband off and on, but still very much in a supportive relationship. I didn't know about asexuality at the time. And no, it wasn't a trial separation. ( Been married for approx 30 years).

During that time, I was still looking for answers. 

What was glaringly obvious is that we loved each very much and without a suitable replacement it was a lose, lose situation. ( i.e not being fulfilled sexually while losing the best person in my life).

By suitable replacement, I mean having the head space to be open to another deep relationship or a flimsy love affair (I'm the sexual partner).

 

Did being away help? Not sure? 

In a way it made me feel less free.

My husband ached at the thought of loosing me and that in itself was a double edged sword. i.e I cherished the love, security, trustworthiness but it also lay bare the fact that if I had chosen to cut things off that's what I'd be loosing.

And yes, he would have accepted my choice, but oh the angst and turmoil it would have given me.

Beside the knowledge of having thrown away the baby with the bathwater.

 

No advice from me, I'm afraid, just my story.

Thank you for sharing. I know that I cannot know what is really deep in his thoughts. I very much want him to have a lovely person desire him and I don't think a sex partner would fulfill him. He is such a caring and fun lover. When I was able to "get into it" he had so much joy and it radiated from him. I want that for him. He is a bit OCD/engineer brain, he does not like change. I feel he is sort of lazy. That is why I a trial separation might benefit us both...maybe that would put a fire under his butt to look for a fun companion. I know I can't make decisions for him...and maybe that is what I am telling myself so that I don't feel guilty if I decide to leave. Thank you for your reply and I sure hope you are finding peace and happiness!

[Guest]

On 10/21/2022 at 2:20 PM, learning2bme said:

Thank you for sharing. I know that I cannot know what is really deep in his thoughts. I very much want him to have a lovely person desire him and I don't think a sex partner would fulfill him. He is such a caring and fun lover. When I was able to "get into it" he had so much joy and it radiated from him. I want that for him. He is a bit OCD/engineer brain, he does not like change. I feel he is sort of lazy. That is why I a trial separation might benefit us both...maybe that would put a fire under his butt to look for a fun companion. I know I can't make decisions for him...and maybe that is what I am telling myself so that I don't feel guilty if I decide to leave. Thank you for your reply and I sure hope you are finding peace and happiness!

Thanks 

[Mountain House]

On 10/21/2022 at 6:20 AM, learning2bme said:

That is why I a trial separation might benefit us both...maybe that would put a fire under his butt to look for a fun companion. I know I can't make decisions for him...and maybe that is what I am telling myself so that I don't feel guilty if I decide to leave.

I'm pulling from this what I believe your answers to my questions are. I could be wrong so correct me where needed.

 

Don't expect changes in your husband behavior that he didn't agree to work on. I don't think using a trial separation as a form of relationship pressure is a good idea.

 

I found this and it makes sense to me.

 

In our journey, my wife and I talked about divorce early as it's always an option that either one of us can execute. At one point she wanted what effectively was a trial separation because the conversation was emotional, and she was afraid of what it would feel like to live alone. She told me when and why she was doing this and then booked a room. When she returned less than a week later, she had determined that hell yeah, she can live alone, and our divorce talks became rational conversations vs emotional outbursts.

 

Basically, the bottom two bullets "What Are the Benefits of a Trial Separation?" section.

[ThannaA]

thinking about trying to compromise again in our relationship…

we’ve been doing celibacy and ENM

but now on further reflection it seems my husband might be grey asexual because we have enjoyed it a couple of times both of us

Going back to sexual intimacy seems a little like a barrier to be crossed… We’ve discussed it and the barrier isn’t a hard barrier  anymore… I think we are back to the possibility of experimentation, with the option to stop instead of the ignorant carrying on no matter what which we had before discovering asexual as a concept and a thing

The infrequent cuddling has never been enough for me… But with ENM working very well… I feel selfish to want even more

And my husband feels uncomfortable with having to say no never will the idea of having to say no and letting me down

I’ve told him this isn’t the case but I don’t think he gets it

[Traveler40]

9 hours ago, kamel said:

thinking about trying to compromise again in our relationship…

we’ve been doing celibacy and ENM

but now on further reflection it seems my husband might be grey asexual because we have enjoyed it a couple of times both of us

Going back to sexual intimacy seems a little like a barrier to be crossed… We’ve discussed it and the barrier isn’t a hard barrier  anymore… I think we are back to the possibility of experimentation, with the option to stop instead of the ignorant carrying on no matter what which we had before discovering asexual as a concept and a thing

The infrequent cuddling has never been enough for me… But with ENM working very well… I feel selfish to want even more

And my husband feels uncomfortable with having to say no never will the idea of having to say no and letting me down

I’ve told him this isn’t the case but I don’t think he gets it

Interesting turn of events. It seems good to try intimacy with him without making firm decisions. I only say this as the further I was into celibacy with my ace, the less I wanted to connect in that way with him. Try not to lose that if the desire is there.

 

You should delve into feelings all around on ENM as a touch base since it’s all new anyhow. These changes are happening quickly and his experiences are not yours in these decisions. You two seem to be able to communicate generally well so that’s a plus. 

 

Your post made me look inward. If my husband ever decided ENM was no longer working as a viable alternative to me being celibate, I would move towards divorce. It’s so far beyond sex. It’s majority aspects of my fulfillment in life at stake. 
 

This is not a comfortable position to be in. Sometimes I wonder if he feels there is no choice. (Which, of course, there is.) Deep down I know his preference would be that I opt for a life sentence of celibacy. By nature, he fails to grasp the importance of sex. Sex, for sexuals, is merely a starting line to a million critical connections.
 

I don’t recall my feelings during the celibate years. Thinking back, a numbness had settled in across time. In that state, flushing another year was not much of a thought. Life slipped quickly and “What’s another year” seemed minor. Nowadays, having crossed to the other side, it’s everything to me.

 

One last thought that came to mind was a book by Dr. Seuss, Oh, the Places You’ll Go!:  “The waiting place” is so dark. Many opting for celibacy live in the waiting place. My fear is having our kids end up in that space. Having lived it, I don’t want them stuck there - ever. 

[marius123]

On 11/13/2022 at 9:51 AM, kamel said:

Going back to sexual intimacy seems a little like a barrier to be crossed…

I'm finding this in my relationship at the moment. We don't communicate well about this but the last argument about it was that she'd "rather not", a few months back. It seemed to draw a little line in the sand / a little barrier.

 

In some ways it's been helpful, a realisation that it's not going to happen any more. I was sort of content with this for the time being with the intention of re-evaluating it maybe next year or the year after and deciding what to do for me.

 

Last few days I've been particularly frustrated and I've felt the 'hope' again that something might happen. Time away from the kids, opportunities we don't always have etc. Obviously nothing happened, I didn't raise it for fear of more arguments and upset and I feel a bit crap about the whole thing again.

 

All my fault for not tackling things properly I know ☹️

[Mountain House]

1 hour ago, marius123 said:

I've felt the 'hope' again that something might happen. ... I feel a bit crap about the whole thing again.

It's been two years since I made the agreement with my wife that if we have sex, it will be on her terms. This means that she initiates when she wants sex and also means we may never have sex again.

 

I still get those feelings of hope that something might happen. I've mostly made peace with it because I value that I still feel that way about her. But, yeah, sometimes it does feel like crap, and I get emotional and all of that. It's just a feeling. I know where it comes from, I know what triggers it, I know why I allow it, and it moves along when I remind myself.