The Asexual man

[Marvin800]

It is the way of our society that men and women are supposed to be sexual beings. Indeed an eminent GP told me that "you have to think of yourself as a sexual animal".  I got married some years ago and my wife and i are divorcing. She was married before and he was a sex machine by all accounts but over the years i have come to realise that i not only dislike sex and intercourse but don't need it for my existence and feel liberated by not wanting it. My soon to be ex-wife of course hates me because she is not "getting it" as she is conditioned to it because of the behaviour of her first husband and her two other boyfriends. The point i am making is that asexuality should be regarded as ok and acceptable by a society but our world is sex-mad to the point of obsession. If couples go on a date it is expected that they have to "do it". Why? Surely love and sex are two different things and loving someone or something is about the kindnesses you do to others, trust and fun and laughter whereas sex is a physical act that appears to be compulsory in marriage and cohabitation. This not only puts pressure on the couple to "perform" but sex does not mean that intercourse is about whether someone is good or not and indeed some men and women could be viewed as sexual predators. The other person in the relationship is then put under pressure, being told by society and his/her partner that sex is good for you whether you want it or not. My wife and I certainly had different libidos and she verbally abused me because she wasn't getting "it" but i told her repeatedly that sex doesn't or shouldn't define that person, however that is not how society views relationships. It seems that many couples only marry or get together for "the other" and then there is constant pressure for it throughout the relationship in the same way that couples are also expected to procreate, though many men (including myself) never had any desire to be a Dad. I have heard men brag to me that they are up half the night "enjoying themselves" , in other words having sex and it is not always clear if the other person in the relationship approved of this or went along with it for a quiet life. Shagging to me appears meaningless and if an average couple are supposed to do "it" three times a week, so a couple together for 50 years will have had to have done "it" for 7,800 times and to me it proves nothing, only adding to pressure on the couple, generally the man is expected to initiate it. 

For me, love and sex are two different things and i find it regrettable that society takes such a wonderful view of sex being the golden key to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. I am now in my sixties and feel liberated now from the dictatorship of intercourse in my life. Yes i have been verbally abused and insulted by my wife because i have told her how much i dislike sex and am asexual, not from choice but orientation. I wish more people would state loudly that intercourse is not necessary for lives or even marriage. I think that society and conditioning have a lot to answer for.  

[alto]

I hear you dude.

[Davgin]

Had a similar situation with an old relationship of mine, where sex was wanted more than I was willing to give. I thought at the time that I didn't have a libido but then I discovered AVEN and found a whole new vocabulary which fitted me. 

[Vero Totem]

Bravo, @Marvin800!  Say it louder for the people in the back!

[thylacine]

Yeah, totally.  I'm with yah, man.  Even though I'm not a man - LOL.

[matt-atx]

I agree. And it's nice to hear a man expressing this point of view. 

[Marvin800]

Yes, men are viewed by society as sex machines, though i am sure many are not. Many (not all) are conditioned from a young age, to view girls and women as only fit for one thing. Marriage and relationships are a route for many men to pursue a sexist and misogynist attitude throughout their lives. It is of course the case that many women wish to be mothers and have a strongly maternal instinct and of course that means that they have to indulge in sex, even if they don't enjoy it. Of course many do enjoy it as society conditions them to be sexual animals as a former GP told me and to speak out and criticise that view is seen as odd and "queer" which is what my former wife said. Her first husband could probably perform for England and dropping his trousers was his priority but then so are many other men. I worked with a young woman who was my boss and she was always bragging in the office about being "laid" on one night stands, and i did not think it was right or appropriate for this sort of behaviour in the office. A more senior boss was having sex in his office with a senior woman manager and again this should not have been tolerated.  Sex is not the only thing in this world and there are so many other things that matter rather than physical behaviour- what about love and trust and fun? Who said that sex was fun? I didn't 

[Marvin800]

I also think its totally wrong that relationships are judged on sex alone. That in itself is corrosive, not only does it narrow life down to one thing but it ignores other things like fun and trust and care. I told my wife repeatedly that i did not want to be judged on "that" as i believe i had other skills not related to physical sex. Sex and love and not the same by any means but society values intercourse above all things by some people, more important than health and wellbeing and living itself.  Look how some comedies go on about "that" as the be all and end all of life. As i said in my first email, just because a couple have done "it" thousands of times in a lifetime actually proves nothing, it is more to do with sexual prowess and libido rather than love. Why does society think that couples have to prove they "love" each other by having sex? Sex proves nothing other than physical behaviour and does not prove they are good or bad in any way, all it shows is that they are good in bed and their so-called sexual desires. Couples are conditioned to the compulsory nature of sex in their relationships without any question. A lot of this is down to society and conditioning and various faiths. One religion indicates that if couples do not have intercourse for a certain period then the marriage has to end!.

[Antique]

Marvin,

Thank you for your open an honest remarks. As a female I've always felt that I was nothing more than an object and no longer being in a relationship and knowing and accepting that I am asexual has been very freeing. I have openly discussed with the 20-30 year old young men and women that I know how important it is to know their own sexual appetites and those of anyone they may be seeking to engage in an intimate physical relationship with. Sex will not make a relationship but it can certainly break one ( historical knowledge). As you have so wonderfully stated there is much more to intimacy than just physicality. In my opinion, for what it is worth, I believe the obsession of our culture with sex has kept us from making strides in deep emotional development. Thank you again.

 

 

 

 

[thylacine]

10 hours ago, Marvin800 said:

I also think its totally wrong that relationships are judged on sex alone. That in itself is corrosive, not only does it narrow life down to one thing but it ignores other things like fun and trust and care. I told my wife repeatedly that i did not want to be judged on "that" as i believe i had other skills not related to physical sex. Sex and love and not the same by any means but society values intercourse above all things by some people, more important than health and wellbeing and living itself.  Look how some comedies go on about "that" as the be all and end all of life. As i said in my first email, just because a couple have done "it" thousands of times in a lifetime actually proves nothing, it is more to do with sexual prowess and libido rather than love. Why does society think that couples have to prove they "love" each other by having sex? Sex proves nothing other than physical behaviour and does not prove they are good or bad in any way, all it shows is that they are good in bed and their so-called sexual desires. Couples are conditioned to the compulsory nature of sex in their relationships without any question. A lot of this is down to society and conditioning and various faiths. One religion indicates that if couples do not have intercourse for a certain period then the marriage has to end!.

It is very clear that sex is not love.  I agree.

[Theoryal]

Oh man, I agree with every word, I feel like you do.  I have so many thoughts and feelings about this,  annd... I've written a wall of text.  

 

A relationship is an emotional-mental thing, and when it is a loving relationship it leads to actions that benefit each other.  Actual Love is about giving of your time/effort/resources for the benefit of another.  A romantic relationship shouldn't depend solely on one physical activity together, it should be built on a large number of things as you said - trust, loyalty, respect, cooperation, values, goals, affection, emotions, humor, . . .  

 

While I can understand the idea of wanting to bring physical pleasure to your partner, the impression one gets from the way many people talk about it and especially from movies/shows/books is that people are driven by sexual desire moreso than love - meaning their own apatite for fulfillment, which seems to often take the focus off from the other person onto your own experience.  It just starts looking and sounding pretty selfish, like both people trying to get something from each other, even though I know the Ideal is that you're both trying to satisfy the other.  Media seems to focus a lot on this gut-wrenching 'I want you' sort of feeling, rather than people demonstrating care and respect and truly treasuring the other person.  This is why, personally, a nice snuggly hug feels more loving than sex because generally when people hug there isn't this intense 'I'm getitng my fix' kind of vibe going on, it's a comfortable mutual feeling of 'we like to be near each other'.  

 

There are so many ways to show love and care, sex isn't the only way to connect intimately.  Honestly I don't really understand how physical interaction could be seen as creating a deep relationship - it's all to do with the mental-emotional interaction you have together, do you agree with each other, does conversation flow easily between you, do you find each other interesting, do you empathize and feel with each other, do you understand where each other is coming from idealogially and psychologically, do you have a sense of what each other likes or would prefer, do you make each other laugh, do you bring each other mental peace and happiness, and so forth.  When you have the emotional-mental connection of having a relationship, then physical interaction takes on new meaning and can be one of the ways of demonstrating the intangible idea of caring for one another, but.... I don't see how physical interaction alone could create the actual mental state of cooperation and respect and adoration, because a body is not the same as the attitudes and values the person inside it lives out.  I can hug a person I've never met and I will feel the warm pressure, but that can't make us like the same things and converse easily, in short a hug can't make a friend out of someone, no more can sex make a life-partner.  And yet this seems to be the expectation so often, that 'good sex' is the main indicator of whether a relationship is good or not.  How about feeling inner peace?  How about feeling secure?  How about feeling your heart burst with joy when you see them?  How about laughing together? How about feeling 'flow' when you're working together through the routines and tirals of life?  That's what actually makes a good relationship. 

 

Would I absolutely love to have snuggles and back rubs?  Yes (I thrive off cuddles!).  Do those things reinforce my feeling of closeness and being treasured?  Yes.  Would I leave my husband if he couldn't stand being touched?  NO.  Because my love for him is more than my need for affection.  Would it be hard?  Of course, but it would be worth it to maintain the life we have made together, it would still be worth it for seeing his smile, for hearing his silly jokes, for the reassurance of his know-how and strength in the face of physical hardships and accidents, for the joy of sameness when picking out paint/furniture/art/clothes/music/etc., for his unique quirks that make him him, for the way it feels when we're relating emotionally, for the way our habits work well together, for the atmosphere and attutide of peace and positivity that we make together in our home, and so forth.  There is so much more to our relationship than my insatiable apatite for affectionate touch, and I can live with less, I can cuddle stuffies and wrap myself in weighted blankets if he doesn't enjoy cuddling, I can rub my own neck if he doesn't have any endurance for doing so.  It might not be ideal, but real life is never going to be totally ideal, some sacrifices will always have to be made in relationships with others.   So this is why it is so disturbing to me how many people think it's completely justified to leave their partner if their own sexual desires are not being met.  Is that really truely of more importance?  Can you not feel closeness and joy from other things?  

 

While I can understand people really liking something even if I don't, I feel like there has to be a lot of cultural conditioning going on as well in regards to sex, and that in a different setting sexual people would not be quite so obsessed with, nor so highly value, sex as they do in modern western culture.  I'm not saying they wouldn't want it and wouldn't put in effort to get it, but.... It's really gotten out of hand.  Honestly to me it kind of seems like a cult, even though people wouldn't think of it as a religion, people seem to basically worship sex as the best thing ever, the ultimate goal of life, the source of all maturity, happiness, fulfillment, health, the main thing worth persuing.  The message is so strong that you're worthlss if you're not having sex and loving it, that it verges on dehumanizing in the same way as racism has sometimes done.  It may not be said in so many words, but the idea that you're not quite fully human without being sexually active seems to come through a lot.  

 

Although personally I find sex gross and boring, I don't think it's a 'bad' thing and I don't think people pathetic for liking it (just like I don't think people are wrong for liking hot peppers which I also don't like), but I do think it has been blown way out of proprotion in so many ways:  

 

- as a rite of passage or indication of maturity - while being capable of procreating and hormones raising libido may be related to physical age, many people don't really handle sex responsibly, it seems pretty nonsensical to consider someone 'immature' who hasn't had sex but shows wisdom, responsibility, and respect towards others 

- as a goal in life -  it seems to me that waaay too many teenagers and young adults are so focused on finding a romantic/sexual partner when their attention and energy could be better spent actually figuring out what they want to do with their lives so they might then have a better idea what kind of person they actually want to share it with. It just seems like sex ought to be more like a side-dish to one's primary goals.  

 

- as a measure of personal achievement and fulfillment - Aren't there other activities, causes, or achievements in life that should be recognized as worthwhile and fulfilling without a person having to have a sexual relationship in addition in order to feel like they've got a full life?  Couldn't people respect someone for other things they do and not see them as pathetic or unfulfilled if they don't happen to have a sexual partner?  Surely there are many things that provide a sense of fulfillment.  

 

- as a measure of relationship health - as I already mentioned above, emotional health and the ability to cooperate and show respect and care for one another are much MUCH better indicators of whether you have a good relationship. 

 

- as the thing that's supposed to be the most amazing experience for every person (despite people having different tastes for all number of other things) - maybe sex is just a good experience but not 'The Best' experience for some people, could we be allowed to enjoy say... the rush of skii-jumping, or the decadence of a gormet meal, or the chills evoked by a great piece of music, or the joy of laughter that makes you cry and you just can't stop,  more than sex?  Couldn't it be normal to like some things more than sex even if you do enjoy sex?  What if we stopped building it up and telling people it's supposed to be mindblowing beyond everything else?  I can't help feeling like it sets people up to chase something that isn't really realistic, leading to not finding contentment in their relationships and thus resulting in heartbreak.  I think it should be concerning to our society that there is so much crime related to people trying to get sex and that it should be obvious that too many people need to sort out their priorities better on this subject.   Sex may be a good thing within reason, but I must question the reason of a society that makes it the end-all-be-all while at the same time not holding the natural outcome of this activity - parenthood - in much esteem (like you're supposed to have kids but you're not supposed to actually give up or dial back your single life activities and career to invest in family life because doing kid stuff is considered kind of pathetic).  This subject is just a mess in our culture, if you ask me.  

 

 

 

[Vero Totem]

10 hours ago, Theoryal said:

It just seems like sex ought to be more like a side-dish to one's primary goals.  

I love just about everything you've written in this post, but this statement stands out the most to me.  I love the image that it creates in my mind's eye.

[will123]

On 11/29/2023 at 1:52 PM, Marvin800 said:

It is the way of our society that men and women are supposed to be sexual beings. Indeed an eminent GP told me that "you have to think of yourself as a sexual animal".  I got married some years ago and my wife and i are divorcing. She was married before and he was a sex machine by all accounts but over the years i have come to realise that i not only dislike sex and intercourse but don't need it for my existence and feel liberated by not wanting it. My soon to be ex-wife of course hates me because she is not "getting it" as she is conditioned to it because of the behaviour of her first husband and her two other boyfriends. The point i am making is that asexuality should be regarded as ok and acceptable by a society but our world is sex-mad to the point of obsession. If couples go on a date it is expected that they have to "do it". Why? Surely love and sex are two different things and loving someone or something is about the kindnesses you do to others, trust and fun and laughter whereas sex is a physical act that appears to be compulsory in marriage and cohabitation. This not only puts pressure on the couple to "perform" but sex does not mean that intercourse is about whether someone is good or not and indeed some men and women could be viewed as sexual predators. The other person in the relationship is then put under pressure, being told by society and his/her partner that sex is good for you whether you want it or not. My wife and I certainly had different libidos and she verbally abused me because she wasn't getting "it" but i told her repeatedly that sex doesn't or shouldn't define that person, however that is not how society views relationships. It seems that many couples only marry or get together for "the other" and then there is constant pressure for it throughout the relationship in the same way that couples are also expected to procreate, though many men (including myself) never had any desire to be a Dad. I have heard men brag to me that they are up half the night "enjoying themselves" , in other words having sex and it is not always clear if the other person in the relationship approved of this or went along with it for a quiet life. Shagging to me appears meaningless and if an average couple are supposed to do "it" three times a week, so a couple together for 50 years will have had to have done "it" for 7,800 times and to me it proves nothing, only adding to pressure on the couple, generally the man is expected to initiate it. 

For me, love and sex are two different things and i find it regrettable that society takes such a wonderful view of sex being the golden key to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. I am now in my sixties and feel liberated now from the dictatorship of intercourse in my life. Yes i have been verbally abused and insulted by my wife because i have told her how much i dislike sex and am asexual, not from choice but orientation. I wish more people would state loudly that intercourse is not necessary for lives or even marriage. I think that society and conditioning have a lot to answer for.  

On the first bold that is more or less what a female friend said when I came out to about four years ago. 'There's no problem with me if you're not interested in sex because the world is so over-sexed" We've known each other since we were in our late teens and had a very platonic friendship.

 

On the latter, X2.

[jay williams]

It is great to see guys talking about their "asexuality." The more men who attest that they do not need, desire nor enjoy sex, the better for all!

Too often, I have seen a woman state a belief that all men require sex in a relationship, and asexual women just have to put up with that if a romantic relationship is sought.

Not true!

There are some men who are very compatible with a woman who feels that having sex is NOT "making love" in any kind of sense, except nonsense!     

 

  

[will123]

I've come out to mostly to women I know and I haven't noticed any difference in how they treat me. We're either long time friends or high school classmates that I've kept in touch with.