Jayann Posted February 25, 2004 Share Posted February 25, 2004 My prof is excellent. Several days ago in class, while on the topic of sexual orientation, she cared to throw in, "Oh, and asexuals! People forget about them!" And in my head, I was all, "Yes, they DO! Right ON, sister!" So after class I took a moment to speak to her about it, gave her the url, and hoped she might poke around a little bit. As it turns out, she did just that. And today in class, she drew the triangle shown in our very Info section: Obviously gender attraction and sexual identity are far more complex than our triangle shows, but her point was that seeing it this way offered a step in the way of beginning to view the immense complexities of sexuality, and the huge problems offered by heternormativity. So professor, if you're out there reading this, THANK YOU! :D As a sidebar... All this stuff (my awesome and genuinely interested prof, my meetings with QUAD, planning these talks/workshops) is getting to make me feel pretty empowered. I feel more at ease with who and what I am these days than I think I ever did in the past. There are times when I'm really glad to be out, and have people recognize that I'm different and respect that. I don't necessarily want to become The Campus Asexual (well, one of two, now that we've dragged Josh down into our loathsome pit ;)) because then I suspect I'd be persistently harrassed by the skeptics and the genuinely curious alike. And being as disinclined to socializing as I am, I don't think I'd handle that too well. But still, I do get some pleasure in starting to think, "I don't fit the mythic mold, and I don't want to be oppressed. So I'm not going to let myself be." Link to post Share on other sites
AVENguy Posted February 25, 2004 Share Posted February 25, 2004 Go empowered Julie!! Wish I could say the same thing about my "social construction of woman" prof. The only time she brought up asexuality went a little like Women who did not fit the heteronormative mold of marraige were termed "spinsters," a derogatory term which implied that they were undesirable, asexual and emotionally frigid. When she said this I gave a little "woot woot" and raised the roof. I talked to her after class and we reached something of an understanding, but she didn't seem terribly interested in unpacking the negative stigma around asexuality. More work for me.... Julie it's GREAT that your prof used the model in class. Though if we're gonna drag it up I wonder if we shouldn't alter it to include gendered attraction... Link to post Share on other sites
bard of aven Posted February 25, 2004 Share Posted February 25, 2004 YOu go, Woman! boa Link to post Share on other sites
fluffy_hime Posted February 25, 2004 Share Posted February 25, 2004 Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted February 25, 2004 Share Posted February 25, 2004 Yeah! That's awesome! *Does a little dance for Julie* :D Link to post Share on other sites
aury Posted February 26, 2004 Share Posted February 26, 2004 your professor officially kicks my ass. :twisted: can't wait to take women's studies when i start going to the other school i wanna go to. by the way, what did the people in class say when she brought up asexuality? Link to post Share on other sites
Jayann Posted February 26, 2004 Author Share Posted February 26, 2004 They didn't say anything. Though today when she was drawing the diagram, before she got to the asexual point, she asked what was missing from the homo-bi-hetero continuum, and someone from the class offered, "Asexual?" And in my head, I was all, "OMFG YES. :D" I became aware I was grinning like a dipshit. *is a spaz* Other folks looked somewhat interested. At least they were paying attention. Link to post Share on other sites
aury Posted February 26, 2004 Share Posted February 26, 2004 YAY!!!!!!!!! EDUCATED PEOPLE!!!!!!!!! :D Link to post Share on other sites
JKReagan99 Posted February 26, 2004 Share Posted February 26, 2004 It's great she brought it back up :D :D Congratulations for talking to her :) At one point didn't you say someone else from UConn said they were a online to you, sometime last semester I think, or over break? (that would bring the total up to 3 UConn students currently at Storrs that we know of...) Link to post Share on other sites
Jayann Posted February 26, 2004 Author Share Posted February 26, 2004 *thinks* Not that I can recall...? I think I'd remember that. Hold on...*rummage rummage* I think I found who you were talking about... http://asexuality.org/discussion/viewtopic.php?p=33108#33108 Whatever happened to them? Well. That settles that, then. I have to go postering and chalking. I need to draw out the closeted and as-of-now unaware asexuals of UConn. Link to post Share on other sites
VivreEstEsperer Posted February 26, 2004 Share Posted February 26, 2004 Didn't AVENGuy say something once about a "big queer at uconn" interested in asexuality or something along those lines? i remember we were talking about it in the chat once. and Julie, that rocks, that is so awesome, I love your professor too. :) if prof is reading this, thank you!! Link to post Share on other sites
Jayann Posted February 26, 2004 Author Share Posted February 26, 2004 Didn't AVENGuy say something once about a "big queer at uconn" interested in asexuality or something along those lines? ...Are you talking about my professor? Because it's not her. She's not a "big queer." She is an ally, though. Perhaps a big one. Link to post Share on other sites
JKReagan99 Posted February 26, 2004 Share Posted February 26, 2004 Yep, that was who I was referring too... you had im'ed me before I say that thread, so I remembered it from you telling me... as for the *big queer*, we still have yet to find out exactly who... and no one I know has said anything here (@ Storrs)... Link to post Share on other sites
davelwhite Posted February 26, 2004 Share Posted February 26, 2004 Congratulations on having such a cool prof! You know your ideas are spreading when they become something that other people have to study in order to get a good grade on their midterms. :D dave Link to post Share on other sites
Cate Perfect Posted February 26, 2004 Share Posted February 26, 2004 YAY!! *grabs Julie and wisks her round in celebration* WAHOOO!! :D :D Smart folks!! And teaching a class too! Cate Link to post Share on other sites
Tom Nook Posted February 26, 2004 Share Posted February 26, 2004 darn, I wish I had your prof!! Reading this just made me get a great big grin on my face! :D Link to post Share on other sites
Live R Perfect Posted February 27, 2004 Share Posted February 27, 2004 Cool 8) I wonder if there will ever be Men's Studies classes...? Link to post Share on other sites
Skiddaloxx Posted February 27, 2004 Share Posted February 27, 2004 ***HALLELUJA!!!!!*** :D :D :D Link to post Share on other sites
mindlife Posted February 27, 2004 Share Posted February 27, 2004 I think Mens' Studies would be a valid field of study. Men need to know themselves consciously. I've read a lot of Victorian literature and have sensed that in the 19th century, men had spaces in which they could be emotionally intimate with each other. Now, with the loss of "saloons" and other places where men gather in America, I think the quality of male thinking and expression has suffered. I wish men here were more emotionally intimate across all lines of sexual orientation. If they speak to each other more, they'll conceive real respect for each other. And if men respect each other and are sensitive to each other, maybe the nations of the earth will stop fighting and share their resources. Link to post Share on other sites
aury Posted February 27, 2004 Share Posted February 27, 2004 male studies: Link to post Share on other sites
Cate Perfect Posted February 27, 2004 Share Posted February 27, 2004 Looky there! The men of AVEN have two huge free areas to use for actual thinking! I knew our men were special. We should have a Men of AVEN calendar. They could be doing things most men wouldn't be caught dead doing e.g. looking women in the eye rather than at their chests, not competing with one another in order to impress a chick, etc. Cate Link to post Share on other sites
aury Posted February 27, 2004 Share Posted February 27, 2004 :lol: :lol: :lol: Link to post Share on other sites
fluffy_hime Posted February 27, 2004 Share Posted February 27, 2004 LOL Cate. Yes, Men's Studies. Maybe if they respected each other, they would respect women as well. Link to post Share on other sites
Skiddaloxx Posted February 27, 2004 Share Posted February 27, 2004 If they speak to each other more, they'll conceive real respect for each other.And if men respect each other and are sensitive to each other, maybe the nations of the earth will stop fighting and share their resources. Funny. I have always had the suspicion that the disability of men to be emotional with each other is the real source why wars and stuff take place. Some rather kill and die than to open up to other men. If there weren't any women (who take part of being the ones men can be emotional and open with), most men would be either highly neurotic (which many are anyway, if you ask me) or dead already. So: GIRL POWER! 8) Link to post Share on other sites
Jayann Posted February 27, 2004 Author Share Posted February 27, 2004 Unfortunately, much in the way of academia has been devoted to the study of men. Being the gender with access to the world of history, literature, politics, and the arts throughout patriarchal society, these subjects have often been androcentric. They've concerned studies of the way men interact with each other, the way they've traditionally viewed their world and women, etc. So a Men's Studies class would be redundant. The reason why we have Women's Studies and not Men's Studies is because women's points of view have been marginalized in our patriarchal society. Men have never had this problem. Funny. I have always had the suspicion that the disability of men to be emotional with each other is the real source why wars and stuff take place. Some rather kill and die than to open up to other men. If there weren't any women (who take part of being the ones men can be emotional and open with), most men would be either highly neurotic (which many are anyway, if you ask me) or dead already. So: GIRL POWER! 8) Well...the reason why men seem unable to open up has nothing to do with a lack of ability to relate to one another. If anything, men relate more easily to one another than they do to women; a study of the politics of gender in relationships gives testament to the ways in which men have traditionally maintained power through stoicism and lack of communication - if you're unapproachable and unresponsive, you can't lose an argument. And really, this is not a "natural" way for men and women to be. The concepts of the machismo badass, the ambitious "big wheel," the strong, silent "sturdy oak" are not "just the way men are." They are "masculine" qualities that are social constructions designed to keep men unlike women. Many of these social constructions came into being in our society as a backlash response to the feminist movements of the 50's and the 70's. Women don't make men more socially and emotionally available. They can only do that by themselves, and to do that they need to stop viewing the world with eyes adjusted to ignore the oppression of women. They need to start looking at the world from outside themselves, from the point of view of the oppressed. You can't understand yourself as an oppressor if you only study yourself and others like you. Men can't see themselves as members of a patriarchal society if they only take a Men's Studies course. They're not learning anything new - it'd just be within the framework of everything they already think about the world they live in. And that's why Women's Studies is important. :) Link to post Share on other sites
bard of aven Posted February 27, 2004 Share Posted February 27, 2004 Looky there! The men of AVEN have two huge free areas to use for actual thinking! I knew our men were special. Why is the driving area shaped like lower Michegan? Why is the dangerous pursuits one shaped like a...well, nevermind, but it makes me suspect some man drew that thing. We should have a Men of AVEN calendar. They could be doing things most men wouldn't be caught dead doing e.g. looking women in the eye rather than at their chests, not competing with one another in order to impress a chick, etc. I'll be Mr. April. You can do a pinup photo of me reading at the gendercrash open mic night in Boston on April 8. If I have the chutzpah to go through with it. boa Link to post Share on other sites
underminethewalls Posted February 27, 2004 Share Posted February 27, 2004 An argument can be made for the importance of men's studies, that the study of the male identity is crucial to the understanding of how men oppress women, and maleness as an identity perpetuates patriarchy and creates strife throughout the world. If maleness is not viewed as an identity that can be changed, do we risk limiting ourselves to a biological determinism that relegates half of our population to the category of oppressor and half to that of oppressed, to the detriment of both, for eternity? Of course it would have to be seen through a feminist framework, and its proponents would have to watch very carefully to keep it from being coopted and turned into a celebration of masculinity or a navel-gazing forum. Thoughts? Link to post Share on other sites
Jayann Posted February 27, 2004 Author Share Posted February 27, 2004 Boa. That is asexy as HELL. I'd buy a calendar. There's little in this world as asexy as a-men subverting the social constructions of gender roles and making the patriarchy look real bad. Whoo. *fans self* Link to post Share on other sites
Jayann Posted February 27, 2004 Author Share Posted February 27, 2004 An argument can be made for the importance of men's studies...Of course it would have to be seen through a feminist framework, and its proponents would have to watch very carefully to keep it from being coopted and turned into a celebration of masculinity or a navel-gazing forum. So...if it's a study of gender identity, from the perspective of women, how does that make it different from Women's Studies? Is it a feminist perspective on the social interactions of men? Because Women's Studies includes that. I'm gonna use the parallel with race issues again, because it's similar. How much sense would it make for a white professor to teach a course on White Culture, supposedly from a minority's perspective, just so the white students could learn about themselves and expect to be able to apply that to their interactions with minorities? Aren't many subjects, at least traditionally, centered around white culture, unless otherwise stated? Whole literature courses could be on white authors, and no one would notice, because white is "default." But if it was a course on just black authors, THEN it's explicitly stated as such. It's too hard to see yourself from the inside. Even when you try to take the point of view of the oppressed, because you're just having the ideas of your own normativity being reinforced. But maybe I'm not fully understanding your proposal. So if I've misunderstood, I apologize. I'm not attacking your idea, I just can't see it going in the direction you're hoping it would. By the way... ...do we risk limiting ourselves to a biological determinism... Are you implying that you think biological determinism is an actual part of/the sole explanation for the construction of gender? Or are you saying that you think people will just fall prey to the assumption that biology is the only determining factor in gender identity? Just curious. Link to post Share on other sites
ApolloSeek Posted February 27, 2004 Share Posted February 27, 2004 male studies: I find your blatantly sexist propaganda extremely offensive! Were I or another man to post something similar to what you did, only with women as the subject, that person would be excoriated. Equality means equal treatment. That means if I or a man can't spout female-sexist propaganda, you can't either. Link to post Share on other sites
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