Just Curious How many Sex Favorable Asexuals are left here

[gray-a girl]

After all the invalidating that we've received, I'm just curious who, if anyone, is left at AVEN that identifies as a sex favorable asexual. I have heard about a lot of us leaving AVEN because of all the hostility and invalidation. I've certainly considered it, especially since I've found other groups where I'm much more welcome. So I'm wondering which brave souls have stuck it out.

[Guest]

None ace here. Even if I've never had sex. Lol 😂

[Grimalkin]

To be honest, even after all the drama, I'm still not sure what exactly constitutes a "sex favorable" asexual. 

[Guest]

22 minutes ago, Grimalkin said:

To be honest, even after all the drama, I'm still not sure what exactly constitutes a "sex favorable" asexual. 

Anywhere from "OK having sex for other people" to "Seeks out sex with people for personal enjoyment but describe it as desire without attraction with partner preferences" to "Hypersexual asexual". And all the in between. So basically, asexual compromising to cupiosexual with a high sex drive. Rather wide range of people use it. 

[A. Sterling]

2 minutes ago, Serran said:

Anywhere from "OK having sex for other people" to "Seeks out sex with people for personal enjoyment but describe it as desire without attraction with partner preferences" to "Hypersexual asexual". And all the in between. So basically, asexual compromising to cupiosexual with a high sex drive. Rather wide range of people use it. 

I'm confused. 😕

[KoiFishShoes]

I identify with the "does not experience sexual attraction" definition of asexuality and consider myself sex-favorable. To me, sex-favorable means that I know sex can be fun under the right circumstances (mine includes being consensual, with good communication and respect) and is something I would like to do occasionally with my romantic partner, but it's not high on my priority list.

[Zagadka]

I think that people being sex positive is awesome and I'm so glad society is loosening up. I just don't want any part of it.

[Philip027]

Quote

Anywhere from "OK having sex for other people" to "Seeks out sex with people for personal enjoyment but describe it as desire without attraction with partner preferences" to "Hypersexual asexual". And all the in between. So basically, asexual compromising to cupiosexual with a high sex drive. Rather wide range of people use it. 

So basically, it means anything, yet also nothing.  A paradox.

[SithLord]

Sex positive and sex favorable are two different things. Sex positive implies a political stance of being in favor of sex being seen with less stigma and judgement in society as a whole. As in, other people can have all the sex they want and I will not judge them for it and believe others should not either. Sex favorable is a more personal meaning and has confusing usages. Some mean it to be "can enjoy sex but does not desire it" others have a definition more conflicting with the definition of asexuality which is "desires to have sex" though often times those using the latter definition have some wordplay to justify its usage alongside the definitions of asexuality.

 

Personally, anyone using the term "sex favorable asexual" is welcome on AVEN and I do not wish them gone. If I wish individuals gone, it is not because of the labels they use, but rather their words and actions. So I can confidently say that I am sorry if AVEN has pushed anyone away, be they sex-favorable asexuals, sex-averse asexuals, sexuals, or anyone who comes here honestly and with pure intentions of joining our community and not seeking to divide it. 

[Marlow1]

I think a lot of sex favourable asexual folk have left. Hard to prove though, because AVEN does not have a section where folk that are not happy in this particular way can say so, before they leave. I think it is a shame that people who are sex favourable do feel so sad and hurt from all this. AVEN is so welcoming in so many ways, but I know from chatting to folk that meet the criteria for being Asexual and Sex Favourable do generally feel invalidated here

[Guest]

It's sad that the literal definition of asexuality makes people who love and desire sex feel invalidated :c

[Guest]

4 hours ago, A. Sterling said:

I'm confused. 😕

What's so confusing about the idea of an asexual loving and desiring sex, and being unhappy without sex in their life? It makes perfect sense

[FaerieFate]

54 minutes ago, Marlow1 said:

I think a lot of sex favourable asexual folk have left. Hard to prove though, because AVEN does not have a section where folk that are not happy in this particular way can say so, before they leave. I think it is a shame that people who are sex favourable do feel so sad and hurt from all this. AVEN is so welcoming in so many ways, but I know from chatting to folk that meet the criteria for being Asexual and Sex Favourable do generally feel invalidated here

Fun fact. You can post in Site Comments and not leave. Ya know, because If you post in Site Comments we can know it's a problem and address it. 

 

Also, I'd be invalidated here. Given asexuality is only recently coming into the spotlight, it's only recently been fully explored as an identity. If it's something you feel strongly about, I'd hope you dig your heals in and try to change it. I have a high libido, and if I had a sexual partner I probably would be sexually active for them (I mean, biology says it feels good, so it's no big compromise). And... some people would have a problem with me identifying as ace. Well, I am asexual, whether they agree or not. Because I don't experience sexual attraction and I'm perfectly happy without sex. There's a lot of things I'd rather do like read a good book, see a good movie, eat yummy food, go to an awesome concert, etc. I'm just an asexual that's like "Yeah, sure" about sex if it made my partner happy.

[Philip027]

^ I don't think pretty much anyone here with actual knowledge of asexuality would take any of that to mean you couldn't be asexual, because most of us understand that being willing/able to do something is separate from actively desiring it to happen (and that asexuality doesn't mean you must dislike sex).  In fact this is something many of us have had to reconcile / come to terms with in the process of recognizing our own asexual identities.

 

I don't know what it is that is causing this eternal conflation between "can consent to / likes sex" and "wants sex", as if it is impossible to speak against the latter falling under the scope of asexuality without also speaking against the former.  It's not impossible, because they are not the same thing.  There is a difference and trying to pretend otherwise is starting to be a willful misrepresentation of our position at this point.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, FaerieFate said:

Fun fact. You can post in Site Comments and not leave. Ya know, because If you post in Site Comments we can know it's a problem and address it. 

 

Also, I'd be invalidated here. Given asexuality is only recently coming into the spotlight, it's only recently been fully explored as an identity. If it's something you feel strongly about, I'd hope you dig your heals in and try to change it. I have a high libido, and if I had a sexual partner I probably would be sexually active for them (I mean, biology says it feels good, so it's no big compromise). And... some people would have a problem with me identifying as ace. Well, I am asexual, whether they agree or not. Because I don't experience sexual attraction and I'm perfectly happy without sex. There's a lot of things I'd rather do like read a good book, see a good movie, eat yummy food, go to an awesome concert, etc. I'm just an asexual that's like "Yeah, sure" about sex if it made my partner happy.

I know few people in the debates who call compromise sex for a partner either sexual attraction or sexual desire. So, short of one or two people who mostly get disagreed with by the overwhelming majority, you wouldn't get invalidated, unless you preferred sex to no sex when in a relationship where it was an option, which are the people who feel invalidated and upset here. Which, cupiosexual as a label tried to address I think but seems to have been largely rejected as a thing. 

 

Also, saying things like "biology says it feels good" could feel rather bad to read for the many aces who don't feel good during sex. Makes it sound like you think they are biologically broken or something for sex producing no pleasure sensations. "My biology means sexual pleasure and orgasm feels good" or "the physical sensations feel good to me" makes it less general sounding like everyone should find it feels good. It is no big compromise for you and I get you meant your biological response makes it feel good physically, but the wording comes off like you mean it should feel good to everyone due to general human biology so no big deal to just do the sex, when it is a gigantic deal to many aces. 

[HikaruBG]

5 hours ago, SithGirl said:

Sex positive and sex favorable are two different things. Sex positive implies a political stance of being in favor of sex being seen with less stigma and judgement in society as a whole. As in, other people can have all the sex they want and I will not judge them for it and believe others should not either. Sex favorable is a more personal meaning and has confusing usages.

Unfortunately, outside of AVEN, the meaning of sex-positive has been distorted to be a synonym to sex-favourite, or the very least, they are interchangeable.

Same could be said about sex-repulsion, except that it's interchangeable with sex-negative/anti-sexual.

As someome who considers to be sex-positive (or the very least, sex-neutral) and sex-repulsed, it's extremely frustrating (both because of anti-sexuality itself but also that it portraits me as homophobic).

I had to respond to old Reddit post  on this, to explain properly what's the problem.

I guess the reason why this is happening, is because this all goes back to @Nowhere Girl (sorry for tagging you in advance) and her recent posts about the sex-positivity movement. It seems like the message of sex-positive movement has been heavily distorted from "there is nothing wrong with wanting to have sex and your sexuality... Here is how can you do it safely and responsibly" to "Sex is good and healthy, therefore you should be having it, even if you don't want to have it for yourself"

Edited November 10, 2019 by HikaruBG
fixing typos

[SithLord]

6 minutes ago, HikaruBG said:

I guess the reason this is happening, is because this all goes back to @Nowhere Girl (sorry for tagging you in advance) and her recent posts about the sex-positivity movement. It seems like the message of sex-positive movement has been heavily distorted from "there is nothing wrong is wanting to have sex and your sexuality... Here is how can you do it safely and responsibly" to "Sex is good amd healthy, therefore you should be having it even if you don't want to have it for yourself"

Maybe it's because I've never met someone in the latter camp. I've only interacted with people who find non-consensual sex abhorrent, and that's what pressuring someone into having sex would be. 

[HikaruBG]

Um... No, OP, Sex-favourite Aces are still pretty much valid and they are still very much asexual.

The reason why that is is because Liking an activity of sorts ≠ Wanting that activity in question.

There is massive difference between liking and wanting something because the neurogical paths in the brain for both of those are completely different.

Even I know this and I'm not even Sex-favourite Ace.

 

While Sex-favourite Asexuals can choose to engage in sexual activity (if it's offered to them by their SO), they don't inherently desire the sex for what it is.

That's the difference between Sex-favourite Asexuals and "Sex-desiring Asexuals".

 

I believe that it's has been explained to you multiple times but you not only refused to listen, but also claimed "Invalidation".

 

[everywhere and nowhere]

20 minutes ago, HikaruBG said:

I guess the reason this is happening, is because this all goes back to @Nowhere Girl (sorry for tagging you in advance) and her recent posts about the sex-positivity movement.

No problem at all, just remember that this way I won't receive any notification. Instead: type "@" and then the beginning of a person's user name, then choose it from the list which should appear. It will be highlighted purple and the user will receive a notification.

[Guest]

6 hours ago, A. Sterling said:

I'm confused. 😕

The label is used by anyone who isn't repulsed, basically. So, the meaning varies a bit. There are some that go out for casual sex / ONS cause they like sex, there are others who just are happy giving compromise sex to their partners (but would drop sex if their partners didnt want it). The sex favorable asexual label has become quite broad in its use. 

 

As for the issue, the definition debates and people feeling seeking out sex isn't in line with the definition of asexual has some who ID as sex favorable upset and some leave AVEN over it. 

[Guest]

2 hours ago, FaerieFate said:

Fun fact. You can post in Site Comments and not leave. Ya know, because If you post in Site Comments we can know it's a problem and address it. 

 

Also, I'd be invalidated here. Given asexuality is only recently coming into the spotlight, it's only recently been fully explored as an identity. If it's something you feel strongly about, I'd hope you dig your heals in and try to change it. I have a high libido, and if I had a sexual partner I probably would be sexually active for them (I mean, biology says it feels good, so it's no big compromise). And... some people would have a problem with me identifying as ace. Well, I am asexual, whether they agree or not. Because I don't experience sexual attraction and I'm perfectly happy without sex. There's a lot of things I'd rather do like read a good book, see a good movie, eat yummy food, go to an awesome concert, etc. I'm just an asexual that's like "Yeah, sure" about sex if it made my partner happy.

Just so you know, none of us would disagree that you're asexual based on what you just said. If you said "I can't be happy without sex so I have to seek out people to satisfy my libido with, and if they can't satisfy my libido I drop them and look for someone better at satisfying me, I'm asexual" (which someone in this thread has literally said here on AVEN in the past) then yeah we'd question why you feel the need to ID as ace. But no one is denying that an ace may be able to enjoy sex when they do have it to keep a romantic partner happy.

[SithLord]

2 hours ago, FaerieFate said:

Also, I'd be invalidated here. Given asexuality is only recently coming into the spotlight, it's only recently been fully explored as an identity. If it's something you feel strongly about, I'd hope you dig your heals in and try to change it. I have a high libido, and if I had a sexual partner I probably would be sexually active for them (I mean, biology says it feels good, so it's no big compromise). And... some people would have a problem with me identifying as ace. Well, I am asexual, whether they agree or not. Because I don't experience sexual attraction and I'm perfectly happy without sex. There's a lot of things I'd rather do like read a good book, see a good movie, eat yummy food, go to an awesome concert, etc. I'm just an asexual that's like "Yeah, sure" about sex if it made my partner happy.

Most people wouldn't deny you're asexual. We acknowledge that arousal and libido are not the same as attraction and intrinsic desire for sex as they're biological functions. But there is no clear definition for "sex favorable" as should be clear just by the few above examples, and thus anyone can use it. It is impossible to differentiate sexuals from asexuals based on some usages of the term, hence people's confusion and general protestation. 

 

I would like to point out I do know some sex-favorable asexuals who I agree with their usage of the labels, so I am not saying sex-favorable asexuals cannot exist. 

[Chihiro]

2 hours ago, HikaruBG said:

I had to respond to old Reddit post  on this, to explain properly what's the problem.

 

The reddit post really drives the point about how asexuality has become a joke. I get why over half the posts were mocking asexuality. Its sad that asexuality has lost its meaning thanks to snowflakes, incels and attaching-too-many-unnecessary-labels to asexuality.

[Guest]

I'm a sex favourable asexual in a non-sexual marriage, I didn't realise how great that would be until it happened to me.

 

Also this thread is important. Why can't we have a nice civilised discussion about it like we did there?

[NickyTannock]

@gray-a girl I think My Co-moderator, who commented earlier identifies as a Sex-favourable Asexual.

[Janus the Fox]

I don’t see much of a difference in generated member content before or after such of this recent schism.  So I’d say... nobody has actually left, nothing has really changed to me.  Also bare in mind that after the BOD response people may not bring the issue up anymore because it’s settled now, I’d see that this is a non-issue for the vast majority of the AVEN membership also such a schism And BOD response and reaction to may also encouraged new membership that would of been only lurkers.  My observations looking at the widest picture site wide.
 

44 minutes ago, ratherdrinktea said:

I'm a sex favourable asexual in a non-sexual marriage, I didn't realise how great that would be until it happened to me.

 

Also this thread is important. Why can't we have a nice civilised discussion about it like we did there?

This is an example why attitudes where very different 3 years ago and definitely why BOD had to do something now.  Take note if that threads poll.  It’s pretty clear where AVENs majority lies.  It brings up a curious question is to what the heck triggered definition debate reactions in the first place, even if this issue is as old as 4 or even more years ago.

[gray-a girl]

8 hours ago, Serran said:

Also, saying things like "biology says it feels good" could feel rather bad to read for the many aces who don't feel good during sex. Makes it sound like you think they are biologically broken or something for sex producing no pleasure sensations. "My biology means sexual pleasure and orgasm feels good" or "the physical sensations feel good to me" makes it less general sounding like everyone should find it feels good. It is no big compromise for you and I get you meant your biological response makes it feel good physically, but the wording comes off like you mean it should feel good to everyone due to general human biology so no big deal to just do the sex, when it is a gigantic deal to many aces. 

I think you are taking this too personally. For some people, biology does say it feels good. That doesn't mean that for other people, biology does not say it feels good. They were talking about themselves, not other people.

 

 

13 hours ago, SithGirl said:

Sex positive and sex favorable are two different things. Sex positive implies a political stance of being in favor of sex being seen with less stigma and judgement in society as a whole. As in, other people can have all the sex they want and I will not judge them for it and believe others should not either. Sex favorable is a more personal meaning and has confusing usages. Some mean it to be "can enjoy sex but does not desire it" others have a definition more conflicting with the definition of asexuality which is "desires to have sex" though often times those using the latter definition have some wordplay to justify its usage alongside the definitions of asexuality.

 

Personally, anyone using the term "sex favorable asexual" is welcome on AVEN and I do not wish them gone. If I wish individuals gone, it is not because of the labels they use, but rather their words and actions. So I can confidently say that I am sorry if AVEN has pushed anyone away, be they sex-favorable asexuals, sex-averse asexuals, sexuals, or anyone who comes here honestly and with pure intentions of joining our community and not seeking to divide it. 

Thank you.

 

5 hours ago, cbc said:

To me, "sex favourable asexual" always meant someone who had no negative feelings surrounding sex and was happily willing to attempt compromise if they were in a relationship with someone who wasn't asexual, but still had no innate desire to seek out sexual activity with other people and would ideally choose no sex over having sex. I spent a number of years in a relationship with someone whose sexuality could be described that way and I know of other people who are similar, and that's what seems to make the most sense. "I love sex and a life/relationship without it would feel unfulfilling and like something was missing" doesn't really fit with my understanding of asexuality.

Well, I think that generally means sex indifferent, because they are good either way. Sex favorable, as I see it, is someone who does enjoy and seek out sex, but lacks attraction to the other person so that is not the motivating factor. For me, kink is hard to do by myself... (for example its hard to tie oneself up  so that you can't get out... and do so safely). I think what you are describing is sex positive.

 

9 hours ago, FaerieFate said:

Fun fact. You can post in Site Comments and not leave. Ya know, because If you post in Site Comments we can know it's a problem and address it. 

 

Also, I'd be invalidated here. Given asexuality is only recently coming into the spotlight, it's only recently been fully explored as an identity. If it's something you feel strongly about, I'd hope you dig your heals in and try to change it. I have a high libido, and if I had a sexual partner I probably would be sexually active for them (I mean, biology says it feels good, so it's no big compromise). And... some people would have a problem with me identifying as ace. Well, I am asexual, whether they agree or not. Because I don't experience sexual attraction and I'm perfectly happy without sex. There's a lot of things I'd rather do like read a good book, see a good movie, eat yummy food, go to an awesome concert, etc. I'm just an asexual that's like "Yeah, sure" about sex if it made my partner happy.

Good for you.

 

10 hours ago, Marlow1 said:

I think a lot of sex favourable asexual folk have left. Hard to prove though, because AVEN does not have a section where folk that are not happy in this particular way can say so, before they leave. I think it is a shame that people who are sex favourable do feel so sad and hurt from all this. AVEN is so welcoming in so many ways, but I know from chatting to folk that meet the criteria for being Asexual and Sex Favourable do generally feel invalidated here

A lot have, because I've talked to them on another forum. There's another forum I'm a part of that, seems to be mostly sex favorable asexuals. (Non-sex favorable seems to be the minority from what I can tell). It's actually a kink forum... which makes sense to me. I think kink is one of the things that can make someone want sex, even if they're not sexually attracted to or into the person they are doing it with. (And frankly I'm not sure why this is still so confusing to people, unless they lack an understanding of kink or have an atypical definition of sexual attraction, basing it on behavior for example). I'm not sure how non-kinky, vanilla, sex favorable asexuals work (why would they want sex? Not sure?) But, I'm not going to invalidate them.

Also from the very very sparse number of people who have responded to this thread, it makes me very sad. It seems that very few sex favorable aces have remained, and some that have, they have been convinced that they're sexual so no longer identify as such even though they could. It makes me very sad. AVEN has gained a reputation for being hostile to sex favorable asexuals, from the people I have talked to on that other forum.

 

Cupiosexual.... I think even people who wanted to take on the cupiosexual label were invalidated, and told they were just sexual. A couple years back, I was learning about cupiosexual and trying to understand whether or not it applies to me, and in the process I got "cupiosexuals are just sexual". Also, I think, asexuality fits a little better because of the "lack of sexual attraction" part. I think, a lot of people who are sex repulsed or sex indifferent, are having trouble understanding what sexual attraction is... I think this is because their lack of interest in sex is the main focal point of the issues that they face, so including people who don't want to avoid sex or are indifferent to it, is something that is uncomfortable to them. Those people who identify as sexual, I think are thinking the same thing, and just trying to look out for their friends. Which, is nice but there are a diversity of people in the world, and telling them how they feel isn't something people should do.

I think the concern people have about sex favorable asexuals is that, we will turn asexuality into "some of us want sex" and then the asexuals who don't, will feel pressured into it. But, thing is, I don't think it has to be that way for several reasons. First, I think it's the responsibility of sex favorable asexuals to educate people that the majority of asexuals aren't interested, so that if they encounter another asexual they won't make assumptions. The other thing to consider.... I hate to say this but unless you are dating a sexual with no libido (perhaps due to a medical issue) they are going to want sex, and it is in a sense unfair to ask them to abstain. So they are going to pressure you into it anyway, and they are going to be disappointed if its not there. I can sort of understand that....its like asking someone to be celibate but not by choice. In my religion, its possible to become a monk or nun and I know that people find it very difficult to abstain when they do so. It's actually a monumental task for some people to overcome. Since celibacy is so hard for people, I think its unfair to ask someone to be that way not by choice. I know this is a serious problem for people, so the solution would probably have to be, date someone with no libido, date someone in an open relationship with a good acceptance of asexuality (so they can still love you and seek sex elsewhere), date someone whose taken on vows of celibacy (perhaps for religious reasons), or date other asexuals that are not sex favorable. Sex favorable asexuals are not limited in this way, but it doesn't mean we don't have our own set of problems navigating the dating world. These problems do not line up with the things sexuals experience.

[gray-a girl]

3 hours ago, Janus DarkFox said:

don’t see much of a difference in generated member content before or after such of this recent schism.  So I’d say... nobody has actually left, nothing has really changed to me.  Also bare in mind that after the BOD response people may not bring the issue up anymore because it’s settled now, I’d see that this is a non-issue for the vast majority of the AVEN membership also such a schism And BOD response and reaction to may also encouraged new membership that would of been only lurkers.  My observations looking at the widest picture site wide.

As I said earlier, people have left, because I've talked to some of them, and AVEN has gained a reputation for being hostile to sex favorable asexuals so others have never joined in the first place.

 

4 hours ago, ratherdrinktea said:

I'm a sex favourable asexual in a non-sexual marriage, I didn't realise how great that would be until it happened to me.

 

Also this thread is important. Why can't we have a nice civilised discussion about it like we did there?

That is amazing. There are a lot more sex favorable asexuals, here on AVEN, then there seems to be from this thread. (Unless they have left since the poll was taken which is quite possible). It's nice to know that the majority of people on AVEN, at least when the poll was taken, are accepting of sex favorable asexuals. Maybe they are just the quiet ones?

[Philip027]

I'd STILL like to know what sexual attraction even means if it doesn't mean "wants to sex this person"

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, Philip027 said:

I'd STILL like to know what sexual attraction even means if it doesn't mean "wants to sex this person"

This thread doesn't need to be another debate.

 

And OP, I am not taking it personal. But, if staff are going to make such statements and correct us on wording needs to make it clear its personal due to hurting members feelings, it goes both ways... a lot of aces I know get hurt seeing things phrased that way since it doesn't make it seem personal and more general, so it's best to clarify especially as a staff member who the members will see as more of an official statement.