Calling all masculine identifying aces! How do you feel about your asexuality in relation to your masculinity?

[dprose]

Howdy! I'm writing conducting a research project for my Anthropology of Sex, Gender, and Sexuality class on asexuality, and I wanted to touch on how asexuality influences concepts of gender. So, how do you feel about your asexuality in relation to your masculinity? I guess a better question would be, because of cultural norms surrounding masculinity, does identifying as asexual cause any insecurity? Thanks so much! 

[Camicon]

Not for me, though my general reaction to anyone/thing that tries to disqualify my masculinity because I'm not typical in all respects is "fuck you, asshole".

[argar]

It did when I was in my teens.

 

I never did fall into the trap of proving how masculine I was by having sex, and then bragging about it, but it did make me feel more comfortable being alone.

 

Yes, I would pretend I was in on all the macho talk, but after a while it was just too much work.

 

I thought girls were cute, and I did enjoy being in the same classes as pretty girls, but it never really crossed my mine to actually wanting sex.

 

I guess because of this I had to create my own personal definition of masculinity for myself.

[nineGardens]

Hey hey Dprose.

Interesting research project.

 

Hmmm... I guess I might need to ask a clarifying question, when you ask"Calling all masculine identifying aces",  are you specifically interested in people who think of themselves as "M for Manly", or just anyone who identifies as "male"?Because like... I identify as male, and prefer male pronouns... but don't exactly think of myself as "Masculine"

(There's also the question of if Demi-sexual counts as sufficiently Ace for the purposes of your research project... that I'll leave you to figure out)...

 

Anyway... assuming you are interested in just "Anyone who uses male pronouns"....

I think I sort of sidestepped a whole bunch of male stereotypes years BEFORE being Ace/not Ace was a thing I considered.

I was actively awful at all sports the moment I started primary school (probably called elementary school, depending where you live).

I like writing, and poetry and don't really feel obliged to be stoic with my feelings. Baking is one of my favorite hobbies.

As a general rule, peer pressure sort of... never seemed to apply very effectively. I was always different, and it was never a problem. Cultural norms surrounding masculinity were never really relevant, because I could tell from pretty early on that I was never even remotely in the area of those cultural norms.

 

Hell, if anything, Being Ace (or whatever) made all that stuff easier; If I had had a strong sex drive, if I had felt some need to impress girls, then it would have been far more painful to just completely miss the mark on Male stereotypes.

As it was, I got away with just being me. It was great.

[K.I.N.G]

Honestly if someone around me starts talking about finding people attractive then I do get a little I guess dysphoric about it but then I also find it really bloody fucking awkward that they even find people attractive in the first place and on top of that, that they're willing to talk about it. 

 

[lowLifeLoner]

My friend says I'm 90% female, while that may be inaccurate I'm in no way masculine. I'm a scrawny little turd that mostly talks to girls (As the "the gay friend"), however that just me not particular about my asexuality.

[Lord Jade Cross]

.

[Duke Memphis]

I don't find my masculinity completely tied to or separate from the fact that I'm ace. I do have a fair amount of femininity, but I'm 100% a man. I think that being in touch with both my masculine and feminine sides might be why I'm so comfortable with being ace, or maybe it's the other way around.

 

I just don't want people to get the wrong ideas cemented in their heads. By "wrong ideas", I mean making incorrect assumptions about me based on what they think they know about me.

[Mezzo Forte]

I had to acknowledge myself as asexual before I could even begin questioning my gender, as I assumed that my disinterest in sex meant that I couldn't be a man. My questioning began not long after I learned of my asexuality, realizing that if I'm not straight by default, then I'm not necessarily a girl by default either. It took 4 years of intense questioning and navigating "not trans enough" feelings before finally admitting that I needed to transition.

 

I definitely don't click with expressions of machismo/hypermasculinity in general, but I fail to click with hypersexual expression in general even despite being rather sex positive. (Doing the kind of research I do, I have sometimes found myself obligated to attend drag and queer burlesque shows, but while I can see the good in them, they very rarely interest me.) I honestly feel weird about being expected to be attracted to women, especially because I seem to prefer platonic/tactile bonds with man/masc-leaning folks. I get assumed/essentialized as gay quite a bit now, but that's strangely more comfortable to me than being assumed straight in certain situations.

[General]

I'm a masculine nonbinary ace who is AFAB.  Personally I don't feel that my sexual orientation has any connection to my masculinity.  Being ace doesn't make me feel any less or more masculine.  It wouldn't even matter if I was in a relationship, or who I was dating, I would still take on the dominant role.  I was this way as a small child, before I even knew I was ace or anything else for that matter.  Masculinity is simply in my nature.  

[F_p_m]

to be honest? I never realised I was unusual in not wanting to bone randoms. I assumed my friends were all oversexed wierdos and rolled my eyes at them!

 

But i'm uh.. not that socially clued up hahah. Oops?

 

I suppose it helps a bit that i'm demisexual rather than totally completely ace (on the spectrum but not completely uninterested) but even so, I genuinely just thought other people were freaks for wanting to have sex with people they just met!

 

Oh man...

 

I still do to be fair. Freaking wierdos. (lol jks)

 

Can't say it's ever made me feel less masculine or less feminine (I'm afab but sort of more masculine in my thinking and behaviours I believe)

I personally find the idea that all men think about is sex personally extremely offensive and reductive. I have known a LOT of guys in my life and honestly? Aside from one or two self proclaimed bikes, the majority really didn't do the whole sleeping around, jump into bed with any rando thing at all.

The closest we ever got to oogling women was FHMs yearly "hottest woman" awards.

I lived with 6 guys at university, they were all very nice, very respectful guys. So when I think of "masculinity" that's what I think of. Not those stupid drunk idiot lads going out sleeping with multiple women and getting dumb tattoos because honestly they are a minority. The guys i've interacted with in the past 30+ years of my life have simply not been like that.  Never had them brag about sex, never had them comment on a woman in a lecherous way, never seen them sneak off at a party to go grope someone in a spare room.

 

I just don't see how the two are in any way connected except to someone with a very mysandrist view of what "masculinity" is.

[Divide By Zero]

On 4/9/2019 at 9:44 PM, dprose said:

So, how do you feel about your asexuality in relation to your masculinity?

* shrugs *  Meh

 

On 4/9/2019 at 9:44 PM, dprose said:

because of cultural norms surrounding masculinity, does identifying as asexual cause any insecurity?

Nope. I largely ignored peer pressure in school and still do as an adult. I live my life the way I want to.

[Guest]

Forget this noise.

[bog]

Like others have said, I think that learning about asexuality, and then realizing I was ace, allowed me to question my gender without the burden of "oh but guys need to experience a lot of sexual attraction!!" bc at that point I already knew it wasn't an obligatory experience for everyone, regardless of gender. 
That being said I /do/ remember, before realizing I was a guy, thinking 'oh dang being ace would kinda suck if I was a guy bc everyone would think its impossible'. Which is more a reflection on how society views the sexual autonomy of cis men versus cis women rather than the relationship between masculinity and asexuality. 
In my case, learning I was ace is what opened the door for me to understand my gender and realize I was/am a guy, and so without asexuality I wouldnt be as aware of or in tune with my masculinity, and I would probably be very depressed and dysphoric without understanding why. I think the perceived issue with masculinity and asexuality is a by-product of the lack of asexual education/ masculine asexual rep, as well as the outdated society assumption that masculinity is linked to sexual attraction and drive.  
learning I was ace before realizing I was a guy allowed me to realize my masculinity without having to cave into toxicity or hyper-sexualization of masculinity, so for cis guys the experience may be different. However, being gay and asexual has caused me to experience a lot of doubt/imposter syndrome due to the hypersexualization of gay men- but thats a whole different can of worms.  

[Anthracite_Impreza]

I never saw sexual prowess as an indicator of masculinity, so being ace doesn't faze me in the least. I have long hair too ¯\ _(ツ)_/¯

[General]

7 hours ago, Jon A. said:

I don't really fit any of the stereotypes, a good thing in my opinion because I think of the term "masculine" as synonymous with "duh".

 

I'm a man because of the way I was put together, not because of anything I do.

Masculinity is very different from "hyper masculinity."  Two completely separate things.

 

You are "male" because of how you were put together.  Being male doesn't make you a man.  Also two completely different things.

 

Many people here identify as masculine in gender and/or gender expression.  I found your statements  extremely off-putting.

[Guest]

7 hours ago, AceOfHearts_85 said:

Masculinity is very different from "hyper masculinity."  Two completely separate things.

 

You are "male" because of how you were put together.  Being male doesn't make you a man.  Also two completely different things.

 

Many people here identify as masculine in gender and/or gender expression.  I found your statements  extremely off-putting.

I didn't come here to offend or fight with anyone, but the former is inevitable. Besides, I find the term "man" kind of off-putting because of the expectations that come with it and the negative connotations it carries, i.e. rapist, abuser, et cetera. I grew up with one of these "hyper masculine" guys as you call them; excessive drinking, swearing, intimidation, that sort of thing. He expected me to be a lot more "manly" and when I didn't measure up there was hell to pay.

 

That's the trouble with text, one ambiguous word and at least someone gets hot under the collar.

 

I felt safe here until this came up. Now if you'll excuse me, I have to spend much of the rest of the day trying to shake off the tension created by your pointed statements.

 

No matter, I received some valuable information prior to your second attack and am now shielded against your disruptor fire. Hit in engineering section, possible damage to impulse engines, still maneuverable on warp drive.

[General]

25 minutes ago, Jon A. said:

I didn't come here to offend or fight with anyone, but the former is inevitable. Besides, I find the term "man" kind of off-putting because of the expectations that come with it and the negative connotations it carries, i.e. rapist, abuser, et cetera. I grew up with one of these "hyper masculine" guys as you call them; excessive drinking, swearing, intimidation, that sort of thing. He expected me to be a lot more "manly" and when I didn't measure up there was hell to pay.

 

That's the trouble with text, one ambiguous word and at least someone gets hot under the collar.

 

Now if you'll excuse me, I have to spend much of the rest of the day trying to shake off the tension created by your pointed statements.

I didn't create anyone's tension.  Your emotional reaction has nothing to do with me, as I didn't write anything offensive.  I only expressed my perspective on a comment that contained inaccurate information.  Traumatic past events and ill feelings do not change the definitions of terms.

[Kaitokid1412]

I am ACE and I think I`m mostly trans, (AFAB) with a tiny bit of Agender. I see myself as just masculine, but with the small aftertaste of Agender. This just always gets me confused. Well, I`m only 13 and in middle school and am not allowed crushes or anything yet still, so it doesnt really bother me. Just the fact, I dont think really other dudes get me wanting a crush on them, and I dont think other girls are either. I dont even think the girls on like pinterest with their really thick as hell eyebrows and obsessing over makeup are cute, I dont envy them, i dont really even care. Now for dudes, I do get the occasional holy jesus hes so cool (Like the 10th doctor from doctor who, LOL) I just dont envy them and want to have crushes. I think this feels wrong but IDK. 

[chairdesklamp]

The only thing that bothers me is I'm an ace ASIAN MAN (mixed, but mixed people are 100% whatever is other, and I also identify more with the Japanese side because they raised me, and in Koube)  in a country (US citizen since the '90s) where Asian men are considered undesirable-neuter-robots-to-be-used. So I feel like having figured this out puts me in a 'stereotype-and-bad-representation" spot. 

But ace and male by itself, no, I don't feel like there's any conflict. But I just mentioned being raised in a country not overrun with the particular colonial poison of machoism (though it has other ones), and regardless of being in one that is now, how you were raised has a really strong effect on your worldview, so maybe that protects me. 

 

I do feel like there's conflict with the transphobes above who come here for understanding because they're also something oppressed, only to turn around and be bigots to others, though...

[dprose]

Thanks for the responses! Looks like it's going to be a great paper! 

[Lonemathsytoothbrushthief]

As a masculine leaning genderfluid person the connection between the two is kind of weird. I realised I was asexual before I ever questioned my gender, and the whole process kind of happened without me ever entering an LGBT+ space so I've been kind of an outsider to any of my communities. I didn't really come out properly but I did try, I think when I was around 18. My dad's response to that was the same as his response has been to me coming out as trans and non binary, or even someone who wants to medically transition to male, which is to say "I don't care if you don't want kids" and zero understanding(with occasional disgust) in any other regard. I had trouble accepting my sexuality as I was in several relationships with cis straight men who made me uncomfortable and/or weren't in a good position themselves, who I didn't feel attraction for, before I accepted that being ace made things complicated. I think I'm demisexual now to be honest, and have only really properly fallen for friends of mine(mostly women), within my usually small close friends group, which is surrounded by a larger friend group which changes regularly as I've had many friends upset me or who I was convinced wouldn't accept me.

 

I think since I came out as trans and started understanding that sexuality can change a lot for people who transition, I've questioned whether I am ace, and whether it's an identity I need to stand up for much more. I've had a lot of gaslighting from people who were transphobic in my life, and it's made me paranoid about the people I meet and how they would talk about me to others. I can't trust them to talk about me without misgendering me when around other cis people, and I often avoid meeting with people in more than one on one interactions, which for a long time I thought was entirely explained by me being autistic and having sensory problems as well, but really it's me being convinced they're going to misgender me. So the idea of me transitioning in my mind has often gone along with either me hoping I will stop being ace, so I can find a partner more easily and have more people be in my life who I can trust, or me hoping I don't experience attraction so I don't have to interact with people who will misgender me or bully me.

 

Also, the idea of masculine people as not being able to be ace is a stereotype(which doesn't have the racism involved which others have to deal with but I don't as I'm white) but one which also makes me more nervous about the idea of transitioning and having a different sort of genitalia due to testosterone, because I know I have trouble processing sexual thoughts and such and worry that working through some trauma and intrusive thoughts I had would become hard again if I have a different sort of genitalia. It's both something which I want and something I'm afraid of. So generally speaking I already struggle with imagining myself happy and post-transition, to whatever degree of medical transition I go through but at a point where people gender me more as male or non binary than female, and the idea of imagining myself as a happy transitioned demisexual masculine non binary person? Yeah that's basically nonexistent.

[acematt]

On 4/17/2019 at 3:30 PM, Jon A. said:

I didn't come here to offend or fight with anyone, but the former is inevitable. Besides, I find the term "man" kind of off-putting because of the expectations that come with it and the negative connotations it carries, i.e. rapist, abuser, et cetera. I grew up with one of these "hyper masculine" guys as you call them; excessive drinking, swearing, intimidation, that sort of thing. He expected me to be a lot more "manly" and when I didn't measure up there was hell to pay.

 

That's the trouble with text, one ambiguous word and at least someone gets hot under the collar.

 

I felt safe here until this came up. Now if you'll excuse me, I have to spend much of the rest of the day trying to shake off the tension created by your pointed statements.

 

No matter, I received some valuable information prior to your second attack and am now shielded against your disruptor fire. Hit in engineering section, possible damage to impulse engines, still maneuverable on warp drive.

I don't like the term 'man' either just because of what it may imply. I simply identify as a 3rd gender. Neither here nor there. A whole separate entity. Don't want to be grouped with the idiot hyper masculine guys. Sorry to call them idiots but way too many of them are exactly that. Keep them completely separated from me. 

[Camicon]

1 hour ago, acematt said:

I don't like the term 'man' either just because of what it may imply. I simply identify as a 3rd gender. Neither here nor there. A whole separate entity. Don't want to be grouped with the idiot hyper masculine guys. Sorry to call them idiots but way too many of them are exactly that. Keep them completely separated from me. 

It's a sad state of affairs when people feel that the word "man" implies "aggressively hypermasculine idiot", because we're not and nobody should feel that it does. Yes, some men do fall into those kinds of stereotypes, but - at least, in my experience - most don't. Just as most women aren't emotionally unstable weaklings.

 

How about, instead of identifying as a 3rd gender so as to escape the incorrect assumptions that other people hoist on men, we show them why they're wrong?

[acematt]

Great point Camicon. We shouldn't back down just because some men give most men a bad name and reputation. I'll definitely keep that in mind. Thanks for the timely advice.