possibly asexual? lesbian relationship and compromises etc

[progeriac]

possible TMI warning at some points

Hi everyone,

This is my first post on the forum but I've been reading a lot of the posts lately, trying to gain some perspective from both asexual people and sexual people in mixed relationships. I'm a lesbian and currently in my first real relationship--my girlfriend and I have been together for about a year and a half. We are both in our early twenties and she moved in with me around six months ago (fulfilling stereotypes and all, I know). I've never considered myself to have a high sex drive, I've never had sex with anyone before my girlfriend but I masturbate a few times a week I guess--I'd consider myself average for someone my age. My girlfriend, on the other hand, nearly NEVER wants to have sex and has never masturbated in her life.

Her and I have talked a lot about the possibility of her being asexual but she thinks it's just that she has a naturally low sex drive. She went through a "dry spell", she says, before we started dating, and said it was shitty for her to not be having sex (she's not the type of person who can just hook up, she ends up getting feelings and it just work out, I'm the same way), but she just couldn't bring herself to masturbate. She has never experienced any kind of sexual abuse but members of her family have and she's mentioned that she associates sex with being negative because of this sometimes.

When we first started dating, we had much more frequent sex, but it quickly tapered off and now I don't remember the last time we did anything sexual. She is very closed off to trying new things and rarely gives oral and flat out refuses to let receive it. She refuses to try a strap-on, refuses to do most things. I understand being uncomfortable but it's to the point of sex being mechanical--she doesn't even kiss me or caress me or anything like that while we're having sex--it definitely seems like a chore to her. We've talked about it multiple times and she said it's more difficult for her to get in the mood but she wants to make me happy. More recently though it's become a bigger problem and I feel like I'm at my wit's end.

I don't think she realizes that it is a HUGE compromise for me to only have sex once a month or so, which is what we've been doing, and when I try to talk to her about it she gets very defensive and says that I'm not compromising. I've told her that I am, and tried suggesting things like having sex once a week on her nights off work, and she agreed to it--but doesn't follow through. I feel like I'm trying very hard to compromise and find solutions but she never wants to talk about it and never tells me what would work for her. I don't ever want to make her feel like I'm being coercive but I always feel guilty asking if she wants to have sex or asking if we can even just talk about it--but it just doesn't feel like a fair balance anymore. I'm constantly getting rejected and I know it's not personal but it's difficult to rationalize that to myself. She's my girlfriend and she's the person who I want to want me, to find me attractive and desirable, and she doesn't.

Don't get me wrong, though, I love my girlfriend so much. I don't want our relationship to break up over sex. She is honestly my best friend and I don't know what I would do without her, but it's getting to the point where it doesn't feel like a relationship anymore, but a best friendship. Sex is integral to me for a relationship and she says it is for her too but it just seems like she doesn't make the same effort I do.

I'm sorry this was so long and disorganized, and I hope I didn't say anything offensive. I don't want her to ever feel like I'm coercing her into having sex, but I feel like I am. Does anyone have any tips for helping make a compromise work or for opening up the conversation?

[Touchofinsight]

Honestly, due your self a favor (and her), break up with her. It sounds like sex is an important aspect in your life, and your relationships.

What I see happening here is that your girlfriend doesn't want anything to do with sex or on a very limited basis.... but shes doing it for you, shes compromising in the only way she knows how but despite this it isn't effective.... As you can see for many people bad sex or "mechanical sex" as you describe it... is worse then no sex. (from reading your post I feel like you share this sentiment). As it stands you can stay in the relationship but your future sex life is most likely going to continue to be what is now.. or worse. What you seem to want is mutually passionate sex and there is nothing wrong with not wanting or wanting this type of sex... It just means your incompatible sexually with her.... and you have to make the decision.. is continuing this relationship worth having a sub-par sex life? Don't downplay your own needs... be honest with your self about how important something is to you...

Best of luck

Touch!

[progeriac]

I don't know. I feel like sex is a shitty reason to break up with someone who I love--I know it's an important factor for me but it seems trivial. Maybe that's just a societal thing.

[Kanenas]

There's many people who claim sex isn't a big deal. But when it's not happening as frequently or in the manner that they desire, it does become a very big deal. Obviously, a relationship like yours will consist of compromises. This is not just an asexual-sexual issue, but of course also a low-high sex drive divide between sexual couples. I don't know if you are able to see this, but her compromise might be just feel as big as yours does, you know?

Hypothetically... I imagine that a compromise for me, if I loved the girl very madly and she treated me respectfully, would be giving. I doubt I would feel comfortable receiving in any scenario. I do understand when you call it "mechanic" in this case and my obvious fear would be that my hypothetical partner would feel this way, too. It would hurt me if my girlfriend didn't feel appreciated or loved because of this. I do understand where you are coming from. For me personally it is that I am simply disinterested in my daily life but start to feel awfully uncomfortable when confronted with persistence. I cannot tell you whether your girlfriend is asexual or not, only she can know that. Neither can I tell you whether she has a libido at all. Or how tightly the problems you have mentioned are gripping her and if they are the reason for her feelings and resulting behavior.

But I think that it is only fair of her to let you know how she truly feels about the situation and what she imagines for the future. If I were you, I would bring it up again and tell her I am wondering why she feels this way and that you are trying to not take it personally... But that you are having a hard time doing so. Inquiring, not judging. Be careful of your wording, so she does not feel like you are confronting her with the choice of either sex or breaking up. As you say, breaking up over sex is something I find really pathetic and, going one step further, will probably damage her more for future interactions with either you or other people. Many things that have been said to me (with horrid intent or simply careless insensitivity) are still haunting me years later and make it hard to believe someone is genuinely interested in me as a person.

[Lady Girl]

Breaking up because of sexual disparity is unfortunate, but is not pathetic (in my estimation anyway). Each person probably has a minimum and maximum amount of sexual interaction with their partner that they find acceptable in a relationship. If either partner is outside of their desired high or low amount of frequency/attentiveness/mutual satisfaction range, they may lose their feeling of well being and might begin to feel that the relationship is no longer 'on track'. If the minimum isn't met or the maximum exceeded then feelings of inadequacy, frustration, and even desperation can enter into the picture. These feelings can begin to affect other areas of the relationship and cause a general disruption of an otherwise good match.

The important thing to remember is that if a comfortable median (for both partners) can't be found, it's not trivial, pathetic, or shitty to know your own limits and honestly say, "this isn't working for me." This stands true for both sexual and asexual people in relationships.

[Kanenas]

Okay, but progeriac says she loves the girl and does not want to break up. It is a tough situation for sure, but there are many asexual-sexual couples out there who make it work. I have not been lucky enough to be given love genuinely and frequently, maybe I am enthusiastic because of my lack of experience. This might be the hopeless romantic speaking, then. But I do believe that love is worth fighting for!

In this case, the two would have to sit down and talk about, like you just mentioned, their limits. And if they cannot find a comfortable spot... Well, assuming that we share the same opinion on cheating, I will bring up open relationships or agreements in that direction, then. I personally could never accept that kind of relationship and would probably remove myself from the relationship the second it was brought up. But as we are trying to give a bit of advice here, I think it's okay to bring up things that come to my mind. What do you think your girlfriend would say? Is this something you would want, progeriac? Live out your sexuality with somebody other than your girlfriend, for the sake of fulfilling your sexual needs, or do you only want these types of interactions with the girlfriend you love?

An observation I have made is that most (sexual) people in relationships who are sexually experienced would not be happy with just masturbating whenever they wanted to release sexual tension, but request sex with their (or a) partner. Obviously, I cannot know this from own experience. But I presume that you feel this way, right?

[Notte stellata]

I don't know. I feel like sex is a shitty reason to break up with someone who I love--I know it's an important factor for me but it seems trivial. Maybe that's just a societal thing.

Yes, I think it's social conditioning that makes people think it's shallow to break up over sex. This is one of the many examples of how the society send mixed messages about sex: On one hand, sexless romance is unimaginable and often considered the same as "just friendship"; on the other hand, sex is a trivial reason to break up, because "love conquers all." How ironic is that?

People can break up for many reasons despite their love for each other. They can break up because one of them smokes, does drugs, doesn't believe in god, doesn't want kids, spends too much money on their hobby...the list goes on and on. What makes breaking up over sex more shallow than breaking up for other reasons?

[Lady Girl]

Kanenas, I'm not saying that she should break up over sex, I'm just making it clear that it's not pathetic if it turns out that way. There are plenty of asexual people who have done the breaking up because they didn't want sex as often or in the manner they were comfortable...if it's not pathetic for them to break up over sex, it shouldn't be for sexual people either.

Getting to the point where a compromise can be reached is my first choice too (obviously...). There's lots of ideas for what needs to be addressed and how some people make a compromise work in the pinned thread about compromise in this forum, please check it out progeriac!

I also want to mention two thoughts that helps me realize I am living with more than 'just my best friend' (although he is that too). Firstly, we are sharing our lives together, living space and all...I don't do that with my friends, and secondly, he is the one person with whom I feel completely and totally comfortable. He's my husband and life partner.

[Guest]

I think lack of sex is an excellent reason to end a sexual relationship. For almost everyone, sex is a necessary component of a romantic relationship, so no sex, no relationship.

Anyway, saying there are wrong reasons to end a relationship necessarily implies that staying together is right and breaking up is wrong unless it meets certain criteria. But, a relationship isn't some objectively positive thing... if it isn't making you happy, it isn't fulfilling its purpose (which is to benefit your life) and should be ended.

As you say, breaking up over sex is something I find really pathetic and, going one step further, will probably damage her more for future interactions

This is completely unacceptable.

So, sexuals have to do whatever asexuals want no matter how miserable it makes them because, what, asexuals are too fragile to handle break ups? No one, EVER, has a right to make their feelings someone else's responsibility.

[Guest]

TMI and TW:SA : Do not read further if these bother you.

I am asexual and in a mixed relationship. I also have no libido. I do not masturbate, at all, ever. I can also kind of get where your partner comes from with the family with sexual abuse causing issues.

Now, some things I haven't really shared on AVEN before in detail, but I feel like maybe your partner may be having some of the same issues, so I will go over some TMI stuff:

I grew up with a Grandmother who was married five times, four were abusive rapists. She half raised me, she and my mom were my parents, my dad was just a paycheck. My mom was raped at fourteen by a guy when she said no after making out with him. Both of them dealt with it with anger, resentment and seeking no help. This has made them very anti-sex and very bitter towards men and sexual relationships in general. This is what I was raised with. My mom was very open about sex, I knew it all by nine - even what 69ing was. But, overall, I knew they both considered sex something ... almost evil.

Now, my upbringing is part of why it took me so long to realize I was different and asexual non-libidoist. But, it also has made me uncomfortable with many aspects of sex. I will NOT touch a dildo, even though I will tolerate my boyfriend using it, it is rather gross to me. It took me 10 years of being sexually active to be OK with oral sex. It took years to stop feeling uncomfortable doing all but the most basic parts of sex. It took years to stop viewing sex as negative. After that, I was able to sort through huh I really don't enjoy this. And my drive is not really there. Googling after that lead me to asexuality.

I, after working on it, can give oral now. I can do a few sex positions. I can discuss sex. But, I still blush red and feel silly and embarrassed doing anything too adventurous. Negative views of sex due to even family traumas are hard to change (funny enough, my own abuses gave me fewer negative opinions than theirs), even if she wants to. And if she does, she will probably still be a person with a low libido.

Now, the asexual non-libidoist issues with sex for me are: I cannot enjoy it physically and it isn't emotionally bonding for me. It is a boring chore. But, it isn't traumatic, just... like doing the laundry. I prefer to give than receive. I prefer it is over quickly. And sex takes a lot out of me. Emotionally and mentally, it can be exhausting if too frequent. Having sex when not interested is taxing.

Your partner is probably compromising as best she can. If it is not enough for you, talk about it. Try to not word it as something she is doing wrong, but voice your needs. If she cannot provide them, then there is no shame in breaking up over it. If my partner didn't like my pets we would be over. My friend needs a clubbing girl with similar music tastes. You need sex. These are all valid things. Admitting you are not compatible even though you are in love is not wrong.

[Kanenas]

Kanenas, I'm not saying that she should break up over sex, I'm just making it clear that it's not pathetic if it turns out that way. There are plenty of asexual people who have done the breaking up because they didn't want sex as often or in the manner they were comfortable...if it's not pathetic for them to break up over sex, it shouldn't be for sexual people either.

First of all, thank you for explaining what you think was wrong with my statement. Please keep in mind that English is not my first language and that I was simply trying to transport my own feelings with that message. I was in a situation once, were my ex girlfriend said to me "you either have sex with me or I will break up with you". I told her to break up with me, then. She didn't. Instead, over the next weeks, she told me that basically everything is wrong with me, that I am ruining her life and that if I loved her, I would have sex with her. In that moment, I felt really pathetic. She was trying to shame me and, honestly, managed to make me feel bad for a long time. But after that, I realized that it's not me, the one who was honest from the beginning, but her insensitivity and manipulation that was pathetic. I might need to mention here that she posed as indifferent to sex after hearing my views on it. So, maybe I personalized the message a little too much, no evil intent. I am not sex negative, just deeply concerned about consent.

As you say, breaking up over sex is something I find really pathetic and, going one step further, will probably damage her more for future interactions

This is completely unacceptable.

So, sexuals have to do whatever asexuals want no matter how miserable it makes them because, what, asexuals are too fragile to handle break ups? No one, EVER, has a right to make their feelings someone else's responsibility.

That's not what I was saying at all! I am agreeing with the last part of your statement. It is my personal opinion though that it's "better" to not have sex for the sexual than to have sex for the (not indifferent, but repulsed or traumatized) asexual, if they are really stuck between two rocks. Hypothetically, the worst case scenario would be the sexual cheating then and from there on, people handle things differently. That is a mental hurt and can create trust problems, but I personally do not think that it is as traumatizing as non consensual sex. Progeriac, thankfully, said how concerned she was about this as well and that she would never want to force her girlfriend to do these things.

Your partner is probably compromising as best she can. If it is not enough for you, talk about it. Try to not word it as something she is doing wrong, but voice your needs. If she cannot provide them, then there is no shame in breaking up over it. If my partner didn't like my pets we would be over. My friend needs a clubbing girl with similar music tastes. You need sex. These are all valid things. Admitting you are not compatible even though you are in love is not wrong.

I can totally see what you mean, comparing it to pets, for example. Like I previously said, it is only fair of her girlfriend to be straightforward with her. If I were in progeriac's shoes, I'd feel like the lack of communication is what questions this relationship, not the lack of sex in the first place.

[Guest]

As you say, breaking up over sex is something I find really pathetic and, going one step further, will probably damage her more for future interactions

This is completely unacceptable.

So, sexuals have to do whatever asexuals want no matter how miserable it makes them because, what, asexuals are too fragile to handle break ups? No one, EVER, has a right to make their feelings someone else's responsibility.

That's not what I was saying at all! I am agreeing with the last part of your statement. It is my personal opinion though that it's "better" to not have sex for the sexual than to have sex for the (not indifferent, but repulsed or traumatized) asexual, if they are really stuck between two rocks. Hypothetically, the worst case scenario would be the sexual cheating then and from there on, people handle things differently. That is a mental hurt and can create trust problems, but I personally do not think that it is as traumatizing as non consensual sex. Progeriac, thankfully, said how concerned she was about this as well and that she would never want to force her girlfriend to do these things.

It isn't our place to judge which one would have it better or worse in the sex or no sex scenario. There have been sexuals that have considered suicide because they felt stuck in a no sex relationship where their partner wouldn't compromise, they felt unattractive, undesirable and their self-esteem had bottomed out. Denying yourself sex is traumatizing to some sexuals. Sex is traumatizing for some asexuals. "Blame game" and "who has it worse game" are not good things to play in a mixed relationship. Both sides can be hurting pretty badly. I don't think the OP is the type that is going to rape their partner. And if they are worried about pressuring, I doubt they would manipulate someone like your ex did - which was wrong on your ex's part. Saying "I need sex or this isn't working" is one thing, using it as an empty threat and then berating and insulting someone when they say they can't fulfill your need is manipulation and verbal abuse. But, a lot of sexuals are not like that. :)

What is "better" is if a compromise that makes both parties content cannot be reached, to break up. Either party can, at any time, if they feel they are being hurt by the relationship and it isn't going to get better.

[Guest]

It is my personal opinion though that it's "better" to not have sex for the sexual than to have sex for the (not indifferent, but repulsed or traumatized) asexual, if they are really stuck between two rocks. Hypothetically, the worst case scenario would be the sexual cheating then and from there on, people handle things differently. That is a mental hurt and can create trust problems, but I personally do not think that it is as traumatizing as non consensual sex. Progeriac, thankfully, said how concerned she was about this as well and that she would never want to force her girlfriend to do these things.

Why do you say " Progeriac, thankfully, said how concerned she was about this as well and that she would never want to force her girlfriend to do these things."

Are you implying that the rest of us DO force sex? Because that's what it sounds like. Otherwise, I don't see the relevance of your sentence at all. We all agree that rape is bad, and it really irritates me when asexuals come over here to continuously preach anti-rape. NO DUH. No one is even remotely OK with rape, and rape was never brought up in any way, shape, or form, so I do not see why we're patting anyone on the back for not being a rapist.

Now then, what difference does it make who has it harder? Is it your contention that only the person who has it worse is allowed to care? So, if I'm miserable but my partner is more miserable (not that there's any way to know), then I have to shut up and "stick it out"? Why??? Why does it matter, even a little, how bad the other person has it? If someone isn't happy, they aren't happy. It isn't contigent on a comparison with their partner. Whether it is easier to have sex than not have sex is irrelevant.

It's been well documented on here that lack of sex leads to horrible, cripplingly low self esteem, depression, physical and emotional pain, lessening of feelings of love and companionship, resentment, etc. So let's knock off the "just don't have sex if your partner doesn't want sex" stuff.

Since Serran was so self-disclosive, I will be too. Trigger warning for sexual assault ahead:.

My dad is the victim and perpetrator of sexual assault. He grew up abused by his brothers, his mom's johns (my grandma was a prostitute), and he in turn assaulted cousins, etc.

He is also a marital rapist. He requires his wives to have sex every day. It was significant enough that even as kids we knew about this. Once when we were all staying in a hotel I watched him hold my mom down and rape her in front of me while she cried. His subsequent wives have all told me similar stories.

I was, unfortunately, raised in an environment where sex was demanded and taken. I was never touched. But that doesn't mean I don't have trauma from what I saw.

I can't leave my partner and I can't make her have sex. We have sex a couple times a year and I don't say much about it. It is what it is. Not every sexual has such bizarre marital rape trauma, and I hope those sexuals do what they need to do to be happy, including breaking up with people over sex if necessary.

I love that the asexuals love me because I'm so nice, loving, supportive of my partner. BUT, if anyone wonders why more sexuals aren't as "good" as I am about compromise, my answer is... because they're probably more psychologically healthy than me re: sex.

There is nothing wrong with wanting a great sex life. A great sex life really does have significant benefits that shouldn't be ignored just because asexuals exist. Compromise is great and is obviously an option for mixed relationships, but so is breaking up. And when people are as far apart as the OP and her girlfriend are, and are as young and inexperienced as they are, I think breaking up should be on the table as options.

OP, your girlfriend is the only person you've had sex with. Why not open up the relationship and getting some other experiences?

[progeriac]

Okay, but progeriac says she loves the girl and does not want to break up. It is a tough situation for sure, but there are many asexual-sexual couples out there who make it work. I have not been lucky enough to be given love genuinely and frequently, maybe I am enthusiastic because of my lack of experience. This might be the hopeless romantic speaking, then. But I do believe that love is worth fighting for!

In this case, the two would have to sit down and talk about, like you just mentioned, their limits. And if they cannot find a comfortable spot... Well, assuming that we share the same opinion on cheating, I will bring up open relationships or agreements in that direction, then. I personally could never accept that kind of relationship and would probably remove myself from the relationship the second it was brought up. But as we are trying to give a bit of advice here, I think it's okay to bring up things that come to my mind. What do you think your girlfriend would say? Is this something you would want, progeriac? Live out your sexuality with somebody other than your girlfriend, for the sake of fulfilling your sexual needs, or do you only want these types of interactions with the girlfriend you love?

An observation I have made is that most (sexual) people in relationships who are sexually experienced would not be happy with just masturbating whenever they wanted to release sexual tension, but request sex with their (or a) partner. Obviously, I cannot know this from own experience. But I presume that you feel this way, right?

I've thought about open relationships--I don't know how she'd handle that being brought up. Honestly I'm not sure how I would handle it either. Ideally, I can separate sex and love in the case of an open relationship but obviously considering the problem I'm having in my relationship now, I don't see them as separate things. I'm also just not very experienced--I didn't realize I was gay or attracted to women whatsoever until I started seeing my current gf, so my views and experiences are all based on what has happened with her.

Yes, for me, masturbation and sex are two very different things. I can have better orgasms by myself because I've been doing it for so long and like, it's my body, I know what to do and no communication is needed. But it's not the same because there is no connection to another person. For me sex is, at least in the context of this relationship, about being close and intimate, and orgasm is a bonus. The best analogy I can make is that masturbation is a McDonald's hamburger--it tastes good and sometimes you just really want shitty food and it does the job of relieving hunger--but sex is a Filet Mignon--a much better experience, even though both are just beef. Does that make sense?

TMI and TW:SA : Do not read further if these bother you.

I am asexual and in a mixed relationship. I also have no libido. I do not masturbate, at all, ever. I can also kind of get where your partner comes from with the family with sexual abuse causing issues.

Now, some things I haven't really shared on AVEN before in detail, but I feel like maybe your partner may be having some of the same issues, so I will go over some TMI stuff:

I grew up with a Grandmother who was married five times, four were abusive rapists. She half raised me, she and my mom were my parents, my dad was just a paycheck. My mom was raped at fourteen by a guy when she said no after making out with him. Both of them dealt with it with anger, resentment and seeking no help. This has made them very anti-sex and very bitter towards men and sexual relationships in general. This is what I was raised with. My mom was very open about sex, I knew it all by nine - even what 69ing was. But, overall, I knew they both considered sex something ... almost evil.

Now, my upbringing is part of why it took me so long to realize I was different and asexual non-libidoist. But, it also has made me uncomfortable with many aspects of sex. I will NOT touch a dildo, even though I will tolerate my boyfriend using it, it is rather gross to me. It took me 10 years of being sexually active to be OK with oral sex. It took years to stop feeling uncomfortable doing all but the most basic parts of sex. It took years to stop viewing sex as negative. After that, I was able to sort through huh I really don't enjoy this. And my drive is not really there. Googling after that lead me to asexuality.

I, after working on it, can give oral now. I can do a few sex positions. I can discuss sex. But, I still blush red and feel silly and embarrassed doing anything too adventurous. Negative views of sex due to even family traumas are hard to change (funny enough, my own abuses gave me fewer negative opinions than theirs), even if she wants to. And if she does, she will probably still be a person with a low libido.

Now, the asexual non-libidoist issues with sex for me are: I cannot enjoy it physically and it isn't emotionally bonding for me. It is a boring chore. But, it isn't traumatic, just... like doing the laundry. I prefer to give than receive. I prefer it is over quickly. And sex takes a lot out of me. Emotionally and mentally, it can be exhausting if too frequent. Having sex when not interested is taxing.

Your partner is probably compromising as best she can. If it is not enough for you, talk about it. Try to not word it as something she is doing wrong, but voice your needs. If she cannot provide them, then there is no shame in breaking up over it. If my partner didn't like my pets we would be over. My friend needs a clubbing girl with similar music tastes. You need sex. These are all valid things. Admitting you are not compatible even though you are in love is not wrong.

Serran--thank you for sharing all of this. The perspective really did help. I think my girlfriend's situation is similar in a lot of way--she is able and even enjoys doing things with me that she says she never would have done with her exes. The difference between you two I think is that she does see it as emotionally bonding.

It is my personal opinion though that it's "better" to not have sex for the sexual than to have sex for the (not indifferent, but repulsed or traumatized) asexual, if they are really stuck between two rocks. Hypothetically, the worst case scenario would be the sexual cheating then and from there on, people handle things differently. That is a mental hurt and can create trust problems, but I personally do not think that it is as traumatizing as non consensual sex. Progeriac, thankfully, said how concerned she was about this as well and that she would never want to force her girlfriend to do these things.

Why do you say " Progeriac, thankfully, said how concerned she was about this as well and that she would never want to force her girlfriend to do these things."

Are you implying that the rest of us DO force sex? Because that's what it sounds like. Otherwise, I don't see the relevance of your sentence at all. We all agree that rape is bad, and it really irritates me when asexuals come over here to continuously preach anti-rape. NO DUH. No one is even remotely OK with rape, and rape was never brought up in any way, shape, or form, so I do not see why we're patting anyone on the back for not being a rapist.

Now then, what difference does it make who has it harder? Is it your contention that only the person who has it worse is allowed to care? So, if I'm miserable but my partner is more miserable (not that there's any way to know), then I have to shut up and "stick it out"? Why??? Why does it matter, even a little, how bad the other person has it? If someone isn't happy, they aren't happy. It isn't contigent on a comparison with their partner. Whether it is easier to have sex than not have sex is irrelevant.

It's been well documented on here that lack of sex leads to horrible, cripplingly low self esteem, depression, physical and emotional pain, lessening of feelings of love and companionship, resentment, etc. So let's knock off the "just don't have sex if your partner doesn't want sex" stuff.

Since Serran was so self-disclosive, I will be too. Trigger warning for sexual assault ahead:.

My dad is the victim and perpetrator of sexual assault. He grew up abused by his brothers, his mom's johns (my grandma was a prostitute), and he in turn assaulted cousins, etc.

He is also a marital rapist. He requires his wives to have sex every day. It was significant enough that even as kids we knew about this. Once when we were all staying in a hotel I watched him hold my mom down and rape her in front of me while she cried. His subsequent wives have all told me similar stories.

I was, unfortunately, raised in an environment where sex was demanded and taken. I was never touched. But that doesn't mean I don't have trauma from what I saw.

I can't leave my partner and I can't make her have sex. We have sex a couple times a year and I don't say much about it. It is what it is. Not every sexual has such bizarre marital rape trauma, and I hope those sexuals do what they need to do to be happy, including breaking up with people over sex if necessary.

I love that the asexuals love me because I'm so nice, loving, supportive of my partner. BUT, if anyone wonders why more sexuals aren't as "good" as I am about compromise, my answer is... because they're probably more psychologically healthy than me re: sex.

There is nothing wrong with wanting a great sex life. A great sex life really does have significant benefits that shouldn't be ignored just because asexuals exist. Compromise is great and is obviously an option for mixed relationships, but so is breaking up. And when people are as far apart as the OP and her girlfriend are, and are as young and inexperienced as they are, I think breaking up should be on the table as options.

OP, your girlfriend is the only person you've had sex with. Why not open up the relationship and getting some other experiences?

Thank you for your responses. Obviously I have zero intentions of raping anyone or anything like that--I'm not a piece of shit--but because my girlfriend does have the background she does and because she perceives things that I personally think are no big deal (ie, oral sex, dildos) as big things, I worry that she'll think I'm pressuring her when I have no intentions of doing that. I think that making out with her and trying to be sexy or something (lol I can't take myself seriously as being "sexy" but whatever) is initiating, but I don't want her to feel pressured. Does this make sense? I have no intentions of pressuring her, and I think me trying so hard not to might inhibit communication.

I do want a great sex life. I'm young and recently out and want to experience things, but I also really love my girlfriend. She is my best friend, like I said, and thinking about not cuddling her and thinking about her being this close with someone else makes me so sad. I don't want to break up with her, I just want things to get better. I know that is unrealistic. To be 100% honest, the ideal thing would be to experiment with my sexuality and still be in a relationship with her--but that's selfish. To me I love her and value our relationship more than I want a good sex life but it also makes me sad because I wish she felt the same way I do.

Sorry my responses are so ramble-y. Thanks everyone for responding! Sorry it caused an argument, lol.

[Guest]

If experimenting and exploring your sexuality is something you need, then I would say bring up the open relationship and see what she says. Talking about it is not doing it, so it's not like you'd be cheating just to ask her feelings on it. Just reassure her that you love her, want to be with her, but there is also this need to explore your new found sexuality that you have to satisfy eventually and you respect her too much to push her into it, since you know she's not comfortable. It's possible to voice your own needs without coercing. There is a big difference between the two. Saying "I need sex and to explore more sexual practices, I understand if you cannot give me this. But, I do feel it's something I need in my life" is not pressuring her to do it. It's stating a need. Then you two can decide together how to meet that need, or if it's even possible within the relationship.

[Kanenas]

Progeriac, I imagine how your girlfriend feels uncomfortable to even talk about this. I think I was like this at one point, too. But I think it is perfectly fine of you to bring this topic up again. By avoiding the conversation, your girlfriend leaves you hanging. Kind of like she would expect the problem to solve itself. A clear statement on her side - "I don't want sex" - "We can agree to sex X times" - "It's okay for you to have sex with other people" - "I'm not okay with you having sex with other people" - will give you something, anything, to react to. I don't think you should call such an agreement selfish, it is what it is, an agreement! If you can separate love and sex and your girlfriend would rather let you do it with somebody else than with her, there is nothing selfish about it.

The reason I support what you say, that you don't want to break up, is because I heard so, so many people say that if they do not get want they want in the bedroom, they will end the relationship immediately. And you did not say that at all. It sounds like you love the girl a lot and are trying to compromise really heavily. You don't have to, you don't owe her - But you are looking for a solution because you want to make the relationship work and that is sweet! I hope that your girlfriend will do the same thing for you.

Skull, you come off as a little aggressive towards me. And I have no intention of giving any of that back. I am positive that if we were to have this conversation face to face, neither of us would be offended by what the other said. You are reading into it a little too much. To answer your question, no, I am not implying anything. If I wish to make a statement, I simply do so. I am confident in my opinions and have no trouble speaking my mind. If I had the hideous mindset that sexuals were monsters, I would say so. And guess what, besides being entitled to my opinion (which is not what you believe it to be at all), I cannot do more than mention that it is my personal one only and not a fact.

[Lucinda]

Why not redefine your relationship for what it really is -- a best friendship?! You can love your best friend and value the relationship you have with your best friend, as you already know. Perhaps your first sexual experience was a positive for you because it was with your best friend. You seemed to have learned alot about yourself which is a good thing, I would think. :)

However, trying to fit the relationship as it is into the relationship you would want it to be is like fitting a square peg into a round hole. Doesn't that explain why you are at your wit's end?

Aren't best friendships both positive and open by their very definition? I know they are for me. :)

All the best,

Lucinda

[Notte stellata]

Why not redefine your relationship for what it really is -- a best friendship?! You can love your best friend and value the relationship you have with your best friend, as you already know. Perhaps your first sexual experience was a positive for you because it was with your best friend. You seemed to have learned alot about yourself which is a good thing, I would think. :)

However, trying to fit the relationship as it is into the relationship you would want it to be is like fitting a square peg into a round hole. Doesn't that explain why you are at your wit's end?

Aren't best friendships both positive and open by their very definition? I know they are for me. :)

Exactly my thought on many similar mixed relationship stories on AVEN. If you're unhappy with your relationship, but love your partner too much to leave them, why not turn the romantic relationship into a best friendship? No, it's not "just" a best friendship, and the transition is not necessarily a downgrade. A best friendship is love, and if you also want other stuff like a shared life together, who says you can't have that with your best friend? Relationships don't have to be all or nothing. If we can break down our relationship needs and fulfill different needs with different people, our relationships will be much less stressful.

[WhenSummersGone]

Why not redefine your relationship for what it really is -- a best friendship?! You can love your best friend and value the relationship you have with your best friend, as you already know. Perhaps your first sexual experience was a positive for you because it was with your best friend. You seemed to have learned alot about yourself which is a good thing, I would think. :)

However, trying to fit the relationship as it is into the relationship you would want it to be is like fitting a square peg into a round hole. Doesn't that explain why you are at your wit's end?

Aren't best friendships both positive and open by their very definition? I know they are for me. :)

Exactly my thought on many similar mixed relationship stories on AVEN. If you're unhappy with your relationship, but love your partner too much to leave them, why not turn the romantic relationship into a best friendship? No, it's not "just" a best friendship, and the transition is not necessarily a downgrade. A best friendship is love, and if you also want other stuff like a shared life together, who says you can't have that with your best friend? Relationships don't have to be all or nothing. If we can break down our relationship needs and fulfill different needs with different people, our relationships will be much less stressful.

I think it depends on how an asexual would define a relationship. The asexual may not see a relationship as a friendship so this may be hurtful. Even as someone who recently identifies as Demisexual I would be hurt if I started dating someone and they called it a friendship.

[Kitty Spoon Train]

Relationships don't have to be all or nothing. If we can break down our relationship needs and fulfill different needs with different people, our relationships will be much less stressful.

Wisdom.

[WhenSummersGone]

Relationships don't have to be all or nothing. If we can break down our relationship needs and fulfill different needs with different people, our relationships will be much less stressful.

Wisdom.

Except for those who are into monogamy, which is why communication is important. Find someone who is into opened relationships and it's better.

[Notte stellata]

Relationships don't have to be all or nothing. If we can break down our relationship needs and fulfill different needs with different people, our relationships will be much less stressful.

Wisdom.

Except for those who are into monogamy, which is why communication is important. Find someone who is into opened relationships and it's better.

Even for monogamists, it's still possible to have a monogamous romantic-sexual relationship with one person, and a live-in best friendship with another, and the two relationships can be equally important. Of course, for many people a romantic relationship is incomplete without cohabitation, but for a large part it's just because they've never thought of other possibilities.

[WhenSummersGone]

Relationships don't have to be all or nothing. If we can break down our relationship needs and fulfill different needs with different people, our relationships will be much less stressful.

Wisdom.

Except for those who are into monogamy, which is why communication is important. Find someone who is into opened relationships and it's better.

Even for monogamists, it's still possible to have a monogamous romantic-sexual relationship with one person, and a live-in best friendship with another, and the two relationships can be equally important. Of course, for many people a romantic relationship is incomplete without cohabitation, but for a large part it's just because they've never thought of other possibilities.

I agree. A relationship and friends are good, but having more than one romantic/sexual partner varies depending on the people involved. I know I would have a problem if a romantic partner wanted sex with other people.

[Guest]

I disagree and believe a friendship to be a downgrade. I think almost everyone feels the same... if it wasn't, we wouldn't be sad during break ups, we'd be happy. When a friendship ends and becomes a romantic relationship, people don't mourn the loss of the friendship but say "it's ok, we're still girlfriends". But when a romantic relationship ends and becomes a friendship, there is a sadness and mourning because it really is a loss. It's nearly universally understood - and reflected by people's actual feelings and responses - that a romantic relationship is a step up from friendship... largely because romantic partners are also friends, but not all friends are romantic partners. One encompasses the other but not vice versa.

Anyway. An open relationship adopted as a relationship saver exists for one reason only... so the people can find new partners before ending the first relationship and thereby avoid a painful breakup. It's a coward's way to break up, because you maintain emotional intimacy until it's being supplied by someone else. That being said, if it's the only way a person will leave, so be it. Its a pretty common way of ending relationships.

Kan - you've continued to make it clear that you think sexuals who stay with their asexual partners are better than those who don't. Even though I'm one of the people in the group you seem to like, I don't care... I still think it's wrong. Sexuals who stay are no better... and likely have just made sure they will be less happy than they could be with someone else... so the "it's so sweet!" and other pats on the back that you're giving really really bother me. And I am positive that I would disagree with you to your face. Oh, and EDIT. It was pretty aggressive calling me out personally and starting this side conversation, so.

[Lady Girl]

Personally speaking, there are going to be pluses and minuses whether one is involved in a poly situation or a monogamous relationship.

It often seems to me that people who prefer poly relationships sometimes speak in ways that make monogamous people look as though they aren't "enlightened" and that if they would just open their minds to all the satisfying characteristics of polyamory their problems would be solved. I don't think that's always the case...there can be issues with time, attention, and juggling it all. I personally don't really relate to the comparison to having more than one child and the ability to love them all either, it's not the same kind of relationship to me.

I think sometimes monogamous people are too quick to dismiss the possibility that others genuinely prefer a poly arrangement, implying somehow that their love isn't as deep or as great for multiple partners. There might be some social stigma connected to it, which is sad when so many people have different lifestyles and arrangements regarding relationships...they all should be acceptable if all the parties involved prefer it. I said I didn't relate to the loving more than one child comparison, but I do relate to being able to have romantic feelings for more than one person at the same time, even though it isn't what I want.

Sadly, I have now helped to derail this thread again. I'm sorry progeriac! I do think if you really want to experiment outside of the relationship be sure to be up front with your girlfriend about it, as I'm sure you would. You might not get her blessing and even so, she still might want to stay with you. There are so many possibilities here. I know you feel torn...it's difficult to love/want to be with someone and be unhappy at the same time.

Edit: I also agree with Skullery, seeking romance outside the relationship is often the beginning of the end...on the rare occasion, it shows you who are with is indeed the one you want to be your partner. If the latter is true, it's probably even more rare if they can stand for you to figure it out that way.

[Guest]

Of course, for many people a romantic relationship is incomplete without cohabitation, but for a large part it's just because they've never thought of other possibilities.

Cite your sources.

Most people have roommates during their life. Most people eventually move out of their friends' places and in with romantic partners because that's what they genuinely want to do. Everyone I've known who moves in with partners does so excitedly, because it is what they actually want. I guarantee that it occurred to all of us to stay in our shared apartments rather than move in with a date.

I think poly is a fine way to live, but it isn't a stopgap, it is a genuine lifestyle that should be motivated by internal factors. It isn't going to save what is, at its heart, a monogamous relationship.

[WhenSummersGone]

I agree with friendship being a downgrade, maybe I misread what was being said. For me I would feel my romantic feelings aren't being returned if someone just wanted to be friends with me. I would be hurt by that and I have been hurt in my past from lack of feelings from someone else.

[Notte stellata]

I disagree and believe a friendship to be a downgrade. I think almost everyone feels the same... if it wasn't, we wouldn't be sad during break ups, we'd be happy. When a friendship ends and becomes a romantic relationship, people don't mourn the loss of the friendship but say "it's ok, we're still girlfriends". But when a romantic relationship ends and becomes a friendship, there is a sadness and mourning because it really is a loss. It's nearly universally understood - and reflected by people's actual feelings and responses - that a romantic relationship is a step up from friendship... largely because romantic partners are also friends, but not all friends are romantic partners. One encompasses the other but not vice versa.

That's generally true, but I think it largely depends on how people see friendship and romance. Normally people are sad about breaking up, because once they're downgraded to friends, they can no longer share a life together, be each other's top priority, or be physically and emotionally intimate with each other - these things are reserved to romantic relationships only. But what if you can still have all (or at least some of) these things as friends? Of course, if one person still has one-sided romantic feelings for the other, they may still be sad. I'm not saying it's always a happy ending. But there are cases where two people mutually realize a romantic relationship doesn't work for them, so they both agree to be friends, and the friendship is even more enjoyable (and no less significant) than their previous romantic relationship.

Most people have roommates during their life. Most people eventually move out of their friends' places and in with romantic partners because that's what they genuinely want to do. Everyone I've known who moves in with partners does so excitedly, because it is what they actually want. I guarantee that it occurred to all of us to stay in our shared apartments rather than move in with a date.

I think poly is a fine way to live, but it isn't a stopgap, it is a genuine lifestyle that should be motivated by internal factors. It isn't going to save what is, at its heart, a monogamous relationship.

I don't deny most people live with roommates at some point, but what I meant is most people think it's a given that a romantic relationship must include cohabitation, even if they end up fighting about household chores with their partner all the time and they may actually be better life partners with a friend. And I agree poly doesn't work for everyone. My point is even for mono people, it may help to see relationships in a more flexible way without giving up monogamy.

[WhenSummersGone]

I disagree and believe a friendship to be a downgrade. I think almost everyone feels the same... if it wasn't, we wouldn't be sad during break ups, we'd be happy. When a friendship ends and becomes a romantic relationship, people don't mourn the loss of the friendship but say "it's ok, we're still girlfriends". But when a romantic relationship ends and becomes a friendship, there is a sadness and mourning because it really is a loss. It's nearly universally understood - and reflected by people's actual feelings and responses - that a romantic relationship is a step up from friendship... largely because romantic partners are also friends, but not all friends are romantic partners. One encompasses the other but not vice versa.

That's generally true, but I think it largely depends on how people see friendship and romance. Normally people are sad about breaking up, because once they're downgraded to friends, they can no longer share a life together, be each other's top priority, or be physically and emotionally intimate with each other - these things are reserved to romantic relationships only. But what if you can still have all (or at least some of) these things as friends? Of course, if one person still has one-sided romantic feelings for the other, they may still be sad. I'm not saying it's always a happy ending. But there are cases where two people mutually realize a romantic relationship doesn't work for them, so they both agree to be friends, and the friendship is even more enjoyable (and no less significant) than their previous romantic relationship.

Most people have roommates during their life. Most people eventually move out of their friends' places and in with romantic partners because that's what they genuinely want to do. Everyone I've known who moves in with partners does so excitedly, because it is what they actually want. I guarantee that it occurred to all of us to stay in our shared apartments rather than move in with a date.

I think poly is a fine way to live, but it isn't a stopgap, it is a genuine lifestyle that should be motivated by internal factors. It isn't going to save what is, at its heart, a monogamous relationship.

I don't deny most people live with roommates at some point, but what I meant is most people think it's a given that a romantic relationship must include cohabitation, even if they end up fighting about household chores with their partner all the time and they may actually be better life partners with a friend. And I agree poly doesn't work for everyone. My point is even for mono people, it may help to see relationships in a more flexible way without giving up monogamy.

This isn't true or possible for everyone. I personally don't do friends with benefits and I'm sure some other people are the same way. Once a break up happens I'm basically done in every way with that person.

My point is to talk things over with your partner, but be prepared for disagreement and even a break up if your partner views things differently. Some asexuals do want a relationship, at least that's what I'm seeing on this site, and not just a friendship or opened relationship.

[Guest]

. Some asexuals do want a relationship, at least that's what I'm seeing on this site, and not just a friendship or opened relationship.

What a person wants varies and the value of each type of relationship depends on the person. But, there is never any harm in discussing options. Opening up a relationship should not be done if EITHER party is not on board with the idea - as in, thinks it's a good idea, won't be hurt and wants to actually do it and not just do it because they feel it's the only option beyond breaking up. Some people don't even think about it though until it's brought up, so no harm in discussing each others feelings and interests in each option.