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A Frustrated "Sexual"


UndergoingMitosis

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UndergoingMitosis

I'm a straight woman dating a self-identified asexual man.

I don't really know what I thought about his asexuality at the beginning. I really didn't think it was real. We had a pretty standard highly sexed early relationship. He initiated, I initiated, he seemed happy, I was happy--I nearly forgot about his weird two a.m. pre-relationship outing speech. Then he started to talk about how sex with his ex had become a chore, and how much strain that put on his relationship. He started to initiate less, and I was suddenly afraid to, for fear I was burdening him with my sexuality or some such nonsense.

We talked, he said that he liked sex because I liked it, and he liked to make me happy. That I shouldn't worry, that he wouldn't let it get to the point where sex seemed like a chore.

I'm still not really understanding this whole asexuality thing anyway. The way he's been talking just seems like he has a low sex drive and seeing a woman get off is an important part of whatever sex drive he has--which was definitely fine by me. He certainly hasn't acted like someone who doesn't like sex at all, and yet he *says* he doesn't like it. He insists that when he's initiating it's not "charity"--it's because he legitimately wants to have sex, but what he gets out of it is seeing me enjoy myself. But...isn't knowing your partner's needs are being fulfilled a large part of many people's sexualities? How can he claim to not be sexual if he likes having sex (if not as often as I would like)? Thus, my first reaction was to dismiss his "asexuality" as just a word he chose to describe his relatively low sex drive. Still, he kept bringing it up, and I started to believe him, that he was different, that he really wasn't enjoying sex the same way I was, the way I wanted to share with him.

The rest of our relationship has been a dream, but I'm iffy about the bedroom. I'm still nervous about initiating, because he *does* get frustrated when I ask for too much, despite his assertions to the contrary. Mostly, though, I'm finding that I don't feel as good about the sex we do have, because I don't like the feeling that he's not getting as much out of our life in the between the sheets as I am. Which in turn is lowering *my* sexual satisfaction, which is lowering *his*...It doesn't make for a very fulfilling sex life. I've never thought of myself as the kind of person who *needs* sex--I've been single for long stretches of time (over a year) without really missing sex. This is the first time I've really had to decide if sex is a thing that I need *in* a relationship, and I think I'm falling on the side of yes. And I really want the sexual component of our relationship to be mutually fulfilling.

How do you other "sexuals" deal with...well, sex? I'm really just looking for someone who has felt similarly in the past, or is maybe feeling this way now. I'm also still a little fuzzy on this whole asexuality business in the first place--I'd heard of it before somewhere, and I had blindly accepted it as something real. Now, though...I watched the documentary. I've talked about it with my boyfriend. I've read a little on these forums, and the more I look the more I'm convinced that asexuality as I had imagined it to be, in that you don't feel *any* sex drive or sexual attraction or derive *any* pleasure from sex is EXCEEDINGLY rare. I really, really don't want to offend anyone here, and I'm really not trying to invalidate anyone's identity (sexual or otherwise)--I'm just trying to understand. This whole gray area where you sometimes have and enjoy sex doesn't really seem "asexual" to me, but my boyfriend insists that he's different from "sexual" people, and that he doesn't feel the same as other people do when they have sex, and he doesn't experience sexual attraction in the same way. But how does he know how other people feel during sex? How does he know how other, "sexual" people experience sexual attraction?

While I recognize that he's found peace in this identity, has made me feel guilty about wanting sex for the very first time in my life (quite a feat, considering my catholic, no-sex-before-marriage upbringing). I feel like I'm betraying myself a little in this relationship--I'm having sex with a person, who by his own admission, does not find me sexually attractive and does not like having sex with me. The fact that he asserts that does not have those things with other people is not making me feel better in practice.

I really want to reiterate that except for the sex, this is a great relationship. I'm hoping that some of you will have some much needed perspective that will untie these mental knots I've been tying over the last few months.

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Asexuality is a lack of sexual attraction towards other people. Whether or not people enjoy it or their feelings about doing it vary. Libido can also vary between asexuals. Some still have a physical desire despite not being attracted to other people per say, others feel nothing at all.

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Asexuality (the grey area) is also described as having sexual attraction but not enough to act upon it, or not having the desire to act upon it.

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Asexuality is lack of sexual attraction (sex drive/libido is separate), and not necessarily the lack of sexuality ('sexuality' can be a broad term). Some asexual people can enjoy sex, and he could be one of them; if it's not the act itself that's enjoyed, some may enjoy sex with their partner because they can get happiness from making their partner happy. That can be done without the asexual partner facing coercion or peer pressure, if that's what you're concerned about.

When he said he wasn't enjoying sex the same way you do, or has the same feelings as other people about sex, that may mean he naturally doesn't seek it out (from lack of sexual attraction), or at least doesn't have sex for the sake of sex, but for a secondary reason (i.e: because you enjoy it). Are you concerned that asking him for sex at all is pressuring him, and is that concern making you feel guilty, despite what he says? You should tell him these concerns because it is making the relationship less satisfying for both of you, and alleviating that guilt should make both of you feel better and improve the relationship.

Asexuality, or the asexual spectrum is diverse, so you should also ask how asexuality affects him personally, because that could resolve some of the apparent contradictions in his behavior. If sex is low enough on your priorities, and you didn't feel you were 'missing' it, you could agree to make the relationship nonsexual if that'll make both of you happier.

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except for the sex, this is a great relationship

many of us here in the same situation as you. unfortunately there's no easy solution. only you can decide whether to stick it out and find a compromise or not.

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It sounds like your partner has a grip on his own identity and is up front and has enough experience to keep himself enjoying it. So, yes he may not enjoy it the SAME WAY you enjoy it, but take him at his word that it's enjoyable for him. I enjoy the closeness, the physical touch, the kissing, the holding... but not the sexual physical sensations of sex that people love (I don't even like orgasms). Others enjoy the physical and the emotional, but have no drive for doing it with someone.

I look at it this way. I don't ENJOY comedies for themselves, if alone comedy is one of the last things I will watch. I find them silly. But, I watch comedies with my boyfriend and while I still find the show stupid, I enjoy the time / sharing with him. I view sex the same way ... if it was solely up to me and no one else involved, I would choose to never have sex again. But, with a partner, I can enjoy certain aspects enough. Now, my partner has it at 4 days a week so it does often feel like a chore, but if it's not too often I can enjoy it enough.

Asexuality has a varied amount of people in it. Some enjoy sex, orgasm, etc. Some do not. Some are repulsed, some are not. It sounds like your partner is non-repulsed and enjoys it, as long as it isn't too often. Compromise should be pretty easy with him. Just because he doesn't view sex in quite the same way as you, doesn't mean it means any less to him. Asexual means no sexual ATTRACTION and some move that definition to no SEXUAL DESIRE (partnered sex), but it doesn't mean no enjoyment out of the act or inability to perform or lack of masturbation etc.

Now, whether you can be satisfied with a lower amount than you like, or that he may not have the same urges/needs you do even if he compromises, is totally up to you to decide. It's entirely possible the sex will continue to get less and less frequent as the relationship goes on. Or it might not. There is no guarantee, but there is also no guarantee in a sexual/sexual relationship either. Weigh your pros/cons and decide if this is something you can handle. He was honest with you, up front about his sexuality and his issues with sex, so figure out what you want and be honest with him. No one should think badly of you if you decide a better sex life is something you require. :)

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Hi and welcome to AVEN. I've done the mental knot tying a couple few times and then untied and retied them. It's hard not to do when it comes to sex and your partner telling you they identify differently than you do. I don't think all asexual people focus on the lack of attraction as much when they are with someone. It seems like often the avoidance of sexual interaction, and as you mentioned, his feeling it is a chore becomes the bigger deal. I feel that one of the main differences between my husband and I is that I can't help but associate being or feeling loved with having sex and I don't think he does at all. This is one of my favorite quotes...

For me, that lack of desire to have partnered sex is much more telling than that ambiguous term that is sexual attraction. I experience some very strong aesthetic attraction which isn't so different from sexual attraction and often doesn't feel very different, in and of itself. What is very much different is the fact that I have no real desire to engage in sex at all.

I see that fundamental lack of desire for partnered sex to be the practical real life difference between sexuals and asexuals. I think if you ask any mixed partnership what the most difficult aspect of maintaining the relationship is, they aren't going to mention a lack of sexual attraction but are far more likely to mention that lack of sexual desire.

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Touchofinsight

I'm a straight woman dating a self-identified asexual man.

I'm still not really understanding this whole asexuality thing anyway. The way he's been talking just seems like he has a low sex drive and seeing a woman get off is an important part of whatever sex drive he has--which was definitely fine by me. He certainly hasn't acted like someone who doesn't like sex at all, and yet he *says* he doesn't like it. He insists that when he's initiating it's not "charity"--it's because he legitimately wants to have sex, but what he gets out of it is seeing me enjoy myself. But...isn't knowing your partner's needs are being fulfilled a large part of many people's sexualities? How can he claim to not be sexual if he likes having sex (if not as often as I would like)? Thus, my first reaction was to dismiss his "asexuality" as just a word he chose to describe his relatively low sex drive. Still, he kept bringing it up, and I started to believe him, that he was different, that he really wasn't enjoying sex the same way I was, the way I wanted to share with him.

The rest of our relationship has been a dream, but I'm iffy about the bedroom. I'm still nervous about initiating, because he *does* get frustrated when I ask for too much, despite his assertions to the contrary. Mostly, though, I'm finding that I don't feel as good about the sex we do have, because I don't like the feeling that he's not getting as much out of our life in the between the sheets as I am. Which in turn is lowering *my* sexual satisfaction, which is lowering *his*...It doesn't make for a very fulfilling sex life. I've never thought of myself as the kind of person who *needs* sex--I've been single for long stretches of time (over a year) without really missing sex. This is the first time I've really had to decide if sex is a thing that I need *in* a relationship, and I think I'm falling on the side of yes. And I really want the sexual component of our relationship to be mutually fulfilling.

I am one of these guys. I take care of my self via masturbation when I feel the need or desire to. The difference between me and him is for multiple reasons I refuse to deal with intercourse. I actually have made it a fun past time to be as good at foreplay as I can. I enjoy the idea of being able to make a woman reach climax multiple times in one sitting, finding their uncommon sensual areas etc etc. However I do not need or desire reciprocation of any kind, in fact I think I have come to the point where I prefer they don't.

We exist but you have to ask your self, is this an acceptable long term sex life for you? For some women men like us are dreams come true for others, well they feel the need to be desired sexually and fulfill their partner's needs.

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Down in Texas

I am afraid to say you are the only one that can determine if you need sex more than you are getting and whether or not your partner will be able to keep up what he is promising. None of us will be able to answer that question for you. What we can tell you is what we have experienced in our own relationships. We cannot presume to know about anyone else. So having said that, I will say I am a highly sexual female married for 40 years to what I recently figured out to be a Gray A. It took me almost 39 years to find the answer to our (my) problem. I was the female that wanted sex and he was happy with what he had. Yet our needs were miles apart even from the beginning. I can tell you that as the years have gone by things have gotten less and less active sexually. Now ED has entered the picture. Many will say there is no correlation between Asexuality and ED. I differ with their rational in that the brain is the largest sex organ in a human body. It is the main difference between Sexuals and Asexuals it all starts with the function of the brain and how it is processed in my opinion. My Gray-A has never enjoyed sex in the same way I have and now tells me he cannot remember any of the sex we have had throughout the years. I on the other hand can recall almost every sexual act we have had, I can dress to try to look desirable to him and he will not even notice that I have on something new let alone something provocative. For years, I undressed for bed at the foot of our bed and he never looked at me.

The best I can offer is that there are as many shades of Gray on both sides of the asexual /sexual spectrum and you can possible imagine. The other thing is you cannot change them any more than you can change yourself. There is no fix and most Asexuals will get offended if you use the word fix they do not feel they need fixing. I understand that there is liberation of the feeling of HAVING TO do something they do not enjoy. No one can tell you what to do all we can do is answer any question you may have if we can. Just know you will get many answers on this site some answers come from pain, some form fear and others form inexperience. Only you will know what pertains to you and only you will know what you can use, no two people are the same so use what you can and what you feel comfortable with and let the rest go.

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I am in I think the same boat as your boyfriend. My question is when you said he doesn't like sex does he dislike it? I don't like it but I'm indifferent so I don't mind doing it when she asks.

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Down in Texas

I am in I think the same boat as your boyfriend. My question is when you said he doesn't like sex does he dislike it? I don't like it but I'm indifferent so I don't mind doing it when she asks.

I am not trying to be a downer, rain on your parade, or cause you any Pain...However, just wants you to think....

How long will you be able to do that when you get older, sex becomes a routine, and you are not as interested in pleasing her after there are other factors that may diminish your ability?

My Gray A was fine for the first 15 years or a little longer before things really took a nosedive. In the beginning, the main problem was our lack of frequency and intensity. Sex was short and sweet in the beginning any never more than once in a day. Often told he would run out of sperm. I was young enough and naive enough to not know any better back then. You must remember this was before sex was as openly talked about as it is today.

Just please think about some of the things written by older sexuals if you plan on entering a mixed relationship. That is all I wish for you to do. Please do not think that things will always be the same as they are today while you have your youth.

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I am in I think the same boat as your boyfriend. My question is when you said he doesn't like sex does he dislike it? I don't like it but I'm indifferent so I don't mind doing it when she asks.

Just please think about some of the things written by older sexuals if you plan on entering a mixed relationship. That is all I wish for you to do. Please do not think that things will always be the same as they are today while you have your youth.

I personally feel that no young couple, regardless of their orientations, can count on things to be the same as they age. I think there are probably plenty of sexual w/sexual couples out there that have differing ideas about their sex life after children arrive, they have a mortgage on the house, or one of them gets a long distance trucking job. So many things can happen in life, and honestly, if there's anything I've noticed in the years I've been around it's that you can't warn people about being in love. They feel what they feel and if it works out long term it does, if it doesn't, then it doesn't.

I don't think it's reasonable for anyone to think things will be as they are in their youth. I also think, based on the differences from one person to another, that we can't predict with any certainty that every asexual is going to lose interest in pleasing their partner. It is a possibility...but that can and does happen with sexual people and their partners as well.

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For my gf personally, she understands that possibility and is ok with it. We have other compromises as well besides me just doing it for her. An example is I can cuddle her while she does stuff herself. The most important thing is our friendship, trust and emotional connection. We agree on almost everything else: politics, religion, etc and have most of the same hobbys. Sex is a small facet of our relationship. I know she doesn't ask for it as often as she wants for me but I try my best when she does for her. Luckily, we both love cuddles alot. Anyways, I guess each couple has to figure out how important sex is and what compromises can be made both ways. The important thing is don't settle now and demand something different later.

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Lady Girl always tries to be so kind..bless you; but truely, I believe what she says to partially true, as we age everything changes. What we are missing here is that we don't normally fall in opposite directions; sexually oriented people slow but continue to enjoy a mutual diminished frequency. That is not the case with the mixed orientation people. The sexual may slow but the asexual tends to stop. I have as many years in marriage as many of you in life and there are high points of any good marriage but the sexual high points were in the young unknowing years. The only thing that really, really changes is that the sexual gives up, becomes dishearted and give up. And if you can do this and survive, things do get better. If you want to know how older married life becomes, ask Down in Texas; if you don't want to know than disregard us older, cynical types. Don't forget..first you must give up!

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I have to disagree with oldandnew. I don't think we can say that mixed marriages always get worse as the couple gets older. That's making a generalization that may not fit every mixed couple. Likewise, sexual couples don't always have a mutually-diminished sex life; sometimes one partner feels much more sexual than the other, which can cause problems even when they're both the same orientation. I've heard that often from friends around my age.

I think the only thing that can be definitely said is that each couple is composed of two individuals, and no couple is exactly the same as any other couple -- same-orientation or mixed.

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Lady Girl always tries to be so kind..bless you; but truely, I believe what she says to partially true, as we age everything changes. What we are missing here is that we don't normally fall in opposite directions; sexually oriented people slow but continue to enjoy a mutual diminished frequency. That is not the case with the mixed orientation people. The sexual may slow but the asexual tends to stop. I have as many years in marriage as many of you in life and there are high points of any good marriage but the sexual high points were in the young unknowing years. The only thing that really, really changes is that the sexual gives up, becomes dishearted and give up. And if you can do this and survive, things do get better. If you want to know how older married life becomes, ask Down in Texas; if you don't want to know than disregard us older, cynical types. Don't forget..first you must give up!

I know my marriage isn't as old as Down's, but we are approaching 27 years and by some standards that's getting up there. I have to agree with Sally's assessment of these comments, not every sexual gives up or becomes disheartened, and not every asexual tends to stop. I don't believe things only get better if you give up, I believe they get better if you stay interested in your partner and want to stay together. I think it's wrong to say that the only truth can be had from older cynical types...

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Down in Texas

Lady Girl always tries to be so kind..bless you; but truely, I believe what she says to partially true, as we age everything changes. What we are missing here is that we don't normally fall in opposite directions; sexually oriented people slow but continue to enjoy a mutual diminished frequency. That is not the case with the mixed orientation people. The sexual may slow but the asexual tends to stop. I have as many years in marriage as many of you in life and there are high points of any good marriage but the sexual high points were in the young unknowing years. The only thing that really, really changes is that the sexual gives up, becomes dishearted and give up. And if you can do this and survive, things do get better. If you want to know how older married life becomes, ask Down in Texas; if you don't want to know than disregard us older, cynical types. Don't forget..first you must give up!

I know my marriage isn't as old as Down's, but we are approaching 27 years and by some standards that's getting up there. I have to agree with Sally's assessment of these comments, not every sexual gives up or becomes disheartened, and not every asexual tends to stop. I don't believe things only get better if you give up, I believe they only get better if you stay interested in your partner and want to stay together. I think it's wrong to say that the only truth can be had from older cynical types...

Unless you know that the couples you are talking about are both sexual, which would be hard to know, you have no way of knowing if they too may be of a mixed relationship and you do not know what goes on behind closed doors.

No one knows what I live from day to day. To anyone in our town they would think that my husband and I are the perfect match and that we get along greatly. I go with my husband all the time. We are seldom seen alone in town. I have worked beside him when he is not at his paying job, hand in hand. We have worked and hauled cattle together(I do all the driving he cannot back a cattle trailer), fixed fences together and I have been the one that has given all the shots that the cattle need. I am the one that always pulled any calves that needed help getting into this world and have been called to help many family friends when they have not been able to reach a Vet. in time. Yes, he was there helping but so was I. If there are home repairs to be made, I am there also I have often done repairs while he is at work. We attend church together and we DANCE usually only with each other.

What you say is true Sally even sexuals do not match in sexual needs which only makes it harder on mixed relationships to stay in a harmonious sexual compatible compromised greement. However, you cannot determine that just by looking at a couple (they could be Grays or even Mixed) their sexual history is unknown, WHOS sex lives have or have not changed cannot be determined simply from looking from the outside in. Unless you know firsthand then you cannot say that either.

I am not trying to pick a fight I am and have always spoken from my personal experience. I did not tell them it would happen, nor did I tell them to break up, I told them to think about it. It has been my experience that if there is not a desire to please a partner when the relationship is NEW it will become harder to maintain when they are years into that relationship and Life’s problems work their way into a relationship as all relationships experience. Life always has a way of putting bumps in the road. My intent was to have them think before walking blindly down a road we all have walked, in one form or another, whether it is a lifelong committed relationship or a marriage. Most of us ending in pain or we would not be on this site looking for answers or validation.

By the way I am a sexual all that have read my post will know that and I HAVE NOT GIVEN UP ON MY MARRIAGE nor did I suggest they give up. That does not mean that there has not been pain in dealing with the fact that my husband and I do not match sexually. HOWEVER, I have had to GIVE UP on my DREAMS AND EXPECTATIONS when it comes to sex.

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Down...I don't think anyone said that we know what goes on between couples. I think we all know that appearances are often different than the reality at home. I simply don't think anyone can predict what will happen in the future, and no one should expect it to stay the same regardless of their orientations.

Doing what you feel is best in your own situation is what I believe Sally and I both advocate. No two people are alike, no two couples are alike...no outsider knows what each person in a relationship feels in their heart. Sally and I took different paths in our relationships yet I'm sure we agree on these points and it's often what we say in posts here.

I happen to agree with her about sexual couples struggling with sexuality...why else would there be all this advice about spicing it up, having date night, don't let the spark die, etc. We don't know if one of them is asexual, but we can't assume that one is either.

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Down in Texas

Down...I don't think anyone said that we know what goes on between couples. I think we all know that appearances are often different than the reality at home. I simply don't think anyone can predict what will happen in the future, and no one should expect it to stay the same regardless of their orientations.

Doing what you feel is best in your own situation is what I believe Sally and I both advocate. No two people are alike, no two couples are alike...no outsider knows what each person in a relationship feels in their heart. Sally and I took different paths in our relationships yet I'm sure we agree on these points and it's often what we say in posts here.

I happen to agree with her about sexual couples struggling with sexuality...why else would there be all this advice about spicing it up, having date night, don't let the spark die, etc. We don't know if one of them is asexual, but we can't assume that one is either.

This is very true Lady, but she has come here looking for information. She said he told her about his asexuality and that it caused the breakup of his last relationship. We cannot do her justice by sugar coating the relationships that we all three have experienced pain in. Why over look problems that are already present in the beginning of this relationship. When this should be when the highest level of compressing, from both sides, exist while establishing a new relationship. Yes, there is the factor of LOVE but how long can that love survive before the pain starts to make it wilt. We should not give false hope to those that are already seeing problems in the relationship before there is a commitment. If we are going to furnish her with the information she came here looking for, we need to be honest with her. We need to share what happened in our relationship to give her a clear view of her options. It IS HER choice to decide if she wishes to stay or leave. Why should we cover our eyes and let her get into a possible marriage only to be where all three of us have been Five years down the road for her. Then when she comes back, due to her pain we tell her you knew what you were getting and tell her deal or leave. Why put her through that pain?

If you have noticed, I have advocated for compromises once there is an established committed relationship. It is only when I see people that have come here looking for help in a new relationship. A relationship that is in the early stages of progression. That is when I have voiced MY OPINION of what has happened in MY relationship, and pointed out the decrease that has occurred with my husband, (who is a high functioning Gray A). Yes, I understand we do not know what degree of Asexual he is nor do we know what degree of sexual she is. You can go back and read other post that I posted, speaking to Sexuals and Asexuals that are in a committed relationship and you will find a different point of advice striving to try to find a place where they can be comfortable. It is mainly the relationships that I see as NEW or short when there are already problems that I tell them ONLY from what has happened in my relationship and suggest they THINK about what they are getting in to and how much they are WILLING to give. Both of you may come from a different path but you both are dealing with the same set of problems. One welcomes the lack of sex (that does not mean she has not been hurt and she has voiced that she wishes she were different but we all know we cannot change who or what we are) while one wishes there was more.

I feel we should be fair, I do not think I have put a blanket on every one by saying what I have. I have tried to make sure I have always said it is what has happened to ME. In addition, that they must make the decisions for themselves that NO ONE has a right to tell them what or how to make that choice. Also that there are many shades of GRAY on both sides of the septum. But I FEEL that if we make it all sound like we are walking down a rose covered path then we are doing a great injustice to those that are asking for information.

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My information is always different than yours Down, because I'm a different person than you. I may go through some pain, and I usually say so, but I don't have strong regrets or bitter feelings. I post what I think and sometimes feel. I don't paint a rosy picture for anyone. I say what I see as truth when it comes to relationships based on my experience.

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I am NOT bitter only realistic.

Sorry, I shouldn't have used that word (however, pain didn't make my love wilt, I think that's why I said it). My real is different than your real. We have touched on it numerous times...every couple is different. New relationships aren't doomed because asexuality is part of it. We can't predict. I can tell my story just as you can. Mine is different from yours, not less real.

There are other asexual and sexual people on this site in different compromises and experiencing varying degrees of success being together. There really is room for everyone's opinion and story, your's, mine, and everyone else's.

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Down in Texas

I am afraid to say you are the only one that can determine if you need sex more than you are getting and whether or not your partner will be able to keep up what he is promising. None of us will be able to answer that question for you. What we can tell you is what we have experienced in our own relationships. We cannot presume to know about anyone else. So having said that, I will say I am a highly sexual female married for 40 years to what I recently figured out to be a Gray A. It took me almost 39 years to find the answer to our (my) problem. I was the female that wanted sex and he was happy with what he had. Yet our needs were miles apart even from the beginning. I can tell you that as the years have gone by things have gotten less and less active sexually. Now ED has entered the picture. Many will say there is no correlation between Asexuality and ED. I differ with their rational in that the brain is the largest sex organ in a human body. It is the main difference between Sexuals and Asexuals it all starts with the function of the brain and how it is processed in my opinion. My Gray-A has never enjoyed sex in the same way I have and now tells me he cannot remember any of the sex we have had throughout the years. I on the other hand can recall almost every sexual act we have had, I can dress to try to look desirable to him and he will not even notice that I have on something new let alone something provocative. For years, I undressed for bed at the foot of our bed and he never looked at me.

The best I can offer is that there are as many shades of Gray on both sides of the asexual /sexual spectrum and you can possible imagine. The other thing is you cannot change them any more than you can change yourself. There is no fix and most Asexuals will get offended if you use the word fix they do not feel they need fixing. I understand that there is liberation of the feeling of HAVING TO do something they do not enjoy. No one can tell you what to do all we can do is answer any question you may have if we can. Just know you will get many answers on this site some answers come from pain, some form fear and others form inexperience. Only you will know what pertains to you and only you will know what you can use, no two people are the same so use what you can and what you feel comfortable with and let the rest go.

I never ever said they were doomed. MY only comments were based on what has happened to ME and I tell it from MY sexual-ness. I have admitted many times that I have a very high sexual desire. I have said the choice is theirs. If the person relates to MY HIGH sexual needs, they will understand where I am coming from. If they chose to live with the fact that what they have now may be the best, it will ever be. Then so be it, that is THEIR CHOICE. I will not condemn anyone for his or her choice. I Never have and Never will. However, if a comment I make saves just ONE Person from the pain and disappointment I have had to live with then I have done what God wishes me to do with the knowledge I now have.

There are bonds forged through sex that cannot be forged any other way and YES, I have regrets of lost dreams. However, my marriage still has LOVE; it is just a different form than what I had dreamt it would be at this stage of my life. Love comes in many different degrees just as sex does. I had always expected that the love I shared with my husband would be the type where we could read each other and ALWAYS put the other person first. My husband is like a sponge he soaks up the love I give but does not know how to give it back and I am not talking about sex here. I know he love me with ALL HE can. I know his likes and dislikes, I could go in any store and be able to pick out what my husband would want; be it food, clothing, books, shoes or any host of options. My husband to this day cannot go into a store and buy me a drink, bag of chips or candy bar that I like, he buys me a second of what he likes. This is just one small example of the differences in our ability to show love beyond sex. I only bring this up trying to give a small insight into his thought process. I except his offer and simply allow him to have the second candy bar or famous bag of peanuts that he knows I do not care for. Fighting over it or making a big scene is not part of my character and just not part of whom I am. I again only offer it as a form of insight.

Love comes in many different degrees you can love your brother, you can love a relative, you can love a child, and you can love a friend. In addition, I still LOVE my husband. However, the love I was hoping for was the kind that goes beyond a companionship form of love; it is the kind that touches the soul. I had that love for my husband for a long time but when you give, give, and never get more than the companionable type of love from your mate that LOVE WILTS. It is still there however, it is not as strong as it would have or could have been if he had been able to give back just a portion of the type of LOVE that is usually shared between people in a sexual relationship. A relationship I thought I was in. It is starving for the same affection that it gives, just as a plant that is watered yet never feed. That plant can stay alive but if feed it blossoms.

Lady I offer your words from above. My real is different than your real. We have touched on it numerous times...every couple is different. New relationships aren't doomed because asexuality is part of it. We can't predict. I can tell my story just as you can. Mine is different from yours, not less real.”

Then why do you seem to always have a need to pick mine apart? This was my original post on this site. Why has it come down to me having to defend my feelings again? Just as there are differences of Gray in asexuals there are also the same differences of Gray in Sexuals. I acknowledged this a long time ago but for some reason you get the feeling that I am making blanket remarks against asexuals or that I am Bitter or Hostile. I am just different than you and I am voicing MY SEXUAL feelings and needs or lack of without attacking anyone. My remarks are simply made to allow the sexual that has come here THINK and know that what they have now may be the best it will ever be and it that is good enough for them great if not they need to THINK. Choice is their’s.

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I know his likes and dislikes, I could go in any store and be able to pick out what my husband would want; be it food, clothing, books, shoes or any host of options. My husband to this day cannot go into a store and buy me a drink, bag of chips or candy bar that I like, he buys me a second of what he likes. This is just one small example of the differences in our ability to show love beyond sex. I only bring this up trying to give a small insight into his thought process. I except his offer and simply allow him to have the second candy bar or famous bag of peanuts that he knows I do not care for. Fighting over it or making a big scene is not part of my character and just not part of whom I am. I again only offer it as a form of insight.

My relationship is the opposite. I pay attention to what my sexual boyfriend likes/dislikes, I try to get him things I know he will want - I even make notes on the casual mentions of things he thinks are cool. Example: When Kiva first started running commercials on TV the boyfriend mentioned it sounded cool and he wanted to donate. We are tight with money a lot, but he likes to do stuff like that. So, two years later on his birthday I got him a gift card for a donation to them, because I remembered his random mention about a commercial two years previously. But, to this day (seven years into the relationship tomorrow) he still can't even remember I don't like RC cola (his favorite, so he keeps buying it for me like "I didn't know you didn't like it" "I have only told you about 50 times by now, so you drink it") or anything "fake fruit" (I like fresh fruit only, but he keeps buying fake fruit flavored stuff, cause "it all tastes like fruit and you like fruit".. I have been telling him I don't like it from day 7 when he ordered me fruit crepes!). Tomorrow is our anniversary and I bet he won't even remember. And you're right, it's not worth fighting about. So I just remind him I don't like stuff he buys and give it to him to eat/drink and when he remembers he forgot our anniversary I say "I am aware" and leave it at that.
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I think TEX had some very good things to say that are quite common with mixed relationships. I have not only had to put my labido on ice but my expectations and actions have cooled/lowered greatly. I do feel I have to settle for a companionship marriage because there is little intimacy and passion...and I don't mean with just sex, but, in all that we do. You could say our love is great because of the sacrifices we make for each other and we enjoy and care about each other.... but it is "cool", meaning - not passionate. And I don't feel we can try to "heat it up" (I don't meaning sexually) because it is very hard to get past the sex thing. It is a great deal of work and frustration and all those other things.

I agree that it is important to be realistic to those who come here for answers and I think we mostly are. But, hope and positiveness are good things to cling to as well.

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However, if a comment I make saves just ONE Person from the pain and disappointment I have had to live with then I have done what God wishes me to do with the knowledge I now have.

None of us is here to save anyone. The knowledge you have is from your personal experience. I think what people are reacting to is -- or at least what I've reacted to -- is that your posts appear to extend that experience to every sexual in a mixed relationship.

As far as being bitter, I feel that you have displayed bitterness. Somewhere above (you quoted it yourself directly above), you mentioned that you'd undress in the bedroom and he didn't react. The fact that that is still being said is not consonant with your saying that no one can change what they are. It sounds like you're bitter because your husband couldn't change.

What it sounds like to me -- and that's my opinion -- is that you have continued to be angry that he didn't change. And yet you couldn't change, and didn't. Feelings are feelings; they can't be changed by anyone just because they're inconvenient or disappointing to someone else, even when that someone is a person you love.

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Now Sally; that wasn't kind! You definitely do not feel the types of disappointments that sexuals feel. Sexuals love without sex, they partner without sex and have truly great friendships without sex. But, we also have sexual expectations and dreams for the future as things smooth out along the way; little blessings and passions that might be a sort of bonus for the tough years behind us. But when sex is not part of it, I feel a bit cheated. And that is not hearsay, Sally, that's from the mouth of experience and not from what "people tell me". It has been a long road for some of us; I know that it has put some bitter memories for my young children when my wife and I first started out. I couldn't understand why I wasn't getting my share of quality time with her. We're in the late 70's here; who knew about orientations. We didn't give up on love but as the years moved along I knew I had to give up on passion, special occasions, special moments while on vacation and travelling. It has left a huge hole in an otherwise wonderful commitment and it cannot be repaired. That time is gone..I've missed it, taken away as if I had been a bad person. My wife didn't miss it; never knew it was there! I'm glad we're here, at this point, because I had to give up on something important to me; I wouldn't go through it again. And Sally, I'm am here to save someone, anyone, who is questioning a lifelong commitment just as I would do for my own children.

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Please don't tell me what I don't feel.

I reiterate: it is not appropriate for anyone on AVEN, sexuals or asexuals alike, to talk about "saving" someone. No one is anyone's child here.

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What a small word can lead to. Let us again try to focus.

Down in Texas, you should not use the wording "save" someone. It has a negative connotation, although I know you do not mean it to sound that way.

LG, the same goes for words like "bitter", but you already appologized, so we are done there.

Sally, if you tell someone they display bitterness, expect others to react in a fashion they did.

oldandnew, you should not fill in what other people are feeling.

And lastly JoJo shouldn't be condescending :).

Now, to get back to the issues at hand. Dear Undergoing. It is not easy living in a mixed relationship. Neither for the sexual partner, nor for the asexual partner. To prevent frustration amongst the two of you, communicate. Try to find the common ground in your sexual relations. It seems that your partner is willing to compromise to help your relationship. Ask him to tell you what is OK and what is to much.

And lastly, be aware that moods and needs can change on both sides. Keep talking about your relationship and keep remembering the good parts.

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Down in Texas

However, if a comment I make saves just ONE Person from the pain and disappointment I have had to live with then I have done what God wishes me to do with the knowledge I now have.

None of us is here to save anyone. The knowledge you have is from your personal experience. I think what people are reacting to is -- or at least what I've reacted to -- is that your posts appear to extend that experience to every sexual in a mixed relationship.

As far as being bitter, I feel that you have displayed bitterness. Somewhere above (you quoted it yourself directly above), you mentioned that you'd undress in the bedroom and he didn't react. The fact that that is still being said is not consonant with your saying that no one can change what they are. It sounds like you're bitter because your husband couldn't change.

What it sounds like to me -- and that's my opinion -- is that you have continued to be angry that he didn't change. And yet you couldn't change, and didn't. Feelings are feelings; they can't be changed by anyone just because they're inconvenient or disappointing to someone else, even when that someone is a person you love.

Before Lady thinks this is getting to heated I want to stress I am not upset just trying to clarify remarks that have been made. I do not know how to point out the parts I need to refer to without using the only tools I know how to use in order to highlight certain words or phrases.

You are editing things to make them conform to your interpretation. If you wish to point out parts of my comments then at least use the whole thing…”However, if a comment I make saves just ONE Person from the pain and disappointment I have had to live with then I have done what God wishes me to do with the knowledge I now have.” I am talking about saving them from pain and disappointment (expectations of what older sexuals assumed was their right in a sexual relationship before knowing about the world of Asexuality and all it entails). NOT FROM AN ASEXUAL nor am I trying to SAVE their SOUL just with the mention of GOD as you seem to imply. If once they know that there is not a “fix” as you hate to hear but what we looked for before learning about asexuality. I have pointed out in all post even this one if you will go back and read my first posting on this thread. However, for your information MY pain is dissipating since I learned there was no way to fix things. Even though the pain is going away the memories and dreams of what life during retirement are also gone. It took finding AVEN which is still fairly new for me to change gears in what I was thinking and looking forward to. What I expected to have in a “sexual marriage” as I grew old with the man I LOVE are now gone. I am still the same sexual person I always was my desires are still there. However, I have had to find a way to suppress them for my GRAY ASEXUAL husband while there is nothing he can give me; So I ask you Who is doing the compromising?

It was not until I discovered AVEN that I LEARNED the word ASEXUAL(less than a year ago) and all it entailed. I had lived 39 years of disappointment before AVEN. (ranging from infrequency, broken promises, lack of desire on his part not just physical but emotional, little things that had been present before marriage that were no longer present just because we were now married) ALL before I discovered there was nothing I could do to change things.

Again, please use the whole sentence you refer to. I can dress to try to look desirable to him and he will not even notice that I have on something new let alone something provocative. For years, I undressed for bed at the foot of our bed and he never looked at me.For years was before I found AVEN I only found AVEN less than a year ago. However, I did see one typo I should have said could instead of can. After a while, you stop trying because the hurt that follows making such an attempt can bring you to your knees with pain and disappointment. When money is scarce and time is also scarce while raising children who you cannot take with you while you shop because it would raise questions that you cannot explain to a child. These are just a few of the kinds of hurt I am referring to in SAFING someone from pain with the knowledge I now know. My attempts were useless. Not until I found AVEN did I know that they were useless. Therefore, I kept trying.

I NEVER used the word BITTER –Lady did and then apologized for it. I accepted her apology as it was given. You claim I am bitter that I SOUND BITTER again that is your assumption. I am not bitter DO I WISH THINGS HAD BEEN DIFFERENT? You bet I do. But, just wishing does not make a person bitter. My husband did not change at all! After finding AVEN I realize expecting him to change would be impossible. You say I was unable to change. I did all the changing. Once AVEN was found, I no longer initiate sex for fear of causing him undue pressure that would only ensure that the ED would prevent any action he may wish to offer. Which would then only make him feel worse and then becomes a cycle for a person dealing with ED. (Again before someone tries to say the two are not related) they are both present in my relationship. I am the one doing without any form of sex or intimacy as I once knew it. As others have said I have been forced into celibacy. After finding AVEN, it is now clear that the decline of sex and intimacy right from the beginning and later the impending effects of ED are all due to his Asexuality. A quote straight from you “Feelings are feelings; they can't be changed by anyone just because they're inconvenient or disappointing to someone else, even when that someone is a person you love.” So I ask what makes your feelings any more valid than MINE?

I would never have gone into such detailed information about my relationship if I had not felt attacked. I did not realize that each statement must include what was included in my first on this thread. As if being a sexual we must include a DISCLAIMER so to speak, Acknowledging that we understand Asexuality. I had hoped by now that those on this site know from where I speak.

I would like to thanks jojo for trying to calm things down and I do not think you were condescending. Thank you jojo.

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