Guest Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 5 minutes ago, xstatic ☆ﾟ°˖* ᕕ( ᐛ )ᕗ said: Yeah, it's one thing to ask if someone has kids, but hounding and guilting women about their choice not to have them is kinda disgusting. If they get too annoying at me about it, I just give them part of the truth that they'd understand. "I have a very irregular body and I don't think I can get pregnant" My periods are all over the place and I've had sex without protection enough times (stupidly) that I probably should be if I could be. But, I'm quite OK with that being a thing. I don't really want kids. I work with them every day, I like them, I connect with my students... but I don't want one at home needing me 24/7. Wish people would back off caring if another person has kids or not though. Some of us are not into the idea of parenthood... there are plenty of people who are, the species will continue without us. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Xstatic Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 Unfortunately I think it's often considered our duty and our purpose. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
anisotrophic Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 Children are an incredible amount of work. I 100% don't think people should be pressured into it, especially women as they tend to end up with an unfair share of domestic labor (in standard cishet relationships). Even male partners that promise to pull equal weight often won't due to the factors like upbringing, socialization, and social context stuff affecting their behavior. 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
AceMissBehaving Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 13 minutes ago, CBC said: Yep. 🤮 I consider myself to have no duties to anything or anyone in that sense, and my purpose is to do whatever the fuck I want with my existence. People can piss right off with whatever expectations they have of my life or my character based on my sex/gender. I left a dance school once because someone who worked there during the day tried telling me I needed to quit my job and start having babies since I was married, as that is the truest calling for a woman according to god, and anything else was going against my sex. I had never been more upset or offended by a stranger in my life. 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
AceMissBehaving Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 48 minutes ago, CBC said: Just had a thought. I wonder if the people who are astonished that some people (especially women) don't want children think of it as a drive that's as generally universal as being sexual (vs. asexual). Like if 1% of the human population is asexual, do some folks think that the drive to pop out babies is roughly the same? That’s an interesting question. If there really is a drive to have children, much like the drive to have sex, I don’t have it, and learning about how it feels for those that do, would be the same as when I learned people really do have a pull to have sex with others. I don’t know if the numbers would be the same, but I imagine the two things to be pretty similar 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 9 minutes ago, CBC said: Grosssss. I hate the religious nutters. I guess the worst thing anyone (in this case, an internet stranger) has ever said to me in regards to that realm of life is that I was a slut and human garbage who should face the death penalty for having an abortion. On the one hand, I know they were entirely serious, so it stung a little bit. And it was about a week after the procedure. On the other hand though, that's such asinine nonsense that I was able to disregard it and laugh for the most part. It's still deeply unpleasant to think that some people have so little regard for the distress that I went through in that situation though, and that my life and health are so meaningless and my emotional needs are so morally wrong that I deserve to die. The worst thing anyone has ever said though, in regards to any aspect of my existence (I've told this one before on here several times, including recently) is my dad's declaration that I have "nothing to say that's worth listening to". Cheers, fucker. 🙃 Funny thing is that person probably considers themselves prolife... while trying to hurt someone (not just a fetus, but a human being) to the point some do actually end their lives over such bullying. Not very pro life... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
anisotrophic Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 I don't think there's much innate instinct to wanting kids, I think it's a bit like socialization & expected life paths, doing X because you want to be on a path to Y, and you believe Y is good because you've seen others do X -> Y, and not X -> not Y, and you think Y is what you want so you need to do X. Sorry that's abstract but I think deciding to pursue higher education can be like this. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ryn2 Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 3 hours ago, xstatic ☆ﾟ°˖* ᕕ( ᐛ )ᕗ said: Yeah, it's one thing to ask if someone has kids, but hounding and guilting women about their choice not to have them is kinda disgusting. *nods* I feel like the former is just an attempt to find common ground for small talk, but the latter is over the line. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ryn2 Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 2 hours ago, CBC said: Just had a thought. I wonder if the people who are astonished that some people (especially women) don't want children think of it as a drive that's as generally universal as being sexual (vs. asexual). Like if 1% of the human population is asexual, do some folks think that the drive to pop out babies is roughly the same? I always feel more like it’s crowd validation of their choices. If “everyone has to” have kids, they don’t have to own the choice they now see made them miserable. That said, a lot of little kids do pretend their dolls are babies and seem to want kids from an early age, where I was never, ever that way. I don’t have any sort of “maternal” response to babies or children. I was definitely raised with the expectation I would have kids... in fact, the last conversation I had with my mother before she died was about me promising to consider adoption if I didn’t want to go through a pregnancy. I did consider it as agreed, so I don’t feel like I lied to her on the eve of her death, but I came to the same old conclusion. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ryn2 Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 15 minutes ago, anisotrophic said: doing X because you want to be on a path to Y I did college because it was expected of me but kids (which were also expected) were a big nope all along. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
anisotrophic Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 13 minutes ago, ryn2 said: I did college because it was expected of me but kids (which were also expected) were a big nope all along. Yeah, like that. And I think I'm saying, it's not wrong to do one or the other. And that people often end up doing these life path things based on what's expected/typical in their social context, what they understand (and potentially idealize) in others doing it. And when they invest so heavily, they might start to conceive of the other choice as "wrong"; but there's there's something akin to a sunk cost fallacy in it, and what's right for one person isn't right for another. And sometimes we'll regret our choices, sometimes we'll be glad about them. It's conversely shitty to use language like "breeders" and not respect the lifetime costs & struggles of parenting people (especially women) bear, but I don't think anyone here is doing that. (Instead, I think folks are being realistic about the costs, and that's a very good reason to *not* have kids!) 🙂 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ryn2 Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 49 minutes ago, CBC said: Same. My mother goes nuts over photos of babies, and I'm like... "Huh?" And everyone wants to hold them, and talks about the great new baby smell, and... I’m like no thanks keep it please. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ryn2 Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 2 hours ago, anisotrophic said: it's not wrong to do one or the other Completely agreed. I’m just not sure it’s entirely societal expectation, as I totally went the “school is expected” route while never once considering NOT rejecting “kids are expected.” Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Anthracite_Impreza Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 I absolutely refuse to hold babies. I have no idea why anyone would want one (or more!!) at all when all they seem to do is moan about them. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 1 hour ago, CBC said: In all honesty, I don't even know what that smell is. Sour throw-up and/or poop would be my guess, haha. I've held a baby precisely once in my life, about 20 years ago, and was worried I was doing it wrong. The smell is baby wipes, baby powder, diaper cream, etc... which, granted, all can smell nice. But, I can get the same scent in a lotion. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Xstatic Posted February 17, 2020 Share Posted February 17, 2020 Y'all are harsh! 😂😂😂 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted February 17, 2020 Share Posted February 17, 2020 28 minutes ago, xstatic ☆ﾟ°˖* ᕕ( ᐛ )ᕗ said: Y'all are harsh! 😂😂😂 I like kids and babies... I just... don't see any real need for one at all. 😛 Of course, it helps that I literally had my first black eye given to me by a 5 year old. Working with the kids I work with, seeing how exhausted and on the brink of being insane the parents are every day, any aw wouldn't that be nice about kids went away fast. (I love them, but omg I couldn't take that being my 24/7... it's so exhausting just doing 6 1/2 hours of it) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Anthracite_Impreza Posted February 17, 2020 Share Posted February 17, 2020 Just to clarify, if others want to have babies or kids, I would never attempt to get in their way. If I thought they were doing it at the wrong time or with the wrong partner and they were a close friend, then yes, it would be my duty to say something, but I still wouldn't voice my own personal views (though all my close friends already know me =/= gets on with kids). I just hate when those who have kids become unbearable cos of it - trying to foist their kids on you, demand you pay attention to them, insist how cute and amazing they are. Just, no. Stop. You're making me hate them more by doing that. I don't like them, and I'm not there to see them, I'm there to see my friend. It would be like if they got a cat knowing I hate cats and trying to make me hold it. I would never deliberately hurt a child and I will stop them doing stupid shit if I have to, but I don't want anyone foisting that responsibility on me just cos the child now exists. The friend is still my priority, not the child. Just like any other human I don't have any dealings with, they're irrelevant to me. Them being children doesn't mean they will get any special treatment, nor will I pretend I have any feelings towards them. My friend may get pregnant soon, she may not - it is currently at the whims of the Stork Goddess - but she has already expressly said she knows I'm not interested in them and will never try to pressure me to hold or play with it, nor will send me random photos and expect me to coo. That's the kind of response I appreciate from child-bearing people. In return I will accept I am now lower in the pecking order, acknowledge the child's existence and do my best to be supportive, but distant. /r Quote Link to post Share on other sites
AceMissBehaving Posted February 17, 2020 Share Posted February 17, 2020 4 hours ago, ryn2 said: And everyone wants to hold them, and talks about the great new baby smell, and... I’m like no thanks keep it please. People will try to get me to hold their babies and I literally freeze in fear 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ryn2 Posted February 17, 2020 Share Posted February 17, 2020 45 minutes ago, Anthracite_Impreza said: Just to clarify, if others want to have babies or kids, I would never attempt to get in their way. Same. They just aren’t for me. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
anisotrophic Posted February 17, 2020 Share Posted February 17, 2020 1 hour ago, AceMissBehaving said: People will try to get me to hold their babies and I literally freeze in fear Eh. They’re just small animals. I’m not repulsed by or attracted to random babies. I am baby-indifferent. 😄 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ryn2 Posted February 17, 2020 Share Posted February 17, 2020 3 minutes ago, CBC said: Actually I felt that way as a child too. Always preferred adult company. Same! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ryn2 Posted February 17, 2020 Share Posted February 17, 2020 17 minutes ago, anisotrophic said: They’re just small animals. Small non-human animals, I like. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Xstatic Posted February 17, 2020 Share Posted February 17, 2020 To clarify, I hate almost all children. I think they're disgusting and annoying more often than not. Some I like just fine, but in general they annoy me. And yet, I would fight a bear for mine. Maternal instinct is crazy. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
iff Posted February 17, 2020 Share Posted February 17, 2020 A work colleague had a baby of their's in once. People were giving the baby attention but I wasn't. Someone pointed it to me. I said that "I didn't like babies" His response to this? "you should like babies because you were one once" I don't think that is a good reason 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted February 17, 2020 Share Posted February 17, 2020 Nothing here. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Xstatic Posted February 17, 2020 Share Posted February 17, 2020 I consider myself a nihilist. And I know your thought process well @CBC. I've been trying to be more positive about life lately, as bleak as it is. I'm here, and I might as well do something with it. It's better than the alternative, which is also a newer thought process for me. The dark days are hard. I used to describe it as feeling like I was always stuck behind a pane of glass. I could see the world around me but I wasn't really a part of it. I was detached from it. I hope you pull out of this soon. Sorry, not many useful words at 6am. Summary: I completely understand. Hang in there. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Pheedre Posted February 17, 2020 Share Posted February 17, 2020 29 minutes ago, CBC said: And thanks for the writing prompt. It was cathartic. I'm just going to comment here so as not to repost your long (not in a bad way) post haha. I loved reading this. I think it is real, and thought provoking and honest. You're right, we shouldn't have to be positive every single moment to make others comfortable, that isn't truthful or real at all. Life is weird and I don't know, I think you look at it in a fascinating way. I don't pretend to know what your life has been like but I think it is better to be real about things and allow yourself to feel instead of always hiding behind a mask of smiles...just my opinion though 🤷♀️ P.S. you're a very good writer 😊 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ryn2 Posted February 17, 2020 Share Posted February 17, 2020 4 hours ago, CBC said: Reminds me of how people say you should be against abortion since you're lucky your mother didn't abort you. Hey, I didn't ask to be here. I'm not thankful for being gifted the bullshitty mess of human existence and I'm not obligated to be. And if I'd been aborted, I wouldn't be somehow aware of it and be saddened or hurt or angry. Philosophical musings aside, I saw the bold as the key point: it’s silly to say we should be pro-life because someone let us live. If they didn’t, we wouldn’t exist to care either way. 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ryn2 Posted February 17, 2020 Share Posted February 17, 2020 (I always found the logic “you should be grateful you exist” annoying to begin with... why, oh wise stranger, and how exactly do you know?) 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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