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Discussion 2.0: Asexual Flag

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Lirael1
personally i don't think we should have a flag in which some of the stripes are bigger than others (unless it's the purple, because that's representative of the community as a whole in people's minds) because that would be like saying one identity is bigger/more important than another. i am very for the stripes being the same size for this reason.

Seconded.

I still prefer the simpler four stripe ones. The busier ones with lots of stripes make my eyes hurt. Plus, I still like the idea of the strips being the same size, indicating equality between the four colours.

And, seconded.

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asexual cake

I posted about this on the Spanish-language forum here.

personally i don't think we should have a flag in which some of the stripes are bigger than others (unless it's the purple, because that's representative of the community as a whole in people's minds) because that would be like saying one identity is bigger/more important than another. i am very for the stripes being the same size for this reason.

Seconded.

Thirded.

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standup

Ive been saying this the whole time........

I'd still like to keep this process working to get a "universal" flag. I was just pointing out that the triangle might work better on a different flag. I know you've been saying it, I was just trying to reiterate... sort of... in a way relevant to the idea of using a flagpole. Wow this doesn't even make any sense. In short: I agree with what you have been saying!

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standup

Also, from what I can tell in the foreign forums, most people do not feel strongly one way or the other in having a flag.

I'll record the winners/results tomorrow around noon for the first round, then post thumbnails here for any comments/critique. If any of the winners resemble a flag from a foreign country you guys can say so and I'll replace it with a runner-up.

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you*hear*but*do*you*listen

I don't see why the triangle can't become a universal asexual symbol as opposed to just an AVEN symbol, potentially through the development of a flag. I mean, we're making an effort to include non-AVEN asexual sites in the flag development process, so why don't we put the idea of the triangle henceforth being a univeral asexual symbol to them?

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standup

So many people debate the use of a triangle on a universal flag that I feel it's getting pointless to argue. I don't care either way, personally.

In other news, the first round results are in. Here's the top 5 from each category. I think we might need to make some adjustments, based on what everyone's opinions are, because the flag that looks sorta like the Confederate Flag made it into the top 3. I'm not sure how people feel about that?

Results are HERE!

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bristrek

Because not everyone agrees. Look, there should be a space to put the AVEN triangle in if a person wants to, but it shouldn't be an actual part of the actual flag more like.... an add on. If someone wants to put it there, it's there, if they don't, it isn't. And the flag should be able to look just as good both ways.

ETA: That spot doesn't have to be dead space, but could just as easily be an area where it'd show up easily enough and clearly like white/grey area.

Son of ETA:

On the results, assuming that from left to right is A, B and C then....

- B2(2) Looks like the Irish flag but diff colours. Or Italian.

- C3 looks too much like the Confederate flag to some, the Scottish flag to others.

- C4(1) Looks like the various Scandinavian flags, different colour.

- C4(2) Doesn't fill the colour requirements, not even close. C2 and C4(1) also fit this if less so.

- C1 has an actual gradient in it, not colour blocks. I don't know if this is in the rules or not but it isn't easy to sow and so on so forth and I think we've all decided that as a bad idea. We could take it without the triangle but then it's basically A1. Could maybe work as a sub-set of A1 as a specific AVEN type thing with modifications but...

ETA the 3rd: I just realised I just objected to all of C there. Daaaaamn. I have to say though, that none of this is based on personal opinion of like/dislike or else there's others I'd be ruling out (sorry guys).

And, on an unrelated note I have to say - GO NETHERLANDS!

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Lirael1

Because not everyone agrees. Look, there should be a space to put the AVEN triangle in if a person wants to, but it shouldn't be an actual part of the actual flag more like.... an add on. If someone wants to put it there, it's there, if they don't, it isn't. And the flag should be able to look just as good both ways.

ETA: That spot doesn't have to be dead space, but could just as easily be an area where it'd show up easily enough and clearly like white/grey area.

This.

- B2(2) Looks like the Irish flag but diff colours. Or Italian.

Or French. Waaay too many national flags with that pattern.

And to add to the list of flags that look like national flags: C2 reminds me very strongly of the Israeli flag, plus it has the black-and-white triangle that a lot of us don't like. And no grey.

ETA the 3rd: I just realised I just objected to all of C there. Daaaaamn.

I object to all of C, too (though I would still love to get C1 on a button. But not a flag). I'm generally anti-having a symbol on our flag, so that's probably why. I also object to A2 and A3, because I just don't like how that triangle looks.

I think it's telling that the winner in every category is just really simple, four or five stripes of black, grey, white, and purple. Two of them are even the same design with and without the AVEN triangle. People seem to like that sort of design.

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Pandoren

As the one who made the accidental Confederate flag, I agree that it looks too much like the original flag and that's fine by me. I admit to having voted for my own flag because I really didn't like most of the others in that category... maybe other people did that as well.

I think of all of them I still like A1 the best. Someone above mentioned that there are two flags, one with the triangle and one without. The thing about the A1 with triangle design is that it has the triangle with gradient which, although it would be suitable as an asexual flag + AVEN symbol design, obviously we've spoken before about flag maker's reluctance to use gradients. But if we got around that by doing the three layer black, grey, white on the triangle, I don't think that would work with a flag with four stripes (of the same colours) on the background.

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bristrek

But you've already got the black/grey/white three-colour outside the flag, surely that'd just make it more confusing?

Honestly, I think A1 is the best by far, though I'm rather fond of A5 (maybe cause I made it, but would probably think same if it were another). The diagonal ones just don't sit right with me, and maybe if the incline were reversed it'd be better as someone suggested ages ago on 1.0 but I don't think it'd be drastic. B5 whilst fulfilling the criteria doesn't really look like a flag and actually of all the B flags, B5 is my fave. Nice, simple, not diagonal and just needs some experimentation with placement of colour and exact proportions. Though I think the designer said they used pi? You can tell actually.

Maybe pi is something we should pay more attention to?

Lirael, the Israel thing with C2 hadn't occurred to me but I can see it now. Especially with the triangle in there, it's like half the star of David or something. It isn't but in that context... and A2 and A3 are, yeah. With you there.

Actually, I'm mostly anti-symbol and anti-triangle. And generally prefer one grey shade rather than two. One triangle makes me think of either the Czech republic and eastern Europe in general or South Africa. And two triangles, like that, though symmetrical (yay!) doesn't look like a flag.

Basically, my top three are A1, A5 and B4 by a decent distance, especially A1.

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you*hear*but*do*you*listen

So now what to we do with the results? Are we still having a second round of voting?

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standup

Yeah, the second round will start after this thread expires on July 24th. I'll take the winners from the first and any additional flags added here and put them in the second round.

Can someone summarize which ones look like countries? So far I've got 3rd in B (France), C2 (Israel?), C3 (Confederate)... is that it?

And then we need to decide which don't qualify based on the rest of the criteria. I think the gradient looks alright but if it'll look bad on a flag or will be really expensive, we should think about disqualifying it. (I think I might look up some button makers... other merch too, maybe when the flags are done with we can open a thread based on putting it on items. I would love doing that!) And should we count out the last two in Column C because they don't have any grey?

Oh - and B4 and B5 are based on the Golden Rule, I think. That, or the rule of thirds. (I think they look really good because of that, but I'd want the color order changed on B4.)

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bristrek

C4(1) is basically every Scandinavian country's flag but with some of our colours instead.

The criteria mentions no actual gradient on Page 1 and.... I mentioned my opinions on which ones qualify and don't a bit up back with several edits in it. No point typing out again.

But aside from the nation flags thing, there are several there that are missing one or more of the colours and so none of them qualify. If the designer wants to take 'em back, redesign 'em with the right colours they can and then submit them again but as is...

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standup

Alright, noted. :)

I just got really bored and made theeeese.

merchshoes1.png

Zazzle is a place of miracles.

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Brackets

I made another version(s) of it. XD

Screenshot2010-07-09at101000AM.png

Ok, I shall stop making designs!! I've made a heck load so unless I come up with something really interesting I think I better stop!! The most I'll do is maybe another diagonal one but no more horizontal.

I like these ones. I am also in favour of the equal-width stripes.

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asexual cake

Those are pretty exciting shoes.

And I object to the same flags as bristek for essentially the same reasons, especially the flags which resemble other flags, just with our colours (and especially C3 - honestly, I can't see anything but the Confederate flag when I look at it, and even if someone doesn't associated the Confederate flag with slavery, there are hordes of people who do, so the decision to pick that one - assuming someone did - would likely be alienating and controversial regardless of whether you think it should be).

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standup

What should we do about column C then? There's 3 submissions that don't qualify now and I'm wondering if I should keep using runners-up or just stick to the few that are left. Most of the votes went to the top two anyway.

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Lirael1
And should we count out the last two in Column C because they don't have any grey?

I'd say yes.

Also, those shoes are amazing. I want them.

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bristrek

None of C qualifies, which is a shame. Maybe bring in some of the runners up from the other groups that do to fill in the numbers? Hell, if of all those in A, B and C that meet the criteria go through and all those that don't are taken out we're left with a good number. You still end up with nine.

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standup

Alright, this is what we have left.

firstroundresults2.png

Would anyone be interested in deciding a standard grey and purple? I'm not sure if we should do that now or wait till later.

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bristrek

I like the purple on C3 which is also the same as A1 and the rest of the As I think. It's not too dark, not too red and not too blue. And I just like it really. It's not the same shade as the banner we marched behind (closer to some of the shirts though) but flag wise it works. Too dark/blue a shade, with black on the flag too, and it can look a bit dark.

Or something similar to it at least.

As for the grey, something like the one on A1 or B1 maybe?

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Lirael1

I like the purple on C3 which is also the same as A1 and the rest of the As I think. It's not too dark, not too red and not too blue. And I just like it really. It's not the same shade as the banner we marched behind (closer to some of the shirts though) but flag wise it works. Too dark/blue a shade, with black on the flag too, and it can look a bit dark.

Or something similar to it at least.

Agreed. I think with black on the flag, a brighter shade of purple helps lighten things up a bit. I like the lighter shade of grey on A1, for the same reason.

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RJDaae

I decided to have a go at a making a few designs. :) Here's what I came up with:

aceflagrev-1.png

aceflagrev4-1.png

They each use an 'ace of spades' symbol, but inverted to help distinguish it from the ordinary playing card symbol (in the case of the first design, this also ties it in a bit with the 'heart' symbol that some people use). These are a bit rough, and if anyone likes them I can polish them up a bit more. :)

More of my reasoning on the upside-down spade: http://www.asexuality.org/en/index.php?showtopic=51825&view=findpost&p=1582943

EDIT: I wasn't 100% happy with the designs, so I fixed them a bit and reposted them.

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bristrek

I decided to have a go at a making a few designs. :) Here's what I came up with:

aceflag2-1.png

aceflag3-1.png

They each use an 'ace of spades' symbol, but inverted to help distinguish it from the ordinary playing card symbol (in the case of the first design, this also ties it in a bit with the 'heart' symbol that some people use). These are a bit rough, and if anyone likes them I can polish them up a bit more. :)

Not so sure if they're good for overall asexual flag cause didn't we go with the ace of spades thing having other connotations and so on thing? But for a asexual group flag that's awesome, like what you did with the gradient in the first one!

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Pandoren

As a side note, I prefer the ace that way up personally... as was said, for the heart shape, but it isn't just for romantics like the ace of hearts would imply, it's something more than that which I feel is good as a complete symbols of romantic orientation...

I agree though that we did say the ace, although a private symbol, isn't something we can put on a flag since it's widely used for other things already. But that first ace looks epic, it would look good on something sometime!

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+Lee

I think we should go with a purple that isn't to red and not to blue, Like the purple I've been using.

Here is an idea:

colorp.jpg

Lean more twords blue than red, or a pure purple.

For grey, a grey that leans more to the blue/cooler than a warm grey:

colorg.jpg

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Sciatrix

I like the brighter purples like the ones in A better myself, although I'm happy with anything that isn't easily mistaken for blue. I'd categorize B2, for example, as being much too blue for me.

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you*hear*but*do*you*listen

I like the brighter purples like the ones in A better myself, although I'm happy with anything that isn't easily mistaken for blue. I'd categorize B2, for example, as being much too blue for me.

I would actually say the reverse; I really like B2 and the others all look too red/pink.

But keep in mind a lot of see colors differently depending on how our monitors are set up...

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corduroyjackalope

For the purple, why don't we just keep it the same shade as the AVEN homepage? I don't see the point of changing the shade of a color already established. I do like the shade of grey on B1. Flag A1 is still my favorite, and I LOVE those shoes!

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PiF

the simplest of things are quite often the best rememberd becuase they are simple

instant association is a must

for that reason none of these on this page so far I personally would support

i appreciate others feel differently

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