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Fellow Sexuals

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uhtred
On 1/7/2019 at 8:04 AM, ryn2 said:

It sounds like, yes, apostle is suggesting taking over the decision of whether the relationship will be sexless or not (which you can only do by making it sexless).  That would mean not reminding her it’s been a while or commenting on other couples, and also turning her down if she initiates despite your not reminding her.  The downside would be zero sex instead of rare sex; the upside would be no longer being at someone else’s mercy (building hope and getting those hopes dashed).

 

Typing that raised a question in my mind, though.  Does your wife ever initiate sex if you don’t mention that it’s been a while/that seeing other couples makes you sad/etc.?  If not, that could really still fall under you initiating in a broader sense.  She may be the one actually suggesting having sex now (verbally or non-verbally) but the idea is yours.

Yes she does.   If you asked her, she would say we have sex every week,  but really we have sex every week - *when there is nothing else go do*.  (where "sex" means some form of sexual activity, no intercourse in a long time).  It ends up being a lot rarer. 

 

She will initiate sexual activity every sunday between 2pm and 5pm, if there is nothing else we are doing that day except chores (I suspect its on her "chore" list after doing the laundry), and only if we are at home. There is no correlation to any comments I have or have not made, how romantic we've been etc.  She always seems to and claims to enjoy it. 

 

If I bring up our issues with sex, she will get unhappy / upset and ask why I didn't tell her earlier.  Our frequency of sex will very briefly go up, then drop back down to normal.   I bring it up rarely because I don't like making her unhappy and it seems that it just pressures her into having sex she really doesn't want. 

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uhtred
3 hours ago, Apostle said:

That's quite 'slave' like though, isn't it?

To have someone at their beck and call is quite medieval in my eyes. What happened to equality?

Sort of unavoidable if there is some joint activity that one person is always happy to engage in and the other only wants rarely.  I don't see any way around it. 

 

 

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uhtred
2 hours ago, ryn2 said:

Well, I guess that would be up to uhtred (as to whether their arrangement is okay with him or not).  He hasn’t mentioned that she wouldn’t accept a refusal from him, as far as I recall.

I have turned her down once or twice. It upsets her - but that is because the only time I would turn her down is if I was very upset.  Otherwise I'm never negative about sex, so why would I say no - except to prove a point. 

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uhtred
1 hour ago, starweb said:

 

I'm NOT saying that's what you're saying here, but someone reading this might think that. It comes close to the old argument 'you just haven't had good sex'.

Always a question.  I'm sure that in some cases its even true.  Someone who has only had bad / abusive / selfish partners might very reasonably conclude that they "don't like sex".  In other cases asexuals can experience sexual pleasure / orgasm, but still not *want* sex.    Presumably in yet other cases some asexuals cannot experience orgasm or pleasure.   There may also be cases where (women) pretend to enjoy sex and their partners never find out that they are not experiencing any pleasure from it. 

 

Lots of situations. 

 

 

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Pan Ficto. (on hiatus?)
5 hours ago, starweb said:

I've mentioned this in other threads, but 'getting off' has frak all to do with anything. After several years of marriage, I discovered I could 'get off' by disassociating myself from what was actually going on by focusing on made up erotica in my head ( I never imagined myself as part of these thoughts btw, it was always other people. I'm probably autochrissexual). It didn't change a thing about me It didn't make me 'want it'. I could still walk away and just leave it all behind without a second thought. Getting off is not the cure for asexuality. 

 

I'm NOT saying that's what you're saying here, but someone reading this might think that. It comes close to the old argument 'you just haven't had good sex'.

That may be the case for you, but for others it may be as basic as literally never having had truly enjoyable sex before because no one they'd been with previously knew how to do it in a way they'd enjoy properly (emotionally, mentally, and physically). That was literally the case for me and I'm certainly not the only person here who has experienced that after years of unfulfilling, unsatisfying, unpleasurable sex.

 

Also I wasn't at all talking about a 'cure' for asexuality. There are plenty of aces who orgasm during sex but they're still ace. I was referring to something very different (which has more context given the comment I was responding to initially).

 

I was speaking about being an unidentified sexual person but not being able to know what you'd enjoy if you've never had it before, because another sexual person was saying that it's up to the woman to explain what she enjoys sexually. Some women have very specific sexual needs that they can't discover on their own (because masturbation is very different than partnered sex). These women (and some men too) can't KNOW what they enjoy sexually unless they've already had it. Once they've had it, they can seek more of it.

 

I was talking about this as a sexual person in response to a sexual person in a thread titled 'fellow sexuals'. I wasn't talking about asexuals just learning to enjoy sex or whatever.  That's a completely different topic and you took my response completely out of context which makes it look like I was saying something very different than what I actually was.

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starweb
2 hours ago, Ficto. said:

 

 
 

 

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Pan Ficto. (on hiatus?)
4 hours ago, uhtred said:

Sort of unavoidable if there is some joint activity that one person is always happy to engage in and the other only wants rarely.  I don't see any way around it. 

 

 

Well again, that initial comment about the slavery was made to me, and I was referring to a mutually desirable sexual relationship where the male is only able to want sex if the female is aroused and wanting sex with him, and if she doesn't want it he doesn't think about sex.

 

It turns out that's the only way I can enjoy or desire sex. I don't think about sex much myself, and I need to be with a man who doesn't think about sex either unless I'm clearly aroused. When I'm aroused and want sex, that makes him want it too (responsive desire). The fact that he only gets aroused as a result of my own arousal but won't ever think about sex or expect it outside of that is a massive turn on and makes me want quite a lot of sex (there were times with my last guy where I wanted extremely kinky, graphic sex twice or more a day and he was in heaven because the more i want it, the more he wants it)

 

Though yes times may go by when I don't even think about sex for over a week or even longer, but the guy won't care because he doesn't think about it either unless I want it. That's very important to me. To be with someone who doesn't place much importance on sex so he doesn't feel sad without it when we're not having it (because I also don't feel sad without it)

 

I was explaining that I won't get into a relationship unless it's with a guy like that, because that's how my most recent ex made me realise I can desire and love sex. It has to be under those specific circumstances or I actively can't desire sex.

 

Then someone (I think it was Apostle) very distastefully said that's practically slavery.

 

Oh sorry, I didn't know only having sex when both partners actually desire it was slavery. I thought that was what one would call a mutually pleasurable and mutually sexually satisfying and respectful relationship. Which is the only kind of relationship I will settle for. I refuse to ever have sex that I don't want again just because a man wants it when I don't. That's why I will only get with men who experience responsive desire to my own desire. That's not a fucking crime and comparing it to a massive crime like slavery says more about the state of mind of the person who made that comment than anything else 😕

 

 

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Pan Ficto. (on hiatus?)
Just now, starweb said:

I believe I explained I was speaking generally and I even said I was implying that was what you were saying. I was speaking more for the benefit of random readers who use that idea as a means of dismissal. 

Well your response changed the context of what I was saying. I was speaking to sexuals, as a sexual, in a thread for fellow sexuals. Your response made it look like I was saying that asexuality can be 'cured' by having good sex which is not at all what I was saying. As that discussion happened quite a few pages back I obviously had to respond to you to give context to my words (which I'm sure most people would have understood if they were reading the convo from a few pages back and saw what I was responding to. My context was very clear given the discussion that was happening at the time).

 

Now I have had to respond just to explain my stance for the benefit of those reading who did not have any context (if they didn't see the initial comments).

 

I hope you don't try to drag this out because it was obvious I was going to have to respond to you to give context. Most people would have perfectly understood my meaning given the original context which is lost with your response to me here today. That's all. 

 

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starweb
On 1/14/2019 at 3:58 PM, Ficto. said:

 

delete

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alibali

As far as I understand it, sex between 2 consenting adults is better when both desire it with each other at the same time.   Consent is a legal term, and can still be given freely even if sexual desire isn't present.

 

Asexuals just don't desire sex but may have a myriad of reasons to want sex. There's no "one size fits all" for every relationship, and some make mixed relationships work for them.

 

And not all people who don't want sex are asexual. Maybe they have had damaging relationships or experiences, or are not with the right person.

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Pan Ficto. (on hiatus?)
8 hours ago, alibali said:

And not all people who don't want sex are asexual. Maybe they have had damaging relationships or experiences, or are not with the right person.

You're right, and maybe they just don't feel like having sex!! :P I'm celibate and personally enjoy it a lot but have nothing against sex. I just know I need to be with a very specific type of person to be able to want it with them and I just can't be bothered trying to find someone like that for now.

 

Though someone asshat on OkCupid the other day messaged me to say I'm lying to myself if I think my celibacy is a choice, it's just that men don't want sex with single mothers so I can't get the dick, ahaha. I think he was just pissed that he knew he wouldn't have a chance with me no matter how hard he tried so decided to put me down instead. Only made himself look foolish though because there's plenty of single men (and single women!) who look at who you are as a person rather than what your life situation is. :)

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alibali

I'm glad you've worked out where you're at. So have I. I was a (relatively willing to have sex) asexual. Now I am a slightly disgusted bemused one, but I'm a single, slightly disgusted and bemused asexual (hence why I am on this thread - it's an attempt to understand).  I am not celibate though. That's a choice, not a sexuality.

 

I feel for everyone who's trying to work their life situation. Asexual or sexual.

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Apostle
17 hours ago, Ficto. said:

I was speaking about being an unidentified sexual person but not being able to know what you'd enjoy if you've never had it before, because another sexual person was saying that it's up to the woman to explain what she enjoys sexually. Some women have very specific sexual needs that they can't discover on their own (because masturbation is very different than partnered sex). These women (and some men too) can't KNOW what they enjoy sexually unless they've already had it. Once they've had it, they can seek more of it.

I don't see it as one person not being able to experience sex as they wish. One person in the relationship cannot by definition give their experience to the other to fulfil their desire as it still may not turn the 'other' on. Every person has a different switch.

It has to be BOTH partners to discuss and experiment with different was of pleasuring each other. If one of the partners complains that they are bored or any other excuse for not enjoying sex it is because they are not really interested in telling their partner to try something else. 

It appears to me that they are either sex adverse or asexual in some way.

 

As I used to tell my SO, 'you can take a horse to water but you can't make it drink'. She didn't get it but why would she? She was asexual.

 

As far as men are concerned, in general of course, there are very few women who know how to properly masturbate a man. How are women therefore going to know how unless the man tells them? 

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uhtred
1 hour ago, Apostle said:

I don't see it as one person not being able to experience sex as they wish. One person in the relationship cannot by definition give their experience to the other to fulfil their desire as it still may not turn the 'other' on. Every person has a different switch.

It has to be BOTH partners to discuss and experiment with different was of pleasuring each other. If one of the partners complains that they are bored or any other excuse for not enjoying sex it is because they are not really interested in telling their partner to try something else. 

It appears to me that they are either sex adverse or asexual in some way.

 

As I used to tell my SO, 'you can take a horse to water but you can't make it drink'. She didn't get it but why would she? She was asexual.

 

As far as men are concerned, in general of course, there are very few women who know how to properly masturbate a man. How are women therefore going to know how unless the man tells them? 

For sex to be good people have to be willing to tell their partners what they want - and people need to listen to what their partners say.   Its not that uncommon fro someone to ask "what would you like", then ignore everything they were told.   Often I think what they want is to be told to do what they wanted to do in the first place. 

 

 

 

 

 

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ryn2
37 minutes ago, uhtred said:

Its not that uncommon fro someone to ask "what would you like", then ignore everything they were told.   Often I think what they want is to be told to do what they wanted to do in the first place. 

I’ve wondered that as well... if the “right” answer in that case is not the truth, but a convincing variation of “what you do is perfect.”

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Pan Ficto. (on hiatus?)
6 hours ago, Apostle said:

don't see it as one person not being able to experience sex as they wish. One person in the relationship cannot by definition give their experience to the other to fulfil their desire as it still may not turn the 'other' on. Every person has a different switch.

It has to be BOTH partners to discuss and experiment with different was of pleasuring each other. If one of the partners complains that they are bored or any other excuse for not enjoying sex it is because they are not really interested in telling their partner to try something else. 

It appears to me that they are either sex adverse or asexual in some way.

You never seem to actually read what I was saying. You obviously can't say to your partner 'I love the feeling of being spoken to lovingly during sex' if no one has ever done that for you and it's never something you've considered yourself. That's why it's just not as simple sometimes as being able to say 'this is what I want and how I want it'. I never knew any of the things I wanted sexually until I had them with someone I trusted enough to experiment with. Yes communication is of course vitally important but I don't think anyone is denying that.

 

However I went through 5 years of utterly miserable, painful, un-pleasursble sex because I had no idea there was anything that could have been done that could make me enjoy it. My partner would ONLY do the things he knew other women liked. And now that I know what my needs are I know he never would have been able to meet them anyway due to his *expectation* of sex as though it's his right to have it. The expectation is an instant libido killer for me.

 

6 hours ago, Apostle said:

As I used to tell my SO, 'you can take a horse to water but you can't make it drink'. She didn't get it but why would she? She was asexual.

Well... You can't MAKE the horse drink if it doesn't want to. And you can't just FORCE someone to enjoy sex out of sheer will. That's liable to make them enjoy it less, not more. Some women though just need to be with the right type of guy (or girl) before they can learn to enjoy sex. That's what happened with me and I've met a fair few women on AVEN now who experienced that (edit and some men too). For women like us, you can't MAKE us enjoy it by your willpower or by trying to insist we do something different. You just have to be the right type of person who matches our innate desires so perfectly that you awaken them within us. *shrug*

 

And no, that obviously won't ever work for an asexual. But for sexual women who have no idea what it is they desire (so they seem asexual), that's how their sexuality is awakened. Hypersexuality in my case. When it's awakened, I can't get enough.

 

6 hours ago, Apostle said:

As far as men are concerned, in general of course, there are very few women who know how to properly masturbate a man. How are women therefore going to know how unless the man tells them? 

This paragraph does prove you didn't properly read anything I said. If it was something as basic as the masturbation technique you use then that's an easy fix because you both just communicate to each other 'a bit to the left' 'harder' 'softer' 'faster' and you can show each other exactly how to do it on your own genitals, easy (in theory. People who refuse to listen dont get it right a lot of the time though). But I'm talking about something very different than merely the technique you use on someone's genitals, obviously. For women like me it's about something so very different and that's why we never even knew it existed.

 

Example, something that gets me off is having a guy fuck my tits. How was I ever meant to know that though?? It wasn't until the guy I was with (who wakened my sexuality) suggested wanting to try it that I realised it's something I want. But only HE could have wakened that in me because of who he was and his sexual expectations (or lack thereof). I knew he still would have been just as happy to never have any form of sex with me and it's THAT which awakened those desires. I never could have known any of that on my own though or with a different type of man.

 

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Pan Ficto. (on hiatus?)
4 hours ago, uhtred said:

 Its not that uncommon fro someone to ask "what would you like", then ignore everything they were told.   Often I think what they want is to be told to do what they wanted to do in the first place

Yep that's so true. ALL my first ex wanted was to give oral sex, fingering, and vaginal penetration. That's it. Sometimes he'd ask 'what do you want?' but the times that I did suggest something (like anal) he wouldn't do!!! *sigh* (why ask if you only want me to suggest the things you already want??) Or when he asked what I want and I truthfully said 'a foot massage?' (because that would be more fun for me than sex with him), well, that certainly wasn't going to happen haha.

 

So sex with him was only ever about what HE wanted to do, even though those things were to me. He got off on getting women off but his insistence to try to get me off in the way he got other women off is one of the things that killed all desire in me. It turns out I'm just not like other women and giving me oral, fingering me, and sticking your dick in my vaj just don't work for me. In fact, those things all hurt me and feel very uncomfortable.

 

Whereas (as a tie-in example) the guy who awakened my sexuality actually orgasmed FROM giving me foot massages he enjoyed my pleasure so much. He ENJOYED having his orgasm put off for as long as possible while he massaged my feet or anything else I wanted, then he actively desired to masturbate over my feet afterwards (as opposed to needing to put his penis inside me). I never knew that aroused me enough to make me orgasm too until I actually HAD that with him and it's not something I ever could have ascertained entirely on my own. Apostle seems to think I'm talking entirely about technique but actually I'm talking about the type of sex and the expectation behind it. I just can't get off with a guy who NEEDS to give me oral, fingering, or vaginal penetration to get me off.

 

Sex, it turns out, is about very, very different activities than the 'generally accepted ones' for me, but I never could have known that until I'd had it with 'the right guy'. I need someone who truly does care about what I want, as opposed to just wanting me to say I want what THEY want!

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ryn2

Honestly, too, asking and then not listening is way worse than not asking and just making a unilateral choice!

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uhtred
37 minutes ago, Ficto. said:

Yep that's so true. ALL my first ex wanted was to give oral sex, fingering, and vaginal penetration. That's it. Sometimes he'd ask 'what do you want?' but the times that I did suggest something (like anal) he wouldn't do!!! *sigh* (why ask if you only want me to suggest the things you already want??) Or when he asked what I want and I truthfully said 'a foot massage?' (because that would be more fun for me than sex with him), well, that certainly wasn't going to happen haha.

 

So sex with him was only ever about what HE wanted to do, even though those things were to me. He got off on getting women off but his insistence to try to get me off in the way he got other women off is one of the things that killed all desire in me. It turns out I'm just not like other women and giving me oral, fingering me, and sticking your dick in my vaj just don't work for me. In fact, those things all hurt me and feel very uncomfortable.

 

Whereas (as a tie-in example) the guy who awakened my sexuality actually orgasmed FROM giving me foot massages he enjoyed my pleasure so much. He ENJOYED having his orgasm put off for as long as possible while he massaged my feet or anything else I wanted, then he actively desired to masturbate over my feet afterwards (as opposed to needing to put his penis inside me). I never knew that aroused me enough to make me orgasm too until I actually HAD that with him and it's not something I ever could have ascertained entirely on my own. Apostle seems to think I'm talking entirely about technique but actually I'm talking about the type of sex and the expectation behind it. I just can't get off with a guy who NEEDS to give me oral, fingering, or vaginal penetration to get me off.

 

Sex, it turns out, is about very, very different activities than the 'generally accepted ones' for me, but I never could have known that until I'd had it with 'the right guy'. I need someone who truly does care about what I want, as opposed to just wanting me to say I want what THEY want!

Yes this has been one of my frustrations as well. My wife asks, but really wants to do pretty much the same thing every time (its not that what she wants to do is bad, it can be extremely nice, but why ask). At the same time I ask,  and never get a useful answer, always a "you know what I like".   Well maybe, but I really am happy to do something she would like - including foot rubs 😉  (which I do).  

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Apostle
13 hours ago, Ficto. said:

You never seem to actually read what I was saying. You obviously can't say to your partner 'I love the feeling of being spoken to lovingly during sex' if no one has ever done that for you and it's never something you've considered yourself. That's why it's just not as simple sometimes as being able to say 'this is what I want and how I want it'. I never knew any of the things I wanted sexually until I had them with someone I trusted enough to experiment with. Yes communication is of course vitally important but I don't think anyone is denying that.

 

However I went through 5 years of utterly miserable, painful, un-pleasursble sex because I had no idea there was anything that could have been done that could make me enjoy it. My partner would ONLY do the things he knew other women liked. And now that I know what my needs are I know he never would have been able to meet them anyway due to his *expectation* of sex as though it's his right to have it. The expectation is an instant libido killer for me.

 

Well... You can't MAKE the horse drink if it doesn't want to. And you can't just FORCE someone to enjoy sex out of sheer will. That's liable to make them enjoy it less, not more. Some women though just need to be with the right type of guy (or girl) before they can learn to enjoy sex. That's what happened with me and I've met a fair few women on AVEN now who experienced that (edit and some men too). For women like us, you can't MAKE us enjoy it by your willpower or by trying to insist we do something different. You just have to be the right type of person who matches our innate desires so perfectly that you awaken them within us. *shrug*

 

And no, that obviously won't ever work for an asexual. But for sexual women who have no idea what it is they desire (so they seem asexual), that's how their sexuality is awakened. Hypersexuality in my case. When it's awakened, I can't get enough.

 

This paragraph does prove you didn't properly read anything I said. If it was something as basic as the masturbation technique you use then that's an easy fix because you both just communicate to each other 'a bit to the left' 'harder' 'softer' 'faster' and you can show each other exactly how to do it on your own genitals, easy (in theory. People who refuse to listen dont get it right a lot of the time though). But I'm talking about something very different than merely the technique you use on someone's genitals, obviously. For women like me it's about something so very different and that's why we never even knew it existed.

 

Example, something that gets me off is having a guy fuck my tits. How was I ever meant to know that though?? It wasn't until the guy I was with (who wakened my sexuality) suggested wanting to try it that I realised it's something I want. But only HE could have wakened that in me because of who he was and his sexual expectations (or lack thereof). I knew he still would have been just as happy to never have any form of sex with me and it's THAT which awakened those desires. I never could have known any of that on my own though or with a different type of man.

 

Hmm? You seem to be the type of person who has an answer for everything. 

I've been with a lot of frogs and still not found the 'ideal' person to be with as you have found so you should consider yourself to be ooooooooooh so lucky!

Not many people on this website ( and that runs into the thousands) are as luck as you are.

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Pan Ficto. (on hiatus?)

 

2 hours ago, Apostle said:

I've been with a lot of frogs and still not found the 'ideal' person to be with as you have found so you should consider yourself to be ooooooooooh so lucky!

Hmm. 5 years of horrendous, brutal sexual and physical abuse at the hands of a man who was much older than me, who then forced me into prostitution for two years under threat of mutilation and death, before I was finally able to flee with my toddler (with the help of the police) into a safe house while pregnant with our second child. He went to prison and I have since been a solo parent, entirely alone, with no physical support from anyone.

 

I have a vaginal condition called vestibulodynia which causes agonizing pain upon any form of penetration or stimulation of my genitals, shutting me off from any kind of pleasure with any person who enjoys the 'average' kind of sexual intimacy.

 

In 7 years of celibacy, since leaving my violent ex, I have met ONE person (on this website none the less) who was able to teach me what it means to feel loved, and taught me what it feels like to be able to desire someone sexually. Due to his own awful home circumstances we are no longer

even allowed to be in contact, let alone be together.

 

And yes, my sexual needs are so specific that I will very probably never meet another person like him who matches with me sexually.

 

No, this isn't a 'pity me' story. I'm just trying to illustrate the fact that you should never judge someone in the way you've judged me just because I found someone temporarily with whom I could enjoy a form of sexual pleasure in a way I've never physically been able to before, and probably never will again. (because I've literally never experienced sexual pleasure with any other person alive. Only sexual pain).

 

2 hours ago, Apostle said:

Not many people on this website ( and that runs into the thousands) are as luck as you are.

Well actually there are quite a few people on this website alone who have met their soul mates here and are now married. And that's just on this website. In the world at large there are many people with less specific sexual needs who meet someone they are sexually compatible with and can have a happy relationship with. I wonder how much of your issues with finding someone come down to your attitude as opposed to any specific sexual needs you have though, judging by a lot of what you've said here in the past about women and their sexual needs.

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ryn2
3 hours ago, Apostle said:

I've been with a lot of frogs and still not found the 'ideal' person to be with as you have found so you should consider yourself to be ooooooooooh so lucky!

Not many people on this website ( and that runs into the thousands) are as luck as you are.

It’s also easy to focus on what our own lives lack and forget that we may be fortunate in other areas (and also to forget that different people prioritize happiness/success/good luck across the many aspects that make up our life experience differently).

 

Because of that it’s easy to extend “my life would be much better if I only had [a compatible partner/more money/a better job/a newer house/a way to get to work without driving/etc.] to “everyone who has [thing that would complete my life] has it better than I do.”

 

In actuality many people who have the thing that would complete your life also fall short in other key areas instead.  They may actually be less fortunate (and potentially less happy) overall than you are.

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uhtred
4 hours ago, Ficto. said:

snip

And yes, my sexual needs are so specific that I will very probably never meet another person like him who matches with me sexually.

snip

Don't give up. There really are quite a lot of people who actively enjoy pleasing someone and who would be very happy to do something that gives you pleasure even if it isn't traditional sex.  If there are a set of sexual things you can do for your partner (doesn't need to include penetration), you can probably find someone who would be a great partner. 

 

While "matching" is important, I think that if each wants to please the other, and enjoys doing so, there is usually a way. 

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anisotrophic

At some point I reassured my partner that I suspect someone asexual can arguably be better at sex(ual intimacy), because they don't want any of it themselves, in theory they're only doing it to make their partner happy. Not all sexual partners are selfish about sex, but if they are... it's plausible to do better than that.

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Sally
On 1/15/2019 at 6:39 AM, Apostle said:

. If one of the partners complains that they are bored or any other excuse for not enjoying sex it is because they are not really interested in telling their partner to try something else. 

 

"Any other excuse"?   No one needs an "excuse" to not enjoy sex, or anything else for that matter.  

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Winged Whisperer
On 1/14/2019 at 8:02 PM, uhtred said:

 

If I bring up our issues with sex, she will get unhappy / upset and ask why I didn't tell her earlier.  Our frequency of sex will very briefly go up, then drop back down to normal.   I bring it up rarely because I don't like making her unhappy and it seems that it just pressures her into having sex she really doesn't want. 

Have you guys gone to see a therapist? Seems like a mixture of some underlying issue and communication.

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Pan Ficto. (on hiatus?)
6 hours ago, uhtred said:

Don't give up. There really are quite a lot of people who actively enjoy pleasing someone and who would be very happy to do something that gives you pleasure even if it isn't traditional sex.  If there are a set of sexual things you can do for your partner (doesn't need to include penetration), you can probably find someone who would be a great partner. 

 

While "matching" is important, I think that if each wants to please the other, and enjoys doing so, there is usually a way. 

This next part will be TMI for sex repulsed people

 

For me, I love eating cum.. I can orgasm just from drinking a cup of cum haha. I love the idea of having my tits fucked, being masturbated over, and I orgasm from sucking cock. I also orgasm from anal penetration (both giving and receiving). And the things I can do and enjoy with women are even more extensive. I worship (sexually and in other ways) the body of a man or a woman who I am in love with, and get off sexually on that worship. And those things are just the tip of the iceberg.

 

End TMI

 

So it's not an issue of the activities I am capable of because I'm pretty sure there are a lot of men out there who would be into those things even without being able to give me vaginal penetration or oral, and many women who love to be worshipped sexually as well.

 

The incompatibility issue is that I need the other person to not need sex, and to be perfectly happy to go without it, and to have no expectation of having sex with me, ever. They can't see sex as something they deserve, or have a right to, because that induces immediate and permenant 'asexuality' (an asexual-like state) within me in relation to them. There is no way to turn me off faster than by giving me the impression you'd be unhappy without sex from me, and when that happens, I can't get the desire for you (general you, not you uhtred, lol) back. It's gone.

 

My 'requirements' therefore are very, very specific and apply only to a very small minority of the population. I need someone who isn't unhappy without sex but who actively desires and enjoys the types of sex I desire ONLY when I am aroused enough to want them. He (or she) must be capable of going for long periods of time without sex without even thinking about it, because that lack of reliance on sex induces a kind of hypersexuality in me that can make me want a LOT of sex, only as long as the other person desires it too (when I do) of course. And then of course there are all my other non-sexual boxes that need to be ticked. Because I need to be able to develop an emotional and friendship bond with that person before I can want any kind of sex with them. They need to be funny, kind, honest, hard working, intelligent.. etc. It's not just the sex. The sexual compatibility is only one part of it. (And again, I never would have known any of this if I hadn't found that one person who was able to awaken those things within me, which was the original point I was trying to make)

 

Ergo, it will be very, very difficult for me to find another sexually compatible partner in future. I did find one in my life (the one who made me realise I can desire sex) but like I said his family situation means he's not allowed to contact me anymore, let alone be with me.

 

But I'm not feeling as down as I was yesterday about it (I was just pissed off at being mockingly called 'so lucky' for something that took me years of agonising sexual pain and even more years of celibacy to be able to discover). I know if the right person is out there though then they'll eventually cross my path in a totally unexpected way and things will work out for the best :)

 

I just wanted to clarify that it's not necessarily the actions that are the issue, it's what I need in order to be able to want those actions that are the issue. Yes I'll never be able to enjoy 'normal' sex, but the bigger issue is that the conditions that spark my desire are so rare that it will be a miracle if I ever find another sexually compatible person in my life :P Fortunately I'm happy to go without sex, I just don't like mockingly being called 'lucky' and 'blessed' by a sexual male for something that cost me so much pain and suffering to discover. *sigh*

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uhtred
28 minutes ago, Winged Whisperer said:

Have you guys gone to see a therapist? Seems like a mixture of some underlying issue and communication.

No.  Probably we should.  Its just so difficult to talk to her, and she will insist that there isn't a problem, while getting upset.    I sort of feel like its unlikely to change her behavior.  

 

Yes, I know....  (I have my own hang-ups as well.)

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uhtred
26 minutes ago, Ficto. said:

This next part will be TMI for sex repulsed people

 

For me, I love eating cum.. I can orgasm just from drinking a cup of cum haha. I love the idea of having my tits fucked, being masturbated over, and I orgasm from sucking cock. I also orgasm from anal penetration (both giving and receiving). And the things I can do and enjoy with women are even more extensive. I worship (sexually and in other ways) the body of a man or a woman who I am in love with, and get off sexually on that worship. And those things are just the tip of the iceberg.

 

End TMI

 

So it's not an issue of the activities I am capable of because I'm pretty sure there are a lot of men out there who would be into those things even without being able to give me vaginal penetration or oral, and many women who love to be worshipped sexually as well.

 

The incompatibility issue is that I need the other person to not need sex, and to be perfectly happy to go without it, and to have no expectation of having sex with me, ever. They can't see sex as something they deserve, or have a right to, because that induces immediate and permenant 'asexuality' (an asexual-like state) within me in relation to them. There is no way to turn me off faster than by giving me the impression you'd be unhappy without sex from me, and when that happens, I can't get the desire for you (general you, not you uhtred, lol) back. It's gone.

 

My 'requirements' therefore are very, very specific and apply only to a very small minority of the population. I need someone who isn't unhappy without sex but who actively desires and enjoys the types of sex I desire ONLY when I am aroused enough to want them. He (or she) must be capable of going for long periods of time without sex without even thinking about it, because that lack of reliance on sex induces a kind of hypersexuality in me that can make me want a LOT of sex, only as long as the other person desires it too (when I do) of course. And then of course there are all my other non-sexual boxes that need to be ticked. Because I need to be able to develop an emotional and friendship bond with that person before I can want any kind of sex with them. They need to be funny, kind, honest, hard working, intelligent.. etc. It's not just the sex. The sexual compatibility is only one part of it. (And again, I never would have known any of this if I hadn't found that one person who was able to awaken those things within me, which was the original point I was trying to make)

 

Ergo, it will be very, very difficult for me to find another sexually compatible partner in future. I did find one in my life (the one who made me realise I can desire sex) but like I said his family situation means he's not allowed to contact me anymore, let alone be with me.

 

But I'm not feeling as down as I was yesterday about it (I was just pissed off at being mockingly called 'so lucky' for something that took me years of agonising sexual pain and even more years of celibacy to be able to discover). I know if the right person is out there though then they'll eventually cross my path in a totally unexpected way and things will work out for the best :)

 

I just wanted to clarify that it's not necessarily the actions that are the issue, it's what I need in order to be able to want those actions that are the issue. Yes I'll never be able to enjoy 'normal' sex, but the bigger issue is that the conditions that spark my desire are so rare that it will be a miracle if I ever find another sexually compatible person in my life :P Fortunately I'm happy to go without sex, I just don't like mockingly being called 'lucky' and 'blessed' by a sexual male for something that cost me so much pain and suffering to discover. *sigh*

As you say, your physical interests are fine with many people, and the intelligent, funny etc are all  things that you can find.   A person who likes the sort of sexual activities you enjoy is probably themselves quite active sexually - so someone like that is going to have a hard time not indicating that they want sex.  (which is a turn-off for you).   

 

Can you deal with someone who has a sexual outlet outside of your relationship?

 

Or, what about someone who is happy with a sexual D/S relationship where they are at your sexual beck and call but never allowed to ask themselves. Does it work if its roleplaying?  I could see the activities you enjoy being incorporated into that type of sexual relationship, and that sort of partner might not be that difficult to find.  

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Pan Ficto. (on hiatus?)
Just now, uhtred said:

Can you deal with someone who has a sexual outlet outside of your relationship?

 

Oh absolutely not and that's the point, their need for sex to the extent they'd need to seek outside of the relationship for sexual release would kill any desire I could potentially feel for them.

 

I'm not some fucktoy they can use sometimes and go and get their needs met elsewhere when I can't 'put out' *shudder*, haha! I'd much rather be happily single and celibate like I am right now :P

 

That's the point of why my very specific desires mean I have a very small partner pool (probably less than 1% of the population). I'm not speaking of 'preferences' but of the requirements that have to be met for my body to be physically capable of desiring sex with someone AT ALL :o I am literally unable to desire sex with someone who needs it enough that they'd be unhappy without it, and that's why I thought I was asexual for so long. I'd just never been with someone who truly didn't need sex (but still loved it when he did have it) until I met the guy who made me realise I'm sexual. He is exactly like how I've been describing in that he could go his whole life happily without sex, but has extreme responsive desire to my desire. My desire makes him want sex with me, but only when I'm horny and wanting it. Otherwise he doesn't even think about sex :o

 

5 minutes ago, uhtred said:

Or, what about someone who is happy with a sexual D/S relationship where they are at your sexual beck and call but never allowed to ask themselves. Does it work if its roleplaying?  I could see the activities you enjoy being incorporated into that type of sexual relationship, and that sort of partner might not be that difficult to find.

I can't desire something by trying to force it as a 'fix' if that makes sense? I love dom/sub under some circumstances and me and the guy I keep talking about would often switch if we felt in the mood, but it's not something I could do as a means to try to control the sexual dynamics of the relationship. The sexual dynamics need to happen on their own, naturally (as in, my partner needs to naturally only experience responsive desire) or I lose my desire :o

 

Im not unhappy or sad about this, believe me. I'm just glad I know is all after so many years of not knowing. And I'd much rather just remain single and celibate forever than force myself into sexually incompatible relationships where we have to try to find 'fixes' so we can remain together, if that makes sense?

 

I'm very happy with total celibacy, even if it lasts the rest of my life. If the right person crosses my path again, great!! Or maybe the guy I'm referring to can get things back in order in his life and we could try again, who knows? I don't need fixes or solutions though (though I appreciate you trying to give suggestions!) I'm just not someone who will settle for 'fixes' because as soon as they're needed, I'll lose my desire anyway so it would be pointless trying, haha. I refuse to ever have sex I don't fully desire again. :)

 

But yeah, celibacy works for me. I love it. So there's no issue ^_^ (again, I was just pissed off at being called 'blessed' as a result of all this!)

 

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