Challenges of Allo / Ace long-term relationships, coupled with the challenges of parenting.

[Windmills of My Mind]

On 3/17/2025 at 4:10 PM, blaigorn said:

I don't know if separating would be better or worse for my child. I think about the logistics and how hard it would be to share custody every other week.

 

On 3/17/2025 at 4:10 PM, blaigorn said:

for my wife specially, and if separating was my choice, she would probably feel worse. I don't want to subject her to that, and I don't want to subject my child to not have his mother every day, while he's still a toddler at least.

And how about you?

 

You taking responsibility for your kid is a great thing and I applaud you for that. A very large part of what we want as responsible parents is to raise our children to be happy adults. Now do keep in mind that children learn by example. It is not what you say. It is what you do. Show them an unhappy parent, there is a good chance they will grow up to be unhappy adults. Your intentions are good and commendable. But don't fool yourself into sacrificing your own happiness for your child. If you are unhappy in the end two people will be unhappy: your child learns from you that it is normal to not be happy. The best chance of your kid to grow up to be a fulfilled adult is to have fulfilled parents. Pretend-happy parents raise pretend-happy children.

 

Your wife is not your kid. She is a grown up adult. Her happiness is her own responsibility, not yours. That sounds harsh but we are not responsible for other people's feelings. Doesn't mean we should not care, that is something else altogether. It is not healthy to sacrifice your own well being for someone else.

 

Happiness and living a fulfilled life is like the oxygen masks on an airplane. Put on your own mask first before you help others. Happiness is just like that: you have to be happy yourself before you can make other people happy.

[Windmills of My Mind]

Not exactly the same situation, far from it actually. But it is a similar line of thinking so here goes.

 

I once quit a well paying job, at a multinational consulting firm, went back to school, learned new skills and ended up applying for a job at a smallish family owned business. It paid a lot less than my old job. It made me a happier person, a better human. One of the reasons for this risky change was my kids. I did not want to set an example of staying in a well paid job that made me seriously unhappy. I will never make as much money as I used to do. I took a gamble that could have turned out worse than it did, financially among other things. It made me a better parent. I hope my children will grow up to have the guts to take similar decisions in their lives, if the situation would require them to do so. I'd much rather see them happy than rich.

[blaigorn]

@Windmills of My Mind thanks for sharing your views here, I think, yes, I need to think about my happiness. It's just that it feels like maybe there's a happier path than separating or opening our marriage. Maybe not.

 

One interesting experience I heard was from a woman (allo) that divorced, but still lived with her ex-husband (ace). They slept on separate beds, and co-parented on the same house. And they were still platonic, in better terms than when they were married. I think that's an interesting dynamic, that could potentially work. I don't even think we would need to divorce, maybe recognize that we are romantic partners, I'm perfectly fine with sharing a house, finances and a life together. That's what we signed up for, and I'd be happy with that! So opening up seems the logical option, which convinced me to at least learn more about it.

 

I've been also listening to the @Allo And Ace Podcast it's interesting seeing a lot of experiences being mirrored with mine and my wife, which makes me even more certain that my wife is sex-averse. I've listened up to ep. 4, and one thing that resonated with me is the fear from the allo of never having sex again. In the podcast it seems like the allo has accepted that and managed to overcome that fear (at least up to ep. 4 I'm interested to see how they evolved their relationship). I still have that fear, and it grows stronger on me. I'm not sure I could abdicate that. I have come to enjoy the moments of intimacy we have (cuddling, spooning, back rubs), and I do think it helped pairing those with no sexual expectation. But still I yearn for more.

[blaigorn]

And I just got motivated to write a Fear List, that I'll share with my therapist. I think it helped getting this written down. I probably have more, but these were on the top of my mind:

• If I stay
  • I won't ever have sex again
  • I won't get to explore myself sexually
  • I will build resentment and anger into my relationship
  • I'll lose the sense of who I am
  • I won't ever be truly happy
• If I separate
  • I will disappoint and be the talk of my friends and family
  • I won't be able to support my wife
  • I won't find another person to share my life with
  • My child will hate me for causing this situation
  • I might regret it
• If I open
  • I will disappoint and be the talk of my friends and family
  • I won't find a person willing to do this arrangement
  • I won't have time to pursue other relationships
  • I might regret it
  • The arrangement we come up with might not be sufficient
  • My wife may regret the arrangement

[Olallieberry]

@blaigorn There are (at least) two threads here in FSPFA which kind of journal the experiences of sexual spouses/parents who pursued the "extramarital" route.

 

 One is my own, entitled "Gut punched," and one is by @Traveler40, and is entitled "Truce."

 

I'm not saying you're going to find a solution by going extramarital, but, if you want to know what it has been like for a couple of specific people in their specific situations, those are available.

 

These were both lengthy processes and developments are ongoing. These are uncertain journeys, not finger-snap solutions. No matter which among the four options you pursue in your own marriage, the exploration will probably take a long time. On the plus side, this means you can go slow and take it easy. For me, having progress in the relationship makes it worth it to keep trying. If the situation becomes stuck and static, that's when it gets bad and becomes intolerable.

[blaigorn]

Thank you @Olallieberry, learning about all your experiences is helping a lot. I do realize it will take time, and while some part of me feels impatient (I want to get this "fixed" right now), I think that our relationship merits the hard work and patience. Learning there's progress to be had is encouraging in itself.

 

Today I read two interesting resources. One details things recommended to do before opening up: https://www.reddit.com/r/polyamory/comments/z9p7yp/taking_the_idea_of_the_most_skipped_steps_farther/  Reading through that, it's embarassing how codependent we are with each other. I think there's a lot to work on right there.

 

And another interesting one, about "Couples Privilege", the mainstream acceptance of the dyad relationship: https://openrelating.love/couples-privilege/

 

[Traveler40]

Interesting - I read both of those linked articles and don’t connect or identify with either. 
 

I wasn’t ever looking for love without sex, then sex without love or freedom from coupledom. I wanted the “couple privilege” by design not by default.

 

What I got was not what I dreamed of as a girl, but in fighting for my sanity and emotional security in a mixed marriage I blazed my own trail. Our kids are always paramount.
 

Read everything, but listen to yourself most. You know what you need and want. Figure that out, draw up your life plan and  work towards it. That will look different for everyone.
 

This situation is crazy, but these are the cards you’ve been dealt. Play the hand.

[blaigorn]

An update on my situation, as I intend to log these as I find relevant, both in the spirit of sharing and for articulating my own thoughts. We talked plainly about the rough period and negative thoughts I had, and that I would be making efforts to sharing more of those instead of my own pattern of closing myself when that happens. 

 

I told my wife I finally learned to truly accept her as asexual and having empathy for what she felt, and how hard it must have been for her, after reading multiple experiences that mirrored what we experienced. That's part of who she is, and I don't think we should focus on changing her, or hoping she changes. I also told her I was finally able to enjoy physical intimacy with her without being frustrated by the lack of it leading to sexual intimacy. So I promised to do more of that, and enjoy it. Finally I told her that I do have a need for sexual intimacy, and we need to find a solution together. But first I wanted to invest in us, in our communication and quality time together, so that we can reach a solution that's the best for us. Because I still love her as a friend and romantically, and I want us to have a life together, if possible, or if not, be on our best terms.

 

I've alluded to ENM as an option, but didn't focus on it. I think it's the most interesting option right now, but I will only be OK with it on her terms, and if she truly believes it's the best option for us. I didn't share that yet, because I think it would be overwhelming for her. I want us to build a base before seriously considering this with her -- and maybe that won't even be the option we decide, or explore first, and I'm ok with that!

 

So that's what we are at right now. As a result we have been talking more and sharing more. I sense something could be changing for us, and we'll see where it leads.

[Olallieberry]

2 hours ago, blaigorn said:

An update on my situation, as I intend to log these as I find relevant, both in the spirit of sharing and for articulating my own thoughts. We talked plainly about the rough period and negative thoughts I had, and that I would be making efforts to sharing more of those instead of my own pattern of closing myself when that happens. 

 

I told my wife I finally learned to truly accept her as asexual and having empathy for what she felt, and how hard it must have been for her, after reading multiple experiences that mirrored what we experienced. That's part of who she is, and I don't think we should focus on changing her, or hoping she changes. I also told her I was finally able to enjoy physical intimacy with her without being frustrated by the lack of it leading to sexual intimacy. So I promised to do more of that, and enjoy it. Finally I told her that I do have a need for sexual intimacy, and we need to find a solution together. But first I wanted to invest in us, in our communication and quality time together, so that we can reach a solution that's the best for us. Because I still love her as a friend and romantically, and I want us to have a life together, if possible, or if not, be on our best terms.

 

I've alluded to ENM as an option, but didn't focus on it. I think it's the most interesting option right now, but I will only be OK with it on her terms, and if she truly believes it's the best option for us. I didn't share that yet, because I think it would be overwhelming for her. I want us to build a base before seriously considering this with her -- and maybe that won't even be the option we decide, or explore first, and I'm ok with that!

 

So that's what we are at right now. As a result we have been talking more and sharing more. I sense something could be changing for us, and we'll see where it leads.

Soooo relatable

[blaigorn]

small update: we had another talk during the next weekend. Mostly because she mentioned in passing that she might be willing to try something new, that had never worked for her before (she thinks it might work now due to body changes after her pregnancy).

 

I was confused, since I assumed she didn’t want to do anything sexual, based on her saying during therapy that she never felt she good or like she wanted sex with me, she only did it after a sense of duty and for me to leave her alone. In fact this was one of the main reasons why I didn’t think a compromise was possible at all for us.

 

She clarified that was mostly the case for penetrative sex, and that she did enjoy it when I masturbated her. I said that was interesting because I could see it as an avenue to compromise, as I did get some sexual intimacy out of masturbating her, even without reciprocation. I asked her why she hadn’t allowed me to do it more, if she did enjoy it. She said she always felt like, despite me assuring her I didn’t want her to reciprocate, she felt like she did. 

 

We talked about ENM as an option, and she said it would take a great amount of work for her to overcome her self esteem and jealousy issues first. I think this was great progress, because it’s different than the previous: “I’m not sure I could or it’s not for me”. She also said that she would prefer me to leave than for me to subject to a life where I’m not happy with her. She said she preferred to do it sooner rather than later, specially as we have a small children, as building anger and resentment could end worse. I assured her I do value our life, physical intimacy and romantic life together, so I wanted to try everything before that.

 

So we settled to keep talking and trying to see if a compromise work. I said it will take a lot of work from me and her and asked her if she was willing to do the work. She said she is. She suggested us switching our couples therapist, because she’s more focused on us getting more alone time together and walking around the asexuality issue. I agreed it might be better, if we find one that’s more accepting of us.

 

This is getting long, but I want just to add two more things.

 

One is that I suggested us taking a bath together (we do showers from time to time). She agreed and was actually excited for it. I was hoping she would allow me to masturbate her, specially after our talk earlier in the week. She refused. It was disappointing. We still have long ways to go.

 

The second is the Discord support group has been going well. I feel like I can support and be supported by the people in there. Feels like we are all on the same boat and rooting each other. It also gave me an odd sense of purpose (combined with Aven).

 

[blaigorn]

It has been a while, since my last update. In fact, two whole months, which is wild, but in retrospect it makes sense I didn't update. Because nothing seemed to really moved regarding our relationship.

 

Outside the relationship I'm thriving. I've been consistent with running again, and with that my mood seemed to stabilize. I was definitely having the worst depression of my life a couple of months ago, but finally seem to be back at an OK baseline. I've started new hobbies. Most important, I've made a few new online friends and have been regularly talking with them. The allo/ace support group I started is also helping me. Both venting and sharing about minor things on my relationship, and also trying to help others.

 

So what about the relationship? I think the main driver for my unhappiness these last two months was the lack of initiative from my wife. She said she wanted to try a compromise. I didn't believe a compromise was possible and I had already accepted we wouldn't be having sex again, ever. But she said she wanted to try. So I decided I would be open to that. And then, nothing changed. Not a single word about it. I never felt less heard and alone in my life. The little alone time we had, we didn't really talk about anything other than logistics. I tried to bring up the topic twice, and in both cases she diverted it to her own feelings of being overwhelmed. I failed to be assertive and gone to the same behavior I always had. I shut down.

 

I started to ponder on how unimportant and invisible I feel in this relationship. How I constantly sacrifice myself to try and alleviate any of the load she's bearing, since she vents frequently about it. The other day we were spooning in bed and gave her a head massage, which I frequently do. I got aroused by it, as she clearly enjoys the innocent massages I give her. When I stopped, I noticed my legs were sore from all the running I did. I thought, it would be so great if she offered to massage my legs. Reciprocation. In that moment I felt conflicted about asking her to do it. I wanted her to do something spontaneous for me. But then I raised above my own dark thoughts and asked her. She complied. I liked the massage. But I couldn't notice that I lost my physical arousal as she touched me. I don't know what that means, maybe nothing to think too much about.

 

Either way, I'm rambling. The point is, I felt disconnected again with my wife. Like I was divesting myself from the relationship. I felt burned out. I discussed all of this with my therapist. She suggested writing a list of all the things I wished my wife would do for me. I found that incredibly hard to do. There's not a single thing that I would point as significant enough for me to care. I know, the combination, doing these repeatedly might help me. But it's hard to find things that doesn't seem like too small to budge the needle.

 

Over the weekend, before our couple's therapy appointment, I started again the discussion saying I wanted to talk about the lack of progress on a compromise. I said that maybe it would be best if we talked about this on couple's therapy, as I imagined the conversation would be hard. I told her about feeling like she doesn't do a thing for me in the relationship. She told me that was very difficult to hear, and she feels it's not fair. I did say that I'm fully conscious that I'm probably in a very bad mental place to even see the things she does. Because, yes, obviously there are things she does for me. But in a share household and parenting, what are the things she does for me, or the things are just a natural consequence of balancing our conjoined lives?

 

During couple's therapy my wife didn't bring up the topic about our sexual intimacy. I waited until 30 minutes were left in the session and said I wanted to talk about that. She told me, when she said she wanted to try a compromise, she meant medium/long term. I don't know what to make of that. What medium/long term is for her. She said she feels overwhelmed with all the diagnosis (AuDHD) she had recently. And the topic of asexuality was so difficult for her, that she ended up ignoring it. She committed with the therapist to put some time on the calendar to research about asexuality. Research about herself. Try to find what a compromise could be.

 

We are also forcing ourselves to spend more alone time in the evenings, after our son is asleep. We made out physically (just kisses and non sexual touch). I had moments where I felt lost in it, and I enjoyed some of it. I ended up aroused and still wanting for more. The difference is that I don't want more with her, and that does help manage the frustration.

 

I vowed again to wait and not pressure her. That I don't want her to do anything that goes against what she wants physically. We are trying to have the alone time to be opportunities to resume playing puzzles and board games (thanks to the support group suggestions).

 

I don't know if this is enough of a development. But given the state we were in, this feels like progress.

 

I learned that I need to make my wife accountable now. Yes, she needs time, but I need to see her invested. And I need to see progress.

[Olallieberry]

9 hours ago, blaigorn said:

I learned that I need to make my wife accountable now. Yes, she needs time, but I need to see her invested. And I need to see progress.

9 hours ago, blaigorn said:

She said she wanted to try a compromise. [...] And then, nothing changed. Not a single word about it. I never felt less heard and alone in my life. The little alone time we had, we didn't really talk about anything other than logistics. I tried to bring up the topic twice, and in both cases she diverted it to her own feelings of being overwhelmed

9 hours ago, blaigorn said:

I waited until 30 minutes were left in the session and said I wanted to talk about that. She told me, when she said she wanted to try a compromise, she meant medium/long term. I don't know what to make of that. What medium/long term is for her.

And maybe besides what medium/long term is for her, maybe not knowing what to make of what she even means by "compromise?"

 

I get the rug-pulled feeling this caused. She proactively said she wanted to try something, and then backed off from that.

 

And it doesn't seem you know what she even had in mind, what she was even thinking when she said it.

 

I'd find out.

 

So maybe the first bit of progress to look for, to come out and ask her for, is, getting her to say what it means, what she thought she wanted when she brought it up, whether she's changing her mind, whether she has a timeline, what need she has which her "try again" idea is filling.

 

A conversation like that should go a long way toward setting expectations which you can then measure as you look for progress in the future.

 

I'm glad it already feels like progress, even with the rug-pulling of her lack of follow-through.

 

9 hours ago, blaigorn said:

I vowed again to wait and not pressure her.

Wait for what?

 

What if she continues not moving anything forward?

 

You don't have to make it a "pressure," but you also don't have to just wait forever. 

 

So do you have specifics in mind, regarding what it is you believe you're waiting for and how long you think you'll wait for it?

 

It would be good to get those figured out. Because leaving it in the other person's court might be a recipe for getting stuck even longer.

 

It is OK for you to assert yourself. It is not unfair to her if you don't just wait forever for her to figure out what she wants to try and when she wants to try it.

 

It's also OK to not promise that whatever she comes up with will work for you. You need to try it and see, just as much as she does.

 

9 hours ago, blaigorn said:

I learned that I need to make my wife accountable now. Yes, she needs time, but I need to see her invested. And I need to see progress.

Good lesson about her accountability.

[blaigorn]

On 6/18/2025 at 11:24 PM, Olallieberry said:

And maybe besides what medium/long term is for her, maybe not knowing what to make of what she even means by "compromise?"

We talked about what compromises might be possible for her two months ago, when she asked for a compromise. She said she didn't know, that we might need help suggesting a few (we even considered switching our couples therapist at that point, because we were feeling like we were in a stalemate). I even came up with a few suggestions. All things that felt too little to me, but that she showed some openness too. I was open to try if they filled my sexual intimacy needs, despite my skepticism. I felt it was the minimum we could do to honor her wishes and the "easiest path" before exploring other options.

 

More than one week has passed since the latest session. I plan to ask her this week what was her idea of a medium/long term is for a compromise, and if she made any progress regarding her own (a)sexuality research. If she didn't, I'll ask her what is her plan then, and how I can support her to make sure she does the work and we don't get stuck again. She might also not want to do the work, I understand it might be hard for her, if that happens, and there's no support I can give her, we might need to tread on a different path.

 

On a sweeter note, since I've shared with her that I didn't feel she was doing anything for me in this relationship, she started to pay more attention to our parenting/chores distribution. She also offered to give me a night off to do a running race somewhere far away, for a more relaxed environment that I can enjoy. I thought this was thoughtful, but alas, my races until the end of the year are basically already planned, and they are all local. Maybe next year.

[blaigorn]

Can't believe it has been almost three months since my last update.. I guess in a way I procrastinate, waiting for the next big thing. And when a somewhat big thing happens, it's kind of hard to write up everything that has happened. I'll try to be brief (otherwise I won't ever post).

 

I've become more and more comfortable exploring my sexual self. I've started reading and writing kinky erotica. I'm also more comfortable on the idea that I'm bi/pan, and appreciating more that side of me. I'm prouder of my identity at last.

 

I've been exposed to more stories about polyamory/ENM (through podcasts, books and testimonies). I started to see it as a thing that could work for me, even if it would require more work for both of us. I started to become excited about it, about the possibilities of it. I thought, even if I am to separate, maybe this is something I want to try with future partners. A bleak part of me thinks that, if my current monogamous relationship doesn't work out, there's no monogamous relationship that will work for me.

 

So, because I wasn't seeing things going anywhere, I finally had a conversation with my wife telling her I'd like to learn more about ENM, even if we decided it wouldn't be a thing for us. I wanted to truly learn the motions, the "steps", the possibilities, the guidelines and pitfalls. Maybe to try to see if I REALLY could see myself in an ENM arrangement, or not.

 

She took it hard, harder than I expected. She said she couldn't see that working for her. That it would cause her a lot of pain. I could see the pain it caused, just by asking. There was a lot of crying, accusations that I "just wanted a quick way out" or "a girlfriend on the side" and even a "I don't want to talk about this". It made me feel so bad, like I did something awful, and hurt our relationship permanently. 

 

Fortunately, the next day we both agreed that possibility would eventually be up for discussion. We agreed to not talk about it until our next therapy session together.

 

During that session, she told me it was 100% out of the question for her. I told her I respected that. It hurts me she doesn't want to try, to maybe see if she could be okay with it, with small steps. But I do respect her decision. She is entitled to the relationship model she wants, and that's the model we entered the relationship to begin with.

 

So we decided we are back to try a compromise. Because the other solution would be a separation. We came up with actionable plans, deciding a date, and deciding what we would do. I won't go into details, but what she felt comfortable doing seemed not enough on the get go. But I decided to keep an open mind and try.

 

It felt underwhelming. But I thought maybe I needed to give it some time and more tries. Maybe eventually we would both open up and be able to find satisfaction.

Well, second time happened the next week. It felt worse. Honestly, I would much rather be masturbating.

 

That was over a month ago. We stopped trying, mostly from a lack of free time with the holidays (and a small kid at home), but I also know it's a lack of motivation on my end. My depression seems to have come in force, thankfully not as bad as in March this year.

 

I honestly don't know where we go from here. Separation feels like I'm asking for a new problem and obstacle to enter our lives. And I'm not even sure a separation would be a solution for anything. I ponder if I can even feel happiness, and that maybe I'm clinging to the elusive sexual intimacy as a way to find it. What if it isn't there?

 

I was hoping for better news to share, but it almost looks like I'm back to square one.

 

 

[Windmills of My Mind]

5 hours ago, blaigorn said:

So, because I wasn't seeing things going anywhere, I finally had a conversation with my wife telling her I'd like to learn more about ENM, even if we decided it wouldn't be a thing for us. I wanted to truly learn the motions, the "steps", the possibilities, the guidelines and pitfalls. Maybe to try to see if I REALLY could see myself in an ENM arrangement, or not.

Sounds fair to me. You can learn about what it means for you and investigate options.

[Windmills of My Mind]

5 hours ago, blaigorn said:

She took it hard, harder than I expected. She said she couldn't see that working for her. That it would cause her a lot of pain. I could see the pain it caused, just by asking.

A good thing to see and acknowledge her pain. At the same time these are her feelings, to own and process. You can love and support her. But you are not to blame for her discomfort.

[Windmills of My Mind]

5 hours ago, blaigorn said:

There was a lot of crying, accusations that I "just wanted a quick way out" or "a girlfriend on the side" and even a "I don't want to talk about this". It made me feel so bad, like I did something awful, and hurt our relationship permanently.

The crying is OK. This process comes with grief. The accusations are not. If you bring the conversation from " I" statements, sincerely investigating options with an open mind and without judgement then her reaction sounds gaslighty to me. You did not "do something awful" nor "hurt the relationship permanently". For me the "I don't want to talk about this" part is what would endanger the relationship.

[Windmills of My Mind]

5 hours ago, blaigorn said:

Fortunately, the next day we both agreed that possibility would eventually be up for discussion. We agreed to not talk about it until our next therapy session together.

Sounds good, as long as it does not lead to infinite procrastination.

[Windmills of My Mind]

5 hours ago, blaigorn said:

During that session, she told me it was 100% out of the question for her. I told her I respected that. It hurts me she doesn't want to try, to maybe see if she could be okay with it, with small steps. But I do respect her decision. She is entitled to the relationship model she wants, and that's the model we entered the relationship to begin with.

At first that sounds fair. But is "entitlement" a healthy place to start from? Following the same line of reasoning one could state that you are entitled to the relationship model you signed up for. Which is a relationship with an active and fulfilling sexual component. Clearly you are not entitled to sex from her. She is not entitled to a life without sex from you.

 

To me it seems the model you entered the relationship with clearly is not working for the two of you. Either the model needs to be investigated with an open mind and without judgement, blaming or accusations, by both partners. If the model cannot change, it should be clear that either at least one partner remains miserable (more probably both). Or the relationship ends.

[Olallieberry]

Hi @blaigorn. I bet this feels pretty rotten right now. I don't know where this will go for you and your spouse.

 

6 hours ago, blaigorn said:

I ponder if I can even feel happiness, and that maybe I'm clinging to the elusive sexual intimacy as a way to find it. What if it isn't there?

There's a lot to unpack here.

 

First: The pondering sounds like a symptom of depression. You're a human being, of course you're able to feel happiness. Maybe just not right now under the present circumstances. Don't imagine that it won't ever be possible, don't resign yourself to never pursuing it or hoping for it. Know that it's available, but maybe you'll have to do something different in order to access it.

 

Beyond that, it doesn't sound to me like (extramarital) sexual intimacy would automatically bring happiness. "What if it isn't there" is a great question to ask. What if it isn't there? Would there be something there worth reaching for anyway?

 

I have access to that, and "happiness" isn't what it brings me. What brings me happiness is the partnership I'm in which is permissive, empathetic and trusting enough that I can access sexual intimacy. Casual extramarital sex isn't where happiness is, all that's there is occasional relief and entertainment. I don't even take advantage of the opportunity very often at all.

 

The real benefit to me of extramarital permission is that the stuck/trapped/doomed feeling is gone. Gone! No longer do I anticipate having to choose between permanent celibacy or divorce, both of which are unthinkable. Well, at this point, anyway. You know my story: There have been points at which divorce was not unthinkable and in fact seemed inevitable.

 

But not in an out-of-control kind of way, like it was barreling toward me threateningly. I have been all the way to the end of the rope and anticipated that if it ran out, I would be okay. It would at least be a change.

 

Anyway, that was what I felt. I had a long time to think about, am I willing to go there if the alternative is the total destruction of my sex life forever.

 

Take your time.

 

And do something fun! Maybe together, maybe by yourself. Don't let the understandably hyper-negative mood gaslight you into giving up.

[blaigorn]

Thanks for your candidness and support.

 

Yes, depression is something I've been struggling with, probably my whole adult life, as I've been diagnosed with PDD. It's "fine" because at least is functional, as in, I can get out of the bed and grind through the day, everyday. The scary part is when I start to lose motivation on my hobbies and my work, which has happened. At least I know the signs and I know it's my brain doing that. It won't always be like that.

 

5 hours ago, Windmills of My Mind said:

The crying is OK. This process comes with grief. The accusations are not. If you bring the conversation from " I" statements, sincerely investigating options with an open mind and without judgement then her reaction sounds gaslighty to me. You did not "do something awful" nor "hurt the relationship permanently". For me the "I don't want to talk about this" part is what would endanger the relationship.

I should have said that these were reactions in the moment. It hurt me, it made me sick to my stomach. During that night we didn't talk, or even hug each other. I really thought I had made permanent damage and I regretted talking. But in the next morning, it was all good, and we talked about how sensitive that topic was. We had the chance to speak about it later during couple's therapy, as I said. 

 

Oh I forgot one thing she also accused me was that "I didn't want to do the work to make our relationship work (and just wanted quick sex on the side)" and that "I didn't have empathy for her". That I did push back on in the moment, telling that I did an enormous amount of work and effort to learn about asexuality and people on the similar situations as us. And that I've been doing a lot of work myself to try and find alternatives.

 

I had the chance to work this through with my therapist. She told me my wife's accusatory and defensiveness came from a hurt place. She feels cornered, she feels at fault, and she lashes out and projects on me. It was something from that moment, and it's on the past now.

 

 

[Gecko1]

On 9/17/2025 at 3:58 PM, blaigorn said:

I was hoping for better news to share, but it almost looks like I'm back to square one.

It’s not entirely back to square one because at least now you have a better idea of what works and what doesn’t. But I do know what you mean. We started couples’s therapy to fully explore all the options because I wasn’t  (still not) doing well with opening the marriage. And came full circle back to where we started because he really doesn’t want to divorce and that only really leaves open marriage, which in my mind is just one step away from separation.

 

If you do start the conversation about separating, it might be helpful for both of you if you include what that could look like. It doesn’t have to mean you both go your separate ways and never talk again. You could continue to live together as roommates and co-parents. You could buy a duplex so you each have your own space, or both rent apartments in the same apartment complex. It might seem less threatening that way if you do go that route. 

[Windmills of My Mind]

56 minutes ago, Gecko1 said:

But I do know what you mean. We started couples’s therapy to fully explore all the options because I wasn’t  (still not) doing well with opening the marriage. And came full circle back to where we started because he really doesn’t want to divorce

It is takes two to tango, but only one to divorce. By that I mean to say your partner may not want to divorce but you do not require his approval to separate. You can make your own choices in life.

 

Realistically speaking, so other than a sexually fulfilling relationship with your husband, what is it that you want?

[Gecko1]

1 hour ago, Windmills of My Mind said:

It is takes two to tango, but only one to divorce. By that I mean to say your partner may not want to divorce but you do not require his approval to separate. You can make your own choices in life.

Yes, I do plan to give it a few months before bringing the topic back up for several reasons, one of which is to give him some time to experience it and have a clearer idea if that’s still what he wants.  

 

In this situation, I’m the asexual one. I think I just want to focus on raising my kids and relationships with my family and friends, while still leaving the door open to meet someone who I am more compatible with.

[Windmills of My Mind]

Yes, that sounds healthy to me. I hope you will get into a better place. Unhappy parents set a bad example to their children, a healthy divorce is better than an unhappy marriage. Wishing you strength on your path.

[blaigorn]

On 9/19/2025 at 6:12 PM, Gecko1 said:

If you do start the conversation about separating, it might be helpful for both of you if you include what that could look like. It doesn’t have to mean you both go your separate ways and never talk again. You could continue to live together as roommates and co-parents. You could buy a duplex so you each have your own space, or both rent apartments in the same apartment complex. It might seem less threatening that way if you do go that route. 

Thanks for your suggestions and perspective. We actually started talking about divorce a bit more openly. We both don’t want that, but it’s clear that’s a likely possibility.

 

See that’s the thing that gets fuzzy for me. We kind of established that we would still live together, probably separate bedrooms, at least for a while. We bought a house last year and need time to recoup our finances to even consider me moving out, or even selling the house. I also want to give our son the stability of a house that is his own for as long as I can. 

 

That makes for the least disruptive separation to our son I can think of. A separation where our son stays one week with one parent and the other week with the other would eventually follow, but I assume it could take years before we get there.

 

And in this limbo I’m not really sure what differences there are from an ENM arrangement. It already feels like we are roommates as we are right now. For me it might actually make things easier on the dating side, it’s probably easier than finding the right person that is okay with an ENM arrangement (except that I’ve started seeing polyamory as something I would like to try if I were to become single). 

[Gecko1]

I’m glad you’re having those conversations now.

 

6 hours ago, blaigorn said:

And in this limbo I’m not really sure what differences there are from an ENM arrangement. It already feels like we are roommates as we are right now. For me it might actually make things easier on the dating side, it’s probably easier than finding the right person that is okay with an ENM arrangement (except that I’ve started seeing polyamory as something I would like to try if I were to become single). 

From my perspective, the biggest difference between ENM and being divorced but living as roommates is being authentic and open about the situation. At least for us, no one knows we are currently ENM and it feels like living a lie. When he goes on a date, I have to lie to the kids about where dad is going and why they can’t go. If we were divorced, I could tell them that he is on a date. Also our friends and family would know and could support us.

 

Also, there’s the hope for the future. You have a better chance of finding someone who wants a lifelong relationship with you as a divorced person rather than as ENM looking for a girlfriend. Or someone who is poly and interested in an open relationship. Your wife also has a better chance of potentially finding someone who is a better match sexually for her. Or even a close platonic friend. 

[Olallieberry]

14 hours ago, blaigorn said:

in this limbo I’m not really sure what differences there are from an ENM arrangement

Well,

 

I personally have always had a (fairly minor) cognitive dissonance on this subject, since the alternative isn’t exactly “monogamy,” but more like something I have called “zerogamy.” In my case, I just swallow that and call it ENM because it is ethical, informed and consensual from my spouse’s point of view (I mean, mine too, but hers is the one which matters.) In your case, does “separated but cohabiting” and “having separate bedrooms” mean you’ll be seeing anyone else? And if so, is that by implication/assumption, or is it by explicitly spoken statements? And does “not yet divorced” imply any sort of commitment to any sort of thing which looks like any sort of fidelity at all?

 

If there is a lot of unstated stuff here, then, this wouldn’t really look like ENM to me, because ENM is a talked-out-loud-about agreement. On the other hand, if you have talked about it and if the expectation clearly is that you won’t be monogamous nor zerogamous either with your wife, then, maybe that’s ENM or maybe it’s just what we call “over.”

 

I see why you call it “limbo.” If that means you know what direction you’re going but know that it will be a while before you get there, that’s probably a fine basis upon which to start trying ENM. IF “limbo” means that there is still a lot of uncertainty regarding unstated expectations, I personally wouldn’t advise doing anything which the other person OR any potential partner could perceive as “unfaithful” before really, really talking about stuff out loud. I don’t know what the state of the art is, there, so far.

[blaigorn]

On 9/22/2025 at 9:16 AM, Gecko1 said:

At least for us, no one knows we are currently ENM and it feels like living a lie. When he goes on a date, I have to lie to the kids about where dad is going and why they can’t go. If we were divorced, I could tell them that he is on a date. Also our friends and family would know and could support us.

Yes, that I do understand, and my wife's expressed the same concerns about ENM. Unfortunately any sort of non-monogamy arrangement is taboo and not accepted (at least in our group of friends/family and even society around us in general). Wish it was different, but it's something we can't change. In that perspective, yes, I see how a divorce might be way different.

 

On 9/22/2025 at 4:58 PM, Olallieberry said:

In your case, does “separated but cohabiting” and “having separate bedrooms” mean you’ll be seeing anyone else? And if so, is that by implication/assumption, or is it by explicitly spoken statements? And does “not yet divorced” imply any sort of commitment to any sort of thing which looks like any sort of fidelity at all?

We haven't talked about these logistics, but I agree, we would clearly state expectations and rules, to be respectful of each other while we navigate this "limbo", where we gradually untangle our lives (finances, coparenting, house), which needs time for us to do it in a stable and non-damaging way. As you said, there could be an expectation from my wife that I don't pursue relationships during this period, we'd have to talk to see what is reasonable or not.

[Gecko1]

On 9/22/2025 at 12:23 AM, blaigorn said:

We actually started talking about divorce a bit more openly.

We just started this discussion too. It’s definitely hard, but also a relief to start talking about it.