Sex favorable aces? Maybe, even, aces who desire sex?

[binary suns]

Hi I'd like to hear about sex-favorable aces and their experience, since I know literally nothing about it. I've heard about people who desire sex but never feel that sex targeted or based off someone in particular, but i don't know if that is real and what it looks like. 

 

 

AVEN is not all that friendly towards such people however, so I understand if you don't want to share, which is why I made a poll! I hope there are some people on this forum still who can vote about it, since the few I saw on the forum several years ago aren't here and I don't see activity about it....

[Philip027]

Because people have different takes on what it means exactly, what are you defining as "sex-favorable"?

 

I don't generally think of myself as sex-favorable, but the way I've seen some describe it, I could technically qualify to some.  (I haven't voted.)

[Guest]

I'm a sex-favorable gray ace. I find sex to be pleasurable but really the main focus for me is that my allo spouse enjoys it. Also, I love that even after all these years she still desires me so I'm happy to make sure her needs are met.

[everywhere and nowhere]

1 hour ago, hois said:

AVEN is not all that friendly towards such people however

It's not that we are unfriendly. There are sex-favourable asexuals here. (I'm absolutely not one of them, I'm strictly sex-averse.) We are just trying to educate, trying to navigate the narrow corridor between education and "invalidation" or "gatekeeping". I'm not saying that we should be angry gatekeepers, but should we, for the sake of "not invalidating other people's identification", not even try to correct misconceptions? For example, something I have seen (again) just today: the misconception that "sexual attraction" has to be based on appearance, and therefore if you don't think of other people as "hot", you qualify as asexual, seems quite widespread. Not correcting it is beneficial neither to asexuals nor to allosexuals - as many have already pointed out, misconceptions about "sexual attraction" create the image of allosexuals as shallow, superficial, sex-obsessed people.

Yes, to be honest: I favour the desire-based definition of asexuality. I believe that asexuals are people who don't desire partnered sex, and not people who don't perceive others in categories such as "sexually attractive". (I also believe that "sexual attraction" and "finding someone sexually attractive" seem to be commonly confused, and it's not the same!) But there is still a gray area between "not desiring sex" and "not wanting sex for any reason" and many sex-favourable and sex-indifferent asexuals fit in this zone. For me a "sex-favourable asexual" is someone who doesn't desire sex for their own sake, feels like they could be fine with never doing it, but are able to enjoy it and genuinely fine with doing it for a partner. It is an experience very alien to me as someone who is strongly sex-averse and even psychologically incapable of having sex, but I dare not say that some experience is impossible. There's absolutely nothing wrong with it as long as aces who aren't sex-favourable are not pressured to try "whether they could enjoy sex" - those who feel uncomfortable about the possibility of having sex should be free to decide that they don't want to do it without having any sexual experience.

[EmeraldIce]

I think of sex as any other activity you do with your partner. To be fair, it's harder to be mentally there than for other activities because sex feels less natural than most other daily activities and requires my utmost concentration and I tend to go all quiet and still as a result (which honestly my husband does not like). But other than that, yeah, it's no big deal whether or not we do it. I just do it 1) because we want kids, 2) because I've been taught I should, and 3) because I love cuddling and spooning and even playing with his private parts, and one thing kind of leads to another. For someone who claims to have no idea what sex-favorable aces feel or act like, you've certainly had some great options in this survey that correspond to me perfectly! Notably, that " I like masturbation better, but sex is something that is neutral or less appealing, I just know I'm comfortable doing it for the sake of my partner." That describes me perfectly! Sex doesn't scratch the itch even when I have the drive, but it also doesn't hurt or disgust me in any way and I like feeling his body next to mine so that's a plus. Also the "I don't seek sex but do initiate intimacy with expectation of sexual connection." That is soooooo specific, but it is sooooo true when it comes to our sex life!

[everywhere and nowhere]

3 hours ago, EmeraldIce said:

because I've been taught I should

I don't want to question your feelings, I know that you felt hurt by my approach which emphasises protection from unwanted sex and doesn't take into account those who really don't mind sex despite not desiring it. (That said, remember that I am very genuinely sex-averse, although at least I have fortunately never had sex. Sex is for me not "an innocent activity", but something I could never endure, a horrible activity I intend to avoid for life. And I have seen asexuals who were not as lucky as me, who have had sex and it left them traumatised. ) But I very strongly believe that indeed, this is exactly what people should stop being taught. There is always a chance that someone will turn out to be asexual, perhaps even sex-averse - and therefore everyone should have access to knowledge that love without sex is possible and valid, that nobody "owes" another person sex, that "I don't want to" is always a "good enough reason" for not having sex.

[ALobster]

I'm a lurker on this forum, but wanted to speak up since this poll describes me pretty well. I'm somewhere on the line between "sex-favorable ace" and "grey-ace."
 

Actually, pretty much everything @EmeraldIcehas said pretty much also describes me. I don't feel like I'm "wired" for sex, it's unnatural, but I also don't hate it and I don't mind having sex to please my partner. While I have a libido, (partnered) sex doesn't fulfill that part of my life, but as an act to help someone else out it doesn't bother me too much. If I weren't in my current relationship I probably wouldn't have sex at all, but as is it's something I can get /some/ pleasure from, even if it doesn't fulfill any inner sexual desire. If that makes sense. 

[EmeraldIce]

5 hours ago, everywhere and nowhere said:

But I very strongly believe that indeed, this is exactly what people should stop being taught.

If you take into account the contexts in which I call sex innocent or something like that, I would hope that it's clear that I mean it exclusively from the perspective of a sex-neutral individual. I never meant it as a blanket statement encompassing everyone. As far as people being taught that they should have sex, in general I agree. In practice, though, there's a fine line between the two extremes that can be tricky to navigate. I grew up a prude due to the shows I liked to watch. My mom trying to normalize sex for me was partly in an attempt to correct that mindset. As a teen, I had this idea that good people couldn't possibly have sex, so if you had sex (exceptions possibly made for procreation but even that was hard for me to imagine), you couldn't possibly be a good person. At first she ignored it thinking I was an innocent kid who'd just learned about sex and who would surely grow out of it. But when I came to her in college expressing my disappointment that my roommate was sexually active with her boyfriend, she decided something needed to be done. I don't think she was wrong. Not being able to accept sex as normal is just as problematic as not being able to accept the absence of sex as a valid option. I blame my own anxiety for it turning into an obligation mindset.

[Ceebs]

How is desiring sex congruent with being asexual? That's literally the thing that makes me a sexual person as opposed to an asexual one. If it wasn't that factor that made me sexual, can you tell me what would be?

[RileyA]

8 hours ago, everywhere and nowhere said:

I don't want to question your feelings, I know that you felt hurt by my approach which emphasises protection from unwanted sex and doesn't take into account those who really don't mind sex despite not desiring it. (That said, remember that I am very genuinely sex-averse, although at least I have fortunately never had sex. Sex is for me not "an innocent activity", but something I could never endure, a horrible activity I intend to avoid for life. And I have seen asexuals who were not as lucky as me, who have had sex and it left them traumatised. ) But I very strongly believe that indeed, this is exactly what people should stop being taught. There is always a chance that someone will turn out to be asexual, perhaps even sex-averse - and therefore everyone should have access to knowledge that love without sex is possible and valid, that nobody "owes" another person sex, that "I don't want to" is always a "good enough reason" for not having sex.

 

I think what is often missing from your perspective on this is that the ace person often wants a particular individual, or the type of individual who is usually allosexual. Both because allosexual people outnumber ace people and because they want aspects of a relationship that they themselves believe they won't get from an ace person. 

 

So I really don't think it's a case of the ace person believing that a sexless romantic relationship with a fellow ace human is invalid as such, I think they're attracted to other aspects of allo relationships that they believe is absent with ace partners. I mentioned the other day that an ace guy on Feeld said he seeks sexual people because he finds the majority of ace men aren't very tactile and he enjoys touch. So he deals with sex if it means he has a partner who will prioritize affection.

 

 

[Sally]

3 hours ago, Ceebs said:

How is desiring sex congruent with being asexual? That's literally the thing that makes me a sexual person as opposed to an asexual one. If it wasn't that factor that made me sexual, can you tell me what would be?

If I wanted/desired sex -- and I don't mean wanted to please my partner so I had sex, I mean WANTED sex for sex -- I certainly wouldn't call myself an asexual.  Because I wouldn't BE an asexual.  Geez, this is getting kind of silly.  

[Ceebs]

4 minutes ago, Sally said:

Geez, this is getting kind of silly.  

As they say... preach, sister. 😂

[Ceebs]

I genuinely am very curious what would make me sexual if it wasn't the desire for sex. Like if someone who desires sex can be sexual or asexual, what criteria am I supposedly using to differentiate myself from an asexual person?

If I hear something about instantly wanting to bang hot strangers I pass on the street... 🙄

 

One time I got really tongue-tied and blushed a little around a very pretty girl who worked in a shop. That's the closest I can come to instantaneous attraction, I think. However, if she'd shown up on my doorstep the next day and said, 'Let's shag!' I would've said hell no. I didn't even think about having sex with her, she was just... very attractive. End of. That doesn't happen too often for me since I'm not a highly visually-driven person when it comes to attraction, but even for the people who do experience more of that than I do, that's not what makes them sexual. What makes all of us sexual is that at some point, based on our own criteria and preferences, we want to have sex with other people. 

[Skycaptain]

This is not a green post, but a polite request. Can we please try and avoid starting a definition debate, as personally, I think there's been enough or them, and another won't change anything 🙂

[RileyA]

The post title is at "aces" so it would make sense to me that demis etc are included. If they wanted to aim it at people who do not desire sex or experience sexual attraction, it would make sense to me to use "asexual" to refer to those people and ace to refer to everyone on the spectrum. 

 

Because indeed, from the time you start talking about independently desiring a sexual relationship, we at least move towards (if not within) an allosexual realm.

[Sally]

31 minutes ago, Ceebs said:

What makes all of us sexual is that at some point, based on our own criteria and preferences, we want to have sex with other people. 

That's the best definition of being sexual I've read.

[Ceebs]

5 minutes ago, Sally said:

That's the best definition of being sexual I've read.

Well thank you, haha. I'll take that. 😁

[ALobster]

5 hours ago, Ceebs said:

 

I genuinely am very curious what would make me sexual if it wasn't the desire for sex. Like if someone who desires sex can be sexual or asexual, what criteria am I supposedly using to differentiate myself from an asexual person?

 

From what I've read, for some sex-favorable aces they prefer partnered sex over solo stuff to satisfy their libido for... whatever reason.. I guess because it feels better? So that may be a reason why one can "desire" sex without attraction. 
 

For me, that doesn't really apply - sex really does nothing to satisfy my libido (even if it's kind of pleasurable in the moment), I don't want sex for the sex itself. 
 

I guess since this is kind of related, one reason why I think I might be more "grey" rather than "fully" ace is because I have on occasion experienced arousal in response to my partner. What I'm still fuzzy on is whether that arousal is indicative of some sort of "desire" for sex or not. Foreplay stuff can sometimes turn me on quite a bit, but once it transitions into "sex" for me I find it ultimately not that satisfying/hard to stay engaged with despite whatever physical pleasure I feel in the moment. I usually think, "eh, dealing with the arousal by myself probably would have been much better." But would the arousal before the sex still be considered attraction/desire? I have no idea. Heck, sometimes I linger in foreplay for a bit too long because I know that what comes after is unfulfilling. It's all kind of a mess for me.   
 

 

[RileyA]

17 hours ago, ALobster said:

Foreplay stuff can sometimes turn me on quite a bit, but once it transitions into "sex" for me I find it ultimately not that satisfying/hard to stay engaged with despite whatever physical pleasure I feel in the moment.

 

This might be because lots of people are terrible at sex. It's very common for cishet women to feel like this. 

[Ceebs]

4 minutes ago, RileyA said:

It's very common for cishet women to feel like this. 

Mm.

 

If you're talking about PiV sex, @ALobster, lots of women aren't particularly satisfied by it. Personally I have had orgasms from penetration, but it requires the right angle, rhythm, kind of just... everything falling into place perfectly somehow. Doesn't happen often. Oral, on the other hand... that'll do the trick haha (although actually, until my current partner, no one I'd ever had sex with had been particularly good at that either and I'd never had an orgasm from it). Anyway, I enjoy many other aspects of PiV and my partner is definitely not bad at sex, so I still really desire it and will initiate it even if it's probably not going to get me there. If you're not that enthusiastic about PiV for other reasons (for example, I just really love the intimacy of my partner being inside me and there's a huge emotional component, and it generally does still feel quite good to me even if it rarely results in orgasm), then I'm not surprised that you lose interest during that part of things.

[ALobster]

By "sex" I'm referring to both PIV and other forms of sex. 
 

Edit for clarification: I used to also think if was just an issue with me and PIV, or that I was just really picky with how I enjoyed stuff,  but so far everything has been the same. I actually get more overwhelmed by non-PIV sex since it's more focused on me. 

[merkitty]

Thought I'd give my own answers to these questions, because some of them weren't really options on the poll! I identify as on the ace spectrum but not with any specific label (though if you made me pick one I'd probably say I'm the closest to demisexual). I use a broad-ish definition for sex because I think that's a more inclusive and less confusing way to think about it, and where the line is drawn is often arbitrary.

1. I don't masturbate and never really have, I never had any interest and the few times I've tried it didn't really do anything for me, so yeah I would rather have sex. To me, it's a lot about emotional connection to my partner, and I don't really enjoy physical pleasure without that component.

2. I desire sex because it makes me feel close to my partner and I enjoy that, and also because I find the experience generally enjoyable.

3. I don't think sexual attraction and sexual desire are the same thing; you can be attracted to someone but not actually desire to have sex with them and you can desire to have sex even if you don't experience sexual attraction.

4. I like the romantic connection I feel during sex and it's the main reason I desire it.

5. I feel both physical and mental pleasure during sex.

6. I don't necessarily seek sex, but I sometimes try to facilitate it happening if I want it to happen.

7. I desire sex so I don't identify as asexual, but I also don't identify as allosexual. I prefer to think of myself as somewhere in the gray area in between, because sexuality is a spectrum. I don't like to define my sexuality more specifically than that so I don't.

8. I am in a romantic relationship with someone who also identifies somewhere on the ace spectrum. I wouldn't call it an allosexual relationship because neither of us are allosexual, but sex is a part of the relationship.

9. Like many others, I do not understand flirting, but flirting within the context of a relationship is fun.

10. Feeling sexy is weird to me and part of me hates it, but another part of me wants and likes it within a relationship.

[Tezzley]

Interesting poll to take, it made me think about my own Asexuality more. I saw someone answer the questions in more detail, so here's mine.

 

1. Masturbation is how I express my sexuality.I have a high libido, but don't like sex, and mostly feel uncomfortable doing it. I find sex as an idea enjoyable, but prefer not to be involved, so I might be a Aegosexual. There are some things I like to do with a partner, but they're very specific and involve masturbation, so even then I'm quite sex averse.

2. I used to say I quite enjoyed sex, even if it wasn't high on my list. Now, apart from a few specific things, I realized I'm quite sex-averse, and maybe even a bit repulsed (still working it out). I'd still consider sex with someone I trust if they want to, but I'm finding I'd rather not, and just stick to things I like doing on my own.

3. I'm not sure what this is exactly, but I've realized I've never been physically attracted to anyone, though I have an aesthetic preference for men.

4. At the moment I'm willing to be sexual with a partner, but I'm finding it's something I'm not as comfortable with, and may start looking for other asexuals to date,

5. Again, I use to think I got some mental and physical pleasure from sex, but I'm realizing how uncomfortable I felt doing it. I think I tricked myself into thinking I was getting something from it.

6. Don't seek sex, but I'm open to trying it again in the right circumstances where I feel comfortable, though right now I'd rather not.

7. I guess I'm sex favorable because I think sex can be good for some people, but I'm getting less sex-favorable than I used to be.

8. I don't know anymore. I've dated and had close relationships involving sex, but I'm starting to wonder if I did it because I wanted a strong platonic Relationship and did sex to get it. I might also be aromantic.

9. Don't like flirting, giving or receiving, it makes me feel uncomfortable. 

10. I don't really feel sexy, I don't really see my body that way. I had a flicker when I worked out and looked good, and sometimes in very specific sexual situations, but I'm not all that bothered, though I don't like it when I'm overweight.

 

Writing that made me realize I'm more sex-averse than I thought, maybe even a bit repulsed. I also didn't realize I might be aromantic, and just had sex to strengthen platonic relationships. I've identified as asexual for less than a week and I'm making so many discoveries about myself

 

 

 

[Indian geek]

Visually driven attraction seems to be given more importance while defining sexual attraction but what about those who are not as visual or may be visually impaired in some way? Does that make them asexual?

Yes one might argue smell and voice could be a factor. 

Some people may not feel interested in partnered sex with someone based on easily observable characters. 

[Philip027]

7 hours ago, Indian geek said:

Visually driven attraction seems to be given more importance while defining sexual attraction but what about those who are not as visual or may be visually impaired in some way? Does that make them asexual?

Yes one might argue smell and voice could be a factor. 

Some people may not feel interested in partnered sex with someone based on easily observable characters. 

Visuals are not the only way for attraction (sexual or otherwise) to develop; it's just very typically the first thing that makes us aware of another person in meatspace and therefore gets the most Mention Attention, in the same way the first thing that draws many people to a book is usually the cover.  But if you've ever read any books, you probably know that there's other things than just the cover that ultimately hook you.

 

As such, no, blind people are not effectively asexual or anything like that.