Gay asexuals - terminology debate

[parkerM]

how may I ask can one be a gay-asexual? gay would imply showing a preference toward. or like saying 'beef-eating vegetarian'

[Ziffler]

how may I ask can one be a gay-asexual? gay would imply showing a preference toward. or like saying 'beef-eating vegetarian'

Simply put, Asexuals are NOT sexually attracted to anyone, but many, if not most have emotional/spiritual and even romantic attractions to other people.

I think from what I have read here on AVEN, that many are looking for a platonic relationship with someone. A soulmate life partner. Someone to share their life with, without sex.

I think some are looking for better ways to express that attraction in asexual terms, rather than hetero/asexual or homo/asexual, because it does tend to be confusing using sexual terms, hetero and homo when clasifying an asexual.

Some one else more educated might be able to explain this better than me. I just happened to be the next person to see the post.

[ForestRangerFX4]

Thanks Ziff for the perfect explanation but to some people you can talk till your blue in the face and blisters on your fingers to try and explain what something is. Some people can be so shallow, of course everyone knows that "Gay" means to have sex 24 hrs a day with the same gender. Get real people open up your minds and your hearts. Not all of us like "sex", I just like hanging around guys without the "EGO" hangups and they are usually "Gay", I like fashion and football, who knew. It doesnt take a degree to express a persons desires and feelings. I thought I finally found a place I could be me without the word "SEX" being thrown in my face. I guess my search continues. Thanks Ziff again, your cool.

[parkerM]

Thanks Ziff for the perfect explanation but to some people you can talk till your blue in the face and blisters on your fingers to try and explain what something is. Some people can be so shallow, of course everyone knows that "Gay" means to have sex 24 hrs a day with the same gender. Get real people open up your minds and your hearts. Not all of us like "sex", I just like hanging around guys without the "EGO" hangups and they are usually "Gay", I like fashion and football, who knew. It doesnt take a degree to express a persons desires and feelings. I thought I finally found a place I could be me without the word "SEX" being thrown in my face. I guess my search continues. Thanks Ziff again, your cool.

Way to get offended there bro. I was simply asking a question.

we (I'd imagine) all know what being asexual means. Now if you had sex "I'm asexual but I'd prefer the company of men" then I'd totally understand. But to say you're gay-asexual is in fact a contradiction in terms. Does that make sense to you? I'm asexual, I like both the company of men and women, but not in an even remotely sexual way. I'm not straight-asexual, I'm not bi-asexual, I'm not gay-sexual. I am simply Asexual. Maybe when you understand the term a little better you'll more easily be able to express yourself in the future.

[Shockwave]

But to say you're gay-asexual is in fact a contradiction in terms.

It's a commonly used term here. Asexuals who are romantically inclined towards the same sex often call themselves gay-asexuals. Others also use the terms straight-asexual or bi-asexual to refer to their romantic inclinations.

[parkerM]

I honestly don't understand that.

[Shockwave]

It's a lot shorter and easier to say than "homoromantic asexual".

BTW, welcome to the forum, douglasml1974.

[Brodertun]

I honestly don't understand that.

Think of it this way Parker - you like both men and women, even though you are asexaual. That makes you bi-asexual because you have bi-romantic attraction. Or if you are saying that you like them as friends, but have no further attraction than that, you would be an aromantic asexual

I only like men, and there is no way I'd date a woman. I do hope to get married to an asexy man one day. That makes me hetero-asexual.

If my situation were reveresed, I too, would also be gay asexual.

Because there is nothing in the terms, gay, hetero, or bi, that implay anything about sexual attraction. In fact if homo, hetero, and bi did imply sexual attraction, than there would be no need for anyone to ever place the word sexual on the end of them

[parkerM]

no I understand the terminology, but in practice it makes no sense to me. To me it's like saying (and please forgive the star trek reference here) but it's like saying "that guys' one funny vulcan" Vulcans by description aren't funny beings, nor are they known for having a sense of humor in any way shape or form.

(please don't ever let me use a star trek reference on the boards again.) :P

Additional: thank you trip. That answer makes much sense to me

[lloyd_baker]

Not really identifying or accepting my asexual tendency, I feared I was homosexual.

Appalled but curious, over my 60 years, I experimented only twice with the much feared tendency (under the influence of alcohol), submitting as the passive partner in oral sex with a much more dominant, aggressive, masculine male. I didn't experience any sexual response, but must admit I was impressed, even thrilled to experience the superior masculinity to which I had no personal experience but have always envied.

As a result, I can't help but wonder if SOMETIMES homosexuality is a similar reaction to to an asexual tendency.

[lloyd_baker]

(please don't ever let me use a star trek reference on the boards again.)

But the BORG is such a good analogy for Islamic Extremism!

[FISH']

Parker has a point. Gay means homosexual, meaning that you are inclined to have sex with people your own gender (one of the reasons why I don't use the word 'gay' when talking about asexuality).

[Brodertun]

Parker has a point. Gay means homosexual, meaning that you are inclined to have sex with people your own gender (one of the reasons why I don't use the word 'gay' when talking about asexuality).

and asexual means reproducing without the union of gametes or individuals. Terminology is not set in stone and it evolves to fit the times.

It wasn't that long ago that gay meant nothing more than being happy, and no heterosexuals would think twice about describing the gay event they attended.

[Mark from the OCD board]

I am learning so much from the people on this board, and I just wanted to say thank you.

As I mentioned in my thread in "For Sexual Partners, Friends & Allies," I have OCD (obsessive-compulsive disorder) that is under control, and I often talk to and help people whose OCD is spinning out of control. Consequently, I have learned to be a good, supportive listener. Of course, I am always happy to help with OCD issues. In addition, if anyone here with no OCD ever wants to talk to an asexual-friendly gay sexual about asexual identity, I promise to listen and be supportive. It does not matter to me how you identify yourself, what your gender is, or whether or not/to whom you have romantic or sexual attractions. We're all human.

Except for the Vulcans in this thread, of course... (Oh please, please, please don't stop the Star Trek references...)

Incidentally, I have learned to speak Italian well, and I keep up with it by being the only American on an Italian Star Trek board. Most Italians in Italy see the Borg as a symbol of globalization and American domination, not as Islamic Extremism. I can, however, see the analogy with extremism just as easily as I can see the other analogy.

So what do Italian Vulcans say? When the show is dubbed, "Live Long and Prosper" translates as Lunga vita e prosperità (literally "long life and prosperity").

Setting a heading away from the Italian Embassy on Vulcan at warp factor two...

The analysis in this thread of what terms mean is very interesting. In the gay community, we often use queer as an all-encompassing term for anyone who is not in the sexual mainstream for any reason. Some people object to that term, though. Similarly, some lesbians object to being called "gay women" since they consider themselves lesbians and thus not "gay." Other lesbians say "gay women" with pride.

As far as I am concerned, the term gay can most definitely include asexuals--but only those asexuals who choose to identify themselves that way for whatever reason. It's perfecty fine if others choose not to for whatever reason.

I have a good gay friend who is celibate by choice. There are also gays who cannot have sex because of medical conditions or medication, and gays who die virgins. All of those people are as gay as I am, for I believe that being gay is who you are, not who you sleep with.

As for Trip's last post... Yes, the word has changed meaning. Think about the song Maria sings in West Side Story: "I feel pretty and witty and GAY..."

[bug]

As has been said in this thread, everyone is welcome here, since we are mostly open-minded enough to learn from everyone else.

Before I knew the word asexual, I always called myself bi-emotional.

I like to identify myself with the word emotional because I am an extremely feeling sort of person. I just don't like the word asexual. There is something cold and biological about it. I love people for themselves, thus my emotions are the forefront of my life, not someone's gender or action with their "bits".

[epiphanystars]

As has been said in this thread, everyone is welcome here, since we are mostly open-minded enough to learn from everyone else.

Before I knew the word asexual, I always called myself bi-emotional.

I like to identify myself with the word emotional because I am an extremely feeling sort of person. I just don't like the word asexual. There is something cold and biological about it. I love people for themselves, thus my emotions are the forefront of my life, not someone's gender or action with their "bits".

That is a really cool idea for terminology. I like it 'cause I'm not sexually attrackted to ppl but I like to engage on a personal emotional level.

[Pobblebonk]

Parker has a point. Gay means homosexual, meaning that you are inclined to have sex with people your own gender (one of the reasons why I don't use the word 'gay' when talking about asexuality).

But the etymology of "homosexual" implies nothing at all to do with sexual activity - it just means "same sex"; "sexual" in the context of "homosexual" simply indicates the object of attraction, not the nature of that attraction. "Inclined to have sex with people your own gender" would strictly be "homosexualsexual".

Phil

[Amcan]

Moved form welcome.

Split thread.

Amcan admin.

[oneofthesun]

But the etymology of "homosexual" implies nothing at all to do with sexual activity - it just means "same sex"; "sexual" in the context of "homosexual" simply indicates the object of attraction, not the nature of that attraction. "Inclined to have sex with people your own gender" would strictly be "homosexualsexual".

Phil

This is like the debate some churches are having over whether a celibate gay person is still a sinner.

[mymonkeyfish]

But the etymology of "homosexual" implies nothing at all to do with sexual activity - it just means "same sex"; "sexual" in the context of "homosexual" simply indicates the object of attraction, not the nature of that attraction. "Inclined to have sex with people your own gender" would strictly be "homosexualsexual".

I think this is a great conversation. The biggest problem in discussing queer issues, is all in the definitions. Its so hard to have a conversation with people about anything if the definitions of the words you're using are so fuzzy. Sexual Orientations are not as simple as they seem. Like pointed out above, "homosexual" indicates the attraction only. From the sexual culture that we live in (most cultures at least, I'm in the States and we are obsessed with sex) we assume sexual activity to accompany the sexual attraction. I think that is where one mistake is made. Many, not all, asexual people still have an attraction to other people, its just not one that develops around sex (the noun). Which I should point out does not mean that all homo-, hetero-, or bisexual people develop their preference around sex (the noun).

Not all people fit into the catagories that we created. Some people are neither homo-, hetero-, bi-, or asexual. I am one of those people.

Sexual Orientation is such a difficult concept to apply to human life. The definitions of sexual orientations are founded on the basic principal that there are two sexes, and we know that there are more then just two sexes. In a multisexed culture, our current system of sexual orientations doesnt work. One thing that is causing people trouble I think is that with all these new movements toward equality, we are discovering that people are so much more diverse then we ever thought. We are not just woman or man, female or male, straight or gay, black or white. There is so much more and with every new catagory comes the same problem. Not everyone fits. I can go into this a lot further, but I'll spare you all my psycho-babble.

[Rainbow Amoeba]

Before I knew the word asexual, I always called myself bi-emotional.

I like to identify myself with the word emotional because I am an extremely feeling sort of person. I just don't like the word asexual. There is something cold and biological about it. I love people for themselves, thus my emotions are the forefront of my life, not someone's gender or action with their "bits".

Thank you, thank you, thank you! I have been looking for a more "positive" word than "asexual" to define myself. Just as you said, there is something cold about it. I don't want to define myself in relation to sexuality. And I don't like defining myself negatively in relation to something, because it kinds of suggests that this is something I should have but don't have, and even though it's probably biologically true, this is not how I feel about it.

Like you, I love people for themselves, and I don't care what their gender is. I also have very strong emotions and feelings for some people. I think "bi-emotional" describes me very well, especially as I understand it to replace also "bi-romantic" which does not seem very appropriate for me because, although I can have very strong feelings for people, these feelings are not romantic.

Bi-emotional. Why didn't I think of that?

Do you allow me to use this terminology? I'll credit you with it if you like. :D

Sorry for getting off-topic :?

[ghosts]

How about pan-emotional? (that would be all genders)

Also, I heard a new word in class- humansexual. I don't know if I'm crazy about it, but it's a pretty interesting word. :)

[Placebo]

How about pan-emotional? (that would be all genders)

Also, I heard a new word in class- humansexual. I don't know if I'm crazy about it, but it's a pretty interesting word. :)

Ok, does that mean attracted to humans as opposed to, say, animals or non-human fetishes? Or attracted to all flavors of human, sort of like pansexual? Or something else entirely?

[Rabger]

But to say you're gay-asexual is in fact a contradiction in terms.

I think most here do and have explained well enough. But I thought I'd add just a little. You are basing your opinion on the rather narrow view point of the majority. The people that think EVERYONE is sexual, the people that think heterosexuality is the natural biological majority, the people that think male=man, female=woman, end of story, the people that think sexual and romantic are the same thing. And that is incredibly lacking and closed minded. I understand how people can naively buy that, since its what the majority things and its easier to go along, but to limit things to that is just crazy.

I am gay. I am also asexual. No, this is not a contradiction of terms and I understand the terms just perfectly. I am NOT homosexual. That specifically implies a SEXUAL attraction to someone of the same sex. Gay does not imply that specific sexual attraction. It is more general, meaning attracted to the same sex. It does not imply what type of attraction that is. I am homoromantic. I am also asexual. Its not a far stretch to combine those terms and call myself homoasexual. It is also not a far stretch to call myself gay asexual, since asexul specifices sexual attraction, being there is none, and gay implies a type of attraction toward the same sex. If asexual already clarifies that there is no sexual attraction, that only leaves romantic attraction for the gay to mean.

Its not complicated, it just requires thinking outside the narrow little boxes society tries to get us to swallow.

[Rainbow Amoeba]

How about pan-emotional? (that would be all genders)

Even better I guess... I always have trouble remembering to think of gender outside the binary division, although I don't agree with the binary division in the first place. So now I'll have to credit both bug and ghosts for it :)

[ghosts]

Ok, does that mean attracted to humans as opposed to, say, animals or non-human fetishes? Or attracted to all flavors of human, sort of like pansexual? Or something else entirely?

I'm pretty sure it's like pansexual- basically all flavors of human. I could be wrong though...

Even better I guess... I always have trouble remembering to think of gender outside the binary division, although I don't agree with the binary division in the first place. So now I'll have to credit both bug and ghosts for it

Cool, glad you like it. :)

[oneofthesun]

You are basing your opinion on the rather narrow view point of the majority. The people that think EVERYONE is sexual,

*nods* I asked a fundie once what he thought of a gay person who was a lifelong virgin. He couldn't answer me because he had honestly never thought of it.

[Zedekai]

I don't know how many times I've seen a similar thread to this or another tread that has lead to a discusion like this. I understand your confusion about the technical usage of the words Gay-Asexual. I'n my mind it goes beyond the words, we use words to discribe things feelings ect. if it's not completely correct most of the time we still get the idea of wot someone is trying to express.

As a last resort we all have to keep in mind that we as a species are not fully capable to understand everything. There are many times where i come arcoss something i don't understand, i ask about it, try to find out more and if still I don't come to any conclusions that help me understand I accept that.

I applaud you for asking questions and trying to make sense of things.

[Whee]

I'm gay asexual, and I'm like that because I find men more attractive than women. As easy as that. :D

[HighMach]

Like you, I love people for themselves, and I don't care what their gender is. I also have very strong emotions and feelings for some people. I think "bi-emotional" describes me very well, especially as I understand it to replace also "bi-romantic" which does not seem very appropriate for me because, although I can have very strong feelings for people, these feelings are not romantic.

Bi-emotional. Why didn't I think of that?

This is a really interesting thread but I guess I still wonder how these classifications apply. Especially with the bi-emotional term because I have a consistent level of emotional feelings for anyone regardless of gender. Now to a sexual person it's considered friendship across the board but here we have to define it in application to our sexuality? :( It's so confusing :shock:

But to the first poster, I say that if you have romantic attraction towards men or any romantic attraction at all, then kudos to you sir ... you lucky little... sorry envy coming out... You know yourself best so you express yourself with whatever term you want to communicate who you are.

8)