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:( I HATE gynos..


Androgyny

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To all those who would forgo these checkups: If you really would rather die of cancer than endure a short and uncomfortable procedure, then fine. Go ahead and don't take the test. Just make sure you never have sex and are never raped.

Sorry if this sounded at all snarky. It's just I honestly don't get the "omg it's my SPECIAL PLACE - no way am I letting anyone touch it, even if it might save my life" mentality.

Again, sorry. I don't want to heat things up any more than they are (should this be moved to Hot Box?).

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reptilelover
To all those who would forgo these checkups: If you really would rather die of cancer than endure a short and uncomfortable procedure, then fine. Go ahead and don't take the test. Just make sure you never have sex and are never raped.

Sorry if this sounded at all snarky. It's just I honestly don't get the "omg it's my SPECIAL PLACE - no way am I letting anyone touch it, even if it might save my life" mentality.

Again, sorry. I don't want to heat things up any more than they are (should this be moved to Hot Box?).

To all those who advocate going to these checkups: if you really like so much to live in constant fear and endure short and uncomfortable procedures because of it, then fine. Go ahead and take the test. Just make sure you have no illusions it makes you impervious to the complications you have such fear of.

Sorry if this sounded at all snarky. It's just I honestly don't get people who think "omg it's my SPECIAL PLACE - no way am I letting anyone touch it, even if it might save my life" is the only possible reason for someone refusing to go to the doctor.

Again, sorry. I don't want to heat things up any more than they are (should this be moved to Hot Box?).

:twisted: :twisted: :twisted:

Also I have to say that even on AVEN one, obviously, gets the attitude it is impossible for someone to be happily celibate (and that as a celibate person you do not have to do some “doctor things” non-celibate is recommended to have). Also none of the people who “would forgo these checkups” ever said anything of rape victims not going on gyno checks. In fact regular gyno checks are more then recommended for those unfortunate people.

Also, in the unfortunate event ever happens and I do get raped I will go to the gyno. But using “rape” as an argument for discussion is, in my opinion, quite tasteless (especially considering nobody was giving his/her opinion to a “rape” victim).

Considering you did not respond to any of the points I (end others) made in our posts, started putting words in mouth of “all those who would forgo these checkups”, and implicating a situation happening that has, more or less, a same chance of happening whether one goes to the doctor or not, I’d have to say you are deliberately out to make this in a fight. I am making this statement just that in the unfortunate event this does get migrated in “hot box” people have no doubt who was responsible for that. Also, I wouldn’t be too terribly surprised if you deliberately took the first part of this post the wrong way.

Not to mention that saying "omg it's my SPECIAL PLACE - no way am I letting anyone touch it, even if it might save my life" to someone who views the checkup in question as a rape, is less then tasteful (to put it mildly). And by the way, it is a rape if you put something in the “personal regions” of a person who does not want such an action (even if that something is a “health” instrument). And there are other ways of pressuring a person into doing something other then brute force (your post being the prime example of this). :evil:

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I also don't know how I'll get tested for endemetriosis as transabdominal pelvic ultrasounds usually aren't sufficient to detect that. Well, the doctors better find some other way, 'cause there is no way in hell...

Then there's no way in hell they'll find a better way. You're making it sound like it's them who loses out here. The responsibility is on you, not them. You're the grown up, it's your body. It's of no consequence to them if you do or don't get tested. Think about it.

Really, these idiots, quacks, are trampling on the rights of asexuals. Ever been told by any of this unscientific nincompoops that you should get laid? I swear, we just might have to file a classaction lawsuit or something so that our rights to be asexual are recognized 'cause when they are not, which is most of the time, it's not funny!!! :evil: :!:

That's way too dramatic. They're not 'trampling on rights' and certainly not singling out asexuals. (As a matter of fact, that's a very arrogant thing to do, figure we're entitled to different things. Remove the word 'sexual' or 'asexual' from the concept and you'll see for yourself it's not a matter of sexuality. Or, don't remove it and resign yourself to ridicule and eye-rolling, even from within the asexual community.) There are plenty of sexual people who don't want to be tested/examined either, has nothing to do with their sexual attraction. You reckon their 'rights' aren't being trampled on as badly as ours? And it's totally different from being told to get laid. THAT is a social thing, the exam is part of their job. The deal with the lawsuit is going to earn us all (because 'we' WILL be all hauled into the same barrel) a one way ticket to the laughing stocks. Please don't 'crusade' us there - 'we' deserve way more dignity than that or, at least I figure I do, I'm sure you do too.

As far as 'rights' are concerned, it's THEIR right to refuse the solution if they can't examine. Would you want to be in a bodycast because you sprained your arm? They need to check. It's more a matter of RESPONSIBILITY and it's YOUR responsibility to find quack who'll do it without an exam. If they did a prescription/treatment and it turned out that a person didn't need or couldn't have it - it IS consequential to THEM.

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We don't need to constantly bludgeon one another over the heads with this... Honestly, this is degenerating into angry restating of points previously made faster than ice cream melts in summer.

If you don't want the exam, that is your choice.

If you do want the exam, that is your choice.

It's a pretty simple thing, and let's keep in mind that the occurence of cervical cancer is around 00.25-00.10%. So those who are not having the exams are making a fairly good gamble, all things considered [odds probably drop if you're celibate too], those who are having them are making certain. It's not something to get so heated up about; do you get offended by people who don't go to the dentist regularly? Because the odds of dental complications are much higher than the chances of getting cervical cancer*. Yelling at someone for their decisions is hardly appropriate, and yes people are getting a bit hysterical one way or another, but that doesn't mean escalating things is in any way an improvement.

*trying to stay unbiased here, but it's a point I want to make

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I, for one, am a little surprised at how many people put so much faith in the opinions of medical doctors, whose field appears to be one the most fallible of modern sciences. :?

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I, for one, am a little surprised at how many people put so much faith in the opinions of medical doctors, whose field appears to be one the most fallible of modern sciences. :?

Well, am I supposed to put faith in my opinion, with my field appearing to be eating pizza and watching DVDs? :? :)

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What's wrong with educating yourself about issues you deem important? It's not that hard, in my opinion, to sort the facts from opinions or myths.

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We don't need to constantly bludgeon one another over the heads with this... Honestly, this is degenerating into angry restating of points previously made faster than ice cream melts in summer.

If you don't want the exam, that is your choice.

If you do want the exam, that is your choice.

It's a pretty simple thing, and let's keep in mind that the occurence of cervical cancer is around 00.25-00.10%. So those who are not having the exams are making a fairly good gamble, all things considered [odds probably drop if you're celibate too], those who are having them are making certain. It's not something to get so heated up about; do you get offended by people who don't go to the dentist regularly? Because the odds of dental complications are much higher than the chances of getting cervical cancer*. Yelling at someone for their decisions is hardly appropriate, and yes people are getting a bit hysterical one way or another, but that doesn't mean escalating things is in any way an improvement.

*trying to stay unbiased here, but it's a point I want to make

*Applauds Jaybird*

I totally agree.

I understand that a lot of people here are simply concerned about the health of their fellow AVENites, but it is, in the end, their choice.

And it isn't as simple a matter of "exam or death". As Jaybird has pointed out, it's not a guarentee that you'll get cervical cancer or whatever without a test.

Sure there's a bit of a gamble, but every time you walk outside, every time you get in a car, every time you do anything it's a gamble.

I know that when I hop in my car I may have an accident and die, but I am willing to risk it because not only do I enjoy driving, but I often need to go places too.

Sure, if I knew for a fact that this one time that I go for a drive I will die, I will refrain from it. But the fact is that I don't know, but I have a fairly good idea from my track record so far that I will make it back alive.

Same with exams. If you've decided that the displeasure outweighs the risk, then nobody can tell you otherwise.

Anyway, I'm not a female, so take what I say with a grain of salt. I don't know what it's like to have a pap smear, nor do I know what it's like to have cervical cancer.

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What about drugs? Like... lots of them? I don't want to get the exam and have already evaded it once, but I've read that the physical discomfort is minimal. So if it's just a mental issue, maybe a healthy dosage of tylenol with codine would make it bearable. I'm pretty mello, so being a little giddy would probably fly under the radar (that's usually all codine does to me).

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What about drugs? Like... lots of them? I don't want to get the exam and have already evaded it once, but I've read that the physical discomfort is minimal. So if it's just a mental issue, maybe a healthy dosage of tylenol with codine would make it bearable. I'm pretty mello, so being a little giddy would probably fly under the radar (that's usually all codine does to me).

Ah, codine knocks me out completely at the correct dosage and makes me extremely hyper at too-small doses. Made childhood illness pretty interesting...

Personally, I'm planning to just bite the bullet and do it, and then talk to whoever my doctor at that point is about how often I'd need to do it if I remained sexually inactive [i'm guessing it's a little less often than usual, since it's an STD they're testing for, but that the average patient is not celibate].

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Personally, I'm planning to just bite the bullet and do it, and then talk to whoever my doctor at that point is about how often I'd need to do it if I remained sexually inactive [i'm guessing it's a little less often than usual, since it's an STD they're testing for, but that the average patient is not celibate].

Yeah, last time I went I heard that unless you're in a high-risk category (i.e. previous abnormal pap smears, birth control usage etc) they only recommend coming in every 3 years or so anyway. So I'm sure that if you have no sexual activity and no need for BC, you'd only need to come in very rarely.

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I KNOW EXACTLY HOW YOU FEEL. I had my first exam at 15 and cried and made a fuss at the doctors and they all wondered why... treated me like a mental patient... well EXCUSE me for being protective of my private space.. because that's just what it is... MY space... I'm on your side... I'm on the pill to help my period too but I go to an endocrinologist not a gynocologist... might I recommend the same for you?

Thanks for the suggestion..I could go look that up but..can I ask you what an edncrinologist does? And are they the ones that prescribe the pill for you?

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I can't stand going to the gyno. I know they're trying to help, and look out for the health of their patients... but in my head they're not called gynos, they're called "Pervert Doctors".

Anyway, I only got checked briefly once, at the hospital (and I couldn't stop crying through the exam). But at the actual gyno, I wasn't checked. I've been there twice. The first time, I almost started crying and he told me it wasn't a good idea due to my "emotional state". The second time I went was today. This time he told me flat-out that it wasn't a good idea for me to be checked, and therefore he wouldn't. He just wanted me to see a psychologist for past sexual abuse issues. I'm kind of glad I wasn't checked, but I also want to know if there's something wrong with me. Anyway, he told me my results of an ultrasound I had done a few months ago. He said I have cyst... as soon as he said that, I wanted to freak out. But I just sat there thinking "Oh my God, I don't want to be cut up". But then he told me it wasn't a big deal, that many women get cysts, and almost all of them don't amount to anything.

Aaand now I have 3 fricking appointments coming up. One with a psychologist, one for another ultrasound, and one again with the gyno. And people wonder why I hate going to the doctor's.

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I can't stand going to the gyno. I know they're trying to help, and look out for the health of their patients... but in my head they're not called gynos, they're called "Pervert Doctors".

i just totally do NOT get this mentality

ok, so here on aven, we (asexuals.. and no, not all of us) are always bitchin' and moanin' about sexuals putting sex into everything and everyone - a sexual nature is only natural, there's something wrong with you if you don't have one, if you brush your teeth you must be looking to get with someone, have sex to cure a headache etc

and yet.. isn't that exactly what is going on in this thread re: gynos must be sexual pervs for wanting to be a gyno or ob/gyn?

yeah, it sure as heck is. the bottom line is a doctor is a doctor is a doctor - maybe that doctor who chose to become an ob/gyn or some specialty therein has personal reason such as a mother or sister or personal connection to the miracle of birth or the horrors of STDs or whatever.

i mean, if you had to go to a podiatrist, would you AUTOMATICALLY assume that they must be some sort of foot fetishist?

look, if WE can see our reproductive organs as something other than inherently sexual, WE need to at least try and imagine that OTHERS can also seem these organs as something other than sexual.

poor doctors, never meant to hurt no one, getting called pervies *kicks toe in the dirt*

and anyway, i go back to what i said to androgyny before - honey, if you want the doctor to prescribe you medication, they are most likely going to want to be able to exam you or do tests on you to make sure it's SAFE for you to be on the pills and that it continues to be safe.

my regular doctor won't even prescribe me medication unless i go in for an office visit and let her poke and prod (albeit usually my ears or eyes or back or whatever she's sadistically inclined to that day :wink: )

whew, ok.. annie out

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^I call them pervert doctors because they look at vaginas half the day. I'm not saying they have a fetish with it. I just don't understand why they'd want to be looking at THAT... though I never considered it from your birth/HIV point.

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I'm quite protective of my 'private space' as others are putting it, and therefore I've put off going to an ob/gyn. I'm only 18, which is the time when it's recommended to get regular examinations (unless you're sexually active before that age, but I wasn't/am not).

I'll probably wait until I'm in my mid-twenties before going for an exam unless I need birth control pills for my period, but let me say that is not a wise choice on my part, and I do not suggest others abstaining from seeing an ob/gyn. At any rate, ob/gyns do NOT have a perverted reason for their choice of medical field, and this is coming from someone who is hesitant to go see one.

It's pretty important health-wise to get checked out, even if you aren't sexually active and/or never have been. It's rather like getting shots. I'm afraid of needles, I hate them, and it's rather uncomfortable to get shots. But would I rather die from some preventable disease, or go through a bit of anxiety and discomfort once every couple of years to ensure that I'll be my healthiest?

At any rate... that's how I see it.

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I can't stand going to the gyno. I know they're trying to help, and look out for the health of their patients... but in my head they're not called gynos, they're called "Pervert Doctors".

i just totally do NOT get this mentality

ok, so here on aven, we (asexuals.. and no, not all of us) are always bitchin' and moanin' about sexuals putting sex into everything and everyone - a sexual nature is only natural, there's something wrong with you if you don't have one, if you brush your teeth you must be looking to get with someone, have sex to cure a headache etc

and yet.. isn't that exactly what is going on in this thread re: gynos must be sexual pervs for wanting to be a gyno or ob/gyn?

Oi..I DONT by any means believe that gynos are PERVS. I'm sure everyone once and a while you'll stumble upon the guy who decided he wanted to be a gyno to check out some pussy, but they are doctors, and the lot of them take what they do as technical, no sexual. I was only saying that the ones I come in contact with lack sympathy and are pretty rude to me. THe last one I went to refused to even write me a note to give my professors (regarding my cramps that make me sick) excusing me from class on days I'd have to miss from them. I dont need an exam to have a written note now, do I? But speaking of mentalities, I can tell you right now that clearly my mentality of going to a gyno is completely different than yours. I understand the majority of the world agrees its uncomfortable and would rather avoid it. I know most people have their dislike of gynos. But my disgust of anything going up my vagina is to an undescribable extreme.

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I know most people have their dislike of gynos. But my disgust of anything going up my vagina is to an undescribable extreme.

I agree. I'm 26, and for the past couple years I've been telling myself that I need to see a gyn. I've come close to making the appointment, but in the end always chicken out.

I've never slept with anyone, and I figure that since I have a fairly rare connective tissue disorder, the chances I have any other unrelated disorder has to be slim. Odd reasoning, I know, but there you go.

In my life I've used maybe 5 tampons. I have to prep myself before using every single one, at times up to an hour (including a hot shower to try to relax myself). Then, half the time, I can't get the darn thing to go in right. Usually I manage to get it in, but I've had to just throw in the towel before.

The thought of going to a GYN is terrifying, as is the thought of actually sleeping with a guy, especially when he says he's "bigger than average." Yikes!

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androgyny - that wasn't really aimed at your post, sorry if i was unclear - someone else had referred to them as pervs..

and no, you and i do not share the same mindset, but i support you in your not wanting to go - i have things that i WILL NOT do no matter what people say or what facts are given to assuage me, etc

all i'm saying, to you in particular, is that i don't find it odd that you can't get a script for the BC without an exam.

like i said earlier in the thread (we may have gotten off topic lol) was that you might want to shop around for another gyno or clinic that might be able to a) write you the script based on something else like say blood work, and B) would be willing to write you a note, for goodness sakes

and by ALL MEANS, find a doctor with sympathy, empathy and a good bedside manner! it makes a world for difference, for me anyway!

if i can't at least feel comfortable with the person doing the uncomfortable thing, then i'm not sure i could go thru WITH the uncomfortable thing :shock:

at any rate, good luck to you!

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In regards to the 'pervy doctors' comment - doctors pick their specific field for a number of reasons. This includes money made, emotional attachment to the field, convenience of hours, personality type [people who love adrenaline go into high-stress emergency type situations, surgeons tend to be confident and aggressive, pediatricians like kids, etc.], and whether or not the field 'clicks' with them.

I don't personally know any gynecologists, but I'm sure that the majority of them have legitimate reasons for entering their field, and it's not because they wanted to look at genitalia all day. I'm also pretty sure that even the most sexual person wouldn't be able to stick with that, especially considering that checkups aside a gyno deals mainly with illness and injury. I doubt that monitoring people with STDs is really a turn-on for anyone. In fact, I've heard it mentioned amongst more than one sexual person that being a gynecologist must completely kill one's sex drive...

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AndrogynousMind

I had to go for some odd reason when I was 19 or so. I was terrified, the FEMALE doctor got a female nurse to nearly hold me down as I was becoming super panicked. I couldn't relax my legs were tense... and she just forcefully did it anyway, despite having me lay there crying while some burly ass huge nurse held me down (with a look of concerned sympathy no less... ). Anyway, apparently the 'plastic' edge on that invading duck thing... cut me deeply inside because of my fighting and I ended up bleeding (She said id 'spot for the day'. I ended up BLEEDING... FOR THE BETTER PART OF A WEEK. That fucking bitch. ...ehm...

...So... I feel ya.

I turned out to be 'fine'. Whoodeefuckindoo.

I haven't gone back to one since. 5 years later.

BTW if any of you live in NYC or Queens, that horrid woman's name was Anna Romeo. STAY AWAY.

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Hi Cijay,

I've never had sex and don't plan to. So the odds of me getting Cervical cancer are very low.

As for the doctor-idiot who said that I "should either get married or have relationships with a man," that son-of-a-bitch ignored the fact that my thyroid was acting up as I had been telling him (he didn't even do a blood test) and blamed everything on anxiety. I almost ended up going into cardiac arrest because of his misogyny and igorance. (In the olden days and, unfortunately even nowadays, women who presented with any sort of health symptoms/problems were deemed to have "hysteria." The "solution" involved a certain male anatomy. For those who don't know, the term "hysteria" comes from the word for "uterus.") I finally found a sensible doctor who didn't dismiss me and who ordered blood tests and later, gave me a beta-blocker. If he didn't, I would've had a heart attack.

As far as the testing for endemetriosis goes, since I've never had sex, they can't do the transvaginal ultrasound so I am not sure how they'll do it if they decide to do it. I am not about to be poked and prodded just because the medical health "care" industry is so limited, even in this day and age, esp. when it comes to women's medicine and health.

As for other cancer testing, I've had breast ultrasounds and even biopsies. So it's not like I am not willing to get tested. What I am not willing to do is endure prodding and poking, esp. when I have an aversion to the whole thing. Plus, I don't think any doctor in his/her right mind would attempt to do a transvaginal examination/insertion when the patient has never been sexually active. At least the last technician didn't.

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So far the Gynes and Gyne Nurse Practicioners I have seen have respected my wish not to be examined. Once, the nurse and the Nurse Practitioner did give me some trouble. The latter said that she was going to write down "AMA--Against Medical Advice" if I didn't do the PAP. I was OK with that since the DOCTOR (gyne) I had seen previously in the same facility didn't do the PAP Smear when I told her that I'd never been sexually active and that I didn't want to have it done. I was 22 at the time. The NP had also acted very rude to me even before we had come to the point of the PAP, so even if I had wanted the PAP done, I wouldn't have felt comfortable with her doing it.

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I still stand by my perv doctor comment. I'm not saying all gynos are pervs, no. But their field of work disgusts me and I'm not apologizing for what I said. And I also have my reason for calling them perverts. Reasons for which are not anyones business, so just know that I don't blindly call them perverts, I have my reasons.

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You have generated much conversation with this very interesting topic. I hope you are not overwhelmed by it all. I understand that you just wanted to vent about the whole idea of going to the gyno. At this point you don't want to feel forced to be pro or con...you just need to feel understood. The time will come when you will come to your own decision. In the meantime, there is nothing abnormal about being afraid. I have had the exams done (every 3 years) because I cannot stand the yearly visits...and each time I tremble and cry and I have to have the nurse hold my hand. I do feel violated and am usually upset mentally and physically for the rest of the day afterwards. One good advice you received is that you have to find a doctor that understands. Some of them can be very unsympathetic and condescending when you react negatively to the exam. On my first exam I had the doctor sigh in exasperation and walk out of the room because I would not relax enough for him to examine me. I did not wait for that "freak" (as I called him) to come back into the room. I got up, put on my clothes and walked out too. I finally found a doctor who is kind, understanding and always request that the nurse holds my hand. No matter how busy he is, he takes the time to talk to me before and afterwards and make me comfortable. It feels good to know that he sees a scared person and not just an object with a vajaygay. It still does not take away the discomfort but it makes it easier to deal with. Bare in mind also that not all female gynos understand your reluctance. It is not the gender, it is the person. If you do make the decision to go, do not be afraid to explain to the doctor exactly how you feel before you undress. If he/she reacts negatively, you have the right to refuse to be examined.

Also, please consider that everyday Doctors come up with new causes of cervical cancer. Whether a woman is sexually active or not, it is up to her to make sure she is healthy "down there". No matter how healthy we eat, how much we excercise and take care of our bodies, we are still vulnerable to any form of cancer. It is just a part of our existence. Abstinence may not be enough to protect you. Some things just cannot be explained. The decision is yours and understand that your fear is not unwarranted. Rant all you want. Only other asexuals can understand the fear of penetration, especially if it is by a cold, metal object being held by a stranger.

Good luck! And thank you for introducing this interesting topic!

Debbie

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epiphanystars

Androgeny I do have some idea where you are coming from I have avoided all thought of pap smears, and the thought of someone poking and poding my nether regions makes me queazy. The fact that the gyno is usually male just compounds this problem, I too would probbaly outright refuse as well. Remeber only youy have the ultimate say over your body. However, you should also take responsability for the consequences. you do run a greaterr risk of getting and dieing from cncer. I feel very lucky that I have not yet felt the need to take BC as my periods are not bad, and don't give me cramps. I know that this is happening to my mom and I can only say I feel sry for you guys.

My Rant on Cancer

Doctors and medicle resaerchers are all very concerned about finding cures to cancer, and researching new methods of diagnosis. However, they seem much less concerned with finding out what is the root cause of the cancer. Yes some of it might be human error, smoking/over eating/old age. That still does not account for the huge increase in cancer cases we are seeing (plus ppl have always over eaten if they could afford too + First nations smoked). It is likely that cancer is caused by environmental degredation, and the use of toxic chemicals. However, research usually doesn't point this out because they are being funded by corporations who use or produce these cheap chemicals or who are helping to destroy the environment. :x

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I went to the gyno today to get some BC pills (I have PMDD). Anyway, it's the first time I've been to this one, and she was pretty good, once she realized that I wasn't joking about being asexual. Although she gave me the ol' "maybe some day you'll meet your dream man" speech and asked her "Are you maybe gay" questions, she was pretty cool, and agreed that we only needed to do the pelvic exam once every THREE years. Cool.

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I haven't been yet, and I'm 21, but my mom is going to make me go sometime this year (she said that last year too, lol). In all honesty I'm dreading going too, BUT...I can't get out of something like that. For one, I don't want to embarass my family and stress out my mom. Second, causing a fuss isn't in my personality, my pride of being brave gets the better of me...I'll just have to bite the bullet when I go, just like when I got my wisdom teeth removed =/ (btw, when I got them removed, it wasn't as bad as I thought, and they praised me for being a good patient, which made that brave pride thing go up, let me tell you, lol)

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just like when I got my wisdom teeth removed =/ (btw, when I got them removed, it wasn't as bad as I thought, and they praised me for being a good patient, which made that brave pride thing go up, let me tell you, lol)

I couldn't resist writing to this! I put off getting my wisdom teeth removed for years because a boy I knew in high school died within hours of getting his removed. Fearing death, I refused to have them taken out. That is until they started to erupt impacted, which was such horrible, agonizing pain that I called every surgeon who could fit me in within the week. A month simply would not due in my case.

For half a year, I wasn't able to open my jaw more than an inch, and for an entire year, more than two inches. Now I have arthritis in my jaw that'll stay with me for the rest of my life. When ever I open my mouth more than half an inch, I hear a grinding sound. During dentist visits, when my jaw is opened for periods of time, it starts to spasm.

Granted, I was predisposed to arthritis, but it was the surgery that triggered it.

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