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Chiaroscuro

I Suddenly Hate My Kind

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Revenge of Rain

It depends on how you're defining sexuality. I've never had sex but I certainly get aroused nonetheless. It isn't some essential part of my existence, though.

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BunnyK.
It isn't some essential part of my existence, though.

I'm not sure that I'm arguing that sexuality is an essential part of existence, but identity. That is, I could live without sexuality (and I have), but in order to do so I would have to lose a piece of myself. A large, happy, satisfying piece of myself.

When I had a period where my sexuality was very suppressed, I lived and worked and did whatever basically just like an asexual would have, and for the most part I was fine. It wasn't until my sexuality woke back up that I realized how much grayer and less vital I felt without it. That's probably part of why it bugs me so much that my boyfriend isn't as into sex as I am - it's a really big fear of mine that eventually I'll repress my sexuality so much to please him, that I'll once again lose it all together. I love my boyfriend, but I don't want to lose myself...I don't want to feel that dead, ever again.

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OperaGhost
Hey there, OperaGhost. I understand that your fear and pain are real, and you may want to share them with an asexual-friendly counselor so that they are not so paralyzing. We fear what we fear, and as an OCD person I will never mock someone else's fear. But when fear gets too all- encompassing, that is when we have to learn what is really behind it. Keeping it to yourself only causes endless rumination, and that is not healthy. I am really, really sorry that this is such an unpleasant issue for you.

My sister and many of our friends are girly girls who have never had anything like what you fear happen to them. There's a big difference between not dressing provocatively (which is wise) and dressing to look ugly.

Of course, you don't have to be a girly girl. Dress and act the way that feels right to you. Don't change yourself because of the way you think others will react, though.

I have recently been seeing a counselour, and it does help a little bit.

Thank you. That sounds like good advice and I appreciate your concern.

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Mark from the OCD board
I have recently been seeing a counselour, and it does help a little bit.

Thank you. That sounds like good advice and I appreciate your concern.

I am glad to hear it. A good counselor can be a godsend.

We are who we are, and who we are comes from an incredible blend of our biological wiring (including wiring that may make us more prone to anxiety) and our environment/experiences. Being human is nothing to be ashamed of, but sometimes it takes a little extra work. :)

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Busrider
I don't want to look good because I'm too afraid. I was thinking about it today and I was wondering if maybe it has to with control. I can't control if other people are attracted to me, and I can't accept that. I don't want to be attractive, so I feel that other people should respect that and just not be attracted to me. It's just I feel threatened because there's the risk that some people may feel something for me that I'll never be able to understand, that I perceive as a threat, and I will not be able to prevent them from feeling that. But I must. I have to try my best to prevent people from being attracted to me.

Some people say that "no one can love you if you don't love yourself" or something like that. So if that applies to sexual attraction as well (I don't know if it does) then if I just think of myself as ugly, then other people shouldn't be able to be attracted to me. I know that I think of myself as ugly, and I know that I snapped at someone once while they were making distateful comments about ugly people (something to the effect of wanting them all to die) and somewhere in the snapping said that I was ugly, and they were just confused, like, "What? You're not ugly..." So some other people don't think I'm ugly, so that means that I must not be trying hard enough to keep myself safe.

I know that when I look at myself in the mirror, I don't really see myself as ugly. But then I start thinking that I'm ugly, and it doesn't connect, so I get confused and realize that if I can see attractive features in myself, other people might be able to, too. Then I panic and try to hide everything, because if anyone can see anything attractive about me then I am not being modest enough.

I don't know how to stop thinking like this, but it doesn't seem healthy to think like this. I don't know. :(

I feel concerned. I believe uglyness isn't the only way out. IMHO religious fundamentalists can radiate some 150% asexual beauty. I wouldn't expect a Mormon missionary girl, traditionally dressed Quaker, female Moslem or similar to be anything beyond "friendly", although they are not bad, often even classy looking.

There was a time when one was able to spot students from the local catholic girls' school according to the way they dressed which wasn't ugly and somehow female too, but somehow in a nerdy way asexy.

All I want to say is: There is a way to radiate a neat, well groomed asexual classyness. Wishing you only the best, I hope you'll find a entry to it, maybe by copying others, to push your career, if you like too.

Being not gay myself I know the feeling of being hit on by men and the urge to avoid that.

Good luck anyhow, especially with your counselor.

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maufry
And since Mark brought up vulcans' date=' can you imagine what it would be like to try to understand what an alien is talking about? Here we are' date=' all member of the same species, and we're talking past one another because our underlying assumptions are completely different.[/quote'']

Yes, what we need in this situation is a vulcan mind meld. ;) Language is a pain in the neck.

I quite agree. I always end up in trouble b/c I don't say things quite the way I mean them.

What else? There was an episode of Star Trek: The Next Generation in which a planet of biologically sexless people were horrified by the concept of male and female (and thus' date=' perhaps, procreation). They persecuted people among their species who were more in touch with their male or female part, and indeed such a person, more in touch with the female part, fell in love with Riker. This was the so-called "gay episode," but it can also be seen asexually. [/quote']

I was going to mention this one!! Their procreation had nothing to do with sex. There was some sort of pod involved, I believe. Don't remember exactly, it's been awhile since I've seen it.

Oh, and the award? Yeah, that one was hard to miss, lol.

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Mark from the OCD board
And no, being attracted to someone is not the same thing as seeing them as a sex toy. But the desire to sleep with that person (which tends to directly follow being attracted to a person, at least with sexuals) is.

Maufry, that's just a flat out ignorant thing to say. You've been here long enough to know better. I look at my wife and desire to sleep with her. I don't act on that because I know she wouldn't enjoy it. That doesn't make me a pig, and it doesn't mean I see her as a sex toy.

Period.

-Chiaroscuro

But I don't understand. What you're desiring is something that you know will hurt her. It's awesome that you're not doing it, since doing it would hurt her, but that doesn't change the fact that you're desiring to hurt her. I know that's not your intention at all, but for those of us on the other side of it, that's what it feels like. The best way I can describe it is that with my ex, he knew that sexual related activities caused me great discomfort. He knew that if he had sex with me, I would feel like I was being raped (even if I did it willingly, I still wouldn't really be wanting it). He knew that such things give me no pleasure, so he couldn't use the argument that he wanted to please me. And yet still he desired to sleep with me. Knowing how I felt about it. So for me, it felt like he was desiring to rape me, since what he was desiring was his own pleasure and gratification at my expense. My brain knows that he would NEVER do such a horrible thing, to me or anyone. But that didn't change the fact that that's how it felt.

I hear you, maufry, and in no way will I minimize what you are feeling. Since I am not asexual, I do not have the right to do so. I know that it must be unsettling to think about how the rest of the world perceives sexual thoughts. The only thing I ask is that you understand that the way you feel about them (and the way I am sure many asexuals feel about them) is not the way most sexuals feel. To most of us, such thoughts are no big deal--and we are not all sex fiends for thinking them.

The only way I can explain further is to be honest, even if it means, sadly, that some people reading this will think less of me. There are some very good-looking guys on this board, and when I saw pictures of certain members for the first time, I really did think "Oh yeah, I'd do him."

Each "him" in question is asexual, however. I would never tell an asexual guy that I had ever thought about him that way, and even if we knew each other in person and had become such good friends that we were sleeping in the same room, I would not so much as jest about having sex with him. Why would I want to make a friend uncomfortable? That is not what I am about. I would fully respect an asexual friend the way I respect my heterosexual male friends--and gay friends who are only friends. He'd be so safe that it would be as if I were castrated.

But would I still think about it? Yes.

I am wired that way. Condemning me for it is hurtful, as I can only choose my actions, not my thoughts or my wiring. I am sexual because that is who I am, and sexual people think sexual thoughts.

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Chiaroscuro

Hi Maufry,

He knew that such things give me no pleasure, so he couldn't use the argument that he wanted to please me. And yet still he desired to sleep with me. Knowing how I felt about it. So for me, it felt like he was desiring to rape me, since what he was desiring was his own pleasure and gratification at my expense.

Here's the thing... your partner didn't want YOU to do anything you didn't want to do. What he wanted was to be with someone who wanted him the same way he wanted them. He wanted a reciprocal relationship. When two sexual people are in a relationship, mutual desire is a shared understanding. It's what's behind the knowing glances at parties, the quick hand-squeeze before getting out of the car to go grocery shopping. It's a coded reaffirmation of that connection: I desire you and I'll show you how much later.

That's what your partner wanted from you. He wasn't interested in raping you, or having you "submit" to him while looking at him like some sort of diseased monster. He knew you loved him, but didn't desire him, and you knew he loved you and desired you. Knowing doesn't trump feeling, unfortunately (for both of you). The repetition of this story is one reason sexuals insist that romantic love and desire are intertwined. It was for your ex, and is, I'm sure, why he IS ex.

-Chiaroscuro

PS - you know the old cliche about "can't we just be friends?". It's code for "you're nice, but I don't desire you." It's universally recognized as the death-knell of a relationship. It should probably be the asexual code for "want to go out with me?" :P

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Mark from the OCD board

I agree with Chiaroscuro. In one of my classes a few weeks ago, a student shared details about a longterm girlfriend who had just broken up with him. When he got to the part where she said "We can still be friends," half the class, both female and male, groaned loadly.

"I hate that!" said one of my other students.

The original student then turned to me and said, "I hate that, too. Why do people say that, Mark?"

What could I say?

...because it's a way to try to be polite and spare hurt feelings even though it is unlikely that you will remain friends.

...because it is a meaningless cliche that is supposed to hurt less than the truth.

But really...

...as Chiaroscuro said, that's the death-knell of a relationship.

Friends are friends, and they are wonderful; I love having them and don't seek them out for sex--particularly if I know that, for whatever reason, they don't have sexual interest in me.

Some sexuals have "friends with fringe benefits"; I don't, but I would not be opposed if the guy and I were single and compatible--and knew we could not be a couple.

Regarding the special someone who is more than a friend... To a sexual, "just being friends" when people are or have been in love, particularly if they were once sexual, is very, very, very, very hard (and even impossible for a very large number).

I know I'd spend a lot of nights locked in the bathroom and crying my eyes out.

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Spoofmaster
When I look at the painting that I used for my Avatar (by John Singer Sargent), I feel the sexual overtones between the man and the woman. It's not pornographic. It's not overt in any way, but his posture and hers call up sexual echoes in me.

-Chairoscuro

:shock: Really?

I don't mean to come off as if I think you're crazy or something for seeing it that way, but that's...well, it's fascinating! The first time I looked at your avatar, before reading any of your posts, I thought you might be asexual because the image seemed so platonic to me. It's the clothes, I think. :roll:

I kind of get the sexual thing because I do get aroused and I do masturbate--it's just not connected to any desire to do it with anyone else. I tried giving it up recently. I made it a week before I was driven to distraction, and then only half a week more before I gave in. Very annoying that I can't give it up so easily, but perhaps just a little bit enlightening about how sexuals are feeling when they talk about being miserable from not having sex. It's a purely physical, personal thing for me, but then if I imagine adding in an emotional factor, well! I can definitely see where you're coming from.

I understand the deal with seeing things a little sexually, but only on an intellectual level. It still doesn't make all that much sense to me on a practical level, but that's okay.

The talk about wanting to tackle a guy and plant a kiss on his nose and have it be platonic really reminds me of when I was in middle school. I spent several weeks at the start of my first year there where every time we went out for recess, I'd fight with a guy a couple years older than me and we'd try to push each other off of one of the platforms on the playground. It was really just a sort of playful mock-fighting, at least on my end, and it involved a lot of physical contact, since pushing your entire body against someone is about the best way to force them to move when they have a death-grip on a railing.

Then...then it was brought to my attention that this was not "appropriate." I guess the guy felt differently about it than I did, and his friend-who-was-a-girl actually came up and basically told me that what I was doing was overtly sexual and that it wasn't something a young girl ought to be doing. I don't think I'd ever felt so mortified or so stupid in my life. The thought of coming on to the guy had never even occurred to me. :?

Anyway, I kind of figured out from that incident that physical contact wasn't something I could have with my friends, which is not such a happy result but which is probably a good policy with sexual people anyway.

And on the personality test thing...anyone ever hear of the Barnum Effect? No matter how bogus a test is, people will see something of themselves in the results they get. I'm sure there are tests out there that are actually helpful, but I for one am incapable of looking at myself subjectively enough to actually decide if I think the results are valid.

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OperaGhost

I have recently been seeing a counselour, and it does help a little bit.

Thank you. That sounds like good advice and I appreciate your concern.

I am glad to hear it. A good counselor can be a godsend.

We are who we are, and who we are comes from an incredible blend of our biological wiring (including wiring that may make us more prone to anxiety) and our environment/experiences. Being human is nothing to be ashamed of, but sometimes it takes a little extra work. :)

Yes, it can be really helpful.

I guess so.

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Chiaroscuro

Spoofmaster writes:

I don't mean to come off as if I think you're crazy or something for seeing it that way, but that's...well, it's fascinating! The first time I looked at your avatar, before reading any of your posts, I thought you might be asexual because the image seemed so platonic to me. It's the clothes, I think.

I chose that picture because, to me, it seemed to express what my marriage is like... the man yearning for the woman, but remaining formal because of her orientation. The woman reading the letter seems utterly oblivious of the man's attention.

Seeing a sexual subtext in art (or seeing anything in art), is incredibly subjective. People see things in my paintings that I didn't intend (consciously). Much of art occurs on the instinctive level though, so I'm sure a lot of what they see I am doing unconsciously.

Chiaroscuro

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maufry
Regarding the special someone who is more than a friend... To a sexual, "just being friends" when people are or have been in love, particularly if they were once sexual, is very, very, very, very hard (and even impossible for a very large number).

I know I'd spend a lot of nights locked in the bathroom and crying my eyes out.

I don't think that's has anything to do with sex. I think that has to do with having once been able to open up to a person completely and being totally vulnerable with them, and then realizing that you can't do that anymore.

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M51

Gotta concur with maufry on this one. I have spent many nights crying over lost love that is now "just friends" or a desired love that will never be more than "just friends", and it had nothing to do with not having sexual access to that person.

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Mark from the OCD board
Yes, it can be really helpful.

I guess so.

I'm not sure how to take the last sentence since I am reading a printed message and cannot hear the inflection of your voice or see the expression on your face.

You don't have to agree with me or anyone else just because I/we say it. You've expressed a mixed reaction to your counselor earlier, and that is fine. :)

Regarding the special someone who is more than a friend... To a sexual, "just being friends" when people are or have been in love, particularly if they were once sexual, is very, very, very, very hard (and even impossible for a very large number).

I know I'd spend a lot of nights locked in the bathroom and crying my eyes out.

I don't think that's has anything to do with sex. I think that has to do with having once been able to open up to a person completely and being totally vulnerable with them, and then realizing that you can't do that anymore.

Gotta concur with maufry on this one. I have spent many nights crying over lost love that is now "just friends" or a desired love that will never be more than "just friends", and it had nothing to do with not having sexual access to that person.

I agree with both of you--as that would be at the heart of the matter. If I lost a very close friend and confidante with whom I had never been sexual, I would react in this manner.

If I were asexual and I had split with my life partner, I would also react in the manner you describe.

Because I am a sexual, though, sexuality is a key way I express vulnerability, opening up, bonding, and love with a person who is more than a friend. For me, sexual bonding (not to be confused with recreational sex) and what it represents (trust, vulnerability, union) is part of the whole package and is not usually separated from the rest. My feeling cut off from the person and his love because of loss of sexual sharing would also be at the heart of the matter.

In the end, we are all humans reacting to a loss for a variety of reasons and in a variety of ways. I would be wrong to try to minimize your feelings or reinterpret them through my wiring, but I also say that it would be wrong of you to try to minimize mine or reinterpret mine.

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Chiaroscuro

This is one area where the A's and the S's are just going to react differently. It's not so important that you guys understand WHY sexuality is bound up in romantic love for a sexual person. What I hope you can sympathize with is that it DOES, in some mysterious way that only sexuals can feel. It doesn't have to make sense to you. It doesn't have to be logical. Just trust us on this one.

Also, like Mark says, feeling the way we do doesn't make us better than asexuals or worse than asexuals. IDIC.

-Chiaroscuro

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ghosts

Hm... I don't mean to say "No, you're wrong!", but there are sexuals out there that have nonsexual relationships that they'd consider romantic. Or, in my own case, I have intimate relationships with sexual people that aren't defined, but to them, they're apparently just as intimate as their sexual relationships. So I think there's variation...

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Chiaroscuro

Come on, Ghosts. You break every sexual and asexual mould ever made. :D

We're debating in broad generalities at this point. I don't claim to speak for every sexual in the world.

-Chiaroscuro

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ghosts
Come on, Ghosts. You break every sexual and asexual mould ever made. :D

Bwah ha ha... :twisted:

But yeah, I figured you were. ;)

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Placebo
PS - you know the old cliche about "can't we just be friends?". It's code for "you're nice, but I don't desire you." It's universally recognized as the death-knell of a relationship. It should probably be the asexual code for "want to go out with me?" :P

Oooooh!

*suddenly past conversations with almost-boyfriends make more sense*

I never really understood why they took it so hard. Telling them that I was friends with them was the nicest thing I could possibly say! And then they never talked to me again.

Man, and they say that men and women can't understand each other. Sheesh, that's nothing compared to sexual/asexual, sometimes. ;)

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*a*rteest
I never really understood why they took it so hard. Telling them that I was friends with them was the nicest thing I could possibly say! And then they never talked to me again.

This is why I view most sexuals as predators to be avoided. It doesn't matter how nice you are, your reputation, your personality, your interests, your common goals. They won't actually *bother* getting to know you personally, they'll just hit you up for sex, and when the answer is "no", they move on to find the next person willing to do them.

I've had this happen many, mnay times before. All these people want, is sex.

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Chiaroscuro
All these people want, is sex.

"These people?"

There are bastards who are sexual and bastards who are asexual.

Think about the kind of asexual you want to be next time you begin typing.

-Chiaroscuro

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Mark from the OCD board

Hi, *a*rteest.

One of my ESL (English as a Second Language) classes contains 12 Korean, Japanese, and Chinese university students. After doing some Asian-American literature with them, we moved on to Maya Angelou and a piece on Africa. When, as a pre-reading exercise, I broke the class into discussion groups and asked what they thought about when they heard the word "Africa," they proceeded to put together the most stereotypical lists imaginable.

My explaining stereotypes and prejudice only produced polite nods. However, when I explained, quite graphically, some of the most offensive stereotypes that Americans use to describe Asians, and then drew a figure with slanted eyes, buck teeth, a straw hat, and a "flied lice" word balloon on the board, they understood what I was saying. Some laughed heartily; others were embarrassed. They then reconsidered some of what they had said about Africa.

So, rather than argue your points, I will simply turn your anti-sexual remarks into anti-asexual remarks in hopes of letting you see the sadness with which I view your post.

Please note: I do not actually believe what I am about to write any more than I actually believe the anti-Asian nonsense I explained to my Asian students.

This is why I view most sexuals as predators to be avoided.

That is why I view most asexuals as nuns with ice in their veins--to be avoided since they have no emotions.

It doesn't matter how nice you are, your reputation, your personality, your interests, your common goals. They won't actually *bother* getting to know you personally, they'll just hit you up for sex, and when the answer is "no", they move on to find the next person willing to do them.

It doesn't matter how willing you, the sexual, are to accept people as they are, your reputation as a good person, your many close friends with whom you do not have sex, your interests in things beyond sex, your common goals. Asexuals won't actually *bother* getting to know you personally because they view you as an inferior being. They'll just assume you want them only for sex, and even if you make it clear that you don't they still won't trust you because you are sexual. They move on to find other asexuals and never get to know sexuals because they are too scared to leave their asexual ghettos.

I've had this happen many, mnay times before. All these people want, is sex.

I've seen this sentiment many, many times on this board. All these people want is to convince themselves that they are morally superior.

---

If you find my words--which, as I said, I don't believe--offensive, then you understand why yours are so hurtful. I recognize that there are indeed many sexuals who only want sex, but I also know many sexuals (including myself) who do have and love sex yet also have close friends from the sex they are attracted to even though they have never had and will never have sex with them.

I regret any bad experiences you have had, and I certainly don't deny them. I just ask that you try to see who else is out there.

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thylacine

"t doesn't matter how nice you are, your reputation, your personality, your interests, your common goals. They won't actually *bother* getting to know you personally, they'll just hit you up for sex, and when the answer is "no", they move on to find the next person willing to do them."

Yah know... really, I'm not trying to be "superior" here... but I've felt this way too sometimes. I know that a lot of sexual people are not this way... but some of them are. Honestly, there are people "like that" out there in this big bad world, and God help me, I've met quite a few of them!

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Placebo
I never really understood why they took it so hard. Telling them that I was friends with them was the nicest thing I could possibly say! And then they never talked to me again.

This is why I view most sexuals as predators to be avoided. It doesn't matter how nice you are, your reputation, your personality, your interests, your common goals. They won't actually *bother* getting to know you personally, they'll just hit you up for sex, and when the answer is "no", they move on to find the next person willing to do them.

I've had this happen many, mnay times before. All these people want, is sex.

Nah--it never got to the point of sex. Heck, it never even got to the point of holding hands or kissing. And I honestly never felt like they were hitting me up or forcing me in any way--we were friends. :)

As some of the rest of the discussion on this board has pointed out, it's just that we communicate emotionally with two different languages. So it was more that the fact that I said (in my language) that I really valued their friendship and thought highly of them and cared for them deeply. . . .but that (in their language) it translated to the fact that I was spurning them on a deep, emotional level because I couldn't "speak" to them in the way that they required. What they heard was exactly the opposite of what I actually said and meant, because I don't communicate in the language of sexuality--to sexuals, if I understand the concept right, sex and sexuality are a deep means of bonding, and me not engaging in that is a complete and total rejection. But I never understood that at the time--in fact, I'm only now realizing just how different the sexual/asexual divide is--and they didn't me either. It was an honest misunderstanding.

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Chiaroscuro
I never understood that at the time--in fact, I'm only now realizing just how different the sexual/asexual divide is--and they didn't me either. It was an honest misunderstanding.

Well said, Placebo. And you know that the people who assumed you were rejecting them had no idea that there even was such a thing as a divide. There's plenty of ignorance to go around (I don't mean that disparagingly... I came to Aven in total ignorance).

-Chiaroscuro

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Mark from the OCD board

Sometimes even sexuals speak to each other with incomprehensible signals, Placebo. I, for example, tend to be too literal for my own good and don't always pick up on subtlety.

Some years ago, a fellow gay guy named Robert asked me if I planned to go to a party at the LGBT Center. I told him the truth: With a smile, I explained that I was not a party person and did not enjoy myself too much in crowds of people I did not know. I then told him that I had heard many people who were so inclined enjoyed Center parties immensely, and I wished him a good time.

A few weeks later, I heard through the grapevine that I was a rude person who had turned Robert down in an extremely insensitive manner. I had had no idea that I was being asked out; in fact, if I had, I would have said yes--and suggested a meal or a nice walk or a museum instead of a party. Robert had said "Are you going?" and not "Would you like to go with me?" Again, I am very literal (an OCD trait--but also one a number of non-OCD people have).

Some of my friends feel I should have understood that I was being asked out; I do not see how I could have. It's not like I've ever read a training manual on interpreting indirect questions. Well... If it happens again, at least I'll know better.

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Octarine
"t doesn't matter how nice you are, your reputation, your personality, your interests, your common goals. They won't actually *bother* getting to know you personally, they'll just hit you up for sex, and when the answer is "no", they move on to find the next person willing to do them."

Yah know... really, I'm not trying to be "superior" here... but I've felt this way too sometimes. I know that a lot of sexual people are not this way... but some of them are. Honestly, there are people "like that" out there in this big bad world, and God help me, I've met quite a few of them!

The offensive part, (at least for me, an asexual) was the "most" part. In my experience, most sexuals are perfectly nice people. Most have respected the fact that I wouldn't appreciate their advances. Most sexuals don't like being contacted only for sex, either. Yes, there are some people to whom that description would fit perfectly. But to say that most sexuals are like that is rather... inaccurate.

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Wolf X Omega

Well Life's a b**** or not XD depends on how you see life, Many sexuals can be really cruel, but i say it isn't their fault(not directly tought) it's most fault of those who raised them, and the ancient civilizations, greece was a place full of orgy and stuff, people tought that sex was important, expecially after... a philosophic movement which i don't remember the name came by and said that people should Carpe diem life between other things and said for people to satisfy their pleasures to get closer to god or something of the like.

Edit:

Almost forgot, It's also know as the famous "All the cool kids are doing it!"

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maufry
"t doesn't matter how nice you are, your reputation, your personality, your interests, your common goals. They won't actually *bother* getting to know you personally, they'll just hit you up for sex, and when the answer is "no", they move on to find the next person willing to do them."

Yah know... really, I'm not trying to be "superior" here... but I've felt this way too sometimes. I know that a lot of sexual people are not this way... but some of them are. Honestly, there are people "like that" out there in this big bad world, and God help me, I've met quite a few of them!

The offensive part, (at least for me, an asexual) was the "most" part. In my experience, most sexuals are perfectly nice people. Most have respected the fact that I wouldn't appreciate their advances. Most sexuals don't like being contacted only for sex, either. Yes, there are some people to whom that description would fit perfectly. But to say that most sexuals are like that is rather... inaccurate.

I think there can be a vast difference b/t how people act towards friends and how they act towards romantic partners. All of my sexual male friends are perfectly wonderful people. I love them dearly. They're a lot of fun to be around, and they certainly don't judge me for being asexual. However.....when it comes to romantic relationships, most of them I wouldn't touch with a twenty foot pole. They're complete jackasses when it comes to stuff like that. B/c all they want is the pretty big-boobed bimbo who will put out. And if she won't, out the door she goes. Not all of them are like this, but most of them. So yeah, in my experience they're great guys, but only b/c I've never tried to date them. When it comes to romance, people are completely different. I don't think our contention here is that sexuals are terrible people all the time. Just that, when it comes to "romance," a lot of them sure as hell are. Note that I didn't say all, even though in the dating experience of me and several of my (sexual) friends, we could certainly say all (and yes, I did think about that, just to make sure there weren't any exceptions - there weren't). Mark, you're right, stereotypes suck. But if every time you touch a stove it happens to be on and you get burned, you're going to think that stoves are always hot and will always burn. Even if you know, intellectually, that stoves can be turned off and don't always burn. But if your experiences consistently contradict what you know to be true, which one are you going to end up believing?

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