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Master US Political Discussion Thread


LeChat
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LeChat,

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As far as i am concerned, Ingram, Carlson, Hannity, Murdoch and everyone else on FOX who knew they were lying should be on trial. Alex Jones rightly stood trial and was fined, so should they. Put them all trial. Also, FOX News should not be allowed to call itself News. And by the way, I have not saying conservative media should be banned, but, as Carlson said many years ago at CPAC, conservatives need actual, reliable media It says alot when people at FOX rail against MSNBC and the NY Times while using them privately when they want real news. 

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"The centerpiece of the package, Senate Bill 8 — dubbed The Texas Parental Bill of Rights by its GOP authors — would give parents who want to pull their children out of public school $8,000 a year to cover home-schooling expenses or private school tuition. Those who chose to keep their children in public schools would be granted new oversight over what students were taught and what books they could access. The 53-page bill also includes a provision, similar to one adopted a year ago in Florida, that would prohibit public schools from providing instruction or activities “regarding sexual orientation or gender identity” at all grade levels."

 

This is literally what the state of Virginia did after Brown v. Board of Education.

To avoid desegregation, they gave white parents money to attend a private school of their choice while subsequently closing smaller public schools.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/gop-lawmakers-aim-reshape-education-texas-parental-bill-rights-rcna76216

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Texas and Florida are in a race with each other to see which one is most horrible.  Mississippi and Alabama are feeling dissed because they used to be the most-horribles.  

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6 minutes ago, daveb said:

Tennessee wants to be in the running, too.

Nah, Tennessee's way behind.  There may still be some politicians there who have functioning brains and hearts.  

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1 minute ago, Sally said:

Nah, Tennessee's way behind.  There may still be some politicians there who have functioning brains and hearts.  

They did pass an anti-drag law, first state to do so. I wouldn't dismiss them.

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I have a lot of respect and admiration for people such as Grace Linn.

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Gentle Giant

T-rump and Desantis being the top picks for GOP 2024 candidates are no contrast at all, they’re basically the same rotten thing. Either would be terrible for our country. The others aren’t much better either, trying to model T-rump too. Why do they think that is a winning strategy? Now T-rump has his rally in Waco TX and has been inciting violence again.

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36 minutes ago, Gentle Giant said:

T-rump and Desantis being the top picks for GOP 2024 candidates are no contrast at all, they’re basically the same rotten thing. Either would be terrible for our country. The others aren’t much better either, trying to model T-rump too. Why do they think that is a winning strategy? Now T-rump has his rally in Waco TX and has been inciting violence again.

Very interesting that he chose Waco, considering the government murdered dozens of fundamentalist Christians there 30 years ago while trying to serve a warrant for alleged illegal arms dealing.

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Olallieberry
1 hour ago, RobL2415 said:

Very interesting that he chose Waco, considering the government murdered dozens of fundamentalist Christians there 30 years ago while trying to serve a warrant for alleged illegal arms dealing.

I'm not sure how much "fundamentalist Christians" in general identify with the Waco sect. 

 

I think they may be aligned with the "freedom" aspect of what they were doing, and with the "state sponsored terror/gubmint overreach" interpretations, but do they see David Koresh and his religious practices and philosophies aligning with their own?

 

Like I said, I'm not sure about that, but regardless, I don't think it's "fundamentalist Christians" he's trying to reach with this rally. I think it's weapons stockpilers (illegal or otherwise), anti-government militia types, and RaHoWa preppers.

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Olallieberry
1 hour ago, - 𝕱𝖗𝖆𝖌𝖌𝖑𝖊𝕽𝖔𝖈𝕶 - said:

I'm not too worried, I think it's nearly impossible for Trump to win a general election at this point, and DeSantis is running on his opposition to the way a lot of the rest of the country does things. (He'd have a shot though, unlike Trump.) I don't know who the democratic candidate would be but I'm curious to see how things go. I don't think Biden should run again, I like him a lot as president but I think in the climate of the next election other candidates would be better picks.

Any suggestions?

 

Kamala is beyond unelectable because of her severe charisma problems, besides being a shitty executive.

 

I like Pete Buttegieg and find him smart, classy, reasonable, and impeccable policy-wise, and would love to see an out gay parent achieve the presidency, but he's already trolled by Fox News daily and his two-daddies story is already used to whip up the Heartland Taliban hate.

 

Sanders is too old, and already failed a run. Warren is too polarizing, and already failed a run. AOC is too young and inexperienced to be a credible presidential candidate today.

 

Newsom can win California but he can't win the nation. Eric Swalwell is a very prominent Democrat but mostly known for perceived hyper-partisanship for being the House impeachment manager, rather than for effectively legislating, and Adam Schiff is in the same boat for the 1/6 committee.

 

I like Jamie Raskin a lot, he's also classy, witty, unperturbable, and a splendid leader. Concerns about his health though probably make him non-viable for president. Maybe vice. He was also on the 1/6 committee but wasn't the prominent figure Schiff was on this matter. He's also even less experienced at the federal level than AOC is.

 

Nancy Pelosi isn't interested, and I don't think she'd be a strong candidate anyway. Also quite old, and in my opinion lacking the resolve to win a presidential campaign even if she was interested.

 

So who is there? I'm not saying there's nobody, I'm just saying Biden with his incumbency is a very strong candidate compared to a lot of obvious top choices. So that leaves someone un-obvious?

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Raskin and Schiff are both excellent and would make great Presidents.  But Raskin's type of lymphoma isn't always curable, and they're both Jews; with rising antisemitism, the GOP would be able to say all sorts of things that would convey what's meant without being obvious. 

 

There's nobody yet, but in 1960 and 1976 there wasn't anyone either.  

 

 

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Fraggle Underdark

Yeah I like Buttegieg a lot too, and generally agree with the electability critiques of the others.

 

But "I don't see there being any reasonable, experienced, sane person who can win the election out of this huge field of reasonable, experienced, sane people" (including those not mentioned, it could be whoever) just doesn't seem like a fundamental problem. Like if you were betting *against* the democrats on this one issue, you would need every possible candidate to fail. There's not a fundamental problem with the party or anything, it would be extremely improbable that every single person has some different one-off, idiosyncratic reason they can't beat lumpy weird Florida businessmen.

 

And one of the big reasons it'd be hard to fail for this reason is that it's easy to sit back and say someone isn't electable, e.g. Trump or Biden, though both drew record vote counts. (A lot of the Biden votes are anti-Trump votes, but still, the anti-crazy vote is still a vote.)

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I like Buttegieg a lot, but I think the Biden administration screwed up by appointing him to the department of transportation. It’s such an important position, and things have been really rough lately. Not that Buttegieg is responsible for that, but he hasn’t done enough. 
I think something needs to change (and maybe he needs to get a little more experience) before he’s ready to be a VP or President. 

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I'm thinking it's too early to say. There may be some Democrat that isn't getting much notice at this time who will end up being the nominee (and hopefully the president). If Biden runs I think it is not unlikely he would get the nomination. I can see him winning a second term. At the same time, I can't think of any potential Democratic candidate I wouldn't prefer over the lumpy Floridamans. :P 

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2 hours ago, Autumn ace said:

before he’s ready to be a VP or President. 

I think he could help the ticket as a VP candidate, with the right P candidate -- someone older and well-known, but not ancient.

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On 3/26/2023 at 12:53 PM, Ollie415 said:

I'm not sure how much "fundamentalist Christians" in general identify with the Waco sect. 

 

I think they may be aligned with the "freedom" aspect of what they were doing, and with the "state sponsored terror/gubmint overreach" interpretations, but do they see David Koresh and his religious practices and philosophies aligning with their own?

 

Like I said, I'm not sure about that, but regardless, I don't think it's "fundamentalist Christians" he's trying to reach with this rally. I think it's weapons stockpilers (illegal or otherwise), anti-government militia types, and RaHoWa preppers.

They would certainly be their allies and use it in furtherance of their persecution complex.

 

I put the blame for that whole situation squarely on the Clinton administration. Koresh was crazy, but he and his people were not violent. There was no reason to believe they were planning on harming anyone. AG Reno and Clinton wanted this to be a political stunt to show how dangerous Christian extremism is, but they did it, IMO, in the worst way possible.

 

Controversial opinion, but if the Waco siege happened in the 2010s or 2020s I would be calling for justice for the Branch Davidians just as much as I would have for Breonna Taylor.

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1 hour ago, daveb said:

Cory Booker could be a good contender.

Agreed. And if anyone complains about his lack of experience remember that Obama was a Junior Senator. 

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Lysandre, the Star-Crossed
On 3/27/2023 at 12:06 PM, RobL2415 said:

They would certainly be their allies and use it in furtherance of their persecution complex.

 

I put the blame for that whole situation squarely on the Clinton administration. Koresh was crazy, but he and his people were not violent. There was no reason to believe they were planning on harming anyone. AG Reno and Clinton wanted this to be a political stunt to show how dangerous Christian extremism is, but they did it, IMO, in the worst way possible.

 

Controversial opinion, but if the Waco siege happened in the 2010s or 2020s I would be calling for justice for the Branch Davidians just as much as I would have for Breonna Taylor.

Shooting some dogs and BBQing some kids over a tax crime, that's what happens when you elect the wrong kind of Democrats.

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18 hours ago, Lysandre, the Star-Crossed said:

Shooting some dogs and BBQing some kids over a tax crime, that's what happens when you elect the wrong kind of Democrats.

Well, that's what happens when you elect any politicians who don't support a deescalation and community policing system.

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Olallieberry
5 hours ago, RobL2415 said:

Well, that's what happens when you elect any politicians who don't support a deescalation and community policing system.

It wasn't local/municipal cops, it was Feds from outside the community.

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22 hours ago, Ollie415 said:

It wasn't local/municipal cops, it was Feds from outside the community.

It might as well have been the military. The FBI used tanks, for crying out loud. Waco (I think) is the largest loss of life resulting from an armed civilian conflict in American history.

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Lysandre, the Star-Crossed
On 4/4/2023 at 6:05 PM, Ollie415 said:

It wasn't local/municipal cops, it was Feds from outside the community.

The state and local cops do it too, don't forget that time Philadelphia bombed a group of black people from a helicopter and burned down two city blocks.

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So basically, it's OK to use militarized police on people the AG or the POTUS deems undesirable.

 

David Koresh was undoubtedly crazy, but maybe -- here's a thought, maybe don't go into the execution of a search warrant with guns blazing.

5 hours ago, Lysandre, the Star-Crossed said:

The state and local cops do it too, don't forget that time Philadelphia bombed a group of black people from a helicopter and burned down two city blocks.

 

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Lysandre, the Star-Crossed
2 hours ago, RobL2415 said:

So basically, it's OK to use militarized police on people the AG or the POTUS deems undesirable.

Godwin's law in three... two...one...

 

...and whoever does it would not be wrong 

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2 hours ago, Lysandre, the Star-Crossed said:

Godwin's law in three... two...one...

 

...and whoever does it would not be wrong 

Oh please don't.  

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Tennessee republicans haven’t even pretended to care lately 

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Olallieberry
2 hours ago, Sally said:

Oh please don't.  

too late, who smelt it dealt it.

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Olallieberry
7 hours ago, RobL2415 said:

So basically, it's OK to use militarized police on people the AG or the POTUS deems undesirable.

 

That's quite the distortion of what anyone else besides you said here.

 

Saying "it happens" isn't the same as saying "it's OK."

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