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Do people actually "feel" like their gender?


Neocaridina

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Janus the Fox

I've sense that I do sense internally a Female Sex in contrast to the Male birth sex.

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On 1/8/2021 at 11:55 PM, Neocaridina said:

I am biologically female, and also identify as female. However, I don't "feel" female. I don't feel a connection to that label. Like when I fill out a survey and they ask about gender I tick the female box because that's what I look like and it's good enough I guess. But I always feel a bit weird about it, like I'm giving people an inaccurate idea of what I really am. When I think about women I don't really think of it as a group that I belong to, at least until I remind myself that I am in fact one of "those people".

And this has been going on basically ever since I hit puberty, sometimes more, sometimes less (I'm 22 now). When I was 12-13 I would feel bad when someone would say that I'm a girl. When I was 13 I got a short haircut and was called a boy once and it felt great. Every now and then I would feel like my female physical characteristics are "wrong" somehow. For a long time I felt uncomfortable in clothing that I deemed "too feminine" (that has changed a bit now). I didn't and don't wear makeup and the thought of doing it seems really "off". I went to an all-girls school from age 11 to 19, and while I didn't mind it too much I always felt a bit out of place and like I was different from everyone else (but I basically didn't know any boys my age during that time, so I didn't know if I would have felt better among them). I could go on. So every now and then I would start questioning my gender, going so far as to identify as non-binary or trans for a short time, but I never really got anywhere. Eventually I would always come to the conclusion that I am a girl, I just feel like I am not a girl because I mostly tend to like more stereotypically masculine things, so I don't fit society's idea of what a girl is. I figured that gender doesn't mean anything, it's just a box to tick and I can be whoever I want to be. I also attributed my feelings to mainly having male role models due to my interests.

But this thing is still in the back of my mind. I often think that if I had had the choice before I was born, I would have preferred to have been born male. If I somehow turned male overnight I would probably not mind it at all, and I might even be somewhat relieved. But I just tell myself that I need to grow up and accept the fact that I am female. I try to get myself to see being female as a positive thing, and as something that I want to be, and it has helped to some extent.

Whenever I read about people's gender identities I often see things like "I feel like I'm xyz" or "my gender can be described as abc". So that implies that for those people, at least, gender isn't just a tick box, they actually strongly identify with it. And I most certainly don't feel that way about being female. So I wonder whether I'm just deluding myself by holding on to the idea that I'm female. Maybe I'm actually non-binary. And I wonder what the point of identifying as non-binary would even be for me. It feels a bit weird to be called "she", but people don't often talk about me in third person while I'm around anyway. It feels a bit weird to have a female body sometimes, but I don't think I would want to transition because I do like my body for what it is, with it's feminine aspects. So yeah, I just don't know what to make of all this. Is it unusual that I don't feel female, that being female just seems like something that I have to deal with?

I have a female body but have no idea what 'feeling' any type of gender would be like! It seems many people feel this way about their gender. The people who seem to have the strongest sense of gender identity are usually transpeople which is very interesting, it's just sad their gender identity doesn't match their birth-assigned sex which causes them a lot of emotional turmoil as they grow older if confined to strict societal gender roles :c 

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On 2/15/2021 at 8:45 PM, QuasiSquirrel said:

The Gender Dysphoria Bible :: That's Gender Dysphoria, FYI

Thanks for sharing, that was very interesting! I can relate to some of it, but that is kind of upsetting to me because it's like I want to want to be female, I just can't quite make it.. still have a lot of work to do with accepting myself I suppose

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pickles the cat
On 1/8/2021 at 10:55 AM, Neocaridina said:

going so far as to identify as non-binary or trans for a short time, but I never really got anywhere. Eventually I would always come to the conclusion that I am a girl

Yeah, i have the exact same thing, i've currently landed on agender for when i'm talking to fellow queer people. 

I still call myself a 'cis woman' a lot of the time though because i don't feel strongly about it and i still present as female. Besides, i don't want to have to explain in depth a concept i barely understand myself whenever i introduce myself

The best way i've come up with to describe it is 'none gender with left woman'  - technically i suppose you would call me a woman but i'm so far from the spirit of womanhood that it wouldn't really make sense

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Neocaridina

I want to share an update about this situation, in case someone can relate and this helps them (should this be a new topic instead? I don't know).

So I kept on trying to basically force myself to "be female", trying to be okay with it, wishing I could just get rid of the desire to be male. All that just made me exhausted and depressed and irritable, but I somehow had this messed-up belief that this suffering was somehow "good" and "honourable" because I have to fit into the binary, right? Like this was just something I had to go through. But at some point I realised that all this was helping no one, I wasn't being the best version of myself because I was so moody and angry all the time, and I was just hurting myself emotionally.

So a few days ago I finally decided that I would keep on publicly identifying as female, because it's easier, but would try to find a word to better describe what I feel like, just for myself. And I think I have always seen myself as being in between male and female. I feel drawn to both, maybe more to the male side than the female side, and varying from time to time, but still pretty much in the middle. "Androgyne" seems to describe that pretty well. So for the last few days I have started to think of myself as androgyne,

and also read more about it, and it just feels so good. Like it's crazy how happy this word makes me. I feel so free. I feel at more at peace with myself than I have for quite some time. I feel like everything makes sense now. I wish I had allowed myself to feel like this earlier, instead of telling myself that everyone feels like me and if I call myself anything other than female that's just me trying to make myself feel special. As I said I did identify as some kind of non-binary for a short while years ago, but I gave it up for that reason and because I figured no one irl would understand it anyway so what's the point.

Of course I could be wrong, it's only been a few days. Maybe I'm not androgyne but something else, like fully male or female or who knows what. And I'm still not entirely sure what gender feels like, this is based on how I see myself internally. Maybe that's the same thing as feeling gender, I don't know. I still have a lot to figure out but I'm just so grateful that I finally found some peace for now. So thanks to everyone who encouraged me to explore my gender identity.

 

Edit: I went back to identifying as female. The reasons for that are complicated and a bit hard to explain, but I stopped identifying as androgyne a few weeks after posting this, and I thought I'd finally edit this for accuracy.

 

Edited by Neocaridina
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  • 2 weeks later...
On 1/8/2021 at 2:55 AM, Neocaridina said:

I am biologically female, and also identify as female. However, I don't "feel" female. I don't feel a connection to that label. Like when I fill out a survey and they ask about gender I tick the female box because that's what I look like and it's good enough I guess. But I always feel a bit weird about it, like I'm giving people an inaccurate idea of what I really am. When I think about women I don't really think of it as a group that I belong to, at least until I remind myself that I am in fact one of "those people".

And this has been going on basically ever since I hit puberty, sometimes more, sometimes less (I'm 22 now). When I was 12-13 I would feel bad when someone would say that I'm a girl. When I was 13 I got a short haircut and was called a boy once and it felt great. Every now and then I would feel like my female physical characteristics are "wrong" somehow. For a long time I felt uncomfortable in clothing that I deemed "too feminine" (that has changed a bit now). I didn't and don't wear makeup and the thought of doing it seems really "off". I went to an all-girls school from age 11 to 19, and while I didn't mind it too much I always felt a bit out of place and like I was different from everyone else (but I basically didn't know any boys my age during that time, so I didn't know if I would have felt better among them). I could go on. So every now and then I would start questioning my gender, going so far as to identify as non-binary or trans for a short time, but I never really got anywhere. Eventually I would always come to the conclusion that I am a girl, I just feel like I am not a girl because I mostly tend to like more stereotypically masculine things, so I don't fit society's idea of what a girl is. I figured that gender doesn't mean anything, it's just a box to tick and I can be whoever I want to be. I also attributed my feelings to mainly having male role models due to my interests.

But this thing is still in the back of my mind. I often think that if I had had the choice before I was born, I would have preferred to have been born male. If I somehow turned male overnight I would probably not mind it at all, and I might even be somewhat relieved. But I just tell myself that I need to grow up and accept the fact that I am female. I try to get myself to see being female as a positive thing, and as something that I want to be, and it has helped to some extent.

Whenever I read about people's gender identities I often see things like "I feel like I'm xyz" or "my gender can be described as abc". So that implies that for those people, at least, gender isn't just a tick box, they actually strongly identify with it. And I most certainly don't feel that way about being female. So I wonder whether I'm just deluding myself by holding on to the idea that I'm female. Maybe I'm actually non-binary. And I wonder what the point of identifying as non-binary would even be for me. It feels a bit weird to be called "she", but people don't often talk about me in third person while I'm around anyway. It feels a bit weird to have a female body sometimes, but I don't think I would want to transition because I do like my body for what it is, with it's feminine aspects. So yeah, I just don't know what to make of all this. Is it unusual that I don't feel female, that being female just seems like something that I have to deal with?

I wouldn't even class my self as human in most cases. I often refer to myself as a "It, creature, Alien, Dog". I so detached from normal human interactions and understanding that I just do not feel it fits. I also have very simple desires in the most cases. If I do something whimsical I am not always looking for attention. I kind of over in my own world being colorful because I felt like it. I do desire admiration but not like I will get it through deceitful means. I might desire company and interactions but it doesn't mean I need freinds 24/7. I might not mind affection and kindness from others but it doesn't mean I want to sleep with every person I wouldn't mind giving a hug too. I like getting involved in community and volunteering since I enjoy helping and I am given a task. I often do kind deeds for other out of moral obligation but somehow its often read as being for ulterior motives. Gender is a concept normal human creatures use. I kind of just don't think I can be classed like them. 

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On 1/8/2021 at 5:55 AM, Neocaridina said:

Is it unusual that I don't feel female, that being female

I am told I have some effeminate behaviors. 

 

I mean my skin care products, to enjoying cooking and baking. I never knew this had a gender attached to it, mind you. 

 

I have cried at a couple movies, which apparently revokes my man card o_O

 

I just never related to most men I was around. 

 

I was into combat sports, but would refuse to hurt a fly kind of deal. 

 

For me it's deeper, as a black male, I was always told I was too white to belong. 

 

To quote one artist I like:

 

"I was too white for the blacks and too black for the whites" 

 

I honestly don't know how to act like a man or black.

 

People would say code of honor things to me which relate to integrity. Not gender. 

 

Sorry, I don't know how to answer your question. 

 

Best decision I made, is stopping to care of what others think of me. I have never looked back, since. 

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QuasiSquirrel
On 3/7/2021 at 10:01 AM, Neocaridina said:

I want to share an update about this situation, in case someone can relate and this helps them (should this be a new topic instead? I don't know).

So I kept on trying to basically force myself to "be female", trying to be okay with it, wishing I could just get rid of the desire to be male. All that just made me exhausted and depressed and irritable, but I somehow had this messed-up belief that this suffering was somehow "good" and "honourable" because I have to fit into the binary, right? Like this was just something I had to go through. But at some point I realised that all this was helping no one, I wasn't being the best version of myself because I was so moody and angry all the time, and I was just hurting myself emotionally.

So a few days ago I finally decided that I would keep on publicly identifying as female, because it's easier, but would try to find a word to better describe what I feel like, just for myself. And I think I have always seen myself as being in between male and female. I feel drawn to both, maybe more to the male side than the female side, and varying from time to time, but still pretty much in the middle. "Androgyne" seems to describe that pretty well. So for the last few days I have started to think of myself as androgyne,

and also read more about it, and it just feels so good. Like it's crazy how happy this word makes me. I feel so free. I feel at more at peace with myself than I have for quite some time. I feel like everything makes sense now. I wish I had allowed myself to feel like this earlier, instead of telling myself that everyone feels like me and if I call myself anything other than female that's just me trying to make myself feel special. As I said I did identify as some kind of non-binary for a short while years ago, but I gave it up for that reason and because I figured no one irl would understand it anyway so what's the point.

Of course I could be wrong, it's only been a few days. Maybe I'm not androgyne but something else, like fully male or female or who knows what. And I'm still not entirely sure what gender feels like, this is based on how I see myself internally. Maybe that's the same thing as feeling gender, I don't know. I still have a lot to figure out but I'm just so grateful that I finally found some peace for now. So thanks to everyone who encouraged me to explore my gender identity.

Oh, I walked down this road, too. Thinking of myself as female just "unshackles" my brain, if that makes sense. Like when I was in male-mode, which is most of my life, it always felt like parts of my brain were locked up, like it was trying to protect me from something. I guess it was trying to protect me from dysphoria. Fact is, being called and perceived as female makes my brain happy. It makes me happy. It's the first time I think I'm actually happy and it doesn't feel performative. I'm scared for my future, but at least now I'm looking forward to one...

 

Also, you can be effeminate and be masculine as the same time (femboys for (cis and trans) males and tomboys for (cis and trans) females). Keep delving, keep researching. :)

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QuasiSquirrel
On 3/18/2021 at 10:30 AM, Perspektiv said:

I am told I have some effeminate behaviors. 

 

I mean my skin care products, to enjoying cooking and baking. I never knew this had a gender attached to it, mind you. 

 

I have cried at a couple movies, which apparently revokes my man card o_O

 

I just never related to most men I was around. 

 

I was into combat sports, but would refuse to hurt a fly kind of deal. 

 

For me it's deeper, as a black male, I was always told I was too white to belong. 

 

To quote one artist I like:

 

"I was too white for the blacks and too black for the whites" 

 

I honestly don't know how to act like a man or black.

 

People would say code of honor things to me which relate to integrity. Not gender. 

 

Sorry, I don't know how to answer your question. 

 

Best decision I made, is stopping to care of what others think of me. I have never looked back, since. 

Way to go, you don't owe stereotyped gender/race performance to anyone!

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I don't really fit the super girly girl stereotype but I'm also not a tomboy either, personally I've never really cared about the gender differences between any of that stuff. I "feel" female as in I have a female body, but I don't feel like I particularly fit in with girls any more than I would with somebody else you know? There certainly are differences between genders, but I feel odd when somebody says "ugh boys blah blah" or "ugh girls blah blah" because its generalizing so many people into a category. A friend of mine became trans a while back, but it didn't feel super odd changing pronouns for him, I realized after a while of becoming friends with somebody I stop thinking about them as a girl or a guy and just think of them as who they are.

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I'm assigned-female-at-birth, but I use "they/them" and describe myself as non-binary (agender, if you really want to get specific about it).  I can't say that I have particularly strong leanings toward either of the Traditional Genders- being seen as female feels viscerally wrong to me, and I'm terrible at most traditionally feminine things, like cooking and emotional literacy.  On the other hand, I'm lucky enough not to have too much dysphoria about my body, and the times I've given passing as male a try have felt like dressing up for a drag show.  So, for me, being agender is more of a "none of the other options on offer really seem to work" thing than a deeply held part of my identity.

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I just do not get what it means at all. What does it even mean to feel like a gender? I go by male because cis-by-default philosophy.

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How does that work anyways lmao. 

 

Do you mean my agab, because no, I don't fully feel like my agab. I prefer to pass as masc-leaning but not full man

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I know you may have your virtual pitchforks and torches ready, but I "feel female" when I care for babies.

Also, when I have my period. 

I also "feel female" when I think about my chromosome syndrome, since it only affects females, I like to think about what it means to be female on a chromosome level sometimes.

 

 

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On 1/8/2021 at 4:07 AM, Guest said:

Nah I don't have a clue what "feeling" female would be like. I'm just a woman because I was born female and have no reason to identify as anything else.

I pretty much agree with this. Sorry I can’t be of more help.

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I'm a cis-woman, but lately I've thought if demiwoman would be more accurate (still sitting on the fence with that...). So here are my thoughts:

I kinda feel like that being cis and not really "feeling" the gender is a bit similar to being in room temperature and not really feeling temperature. The temperature exists, but there's nothing off with it and hence you don't really perceive it.

I think a question that caused me to question if I'm 100% cis was this: "Do I like people perceiving me as a woman?" This was what made me pop question marks. I'm definitely not 100% feminine, for example I don't really like dresses unless it's crazy hot outside. There are situations where I wish people just forgot my gender and just approached me without gender expectations. By this, I don't mean discrimination or blatant stereotypes against women specifically, even if those suck badly. But like, if people would forget my gender and then be like "weird I forgot you're a woman", I wouldn't be feeling anything bad about it. In fact, I would see it as a kind of flattery: it would look like my personality shows brighter than my (assigned?) gender.

Then why I'm not gender-neutral, either? Because I feel okay being addressed as a woman but feel really off when addressed as a man, so here is clearly a woman-leaning.

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For me it's less about feeling like a gender and more how I feel about my own gender. I'm genderfluid and the way I can tell what my gender is at a given time is by evaluating my feelings on what I want to be perceived as and what I want to see myself as. Like does "I am a man/woman" feel like a correct statement or is there some part of me that feels uncomfortable with that? Idk that's how I approach it at least . For me it's less that I feel genderfluid but more so that when I say: I am genderfluid, it feels authentic

 

 

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rainbowocollie
On 9/11/2022 at 5:21 AM, AavaMeri said:

I kinda feel like that being cis and not really "feeling" the gender is a bit similar to being in room temperature and not really feeling temperature. The temperature exists, but there's nothing off with it and hence you don't really perceive it.

I think this is accurate.

For me, I just don't really feel connected to woman-hood. 

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I have no opinion.  I don't think I would have an opinion, even if I was the opposite sex.  It's just not something I think about or have any affinity to.  I don't much care for "girl power" or "girls-only blah blah blah," not because I'm uncomfortable, but I don't see the point?  I don't think about my gender normally as it is, and I'm not going to feel affinity towards other women just because they're same gender as me.  We might not have anything else in common beyond that, after all.

 

I don't begrudge other people who feel they don't fit the gender norm, because it's important to them, and I'm pretty positive there's a biological component to being gender nonconforming anyway.  But for me, gender just isn't something I think about.

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I identify as non-binary but that didn't really change much for me. just made me feel more comfy with myself. I'm afab, and started questioning my gender identity at 16. stuck with "girl" for a long time but hated everything associated with being a girl and never felt like a girl.

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Riotboi81

I have a question that I'm trying to articulate without being confusing or insensitive. Moreover, I want you convey it without being offensive. Is it possible or probable someone can be paid transsexual male to female and one to identify as female without changing anything physically or even wanting to look feminine? Does that make sense? I'm trying to say is it possible for someone assigned male at birth to be a trans female without any desire to change ANYTHING? NO HORMONES, NO FEMININE CLOTHING, MAKE UP ETC...

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I'm a ciswoman, and I don't feel any strong connection to my gender, but there is still no doubt about being a woman. There are some things that are uncomfortable about womanhood (and girlhood) and sometimes I wish I looked more "genderless" (I find small boobs aesthetically pleasing) but I'm still sure that I'm a woman. I just don't even think about it most of the time. It's just what it is.

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Old Maid Librarian
On 4/19/2021 at 3:32 AM, Killua said:

I don't really fit the super girly girl stereotype but I'm also not a tomboy either, personally I've never really cared about the gender differences between any of that stuff. I "feel" female as in I have a female body, but I don't feel like I particularly fit in with girls any more than I would with somebody else you know? There certainly are differences between genders, but I feel odd when somebody says "ugh boys blah blah" or "ugh girls blah blah" because its generalizing so many people into a category. A friend of mine became trans a while back, but it didn't feel super odd changing pronouns for him, I realized after a while of becoming friends with somebody I stop thinking about them as a girl or a guy and just think of them as who they are.

I'm pretty much the same, I don't know how one "feels like a woman" and think it may be different for everyone. The main times I have "felt like a woman" are when the "wonderful thing that happens every month" was happening (fortunately no longer possible), trying to find a bra that fits, and being scared walking alone in a dark place or dealing with an overly aggressive man.  Those issues aren't limited to cis women, but are the ones that make me most aware of my gender.

 

I've always had both female and male friends, and have a lot of interests in common with both. The main problem with either being how obsessed they are with sex because I prefer not to get into discussions where I have to out myself as aro-ace and then try to explain it to casual acquaintances at a party or at work.

 

 

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Well, I like to keep seperate the concepts of sex and gender. I do recognise myself as female, because that's what my body is. I neither like nor dislike my sex. I'm just neutral about it. It is what it is. Feeling female?  That's a tricky thing to describe.


Feeling like a woman (whatever that really is)??  I'm not as confident about that. The word can feel somewhat ill-fitting to me but then again I still sometimes refer to myself as a woman. Then other times, I would rather be known as and seen as something genderless; without having the ties to either binary gender or sex. 


@Riotboi81 That is a question with several possible answers, and I believe  links to the old debate of "do you need dysphoria to be trans?"   Some people say yes, others say no. 
Your question is very complex and probably comes down to the individual with those feelings and experiences.

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I would say that I "feel" female but sometimes I like to feel androgynous. 

 

There are times where my identity as a woman feels too...exposed or emphasized which I don't like. I work in a male dominated trade, so being seen as a woman first and a tradesperson second can be irritating, but this feeling isn't related to my personal identity. I've mentioned before that I've been mistook for a teenage boy in my work clothes and mask and I am fine with that. Despite being mistook for a boy, I feel like my gender is just understated and unimportant. 

 

So I am a woman and feel female but sometimes I want that to just take a back seat so people see me for the skills I develop first rather than my gender.

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nickolekuebler
On 1/8/2021 at 5:44 AM, QuasiSquirrel said:

I'm very much like you in how I perceive my assigned sex (male), the masculine aspects of my body can actually trigger episodes of dysphoria for me, tho. I always (until recently) identified as male because I was always told by others that men have penises. And that's it. That was the only thing that made me a male. I don't even like the thing and would often wish it was gone 😖If I reincarnated I would also press the opposite gender button without thinking about it. Life always felt a bit fake, as well...

These are some articles about gender dysphoria and most of them hit very close to home for me (these are from the perspective of a transfemme person):

Twitter thread

Gender Dysphoria Isn’t What You Think | by Cassie LaBelle | Medium

 

Maybe do a week or two long trial run of people calling you he/him or they/them, see how you feel about it?

I read this article right now and I literally started to cry. I do relate to so much of this, I did join the military but not entirely as a way to embrace or be seen as more masculine cause even then that did not bother me much. I joined so that I would be able to go back to school after training. before I joined I went to an art college, I was surrounded by so many other queer people that I never felt like I needed to do anything to prove who I was. I do remember a story though from being in class with an old friend, he showed me a picture of a nice fully restored Chevelle and my immediate response was that it was a nice car. I thought nothing of the girl in a bikini sitting on the hood, to which he just said yup you are gay. I did not feel like this was an insult or anything else like that as the way he said it was more so matter of fact than anything else. at the time I identified as bisexual, I still did not know anything about asexuality. I never really thought much about being gay once I got out of high school and into college. when I was in high school I would have likely been killed if I had come out but in college it was just totally cool.

 

I just felt like though there is so much truth to this story. I knew at 5 years old that I wanted to be a girl and that I felt like I was born in the wrong body. I knew though that I could never tell anyone. I was scared to be who I was, I was even more scared that the people around me would figure out who I really was. I remember being in the military and always feeling so alone and so different from everyone else and scared that they might one day figure out how I felt inside. I found out now though after getting out and finally accepting who I am that their reaction to me coming out was not so much shock as it was them saying its about time. I never really thought about it back then but a lot of the things that I was interested in were more masculine, but what gave me away was my extremely feminine mannerisms. I always did have a tendency to talk with my hands and to sit cross legged,  I would pull my pants up to my waist and never would let them sag at all or show my underwear, I would also always get dressed in a stall and not with everyone else in the locker room. 

 

I just find it funny and refreshing that though my story is so different I can see so many of the similarities. 

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I think that the most important thing in life  is to feel like a human. What does it mean to be a human? I think to be a human is to have ability for love, compassion, suffering. For trans people transition deepen their humanity, their ability for love, compassion. Also keep in mind that people don't live in biological reality because we are not plants or simple animals. We live in cultural reality, and this reality is based on symbols and language (system of symbols), so in order to be happy we need the best path in this symbolic reality. And gender is important part of such reality. System of symbols related to gender is real and it deeply rooted in any culture. And for some people it is better for them to reconstruct their  identity ( the concept of "I am...") in particular symbolic and cultural fashion, some social groups can even create new symbols. And such identity will deepen their humanity, allow them to be better humans who value humanity, complexity and diversity.  I am trans woman, and it is part of my deep reality and sense of self, it is part of my experience of being human. 

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