I feel like a huge piece of shit (HRT)

[vmdraco]

I guess this is more of a vent rather than an advice thread than anything else.  I've been on testosterone for 6 months now, .25 ml.  It's honestly been really fantastic for me mental health wise, as well as physically.  I feel like a human being who can function for the first time, and I feel more at peace after over a decade of wondering what the fuck was wrong with me.  Yet simultaneously, it gets complicated, especially now.  My voice is noticeably deeper (I finally sound like a man! ), and my face looks more masculine and I'm developing some facial hair, and all of that is great but... I'm starting to not feel very well mentally.  I don't know if it's the time of year, but I'm noticing more erratic moods, especially at night.  Since starting in May I've been calmer and even tempered, and thankfully not crying all the time like I was prior to starting HRT, but I'm noticing I'm slipping back into self-deprecation and depression again; I would tear up instead of all out crying, and would instead just feel frustration and rage.  In one sitting I could range from amusement at a video, to feeling sad and sleepy, and then angry, because my own mind gets away from me.  I feel like I've been doing it more often, when before I was probably the most stable I've been in a decade.

 

I know I've not really been on AVEN, and when I am after long breaks, I'm just... an asshole.  Or I feel like I've been meaner or quicker to anger and as a result I just get snarky, sarcastic, and defensive.  I'm scared I hurt people when I do this, or have already done so.  I think about it too much and it's ruining me.  That's a thing too, my anxiety has come back somewhat as well, where I overthink and internalize my thoughts too much.  I've thankfully kept it in check around my family by going in my room, but as a result I have no outlet.  It's just been a really weird time for me where I'm going through a second puberty and yet I'm in my mid 20's and expected to be a fully functioning adult.  Everything's a bit overwhelming. 

 

Is this like... normal?  Have any trans guys on T here have similar periods of time on hormones where it just feels really... weird like this?  I didn't do a good job explaining it but It feels very lonely and isolating.  I know I don't feel good now, and it's been like this for several weeks in a row on and off.  I'm wondering if it's dosage, too? 

Thank you for reading.  I'm sorry.

[Snao Cone]

I don't have any experience from an HRT perspective, but...this is a difficult year to go through any major change in life, and winter is a difficult season for mood stability even without significant world events and/or life changes. It piles up. I've heard from other transmascs that the testosterone can build up frustration that would've manifested differently before HRT. I don't know what the solution might be, whether it's dosage or growing pains or just this dumpster fire year, but it's great that you're reflecting on this and I hope you find some answers that help you along the way from people who have been through it. You got this, dude.

[Guest]

Sends viritual hugs.   Do not worry about  changes.  I think we all face them in one way or another. I hope that you find your place( in this aven  world) .    Do not overthink  things. MR. 

[vmdraco]

4 minutes ago, Snaovember Rain said:

I've heard from other transmascs that the testosterone can build up frustration that would've manifested differently before HRT.

That's a good way to describe it, honestly.  It feels like all the shit that I put up with before is easier to express.  Though honestly that doesn't make it healthy.

[Fraggle Underdark]

I'm not trans and I want to be clear I'm not trying to speak as if I have experience there. I did read a really interesting short interview collection of trans guys and a few of them found that they were less patient, and their personalities changed in other ways too, but I doubt that's news to you.

 

What I can speak to is just being a guy. And I don't know how much is normal so maybe there is some kind of dosage thing but it sounds very plausible that the issue is just not being used to having the hormone balance of your gender. But yeah dude it can be tough  Personally I get pissed pretty frequently, especially at the recent coup attempt, but even at small stuff sometimes. I often get frustrated and angry at problems, like maybe something is just taking longer than I want it to. Of course there's nothing wrong with being angry, it's an emotion like any other, it doesn't even have to involve suffering in the Buddhist sense. It's just what you do with it that matters. For me I direct it at general problems, as in "fuck this, I do not like how this situation is going. Okay, what's the problem? What don't I like, and why? How can I make this more like I want it?" Something I like about anger is that it's a fairly active emotion that can be harnessed to address what's bothering you, if you can go meta enough. Feeling pissed about not knowing what's pissing you off? You can use that anger at your confusion to focus your mind and work through ideas about what it might be, etc. 

 

As I said I'm not experienced with ftm transition so I don't know how much is normal but from what I understand trans guys generally have an emotional distribution like cis guys. And I don't see that working with a stereotypical female personality (though I don't know what your personality was like before transitioning, and not to say you were female then, etc). I'd imagine people would expect you to respond to things like you used to, and if your emotional distribution is different then that's not what's going to be authentic or natural for you now, which I would find very frustrating. 

 

Like you said it's a second puberty and it sounds like you're entirely aware of that, but as someone who's already gone through male puberty (albeit at the typical time) it makes absolute sense to me that it would take time to work through all that. It takes every guy time to work through all that! Remember how much leeway people often give guys as they go through puberty, and try to give yourself that too. You seem like a considerate person and I doubt you'll step on toes too bad, and there's always apologies! Just a "hey, seriously my bad, I fucked that up, I'm working on that". And that's something that doesn't need to be self-deprecating because mistakes are human. To own up to them with integrity is real sign of character, not something that lowers the speaker. 

 

This was kind of rambling and I hope I didn't overstep, just wanted to give some insights as someone who's already gone through male puberty and some of the tools I use to handle anger, etc. I expect that you're logically aware of all or most of what I said here but might not be as familiar with what it feels like to slot those perspectives into a mind with a lot of testosterone. I expect that different angles will resonate now, as it were.

[vmdraco]

7 minutes ago, fragglesinthedark said:

it sounds very plausible that the issue is just not being used to having the hormone balance of your gender.

I'd say that's reasonable.  I feel much better but just not really used to how I react to situations.  Normally if I were angry, it wouldn't translate into well... anger, I would just feel frustrated and cry, or feel sad instead.  I feel if someone pushed me far enough, I'd be yelling instead of backing away and cowering.  Like I'm much more willing to be assertive now than I was prior to hrt.  Then again, the opportunity hasn't come yet lol  I blame part of it on a new sense of confidence in finally appearing how I imagined myself to be, and saying how I really feel.  I'd say that was a good thing, but even through the internet I've noticed my shorter fuse.  I'm thankful I've not had it with my family yet.

 

13 minutes ago, fragglesinthedark said:

As I said I'm not experienced with ftm transition so I don't know how much is normal but from what I understand trans guys generally have an emotional distribution like cis guys. And I don't see that working with a stereotypical female personality (though I don't know what your personality was like before transitioning, and not to say you were female then, etc). I'd imagine people would expect you to respond to things like you used to, and if your emotional distribution is different then that's not what's going to be authentic or natural for you now, which I would find very frustrating. 

Prior to hormone therapy I was prone to cry a lot, and thankfully that's gone.  My personality hasn't really changed, but it's come out in different (good) ways that I don't think I've felt since before puberty.  It's very hard to describe.  I'm still sensitive in an emotionally intelligent way, in what I hope to think is down to earth; I still am gentle, and try to be kind and open-minded.  I've never been a very macho kind of guy.  I guess it's just a matter of me not willing to put up with bullshit as easily, or let it roll over me like it did before.  It is, indeed, extremely frustrating to not predict how I react to things unless they happen.  In the adult world it is extremely inconvenient to be going through puberty lol 

 

If you don't mind me asking, what do you mean by having an emotional distribution like a cisgender man?  I do appreciate it from someone who grew up male, because god knows I wish that happened to me to save me all this trouble 😅

 

25 minutes ago, fragglesinthedark said:

Remember how much leeway people often give guys as they go through puberty, and try to give yourself that too. You seem like a considerate person and I doubt you'll step on toes too bad, and there's always apologies! Just a "hey, seriously my bad, I fucked that up, I'm working on that". And that's something that doesn't need to be self-deprecating because mistakes are human. To own up to them with integrity is real sign of character, not something that lowers the speaker. 

You're right in that.  I've truly, honest to god, been a lot better overall with my ability to manage my emotions since receiving care, including my ability to accept mistakes and work through self-deprecation.  This thread contradicts it somewhat, but I've been having a bunch of low points these past few weeks.  I know I've genuinely apologized to those I think I've hurt, because I'm not afraid to admit my mistakes in the open.  I just wish there was a way to just... control how angry I get and not let it get to me to a point where I lash out.  I know my father is similar, and I don't think he thinks through his anger the way you have described lol it's just reaction only.  So he is clearly the template  

[Fraggle Underdark]

6 minutes ago, vmdraco said:

I've never been a very macho kind of guy.  I guess it's just a matter of me not willing to put up with bullshit as easily, or let it roll over me like it did before.

Yeah I'm that way too. I don't like to pound my chest or throw my weight around, I much prefer Jimmy Stewart to say, Burt Reynolds. But if someone is trying to push me (or others) around unjustly then fuck that.

 

11 minutes ago, vmdraco said:

It is, indeed, extremely frustrating to not predict how I react to things unless they happen.  In the adult world it is extremely inconvenient to be going through puberty lol 

Yeah that's wild!

 

11 minutes ago, vmdraco said:

If you don't mind me asking, what do you mean by having an emotional distribution like a cisgender man?  I do appreciate it from someone who grew up male, because god knows I wish that happened to me to save me all this trouble 😅

It's hard to describe the way I'd like, but I mean both the distribution of emotions in one guy (like the frequency and range of different emotions) and then also the distribution across the population of individual guys. As in obviously there are guys who are gentle, women who are harsh, guys who are diffident, women who are strong, etc, but the general pattern of how guys tend statistically to be more aggressive, assertive, less affected by others' emotions (for good and bad), etc. 

 

But that if you plotted like a bell curve of personality of cis guys, and a bell curve of personality of trans guys, my take so far is that it's basically the same bell curve. Maybe a little more sensitive since most guys haven't grown up with society treating them as women, and that shows you a different side of society, etc? But in terms of the hormonal foundation of emotions trans guys' emotions seem to be to be just like cis guys' emotions.

 

Kind of abstract and hard to express, did that make sense?

 

21 minutes ago, vmdraco said:

I just wish there was a way to just... control how angry I get and not let it get to me to a point where I lash out.  I know my father is similar

I didn't know this when I was growing up but my dad would sometimes get really angry internally and was likewise scared about lashing out. So he got this little book of daily meditations for men or something like that, and he had a practice of getting up early every morning to read or reflect, things like that. I knew he had that habit but it was only when I was an adult that he mentioned in conversation why he started doing that. Not trying to have a dad competition here  just thought I'd share another approach I've heard of for managing anger.

[Fraggle Underdark]

There was this particularly funny anecdote from that interview collection I mentioned, where a guy was saying how he was less patient after transitioning. He was driving with a female friend and wanted to know if her sister was planning to attend a party. She started talking about a conversation with her sister, and then some stories that had come up with her sister, and after 10 minutes he snapped "Is your sister coming or not??" and his friend was surprised because he used to be willing to wait for the answer until a long winding story was done. His friend kind of joked "you used to be such a good listener".

 

It's funny how transitioning, in both directions, is such a clear example of how hormones etc influence our moods. It doesn't make any sense to ask or expect everyone to respond to things the same way, as if the inside of each person's brain feels like the inside of every other person's brain. Obviously this is known to you but I just find that really interesting.

 

Incidentally I'm technically agender, in that I don't care about my gender per se and if I was in a female body I think I'd be like "huh okay, society will make things harder now but whatever". But I think that if I switched to a lot more estrogen and/or less testosterone that would feel really weird, like a piece of myself had been taken away. The "fire" of having a testosterone-leaning hormone balance feels like a core part of me that I really appreciate.

[Missing]

I’m a trans woman, so I can’t speak to the experience of transitioning onto testosterone, but speaking as someone who’s had two puberties, I was definitely unusually moody at first both times, but both times it leveled out and found a good balance after a while. During my testosterone puberty in adolescence, I definitely felt more aggressive and easier to anger until my body got used to it, while with the estrogen one I mostly ate a lot of chocolate and cried all the time until my body got used to it and now I just eat some chocolate and cry some of the time. 

 

Six months was a pretty tough point for me, it can take a while for your body to adjust to a whole new hormone balance. You will probably continue to find yourself having significantly more aggression and anger than you’re currently used to, but you will get used to it. And especially given the awareness you have of your responses and things, I would be surprised if you don’t find what works for you and end up feeling much more comfortable with it all.

 

Transitioning is an exciting yet tumultuous experience. It’s closing in on 6 years after hormones for me, and I can hardly remember how I felt before. There will be a point when it’ll no longer feel new and strange for you, you’ll just feel like you.

[Emery.]

I’m not sure what to say. I feel ya man  All of this sounds familiar and idk, I’m not on T but I have always been like that and you get used to it. I mean, nothing abnormal about any of it. It’s good that you recognise the anger as bad mood and don’t blame yourself that you’re just being mean. I had to put up with a lot of critique for not expressing bad mood as crying and outward sadness. Also, it doesn’t mean you’re insensitive. 

 

One thing I would suggest that you find some outlet. Sport works very well for me. It doesn’t have to be power lifting, you can go for a bike ride. For me that’s martial arts and occasional bike and swimming. 

 

As for lashing out, having an outlet helps me a lot, the remaining time, well, you just have to hold on tight. That might be another aspect with which martial arts are helpful, you exercise being provoked over and over and after some time you grow resilience - and at the same time the ability to use the rage in a controlled way when needed, because some situations require you to act in a more aggressive manner (but losing control isn’t going to benefit you). I think the more aggressive sports in general teach you that. But I guess to learn to have a hold on it without the sports too, it might just take longer. So... There isn’t a way to be less angry. But you don’t have to act on it. 

 

1 hour ago, fragglesinthedark said:

"Is your sister coming or not??"

It would have been my question after 1 minute of talking, lol. I want to know where I’m driving. 

 

1 hour ago, fragglesinthedark said:

But I think that if I switched to a lot more estrogen and/or less testosterone that would feel really weird, like a piece of myself had been taken away. The "fire" of having a testosterone-leaning hormone balance feels like a core part of me that I really appreciate.

Same. 

[vmdraco]

10 hours ago, fragglesinthedark said:

It's hard to describe the way I'd like, but I mean both the distribution of emotions in one guy (like the frequency and range of different emotions) and then also the distribution across the population of individual guys. As in obviously there are guys who are gentle, women who are harsh, guys who are diffident, women who are strong, etc, but the general pattern of how guys tend statistically to be more aggressive, assertive, less affected by others' emotions (for good and bad), etc. 

 

But that if you plotted like a bell curve of personality of cis guys, and a bell curve of personality of trans guys, my take so far is that it's basically the same bell curve. Maybe a little more sensitive since most guys haven't grown up with society treating them as women, and that shows you a different side of society, etc? But in terms of the hormonal foundation of emotions trans guys' emotions seem to be to be just like cis guys' emotions.

 

Kind of abstract and hard to express, did that make sense?

It does make sense It's hard to explain so I get that.  I agree with the idea that guys tend to be more aggressive and less affected by emotions, and it's interesting to experience that firsthand rather than secondarily.  Normally I would scoff at my friends or family who are male who seemed almost unresponsive to things I found upsetting pre-hrt.  I got to experience both worlds of the two recognized genders in society, which is a crazy concept now that I think about it. 

 

I think you're right on the money about trans men being more emotionally sensitive overall, because we were raised as women.  One thing I appreciate about growing up as a woman is that I'm much more in tune to what others need, and have had the privileges of having a social network of people to turn to that is usually found in female social dynamics.  I value my gentleness and emotional intelligence, which is something that society doesn't really value in manhood very often.

 

10 hours ago, fragglesinthedark said:

I didn't know this when I was growing up but my dad would sometimes get really angry internally and was likewise scared about lashing out. So he got this little book of daily meditations for men or something like that, and he had a practice of getting up early every morning to read or reflect, things like that. I knew he had that habit but it was only when I was an adult that he mentioned in conversation why he started doing that. Not trying to have a dad competition here  just thought I'd share another approach I've heard of for managing anger.

I wish that when I offered similar advice, my dad would take it   I've offered meditation apps, tea, hell even said that if it's a huge issue go to therapy like I do.  Doesn't budge.  It's great that your dad took the time to reflect.  My dad isn't like a massive rage machine or anything, he just ends up blowing a gasket when he's angry about small things or when he just has a bad day and brings it home, to which my mother would just roll her eyes and tell him to go play outside lmfao 

 

10 hours ago, fragglesinthedark said:

There was this particularly funny anecdote from that interview collection I mentioned, where a guy was saying how he was less patient after transitioning. He was driving with a female friend and wanted to know if her sister was planning to attend a party. She started talking about a conversation with her sister, and then some stories that had come up with her sister, and after 10 minutes he snapped "Is your sister coming or not??" and his friend was surprised because he used to be willing to wait for the answer until a long winding story was done. His friend kind of joked "you used to be such a good listener".

Oh relatable!  That happened to me just this morning!  My mom and sister needed help carrying something and needed a third person, and I was playing a game at the time.  I was pretty annoyed because I have work in the afternoon (second shift) and just wanted to relax and not think, but I got up to help.  I got outside and my mom, who has back and hip issues, wants help carrying a damn FRIDGE to the garage, up stairs.  Instead of just asking what was needed I blurted out, "you couldn't have waited until dad got home?".  Cue the hurt look on my mom's face and I was like "oh fuck oh god I'm a bad person"  😂  I explained the reasons above, that her needing help carrying something really heavy wasn't a good idea, but well, she's stubborn like that and insisted lol  I would normally just be inwardly annoyed.  It's not the same as having a convo but it was a similar circumstance of being impatient.  I just wanted to go back and not think with a mindless game and I let it effect me 😕

 

9 hours ago, Mackenzie Holiday said:

During my testosterone puberty in adolescence, I definitely felt more aggressive and easier to anger until my body got used to it, while with the estrogen one I mostly ate a lot of chocolate and cried all the time until my body got used to it and now I just eat some chocolate and cry some of the time. 

Oh GOD it's wild that I can relate to both of these 😂  I'm honestly thankful I'm not a sobbing mess, that shit is exhausting.  Do you remember at all when it eventually evened out?  I get it was an amab puberty so it could have taken many years, so my situation might be a little different.  Trans men basically experience male puberty at hyper speed compared to what it is normally.

 

8 hours ago, Emery. said:

One thing I would suggest that you find some outlet. Sport works very well for me. It doesn’t have to be power lifting, you can go for a bike ride. For me that’s martial arts and occasional bike and swimming. 

I've stated I had no outlet but I guess that's technically not true.  I like to go jogging at night (my childhood of men catcalling me out their cars have made me avoid daylight for exercise), which gets my energy out, and in my free time I love to play building/creative games like Terraria and RPGS.  I'm an artist but my ability to draw as of late has been heavily stunted by the turbulence of my second puberty and, tbh, the exhaustion of this pandemic and overall mental health.  Art is something I take a lot of pride and joy in, but this past year has been soooo lacking.  I overthink everything, including my own art, so the outlet I usually have is nonexistent.  The only time I managed to draw was when I was with another artist friend and I was high 😂😂😂

 

[Emery.]

45 minutes ago, vmdraco said:

Normally I would scoff at my friends or family who are male who seemed almost unresponsive to things I found upsetting pre-hrt

 

 

45 minutes ago, vmdraco said:

wants help carrying a damn FRIDGE to the garage, up stairs.  Instead of just asking what was needed I blurted out, "you couldn't have waited until dad got home?".  Cue the hurt look on my mom's face and I was like "oh fuck oh god I'm a bad person"  😂 

Welcome to being a choleric  

 

ummm I got both puberties at once, lol. 

 

Agreed, transgender men are taught emotional intelligence more than cisgender guys. I mean, I’m not sure how this affects me personally, but it seems like it. 

[Karst]

Emotions are more biological than people tend to think.  I always get a little messed up in winter, because the light levels are so low.

[anisotrophic]

Hey @vmdraco – I've been on T since last summer; I can't tell your dose (is there a typo?) but I've been on 60 mg/week (intramuscular) & my blood levels are mid-high cismale (higher than my cismale spouse, woot ).

 

17 hours ago, vmdraco said:

I would tear up instead of all out crying, and would instead just feel frustration and rage

One thing I noticed almost immediately was the loss of crying. I had a lot of moments where I'd sit and stare frustrated into space and know I would have cried, and just couldn't.

 

I think the effects of this (on crying) alone might be broad... sometimes subtle or unconscious, sometimes a consequence of how things play out in interactions with others. My (gender) therapist recommended I pay attention to when I'm angry and understand where it's coming from – from being hurt, or shame, or what – and focus on that, try to communicate it. (But sometimes that falls flat on its face when someone doesn't take it seriously; sometimes when distressed I wondered if people just don't care about me as much if they can't see me cry.)

Over time, it feels less dramatic... it's possible that I've been learning the emotional state I need to experience it, helping myself get there (e.g. one cisguy suggested music to me). Or maybe my body gets used to the changed state, as @Mackenzie Holiday described.

 

4 hours ago, vmdraco said:

I think you're right on the money about trans men being more emotionally sensitive overall, because we were raised as women.  One thing I appreciate about growing up as a woman is that I'm much more in tune to what others need, and have had the privileges of having a social network of people to turn to that is usually found in female social dynamics.  I value my gentleness and emotional intelligence, which is something that society doesn't really value in manhood very often.

This is purely my personal experience, but one of the other first emotional changes I noticed was hard to pinpoint: it was like I was less reflexively focused on what others were thinking/feeling. At the time I connected that behavior (e.g. worrying about someone) to love, and wondered if I couldn't love people anymore. (I mean, I was self aware that this was overly dramatic, and my husband laughed kindly and assured me that I hadn't turned into an asshole. But, it was disconcerting.)

So I thought a lot about that, and the whole topic of "empathy" has been one I've tried to learn a bit about. There's "cognitive empathy" and "emotional empathy" (or affective empathy), and without T I feel like I was much more sucked into emotional empathy – whether I wanted to or not, for better or for worse – and I think it can be "worse" when it leads to obsessive introspection/thinking about my interactions or relationships with others.

But I think I had a habit of empathy so ingrained in my behavior, I kept doing "empathy" things without that reflexive impulse driving it. And maybe it's more of a habitual "cognitive empathy" now, but cognitive empathy has its own rewards & so it's not hard to continue to maintain empathic behavior.

I wonder a lot about these things because before HRT I would've dismissed crying and empathy as socially constructed norms – that men repressed tears, that women were taught to be empathic. Now I wonder about whether there are real differences that we could, for example, help guide boys through – undermined if people are taught "it's all socialization" – to be aware that they may find crying harder (it's not just that someone told them "be tough") & how to better navigate emotionally with that context, to teach that empathy might not be "instinctive" but it's something they can learn to do (and that it's rewarding to do so).

It's really interesting to experience puberty in adulthood. As a parent, a lot of my introspection may also be "taking notes for future reference".  

PS to add – on the whole I'm unconvinced that one hormonal state is "better" than another, especially for myself (still happily NB at this point!), and I think it's likely that one state is better for some people and the other is better for others.

[Karst]

2 minutes ago, anisotrophic said:

I wonder a lot about these things because before HRT I would've dismissed crying and empathy as socially constructed norms – that men repressed tears, that women were taught to be empathic. Now I wonder about whether there are real differences that we could, for example, help guide boys through – undermined if people are taught "it's all socialization" – to be aware that they may find crying harder (it's not just that someone told them "be tough") & how to better navigate emotionally with that context, to teach that empathy might not be "instinctive" but it's something they can learn to do (and that it's rewarding to do so).

It's really interesting to experience puberty in adulthood. As a parent, a lot of my introspection may also be "taking notes for future reference".  

There should really be more scientific research about gender transition- knowing more about how hormones affect the brain would help cis people, too.

[vmdraco]

3 hours ago, anisotrophic said:

I can't tell your dose (is there a typo?) but I've been on 60 mg/week (intramuscular) & my blood levels are mid-high cismale

 lmao my bad I put .25 MILLIGRAMS instead of MILLILITERS 😂 no wonder you're confused.

 

I'm on 0.25 mls through subcutaneous injection per week.  I started off lower at 0.1 because I was nervous, so now it's more than doubled since then.  I still have to go in and get my blood drawn so they could find out where I am hormone wise.

 

3 hours ago, anisotrophic said:

one of the other first emotional changes I noticed was hard to pinpoint: it was like I was less reflexively focused on what others were thinking/feeling.

This.  It's very difficult to fully explain, but it was difficult to have emotional responses the same way I used to.  As stated, crying was harder, and how I compartmentalized my emotions was more straight forward rather than immediately feeling weepy.  Disconnected maybe?  You're still present and acknowledging the emotions but they don't feel... there there.  Like you can control them more, at least in regards to crying, but because of that you're left wondering how you get them out once it gets overwhelming. 

 

I know I almost lost it when I came home today from work, and everyone was trying to talk to me while I was putting groceries away, and I was very close to screaming at them to leave me alone because of my lack of patience.  Normally I would just bottle it up and just get it done, but I found it harder to hold back how pissed off it was making me.

 

3 hours ago, anisotrophic said:

I wonder a lot about these things because before HRT I would've dismissed crying and empathy as socially constructed norms – that men repressed tears, that women were taught to be empathic. Now I wonder about whether there are real differences that we could, for example, help guide boys through – undermined if people are taught "it's all socialization" – to be aware that they may find crying harder (it's not just that someone told them "be tough") & how to better navigate emotionally with that context, to teach that empathy might not be "instinctive" but it's something they can learn to do (and that it's rewarding to do so).

It definitely brings up interesting questions there.  I assumed men repressed them, too, but like you I understand now that part of it is just hormones and how they play a part in crying.  Apparently there is a hormone (prolactin) that is higher in afab bodies for the specific purpose of growing female secondary sex characteristics and for breast feeding, hence why they cry more.  I feel like boys being taught to be tough or man up can lead to a lot of complicated social consequences for them, in ways that lead them to not be introspective about others.  I find that because of this it's harder to really navigate your emotions when you have this anger and it's encouraged by male gender roles.  I often wonder how I would turn out if I were born a man and were brought up in similar environments.

[Guest]

Do you consume caffeine at all? Because caffeine largely contributes to people acting crazy and aggressive. I mean, I acknowledge that to some extent it's the testosterone but if you're drinking coffee or energy drinks then that's just going to make things worse.

[vmdraco]

Just now, Moon Spirit ☽ said:

Do you consume caffeine at all? Because caffeine largely contributes to people acting crazy and aggressive. I mean, I acknowledge that to some extent it's the testosterone but if you're drinking coffee or energy drinks then that's just going to make things worse.

I drink coffee every morning?  I... wasn't aware caffeine can make someone angry.  I mean I know I'm pretty cranky without it when I wake up lol

[Guest]

@vmdraco Yeah, I've noticed caffeine winds a lot of people up and that's going to worsen anger and stress/anxiety. Not everyone seems to be affected by it but you have to be a really chill person to not be, and some people are more sensitive to it than others. Just drinking a cup of black tea makes me feel pretty edgy.

[Calligraphette_Coe]

20 hours ago, vmdraco said:

I guess this is more of a vent rather than an advice thread than anything else.  I've been on testosterone for 6 months now, .25 ml.  It's honestly been really fantastic for me mental health wise, as well as physically.  I feel like a human being who can function for the first time, and I feel more at peace after over a decade of wondering what the fuck was wrong with me.  Yet simultaneously, it gets complicated, especially now.  My voice is noticeably deeper (I finally sound like a man! ), and my face looks more masculine and I'm developing some facial hair, and all of that is great but... I'm starting to not feel very well mentally.  I don't know if it's the time of year, but I'm noticing more erratic moods, especially at night.  Since starting in May I've been calmer and even tempered, and thankfully not crying all the time like I was prior to starting HRT, but I'm noticing I'm slipping back into self-deprecation and depression again; I would tear up instead of all out crying, and would instead just feel frustration and rage.  In one sitting I could range from amusement at a video, to feeling sad and sleepy, and then angry, because my own mind gets away from me.  I feel like I've been doing it more often, when before I was probably the most stable I've been in a decade.

 

I know I've not really been on AVEN, and when I am after long breaks, I'm just... an asshole.  Or I feel like I've been meaner or quicker to anger and as a result I just get snarky, sarcastic, and defensive.  I'm scared I hurt people when I do this, or have already done so.  I think about it too much and it's ruining me.  That's a thing too, my anxiety has come back somewhat as well, where I overthink and internalize my thoughts too much.  I've thankfully kept it in check around my family by going in my room, but as a result I have no outlet.  It's just been a really weird time for me where I'm going through a second puberty and yet I'm in my mid 20's and expected to be a fully functioning adult.  Everything's a bit overwhelming. 

 

Is this like... normal?  Have any trans guys on T here have similar periods of time on hormones where it just feels really... weird like this?  I didn't do a good job explaining it but It feels very lonely and isolating.  I know I don't feel good now, and it's been like this for several weeks in a row on and off.  I'm wondering if it's dosage, too? 

Thank you for reading.  I'm sorry.

You might find this article from Mary Lou Jepsen interesting. She had a pituitary tumor that required her to take a blend of hormones to stay healthy and what she went through until she got them fine tuned.

 

https://www.nytimes.com/2013/11/24/opinion/sunday/bringing-back-my-real-self-with-hormones.html

[vmdraco]

20 minutes ago, Calligraphette_Coe said:

You might find this article from Mary Lou Jepsen interesting. She had a pituitary tumor that required her to take a blend of hormones to stay healthy and what she went through until she got them fine tuned.

 

https://www.nytimes.com/2013/11/24/opinion/sunday/bringing-back-my-real-self-with-hormones.html

Wow that's legit crazy what she went through :0  Glad she's healthy tho.

[Karst]

2 hours ago, Moon Spirit ☽ said:

Do you consume caffeine at all? Because caffeine largely contributes to people acting crazy and aggressive. I mean, I acknowledge that to some extent it's the testosterone but if you're drinking coffee or energy drinks then that's just going to make things worse.

I gave up caffeine a few years back.  It helped me stay alert first thing in the morning, but it just wasn't worth how it made me on edge all the time and gave me sleep issues.

[Guest]

@Karst I have insomnia and it can be difficult to fall asleep and sometimes I don't until 1, 2 or 3 in the morning but in college I'd drink coffee and be awake for 2-3 days straight.