Ya Hate Murderers or the Mentally ill?

[WoodwindWhistler]

First off. 

Foster kids

And those living in poverty 

Have higher rates of mental illness. The numbers don’t lie. 

As well, those who are in school bullied.

If a flower is not given proper nutrition in its soil,

Does it not wilt, or at the very least not thrive,

as well as its nourished counterpart would? 

And then the reaction is to say,

Well, they were just born that way. 

It’s in their brain. 

WTF???? It’s like hobbling and man 

And then telling him he was crippled from birth. 

“Correlation does not equal causation”?

Screw that. For our social species, plastic and adaptive neural net, which is really the weaker theory, here?? 

We already know disadvantaged races

Start behind the pack,

in terms of education

Society has the sadism

to too impose this mental handicap

AND then call them crazy

I mean, how much SALT do you need to PACK in that wound

Until it’s enough for you?

And then, against all numbers, against all odds,

some can come out clear-eyed

And avoid the trap of bitterness at Fate

And/or anger and prejudice against the white

Who so obviously do not understand 

the FIRST thing about what they have experienced.

 

EVERYONE IS BLAMING NATURE, GENES. IGNORING NURTURE. 

 

The funny thing about psychotic breaks? 

Everyone pictures this crazy-eyed, 

foam at the mouth hype

where someone grabs the nearest knife.

Figures, even THAT would have a stereotype.

It merely means a shift in relation to reality. 

Or a drastic change in your mode of thinking. 

A reset.

You can still be quite aware and reasoning. 

Calm. And believe you are fine. 

That is the truly scary kind. 

On the other hands, you can also be calm, not dangerous at all

To yourself or others.

They’re a bit dotty maybe

But actually kind of entertaining.

Those milder cases

Are treated about the same

By the medical field

Sometimes captured, sometimes drugged.

The doctors are just doing their best, trying to be responsible

After all, they have the exact same outward symptoms

As philosophers like to say

You can’t observe another’s mind

And, depending on how much social support or wealth 

They have, they can get over it fairly well

The others with no means are taken to places that feel like jail

Sometimes against their will

Or against their family’s

Consider the two common phrases,

“The poor are crazy, the rich are just eccentric.” 

“Celebrities can get away with murder.” 

CEOs are predators, gulping down others’ lives and happiness

And hoarding their treasures just like dragons.

Don’t just take my word for it. Do your own research. 

Google “Wage theft”

Google “What careers draw the most sociopaths.” 

Google “Hoard cash overseas”

They follow exactly the same rules and laws of nature

That monsters did of old.

 

But here’s the thing.

The ones in charge, commanding and manipulating your own ranks

Are caught in a web of social conditioning

That they cannot see either. 

 

Google "Brain Scans: The rich are less empathetic." 

There IS NO grand conspiracy.

The paranoid like to bang out on their keyboards

They can’t see why anyone would be so conniving and selfish, this mishandling

Or expect everyone else to dig themselves out of a rigged game. 

But. All that’s there

Is mothers and fathers 

passing out skill sets and a culture that served them best,

thinking they are earning it by their sweat,

Google "Myth: There is no entrepreneurial gene." 

Google "Myth: The Garage startup." 

Manipulation, 

Money is power

And power is corrupting

Status. And children who deal with corrosive demons bigger than you could ever hope to quell.

Have you ever wondered why really, reeaally rich spoiled kids would ever be unhappy?

I mean, they have everything handed to them. But that’s not the way it works. 

I read of a thesis 

That expounded on how

Privilege operated like a mental illness

Made people less resilient. 

Their parents are busy making money, maybe “for” them. The culture chews them up and spits them out. 

Or turns them into predators. 

That's the part with 'less empathetic.' 

 

If you are in the middle ranks.

You are lucky.

You have avoided both social conditioning extremes.

Pause and give thanks, whether or not you believe in a deity.

 

Watch the commercials for pharmaceutical drugs.   (And schizophrenics, NOT given meds, a higher recovery rate.) 

They explicitly say they don’t know how SSRIs work.         (A walk outside for 30 minutes a day has been measured)

We’re guinea pigs. Hoping something will stick.             (coupled with sunshine and vitamins, to outperform Zoloft)

When they aren’t manipulating studies, they’re spending money on advertising. Because they think they’re doing good.

 

Google: "Depression is a Disease of Civilization." 

 

I have observed 

that those who are insulated from war

no matter what culture

Are more likely to exhibit higher-order 

thinking

 

If a human child is exposed to war or gang violence

Or starvation

Their I.Q. is forever crippled.

It’s in the numbers.

And then people wonder why 

They blame it on GENES, on the race, 

obviously they’re “naturally” inferior

because they cannot build societies.

They seem to act like “animals”

And are capable of such violence. 

Meanwhile, in America 160 billion pounds of food are thrown away every day

805 million people don’t have enough to eat. 1/5 American children are hungry.

Because CEOs don’t want to give away good food to poor people.

They want to maximize profit. 

But that’s just what the rich are taught. 

WE ARE POTENTIALLY MANUFACTURING MURDERERS AND CRIMINALS

(and/or miserable people who are drains on the healthcare system)

EVERY TIME WE LET A CHILD GO UNFED AND/OR ENTER THE 

FOSTER CARE SYSTEM. 

 

Thousands of churches 

And a Bible that spends hundreds of times more breath

On orphans and the poor

But we're concerned

about six verses on homosexuality. 

 

Which are in themselves, misinterpreted. 

Exegesis. Learn it. 

 

Google HuffPost: "The Bible Does Not Condemn Homosexuality."

 

And thumb through some statistics

on how their suicide rate

and mental illness

are both higher. 

 

Sigh. 

 

The same person, in different emotional states, can seem like a totally different person.

I have a hypothesis

That anger is actually a mild form of non-lucidity.

And when the pressure builds too far, the scale simply slides.

And after you’ve done something you didn’t actually want to do,

That your free will was temporarily loose

What is your consciousness to do?

It either must reconcile it, i.e., forgive,

be understanding with itself for losing control, or form a seed of guilt.

Store up too much of that, and you’re caput.

Or, it begins to think that maybe it really is just a villain.

And gives up on trying to be any better.

Now. You’ve heard of “blind anger?”

Think back to the last time you were angry.

Are those visual memories as sharp as others?

***Or did they seem to be fuzzy?***

 

I ask because, as an aphantasic, my mind is different than most. 

I don't think in images. 

I have proprioception

A ghostly sense of space and orientation. 

 

Maybe that's why I'm talented with words

With rhyme

With rhythm

With analogies

With complexities

With framing issues so large

The lens to zoom out

Would need to be mounted on the space station. 

 

One of my high school professors

And I call him that on purpose,

Though he didn't teach college,

Because he had a Master's Degree in education

He showed us his thesis

On learning styles. 

They were called "Emergenetics."

 

Traits were assigned Red, Yellow, Green, and Blue

You are currently witnessing 

Possibly the most extensive application of "Yellow" 

You will ever encounter in your life. 

It sees the world in BIG picture. 

 

Huge. 

 

So, did you answer my question? 

 

Allow me some speculation. 

 

If visual experience or memory is different when angry, if the answer is “Yes.”

Are we, perhaps, reverting to a more basal instinct,

that doesn’t sync with our ‘normal’ consciousness very well?

A less extreme version of blocking out trauma?

A tiny form of ‘another personality.’

What if personality splits and bipolar

Are just those seeds that have grown bolder

From repeated forcing and swallowing of feelings
Maybe it doesn't "run in families" because of GENES

Maybe it's because of emotional abuse from others unstable

Again:

Those who are living in poverty or bullied

Have higher rates of mental illness!!!

Look up the statistics.

 

When you’re angry,

To re-iterate,

you do things you wouldn’t normally do

if you were just going about your business.

 

That is a personality split. 

Just more easily seamed back together.

 

If not ripped again and again. 

 

Mental modeling has this wonderful power

To understand instead of JUDGE. Even murders. 

Ever thought about the “insane” amount of SSSuffering in the pasts of Criminal Minds?

What, does someone just stop existing after they’ve committed a crime? Their life is forfeit?

All the days they spend for the rest of their life dwelling and dwelling on their mistakes-

In a prison where they may have NO option of escape????? 

After one or a few offenses?

In this supposed “Land of the Free”

Psh. And yes, it sickens me.

To see people hateful and angry. 

When I work so hard to sand those edges off of myself

There's another carpenter you should consider. 

Jesus sat down with MURDERERS AND THIEVES. 

I guess all the SJW crybabies online think he was just some hippie?

I mean, he was a total hippie

But the guy also had nerves of steel. 

 

You kind of have to when you have nails runnin’ through ya.

You know what causes anger?

Hopefully it’s obvious by now: On a macro scale: Poverty. Social inequality. 

Suffering causes anger.

 

Prison: eye-for-an-eye,

wiping out future potential.

Ever heard of “school to prison pipeline”?

More Google fodder.

 

The dominoes are falling. But it’s no one’s FAULT.

Psychology: It’s called “DISPLACEMENT” Where you take out your ANGER on someone else. WATCH THIS.

So let me write you a flow chart, or an equation, a summation, if you will.

 

Social conditioning of the rich —> CEOs --> Poverty --> Anger --> Murder x MILLIONS.

 

You punish the second-order victims. 

 

Jesus was cold and calculating when he had to outfox every question

From the Pharisees trying to ensnare him it wrongdoing

Or he woulda ended up on that cross a lot sooner                          (((So where is the anger here?))) 

And gentle when he embraced and kissed his friends.                 (((Nowhere. Except when overturning moneychangers))) 

He meditated, roaming the wilderness            (((i.e., corrupt banks taking advantage of the poor. Ring a bell?)))

              (((bailout of banks with taxpayer money, exorbitant fees for those struggling to pay rent)))

 

So. 

 

When I say “Murderers deserve rehab.”

 

I’m not playing.

 

I MEAN it. 

 

     THANK YOU FOR TAKING THE TIME TO READ THIS.

ALL OF THIS IS MY MASTER’S THESIS. 

NO CITATIONS. YOU CAN LOOK IT ALL UP YO SELF. IT’S RIGHT THERE ON GOOGLE. 

DUNNO IF ANYONE WANTS TO ACTUALLY GIVE ME A DEGREE FOR IT

BUT I DON’T GIVE A FEATHERING FLYING FLIP.

 

It's not the first

To be submitted in verse

But, I'd like to think it's still unique. 

 

It's not the first 

To break the sad mold

Where only a dozen people or so read newly minted knowledge

And the public snoozes

 

'Honorary degrees' are common

And with any luck, I'll stumble across the right person

Who'd like to partner with me, and expand on my ideas.

 

I WANT TO SINCERELY THANK VANDERBILT AND CSU.

AND YOU DIDN’T HAVE TO WADE THROUGH 

FIVE BAZILLION PAGES.      AND YOU MAYBE GOT SOME CHUCKLES, TOO.

YOU’RE WELCOME.

WHEREAS I’VE SPENT 10 YEARS SERIOUSLY TRYING TO MAKE SENSE OF THIS GOD-AWFUL MESS.

AND NOW, IT’S CONVENIENTLY CONDENSED.

TEN YEARS 

TO DECODE THE WORLD.
WHEW.

MAYBE I CAN ACTUALLY SLEEP AT NIGHT NOW.

I WANT TO STUDY SLEEP CYCLES.

 

AND I’M NOT DONE YET. I’M GOING TO START A BLOG ABOUT YET MORE TOPICS ON LIVEJOURNAL.

AND EXPOUND AND ELABORATE, PROBABLY.

 

AND YOU. YOU THERE.

 

Controlling anger? 

 

There’s an app for that. 

 

It’s called 

 

MEDITATION. 

 

In case you hadn’t taken that hint yet. 

I only mention it

Like . . . every five seconds

on AVEN. 

It's probably the reason

I haven't acted bad enough to be banned

Or alienated every member of my family and friends

It only takes a few minutes 

To start off. 

There are atheistic AND theistic methods.

There are as many types as there are of music.

Find one you like.

 

UP YOUR LUCIDITY, YO. GIT GUD.

And.

Next time you see someone being bullied

 

You step right in there, and maybe you’ll prevent another school shooting.

 

AND FOR ALL OUR SAKES, SPREAD THE F~~KING WORD. SHARE THIS. HERE'S A HANDY LINK.

 

https://docs.google.com/document/d/17-NkySB5d2xyA-5mHwtjqTaR-TstODwmubcJUStr83s/edit?usp=sharing

 

GO YE INTO THE VIRTUAL WORLD AND PREACH.

 

And back here in IRL

 

Feed the poor. Visit prisoners, join a prison ministry.

I know one saintly woman who runs one.

 

And next time you see someone angry or violent

 

Try to see the pain behind it. 

 

I've looked into the eyes of people who have had violent meltdowns.

 

Didn't seem to bother the Messiah.

 

Maybe learn martial arts, so you're not so scared.

 

Either back away or . . . . . . . .

 

Figure out a way to sit down with them and sing or OHM

Maybe one day stop being a keyboard warrior

And show some real BACKBONE.

[Skycaptain]

?? 

[Guest]

1 hour ago, WoodwindWhistler said:

Murderers deserve rehab

Isn't that.. prison?

 

1 hour ago, WoodwindWhistler said:

I ask because, as an aphantasic, my mind is different than most. 

I don't think in images

I have aphantasia as well, it's a nightmare.

 

1 hour ago, WoodwindWhistler said:

MEDITATION

Wait, how do you meditate if you have aphantasia? I've never been able to meditate as there's so much blackness in there that there's nothing 'distracting me' (you're meant to observe the distractions, or follow guided imagery or whatever) ..but there's just nothing there so I sit there bored and frustrated for half an hour and by the end of it am very tense and agitated, due to my aphantasia. People who can see images in their mind seem to have a much better time with meditation.

 

Do you dream? I can dream (though they're often fragmented and very difficult to remember when I can remember anything at all) ..so obviously that part of my brain that creates images does exist, I just can't access it when awake. As a fictoromantic, that makes for a very lonely internal world :c

[Guest]

1 hour ago, WoodwindWhistler said:

I've looked into the eyes of people who have had violent meltdowns

Me too, when I was getting the shit kicked out of me. He broke my nose and my eye sockets and locked me in a room for three days with no food, water, or toilet, and came in every few hours to beat me some more, for the whole three days. I was never allowed to seek medical attention. And he sent me back to 'work' immediately after. When you're that close to their eyes you see that regardless of what pain they're feeling or have ever felt, their main goal is to inflict as much pain as possible. 

 

I've also lived on the streets with violent repeat offenders, eaten with them at soup kitchens, gotten drunk with them more times than I can remember. Sure they have humanity and they have pain, but they're often well aware of what they're doing when they hurt others, they're well aware they did something wrong, they just also know it really does feel better to inflict pain on someone else when you're in a rage, or if you feel another person needs to be punished or 'taught a lesson'. Rage doesn't excuse those actions in any way.

 

I have myself committed acts of violence when in a blind rage, a few times, and was locked up as a result (only while awaiting trial, I didn't go to prison). Regardless of my mental illness, regardless of my own pain (at the time, I was being sex trafficked by the guy I talked about in the first paragraph), I still committed those acts of violence and had to pay the price. No amount of understanding or kindness would change what I did or why I did it.. and I like any other member of society needed to pay the price for breaking the law even if it was rage and helplessness that drove me to that. The guy who did those things to me never paid a societal price because I was always too afraid to the cops due to what he said he'd do to me if I did, but maybe he is haunted by his actions at least. Hopefully he is. More likely he's still out doing the same things to other victims though. 

[WoodwindWhistler]

10 minutes ago, PanFicto. said:

Isn't that.. prison?

 

I have aphantasia as well, it's a nightmare.

 

Wait, how do you meditate if you have aphantasia? I've never been able to meditate as there's so much blackness in there that there's nothing 'distracting me' (you're meant to observe the distractions, or follow guided imagery or whatever) ..but there's just nothing there so I sit there bored and frustrated for half an hour and by the end of it am very tense and agitated, due to my aphantasia. People who can see images in their mind seem to have a much better time with meditation.

 

Do you dream? I can dream (though they're often fragmented and very difficult to remember when I can remember anything at all) ..so obviously that part of my brain that creates images does exist, I just can't access it when awake. As a fictoromantic, that makes for a very lonely internal world :c

 

Oh yikes, if you don't know of what horrors go on in prison, nor that it is not a rehabilitation-oriented place, that is far too much to cover to catch you up on. It would require . . . probably at least two books worth. 

 

I love aphantasia. The idea that I could visualize scares me. I get lost in my own head to my own detriment enough just fiddling with words and characters. I would never eat or sleep and probably die of starvation if I could actually imagine things. 

 

There are like . . . many dozens of different types of meditation. Like I said in the OP. Visualizing is just one type. Maybe we could PM and discuss them, and find one that works for you. 

 

Your mind chatter does not distract you? It distracts me so much I can hardly hold a conversation with people sometimes. 

 

You are tense and agitated after breathing for in for like, twelve seconds at a time, and then breathing out for twenty? I think that's . . . physiologically impossible. Parasympathetic nervous system is automatically activated that way. I guess whoever directed you didn't emphasize the breath enough? 

 

Sometimes I dream, yes, but sometimes it's more like a spoken narrative. 

 

Pffft, some people experience visual hallucinations. I have experienced tactile hallucinations. When sleep deprived. That clued me in that I can pretty vividly 'conjure' up cuddles at my leisure. Just because the characters are technically 'invisible' does not meant they can't comfort me. Fictoromantic is my middle name. 

[Yoruka]

30 minutes ago, WoodwindWhistler said:

I love aphantasia. The idea that I could visualize scares me. I get lost in my own head to my own detriment enough just fiddling with words and characters. I would never eat or sleep and probably die of starvation if I could actually imagine things. 

I would die if I had aphantasia tbh. 

[Anarchist Kaos]

Fantastic message, I really liked that, would be great if someone with good rhythm did a dramatic reading or a rap out of it.

Zey're advocating for empathy in case you don't get it, but not selective empathy but a society based on empathy, because the lack of empathy on our current one is disgusting.

 

At least that's the main take-away I got from it, though it was a general criticism of our systems and social structure, but yeah I very much agree xem.

[Homer]

1 hour ago, PanFicto. said:

Isn't that.. prison?

It would be, in the developed world.

[WoodwindWhistler]

59 minutes ago, Yoruka said:

I would die if I had aphantasia tbh. 

Why's that? 

 

Many people who practice meditation are aiming to achieve a relaxing state of non-thought. That includes mind sounds, mind sights, everything. When I manage to shut off the constant stream of anxiety-inducing thoughts, it is bliss. 

 

The really advanced people can shut off tactile sensations, too. They completely withdraw their senses such that they cannot hear even rustling of leaves or the whine of a refrigerator nearby. They are totally freed from the irritations of their body's constant imputs and sensations. 

 

I have to wonder if this technique would be useful to autistic people, who have sensory processing issues. 

[WoodwindWhistler]

39 minutes ago, Anarchist Kaos said:

Fantastic message, I really liked that, would be great if someone with good rhythm did a dramatic reading or a rap out of it.

Zey're advocating for empathy in case you don't get it, but not selective empathy but a society based on empathy, because the lack of empathy on our current one is disgusting.

 

At least that's the main take-away I got from it, though it was a general criticism of our systems and social structure, but yeah I very much agree xem.

I have a few much shorter poems like this that I have recorded. If you'd like to hear them, I can send you Google Doc links. 

 

I love that you used both versions of pronouns >w< cute. 

[Anarchist Kaos]

58 minutes ago, WoodwindWhistler said:

I have a few much shorter poems like this that I have recorded. If you'd like to hear them, I can send you Google Doc links. 

 

I love that you used both versions of pronouns >w< cute. 

Only if you want to share, glad to hear I didn't upset you.

[J. van Deijck]

That's, uhm, a little bit long.

[Yoruka]

3 hours ago, WoodwindWhistler said:

Why's that? 

 

Many people who practice meditation are aiming to achieve a relaxing state of non-thought. That includes mind sounds, mind sights, everything. When I manage to shut off the constant stream of anxiety-inducing thoughts, it is bliss. 

 

The really advanced people can shut off tactile sensations, too. They completely withdraw their senses such that they cannot hear even rustling of leaves or the whine of a refrigerator nearby. They are totally freed from the irritations of their body's constant imputs and sensations. 

 

I have to wonder if this technique would be useful to autistic people, who have sensory processing issues. 

I love visualizing in my head, seeing all the pictures, I can draw easier, I can imagine things and I like to enjoy that. I would really hate it if I couldn't do these things easily. I thrive off of daydreaming.

[Homer]

I have a question about aphantasia!

 

From what I understand, "please picture a sunset at the beach" makes you folks draw a blank. How does it work if you have actually seen that thing? Can you imagine the scenery if you have actually been to a beach at sunset?

[Oberon Jasper]

I'm with the aphantasia would be real hard for me if I had it. Like the other person I thrive off of daydreams and escapism. Words are nice, but the pictures bring the world around me into a bearable place to be. Reality is a bit dull for my taste and hearing the story for me isn't enough. I have to see and explore. (If any of that made sense)

 

I didn't read the full thing if I'm completely honest... I struggle with reading on a screen. But from reading others comments and the bit that I did read I gathered the general energy of what you're trying to say.

 

The system is set up at a disadvantage for people who learn in different and slower rates. In my opinion it would be better if we could set up a more Socratic seminar based learning system where scores and such ceased to matter. It would be based off the mental stimulation of others building off of each other.

 

As for murderers and such... I'm a paranoid person who has studied out a decent amount on the mindset of serial killers (not one time murderers), but it gets complicated there. Some should be rehabilitated and others should be either killed or locked away for the safety of the public. I find this to be situational because once the disconnect between caring about others and indifference about human life has reached a certain distance it doesn't matter to them anymore if they live or die or if those around them live or die. I am also paranoid as I mentioned so I know my view on this is a little screwy and less rational than most of my opinions.

 

I do believe we should be teaching empathy more for certain. Our world encourages hatred and working only to improve oneself as desirable qualities when they are some of the worst attributes of the human mind. We tend to place people with psychopathic tendencies in positions of power and encourage these behaviors in youth.

[WoodwindWhistler]

4 hours ago, Yoruka said:

I love visualizing in my head, seeing all the pictures, I can draw easier, I can imagine things and I like to enjoy that. I would really hate it if I couldn't do these things easily. I thrive off of daydreaming.

I thrive off of daydreaming too!  It's just cute fluff with character voices talking to each other, (though my mind voice isn't that vivid, either) rather than 'seeing' them. 

 

I've done oodles and oodles of art. Aphantasia does not hinder drawing in the least. For me specifically, proprioception allows me to get a little bit of a ball rolling with an idea, and it takes shape on the paper. 

[WoodwindWhistler]

4 hours ago, Homer said:

I have a question about aphantasia!

 

From what I understand, "please picture a sunset at the beach" makes you folks draw a blank. How does it work if you have actually seen that thing? Can you imagine the scenery if you have actually been to a beach at sunset?

Nope, not at all. I cannot picture my boyfriend's face, nor my mother's. (this probably contributes to mild prosopagnosia) I can draw a reasonable approximation of some faces, maybe. But that's because our brains can recognize and sort and organize shapes without necessarily being able to reproduce them in the mind's eye. 

[WoodwindWhistler]

4 hours ago, Kieran said:

I'm with the aphantasia would be real hard for me if I had it. Like the other person I thrive off of daydreams and escapism. Words are nice, but the pictures bring the world around me into a bearable place to be. Reality is a bit dull for my taste and hearing the story for me isn't enough. I have to see and explore. (If any of that made sense)

 

I didn't read the full thing if I'm completely honest... I struggle with reading on a screen. But from reading others comments and the bit that I did read I gathered the general energy of what you're trying to say.

 

The system is set up at a disadvantage for people who learn in different and slower rates. In my opinion it would be better if we could set up a more Socratic seminar based learning system where scores and such ceased to matter. It would be based off the mental stimulation of others building off of each other.

 

As for murderers and such... I'm a paranoid person who has studied out a decent amount on the mindset of serial killers (not one time murderers), but it gets complicated there. Some should be rehabilitated and others should be either killed or locked away for the safety of the public. I find this to be situational because once the disconnect between caring about others and indifference about human life has reached a certain distance it doesn't matter to them anymore if they live or die or if those around them live or die. I am also paranoid as I mentioned so I know my view on this is a little screwy and less rational than most of my opinions.

 

I do believe we should be teaching empathy more for certain. Our world encourages hatred and working only to improve oneself as desirable qualities when they are some of the worst attributes of the human mind. We tend to place people with psychopathic tendencies in positions of power and encourage these behaviors in youth.

Well I guess I could attempt to record this. I have for other things. It's just like . . . very unlikely that I'll be able to get through the whole thing without flubbing it along the way. I've recorded a 40 minute character conversation before, but it took a good bit of practice and was still not without mistakes (I don't know how to edit sound files, and I'm so overrun with projects I don't really want to learn) 

 

We just need a system like the Finns. It's very simple. 

 

I think that in the case of someone who was truly irredeemable, they should be assigned a live-in officer in their house. Like a bodyguard, but in reverse. They can be banded like some people are when they are being monitored by a parole officer. I don't think life sentencing is necessary, humane, OR cost effective. 

 

And yes, our culture is most definitely socio and psychopath rewarding. I have a shorter poem that mentions that, as well. 

[WoodwindWhistler]

11 hours ago, Skycaptain said:

?? 

Heh, I think I broke SkyCaptain. 

[Guest]

6 hours ago, Homer said:

I have a question about aphantasia!

 

From what I understand, "please picture a sunset at the beach" makes you folks draw a blank. How does it work if you have actually seen that thing? Can you imagine the scenery if you have actually been to a beach at sunset?

I can't see it personally, even though I know a sun is there and a beach is there and the sunset will be orange etc, but that's the same way I know the way to the kitchen at night. It's so hard to explain though. The closest I can come to explaining it is like, imagine if you're in a familiar room and it's pitch black, and you have to walk somewhere in the room. You know the table is over there, and the couch is there, and the book shelf is over there, even though you can't see anything because it's pitch black. That's what 'memory' is like for me. It's a formless 'knowing' in the pitch black

 

Another utterly frustrating aspect of it is that I'm a pretty technically accomplished artist. Like, I can draw photorealistic images using a ballpoint pen, for example. BUT I can *only* draw something if I'm copying off a photo. If I try drawing something as basic as a cat with no photo to copy off, the image will be a poorly drawn stick figure about as good as a childs drawing, because I can't 'picture' a cat to be able to see what it should look like! I know where the head should be, and the tail, and the feet, but there's no details or proportions because I can't see the damn cat!! I am unable to draw anything without something to copy off, which really stifles my creativity unfortunately :c

[Guest]

1 hour ago, WoodwindWhistler said:

I've done oodles and oodles of art. Aphantasia does not hinder drawing in the least. For me specifically, proprioception allows me to get a little bit of a ball rolling with an idea, and it takes shape on the paper. 

I didn't see this until after I made my comment. It's definitely different for me!! I can draw very, very well if I'm copying, but I've never been able to doodle or even draw a basic flower if I'm not copying a photograph. It sucks :c

[Guest]

10 hours ago, Yoruka said:

I would die if I had aphantasia tbh. 

Yeah I think it's deeply contributed to my depression over the years. It's like there's no escape from the constant emotional pain because my mind can't be taken anywhere :c I love dreaming but it happens very rarely, it's fragmented, and the dreams often aren't any good. So yeah.. it sucks!!!

[WoodwindWhistler]

13 hours ago, Anarchist Kaos said:

Only if you want to share

https://drive.google.com/file/d/15sa0PqZn92pxvosXEXv-MMhxj87C_GHU/view?usp=sharing

[WoodwindWhistler]

4 hours ago, PanFicto. said:

I can't see it personally, even though I know a sun is there and a beach is there and the sunset will be orange etc, but that's the same way I know the way to the kitchen at night. It's so hard to explain though. The closest I can come to explaining it is like, imagine if you're in a familiar room and it's pitch black, and you have to walk somewhere in the room. You know the table is over there, and the couch is there, and the book shelf is over there, even though you can't see anything because it's pitch black. That's what 'memory' is like for me. It's a formless 'knowing' in the pitch black

 

Another utterly frustrating aspect of it is that I'm a pretty technically accomplished artist. Like, I can draw photorealistic images using a ballpoint pen, for example. BUT I can *only* draw something if I'm copying off a photo. If I try drawing something as basic as a cat with no photo to copy off, the image will be a poorly drawn stick figure about as good as a childs drawing, because I can't 'picture' a cat to be able to see what it should look like! I know where the head should be, and the tail, and the feet, but there's no details or proportions because I can't see the damn cat!! I am unable to draw anything without something to copy off, which really stifles my creativity unfortunately :c

 

Yep, that's proprioception!

 

I draw stylized and cartoony drawings. My styles range all over the place, and they are certainly NOT like stick figures! If I want to draw a more realistic fantasy animal or something, I will take a bunch of references and kind of "compile" them into an original pose. I think you're drastically over-estimating the average visualizer's ability to just conjure a photo-real image. Most people in the art community must use references, regardless. 

Creativity is not in reproducing things. Any old Xerox machine can do that, haha! 

 

Tons of famous artists have styles that are not realistic. That's what Picasso got famous for. 

 

You seem to be carrying some negative beliefs about art in general, and have somehow attached it to aphantasia. 

 

4 hours ago, PanFicto. said:

Yeah I think it's deeply contributed to my depression over the years. It's like there's no escape from the constant emotional pain because my mind can't be taken anywhere :c I love dreaming but it happens very rarely, it's fragmented, and the dreams often aren't any good. So yeah.. it sucks!!!

That's so weird because I have the opposite problem. I zoom straight off to fantasy character land and muse on the politics of mice and golems instead of being present and dealing with my negative emotions properly like I should. 

 

Again, you are applying some negative beliefs, thinking you should cope with problems the same way as someone different than yourself, instead of finding what works for you. PM me! For reals, we can get this sorted out. 

 

[Guest]

2 hours ago, WoodwindWhistler said:

You seem to be carrying some negative beliefs about art in general, and have somehow attached it to aphantasia. 

My mother is a professional artist and both her and my two kids conjure photorealistic images which they use as references when creating stuff and when daydreaming and things, which makes things feel particularly bleak for me! Most people who I have talked to (anyone who doesnt have aphantasia) sees some form of visual imagery even if they aren't artistic. I guess the thing is that part of what artists do (ones who use references) is they can already see how they want the image or creation to look, then find references to help them reach the goal of what they can picture in their mind. Mum does that for particularly difficult masks or weapons or whatever on her sculptures - she knows what she wants to create and uses the references to help get there, whereas the rest she just 'copies' from her brain. Part of my aphantasia is not being able to see the damned image in the first place, which makes it a huge bumbling mess Y_Y I just find a photo or image that I like, and copy it. That's the extent of my artistic ability sadly, even though I'm an extremely creative person. Aphantasia is a curse as far as I'm concerned :c

 

2 hours ago, WoodwindWhistler said:

I zoom straight off to fantasy character land and muse on the politics of mice and golems instead of being present and dealing with my negative emotions properly like I should.

As a ficto-romantic I do get caught up in other worlds, but there is always this disconnect which has depressed me deeply due to not being able to see any of the things I'm drawn to. I am left with a void inside due to not being able to connect on a visual way to the worlds (and characters) I become absorbed in. Due to having seen my dreams when I can recall fragments, I know the extent at which my visualization could function if I was able to bridge that gap. So I know exactly what I'm missing and that's what makes it all so much harder.

 

2 hours ago, WoodwindWhistler said:

PM me! For reals, we can get this sorted out. 

Thanks that's nice of you to offer but my PM box is broken by fullness, even the mods can't PM me when I'm in trouble It'll be all good. I'm working on it. I've found actual 'cures' online that I want to explore, so I do have hope. It's just depressing when I dwell on it!

 

 

[WoodwindWhistler]

Well I just saw this, and maybe it's not directly what I'm speaking to when I wrote up this verse, it is definitely closely related. 

 

https://liberalsarecool.com/post/633954742958211072

[WoodwindWhistler]

1 hour ago, PanFicto. said:

My mother is a professional artist and both her and my two kids conjure photorealistic images which they use as references when creating stuff and when daydreaming and things, which makes things feel particularly bleak for me! Most people who I have talked to (anyone who doesnt have aphantasia) sees some form of visual imagery even if they aren't artistic. I guess the thing is that part of what artists do (ones who use references) is they can already see how they want the image or creation to look, then find references to help them reach the goal of what they can picture in their mind. Mum does that for particularly difficult masks or weapons or whatever on her sculptures - she knows what she wants to create and uses the references to help get there, whereas the rest she just 'copies' from her brain. Part of my aphantasia is not being able to see the damned image in the first place, which makes it a huge bumbling mess Y_Y I just find a photo or image that I like, and copy it. That's the extent of my artistic ability sadly, even though I'm an extremely creative person. Aphantasia is a curse as far as I'm concerned :c

 

As a ficto-romantic I do get caught up in other worlds, but there is always this disconnect which has depressed me deeply due to not being able to see any of the things I'm drawn to. I am left with a void inside due to not being able to connect on a visual way to the worlds (and characters) I become absorbed in. Due to having seen my dreams when I can recall fragments, I know the extent at which my visualization could function if I was able to bridge that gap. So I know exactly what I'm missing and that's what makes it all so much harder.

 

Thanks that's nice of you to offer but my PM box is broken by fullness, even the mods can't PM me when I'm in trouble It'll be all good. I'm working on it. I've found actual 'cures' online that I want to explore, so I do have hope. It's just depressing when I dwell on it!

 

 

Lemme just say from experience, that ANY time you compare yourself to another person whom you idolize, it's going to be a miserable existence. It doesn't matter one bit what the subject at hand is. 

 

If you'd like to train yourself out of that thought habit, I'd suggest writing some positive affirmations. 

 

Some of the doodly-est little cartoons can change peoples' lives, because of the SUBJECT matter presented. The impact or quality of art is not in the least determined by being visually "stunning." Some of the most detailed, hyper-real digital art does absolutely nothing to me emotionally, but if I read a comic page with the right dialog, or a social commentary picture that may be pretty simplified but mind-blowing in its concept, then it will stick with me the rest of the day (or week. Or even . . . always.) 

 

The longer you continue to allow your mind to dwell on these things, instead of looking at it from another angle, the longer you will be miserable. Reactions. Thought patterns are the source of misery, not situations. That is a basic tenet of mind training. 

 

So, do you want to attempt some tactile imaginings? 

 

You mean sites like this? https://unchainmybrain.com/learn-to-visualize/

 

Ok, so the reason I asked to PM was that I didn't want to clutter up the thread, and I might've asked some personal questions . . . but we could like, start up a thread in Tea and Sympathy or somewhere more casual. Or if you have Discord or some other app . . . 

[Guest]

On 11/6/2020 at 5:05 PM, WoodwindWhistler said:

You mean sites like this? https://unchainmybrain.com/learn-to-visualize/

I've started OMAD again so have been trying to avoid making long posts AVEN while my body/mind re-adjusts to it again (the first week is pretty taxing mentally, making long posts where I have to think too much is a bit beyond me right now!) but wanted to make a quick reply to this as didn't want to leave you hanging!

 

What I was referring to is a process called Image Streaming. People with total aphantasia have managed to reach a point of photorealistic visualization with fully immersive images that they can enter and view from different angles and change the lighting and everything The process creates new neural pathways between your conscious focus and the "image creating" area of your brain (something like that anyway). After I've posted this I'll quickly go and find the article that I found the most beneficial, though I've been studying it for years (back when I discovered Win Wengers writings on it) ..I've just never applied myself properly to the process yet!! What you linked was super interesting and I think combining those techniques from the article you linked with image streaming could be super powerful!! 

 

On 11/6/2020 at 5:05 PM, WoodwindWhistler said:

Ok, so the reason I asked to PM was that I didn't want to clutter up the thread, and I might've asked some personal questions . . . but we could like, start up a thread in Tea and Sympathy or somewhere more casual

Yes that would be good!! I just can't participate right now until my brain has re-adjusted to OMAD. I'll let you know when I'm back in gear. There is another person here with a pretty extreme version of aphantasia, can't even recognise faces very well from what I recall, however I'm not sure if they're still active. I think their name is @Marlow1? (Hah, found them using the tag function!!) So they might want to participate in the thread too when you make it if they're still active

 

I apologise for my previous aggression. I was depressed and angry for the past few months but feel much better since starting OMAD again, just need to readjust my brain to the 23 hour daily fast (as to begin with I experience a fair amount of mental fog).

 

 

[Guest]

 

Here's a quote from the article: (I'm on mobile so can't fix the large size sorry)

 

• First, if I was aphantasic, Image Streaming cured it. I could see bright, vivid images in my head. I haven’t practiced the technique since—but I still see beautifully clear images in my mind’s eye.
• Second, it improved my photography like nothing else I’d ever done. From that point on I didn’t need to construct a set, find models or leave the house to play with composition or photo ideas. I could just sit back, relax and close my eyes. Image Streaming helped me become a better photographer from the comfort of my armchair.

 

 

Here is the article: https://unchainmybrain.com/image-streaming/

 

 

There is a lot of info about Image Streaming online, and I bought Wengers books when I first learned about it, but that article and the video that accompanies it is the best I've come across because it's by someone who had aphantasia and cured it using image streaming. He gives all the details needed to practice Image Streaming, and like I said, combined with the stuff you linked it could be super powerful!! Here's the video:

 

 

[Guest]

And this talks about the process of creating visual stores of references in your mind:

 

 

I am sadly currently unable to create the visual references in my mind but it's something I've always dreamed of being able to do purely for my own pleasure. I know there's stuff inside me that I want to get out onto paper, but it's trapped until I can access those images! 

 

I'll stop derailing the thread now!