NickyTannock Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 I'm not sure why it is, but a lot of places have confused the gynephilia flag with the asexuality flag, so when you order an ace flag, that's what you could get instead. The difference between the two is that whereas an asexuality pride flag uses the colours black, grey, white and purple, the gynephilia pride flag uses black, grey, white and hot pink. https://lgbt.wikia.org/wiki/Androphilia_and_gynephilia Link to post Share on other sites
everywhere and nowhere Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 I'm both asexual and gynephilic (at least on the affectional, not sexual, level), so I wouldn't mind it. Link to post Share on other sites
Skycaptain Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 Ace flag Link to post Share on other sites
Philip027 Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 A "gynephilia" flag rubs me about the same way as a "straight/heterosexual" flag would, incidentally. Oh wow, you like chicks? There's only, like, probably over half of humanity in that particular club. Of course it uses pink too. How else are people gonna know it's girly? 6 Link to post Share on other sites
Janus the Fox Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 There might be a number of flags that use the black white grey and a colour, common combination in textile design for decades. The Ace flag may not necessarily be the first to have these 4 colours. While the Ace flag is likely the first to use it as a flag, it is perhaps popular enough to see derivatives. Link to post Share on other sites
everywhere and nowhere Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 48 minutes ago, Philip027 said: A "gynephilia" flag rubs me about the same way as a "straight/heterosexual" flag would, incidentally. Oh wow, you like chicks? There's only, like, probably over half of humanity in that particular club. Of course it uses pink too. How else are people gonna know it's girly? Not all gynephilic people are men. Actually, I find the perspective of "gynephilia / androphilia" valid for several reasons. The dominant perspective - "heterosexual / homosexual" scale - is dependent on the gender binary. If someone doesn't identify as "100% male" or "100% female", which gender is "same" and which is "opposite" (I, anyway, prefer the term "different gender") in relation to them? Therefore, it seems, for non-binary people it might be very helpful to identiy as, for example, "gynephilic" rather than "homosexual". 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Philip027 Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 Quote Not all gynephilic people are men. I never said they were? Also, I'm not saying the gyne- label is pointless. I'm just saying it seems silly and even a little pretentious to make a "pride flag" over it when it's something over half the populace can resonate with. You are literally not even a minority at that point, which is why I say it rubs me in a similar way like a "hetero" flag or people calling for "straight pride" would. Link to post Share on other sites
witchboi Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 1 hour ago, Philip027 said: Oh wow, you like chicks? There's only, like, probably over half of humanity in that particular club. gynephilia is not about liking women but about liking traditionally feminine people which includes feminine men, feminine genderqueers, and feminine women it's sort of like a "variant" of bisexuality making it a minority (like omnisexuals, pansexuals, etc...) I do find it weird that the flag looks so much like the asexual flag 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Janus the Fox Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 1 hour ago, Nowhere Girl said: Not all gynephilic people are men. Actually, I find the perspective of "gynephilia / androphilia" valid for several reasons. The dominant perspective - "heterosexual / homosexual" scale - is dependent on the gender binary. If someone doesn't identify as "100% male" or "100% female", which gender is "same" and which is "opposite" (I, anyway, prefer the term "different gender") in relation to them? Therefore, it seems, for non-binary people it might be very helpful to identiy as, for example, "gynephilic" rather than "homosexual". Particularly true this, myself having a non-binary gender, being Agender and Intersex. The ‘same sex’ and ‘opposite sex’ attraction models don’t work all that well other than the same sex attractions are for another Agender intersex (without it with genitals) individual and opposite is like a Pangender Androgyne intersex (with both it mixed set of genitals). Its possible one is asexual as there’s no one else that has the same or opposite sex or gender for an individual like myself. There’s a large grey area for those anywhere identifying not completely non gendered. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
NickyTannock Posted August 17, 2020 Author Share Posted August 17, 2020 59 minutes ago, witchboi said: I do find it weird that the flag looks so much like the asexual flag Welcome to AVEN! I've seen a few asexuals proudly displaying their gynephilia flags thinking they're asexual flags, so I thought it would be a good idea to make this thread. The two do look very similar. Incidentally, it is a tradition here to welcome new members by offering cake, and here's a "Dragon" cake, Spoiler https://cakesdecor.com/cakes/215752-dragon 2 Link to post Share on other sites
witchboi Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 28 minutes ago, MichaelTannock said: Welcome to AVEN! thank you ! this made my day lol 2 Link to post Share on other sites
NickyTannock Posted August 17, 2020 Author Share Posted August 17, 2020 1 minute ago, witchboi said: thank you ! this made my day lol You're welcome! I'm glad it did! Link to post Share on other sites
LeChat Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 That's surprising. I didn't know that the flags looked similar. I don't think I've seen anyone use the gynephilia flag; I've just seen slight variations of the purple stripe on asexual flags, some a dark purple or a lighter shade of purple. Link to post Share on other sites
NickyTannock Posted August 17, 2020 Author Share Posted August 17, 2020 @LeChat This is what a gynephilia flag looks like under real world lighting; https://www.theflagshop.co.uk/gynephilia-flag-5ft-x-3ft.html Link to post Share on other sites
FaerySilverwings Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 I am really grateful you posted this. I was just about to order my first flag and now I need to go check before I pay for it that it's the right one. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
LeChat Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 54 minutes ago, MichaelTannock said: ...This is what a gynephilia flag looks like under real world lighting; https://www.theflagshop.co.uk/gynephilia-flag-5ft-x-3ft.html ... Oh! I see; yeah, that color does look like a purple color of the ace flag. Their ace flag looks darker. https://www.theflagshop.co.uk/asexual-flag-5ft-x-3ft-6008.html It looks like a case of bad CGI/photoshopping, to me, perhaps, with whomever made the graphics using the wrong color due to different computers having different color settings; all the flags in that exact position have the same "white" shaded creases in the exact same places (compared to this one, which looks a bit more realistic https://www.theflagshop.co.uk/ireland-tri-colour-hand-waving-flag.html). It'd hope that the actual product sent has the correct colors, that, hopefully, it's just a case of bad/incorrect CGI graphics. Now that I think about it, I've come across a few shoppers giving reviews about a clothing product (i.e. shirt, shoes, etc.) and writing that they were disappointed and surprised that the product they'd received was a different color from the picture shown, online (e.g. pink instead of purple). Link to post Share on other sites
Snao Cone Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 Sigh... There is, in practical terms, a finite number of colours that are discernible enough to be used in flags without confusion (especially given variation that can come from printing flags, whether due to the material or the dye or whatever). Do we need to start limiting to a finite number of identities to make symbols practical anymore? This is mild colour blindness aside, of course. One could even say that the gynophilia flag is ableist (or at least if enforcing the difference between purple and pink became a big deal). 2 Link to post Share on other sites
NickyTannock Posted August 17, 2020 Author Share Posted August 17, 2020 50 minutes ago, FaerySilverwings said: I am really grateful you posted this. I was just about to order my first flag and now I need to go check before I pay for it that it's the right one. You're welcome! And good luck with ordering your asexuality pride flag! 13 minutes ago, LeChat said: Now that I think about it, I've come across a few shoppers giving reviews about a clothing product (i.e. shirt, shoes, etc.) and writing that they were disappointed and surprised that the product they'd received was a different color from the picture shown, online (e.g. pink instead of purple). As I say, I've seen a few asexuals proudly displaying their gynephilia flags thinking they're asexuality flags. 2 minutes ago, Snao Cone (me) said: There is, in practical terms, a finite number of colours that are discernible enough to be used in flags without confusion (especially given variation that can come from printing flags, whether due to the material or the dye or whatever). Do we need to start limiting to a finite number of identities to make symbols practical anymore? My goal by making this thread is not to criticise the gynephilia flag or limit people's options, only inform people about the difference due to a recurring mistake on the part of sellers. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Janus the Fox Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 I can see the differences in the colour and I can certantly see there's that grey area between the purple and the pink, advertising communication between the two looks muddled here This pic in particular, it isn't bright enough to be the gyne flag colour, the lighting and camera composition and for any web picture compression or applied High Dynamic Range editing don't do this justice to me. I'm sure I've see this picture before, for Asexuality. Again, advertising here is mixed or misleading, comparing the two, I'm not convinced it's a photo at all to me. Link to post Share on other sites
Snao Cone Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 The next hot debate in the asexual community will be "Is magenta purple or pink?" Saying it's purple will lead to accusations of gynephiliaphobia and most people will say "magenta is a spectrum" despite how useless of a statement that is. And of course that will be countered with the argument of "No. All visible light is a spectrum. Magenta is a very specific wavelength." Then people will argue against that by saying "Well actually, while pure magenta is in an RGB sense (255,0,255), there is a range of hues that are effectively perceived as magenta to the human eye." 3 Link to post Share on other sites
NickyTannock Posted August 17, 2020 Author Share Posted August 17, 2020 17 minutes ago, Janus DarkFox said: This pic in particular, it isn't bright enough to be the gyne flag colour, the lighting and camera composition and for any web picture compression or applied High Dynamic Range editing don't do this justice to me. I'm sure I've see this picture before, for Asexuality. Again, advertising here is mixed or misleading, comparing the two, I'm not convinced it's a photo at all to me. They digitally applied their colours to a photo of what was most likely a black flag. But I think we're getting sidetracked, since if you want a better example of the two flags to compare, here's a photo that has both of them. The asexuality flag is flying on the left, with someone wearing it as a cape behind the sign, and the gynephilia flag is flying on the right, with several wearing it as a cape. https://www.facebook.com/AVENOfficial/posts/many-thanks-to-everyone-that-marched-with-us-today-at-london-pride-it-was-an-awe/10156387744287584/ Link to post Share on other sites
Snao Cone Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 1 minute ago, CBC said: But is this an asexual colour scheme or a gynephilic one? (I know, the answer is both, as the two are not mutually exclusive.) 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Snao Cone Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 Anyway, to be less shitpost-y, I think we can forgive the error in judgment for people who have magenta on their asexual flag. It shouldn't be that big of a deal. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
NickyTannock Posted August 17, 2020 Author Share Posted August 17, 2020 @Snao Cone (me) @CBC That's just the way the two flags are, and they certainly don't represent the same thing. Do you have any solutions? Link to post Share on other sites
NickyTannock Posted August 17, 2020 Author Share Posted August 17, 2020 I did not appreciate the derailment. Link to post Share on other sites
Snao Cone Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 7 minutes ago, MichaelTannock said: @Snao Cone (me) @CBC That's just the way the two flags are, and they certainly don't represent the same thing. Do you have any solutions? Without formal regulation, what can we do? I don't think the gynephilic flag is as common as the ace one, given how many of us didn't know about it until you brought it up. There are also other flags that include gynephilia, like the lesbian flag, or the bi/pan flags if those apply. We can do our best to personally choose shades of purple that are less ambiguous, but aside from that I don't think anyone is able to decidedly resolve this. People will always interpret ambiguous shades subjectively. I wouldn't be surprised if wars were started over this. Think of the red/orange confusion over things like the Italian and Irish flags, and how mixups continue to offend people. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Philip027 Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 Quote I'm also of the mind that not everything needs a flag Yeah... I personally think it's just weird to have flags representing personality traits, to be honest. To me, flags are something that are supposed to represent countries. Quote gynephilia is not about liking women but about liking traditionally feminine people which includes feminine men, feminine genderqueers, and feminine women it's sort of like a "variant" of bisexuality making it a minority (like omnisexuals, pansexuals, etc...) That's absolutely not my understanding of the term. Gyne- traditionally refers specifically to women and the female body (not just "feminine" traits, whatever THAT's supposed to mean, because that's going to mean different things to different people), and this along with andro- is a prefix used by some trans people to more clearly indicate their relationship preference without specifically bringing up their sex/gender (because hetero/homo indicate relationship preferences in relation to one's own sex/gender) If that's really what it's supposed to mean, I feel like a more distinctive term could have been chosen here. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Janus the Fox Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 2 hours ago, MichaelTannock said: They digitally applied their colours to a photo of what was most likely a black flag. But I think we're getting sidetracked, since if you want a better example of the two flags to compare, here's a photo that has both of them. The asexuality flag is flying on the left, with someone wearing it as a cape behind the sign, and the gynephilia flag is flying on the right, with several wearing it as a cape. https://www.facebook.com/AVENOfficial/posts/many-thanks-to-everyone-that-marched-with-us-today-at-london-pride-it-was-an-awe/10156387744287584/ True, though it can be possible an ace can identify gynephile asexual, also this pic is a few years old now the gynephile flag never formally existed until much more recently. Link to post Share on other sites
Janus the Fox Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 As requested the Thread needs to get back on topic and on track, possibly for the best to keep to serious answers for the moment until this is question is answered. Janus DarkFox Questions about Asexuality, Asexual Musings and Rantings & Open Mic Moderator Link to post Share on other sites
NickyTannock Posted August 17, 2020 Author Share Posted August 17, 2020 11 minutes ago, Janus DarkFox said: True, though it can be possible an ace can identify gynephile asexual, also this pic is a few years old now the gynephile flag never formally existed until much more recently. How long ago is it that the flags started formally representing different things? I'm wondering if out of date records are the reason for the mixup that's been happening, where asexuals receive the wrong flag. Link to post Share on other sites
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