Feeling Invalid.

[pjpsamson]

I haven't been on here in a long time, but I just feel so low and think I need to talk to people who might understand me

 

I'm sick of feeling the way I do. I'm asexual and there's nothing that will actively change that. So why do I always wish that I weren't? I was already feeling this way when I went on twitter and saw "asexual" was trending. If you don't know it's because Nickelodeon posted Spongebob in a pride month post and people were talking about him being asexual. However the posts underneath were a lot of "asexual people aren't LGBT or queer" or "Asexual people are so privileged and obnoxious" or "How is liking no one LGBT?" (I'm paraphrasing people's attitudes) Stuff I'm sure most aces have heard before to some extent. I'm just sick of feeling invalidated by what sometimes feels like everyone around me. Of course most aces, especially cisgendered heteroromantic aces like me don't have it nearly as hard as gay or transgender people as a lot of us can hide our sexualities, I just don't think that because I may have less hardship from my sexuality means that my feelings and problems are invalid. Not to mention that like I said that one of the reasons it is easier is because I can hide my sexuality, which I'm tired of doing! Am I a "fake queer" "LGBT interloper" for identifying as a mostly straight ace, or am I just being gaslit to think so?

Anyways more on the topic of invalidation and my personal story. I came out to friends in high school and kind of got bullied over it. They would bring it up so much that I started to feel like it was my only defining characteristic. One of my friends at the time drew a kind of psuedo stick figure drawing of our friend group and the only identifier that the stick figure was me was that it had acne and its face was just the letter "A". For a while things were pretty good when I started college. Eventually I started dating someone, but they wanted to have sex which I wasn't comfortable with yet and the relationship crumbled. I feel bad because I know that was somewhat her idea of love, and I inadvertently made her feel unloved, but I also have to stop feeling like it was my fault for the relationship ending. we're just different people with different ideas of love/affection. Needless to say that makes me feel invalid because I've told some people that story and they view it as me just being emotionally and sexually immature. Not to mention when I mention the idea of dating someone or having a crush on someone the question is ALWAYS "what do you even want out of a relationship?" Including from the therapist I was seeing. The other day my best friend said that if he was asexual like me he wouldn't be dating his girlfriend he's been dating for a year and a half, as if the only reason he's dating her is to have sex? (Which I know isn't the case) I know people can't fully understand my perspective because they're not in my shoes, but I don't understand how they don't see the middle ground past platonic love, but not involving sex. Now I'm back at my parent's place for a bit and since they moved while I was in college I have no friends here, and feel incredibly lonely and isolated. Not to mention since there's a global pandemic I can't exactly just go out and make friends. Even if there wasn't I still don't really know where to go around here to meet people my age.

Sorry for my lunatic ramblings and it means the world to me if you read all of this. Please let me know your opinion on any of this or if you have any advice or whatever, even just a hello if you want (like I said, I'm lonely). To anyone that relates to this post, you're not alone, it's hard and even though I feel invalid I know there have to be people that feel the same way. 

Also I know I have issues because a television network posting a picture of a rainbow cartoon sponge snowballed into me having an intense depressive episode at 3 AM.

[Purple Red Panda]

I feel for you man, that sounds really tough. I wish I could think of something affirming to say to make you feel better. The only thing I know is that you are valid and I'm sorry people make you feel otherwise💜

[weird elf]

Hey there!

Looks like those folks are still so hurt and insecure that they need to lash out at others because they are not yet able to imagine that other groups can be marginalised as well. That's something nobody can solve for them, and I'm afraid it's a problem in every walk of life - someone overworked can't get behind people complaining of being bored at work, someone wishing for a family / partnership will find it hard to relate to someone complaining about too-demanding kids and / or significant other. Equally, someone struggling with their sexual needs can find it hard to consider someone with no sexual needs as belonging to the same group.

 

To me, it's a matter of perspective. Look into GRSM - gender, romantic, and sexual minorities. In my opinion a much better "umbrella" than LGBTQIA+ never ending letter salad trying to explicitly mention every group instead of the shared characteristic of all of them: Being a minority in a cishet-(amato)normative society.

 

All of that to say: You are valid. We all are. Sexuality (or lack thereof) is not anyone's sole defining characteristic, just like their gender alone doesn't determine who they are. It's kind of a no-brainer really, it's just society making too much of a fuss about certain things while completely disregarding others.

[Pandark]

1 hour ago, pjpsamson said:

I feel bad because I know that was somewhat her idea of love, and I inadvertently made her feel unloved, but I also have to stop feeling like it was my fault for the relationship ending. we're just different people with different ideas of love/affection.

I'm sorry. You don't have to feel bad, exploratory relationships are part of growing up.

 

1 hour ago, pjpsamson said:

I've told some people that story and they view it as me just being emotionally and sexually immature.

How they view it doesn't matter, they haven't experienced it. It still sucks when people can't relate to you, though.

 

1 hour ago, pjpsamson said:

when I mention the idea of dating someone or having a crush on someone the question is ALWAYS "what do you even want out of a relationship?" Including from the therapist I was seeing.

Wow, that's just cold. But I guess they could be so shallow to think they're only with their partners for the sex.

 

1 hour ago, pjpsamson said:

Also I know I have issues because a television network posting a picture of a rainbow cartoon sponge snowballed into me having an intense depressive episode at 3 AM.

Does it really matter whether or not asexuality belongs to LGBT, though?  You're not alone in any case.

[clover282]

I'm so sorry you feel invalidated  I kind of know the feeling, the other day I was looking at a post on the paws of pride instagram account, an account that's all about inclusitivity for LGBTQIA+ people, and there was a comment saying that asexuality, demisexuality along with queer and pan shouldn't be with the trans, gay, and lesbian flags because they're not real. And being a Demisexual I felt so frustrated by being invalidated by someone who should know what it feels like to be invalidated by society. There was even a reply saying they shouldn't invalidate queer and pan, but they agree Demisexuality shouldn't be included because it's "just a mindset". Like come on! People part of the LGBTQIA+ community should all know what it's like to be invalidated and made to feel "not normal", so this really annoyed me. I just tried to get over it, because I know there are so many people out there who know we are all valid, and I shouldn't care about a strangers opinion. So you're not alone! 

 

I'm also sorry for your friends bullying you about it, that must've been hard, but I'm here if you ever want a friend and heaps of other people on aven are here for you too!

[Astrea]

Hi!
 

I'm so sorry you have been bullied and that you are feeling lonely. It's hard to relate to the rest of the world, sometimes, and it can make you feel super isolated.  Also, I don't wish to play the 'old person' here but I saw you were born in 1999. Early twenties are a bitch - it's a very scary moment of your life where you generally don't have a stable employement, still care about things you lived through in school (I got bullied too, though more because I was a super swot with a healthy dose of disdain for some of my classmates which I've never even tried to hide 😅), get horribly desillusionned by confirming that nothing in your adult life is the way series, movies and books promised you it would be, and don't know where you are going.

I remember crying all the time when I was around your age. And my little sister, who is one year younger than you are, just started that magical phase of her life. I actually had never really realized this before last month when I talked to my crying sister and, thinking back, I was like... oh yeah, I remember that shitty time of my life ^^

I'm not saying everything is easy afterwards. Life is inherently scary : my father is dying and that just pushes on the 'what if you stay alone for the rest of your life and get sick and die without anyone around?' button in a not very nice way, which I cope with by trying very hard not to think about it.

But I really don't care about what other people might think about me being ace. I'm not even really annoyed at people going 'why are you alone? But you're so pretty! (translation 'there must be something deeply wrong with you / did you get rejected by ALL THE GUYS?')' or 'Oh, you don't have children / are not married YET?' anymore.

The fact that I write mainly  YA books for a living doesn't really help (it's hard to explain to people that liking children litterature doesn't mean you actually like children enough to want to make them) so I'll probably always have to answer intrusive questions about my personal life (which isn't always easy : I am regularly invited by schools to talk about my books and I'll admit I've never had the guts to say I was ace in front of a class of students, I just evade the question by saying I like rabbits more than people).

For the longest time, asexuality being represented didn't matter much to me, but these days I'm realizing how much better I would have felt about this if my representation of happiness wasn't 100% shaped around successful sexual and romantic relationships.
So, you know... after ignoring the issue for years, I'm in the process of including more overtly asexual characters in my stories (from the start most of my hero.ins were ace, but it was never clearly said or all that deliberate and I'm slowly realizing that it's not enough). I'm also thinking about writing a webcomic about asexuality if I can get my hand of a decent illustrator interested in doing this. Channelling your crippling insecurities and fears into actions is always good, I think. I'll give it a try anyway ^^

About your other points : the fact that a lot of people seem to think that a relationship is mostly (or all) about sex is pretty sad in itself. 

I don't really understand the LGBT+ controversy, which I discovered a few days ago, never really having looked into this before. I don't really get this. To me, LGBT+ isn't about 'who have it worse' but more a banner thing for all the people who aren't included into the overwhelming 'norm' so we can all support each other (more of a 'not cisgender romantic straight' people organisation with smaller groups who don't have exactly the same issues / aspirations but who are just united towards incredible goals like 'existing' and 'being left alone by normies who don't care for our sexual identities / preferences'). But that's one more point which makes me think we should work more on our representation. We can't find our place probably because ace is only understood in a negative way as what we don't do / want and not as what we are / do. It makes it hard to empathize and just identify with us. Once again, I'm guilty too. I remember getting an email from a fan years ago telling me how much he saw himself in one of my heroin and I didn't really understood what he meant as he stayed super vague. He added me on FB and I saw him post asexual themed videos this year (which kinda prompted me to reach out to the community too) and I suddenly thought 'Oh... that's what he meant' and felt bad I didn't even think about it at the time.

So you know, there will be hard times for all of us, like for everyone else but in a slightly different way. It's normal to be sad and to need support. But there are things to be done, I think. This is what AVEN has been working towards and there are still a million of ways to help yourself and other people from the community to get through life as happily as we can. ^^

[Plushval]

4 hours ago, pjpsamson said:

They would bring it up so much that I started to feel like it was my only defining characteristic.

Oh I can relate to the feeling of being reduced to your sexual identity. Of course it is a big part of me and who I am and it shapes my way of thinking at certain times because of different or in fact, lacking experience, I know that. But that doesn't mean that everything I say and every opinion I share is to be brought back to my sexuality and that it influences me to the fullest. For example, I once said something about a TV show not perfectly bringing out the romantic scenes of two characters who apparently fall in love, it was just so hidden from the viewer I found it a bit dull and unsatisfying. Even though that's just an opinion, and the characters didn't really catch me that much from the beginning if I'm honest, my sister really loved the show and started ranting about how I can't evaluate it anyway because I don't know these feelings in real life. Ouch. I have seen so much shows and read a lot of stories about people falling in love and I for myself know what I find catching and "well portrayed", so it's just an opinion from my side regarding the show. I said to my sister that she should be careful with her assumptions as it can really hurt my feelings, and it did. No one wants to be reduced to just a part of them, even if it's an important or very significant one. It makes you feel like the other person doesn't take you seriously and also doesn't see the worth in your words or opinions.

[aces&eights]

Hi!! 
I can relate to a lot of that. A lot of my friends have invalidated asexuality with the usual list; you’re in denial, you must be a prude, you’re incapable of love, relationships have to involve sex etc. And I even got into a debate with some of my gay friends since they don’t think asexuality belongs in the LGBT+. What is the MOST annoying is that all my friends are super left and progressive. They will throw up a huge fuss if a celebrity tweets something and the wording isn’t quite right so it seems like it excludes a certain group. Yet they have all these prejudiced and ignorant views on the asexual minority. All I can say is that some people, the good sort, if you sit down with them and have a civil conversation about asexuality, might come to a more inclusive understanding. It’s hard for others to understand what it’s like to have no sexual attraction particularly when there’s no media representation. A good chat can go a long way

 

Also if you’re ever lonely and wanna talk you can always pm me 😊

[Andrea KF]

I'm sorry I have no better advice than you should stop seeing that "therapist", but I just wanted to say Hello @pjpsamson!

 

[Madao]

Sorry to hear that you are feeling this way. I am also sorry that these people invalidated how you felt. I am a stranger to you, but I just want to say that you are 100% valid. Internet is full of trolls and ignorant people, who keep saying that aces don't belong. Cishet aces in particular receive a lot of backlash because apparently, they are 'privileged'. I have experienced lots of hate from such people too, back when I identified as cishet ace.

 

It might be a hard time for you right now, but stay strong. You are not alone, because no matter what, the ace community has your back. You aren't fake queer or a LGBTQ+ interloper. I have said this before too, but being queer is not some kind of oppression competition where being oppressed = being queer. You are valid as you are. The A in the LGBTQIA+ is Asexual for sure, to my knowledge. Also, the internet doesn't speak for the actual community, to be honest. There are loads of bigots out there who aren't even LGBTQ+, but just use the community's voice to spread hate. I have been to pride parades, and I have seen many asexuals proudly display their ace flags and other non-ace queer people support asexuals and tell them they belong. 

 

In conclusion, I will just say that I can totally relate from where you are coming from since I had been through that too, when I felt I don't belong. Try to ignore those who invalidate your asexuality for now. Hiding your identity might be painful, but it is for your own safety at times. Things will get better. And even if you feel you have no one, the asexual community has your back. You are awesome as you are! 

[pjpsamson]

I just wanted to say thank you to everyone for posting in this thread, it really means a lot to read your kind words and support! ❤️ I do feel much better after getting some sleep and reading these replies. Now I'll do some responding and maybe keep the conversation going haha.

6 hours ago, weird elf said:

I'm afraid it's a problem in every walk of life - someone overworked can't get behind people complaining of being bored at work, someone wishing for a family / partnership will find it hard to relate to someone complaining about too-demanding kids and / or significant other. Equally, someone struggling with their sexual needs can find it hard to consider someone with no sexual needs as belonging to the same group.

This is what I was trying to say when I said that I know people can't understand my perspective, but worded much better. I totally agree with this and ironically sometimes as someone who is (I'd like to think) pretty empathetic I find it hard to relate to someone that maybe has trouble trying to put themselves in someone else's shoes.

 

6 hours ago, Pandark said:

Does it really matter whether or not asexuality belongs to LGBT, though?  You're not alone in any case.

It's not so much that I wish to be a part of LGBT, I feel like it's more of the fact that people have a sort of attitude where it feels like they're saying Asexual people are valid, BUT... not as valid as us. The other thing that pisses me off is when people say that the a in LGBTQIA+ stands for ally and not asexual or agender or any sort of queer representation. Don't get me wrong, Allies are super important to the LGBT community and LGBT rights, and I don't really care if they have another a in the "never ending letter salad" as someone else put it in this thread, but when that happens it feels like they are excluding an actual minority to accommodate heterosexual people.

 

5 hours ago, clover282 said:

there was a comment saying that asexuality, demisexuality along with queer and pan shouldn't be with the trans, gay, and lesbian flags because they're not real. And being a Demisexual I felt so frustrated by being invalidated by someone who should know what it feels like to be invalidated by society.

I know! When I saw "Asexual" trending I expected to see some people that didn't understand what it was and just tweeted because they saw it trending, but I was shocked to find so many queer people kind of bashing the sexuality as a whole. Hearing people dismiss pan as well is a new one to me haha, it's so wild.

 

5 hours ago, clover282 said:

There was even a reply saying they shouldn't invalidate queer and pan, but they agree Demisexuality shouldn't be included because it's "just a mindset"

It's so crazy how often this is brought up. I've certainly had the whole "it's just a mindset" thing said to me a number of times.

 

4 hours ago, Astrea said:

For the longest time, asexuality being represented didn't matter much to me

I was in the same boat, I was kind of put off from identifying as asexual because of my experiences in high school for a while, I didn't even tell anyone I was asexual until a year into college or so. I went to a party about half a year ago and I mentioned I was asexual because someone was kinda flirting me and asking if I was into guys or girls and everything. I then felt like I was having a press conference because everyone around that area started asking me questions about it (which I didn't mind, I'd rather have people be educates than make assumptions) and someone asked me how I felt about the lack of asexual representation and I said I didn't care, but my tune has kind of changed. I watched Bojack Horseman at the beginning of quarantine and if you didn't know there is a character who has a whole asexual arc. Honestly watching it made me come to terms with some things that I didn't even realize I still hadn't come to terms with and ultimately I think became more accepting of myself. 
So that convoluted story was to say that I thought representation didn't matter, but now I realize it really does, especially for people that haven't even realized they're ace yet.

I also wanted to say that this was a really nice message and I related to a lot more parts of it, but I don't have much to add onto most things you said. I just don't want you to think that all I got from your nice message was this tangentially related paragraph based on a sentence. I'm sorry to hear about the hardships that you and your family are going through. Stay strong and you can certainly PM me if you need to talk!
 

4 hours ago, Plushval said:

Of course it is a big part of me and who I am and it shapes my way of thinking at certain times because of different or in fact, lacking experience, I know that. But that doesn't mean that everything I say and every opinion I share is to be brought back to my sexuality and that it influences me to the fullest. For example, I once said something about a TV show not perfectly bringing out the romantic scenes of two characters who apparently fall in love, it was just so hidden from the viewer I found it a bit dull and unsatisfying.

Yes! I heavily relate to this. It is a big part of me and I don't mind talking about it, in fact a lot of times I like to talk about it, but it's not all I want to talk about. My friends in high school used to actively avoid talking about relationships around me, fictional or real, and it just felt shitty because of course I couldn't speak on those topics from experience, but I'm not stupid. We live in a culture that talks about romance and sex so much and to think that I don't have the first clue about any of that stuff is honestly just insulting. Also the idea that ace people can't relate to romantic media is total BS. Even if I've never experienced a lot of the things happening in a romantic context I can still relate from platonic experience or even romantic feelings I've had that aren't experiences.
 

3 hours ago, aces&eights said:

And I even got into a debate with some of my gay friends since they don’t think asexuality belongs in the LGBT+. What is the MOST annoying is that all my friends are super left and progressive. They will throw up a huge fuss if a celebrity tweets something and the wording isn’t quite right so it seems like it excludes a certain group. Yet they have all these prejudiced and ignorant views on the asexual minority.

I really don't understand how THIS is where the line is drawn in the sand. Like to me sexuality is such a crazy spectrum that I don't think you can really play the semantics and strict definition game with it? I'm sorry that you have to deal with that hypocrisy.

 

1 hour ago, Andrea KF said:

you should stop seeing that "therapist"

I did haha. I don't have a great track record with therapy. The therapist or counselor or whatever at my high school just outwardly denied that asexuality was even a thing.

 

1 hour ago, Madao said:

Cishet aces in particular receive a lot of backlash because apparently, they are 'privileged'

I feel like as a cishet ace I do have some privilege and I won't deny that, the thing I hate is how dismissive people are about it. And exactly as you said even if I do I don't see why that should exclude me from the community just because I'm not as oppressed. It's truly amazing how misunderstood asexuality is, I've even had my straight friends say they wish they were asexual because then they wouldn't have to worry about the toils and issues of relationships.

 

Whew I spent about an hour and a half writing all that, I hope everything makes sense!

[pjpsamson]

I also just want to say something that I forgot. I'm not trying to force myself into LGBT or LGBT+ in fact I never really viewed myself as being in the LGBT umbrella until my gay and trans friends started to include me. I don't want to stick my nose where I don't belong, but the denial of ace or cishet ace people just seems somewhat arbitrary and exclusionary to me. I'm honestly not even positive I'm heteroromantic, and not biromantic, but I come from a family and town of homophobia so I always dismissed and suppressed any sort of even slightly homoromantic thoughts because I didn't even want to begin to have to deal with that where I was from.

[Someone Else]

Sometimes -- maybe not always -- it really is "everyone else" and not you.  Once upon a time (and even sometimes now sadly as I've seen all too often in the news) people decide to invalidate the humanity of people of a different skin color.  They're wrong.  It doesn't matter how many of them believe it, or how sure they sound, they're still wrong.  They're being nasty people and we don't really need their validation.  They need our raised middle fingers, if they can't be educated.  
 

[MmmynameisEl]

I feel you. When I came out a few years ago, I saw how toxic the LGBTQ community could be towards Aces, but I also saw those people who accepted them. I feel like my asexuality and my gender dysphoria go hand in hand, usually I stress so much about my dysphoria. BUT, lately I also have been struggling with just my sexuality, so while having both problems is tough, I feel like just dealing with asexuality has its share of heaviness, so you shouldn't feel invalidated whatsoever. I recently came across the term "Asexual Elitism", and it's scary how accurate the concept can be when applied to my beliefs. I've been a lot more open to others' sexuality, but lately I'll have complete meltdowns because my asexuality has created a dysfunction in my life where I judge people and feel so out casted from the rest of the world. I know it's wrong to judge others for their sexuality and to be so harsh, but for some reason I just can't shake my disdain for sex. So on top of this, you can imagine the strain it puts on my relationship with a heterosexual male who considers himself a nymphomaniac. We constantly get in arguments because of my insecurities and biases around sexuality, even though he accepts that I'm asexual, and lately even anti-sexual. Sorry for the long rant, but yesterday I was literally sobbing and felt so alone, so I want you to know you're not alone. ❤️