My partner in denial about being ACE

[Vexed2018]

I'm pretty sure my partner is ACE. We haven't had sex in over a year. He gives excuse after excuse after excuse, from no sex gives him mental clarity, to waiting until we're married ( which he knows we have no intentions on doing), to not while my kid is home or he needs to shower to.......  I'm so frustrated! I have tried bringing up Asexuality and he denies this is what he experiences, then makes jokes or postures like we'll have sex, but something always gets in the way. I'm tired of the constant let down. The gaslighting. The disappointment. It's making me someone who nags all the time, which I hate.

 

He lives with me, and honestly if not for this pandemic I think I would ask him to leave. I just need more of a connection than he can give, no matter how much we love each other. 

 

It use to hurt when he showed no concern when I discussed sleeping with other people, at one point early on he encouraged it. I admit that on my I hadn't made the connection to his possible Asexuality, and I was trying to use immature manipulation to get him to have sex with me. Back then I would never have slept with anyone else and still have not. But now that we have been together for so long he claims to hate the possibility of me being with someone else, while I think it is what I need in order for us to survive.

 

Honestly I know what I need to do, I'm just not sure how to get the idea that he may change out of my head. 

 

 

[Daniella]

The fact that he's lost his sex drive doesn't necessarily mean he's asexual, there could be different causes, for example work or personal stress, hormone imbalances, obligation and so on :,0 I think that maybe you should talk and think about a cause that may not be asexuality at first if he's claiming he's not. I think you guys can solve it together talking about it and not end the relationship since you two have a child. Tell him how you feel and be patient, avoid blaming or judging. Try to do lots of exercise to alleviate your frustration and focus on your hobbies, masturbation will also help. You said that one of his excuses is no sex until marriage, maybe he does have an intention on marrying you and he believes in something, I think you should talk more about that and discuss calmly. You should tell him what you told us here, that those jokes hurt you because of the situation you're in.

[AceMissBehaving]

It can be harder for some men to accept the idea they may be asexual because of the way sex is tied in to societal ideas of masculinity.

 

If he was on the defensive when the idea was put out there, there’s an even higher chance of it getting brushed off.

 

It’s possible that there is another reason for his behavior, but it’s also possible that he could be ace and have no idea. 
 

The jokes after you mention it could point to the threatened masculinity thing, which can be a lot to untangle, and might have some additional baggage from the past.

 

Some very careful conversations at a time where there hasn’t been any pressure for, or arguments around sex might help, but it could also require a lot of patience and support to get him to feel comfortable looking into the possibility.

[Guest]

Well there are a lot of reasons why he might not want to have sex aside for asexuality... maybe his has no libido, maybe he's gay, maybe he's no longer attracted to you, maybe he is sex repulsed, maybe he wants to remain celibate for other reasons etc.

 

But really the why isn't so important, it's the fact that he won't communicate honestly and that you are unhappy which is important. If he refuses to communicate and you can't reach a compromise with which you are both happy then whether he is asexual or not is irrelevant, the relationship is going to be a train-wreck either way.

 

45 minutes ago, Vexed2018 said:

Honestly I know what I need to do, I'm just not sure how to get the idea that he may change out of my head. 

He might change, but would that potential future change be worth months or years of frustration, gaslighting, disappointment? Will you even still like him by that point?

[Vexed2018]

Sorry, because there has been so much I didn't type everything in my original post. From the very first time we met, our sex frives haven't matched. Even on our first date where things could have possibly gone farther, he abruptly left because he had a sandwich he wanted waiting for him at home. After we did finally have sex, it was few and far between the first year. He mentioned low libido so we discussed going to his doctor, buying health supplements, seeing a therapist regarding stress, depression and other mental health issues, finances everything. However, I feel that as I was trying to come up with solutions, he just needed another excuse that would buy him time. Finally in March of 2019 he said he wanted to focus on his creativity so no sex until July. In July he moved it to August. August became Nobemer, November  became March. Niw here in April nothing has changed. 

 

Also no amount of talking helps. He calls me addicted to sex and says I need therapy because it runs my life. He also says the conversation gives him anxiety anytime I bring it up. I'm open to therapy and would do it in a heartbeat, but he backs out  when I bring it up.

 

Also, we dont have a child together. The child is mine from a previous marriage. 

 

Hopefully this gives a better idea of what I'm getting from him and what we have considered prior. 

[Vexed2018]

9 minutes ago, AceMissBehaving said:

It can be harder for some men to accept the idea they may be asexual because of the way sex is tied in to societal ideas of masculinity.

 

If he was on the defensive when the idea was put out there, there’s an even higher chance of it getting brushed off.

 

It’s possible that there is another reason for his behavior, but it’s also possible that he could be ace and have no idea. 
 

The jokes after you mention it could point to the threatened masculinity thing, which can be a lot to untangle, and might have some additional baggage from the past.

 

Some very careful conversations at a time where there hasn’t been any pressure for, or arguments around sex might help, but it could also require a lot of patience and support to get him to feel comfortable looking into the possibility.

I definitely figured out the pattern after reading through post on this site. If I bring up sex (wanting it, lack thereof) he then immediately goes into- come here girl I'm going to give you this thing or some other overtly sexual ruse. I used to believe that something would happen, but now I know it's posturing. He'll euther be obnixious so I am no longer interested or a reason to get out of the situation.  I do think it's because hos masculinity is threatened. I'm honest about how I have acted selfishly and perpetuated stereotypes about men in sex due to my lack of understanding and my frustration. 

[Vexed2018]

11 minutes ago, theV0ID said:

Well there are a lot of reasons why he might not want to have sex aside for asexuality... maybe his has no libido, maybe he's gay, maybe he's no longer attracted to you, maybe he is sex repulsed, maybe he wants to remain celibate for other reasons etc.

 

But really the why isn't so important, it's the fact that he won't communicate honestly and that you are unhappy which is important. If he refuses to communicate and you can't reach a compromise with which you are both happy then whether he is asexual or not is irrelevant, the relationship is going to be a train-wreck either way.

 

He might change, but would that potential future change be worth months or years of frustration, gaslighting, disappointment? Will you even still like him by that point?

I definitely have had all these reasons go through my head. He says he is attracted to me and that it hurts him to think that he doesnt. He'll also give me compliments on my look when I have a new hairstyle or cute clothes.  He'll even smack me on the butt any chance he gets, but none of that translates into sex or kissing or passionate touching.

 

And you are right about if the label matters and communication ia everything. It's the lack of open communication that is driving me insane. His leaving the window open for the possibility, when deep down inside he probably knows it won't happen. 

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, Vexed2018 said:

He says he is attracted to me and that it hurts him to think that he doesnt. He'll also give me compliments on my look when I have a new hairstyle or cute clothes.  He'll even smack me on the butt any chance he gets, but none of that translates into sex or kissing or passionate touching.

Are you and he aware of the split attraction model? It has it's issues but could help you both with understand what it is he is feeling for you.

[AceMissBehaving]

14 minutes ago, Vexed2018 said:

I definitely figured out the pattern after reading through post on this site. If I bring up sex (wanting it, lack thereof) he then immediately goes into- come here girl I'm going to give you this thing or some other overtly sexual ruse. I used to believe that something would happen, but now I know it's posturing. He'll euther be obnixious so I am no longer interested or a reason to get out of the situation.  I do think it's because hos masculinity is threatened. I'm honest about how I have acted selfishly and perpetuated stereotypes about men in sex due to my lack of understanding and my frustration. 

It’s hard being the asexual person in a mixed relationship, but it’s also really hard being the sexual partner, so I can certainly sympathize with your hurt and frustrations.

 

We can’t change the past, and I think these kinds of responses can be pretty common and normal, but it’s still possible to overcome and get to a more positive place to jump off from for future conversations.

 

21 minutes ago, Vexed2018 said:

Also no amount of talking helps. He calls me addicted to sex and says I need therapy because it runs my life. He also says the conversation gives him anxiety anytime I bring it up. I'm open to therapy and would do it in a heartbeat, but he backs out  when I bring it up.

Quote

This sounds very familiar to how I used to feel with my husband. At the time I honestly did not understand that sex to

a sexual person was something more than a “want to do” activity, like swimming or hiking, so I would get annoyed because I thought I was perfectly in step with the rest of the world, and couldn’t understand why he made such a big deal about it. 
 

It’s possible your fella is currently the same way. If you don’t experience sexual attraction it’s easy to confuse things like romantic attraction, aesthetic attraction as being sexual attraction.

 

I’ll admit my biggest “oh shit, I’m definitely asexual” moment was when I learned how sexual people actually feel, and saw how different my experience was to theirs 

 

 

 

[everywhere and nowhere]

1 hour ago, theV0ID said:

maybe he is sex repulsed

If he's sex-repulsed to the point of never wanting to have sex, he is effectively asexual.

[hypnopompic]

1 minute ago, Nowhere Girl said:

If he's sex-repulsed to the point of never wanting to have sex, he is effectively asexual.

But Vexed2018 wrote that they had sex "few and far between the first year". Could a sex-repulsed asexual overcome his aversion not once but multiple times? Aren't most sex-repulsed asexuals so averse to even the idea of having sex that they never try it (I'm coming from a place of ignorance here since I'm sex-neutral, so I do not intend to generalize or stereotype!)?

[Memento1]

Geez, that sounds like it would be so frustrating and unfulfilling.  It sounds like you guys have a deep sexual mismatch, and have since the beginning.  You feel that he's not been honest with you about his true feelings, and you think at times you may have contributed to this by pushing it and trying to get sex from him anyway.  Now you wonder if you change your approach, whether things could improve and he could want sex again.  Is that a decent summary?  Did I leave out anything?

 

Well it sounds like you already know what you want: it's probably time to break up.  You're obviously mismatched sexually, on top of having communication problems and growing resentment and bitterness both ways.  It would take an extraordinary amount of work from both of you to resolve the communication and intimacy gap, with no guarantee on the sexual mismatch, and there is absolutely nothing wrong with going your separate ways because of that.  There's usually a pressure from society than you have to go to every length possible to keep a relationship together or else you will be judged as flaky and selfish - that as long as there's love, you should suck it up and try to work through things.  Is that something that's holding you back?  Personally, I think it's perfectly acceptable to love someone and still break up with them - that the best thing for both parties is to find a better match elsewhere.  Not that he'll necessarily thank you for it.  If you felt differently, if you had a large drive to stay together and energy to spare to do the hard work required, I may say differently, but you are the expert on your own feelings, and it sounds like there's not much goodwill left in the tank to start such a large quest.  That's not a judgement; it's just an acceptance.

 

It's definitely a terrible time to be considering a break-up, so I feel for you.  The added pressure of a pandemic adds an exta dimension to worry about.  I'm sorry.  But it sounds like you know yourself pretty well, and are really trying to respect both your own desires and his: I think this bodes well for your ability to find a path forward to relief.  Godspeed!

[Vexed2018]

1 hour ago, theV0ID said:

Are you and he aware of the split attraction model? It has it's issues but could help you both with understand what it is he is feeling for you.

I'm not, but I'm looking it up now!

[Vexed2018]

1 minute ago, Memento1 said:

Geez, that sounds like it would be so frustrating and unfulfilling.  It sounds like you guys have a deep sexual mismatch, and have since the beginning.  You feel that he's not been honest with you about his true feelings, and you think at times you may have contributed to this by pushing it and trying to get sex from him anyway.  Now you wonder if you change your approach, whether things could improve and he could want sex again.  Is that a decent summary?  Did I leave out anything?

This is an awesome summary! Like therapeutic level of summarizatuon!

[Guest]

10 minutes ago, Memento1 said:

break up

especially if one or the other party starts using words like 'gaslighting' it's gone so deep. That whatever another person says, either party... becomes just more gaslighting.

 

Both get help... 😕. 

[Vexed2018]

18 minutes ago, Memento1 said:

There's usually a pressure from society than you have to go to every length possible to keep a relationship together or else you will be judged as flaky and selfish - that as long as there's love, you should suck it up and try to work through things.  Is that something that's holding you back? 

I think what is holding me back is that outside of our mixed matched sexualties, we are good together. He accepts me flaws and all and I do the same with him. We motivate each other and make each other laugh. For me of this one aspect of sex was addressed I would feel fulfilled in our relationship.  I imagine that if I didn't complain about sex he too would feel completely fulfilled in our relationship. So overall a combination of love, his desire not to seperate, or me doubting that I will find someone that matches my vibe like he does, keeps us where we are.

[Vexed2018]

1 hour ago, AceMissBehaving said:

I’ll admit my biggest “oh shit, I’m definitely asexual” moment was when I learned how sexual people actually feel, and saw how different my experience was to theirs 

What pronpted this moment? 

[hypnopompic]

14 minutes ago, Vexed2018 said:

What pronpted this moment? 

I know you didn't ask me this question but maybe my answer can help you as well. I already suspected that I'm asexual because when I had sex with my first boyfriend, I could see that our experiences were not the same. He always seemed very focused on me and my pleasure, he was completely "present" in the moment while my mind would always wander off to simple tasks such as writing a shopping list or thinking about last night's movie. I asked my female friends about their sexual encounters and what they told me totally differed from my experiences. I then thought this was due to my boyfriend and I being virgins and I figured he simply wasn't good at keeping me rooted in the moment. But I knew that this couldn't be the reason because two of my friends had also been with virgins and according to them, sex was still enjoyable for all parties involved.

 

After this failed relationship, I sought out a man who had been with a lot of women and claimed to know that he was doing (total douchebag but I needed his expertise for my experiment). Turns out he really had a lot of experience and quite a few tricks up his sleeve but no matter what he was doing to my body, no matter how hard he tried, no matter which method he would use to try and give me pleasure, my mind would still wander off and completely disconnect. To me, it felt robotic, technical, like operating a machine to get a certain result. That's when I was 100% sure that I'm asexual.

[Memento1]

3 hours ago, Vexed2018 said:

So overall a combination of love, his desire not to seperate, or me doubting that I will find someone that matches my vibe like he does keeps us where we are.

Okay, so you want to work through your ambivalence.  It's normal to feel competing desires in such a situation.  It could help to know where you're at, first.  How important is a change from the status quo to you?  And how confident are you in your ability to make a change if necessary?  I have assumptions based on what you've already said, but I'd rather double-check we're on the same page.

[AceMissBehaving]

31 minutes ago, Vexed2018 said:

What pronpted this moment? 

Honestly the thing that really sealed it was reading this part of the forums. I kind of got the feeling I was off the mark before then, but having this resource of people spelling it out without the expectation of there being shared experience or knowledge was invaluable.

 

How to have the conversation with your guy, I’m not sure if he won’t check out sites like this. But it might be a key puzzle piece that helps put things together.

[Traveler40]

18 hours ago, AceMissBehaving said:

How to have the conversation with your guy,

So, herein lies the problem for a number of folks who end up on AVEN. Either he will honestly come to the table and want to learn about himself or not. You can’t force it, and he must want it. For the partners who want to avoid a deeper understanding of the issue, there’s nothing you can do. 
 

The OP’s description of her partner pretending to want it for a hot second as a caveat emptor really hit home. That fruitless routine initially creates hope, then it changes to bewilderment, eventually leads to questions, morphs into resentment and culminates in apathy regarding sex of any kind with the rejecting party.
 

You can love your partner and create a solid life with them, but you cannot make them face these fundamental differences unless they want to. If you’re young and relatively unencumbered, I’d think about splitting up and move on.

[Vexed2018]

4 hours ago, Memento1 said:

How important is a change from the status quo to you?  And how confident are you in your ability to make a change if necessary?

On a scale from 1 to 10 with 1 being not important and 10 being extremely important, I am at a 7. I'm at a seven and not say an 8 or 9 because there are definitely times where sex is not as imperative for me throughout the month- where I can focus on myself sexually and be okay or I'mjust not that in the mood. 

[Memento1]

21 minutes ago, Vexed2018 said:

On a scale from 1 to 10 with 1 being not important and 10 being extremely important, I am at a 7. I'm at a seven and not say an 8 or 9 because there are definitely times where sex is not as imperative for me throughout the month- where I can focus on myself sexually and be okay or I'm just not that in the mood. 

Okay.  So changing loses importance because sometimes you're okay without sex, or can make do without his involvement.  The benefits of the status quo also are that he's otherwise accepting, motivating, and humorous.

 

And changing is important because...I have to take guesses here based on what you've said and what other people commonly say, so tell me if I'm off the mark.  Changing gains importance because sex makes you feel desired, wanted, and connected.  Also because your communication in general is suffering, where you can't openly talk and listen to each other.  You don't feel connected, your sexuality isn't accepted, and you want a relationship that feels authentic and supportive. Is that right?  Anything else?

[Vexed2018]

26 minutes ago, Memento1 said:

27 minutes ago, Memento1 said:

Okay.  So changing loses importance because sometimes you're okay without sex, or can make do without his involvement.  The benefits of the status quo also are that he's otherwise accepting, motivating, and humorous.

 

And changing is important because...I have to take guesses here based on what you've said and what other people commonly say, so tell me if I'm off the mark.  Changing gains importance because sex makes you feel desired, wanted, and connected.  Also because your communication in general is suffering, where you can't openly talk and listen to each other.  You don't feel connected, your sexuality isn't accepted, and you want a relationship that feels authentic and supportive. Is that right?  Anything else?

I guess changing doesn't lose important, maybe just urgency. There are times when I am less willing to put up a fight, but still desire and am open to intimacy with him. Everything else is spot on. 

 

[Grey-Ace Ventura]

Why did you capitalize ace?

[anisotrophic]

I think it’s very hard to be happy in a relationship where you don’t feel like someone is honest with you, and loves you for who you are. Communication and empathy.

 

You can give, and you can ask, but you can’t make someone else give those things. You can give acceptance, validation, and support for someone else’s asexuality. You deserve the same for your own sexuality (which might be very linked to your experience of love, that’s pretty typical for sexual folks).

With communication and empathy, you can figure out where to go from there together. But without it, you have to draw your own lines.

To be honest, it’s very hard to know what’s happened here, if he’s not communicating. For all I can tell here, he’s hiding a porn addiction, homosexuality, or whatever else.

 

My partner lets me ask for sex, he’s not repulsed by it (just doesn’t care about it), and I’m used to asking and doing everything “in bed”, and — now that we understand the difference between us — he’s very kind about my own desire for it. He never put on a show, was never invested in the heteronormative role (identified as bi before learning about asexuality).

 

So... I don’t have any advice on how to deal with potential denial & avoidance. It sounds awful and I don’t think you should learn to live with that. Our sexuality (or lack thereof) is a core part of why we are; it’s why gay rights matter — we deserve to value this part of ourselves, without shame.

[Memento1]

1 hour ago, Vexed2018 said:

I guess changing doesn't lose important, maybe just urgency. There are times when I am less willing to put up a fight, but still desire and am open to intimacy with him. Everything else is spot on. 

Okay, so change is important, but urgency varies.  Regardless of urgency to change, do you think you have resources to make changes - personal or social resources?  Do you have confidence in your ability to change things if you wanted to?

[Traveler40]

Nailed it @anisotrophic - thank you.

[Vexed2018]

2 hours ago, Grey-Ace Ventura said:

Why did you capitalize ace?

I'm confused by the question, yet hopeful that it comes with gentle education. But to answer it, there was no specific reasoning 🤷🏿‍♀️

[Vexed2018]

1 hour ago, Memento1 said:

Okay, so change is important, but urgency varies.  Regardless of urgency to change, do you think you have resources to make changes - personal or social resources?  Do you have confidence in your ability to change things if you wanted to?

Resources, yes. Confidence I could get there. I definitely realize I'm plagued by self doubt in this situation.