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Whore*of*Mensa

Sexual jealousy; trying to understand

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Memento1
31 minutes ago, More*of*Wenceslas said:

But sometimes it feels like the more you care about someone the less you can actually do to help them! I read something today about how people (well this was about men but might not just be men) get angry and defensive when they feel vulnerable. So maybe when you’re the person they confide in you end up in the firing line.

Oh-ho yes!  I've even had that happen to me on AVEN - gave someone some advice in a poorly worded way, and they ripped my head off.  If I hadn't wanted to help, I wouldn't have put myself in that position.  I am very aware now that when people are in pain, they are more likely to lash out defensively.  I'm training to become a therapist and it's something that terrifies me - I'm putting myself in the firing line by making myself the person people confide in when they're vulnerable.  I'm trying to learn all the skills I can to avoid triggering defensiveness, as well as how to deal with it if it happens.

 

I'm trying to change my view a bit - not that the more I care, the less I can help, but the more I care the more I am drawn to unhelpful behavior like advice-giving. ;)  I always try to FIX things, or cheer them up, or change the situation.  I can't change someone, they have to change themselves.

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Whore*of*Mensa

@Memento1 I think you’ll be a brilliant therapist. You’re like my therapist on AVEN! I always find your comments helpful.

 

The defensiveness is scary. In a way you can’t become vulnerable yourself if you want to help people?  I guess you have to have a therapy room in a public space and make sure you have support around you.

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Whore*of*Mensa

What this thread has done for me is helped me to stop blaming everything on my asexuality. Since discovering it this year I’ve been revising everything, like it all has hidden meaning that I didn’t see before, and thinking that every single problem was down to me/asexuality. 

 

Also I thought if I just explained about asexuality to my ex he’d get it and realise I never fancied other men...That definitely didn’t work out..!

 

It’s been so helpful to get this reassurance that this particular issue wasn’t actually about me at all. 

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Whore*of*Mensa

He saw my daughter this week. I think my fears are unfounded - he wouldn’t upset her.

 

Despite his mental confusion I believe he’s a good man. He never forced me into compromise or anything else. He understood, like nobody else could - because of his own trauma. And that’s why I loved him so much.

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anisotrophic
On 12/16/2019 at 3:52 PM, More*of*Wenceslas said:

I read something today about how people (well this was about men but might not just be men) get angry and defensive when they feel vulnerable.

I can't cry anymore. Barely able to. I think, if I focus, I can bring myself to the state where some tears come. A few. Easier when alone, need to not feel guarded.

 

I used to be unable to prevent crying. It would just happen. I might need to leave a situation, if I didn't want someone to see it, because I was unable to prevent it.

How I reacted when distressed – with tears – or now, with silence and anger – it wasn't a choice I was making. I hadn't known how much hormones would change this.

 

This isn't bragging: I'm miserable about it, I think it's awful. Without crying I think I can't figure out how to feel better, others can't see how miserable I feel. It's the biggest thing I wish I hadn't lost, and I imagine it might be a big reason I would stop, if I ever do. (I trust the tears would return as quickly as they disappeared; it was dramatic, it happened almost immediately, and from what trans women say, very reversible.)

So... yeah, it might be about men. I never appreciated before how little choice there was in it.

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Whore*of*Mensa

Wow. I always try not to 'gender' things like anger and crying, but that does sound about right to me from what I've observed. That is such an amazing insight to get. 

 

When you are angry can you talk about it, or is the silence a part of it? It seems so sad to think about the emotions trapped inside like that. Do you think you will learn different ways to release them? (sorry for all the questions, feel free to ignore them!)

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ryn2

That really is interesting!  It also (anecdotally) implies the push to “raise your boys to be comfortable with expressing their feelings, rather than telling them ‘boys don’t cry!’” may not have as much impact as predicted.

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ryn2

That also reminds me how, when she started the HRT part of her transition, a MTF trans friend of mine (who had played keyboards in a rock band for 15 years and several records) stopped performing and songwriting because she “just didn’t have all that anger to get out anymore.”

 

She attributed it to no longer being frustrated about her body and identify, but maybe that wasn’t the entire story.

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anisotrophic
4 hours ago, More*of*Wenceslas said:

When you are angry can you talk about it, or is the silence a part of it?

I do, and maybe socialization – living female for four decades – helps with that.

But my husband has trouble realizing how unhappy I am, and then... I think I stop talking because he doesn't seem to care. I actually use an app to track mood, and have for many months now, and showed him how bad it was at one point, and he was shocked – had no idea. Some of it may be adjustment: he has to learn that I won't cry anymore when I'm miserable.

 

@ryn2 yeah... people attribute a lot of behavior changes to stuff like dysphoria relief and "living the new identity" but... it was crazy, I noticed the crying thing within a day or two! Harder to pinpoint other stuff, but I think there's some genuine other things ... I think my reflexive empathy & worrying about what others think seems to have dropped a lot – empathy feels like more of a deliberate act than it was before. My mood feels flatter, in general. And a caveat: everyone's body reacts differently to male/female hormone states. But, my husband has been suggesting a punching bag... 😅

 

PS, edit to add – yeah it does seem really sad that men may genuinely, on average due to hormone effects, have a harder time with expressing unhappiness.

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ryn2
1 hour ago, anisotrophic said:

it does seem really sad that men may genuinely, on average due to hormone effects, have a harder time with expressing unhappiness.

It’s certainly less optimistic than “we aren’t raising them effectively.”

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appleseedy

we have biological differences, tis my belief physical differences lead to intellectual and emotional differences. No matter who you are you can try to become more aware of what your body is telling you. Being able to access emotion has been a long and hard won battle. As a man i can cry and i can let emotion into my voice, i can let my feelings colour my language.

 

As to raising boys, or girls or whatever they are :) there's no manual, All they need is unconditional love and attention, the more you heal the more you can be there for them

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anisotrophic
48 minutes ago, appleseedy said:

All they need is unconditional love and attention

And rules and clothes that fit and doctor visits and childcare and sick days and diapers and help with homework (but not too much) and elusive foods that are both "healthy-ish" and "considered edible"... 😞 </tiredparent>

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appleseedy
1 hour ago, anisotrophic said:

And rules and clothes that fit and doctor visits and childcare and sick days and diapers and help with homework (but not too much) and elusive foods that are both "healthy-ish" and "considered edible"... 😞 </tiredparent>

hehe, the struggle is real

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ryn2
1 hour ago, anisotrophic said:

foods that are both "healthy-ish" and "considered edible"

Even as an adult I often question this food exists.

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Whore*of*Mensa

I am such an idiot, I tried again...I mean, I tried to be a friend to him. 

 

He got made redundant, I thought I was being so supportive and helpful. I made suggestions and I praised every idea he had on what to do with his redundancy pay and what to do next.

 

But, I got into bed and cuddled him again, and now he won't stop mentioning it and wanting it to happen again. 

 

And when I said no or wasn't keen he said 'Did I detect a smirk when I told you about my redundancy?' and now he's working himself into a frenzy that I smiled when I found out he was to be made redundant. 

 

How do I explain to him that he is sexually attracted to me but he basically hates me? I think he's the one confused about this, not me...This stuff about sex = love, I'm sorry but sometimes that's absolute rubbish. 

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ryn2

From what you’ve described it sounds like - for whatever reason - he just isn’t capable of being friends with you right now.

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Whore*of*Mensa
15 minutes ago, ryn2 said:

From what you’ve described it sounds like - for whatever reason - he just isn’t capable of being friends with you right now.

He never wanted to be friends with me. I'm really seeing this now - he wants us to be friends with benefits, it's all he's ever wanted from me. He should never have left his wife, basically. And, I'm sorry to say this, he doesn't deserve my friendship and he never did. I thought one day we'd get past the sex, but we were never getting past the sex because that's literally all he wanted from me. 

 

I've been watching youtube videos, about narcissists...And it's all seeming a little too familiar...

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ryn2
4 minutes ago, Whore*of*Mensa said:

he doesn't deserve my friendship and he never did.

Sounds like time to back away from the whole thing.  He will have to find a friend, or a FWB, elsewhere.

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Whore*of*Mensa
1 minute ago, ryn2 said:

Sounds like time to back away from the whole thing.  He will have to find a friend, or a FWB, elsewhere.

Yeah, I'm trying...He's going to keep on for a while but he'll give up eventually.. Thank you..You are kind to talk to me about this.

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ryn2

I remember you felt uncomfortable actively blocking him because he maintains contact with your daughter...

 

What about changing his name in your phone to something that will help you ignore him and then just not engaging?  If you don’t read his messages you won’t be as bothered by the whole thing, and if you stop responding he will likely get bored eventually.

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Whore*of*Mensa
16 minutes ago, ryn2 said:

I remember you felt uncomfortable actively blocking him because he maintains contact with your daughter...

 

What about changing his name in your phone to something that will help you ignore him and then just not engaging?  If you don’t read his messages you won’t be as bothered by the whole thing, and if you stop responding he will likely get bored eventually.

Yeah, I have to do this. I keep trying to reason with him and it doesn't work. 

 

I'm going to do 'grey rock' as advised by the psychologist on youtube...Become boring...don't react....

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ryn2

Excellent approach!

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