Coping, hoping, doping and shopping. Do you do it?

[RakshaTheCat]

Reading book "How Will Capitalism End? Essays on a Failing System" by Wolfgang Streeck inspired me to ask this question, since it explains behavior of most people I know very well. Do you do all of those things yourself?

• Do you struggle with `earning your right to live` and being constantly told by society that you are worthless garbage unless you find a way to have a lot of money?
• Do you hope you will be rich one day?
• Do you dope yourself by using various performance-enhancing or performance-replacing substances?
• And finally, do you do a lot of shopping, to  justify your constant race for more money, and of course, for the glory of almighty GDP?

 

Or maybe you are one of the lucky ones who doesn't have to cope much anymore, and now you are just enjoy telling those less lucky that they are lazy, worthless and useless losers? 😺

[Chris Zulas]

whatever the solution is the current system is poop. ik for a fact that stuff makes people happy, always has and always will, but the way we put keeping up with people and idolizing wealth is kinda poop. as for feeling like shit for not feeling worthy to live bc i dont work, ya it sucks. people in my shithole town are usually as poor or poorer than me and yet say shitty stuff about it.  if i were rich id get a nice one story house, pay off whatever, and just chill. totally doable if ur in that condition, but since ill almost certainly never be rich itll be income based housing for me.

as for doing drugs, i dont have any performance required of me but weed is legal for my age and place of residence, and it makes me feel good and not bad, better than my prozac and stuff. not for everyone, and no replacement, but hey.

[RakshaTheCat]

18 minutes ago, Chris Zulas said:

whatever the solution is the current system is poop.

Last time when something a bit similar happened, `solution` found itself with two world wars... I don't think anyone found realistic solution for current problems though, other than `stop being poor and get lucky to join rich 1% before more things collapse`...

[Lord Jade Cross]

...

[Guest]

I don't really do any of these things, I'm in a relatively well paid job which here in the UK does not quite support me and my daughter - but I definitely find I'm spending money in things to try to avoid her feeling inadequate. 

 

Because one thing capitalism does is make people feel bad if they don't have stuff...advertising preys on people's insecurities. There is some very sophisticated psychology at work, it's not that easy to overcome. I grew up in a very middle class family, was always better off than my friends so didn't understand why they wanted 'stuff'. But then, I've been a single parent, not been able to give my daughter that same sense of superiority and 'we don't need this' mentality. I get how the system works, how it makes people feel inadequate. 

[RoseGoesToYale]

57 minutes ago, Marcin said:

Do you struggle with `earning your right to live` and being constantly told by society that you are worthless garbage unless you find a way to have a lot of money?

I was born and live in the United States, so yes. In this culture your entire worth as a living being is based on what you contribute to society and how much money you make. I'm unemployed and looking for a job, and I've never had a job before, and I'm terrified to say so, because not having a job equates you to scum here. Even in hobbies, people, random strangers, will attempt to justify yours by monetizing them. E.g. at Ikea a few weeks ago a woman asked me if I do creative things, I said yes. She asked what I do, I said I make beaded jewelry. She immediately asked if I sell what I make, and I had to dodge her question using the ol' education schtick. I don't sell what I make, and I don't know if I will, all I know is making them makes me happy. But everything equals money here. Happiness, self-efficacy. Consider the American brand of feminism... if you're female and you don't have high career goals, or sell and buy feminist things, you're not only a failure as a feminist, you're a failure to womanhood.

 

1 hour ago, Marcin said:

Do you hope you will be rich one day?

No. Being rich means more money to have to calculate, more people begging you for money, and the insecurity of never knowing if the people around you love you for you or for your money.

 

1 hour ago, Marcin said:

Do you dope yourself by using various performance-enhancing or performance-replacing substances?

Not really. I do consume caffeine, not for energy, but because I find the drinking of coffee to be gustatorily pleasant.

 

1 hour ago, Marcin said:

And finally, do you do a lot of shopping, to  justify your constant race for more money, and of course, for the glory of almighty GDP?

Eh... Of course, I do buy things. I try not to buy new if I can help it. I lack a lot of things most Americans consider to be status symbols, like a tv, video game consoles, designer handbags, expensive computers, etc. My mother and stepfather, on the other hand, are the most materialistic people I know. They have to have luxury cars, a spotless beautifully-decorated house, expensive jewelry, expensive food. They also seem to be addicted to real estate shopping, because the previous house the bought to downsize (haha!) in was too small and mother wanted to move back to Middle'O'Nowhere and have 10 acres of land. They bought a huge house on some farmland, and now they're starting to feel the pinch because the house they thought would get snapped up hasn't gotten anything. Why? Because they cut down all the trees and xeriscaped the property, it's as lifeless as a ghost town. I'm now guffawing to myself, as they flounder in their previous attempts to look sleek and better than everyone else. I knew it would catch up at some point.

 

Not worth it, at all.

[Gloomy]

I don’t need much money. I don’t live with any other humans so there’s not much of a reason for my lair to have more than one bedroom. My car is just the thing that gets me from point A to point B so I’m fine with driving a shitty used one. I refuse to spend extra money on clothes just because they’re from a certain designer.

 

I do consume a lot of coffee though, so I guess I still partake in “doping”.

[InDefenseOfPOMO]

21 hours ago, Marcin said:

Reading book "How Will Capitalism End? Essays on a Failing System" by Wolfgang Streeck inspired me to ask this question, since it explains behavior of most people I know very well. Do you do all of those things yourself?

• Do you struggle with `earning your right to live` and being constantly told by society that you are worthless garbage unless you find a way to have a lot of money?
• Do you hope you will be rich one day?
• Do you dope yourself by using various performance-enhancing or performance-replacing substances?
• And finally, do you do a lot of shopping, to  justify your constant race for more money, and of course, for the glory of almighty GDP?

 

Or maybe you are one of the lucky ones who doesn't have to cope much anymore, and now you are just enjoy telling those less lucky that they are lazy, worthless and useless losers? 😺

 

The best things in life are the things that have not been commodified, privately owned, priced, and exchanged in markets for profit. I do my best to live outside of the whole private-ownership-utility-maximizing-price-rationing-market regime.

 

Anybody can view the sky. Nobody owns the rights to viewing the sky. Viewing the sky has not been commodified, priced and bought and sold in markets. I know of few things more satisfying and fulfilling than being under a clear, sunny winter sky that has absolutely no clouds. The serenity and awe that that gives me exponentially exceeds the benefits of anything I have ever purchased in a market-price-rationed exchange.

 

The problem is not "stuff". The problem is that we have been socialized from the moment of birth to be homo economicus, almost everything has been commodified, and nearly every place has been turned into a price-rationing market.

 

The day will probably come, unfortunately, when viewing the sky is commodified and privately owned and to experience it you must be a consumer in a market purchasing the right to experience it from an owner who makes a profit from the transaction.

 

Probably the best most of us can do is enjoy experiences outside of capitalist markets as much as we can and meanwhile do everything we can to resist further encroachment of such markets.

[RakshaTheCat]

5 hours ago, RoseGoesToYale said:

In this culture your entire worth as a living being is based on what you contribute to society and how much money you make.

I think it might be even worse than that. Money part is certainly true, but, hmm, have you ever seen anyone being admired for contributing to society by paying taxes for example? I've only seen admiration for those who manage to avoid paying taxes by some creative accounting, and constantly demand more tax cuts, because `contributing to society` is for losers.
 

5 hours ago, RoseGoesToYale said:

Consider the American brand of feminism... if you're female and you don't have high career goals, or sell and buy feminist things, you're not only a failure as a feminist, you're a failure to womanhood.

I've read that capitalists happily supported this kind of feminism exactly because it means more cheap labor and more customers. Capitalists managed to actually hijack good cause and turn it into profit...

As for career goals, here is interesting quote from the book:

Quote

[...]to have a dream for oneself is a moral duty that comes with being a member of the community, perhaps the last remaining duty under liberal individualism, regardless of the circumstances in which one may currently be living

So yep, career is the only thing that is important right now. Nothing else matters...

 

 

5 hours ago, Jade Cross said:

Usually people get drunk on the false sense of power that money creates, instigating them to find more. You get a new car but "oh a new model just came out so I have to have that one"  Got a decent house "but man does that one on the hill look great, I need that too" And so on and so forth. 

I'm not sure if people want, more like people are expected to do it by peers. I feel that for society and peers, you are either ambitious career person, or you are worthless lazy slob...

 

5 hours ago, Jade Cross said:

This is how people are bled out of their money non stop and why prices always go up and up. Isnt it strange that nobody ever advocates for simpler life styles? Why dont banks ever play ads of someone getting a smaller house or a less extravagant vacation that doesnt involved traveling halfway around the world? 

Heh, banks are here to make money, so of course they will do everything they can to squeeze it out of you... Who could play those other adds?

[Lord Jade Cross]

....

[ColeHW34]

I rather be on the run in a van without any permanent residence or any indication to where I'll be going.

It always has appealed to me to travel all over the place.

[Guest]

11 hours ago, Marcin said:

• Do you struggle with `earning your right to live` and being constantly told by society that you are worthless garbage unless you find a way to have a lot of money?
• Do you hope you will be rich one day?
• Do you dope yourself by using various performance-enhancing or performance-replacing substances?
• And finally, do you do a lot of shopping, to  justify your constant race for more money, and of course, for the glory of almighty GDP?

-I was raised to believe wealth was in the mind. I grew up poor, but believed my situation was circumstantial vs it being something I would have to be all my life as a result. 

 

I read a lot if books, and armed my mind. "I can't" was removed from my vocabulary as a result. Same with failure. I focus on positives and lessons. 

 

How you expect to grow out of poverty with a poor man's mind state already accepting that you're worthless and doomed to fail?

 

I was surrounded by dejected people who had done just that. Told they were garbage, so lived accordingly. Did crime accordingly. Messed their lives up as they were expected to.

 

Peeing in elevators, cockroaches and rats and nobody cares. Dog shit on their lawn. Nobody cleaned up.

 

My mother always had a pristine lawn, bed of flowers and we thought she was delusional in acting like she wasn't going to be poor her entire life seeing that is all we saw (failure and poverty). We only understood her philosophy later as teens. 

 

-I don't hope to be rich, but I will live very comfortable with a few properties to my name within the next 10 years. A business within the next 5.

 

Being rich is irrelevant. Financial freedom is important to me. Main reason I financially invest heavily into my future.  I am very ambitious and to me nothing stops me from my goals other than myself.

 

I believe in simple and humble living, but do love to travel so my lifestyle must afford me those luxuries. 

 

My friends told me I was crazy with my lofty goal of traveling the globe back in the days.

 

-I was raised to shun medicine. I prefer natural treatments such as tea and fruit and certain vitamins and natural antioxidants.

 

-I buy on a need basis. I am likely to spoil a girlfriend than myself. But wouldn't date you unless you shared my mind on simple living anyways. 

 

I rather save my money and grow it for future goals. 

 

Start small, finish big. 

 

Chasing wealth you will fail. Chase freedom. 

[Alawyn-Aebt]

12 hours ago, Marcin said:

• Do you struggle with `earning your right to live` and being constantly told by society that you are worthless garbage unless you find a way to have a lot of money?
• Do you hope you will be rich one day?
• Do you dope yourself by using various performance-enhancing or performance-replacing substances?
• And finally, do you do a lot of shopping, to justify your constant race for more money, and of course, for the glory of almighty GDP?

I-No

II-Not directly, but I want to do things that cost money. 

   I always want to travel extensively, sadly travelling can add up even when one is pretty frugal.

   Basically I have things I want to do that cost money, and I know what I would do with money if I had it, but I have no desire for money by itself.

III-No, goes against my principles

IV-No, I only buy what I absolutely need and I really dislike it when people buy things for me.

12 hours ago, Marcin said:

"How Will Capitalism End? Essays on a Failing System" by Wolfgang Streeck

While I have not read that book, I am aware of Wolfgang Streek and I admire his work. I think he might underestimate the ability of Capitalism to change (despite what I want to happen). Particularly now (post-2008 Recession) as we have seen an explosion of recognition of Economic theories (MMT, Post-Keynsian, etc.) that, if they could muster political support, would change Capitalism for the better while still keeping it Capitalistic.

[Chihiro]

12 hours ago, Marcin said:

• Do you struggle with `earning your right to live` and being constantly told by society that you are worthless garbage unless you find a way to have a lot of money?

I am deliberately unemployed (since years) but I am not struggling with earning my right to live. By carefully managing my money, I have managed to make a plan that will allow me to live comfortably/travel internationally without needing to work (for a certain duration). FYI, I am not on any govt benefit, disability benefit etc and neither have I won lottery/inheritance to get to this point. I had to work hard/smart to get to this point.

No one has told me I am useless. If anything people think I am filthy rich but oh boy, they are so so wrong (not sure what makes them think that). I made the mistake of inviting someone to travel with me and it went horribly wrong. (Because they were busy spending money like it was water, which isn't how I spend my money)

 

Quote

• Do you hope you will be rich one day?

Being rich has never been a goal in my life. If I ever become rich it will be because I love making money. Money itself is boring and in day to day life, I barely spend it on myself because I live a minimalist lifestyle. I wonder, this thought hadn't crossed my mind until now.... did I become unemployed to prevent myself from having too much money? *starts thinking*

 

Quote

• Do you dope yourself by using various performance-enhancing or performance-replacing substances?

No. Don't consume caffeine either.

 

Quote

• And finally, do you do a lot of shopping, to  justify your constant race for more money, and of course, for the glory of almighty GDP?

Nope. I live a minimalist lifestyle so that will never happen.

 

@Perspektiv has written some good stuff so I won't repeat it again. I will just highlight few key phrases that he used- "poor man's mind state" and "financial freedom" and those who are interested can learn about it from my friend "google"

 

 

[uhtred]

12 hours ago, Marcin said:

Reading book "How Will Capitalism End? Essays on a Failing System" by Wolfgang Streeck inspired me to ask this question, since it explains behavior of most people I know very well. Do you do all of those things yourself?

• Do you struggle with `earning your right to live` and being constantly told by society that you are worthless garbage unless you find a way to have a lot of money?
• Do you hope you will be rich one day?
• Do you dope yourself by using various performance-enhancing or performance-replacing substances?
• And finally, do you do a lot of shopping, to  justify your constant race for more money, and of course, for the glory of almighty GDP?

 

Or maybe you are one of the lucky ones who doesn't have to cope much anymore, and now you are just enjoy telling those less lucky that they are lazy, worthless and useless losers? 😺

No not really any of those things.

 

It depends on what is meant by "a lot of money" but I have a job that pays OK, and that I enjoy (mostly) so I don't mind working very hard at it.   

 

I know that money doesn't equate to happiness - you need enough to live comfortably, but beyond that the gains are small. I'd be happy to have more money (and to be dashingly handsome, and a rock star), but I don't need any of those things.

 

No drugs of any sort. 

 

I do sometimes buy things I don't need - but then "need" is a funny term. We need food, shelter, clothing medical care. Beyond that its all about how to get the most enjoyment out of whatever money we have. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Neutral Charge]

12 hours ago, Marcin said:

Reading book "How Will Capitalism End? Essays on a Failing System" by Wolfgang Streeck inspired me to ask this question, since it explains behavior of most people I know very well. Do you do all of those things yourself?

• Do you struggle with `earning your right to live` and being constantly told by society that you are worthless garbage unless you find a way to have a lot of money?
• Do you hope you will be rich one day?
• Do you dope yourself by using various performance-enhancing or performance-replacing substances?
• And finally, do you do a lot of shopping, to  justify your constant race for more money, and of course, for the glory of almighty GDP?

 

Or maybe you are one of the lucky ones who doesn't have to cope much anymore, and now you are just enjoy telling those less lucky that they are lazy, worthless and useless losers? 😺

1. i used to struggle, but i got to a place where i can earn a decent amount that allows me my range of goals ( travel, tech books food so on) it was hard and had to work twice as much (working in a field dominated by men, they were quite mean) and i had to learn a lot of things like shitloads 😂

 i used to have my own business but in the end i came to the conclusion that running for the money takes more time from you then you will get to enjoy, this is just in the beginning of a business ( what i assume) mine lasted 4 years before i didn't want it anymore, it didnt fail i just felt its robing me of time and freedom more then a normal job would - all the space that it occupies in your mind its to much for me personally.

2. Nop, i hope i have enough to keep living with my freedom( a small house, food and cheap travel maybe) and enjoying life and the planet im on and the nice ppl i meet :x

3.No, i do dope myself to survive other aspects of selling my freedom for money so i can survive in a society  that doesnt understand or accept me the way i am anyway, and i often think about moving to the country side and not requiring society after i get myself the tools for independence ( i dont mind the work of the land and caring for animals)

4. I do shopping of things that i feel attracted to in order to  distract myself from the standard boredom of daily life normally

 

Imma look up that book sounds like it brought up some interesting points :x

 

[Neutral Charge]

1 hour ago, ColeHW said:

I rather be on the run in a van without any permanent residence or any indication to where I'll be going.

It always has appealed to me to travel all over the place.

i debated that at least twice, even found a group of ppl who were traveling in europe by campervan and living togheter working random places =)))

[RakshaTheCat]

5 hours ago, Aebt said:

While I have not read that book, I am aware of Wolfgang Streek and I admire his work. I think he might underestimate the ability of Capitalism to change (despite what I want to happen). Particularly now (post-2008 Recession) as we have seen an explosion of recognition of Economic theories (MMT, Post-Keynsian, etc.) that, if they could muster political support, would change Capitalism for the better while still keeping it Capitalistic.

His theory is that capitalism naturally changes to be more efficient with extracting value from everything through constant growth, and this is what has been happening unhindered for few decades now. Any other change needs external force (governments did that in the past).

 

Do you think those new economic theories could muster some support? Who could realistically support them?

[ColeHW34]

I also consider taking a 10 minute long cool shower or volunteering for about 7 hours to be a healthy coping mechanism.

Volunteering kept my anxiety down enough to stop stuttering and my headaches for a while.

[Anthracite_Impreza]

21 hours ago, Marcin said:

Do you struggle with `earning your right to live` and being constantly told by society that you are worthless garbage unless you find a way to have a lot of money?

Yes, no matter how much I tell myself it's bollocks. Sometimes I outright lie about my job, because when people find out it's voluntary they start grilling me on why I don't have a "proper" one. The fact I sometimes do 12 hour days FOR FREE doesn't seem to lend me any worth at all.

 

21 hours ago, Marcin said:

Do you hope you will be rich one day?

I certainly hope I'll have enough for me and the cars to be comfortable, and yes, extend the car family.

 

21 hours ago, Marcin said:

Do you dope yourself by using various performance-enhancing or performance-replacing substances?

No, but I do "self-medicate" with certain legal drugs if I'm feeling particularly shit.

 

21 hours ago, Marcin said:

And finally, do you do a lot of shopping, to  justify your constant race for more money, and of course, for the glory of almighty GDP?

No, I buy very little for myself, only food, clothes and games (the last two being rare). Most of my money goes on the cars, easily over 10K in the last few years. I'd buy them a hell of a lot more if I could, not as a justification, but because I love them and they deserve it (and me and Blitz want to do drifting/dragging so hello money-pit).

[InDefenseOfPOMO]

10 hours ago, Perspektiv said:

-I was raised to believe wealth was in the mind. I grew up poor, but believed my situation was circumstantial vs it being something I would have to be all my life as a result. 

 

I read a lot if books, and armed my mind. "I can't" was removed from my vocabulary as a result. Same with failure. I focus on positives and lessons. 

 

How you expect to grow out of poverty with a poor man's mind state already accepting that you're worthless and doomed to fail?

 

I was surrounded by dejected people who had done just that. Told they were garbage, so lived accordingly. Did crime accordingly. Messed their lives up as they were expected to.

 

Peeing in elevators, cockroaches and rats and nobody cares. Dog shit on their lawn. Nobody cleaned up.

 

My mother always had a pristine lawn, bed of flowers and we thought she was delusional in acting like she wasn't going to be poor her entire life seeing that is all we saw (failure and poverty). We only understood her philosophy later as teens. 

 

-I don't hope to be rich, but I will live very comfortable with a few properties to my name within the next 10 years. A business within the next 5.

 

Being rich is irrelevant. Financial freedom is important to me. Main reason I financially invest heavily into my future.  I am very ambitious and to me nothing stops me from my goals other than myself.

 

I believe in simple and humble living, but do love to travel so my lifestyle must afford me those luxuries. 

 

My friends told me I was crazy with my lofty goal of traveling the globe back in the days.

 

-I was raised to shun medicine. I prefer natural treatments such as tea and fruit and certain vitamins and natural antioxidants.

 

-I buy on a need basis. I am likely to spoil a girlfriend than myself. But wouldn't date you unless you shared my mind on simple living anyways. 

 

I rather save my money and grow it for future goals. 

 

Start small, finish big. 

 

Chasing wealth you will fail. Chase freedom. 

 

The lack of empathy and compassion in posts like the one above is breathtaking.

[Zagadka]

I put more stock in being comfortable, whatever level that is for you. That can depend on how you were raised, but could just also be personality. I don't know what I would do with that much money. If I have healthcare, friends, comfortable living... that's cool. I'd rather look at what I do have than what I don't. The air conditioning is on, so I'm pretty damn lucky.

 

I've used alcohol and some drugs because... it is fun, in moderation. Especially socially. Some of my best memories. I understand the need some people have to use them more abusively, and that is actually OK.

 

The one thing I do have... I don't want to stagnate. I am comfortable in life, I have a nice room in a nice house in a decent area. I'm slowly saving money overall. But I don't want to just accept where I am and not work to do better, and I don't have kids or a family to help take care of. I'll look got better opportunities, but I don't feel bad about where I am. I would be much more comfortable in a place with universal healthcare, though. I know a lot of people living paycheck to paycheck, and that isn't comfortable at all.

[RakshaTheCat]

33 minutes ago, InDefenseOfPOMO said:

 

The lack of empathy and compassion in posts like the one above is breathtaking.

And sad thing is, this is what seems to be expected of people. Even if you have conscience, I'm sure there are plenty charities whose main goal is to make donors feel good about themselves, so they will happily take care of it for a small fee. Even empathy got commodified 😺

[Alawyn-Aebt]

8 hours ago, Marcin said:

Do you think those new economic theories could muster some support? Who could realistically support them?

I do, some of them only work in some circumstances (MMT would only be fully effective for a nation [or currency-issuing board] whose currency is a/the reserve currency of the world, meaning in present day the USA maybe Euro) but what they offer could be great. Even while they might not fully work for everywhere, they do offer something for nations of all sizes and power.

 

The problem is people often think the finances of a government are equivalent to the finances of a person. Ignoring the fact one can literally print money and the other one cannot. Sadly the majority of people do not understand how the global economy works, besides the basic, "I spend money, the business gets my money, the government gets money from everyone, ad infinitum". If people could learn to look past those ideas and excessively-simple analogies they might easily embrace these different economic theories.

8 hours ago, Marcin said:

His theory is that capitalism naturally changes to be more efficient with extracting value from everything through constant growth, and this is what has been happening unhindered for few decades now. Any other change needs external force (governments did that in the past).

Makes sense, I must remember to read the book. The problem is Capitalism is not always as efficient as people claim. Certainly I do think the government plays an enormous role (one larger than most readily admit) in the economy. Does his argument make sense to you? What is your stance on Capitalism?

[Guest]

This is me in a nutshell, sometimes.

 

[Guest]

On 7/26/2019 at 3:21 AM, Marcin said:

Do you struggle with `earning your right to live` and being constantly told by society that you are worthless garbage unless you find a way to have a lot of money?

I don't need to earn my right to live, especially not with money. I just exist already, no matter if I have money or not. The concepts of existence and money don't depend on each other in that way, It makes just no sense to me. I know some may see it that way but I don't care. If society (whoever that is) tells me that I'm worthless, I would be fine with that and I wouldn't bother. I know my worth, and that is enough. I don't need validation from others because of a number on my bank account.

 

On 7/26/2019 at 3:21 AM, Marcin said:

Do you hope you will be rich one day?

Being rich would make things easier but not better. I'm a frugal person so why would I need to be rich? When I've enough money to survive on to maintain a few hobbies, why would I need to be rich? In fact I can't even keep that money, because when I die I'll lose it, like anything else. For me quality is more important than quantity. Time and health for example are more important to me than accumulating money for the sake of having money. Money is just a tool, not the holy grail.

 

On 7/26/2019 at 3:21 AM, Marcin said:

Do you dope yourself by using various performance-enhancing or performance-replacing substances

Never! Like I mentioned before, health is more important to me than money. These substances have heavy side effects. So, no thank you I'll do it my way but without destroying myself with these drugs.

 

On 7/26/2019 at 3:21 AM, Marcin said:

And finally, do you do a lot of shopping, to  justify your constant race for more money, and of course, for the glory of almighty GDP?

No, I mostly buy things out of necessity. For my hobbies like drawing and painting I like to buy stuff because I like to experiment with it. I don't buy the art stuff to justify the race for money. I buy it because it is fun to draw, to color, to paint. So my key motivation here is a qualitative thing. I don't see the point of classic status symbols like a big cars, a house, fancy clocks and such. Why would it matter to have those things for the sake of having them?

 

[Anthracite_Impreza]

3 hours ago, Aebt said:

The problem is people often think the finances of a government are equivalent to the finances of a person. Ignoring the fact one can literally print money and the other one cannot. Sadly the majority of people do not understand how the global economy works, besides the basic, "I spend money, the business gets my money, the government gets money from everyone, ad infinitum". If people could learn to look past those ideas and excessively-simple analogies they might easily embrace these different economic theories.

Finally, someone else who gets it.

[Calligraphette_Coe]

On 7/25/2019 at 9:21 PM, Marcin said:

Reading book "How Will Capitalism End? Essays on a Failing System" by Wolfgang Streeck inspired me to ask this question, since it explains behavior of most people I know very well. Do you do all of those things yourself?

• Do you struggle with `earning your right to live` and being constantly told by society that you are worthless garbage unless you find a way to have a lot of money?
• Do you hope you will be rich one day?
• Do you dope yourself by using various performance-enhancing or performance-replacing substances?
• And finally, do you do a lot of shopping, to  justify your constant race for more money, and of course, for the glory of almighty GDP?

 

Or maybe you are one of the lucky ones who doesn't have to cope much anymore, and now you are just enjoy telling those less lucky that they are lazy, worthless and useless losers? 😺

No, I'd probably tell you that 'The Man Who Dies with the most toys is still dead', or maybe even something from the Bible about the profit in gaining the world and losing your soul. Look at the present inhabitant of the White House- he has it all, yet he still can't stand the slings and arrows that come with being on the Big Stage.

 

Money and wealth are like a big magnifier--- having them will make you cater to your worst internal angel if that is way you're always been. If your an angel of a better nature, you'll find a way to give back and that money and wealth will be a means to you, NOT an end. And getting them almost always takes its pound of flesh from the recipient.

 

In the end, you're still only $3 worth of chemicals and that is where you will someday end up even if you have the most money in the bank ever. It's what you do while you're among the living, NOT how much you have when you die.

 

The real trick is to be happy no matter what life hands you. Not with what you can grab.

[Homer]

4x no

 

Now what

[RakshaTheCat]

16 hours ago, Aebt said:

The problem is people often think the finances of a government are equivalent to the finances of a person. Ignoring the fact one can literally print money and the other one cannot. Sadly the majority of people do not understand how the global economy works, besides the basic, "I spend money, the business gets my money, the government gets money from everyone, ad infinitum". If people could learn to look past those ideas and excessively-simple analogies they might easily embrace these different economic theories.

I've read about MMT and seems to make sense, but again, who will want to promote anything like that? I don't see anyone caring much about `doing things for the nations`, just profits (or GDP). I think problem might be from sociological point. Who will want to change current system, when those with power to change it actually benefit from current one?

 

16 hours ago, Aebt said:

Makes sense, I must remember to read the book. The problem is Capitalism is not always as efficient as people claim. Certainly I do think the government plays an enormous role (one larger than most readily admit) in the economy. Does his argument make sense to you? What is your stance on Capitalism?

I'm not really well versed in all those economy things, but what I've read seems to makes sense. I don't care about power, so for me, capitalism is kinda scary and very alien thing. I don't like  'winner takes all' attitude and current mentality that losers should be punished even more for being losers (to motivate them to stop being losers). Also, seeking profits seem to became `paperclip maximizer`, that maximizes profits just for the sake of it, without serving any meaningful purpose. But like I said, my understanding is limited.

 

3 hours ago, Homer said:

4x no

 

Now what

Well, you can teach those who do these things how to stop 😺