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G0D

Is AVEN learning?

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G0D

I have recently come back from another break, and I am surprised to see what I find.

 

I am not sure that I am right as yet but I have heard stories of moderators just contacting people and letting them off for stepping out of line, and I have also seen some topics that I think would have been deleted in the past. I am also seeing what seems like a more tolerant attitude towards political thinking.

 

No I am not going to try and take any credit for this. No I am not going to mock.. I am just going to say Well done, and thank you. I have always said and believed that AVEN was the right place for the asexual community, and my anger and sadness towards AVEN has always been about the silencing and ejecting of people from the community just because they had different opinions on things.

 

I don't feel like saying "Good start, but there is a way to go", because I am not privy to what has or hasn't changed.

 

I REALLY think AVEN NEEDS to monitor how it acts, and what the effect it's actions have, and take responsibility for it's actions. This may have already taken place, so I am just saying something here that I have said on the other site. 

 

I went through about 10 random declassed warning/nudges. Every single one I looked at stopped posting just after the "discipline" was administrated. If the aim is to ban people, then you should just ban people. If you want them to change then find a way to do that. I can offer a lot of suggestions that have worked with some very cantankerous people, it takes a lot less time, and effort than warnings do, and the person stays around, and usually they don't cross the lines again.  AVEN has a RESPONSIBILITY to act in a kind and fair way to EVERYONE. Just putting your head in the sand and saying "I don't think warnings push people away", AVEN HAS the stats, and info. AVEN SHOULD study it's effect, and publish the studies. Can AVEN do a diversity study, and include political opinion in it? Asexuality doesn't only affect people who vote one way.. Sorry.. I am on my high horse again, and I am trying to say thank you.. sorry about that.. Still it would be a good thing.

 

 

AVEN should be for everyone regardless of age, gender, sex, sexuality, race, size, etc etc, AND political, or philosophic differences. It should encourage people to discuss their opinions, and reach consensus, not be told that "You have no right to have an opinion if we say it's wrong".  That behaviour is the actual definition of bigotry, and I really hope people are actually starting to see that "hate" is "hate" no matter what reasoning you use for having it, it's still wrong.

 

I want to congratulate AVEN on changing. The happiest day of my internet life will be the day I can close ASM because people can just say what they want here without fear of harassment, or bigotry.

 

Thank you AVEN.. Please keep it up. Just talk to people, or let stuff go. People are remarkably decent to one another when the same rules apply fairly to all.. I suggest replacing the TOS with a single rule "Don't be a dick". I know it will never happen, but it's a dream. I am not going to fight till that happens, I am happy enough with just being able to express myself, and see other people able to do the same. 

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Guest

I think not being a dick is an important rule, but I can see why a site that has underage members would need a ToS. When dealing with sexual matters and minors together I could see how specific rules would be necessary in case of litgation. If it was just adults I say don't be a dick would be all that you would need really. Secondly I think a ToS helps define what being a dick is for all the different groups who use the site. Should it be exhaustive? No, it can't be. Should it be applied without having some kind of interview or hearing process? No. So you know as long as the rules are applied fairly and with compassion then I don't see any reason that the ToS should be tossed. Like all rules, they aren't meant to be mindlessly applied but used as a general guideline until sufficient evidence can be ascertained.

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Sage Raven Domino
56 minutes ago, G0D said:

I am not sure that I am right as yet but I have heard stories of moderators just contacting people and letting them off for stepping out of line, and I have also seen some topics that I think would have been deleted in the past.

This practice isn't new and depends on how the offended member reacts.

 

In April 2015, I received a PM from an admin asking me to remove a part of a post because a member had sent them a PM about being upset by it. Fortunately, I was online and edited that part out, and no disciplinary action was taken. I'd have been less lucky if that member had filed a report instead.

 

Surprisingly, I'm still a 'warning virgin'.

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G0D

@MiseryTriumphant What I am referring to is expression that could be called "political" opinion, I am not going to go in to it, as I just don't think it would be of any benefit to drag up the stuff that was happening, as it appears things are getting better. I agree though. Rules are necessary, but the interpretation, and application of the rules should be done dispassionately, and they should be enforced in such a way as to correct issues not eject people.

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G0D
1 minute ago, Sage Raven Domino said:

This practice isn't new and depends on how the offended member reacts.

 

In April 2015, I received a PM from an admin asking me to remove a part of a post because a member had sent them a PM about being upset by it. Fortunately, I was online and edited that part out, and no disciplinary action was taken.

 

Surprisingly, I'm still a 'warning virgin'.

Iv'e moderated a site with a lot of room for offence, and where people have wildly different ideas, and are very passionate about what they express themselves, and in the 3 years I have been doing that we only banned 2 people. 

 

 

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Sage Raven Domino
35 minutes ago, G0D said:

Iv'e moderated a site with a lot of room for offence, and where people have wildly different ideas, and are very passionate about what they express themselves, and in the 3 years I have been doing that we only banned 2 people.

Wait until you start having 50+ active members at peak hours and see how much heat there will be :P

 

The bigger a community, the harder it is to govern. Yours don't need advanced procedures yet.

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G0D
8 minutes ago, Sage Raven Domino said:

Wait until you start having 50+ active members at peak hours and see how much heat there will be :P

 

The bigger a community, the harder it is to govern. Yours don't need advanced procedures yet.

I used to be in charge of systems with a lot more usage than that. It just needs people to moderate parts of the site.. Oh like it is. Each moderator on AVEN isn't dealing with 100s of issues a day. Look at the declass and you can see how many warnings, nudges, and issues that have not been acted on to get an idea about the actual prevalence of moderation. On most sites moderation is a rare thing. Here though the moderation is carried out in a very odd way. More time is devoted to picking both the ToS, and content apart to find ways to totally assume some people are given 0 benefit of doubt, and also by voting anonymously, no one has to justify why they want to eject someone. 

 

Think of that last point a bit. Lets say all the moderators are all Christians, and they are asked to vote on what action to take about a comment by a fervent atheist. They get the ability to make any reason they like, but at the end of the day, who voted for action don't have to justify why because no one knows, and as everything happens under the vale of secrecy with no transparency at all, there is no way for anyone to hold the governing body to account. Also there is no desire to change the system because they believe that kicking out atheist is actually a moral thing to do. 

 

The above sort of goes a way to answer the other point I missed before. The reason many of us split from AVEN was because it was blatantly obvious to many people that their AVEN was dishing out "discipline" in an unbalanced manner. There were nudges being given if someone just generalised about a left political opinion, and this was interpreted as against the ToS. But it was a huge stretch. The "offending" comment was something like "The far left is known to deplatform its opposition". At the same time there are great long threads just defaming anyone who voted for Trump.. I am not a Trump fan, but call me radical, I really do think that rules should apply to everyone, and everyone who is asexual SHOULD be represented by AVEN.. If AVEN wants to be a political movement, then I have no objections to that, but to say it represents all asexual people, and then actively discriminate against half the population is wrong. It's also illegal.  

 

I am only saying all that, because it was something that was happening, it was something that many moderators expressed in private, and with pride. I have talked to many moderators, and they fervently believe that it's fine to eject people who do not have the same political opinions as they do. All part of this great "Everyone who questions my beliefs are Nazis" mentality. 

 

I genuinely am though saying that this situation seems to be on the mend, and from the information I am getting from people who are new here, and do have less left wing views, and do question aspects of the far left political dogma is that AVEN has talked to them when they have crossed over the line, and that it has become much more fair in it's application of the ToS, and it seems to be doing better in not giving people impersonal emails, and  giving them warnings, and points and all that jazz. 

 

I am not sure what the cause was of what seems like a change for the better, but I am very happy it is happening, and I really hope that one day ASM won't need to exist any more. 

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Sage Raven Domino
3 minutes ago, G0D said:

Think of that last point a bit. Lets say all the moderators are all Christians, and they are asked to vote on what action to take about a comment by a fervent atheist.

It's voting members' responsibility to ensure the diversity of the staff. Fortunately, mods', PT's and DT's responsibility to the electoral base is now amplified by the term limits and the votes of confidence.

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Guest Jetsun Milarepa

I'm also fed up with AVEN because, like you say in your first post, nothing really ever seems to be acted on.

 

When I came here, I thought it was a site for Aces to find support and develop community, with a view to greater visibility via educating people within and more importantly outside the ace community.

 

What I've been finding is that we mustn't rock the boat with the sexuals who come here to stamp it into our heads that we'll never understand what real life is like because we don't have such a 'deep and meaningful' relationship with sex.

We get enough of that crap outside of aven without coming here to be insulted, belittled and invalidated.

That's something I feel very strongly about .

 

So in a short while I'll be quitting. I might occasionally pop in purely to see if there Are any ace meets worth the train ticket, but I've found there are loads of other groups out there, by aces for aces.

Having spent 58 years scratching my head at the sexuals, I prefer the company of aces irl and not the ridiculous and unsafe space AVEN seems to be.

'Just hold on there' a mod sent me in a pm. I've held on long enough!

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Just Dani

@chandrakirti You're gonna be quitting AVEN soon? Aw... :( 

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Life Of Tass

@chandrakirti Hey, if you're going to be quitting AVEN soon, I want to wish you the best of luck in everything! We haven't really talked all that much but I've seen you around and you seem like a very nice person, so a proper goodbye seems in order.

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MichaelTannock

I find this whole thread disheartening

 

 

47 minutes ago, G0D said:

I am only saying all that, because it was something that was happening, it was something that many moderators expressed in private, and with pride. I have talked to many moderators, and they fervently believe that it's fine to eject people who do not have the same political opinions as they do. All part of this great "Everyone who questions my beliefs are Nazis" mentality. 

People of any political opinion can be banned, as that's not why people are banned.

I've found that when I member has thought that they've received action because of WHAT they've said, they received said action because HOW they said it breached the ToS.

 

 

38 minutes ago, chandrakirti said:

I'm also fed up with AVEN because, like you say in your first post, nothing really ever seems to be acted on.

Appearances can be deceiving. Many actions aren't visible, and can't be disclosed when enacted, e.g. warnings.

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G0D
32 minutes ago, Sage Raven Domino said:

It's voting members' responsibility to ensure the diversity of the staff. Fortunately, mods', PT's and DT's responsibility to the electoral base is now amplified by the term limits and the votes of confidence.

This place should be run as an open democracy. It is something I have said forever. Their is a wall of secrecy between the members of this place and the management, and you could argue it's fine. It's a private web site, and it can do what it likes. I'd agree if the site was just a discussion forum that had no real world ramifications. It isn't though. AVEN claims to accurately represent the population of asexual people. It has set its self up in such a way to monopolise that representation, It even extends its reach and rules to other sites. For an easy example of that, just check out the external links page.. ASM, and it's predecessor have been running for 3 years, yet no link is provided even though ASM actually obeys AVENs rules. AVEN is the only organisation representing a global sexuality group that is run as secretly, and democratically  as AVEN is. 

 

It has been the case that just bringing up objections would spawn a raft of people standing up for AVEN but all these people were actually being represented by the site. What had happened was that the whole admin group because closer and closer to 100% of one political outlook, and like the rest of the world they saw no reason at all why other political opinions should be expressed, so the rules were bent, and bashed to fit any thing at all, and the warnings they handed out made people quit, because people get upset when they are told "Your ideas are not welcome here". As much as this was being denied, the activists were going about singling out people and then reporting anything they could, where as those with less left bent politics were less likely to report people because they held the view that there is nothing wrong with the way they think, and accepted peoples right to hold a dissimilar point of view. 

 

The end result of all this was an AVEN that was run by, and run for asexual people, but only those who agree with everything out of the far left, all this encouraged the gulf between both political outlooks. 

 

AVEN should be a place for asexual people, and it really should take it's responsibility to represent us a lot more openly, fairly, and honestly more seriously. You can't discipline people for saying "The far right has a habit of deplatforming", because it generalises about a group AVEN members my identify as, but have threads with literally hundreds, if not thousands of posts on saying that anyone who voted for trump is a Nazi.. 

 

All that being said. I do actually want to reiterate something. I am seeing progress, and I congratulate AVEN for making it. Bigotry and prejudice have no place in the modern world, and I hope AVEN continues to understand that, and act accordingly. I also strongly urge AVEN to open up, and be more transparent. There are good reasons that democracy is done in public, and there is no good reason AVEN should operate secretly,. Again Thank you AVEN... 

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G0D

@chandrakirti You should pop over to ASM, and see what we are doing with the place. The diversity of opinion is really good, though there really isn't that much drama, and what there is tends to die out pretty quick. The difference is something else. Though this place really does feel like it has a better atmosphere than the last time I was here for any length of time. 

 

You have one hell of a post count... very impressive.. It will be sad not to see you about.. 

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Guest Jetsun Milarepa
10 minutes ago, Life Of Tass said:

@chandrakirti Hey, if you're going to be quitting AVEN soon, I want to wish you the best of luck in everything! We haven't really talked all that much but I've seen you around and you seem like a very nice person, so a proper goodbye seems in order.

That's very kind of you @Life Of Tass.

It's really 2 things...there's a limit to how many times you can say you had tea and cereal for breakfast and

There's also a limit to how many times you can post something innocuous and be attacked. Reminds me of my time with my abusive sexual husband...but he did his mental and physical abuse without needing a crazy enabler.

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MichaelTannock
4 minutes ago, G0D said:

You can't discipline people for saying "The far right has a habit of deplatforming", because it generalises about a group AVEN members my identify as, but have threads with literally hundreds, if not thousands of posts on saying that anyone who voted for trump is a Nazi.. 

Then report those posts that say "anyone who voted for Trump is a Nazi".

Users who make such posts would be disciplined as well, as the issue isn't Left vs Right for the Admod team.

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Guest Jetsun Milarepa

You just have to look at the 'hotboxing- get a room' thread below this one to see what I've put up with.

 

Later there was a post from someone congratulating them on another thread saying that they had 'seen off' 20 women at a time...unfortunately their gloating reply was edited quickly before I could report it.

There are more things out there than AVEN. Just because it's the first thing on Google doesn't mean it's the best or only thing.

 

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MichaelTannock

@chandrakirti you may not believe me when I say this, but I'd hate to see you go.

 

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Sage Raven Domino

The hotboxing thread was supposed to be an abstract request for a policy change (though inspired by a real precedent) that would serve myself well in the future, but then personal issues were brought into it... oh well. I guess I didn't pay enough attention to my language usage, sorry.

 

ETA: I used 'get a room' in the sense of Urban Dictionary definition #4, which I'm most used to because the other forums where I hang out are predominantly straight cis-male, and the expression is never understood in the sexual or romantic sense there.

 

Quote

Expression used to make fun of couples who are overly (and inapropriately) affectionate in public, and hopefully get them to stop. 
Sometimes used to poke fun at friends who aren't together but always argue and tease each other in front of their other friends, by implying they act just like a couple.

Edited by Sage Raven Domino

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LeChat

If it helps, having a look at the declass thread about forum bans shows that most were banned for being sock accounts.

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Sage Raven Domino

In case it helps, I'm open to the idea of a 'vote of confidence' where AVEN members with the right to vote (not only the admods) would decide if I've violated the ToS, and the poll results would be legally binding with no right to appeal. Now is the perfect time for me to get a warning because I'm not going to run for a position or use AVEN much in the next 3 months. 

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Guest Jetsun Milarepa
25 minutes ago, MichaelTannock said:

@chandrakirti you may not believe me when I say this, but I'd hate to see you go.

 

That's kind of you @MichaelTannock... I shall miss your cakes!😊

 

11 minutes ago, InquisitivePhilosopher said:

If it helps, having a look at the declass thread about forum bans shows that most were banned for being sock accounts.

This one isn't a sock puppet and is still happily stomping over aces heads pretending to be the world's expert in our community even as I type, so these would be of no use to me I'm afraid.

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LeChat
20 minutes ago, chandrakirti said:

...This one isn't a sock puppet and is still happily stomping over aces heads pretending to be the world's expert in our community even as I type, so these would be of no use to me I'm afraid.

I'm sorry; I'm completely clueless as to who you're talking about, as I'm not aware of all arguments that happen between members. I only meant to point out to @G0D and others that, if AVEN mods really had an "agenda/plan" and wanted to ban others with different opinions, based on political beliefs, then there'd be more bans than there are and most wouldn't be bans for sock accounts.

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DuskFire

I can't speak for everyone but this is my opinion and I'm sure others will agree with me.

 

I've never had a bad experience on AVEN and I've always felt very comfortable saying what i think unless it's saying it in a way that might be taken to be mean. Like even if you hate Trump and think that people who voted for him are Nazis. You don't have to bring that up online (a lot of people just voted for who they thought was best, even if it was from hate, don't purposly try to enrage others it's not nice). If you want to discuss stuff like that there are other websites I'm sure. But in that case I want to talk more difficult subjects I can just PM the person so not too possibly hurt others. I have met users that complain about being disciplined for what they claim is nothing (like saying what the absolute definition of asexuality is) but I don't know the full story though it has discouraged me from saying what I think certain definitions are about sexuality. But other than that really I haven't had any issues. I don't really like talking about political stuff anyways it's upsetting.

I do think it's nice how people try to put trigger Warning above things that might upset people. But then again I've forgotten before to do that so I can't get mad when someone else does the same thing. At least people are trying. The Admods especially have been very kind and supportive of me and others. I've been told I can message them anytime even if I just need to talk.

I have PTSD and I've been triggered by following members that post in the hotbox and not realizing I was in the hotbox by reading what they posted.

So maybe it would be good to have a warning when entering the hotbox when clicking on a post?

 

I can't say as much about more serious conversations because I tend to stay away from that stuff.

Im sorry you're leaving @chandrakirti

No website is perfect. But maybe you could just stay away from the hotbox like I do? Then you wouldn't risk getting upset.

 

But really an escape button like other minority websites have for AVEN would be great. That way people could quickly delete browser history and such if they're living in a abusive house. That and a warning saying that you're entering the hotbox would be great.

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G0D
6 minutes ago, MichaelTannock said:

Appearances can be deceiving. Many actions aren't visible, and can't be disclosed when enacted, e.g. warnings.

Yeah.... That's half the problem. 

 

No matter how many times someone says that "Warnings are just that" should just go through declass, find someone who is given a warning, and look at that date, and the date of their last post. I have done this, I want to do a study on it. the SHOCKING thing is that even though AVEN could easily take the hour or so to do this it hasn't.. If your warnings result in someone leaving, then it isn't fit for purpose. Well unless what you actually want to do is ban them. Also way more time is spent arguing about if they should have one, than simply mailing someone one to one, and being reasonable with them. It's like AVEN is the worst of both worlds... It's secrecy meant protect people is actually hurting them, and a thing meant to change behaviour just removers the person.

 

AVEN should act in a responsible manner, it should be actively trying to better it's self and the community, and doggedly inditing that it is all ok really, it's just secret so you don't see it, that statement, and the things I have got warnings for, and the other warnings I have seen, and the experience we here again and again of people being warned for just mad stuff, verses those who hold other views who have never had any trouble at all. What AVEN is asking us to do is just trust that AVEN is ok... Would ANYONE here say that we should just trust companies that their diversity is ok? Is there anyone here that thinks that government should be held in secret? AVEN has stricter non disclosure rules than most armies, or police forces, and there are a number of ex moderators, and serving ones who tell a VERY different story than the AVEN line of "Trust us we are fair". 

 

I remember asking someone a while ago in another thread here, "How many people have actually won their appeal", and the answer I think was something like 2 in 5 years, and I worked out the percentage to be tiny. And lets not even talk about the whole ASM (or AS-NS) cluster fuck vote... Yeah... And then there is my own experience with someone stalking the shit out of me. lying to everyone, creating incidents to frame me, and then getting everyone to believe them... Something I complained about at least 6 times to moderators, and then got you involved, and a whole load of other people, eventually they spill their lies out in public on another forum, a forum that AVEN actually linked to, a place I could actually reply to, and I did, and the person actually admitted in public that I was in fact telling the truth all along. So the opinion AVEN and MANY more people had come to was that I was actually stalking her, and what was AVENs actions after that? An apology? maybe a statement clarifying events for people? Come on... No what happened was that the site the person wrote all the the stuff on lost it's AVEN link because it refused to remove the offending material towards me (Please not I never asked for that to happen, and I didn't want it to, I even offered to save the site and host it my self but fie them complete autonomy) Then the person that did this was allowed to fake leave... Something AVEN had done before. So they announced they were leaving, then allowed to change their username, and come back as another person. I am not saying who, or anything else about that, as I don't wish any ill will towards the person who caused the problem for me. I do though have a very bitter taste in my mouth about that. But THAT is what is permitted if you are liked here, THAT is the actions taken against people with the right kind of politics. because fucking up someones life, and online reputation is fine so long as the victim is someone who dares to hold different opinions. And the idea that the person that actually did that, nearly year of harassment, and character  assassination  was even AFTER knew the truth was still treated as the victim, and I the aggressor, and the reason AS-NS didn't get the link was down to that. There is no way I could ever just say "I trust AVEN to deal with things fairly".

 

I really didn't want this thread to go this way. I was genuinely happy that things looked like they were getting better, but that short sweeping statement REALLY pissed me off. There is just no need for the secrecy here, and the fact there is so much doesn't absolve anyone of anything, and just because people can't "prove" they are being targeted because it's all most impossible to see what other people are being disciplined for, the fact that some people keep getting away with real breaches of the ToS, and it can be seen in the fact every day their words appear on a screen yet other people get warnings, for the slightest thing makes it obvious to many there is an issue. The other thing is that I do talk to a number of people who are moderators, and I have seen evidence this sort of stuff was happening, and the biggest 

 

Let me reiterate. If AVEN takes an action it calls a "warning", but the effect is that someone never comes back, and this happens in regularly what would a reasonable person say the "warning" was? You could say that "well it's not our fault people don't come back", but that would be to totally lack any responsibility, and to say "I can say anything I like, it's not my fault if people are offended", so if its not designed to kick people out but the effect is that it does, is that malice, or gross negligence. I have been banging on about this for years, and all it would take to actually find out is in your back room.. just do a study, and see how many people who get "warnings" leave as a result. Now I have been asking for that for so long it's ridicules so now it really is intentional negligence. 

53 minutes ago, MichaelTannock said:

People of any political opinion can be banned, as that's not why people are banned.

I've found that when I member has thought that they've received action because of WHAT they've said, they received said action because HOW they said it breached the ToS.

Do you guys have a script for dealing with these questions, because these don't actually answer the points. The whole system is setup so that it is biased. I really have a hard time understanding how anyone here could not see this. It's something that feminism, and those that accuse people of being racists keep going on about. It's the patriarchy of politics.  Let me just try and spell this out...

 

The following are generalisations, BUT in this case the generalisations are in fact the traits that identify them

 

Politically left person will report anyone who they judge to be offensive, because they believe that being offended is the SAME as being physically punched.

Politically centrist/right person will only report people if they actually perceive a threat, and in most cases see the report button as against the idea of free speech.

 

AVEN rarely deals with anyone where no complaint has been made, this is institutionally prejudiced against anyone with more right leaning / moderate thinkers.

 

Politically left person will face a group of people who are more motivated by political ideals to support this person and give them the benefit of the doubt.

Politically /centrist/right person will come up against the political beliefs of those on the left who believe that people should not be allowed to share ideas they disagree with.

 

Politically left person is then voted for or against by a secret vote, one where no one knows who voted for what, so the vote cast can be for any reason. As the person is just over eagerly defending a point of view that the majority agrees on, then there is less motivation for people to act.

Politically /centrist/right person will be negatively affected once again, as the left, and MANY AVEN moderators have said to me that they see no problem voting against and getting rid of people who they disagree with. After all many many on the far left view questioning feminism as sexist, questioning BLM as being racist etc, and you just have to read the Trump thread to see the opinions people have on people who's only crime was to vote for the "wrong person", and it's no coincidence that one of the most nasty parts of the antifa bunch is called BAMN... By any means necessary. 

 

And all this is way before we even get to how people actually take being told they are wrong, they are warned, and they feel rejected by the community that should be representing them. There is this attitude that seems to suggest that people who don't think the same way are unfeeling monsters. It's ridicules. I know from personal experience what it is like to get warnings that make no sense, and are blatantly unfair. It's this fucking "Drinking mens tears" attitude, it's like fucking disgusting nasty bigotry and hate disguised as equality, and compassion. 

 

Someone just go through your logs, find all those that have been given warnings, or nudges, and see when they last posted, also if you really want to be fair look at their political motives, just see how many leave... 

 

Any way I sort of regret writing all this. Well I do to a point. I was hoping to see people saying things like "yeah we have been trying to change", or at least some recognition of the issue, and perhaps being proud to be going in a different direction. It's sad to see the same old denial, and excuses. Hey ho.,... Mebee I was just wrong.. someone got lucky I guess. 

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Sage Raven Domino
36 minutes ago, DuskFire said:

But maybe you could just stay away from the hotbox like I do? Then you wouldn't risk getting upset.

Alas, this wouldn't work. In fact, Chandra's 'archrival' has been challenging her on multiple AVEN forums :( (can't be named because of the vigilante modding clause of the ToS).

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LeChat
23 minutes ago, Sage Raven Domino said:

Alas, this wouldn't work. In fact, Chandra's 'archrival' has been challenging her on multiple AVEN forums :( (can't be named because of the vigilante modding clause of the ToS).

Hmm, would it be possible for Chandra to "block" from seeing the member's posts? I also remember a mod recently mentioning that if a member notices that they keep being harassed by another member in different forums, to let the mods know and that they'd handle it.

 

I'm just trying to help Chandra find a solution to their problem, rather than feeling frustrated and leaving.

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Guest Jetsun Milarepa
24 minutes ago, Sage Raven Domino said:

Alas, this wouldn't work. In fact, Chandra's 'archrival' has been challenging her on multiple AVEN forums :( (can't be named because of the vigilante modding clause of the ToS).

And why shouldn't I be able to add anything innocuous to any forum or thread? 

Am I to be a 'good little girl' and not bother my little head about anything more than JFF or Chatterbox?

Let's push all the women into the background because it's about sexual males. 

In truth, my 'archrival' is reading all these as he follows my posts carefully.

 

But as I say, I'd rather move in Ace circles than mixed ones now, in real meets. AVEN helped me make my mind up about that.

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G0D
1 hour ago, MichaelTannock said:

Then report those posts that say "anyone who voted for Trump is a Nazi".

Users who make such posts would be disciplined as well, as the issue isn't Left vs Right for the Admod team.

It's not my job to police the site, and what is the point. the ToS is used like an ancient text stretched to include all sorts of stuff that isn't at all obvious. I mean where does it say in the ToS that making generalisations is an offence, especially when it's true. This is just one example of MANY

 

The thing is that I don't treat AVEN like a game, where I want to like every post that is critical of someone I dislike, and then find any excuse to report them, so I can get rid of them. Many of us KNOW this happens here. It's not some silly thing those paranoid people dream up,  I have seen the evidence. I have had my own personal dealings with all levels of AVEN and I have heard the stories of so many people and read the screen caps. I am sorry I don't think it is a reasonable thing for an organisation that claims to globally represent what it thinks is 1% of the worlds population, so that's 75,000,000 people,  for that organisation to operate in secrecy, and be accountable to no one. We shouldn't have to trust you AVEN, we should be able to see what is going on, and have a say in it. It should NOT be the job of the moderators to police the moderators, and if we don't even know what is being decided let alone who voted for it then how can anyone say that AVEN is representative of the group it claims to represent.

 

I don't want or trust statements from AVEN admods telling the world "we are all ethical", and "you should just trust us" after the shit I have seen go down on this site. 

 

You know the worst thing about this. It's the fact that just about no one here will believe that I haven't made up, or over embellished or grossly exaggerated some of the things I have written. They are so shocking that people would just think it's BS, and the people saying "just trust us, we just follow the ToS actually know what I am saying is actually true. Fancy making an apology, fancy just saying "Yeah we fucked up there".. It's not a stick I would ever use as "PROOF" of anything, but who would it actually effect? No one knows who the other party is. and as far as I am concerned I got an apology from them, and I fully accept it. Be a start. 

 

Just please do a study into how AVENS systems effect its members, and actually turn this place into something approaching democracy. Having year long term limits is a tiny start, but the idea of votes of confidence is just a JOKE... How can anyone even know what things an individual mod does when it's all secret. Most mods stop posting in the actual forums once they get their privileges, and who cares how they feel about a subject, they should be there as representatives of the overall membership, but no one has the faintest idea on how they really think about issues without going through declass stuff thats like 6 months old, not only that but you cant even see what way they voted. It's a bit like the thing most dictatorships do, they put the name "democratic" in the name of their country.

 

 

 

 

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Sage Raven Domino
4 minutes ago, InquisitivePhilosopher said:

Hmm, would it be possible for Chandra to "block" from seeing the member's posts?

I can't comment on the efficiency of the ignore feature because I've never used it :) But it does have some deficiencies, e.g. one still gets notifications about posts by an ignored user made in a followed thread, which is the reason why Chandra has had to unfollow threads (which you did witness).

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