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is this dysphoria? or am i faking it?


milkymars

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ok so, i still need advice about the whole gender thing. since my last post, i've decided to identify under "nonbinary" for now, since i'm not sure enough about anything to get specific, and it just feels more comfortable to me, but i still would really like help, mainly with dysphoria. so, i personally strongly believe that u need dysphoria to be trans/nb, yet for some reason i don't feel "valid" enough to say i have dysphoria, i guess maybe because if i don't have it, then i don't wanna be invalidating actual people with dysphoria by claiming to experience it. if i do have dysphoria, then it's mild, which is probably one reason why i think im doubting myself so much.

 

but, i just kinda wanna vent about my problems, and if anybody could respond or give me some feedback, i would honestly appreciate that so much, responses are very very much encouraged (,:

so, as a start, one reason i feel so fake is i used to like being my agab. every other trans/nb person i have seen talk about their experience, it seems they all used to just know that they were different, or they already had dysphoria at a young age, but i just can't relate to that at all. when i was little i used to actually really enjoy all things associated with my agab, i loved the clothes, toys, colours, just everything about it, and i didn't feel weird or different, i guess i just felt like me, but then again what little cisgender kid thinks about whether they're a boy or a girl? anyways though, the fact that i just recently started to think i was nonbinary makes me feel really shitty, because i feel fake, like i'm just trying to be a special snowflake, and now i'm trying to claim to have dysphoria?? idk.

 

second, i feel really terrible, because some sick, twisted part of me actually wants to have (at least moderate) dysphoria, i know it's awful, and i obviously don't want that, dysphoria is a horrible thing that trans people sadly have to go through, and i wouldn't wish it upon anybody, even myself! but i still can't help sometimes think this, because i feel like if i had clear and noticeable dysphoria, i would definitely be nonbinary, there wouldn't be any "ifs," it just would be. i really want to be nonbinary and i don't want to go back to cisgender, but i feel bad for thinking this because i see that as me being an obvious special snowflake and practically mocking trans people, i dunno ))):

i've noticed that whenever i'm questioning my gender to the point of frustration, i always think: "WHATEVER FORGET IT," or something along those lines, but then i realize that if i just forgot it, then my default is cis, right? and that just for some reason doesn't sit well for me, so i as always keep on trying to figure out what the hell my gender is. once again, i'm scared that's a sign im just a special snowflake who really doesn't wanna be cis coz its "bORiNG," and so i keep searching on this pointless journey, trying to basically fight with myself just to be unique. 

 

for now, i guess that's all for the rant portion of this, so here are some of my "dysphoria" symptoms:

 

- with body dysphoria, i don't really have any as far as i can tell? the only thing that i have noticed is recently (and possibly in the past, idk, i never paid attention) i've had the occasional thought that i just wish i could unscrew my chest and throw it away somewhere. it's not that i hate my chest, (sometimes i even like it, though most of the time it's just neutral. it feels like meh, it's there, it's kinda useless for me, two weird meat sacks, but ok?? i don't feel the need to get surgery or anything major because i don't care about it that much) it's just that i wish i had the option for it to just not be there sometimes, or at least be smaller. i feel like a lot of cisgender girls might feel this too though, because boobs can be inconvenient, so idk if it's dysphoria.

 

- with pronouns, i don't really feel too bothered, but i do prefer they/them pronouns (i think, i've only told my best friend about it, and she forgets most of the time, but when she does use they/them it makes me feel kinda warm) i dunno, when referred to as gendered titles/pronouns, i once described it as it feeling like a single drop of water dripped onto my shoulder, i notice it and it's ever so slightly annoying, but it's so minor that it might as well just be nothing. i'm worried i'm just making this up tho and convincing myself i feel things i don't, because i never felt like this before questioning whether or not im nb?

 

- "am i acting too much like a girl?" this thought has been in my head SO much recently. it's getting so bad that i can't even text people without having the worry that my way of texting is too "girl-like," dude, yesterday i  was just idly dancing to a catchy song, and my brain screamed at me that i was dancing too much "like a girl" and??? these thoughts r kinda sexist. what the hell brain. anyways i don't know if this is considered dysphoria??

 

ok, that's it for now, if u've made it this far i apologize, lmaooooo - but i really really REALLY would appreciate ur opinions. does this seem like dysphoria? do i have dysphoria? or am i just trying to convince myself i do?

 

 

 

 

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anisotrophic
12 minutes ago, milkymars said:

i personally strongly believe that u need dysphoria to be trans/nb

You can believe that but many experts eg the American Psychiatric Association would disagree.

 

"Not all transgender people suffer from gender dysphoria and that distinction is important to keep in mind."

 

From: https://www.psychiatry.org/patients-families/gender-dysphoria/expert-q-and-a

 

I'm not saying what your are -- but personally, believing I needed dysphoria held me back for too long. That said, I certainly took my time coming to this decision, nearly four decades in to life.

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no-longer-in-use

You sound like you definitely could have gender dysphoria, although you'd want to check with a therapist first before making that assumption.

 

What I always say is, if you're happier being a different gender than the one you were assigned, then you probably are that gender, and you need not feel restrained by how much discomfort you experience living as your AGAB to pursue identifying as something different from it.

 

I wish you the best of luck in your gender journey! If you have any more questions, feel free to ask. ❤️

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I find that you don't need to experience dysphoria to be considered non-binary, nor does experiencing it make you non-binary. I prefer the label chick or demi-girl because I dislike the label "girl" and the other labels and everything they imply. It's not that I'm nb, it's that I disagree with the social constructs of the labels and expecations imposed on those labels. 

 

I find that if you're more comfortable with the label nb, then it probably fits better for a reason. I can't gatekeep what makes someone nb or not. 

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Faking is something that you make a deliberate choice to do, so unless you have made a choice to fake, you are not faking.

 

There is absolutely positively NO REQUIREMENT for dysphoria in order to be non-binary. I strongly recommend that you change your personal belief that says otherwise, as it is a false belief. It's like if you made a personal decision that if someone doesn't have blue eyes, then they can't be non-binary; it's nonsense. The only requirement there is to be non-binary is to know inside your head that you are not male or female.

 

Your gender is inside of your brain; if you feel non-binary, then you are.

 

Being non-binary does NOT mean that you have nothing about you that is masculine or feminine, or that you don't like anything that's masculine or feminine, or that you have to hate things that are masculine or feminine… All it means is that inside your brain, you know that you are not a man or a woman. 

 

Gender is something you're born with; it has nothing whatsoever to do with being a "special snowflake." Being a special snowflake requires a conscious decision and choice to do so, it's not a term that gets to be assigned to you because you happen to be different.

 

Non-binary and trans are totally different things. Trans people are not concerned with or offended by your possibly non-binary experience. There are some schools of thought that say that trans people must have dysphoria, which I could not comment on one way or the other, but that has nothing to do with being non-binary, which does NOT require dysphoria.

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no-longer-in-use
3 minutes ago, Dawning said:

Non-binary and trans are totally different things. Trans people are not concerned with or offended by your possibly non-binary experience. There are some schools of thought that say that trans people must have dysphoria, which I could not comment on one way or the other, but that has nothing to do with being non-binary, which does NOT require dysphoria.

I wouldn't say they are totally different things, as both trans and nonbinary people identify as something other than their AGAB, no? I'm nonbinary and I also consider myself trans.

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1 minute ago, Coddiwomple said:

I wouldn't say they are totally different things, as both trans and nonbinary people identify as something other than their AGAB, no? I'm nonbinary and I also consider myself trans.

I see your point, but in my mind that would be like saying that being gay and being asexual are in some way or to some degree the same thing, because they both mean not feeling sexual attraction to the opposite gender. The crucial issue here, I think, is to get across the point that being non-binary does NOT require dysphoria, even though most sources say that being trans DOES require dysphoria, because non-binary and trans are not the same thing.

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no-longer-in-use
2 minutes ago, Dawning said:

I see your point, but in my mind that would be like saying that being gay and being asexual are in some way or to some degree the same thing, because they both mean not feeling sexual attraction to the opposite gender. The crucial issue here, I think, is to get across the point that being non-binary does NOT require dysphoria, even though most sources say that being trans DOES require dysphoria, because non-binary and trans are not the same thing.

Nonbinary people are included in the definition of transgender, which is: "denoting or relating to a person whose sense of personal identity and gender does not correspond with their birth sex." Nowhere in there does it include anything about gender dysphoria, so I would argue that trans and nonbinary are very much the same thing (or rather, transgender is an umbrella term that includes nonbinary people as well as binary trans people).

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10 minutes ago, Coddiwomple said:

Nonbinary people are included in the definition of transgender, which is: "denoting or relating to a person whose sense of personal identity and gender does not correspond with their birth sex." Nowhere in there does it include anything about gender dysphoria, so I would argue that trans and nonbinary are very much the same thing (or rather, transgender is an umbrella term that includes nonbinary people as well as binary trans people).

"Trans" can refer to either transsexual or transgender; some sources say that those words mean the same thing, some sources say that those words mean different things, and the ones that say they are different things don't all use the same definitions. Sorting that out is beyond my sphere of knowledge, and beyond the scope of this discussion. The pivotal issue here is making clear that being non-binary does NOT require dysphoria… If being trans by whatever definition requires dysphoria, then being non-binary does NOT necessarily mean being trans, although obviously some people are both.

 

If this still doesn't make sense to you, why don't we agree to disagree, rather than further hijacking the OP's thread, which is about their experience, not about competing definitions. :D

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loquaciousmushroom

I really understand what you mean. The only time I am ever really sure of my identity is when I am not thinking about gender at all. I how I am as I person, but I fin it really hard to say if I am non-binary. I think I really want to be non-binary, and I can't tell if that desire stems from my actual identity, or if it is just a desire.

 

Reading your post made me feel a lot better, though. It's nice to know that I'm not the only one who is struggling to separate who I am and who I would like to be.

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Calligraphette_Coe
On 3/10/2019 at 10:34 PM, milkymars said:

. does this seem like dysphoria? do i have dysphoria? or am i just trying to convince myself i do?

 

I'd say try to convince yourself that you don't. And if you can't, you do.

 

Since I can't transition because of medical reasons,  I think of that old Star Wars Jedi line: "Do or do not, there is no try." To which *I* say, 'Wanna bet?. Because then I realize there are different transitions and feelings, and wherever you go, there you are."

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  • 6 months later...
BetelgeuseOfOrion

I'm glad you managed to put these feelings into words, because I've been struggling with the same question. I've had almost the same exact experiences that you've described. When it comes down to it, though, only you get to decide what your gender is, whether or not it aligns with your agab.

 

I think the question of nonbinary as a label is harder to understand because as a society (in America, anyway), we don't really have any examples. How can you show something that is defined by what it is not?

 

For me, the longer I've decided to identify as nonbinary, the more dissatisfaction I've felt with being labeled as something else. But believe me, I'm not always sure! Also, there's nothing wrong with identifying a certain way only to change your mind later. Gender can be a fluid thing, and experimenting with labels is an important aspect of self-discovery.

 

All in all, you don't need dysphoria to feel better identifying as something other than your agab, and like I said, only you can decide how to label yourself. 

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here_on_the_morrow

I found the experience of gender EUPHORIA to be a much better determining factor for my deciding i was trans. Did i experience dysphoria? Sometimes, maybe, in certain situations or at certain times... But the first time i put on a binder and men's clothes and looked in the mirror? All questions went out the window. It felt AWESOME and only then was i able to fully see the discomfort i was feeling with my birth gender. I needed the comparison of euphoria to correctly be able to identify the dysphoria. 

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8 hours ago, PottedPatchouli said:

I found the experience of gender EUPHORIA to be a much better determining factor for my deciding i was trans. Did i experience dysphoria? Sometimes, maybe, in certain situations or at certain times... But the first time i put on a binder and men's clothes and looked in the mirror? All questions went out the window. It felt AWESOME and only then was i able to fully see the discomfort i was feeling with my birth gender. I needed the comparison of euphoria to correctly be able to identify the dysphoria. 

You hit the proverbial nail on the head. I always thought that what I was experiencing was simple discomfort and self consciousness over my very feminine appearance(big breasts wide hips that get bigger and wider with weight gain), but in going over my past experiences I think it may have been a mild dysphoria I’ve had. I’m AFAB, but over the years I’ve always been gender non conforming. I had more action figures than Barbie dolls, preferred wearing jeans and t-shirts over dresses and skirts(and whenever I’ve had to wear dresses or skirts I felt obligated to, and I hated it!). I don’t like “chick flicks”(BORING!) give me a good edge of your seat action flick any day ending in y! And I’ve always had certain masculine mannerisms like sitting with my legs apart(except in a dress or skirt, another reason why I hated it). And six years ago, I taught myself how to take a leak standing up, like most guys do. So convenient! 

 

But during the years I didn’t have the language or knew of the existence of the various gender terminology so, I felt like I had to keep up appearances as it were, and felt like I had to suppress my masculine side. I don’t know why. I identified as female but something didn’t feel quite right since I didn’t do typical female things like experimenting with makeup. Or going to the bathroom in groups. Never understood that. Maybe that was also due to my ASD. Speaking of which, it’s very interesting how many people who are on the spectrum also don’t conform to their AG. Whether it’s socially, culturally, or what have you. 

 

Fast forward to today. I also recently purchased a binder. Now because I’m bigger up top, right now it gives me the appearance of body builder pecs. I’m considering a reduction in the future. Hopefully the early onset of thoracic kyphosis will be a reason to have it covered by insurance. But anyway, when I put it on, and changed over to wearing men’s clothes, I felt, this sense of freedom. Like, this is me. But I’m not going to do a complete overhaul of my wardrobe. I still like wearing woman’s clothes from time to time. Especially the East Indian stuff. And l love my purses(hello Coach and Michael Kors!) and shoes! I’ve got both masculine and feminine style shoes.

 

I’m not sure what to call it but in reading the various terminology, I feel like Bi-gender fits. Because there are days(or months, however long it lasts) where my feminine side will assert itself and I’ll wear jeans and t-shirts cut for the female body. Then there are times when my masculine side will assert itself. Or both sides assert themselves simultaneously. And the more I think about it, being bi-gender, the more it feels affirming. It feels accurate. I’m still okay with feminine pronouns. Or neutral. Doesn’t matter. Not sure yet about masculine pronouns. That’s gonna take some getting used to.

 

Sorry for the thread hi-jack. But like I said earlier this quote nailed it for me. This place has been an eye opener.

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Yeah I'm pretty much euphoria-driven too.

 

T has been great. Turns out there's a whole emotional experience of masculinity! It's been really interesting to experience the difference. Do recommend. You shouldn't need dysphoria to physically transition (although it doesn't hurt to play it up a bit with the clinic 😄). That's like needing to hate your body before you can get a tattoo?

 

I guess there's social dysphoria but it's very much about being "trapped" in a gender; I'm any gender I want to be & you can be that way too if you'd like. 👍

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A lot of people tend to forget that when one is describing at arms length about gender dysphoria, that isn’t faking at all, it is often a classic example of a gender incongruence and dysphoria, there isn’t a case of mild of severe, it’s just what it is for even my own. 

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On 3/11/2019 at 12:34 PM, milkymars said:

i really want to be nonbinary and i don't want to go back to cisgender, but i feel bad for thinking this because i see that as me being an obvious special snowflake and practically mocking trans people, i dunno ))):

If you feel strongly about a 'gender' or 'lack of' or whatever but are letting lack of 'body dysphoria' get in the way then go with whatever feels right to you. As pointed out there is even evidence to suggest that you don't need 'body dysphoria'. I think I came across something along the lines of 'mental dysphoria' once.... there was this chart but I have no idea where it got to.

On 3/11/2019 at 3:16 PM, Coddiwomple said:

Nonbinary people are included in the definition of transgender, which is: "denoting or relating to a person whose sense of personal identity and gender does not correspond with their birth sex." Nowhere in there does it include anything about gender dysphoria, so I would argue that trans and nonbinary are very much the same thing (or rather, transgender is an umbrella term that includes nonbinary people as well as binary trans people).

Huh, did not know that or think about it that way. That's interesting..... also made me realise that when someone tried to gatekeep demigirl as a thing because 'you're only trans if you have body dysphoria' I fought back with 'demigender isn't trans' except it can be even by the more traditional understanding of trans because a demigirl or demigirl may not have been born that gender, oops so fixed that post. But yeah there is a whole can of worms there because of the body dysphoria, it's bad enough worrying about if you are demigender enough already.

 

On 9/15/2019 at 2:13 PM, anisotrophic said:

I guess there's social dysphoria but it's very much about being "trapped" in a gender; I'm any gender I want to be & you can be that way too if you'd like. 👍

Trapped, that works. ❤️ :) Also trapped and protected because demigender can be funny that way. ❤️ 

On 9/15/2019 at 10:04 PM, Janus DarkFox said:

A lot of people tend to forget that when one is describing at arms length about gender dysphoria, that isn’t faking at all, it is often a classic example of a gender incongruence and dysphoria, there isn’t a case of mild of severe, it’s just what it is for even my own. 

Describing at arms length, I like the idea of that measuring system. :) (The fact that I've probably met this requirement multiple times of late, is also nice to think about. XD :D)  Also 'gender incongruence' I like that word. ❤️ Also cake for the overall acceptance wording of this. 🎂 ❤️

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  • 1 year later...

I just need to say that this made me gasp with happiness and nearly cry. Everything you described was EXACTLY what I have been feeling the past couple months and even into my childhood. Breasts are something I want gone or have no feelings for. Like you said, two meat sacks with no purpose. I love the look of a binder but hate the constraining feeling. Recently, I have tried not wearing a bra at all outside and love it! My chest is small enough to hide under large sweaters without feeling trapped. Also, I wore skirts and played with dolls, but I also wore boys clothes and love my super short hair! I love and hate aspects of both genders. So, that feeling of faking it to be special? I've cried several nights over it because I want so badly to know who I am. I hate being an outlier and to hear you describe experiences exactly like mine? Thank you 😭😭

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This thread has been inactive for a long time and is now being locked. If anyone would like to discuss the topic futher, feel free to start a new thread about it.

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