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Can anyone relate to this (Ace or Gray-A)?


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On 7/30/2020 at 7:55 AM, Iam9man said:

In my case, I would want all of that... except sex. When I found myself in that position I felt broken, as I had the dream experience of meeting someone really attractive, “clicking” and then ending up having sex, but the sex bit felt empty.

 

This is exactly how I feel. I can be attracted to someone aesthetically and if the person is a genuinely nice person I would love to see if I could have a relationship with them. I'd like to experience romance and do all of the things you normally would do in a relationship...except sex. Even as somebody else suggested - foreplay can be fun and I'm surprised at how many of us enjoy it. But then the dreaded "killswitch" happens and ruins the moment. 

I'm often afraid that if I'm going to be honest about my feelings, the other person will reject me straight away and run as far away as possible. Especially if the person means something to me 😕 

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Maybe Michelle
On 2/2/2019 at 1:30 PM, TrippleL said:

I identify as an asexual, but from many discussions I know my experience is somewhat different to other AVEN people, so I have a question:

 

*TMI warning*

 

I identify as a sex-neutral biromantic biaesthetic bisensual asexual (labels, shmables 🙂) because I neither like nor dislike sexual intercourse, I experience romantic, aesthetic and sensual attraction very intensely and I do not experience sexual attraction (if sexual attraction is defined as attraction leading to the desire to have sexual intercourse of any sort).

 

I spent most of my life believing I was heterosexual as I’m biologically male and I find women and female bodies attractive (I won’t discuss attraction to guys for the sake of this post, but it was there too, in the background).

 

So, I can look at a pretty woman and get aroused. I can look at a woman’s body and get aroused. I can touch a woman’s body and get aroused (that sounds creepy; I mean in a consensual way! 🙂). I therefore love foreplay and I get very aroused during it.

 

When foreplay comes to a close and intercourse is due, there’s like a killswitch; I completely lose interest. Don’t get me wrong, I enjoy orgasms, but the intercourse bit is completely “meh, whatever”.

That "killswitch"!!!! Oh my goodness, yes, a million times YES. I know EXACTLY what that feels like. I want ALL the cuddling and ALL the gentle caresses and sweet kisses (no tongue, though! yuck!) and almost NONE of the "actual sex," which to me is fairly boring 50% of the time.

 

Part 1: Who the Hell Am I?

Hi, everyone! I'm new here (just created an account yesterday), and somehow I found this discussion right away. It's almost as if a higher power led me to MY PEOPLE--"hypersensual asexuals." Do you know how VALIDATING it is to have found all of you?! Thank you, TrippleL and others (I read almost every single post last night), for your honesty, sensitivity, and openness. If there's some sort of "club" I need to join now, please sign me up!

 

On the surface, I am as dull, predictable, and heteronormative as they come. And I'm OLD, guys, compared to the rest of you. I may be wrong, but my overall impression after reading all your comments was, "These are KIDS, or at least, nobody older than 35, perfectly describing my sex life and my sexual orientation! WTF?!"

 

So, a little bit about me: I'm 44, married to my high school sweetheart for 21 years, and the mother of two teenagers (a 19-year-old cishet son and a 16-year-old AFAB nonbinary pansexual). These facts alone probably set me apart--FAR, FAR apart--from the majority of folks who identify as asexual or gray-ace. How dare I suddenly declare myself gray-asexual, after so many years of being sexually active and married!!! Who the hell do I think I am?! What drugs am I on?!

 

I'm not on any drugs. I am a "good" girl, a former devout Catholic, who grew up in the '80s and '90s, when nobody had the internet, let alone Google, and *nobody* in my world discussed sexual orientations other than gay and straight. Homophobia was rampant during my childhood, but I like to believe that my generation was still more open-minded and enlightened than our Boomer parents. "Gender identity" certainly wasn't a thing: you were either a male or a female, based on your genitalia, full stop. Nobody was "out" in my Catholic high school. As a young Catholic, I was taught that sex had two purposes: 1) to procreate; 2) to express love. Gay sex was considered "sinful" because it can never lead to procreation. I always thought that was pretty f*cking ignorant, personally, but I went along with the righteous notion of "no sex before marriage," just because it seemed like the smartest, safest way to go. (In fact, I did eventually have sex before I got married, but only after I was engaged, at age 22.) I had exactly three, non-straight, celebrity role models as a teenager in the '90s, all white, male, English musicians/creative geniuses: GAY=Elton John; BISEXUAL=David Bowie; ASEXUAL=Morrissey. (Why not "GAY=Freddie Mercury," too? Well, I don't remember him ever being "out" during his lifetime, and I'm pretty sure it wasn't common knowledge until well after his death. I could be wrong. I love Queen now but wasn't as big of a fan in the '80s and '90s.) 

 

If I hadn't been a huge Smiths fan, Morrissey wouldn't have been on my radar at all. Honestly, it was probably after the '90s, after I was already married, when I found out he considered himself asexual. Nowadays I think he calls himself something else--"humansexual," whatever that means (it's fine; he's Morrissey; he is who he is, and if he needs a label that absolutely no one else on earth uses, cool, whatever; I still love his music). My point is, I didn't know of *any* non-creative-genius asexuals. It was easy to assume that since I was NOT a genius/artist/weirdo, and since I HAD A HUSBAND, I probably was NOT asexual. 

 

I've never been particularly "sexual," however. I strongly relate to all the common definitions of "demisexual," but you know what made it click with me even more? When my enby teenager told me they feel like a "demigirl." Demigirl--partly, but not entirely a girl...And I totally get that, after months of discussions with my child, and their change of name and preferred pronouns, and tons of reading about all things LGBTQ, about trans and nonbinary identities in particular. I am incredibly proud and supportive of my awesome enby baby! Ultimately, it's because of all the reading I did in an effort to better support my child that I started considering, more than ever before, all the different sexual orientations, and where *I* fit in, because I had to admit, a lot of the "asexual" stuff resonated with me.

 

I knew, without any shadow of a doubt, that I was demisexual the second I found out what it was, and this did explain my life story pretty well. I had formed a friendship and deep emotional bond with my eventual husband when we were 16-year-old co-workers, and built on that bond, and created a new family from that bond. I have never desired sex with anyone else. I may have fantasized about it from time to time in a "what if" sense, but if I look more critically at those fantasies, they all involve everything that comes before sex (for someone like me, at least): the "meet cute" moment; the awkward first date; the playful, flirty banter; the phone calls (or text messages, nowadays); the cuddling/kissing/making out; the joy that comes when you realize you are COMPLETELY CHERISHED by someone else, and madly in love with them.

 

I was recently introduced to the concept of a "split attraction" after posting a question in my "Mindful Moms of LGBTQ+ Teens" Facebook group (I told you guys I'm old!). One of the great things about that group is that many of the moms are themselves part of the LGBTQ+ community. I asked the group what my teenager might mean when they say they're "physically attracted to boys (they like boys' "faces" and want to "hold their hand" or "cuddle" or "be held" by them) but sexually attracted only to girls"--in other words, what is my kid's "proper" sexual orientation label? (I dislike my kid's obsession with trying to label themselves, but it was causing them some genuine distress, so I reached out for help.) Their nonbinary gender makes these classifications extra tricky.

 

I found my teen's description of their feelings incredibly intriguing...to separate "physical" and "sexual" attraction the way they had, as if they were completely different things. One of the moms, who identifies as gay, lesbian, bisexual, or queer, depending on who she's talking to, assured me that it's "fine to use more than one label to describe yourself," which my questioning child really needed to hear, and suggested that my teen was probably describing a split attraction: romantic attraction that wasn't fully aligned with their sexual attraction. Maybe I'd read about that in all my research, but I didn't REALLY get it until that moment. My enby teen is romantically/sensually/aesthetically attracted to all genders, but only sexually attracted to girls, or nonbinary people who present as mostly feminine. Aha!

 

Which brings us back to me, and my demisexual nature--my "partly or halfway" sexual nature. My kid is a demigirl and I'm demisexual. Perfect. This all makes sense. My kid has split attraction and I have...OH MY GOD!!! I have split attraction, too! I am romantically and sensually and aesthetically attracted to my husband, but sexually, it's SO COMPLICATED. "Demisexual" doesn't adequately express how complicated it is, but I think "gray-asexual" does.

 

I'm sorry if this is all super-tedious and boring. I couldn't jump right in to all the cringey sex stuff without first introducing myself and providing some context. Thanks for hanging in there, everyone (anyone?) who actually got all the way to the end of Part 1. I do intend to discuss how it actually feels to be a hypersensual gray-asexual in a long-term sexual relationship. Spoiler alert: it's weird and hard sometimes but mostly okay, because I'm married to a remarkably compassionate, sensitive person who knows me almost better than I know myself, and because there's so much more to us than our sexuality. [PART 2 COMING SOON!]  

 

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Maybe Michelle
1 hour ago, Maybe Michelle said:

I am romantically and sensually and aesthetically attracted to my husband, but sexually, it's SO COMPLICATED. "Demisexual" doesn't adequately express how complicated it is, but I think "gray-asexual" does.

 

Who's ready for Part 2? Anybody?...Bueller? Well, if I can connect with even a single person who gains something from my story, all these hours of writing will have been worth it. If you want to know how I, a "normal," middle-aged, married straight woman and mother, stumbled upon my fresh new identity as a demisexual/gray-ace, read my first post. If all you really care about is my experience as a sexually active "hypersensual" gray-asexual, read on... 

 

When I was young and dating my first and only boyfriend (now-husband), from ages 16 through 22, it was incredibly convenient to have my religion--all those vague notions of "sin" and "no sex before marriage"--and my fears of pregnancy to effectively prevent me from having sex. (I wasn't worried about STDs because we were both virgins.) My boyfriend understood my reasons for wanting to wait. He never pressured me. We held hands, kissed, fooled around in parked cars, groped and petted each other, eventually experimented with dry-humping, but never got to the point of orgasm for either one of us...I loved all of that touching. Did I ever feel like I wanted to have sex with him, though? I don't know! Maybe? Did I ever have to "stop myself" from going too far? No, certainly not. And I never had to stop him, either. He was always respectful and careful. Our parents assumed we were having sex after we'd been dating for a few months, and they tried to have awkward, cautionary talks with us--HA! They needn't have bothered. Not having sex, even as a "horny" teenager with an attractive boyfriend, was pretty damn easy for me.

 

One night, when I was 16 or 17, stands out in my mind--this was pretty early in our relationship, probably before we ever did anything other than kiss: we were sitting in the backseat of a friend's car, on our way to a baseball game, and my boyfriend's arm was close enough to mine that I could feel his warmth seeping through the sleeve of his sweatshirt...and I wanted to touch him SO badly. It was physically painful to just sit there and feel his warmth and not touch him (I merely wanted to caress his arm, but I restrained myself because I was uncomfortable with any PDA in front of the friend sitting on the other side of me in the backseat). Sounds pretty uneventful, I know, but I've never forgotten that extreme sensual pull toward him that I felt in that backseat--I'd never felt anything quite like it before. 

 

In college, we eventually ended up living in separate apartments in the same apartment community for a couple of years. I would spend the night with him on occasion, certainly not all the time. We would climb into the same bed, clothed, and we'd talk and cuddle, and it was absolute bliss. I have no recollection of any purely "sexual" stuff we did when I spent the night, but I do remember how perfectly comfortable I felt in his bed, on those striped sheets that smelled like him. Did I ever feel like I was struggling to not have sex? Again, no. It was heavenly just to be there, next to him, feeling his warmth, his heartbeat, listening to him breathe. It was relaxing, not stressful or ever so sexually charged that it was uncomfortable for me in any way. (I have no idea how HE felt! He may have been in agony the entire time. Probably was, but he never let it show.) 

 

I remember planning our honeymoon in his bedroom. And after we were engaged--not immediately afterward, though; it wasn't like I said yes and put on the ring and jumped his bones right there in the living room of his apartment--we finally, FINALLY decided to seal the deal. My decision, not his; he'd been patiently waiting for me to give the go-ahead for YEARS. He bought condoms in a gas station. We went back to his place and took our clothes off, and we did it--no exclamation point. It was awkward and a bit painful, but it seemed like the right thing to do, like it was time to just get it over with and grow up (I'm kinda shocked to write that, but it's exactly what I felt--not that I *needed* or even *wanted* to have sex, but that I'd have to do it eventually, so I may as well start getting some practice at it). I no longer feared pregnancy, because at least we were engaged and we could always change the wedding date if I needed to conceal a baby bump, right? I no longer feared God's wrath (and never had, to be fair, but it was a convenient excuse to put off sex), and I'd ditched Catholicism by that time. Getting married in my (atheist) husband's childhood Protestant church was quite a blow to my dear grandma, but she got over it...eventually. So that's how I entered the "mature" sexual phase of my existence.

 

And everything went downhill from there.

 

Just kidding! The sex did get better. I even remember it being fun and doing it all over our new apartment, in that brief honeymoon period, before I got pregnant. On the floor, on the couch, in the bathtub (which is absolutely awful--I don't recommend it). I remember eating Doritos in bed after a sweet quickie, and my husband saying that Doritos were "perfect after-sex food." If you'd explained to me what "asexual" meant and asked 23-year-old me if I were asexual, I would have laughed in your face. I loved my husband (still do). Sex wasn't bad. I never had an orgasm in all of my twenties, but it seemed like I came close a lot of the time. I loved sleeping with him.

 

But all along, there were signs that we weren't a perfect match...After the novelty of having regular sex faded, I soon realized that my sexual needs were completely out of sync with my husband's. In fact, it was starting to feel like I didn't even have any sexual needs. He asked me for a list of my turn-ons and sexual fantasies, and I couldn't provide him with one (uh...cuddling and falling asleep together?). He wanted us to try stuff like mutual masturbation or watching porn, and bought me sex toys, and I had no interest in any of it. (I have never masturbated; I tried it once and was so weirded out and bored, I had to stop. I have a similar reaction to porn. Just...nope.) I don't want to be stimulated by a vibrating, inanimate THING--my *only* interest in sex stems from the fact that it's with a person I love. It's all about deepening or reaffirming my connection to him, and sharing something with him that I don't share with anyone else. It's almost NEVER about the sex itself. 

 

So I don't care if we don't have sex for weeks at a time, as long as I feel connected to him in other ways. Going out for a fun date *without* having sex afterward is perfectly fine with me. (Side note: You know how characters in movies are always going out on a first date to dinner, flirting over their dessert, and then rushing home to have sex immediately? They want it so badly, they can't even make it to the bedroom; they're smashed up against the door, kissing, stripping their clothes off with total abandon! Yeah, I cringe whenever I see that shit. Those people *barely know each other*, I want to scream! What the hell are they thinking?! How on EARTH can you do that with a total stranger?! Hello, herpes, unplanned pregnancy, MURDER!) 

 

When I say I love sleeping with my husband, I mean it literally. Sleeping next to him, when we're both feeling cozy and content, is one of the most pleasurable things in the world to me. Sex, or the expectation of sex, usually ruins my ideal sleeping-with-my-husband experience. If there's LOTS of cuddling after the sex, then it's probably worthwhile, but if not, what a disappointment. There are still times when the sex is great--transcendent, even, a few times a year--but often, it's a chore, and I only go through with it because I recognize his need. I'm never being forced to have sex; please don't get the wrong idea. My love and commitment to him are demonstrated in hundreds of other ways, every single day, and I sometimes wish all those other things could entirely take the place of sex in our marriage. It's unfathomable to me to care so much about sex, or to base your self-worth on having it. I don't crave it the way he does. I don't even dream about it (okay, on VERY rare occasions, I do). I don't get depressed or feel unattractive when I don't have sex for long stretches. Wouldn't a nice back rub be better? (My husband does LOVE back rubs, and that's probably one of the reasons we're still together. I'm a great cook, and a great amateur masseuse. And the mother of his children. And smart and funny and generally perfect outside of the bedroom. 😉

 

I feel like sex doesn't have the same power over me that it seems to have over others; there's absolutely no reason for me to do it, other than to reaffirm my connection to my husband. So without my husband in my life, there would be no sex. I would not seek it out with anyone else. Is that sad or sweet? I dunno.

 

Getting back to this "killswitch" idea that started this thread...

 

I sometimes miss my younger, sexless days with my sweet, virgin boyfriend. I miss the lack of pressure to have sex. I miss everything we did instead of sex, and I think it's time for us to reintroduce some of that stuff. Bring back ALL the non-genital touching! Wouldn't that be something--to spice up my sex life by removing the sex? Ha!

 

My husband, being an intelligent, observant, and compassionate man, has realized that I don't thoroughly enjoy sex most of the time these days, and it kills him. He doesn't want to go without sex completely--and, truth be told, neither do I, because it means so much to him--but he also only wants to do it when I'm really into it, which isn't very often. My libido has always been low (as soon as two kids were added to our household, it was like "What libido? Did I ever actually have one to begin with? I'm TIRED, dammit!"). Starting thyroid medication some years ago did not magically supercharge my libido, as I'd hoped it might. Even when I was a teenager with a robust, healthy thyroid, though, I didn't have much of a libido, so I do believe this is just the way I'm made.

 

I realize that sexual attraction is different than libido, but both operate at such a low intensity for me, I can scarcely tell them apart. I think the only true "sexual" attraction I feel is a hodgepodge of romantic, sensual, and aesthetic attraction, all intensely focused on a single person, if that makes any sense. When I try to separate purely "sexual" feelings for my husband from all the other ones, I can't confidently identify any one thing. I want to touch him and be close to him, but not necessarily in a sexual way. Even when we're having sex, am I actually feeling "sexy" about it? Sometimes, I think yes. Other times, definitely not. It's truly strange, to have so much of every other feeling for him, but such a *lack* of pure sexual attraction. You can't tell me there's "just no spark there," because there IS. I love him and I love being with him. No wonder I've been confused for so long. Describing it as a gray area is very fitting...probably akin to my enby teenager trying to explain their exact gender to me. 

 

I'll end by saying that it's a relief to find a couple of shiny new labels that help me make sense of my feelings and my life up to this point. I'll be fine, as long as I stop expecting to be more sexual than I actually am. I'm PARTLY sexual and that sexual fraction of me is weak and GRAY. My devoted, wonderful, WHOLLY sexual husband is genuinely glad that I've come to this new understanding of myself, as it makes it easier for me to talk about sex more honestly and openly with him.

 

And this, my friends, is what it feels like to be a 44-year-old, perimenopausal, hypersensual, demisexual, gray-asexual woman, married to a sexual man. 

 

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Maybe Michelle

That "killswitch" @TrippleL mentioned to start this thread--I've identified exactly when it happens for me. As soon as I can tell that my husband's touches have moved away from purely "romantic" cuddling or purely "sensual" caresses and into that hot, frenzied, entirely "sexual" zone--that "OMG, let's ride this thing out to the glorious end! Yippee!"--that's when I often lose interest. Sometimes my sluggish libido does take over and it's all good, but I need to be absolutely saturated by the sensual and romantic pleasure of the moment for that to happen--so overwhelmed that I can enjoy the sex in spite of my stubbornly "unsexual" brain. I almost have to be tricked into it.

 

I think this is exactly what I'm going to explain to my husband, as delicately as I can: "It's not you, it's ME!" (He's always rolled his eyes at this in the past, but I think he's starting to get it, now that I've fully come out to him as gray-asexual.) "Yeah, I don't feel much *sexual* attraction for you, but don't take it so personally. I don't feel much sexual attraction, period! It could be Chris Hemsworth, naked in my bed, Thor hammer in hand, and absolutely nothing would happen. (I'd ask him for his autograph, obviously, and a selfie, but then I'd send him on his merry way.) So, here's the dreaded killswitch you've gotta avoid, if you want me to enjoy our infrequent sexual encounters more..." (Describe said killswitch.) "You've found the magical killswitch-bypass before, and you can find it again, but you've gotta make sure I don't see it coming from miles away!" It's SO SIMPLE, right?! EASY AS PIE!!!!! 😜

 

I will try to figure out what *I* need to do in this scenario, too, because I'm an active participant in the sex, obviously, but how do I trick myself? Some of you have mentioned alcohol...yeah, I'm not much of a drinker. I also didn't experience much of a change after snacking on marijuana-laced chocolate (only when it was LEGAL, mind you, on vacation. I'm so straight-laced, it's ridiculous!). 

 

All of the above is why I'll probably never pursue another sexual relationship if, god forbid, my husband dies...even if it happens tomorrow, when I'm still relatively young. For me, it's way too complicated and not worth the effort, I'm sorry to say. I'd still rather have a nice back rub than an orgasm most nights.

 

Thanks for reading.

 

   

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  • 3 weeks later...
On 10/4/2021 at 7:16 PM, Maybe Michelle said:

That "killswitch"

Never had sex, but I imagine that I have this switch to. I often imagine that if the right person came along I would just "do it" for them, but I do not know if that is true. I would want to want to, but I think my mind would be so confused by the whole thing that it would just zone out XD

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I am so happy i found out there is distinction between Sensual from sexual.

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You might not be ace but also just not like PIV. Also, what are you defining as intercourse?

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  • 3 months later...
On 2/3/2019 at 1:00 AM, TrippleL said:

I identify as an asexual, but from many discussions I know my experience is somewhat different to other AVEN people, so I have a question:

 

*TMI warning*

 

I identify as a sex-neutral biromantic biaesthetic bisensual asexual (labels, shmables 🙂) because I neither like nor dislike sexual intercourse, I experience romantic, aesthetic and sensual attraction very intensely and I do not experience sexual attraction (if sexual attraction is defined as attraction leading to the desire to have sexual intercourse of any sort).

 

I spent most of my life believing I was heterosexual as I’m biologically male and I find women and female bodies attractive (I won’t discuss attraction to guys for the sake of this post, but it was there too, in the background).

 

So, I can look at a pretty woman and get aroused. I can look at a woman’s body and get aroused. I can touch a woman’s body and get aroused (that sounds creepy; I mean in a consensual way! 🙂). I therefore love foreplay and I get very aroused during it.

 

When foreplay comes to a close and intercourse is due, there’s like a killswitch; I completely lose interest. Don’t get me wrong, I enjoy orgasms, but the intercourse bit is completely “meh, whatever”. To deal with this in a relationship I have to move VERY quickly from foreplay to intercourse, then the physical stimulation keeps things working as they should.

 

I feel the physiological need to ejaculate 1-2 times per week. As long as I’m not “overdue” from a physiological point of view, I’d be quite happy having foreplay then going to sleep and not having sex or ejaculating.

 

Might be relevant: I’m sex-neutral when it comes to PIV; averse when it comes to any form of oral (giving or receiving).

 

So, question: Can anyone relate to this? If you can, do you identify as asexual/gray/other? (No wrong answers here, just curious)

Nah, you are not alone here! I too think that bodies are attractive except vagina area and penis area. And oral is a big no no! (Giving and receiving). Giving oral feels like eating stuff straight out of gutter and receiving feels like...why the hell are you licking me? Are you a dog? It just feels like sexual harassment and the guy just freaking looks like a desperate monster !!

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  • 4 weeks later...

Although I can't relate to most experiences here, this thread is SO. VALIDATING!! See, I do feel attracted to strangers (well, sometimes, and in recent times more often than I'd like), but... It's not sexual. It's hard to put a label to it, but it is not sexual and even if I was aroused it doesn't need to be sexual attraction, that right there is my "mind blown" moment. The only person I'm definitely sexually attracted to is my partner, and I enjoy/want sex with them, and that's as far as it goes. So I do fit the definition for asexuality (or gray asexuality to be precise). It's been hard to identify as that when all the representation, or the majority of asexuals, are just different than that. So... Thank you all for this wonderful thread.

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I'm very very OLD too (45 here!), and although I've never craved for sexual relationships, it was until very very recently that I became fully aware that I may be asexual. It was because of a meme... that made me think: "hey, now that I think, I've hadn't had sex in 7 years...! and with the last partner I had, 4 years ago, I refused to have sex... mmhh something's up here!". 

Also I suspect that being on the autism spectrum (diagnosed very late too) didn't help that much in becoming aware of this.

Anyways it was very useful, by reading the comments, to be able to separate arousal and sexual attraction. This was an essential piece of information for me. Because I wondered, that I couldn't really be asexual, since I get aroused by some shapes and body parts. But of course, I don't want to engage in any sexual activity. Also, I don't fantasize at all.

So this hypersensual label is very fitting, and now I can say that I'm hypersensual asexual for sure. I've also had sex before (in fact I have a daughter from a past relationship), but intercourse was always very "meh" to me... something that had to be done, kind of a chore, so to say. I enjoyed more the fact that it was an "arousal satisfaction" activity, than for the sex itself. Also for some time in the distant past, I thought that it was very unfair with the other person, because I felt that they were, in a sense, just some kind of human sex toy that satisfied my sex drive. Later, I enjoyed having sex, but because it made my partner happy. It also happened to me, that while asked what I liked, I answered "anything you like is fine". 

So there. I'm happy to have found my "place", and my people. And I created this account just to say that. Bye and take care!

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  • 1 month later...
BagelMarie

I created an account here just to share my appreciation for the existence of this thread, because I'm so happy I could cry. I can't believe I FINALLY found people who relate to my experience, and a term that actually feels right!!

 

I've spent most of my life believing I'm purely hetero, through and through. I definitely know I'm strictly heteroromantic, because I've never, ever felt romantic feelings toward another woman, but the sexual side of my identity has always been a little more complicated. There's never been any question that I'm sexually attracted to men, but as far as women were concerned... Well, I knew that I enjoyed kissing my female friends, but to be honest, I always just kinda thought of that as me being a more 'open-minded' heterosexual and called it good. 

 

As I got older and more comfortable with my body and being more 'sexual', it became clear that what I felt towards women (in an intimate sense, I guess) was more than just "I don't mind kissing them". There were certain things about them - the way they dress, dance, flirt, sound, etc. - that actually turned me on. Then I was introduced to sexual attraction and romantic attraction being separate concepts, and I thought, "Oh, I must be heteroromantic bisexual then!" 

 

But the more I thought about it, the more I realized that I was really only aroused by everything around sex, while the sex itself ("sex" here being any activity that's purposely attempting to induce an orgasm) made me feel...nothing. Whenever I'd watch lesbian porn or a lesbian sex scene on tv or in movies, the sexual tension; the flirting; the long glances; the making out; the petting/caressing; everything that led up to the sex all drove me crazy, but as soon as an effort was made to elicit an orgasm, I was just kinda. Done. It really felt like that 'killswitch' that OP so cleverly described it as. So I examined my 'bisexual' label a little more closely and figured, "If sex is the one thing that makes a person bisexual and it's the one thing I wouldn't want in an intimate experience with another woman, I can't really call myself bisexual, can I?" Part of my confusion here is that it seems like everybody and their mother has a different definition of 'sex' and 'sexual attraction', and it seemed like, although I'm attracted to women in a sexual-kinda-way, I don't have sexual desire towards them, which I guess is a key component? Idk, still unsure about all that.

 

So I dug a little deeper into LGBTQIA forums and the wiki trying to find an identity that fit me. I stumbled across the term 'bisensual' early in my research, and though it felt close, all of the descriptions seemed to focus heavily on hugging and cuddling, while kissing always felt like an afterthought, and it all just seemed too, idk, tame? for how far I'd like to go. I mean, hugging, cuddling, and hand-holding are all things I'd do with someone in a completely platonic way, so they didn't really fit with the idea of being physically intimate with a person. So I moved on, and eventually found a few others that also felt kinda close - parosexual, orchidsexual, and iamvanosexual are all ones that I focused on and thought about adopting for a while. But even then, I couldn't find anyone identifying with those labels who shared my exact feelings towards sex and sexual-type encounters, so it still never felt quite right. 

 

Then, my digging back into bisensuality and the different identities on the asexual spectrum brought me to this thread, and I literally jumped up when I read the main post. Finally, someone else described their feelings towards foreplay vs sex EXACTLY the same way as me! And all the replies described it perfectly as well! Then the term 'hypersensual' came up and my god, I've never had such a lightbulb moment in my life. The hyper- prefix is exactly what I needed to feel like 'bisensual' is the right label for me. Not even just when it comes to sexual encounters with women, but also with men, who I know I'm fully allosexual towards - making out turns me on more than any other sexual activities, more than groping or grinding or anything else (again, sexual here meaning intending to "finish" with an orgasm). It's the more, *ahem* intense, side of sensuality that really, really resonates with me, so... hyperbisensual? I guess that's what I'd be called? It's a bit of a mouthful heh, so I'd probably only use it within circles that are In The Know (TM) or if a situation ever arose where I was presented with an opportunity for a hookup with another woman.

 

Now, in fairness, all of this could change - I've never actually tried to have sex with a woman, so all I can go on is how I feel when I see other women together. I'm currently in a long-term relationship with a man, but he is very open to the idea of letting me experiment with women so, who knows lol? In any case, it feels SO GOOD to find a label that feels right, and people who get it! 🥰 THANK YOU to everyone for sharing your experiences and chiming in, it's been such a huge help and a relief!!

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On 2/2/2019 at 1:30 PM, TrippleL said:

I identify as an asexual, but from many discussions I know my experience is somewhat different to other AVEN people, so I have a question:

 

*TMI warning*

 

I identify as a sex-neutral biromantic biaesthetic bisensual asexual (labels, shmables 🙂) because I neither like nor dislike sexual intercourse, I experience romantic, aesthetic and sensual attraction very intensely and I do not experience sexual attraction (if sexual attraction is defined as attraction leading to the desire to have sexual intercourse of any sort).

 

I spent most of my life believing I was heterosexual as I’m biologically male and I find women and female bodies attractive (I won’t discuss attraction to guys for the sake of this post, but it was there too, in the background).

 

So, I can look at a pretty woman and get aroused. I can look at a woman’s body and get aroused. I can touch a woman’s body and get aroused (that sounds creepy; I mean in a consensual way! 🙂). I therefore love foreplay and I get very aroused during it.

 

When foreplay comes to a close and intercourse is due, there’s like a killswitch; I completely lose interest. Don’t get me wrong, I enjoy orgasms, but the intercourse bit is completely “meh, whatever”. To deal with this in a relationship I have to move VERY quickly from foreplay to intercourse, then the physical stimulation keeps things working as they should.

 

I feel the physiological need to ejaculate 1-2 times per week. As long as I’m not “overdue” from a physiological point of view, I’d be quite happy having foreplay then going to sleep and not having sex or ejaculating.

 

Might be relevant: I’m sex-neutral when it comes to PIV; averse when it comes to any form of oral (giving or receiving).

 

So, question: Can anyone relate to this? If you can, do you identify as asexual/gray/other? (No wrong answers here, just curious)

Hi! I identity as a Neutral Heteroromantic Demisexual. I can relate to your comment on foreplay, so you are not alone. Most of the time PIV was not enjoyable for me, but the Neutral-Demi in me will do it for the man that shows himself worthy. 

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On 10/4/2021 at 2:16 PM, Maybe Michelle said:

That "killswitch" @TrippleL mentioned to start this thread--I've identified exactly when it happens for me. As soon as I can tell that my husband's touches have moved away from purely "romantic" cuddling or purely "sensual" caresses and into that hot, frenzied, entirely "sexual" zone--that "OMG, let's ride this thing out to the glorious end! Yippee!"--that's when I often lose interest. Sometimes my sluggish libido does take over and it's all good, but I need to be absolutely saturated by the sensual and romantic pleasure of the moment for that to happen--so overwhelmed that I can enjoy the sex in spite of my stubbornly "unsexual" brain. I almost have to be tricked into it.

I can relate so much to this, for me it is also a killswicth to feel my partner is kissing me in a way that means he want to have sex with me. I always feel I have to trick myself to be able to enjoy sex, as much as like the person I am with. Sometimes if I get asked a question or I am required to think during the act, I immediately feel the  killswicth and just can't keep doing it, which is super frustrating. 

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It's been almost two years since I first started identifying as an ace.

 

Initially, it was a relief. Things started to make sense. However, with time, I realized that I had not yet reached the inner peace I yearned so much for... maybe even went in totally opposite direction.

 

"Things started to make sense." Most of them. Some however, did not, and bug me to this day.

 

I have pretty wild imagination, when it comes to 'these things'. I like to fantasize, got interested in kinks (though never practiced, and most likely never will). Those fantasies, without getting too much into TMI area, do involve sexual acts.

 

This is however, the fantasy world. In the real world... you guessed it: the aforementioned "kill-switch" kicks in. It's almost like I genuinely desire the intimate connection sex is supposed to give... and at the same time, have some sort of intrinsic aversion to it.

 

Not to all of it though. I like to touch the other person, see how their body and mind reacts. Enjoy seeing them reach all kinds of sensual pleasure. I even think it would be a little disappointing if this was missing in the relationship... Myself however, I don't respond well to it being reciprocated. My reactions range from averse to "meh". The more my 'private parts' are getting involved, the more trouble I have enjoying the experience. In fact, I have never really enjoyed it, and honestly don't know if I'm able to.

 

I feel sad writing about this. I used to think that I have all the answers I need, but in reality, I don't know anything. I still think about myself as someone 'broken'. I have always felt different than others and had trouble connecting with people, especially in romantic way (in my over 30 years on this planet, I had only been in one relationship that lasted a month, and had like total 4 attempts to get into one). I'm currently fighting depression, been on meds for over a year. My doctor said once, that I show some signs that indicate Asperger's and recommended getting diagnosed in that direction, but I don't think it would help me much.

 

Sorry for the incoherent rambling. I just wanted to say, that I don't feel 'entirely' ace, despite some obvious signs of ace-ness. Which I guess would make me fall into the gray area. Area where I feel it's even more difficult to find a partner. Being neither here nor there... it doesn't help with feeling lonely.

 

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I am so glad I stumbled on this thread. I have thought something was wrong with me for ten years, maybe even before and about two years ago found “asexual”. I was immediately drawn to it but it was scary so I pushed it aside. Just two weeks ago things came to a head in my seven year marriage (without sex, thank goodness) and I just said it out loud, “I’m pretty sure I’m asexual”. Since then , it’s been a whirlwind. Forums, books, websites, articles, tearful talks with my therapist… 

the one piece that made me doubt the asexual label was this piece, in this thread. And now after reading it it all makes so much sense. I’m so glad I’m not the only one out there. I have a long road ahead as I am married to a sexual person but I am finally unwinding the knots from pretending for so long to enjoy, want, like sex. Cause I don't and I finally know that’s ok. 

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On 9/18/2022 at 1:55 PM, Kernel.Panic said:

Initially, it was a relief. Things started to make sense. However, with time, I realized that I had not yet reached the inner peace I yearned so much for... maybe even went in totally opposite direction.

In the past, I've never been one for labels, and the only reason I started looking into "me" was because a friend came out as Ace and seeing her be happier in herself, wanting to understand the terms she was talking about and her gentle encouraging is what made me start. As it turns out, I am very much Demisexual, but for me that is kind of the starting point.

 

I see it more as the first step; I'm looking for directions to a place and I've found that first signpost that has got me on the right track at last. I'm still working out whether its something I want to 'come out' with to friends and family, heck I'm still learning how to explain what demi is in a way people will easily understand so I'm quite a long way from trying to apply that to relationships. I realise I have a long way to travel and I'm trying to avoid what I think is a trap of thinking that the journey is complete because I have discovered this word.

When my friend first came out she was just Asexual. But over the last three years, she has grown and expanded that definition as she's read more and learned more about herself. So I think it's just not as simple as ace, demi, gray etc, so I have the benefit of seeing that it's something to expand on. I have no idea what I can expand beyond the umbrella "demi" term, but four months ago, I'd never heard the term.

 

I did have a moment where I had settled on the idea that yes I am demi, this is a word that explains me, but like you didn't feel any different, and then I realised that of course I wouldn't, I'm the same me that I was before, it's just I've learned something more about how I function. I realised it's no different from learning what my metabolic rate is, or what my resting heartrate is before exercise. Those things were still facts and truths before I could put a number to them. I realised it's what I do with that information now that I have it in hand. If I decide I want another crack at dating then I can go in with a better idea of what I need to do to make that work, or I know what sort of advice to seek.

 

And I still think label doesn't define me, ie it's not the final stop on a route, but I believe it can help me pick the next path to go down, so I'm not surprised that you identifying as ace didn't suddenly create inner peace, and it's not that you're broken at all, it's simply you haven't reached the end of that path. To me, it is impossible to define a person by one word, in fact I hate those "Describe your friend/partner/family-member/etc in one word" questions because to me that's impossible. Ace doesn't describe you in one word. At most it describes one part of you, but it's not a complete definition, so don't be afraid to expand on that.

 

I'm currently trying to soak up as much information as possible. Not worrying about dating or relationships, in a way I'm treating it as an opportunity to get to know me a bit better first . I'm sprinkling a bit of self-reflection in there as well; looking back and seeing why certain things happened the way they did. This forum helps, because I can read about other peoples experiences, see how they compare and see what terms they're using and then "test-fitting" things that I think might apply to me. At this moment, I'm on a "see where the wind takes me".


Hope that equally incoherent ramble made some sense. 

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DemiGreyQuestioning
On 10/3/2021 at 3:31 AM, Maybe Michelle said:

'll end by saying that it's a relief to find a couple of shiny new labels that help me make sense of my feelings and my life up to this point. I'll be fine, as long as I stop expecting to be more sexual than I actually am. I'm PARTLY sexual and that sexual fraction of me is weak and GRAY. My devoted, wonderful, WHOLLY sexual husband is genuinely glad that I've come to this new understanding of myself, as it makes it easier for me to talk about sex more honestly and openly with him.

 

And this, my friends, is what it feels like to be a 44-year-old, perimenopausal, hypersensual, demisexual, gray-asexual woman, married to a sexual man. 

 

So many things in this post are similar to what I am going through, feeling, thinking. I am 50 and am married to my high school sweetheart too. I was a virgin and he had had sex twice when we met. Gray/demi and hypersensual - that sounds pretty close to what I am feeling: loving sensual contact, PIV is just "eh", only really feeling attraction to my husband who is my best friend. 

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So I went through my periodic “yes, but am I actually ace?” thing my mind seems to enjoy doing. Thankfully they’re less frequent these days, in that I genuinely don’t remember the last time. Anyway, this thread always grounds me and helps me regain my “peace”.

 

Thanks to all that have shared and continue to share their experiences here and I hope others also find this thread helpful if ever doubting themselves! 🐧🥰

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jackQUEENkingACE

I'm new to AVEN, and this thread is what helped me decide that yes, I am asexual, not demi or gray. I kept going back and forth because, like the OG post, while I felt I got the definitions, I wasn't fully resonating with other experiences elsewhere on AVEN. So thank you for this!

 

By the way, I know some people see labels as negative or, as the other extreme, stick so hard to them that they'll exclude others that seem different. When I came out [a few days ago] to my friend who is trans and an active trans teen advocate and an active advocate of LGBTQIA+ (their cred is serious lol), I said I wasn't sure what I was until I found this thread. They responded with these beautiful words:

 

"That’s what labels are all about. Just waiting to find shared experiences that resonate with you"

 

And that, right there, really is what it's all about, finding what resonates with you!

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On 2/2/2019 at 11:30 AM, TrippleL said:

I identify as an asexual, but from many discussions I know my experience is somewhat different to other AVEN people, so I have a question:

 

*TMI warning*

 

I identify as a sex-neutral biromantic biaesthetic bisensual asexual (labels, shmables 🙂) because I neither like nor dislike sexual intercourse, I experience romantic, aesthetic and sensual attraction very intensely and I do not experience sexual attraction (if sexual attraction is defined as attraction leading to the desire to have sexual intercourse of any sort).

 

I spent most of my life believing I was heterosexual as I’m biologically male and I find women and female bodies attractive (I won’t discuss attraction to guys for the sake of this post, but it was there too, in the background).

 

So, I can look at a pretty woman and get aroused. I can look at a woman’s body and get aroused. I can touch a woman’s body and get aroused (that sounds creepy; I mean in a consensual way! 🙂). I therefore love foreplay and I get very aroused during it.

 

When foreplay comes to a close and intercourse is due, there’s like a killswitch; I completely lose interest. Don’t get me wrong, I enjoy orgasms, but the intercourse bit is completely “meh, whatever”. To deal with this in a relationship I have to move VERY quickly from foreplay to intercourse, then the physical stimulation keeps things working as they should.

 

I feel the physiological need to ejaculate 1-2 times per week. As long as I’m not “overdue” from a physiological point of view, I’d be quite happy having foreplay then going to sleep and not having sex or ejaculating.

 

Might be relevant: I’m sex-neutral when it comes to PIV; averse when it comes to any form of oral (giving or receiving).

 

So, question: Can anyone relate to this? If you can, do you identify as asexual/gray/other? (No wrong answers here, just curious)

I want to add my voice to the chorus of people who found this post, and this thread, really helpful. I stumbled across it yesterday, and it's part of what ultimately pushed me to finally start an AVEN account so I could post on these forums.

 

I wouldn't say I identify 100% with this description, but I also spent a lot of time grappling with the phenomenon of desiring 'foreplay' but then having this feeling break down when it comes to 'sex', and what that means for what I can call myself.

 

*also TMI below*

 

Most of the post is exactly on point for me. I can feel aroused by the sight of a woman's body in certain ways, or the thought of touching a woman's body in certain places, and I can fantasize about this--and yes it sounds sketchy to phrase it that way, of course I mean with consent, etc. The point is that the urge or desire (what some would call primary sexual attraction) is there, even if I choose not to act on it, the same way allosexuals don't act on every sexual urge.

 

But then when it comes to 'sex' this feeling breaks down. I would say I'm ambivalent about PIV, in the sense that it would probably feel good, but there's also something uneasy about the thought of it; I came close to trying it during my last relationship, but lost my arousal before I could start, and then we broke up a week later. I'm repulsed about any form of oral (giving or receiving), and also about tongue kissing and fingering. I still want to test out my boundaries a bit if I go back into dating, since there are some things I'm not totally sure whether or not I could compromise on, but in an ideal world, I would be happy to have foreplay only and then go to sleep.

 

I guess you could joke that I'm straight when it comes to the waist up, and ace when it comes to the waist down. I would be super embarrassed if someone described me that way in real life, but that's what quasi-anonymous forum accounts are for, I guess.

 

Where I diverge from the OP, and from some of the discussions in later posts, is that I personally don't consider it accurate to call this 'hypersensual.' Sensual attraction is definitely something I feel, and gentle touch is one of my love languages: I really enjoy cuddling, holding hands, short kisses, and long hugs, and these things make me feel closer to a partner. But for me, there's a categorical difference between how it feels to do hug or cuddle, and how it feels to touch a woman's breasts. The latter definitely crosses the line from a sensual feeling to a 'sexual' one, like it's firing different circuits in my brain. Like I can masturbate to the thought of touching boobs, but I would not masturbate to the thought of hugging or cuddling. To be clear, I don't want to sound like I'm challenging someone else's label--it's entirely possible that for someone else, that is just another act on the sensual continuum, and at the end of the day 'sexual' is a category with fuzzy boundaries, as many others have pointed out before. But for me, it doesn't feel right to call that 'sensual' when it is so clearly sexually arousing to me, in a way that other forms of physical touch aren't. And that was really troubling to me when I started questioning whether I was really asexual.

 

In the end, I decided it was best for me to call myself greysexual, because I do feel 'sexual attraction' depending on how you define it, but this only extends to what most would consider foreplay. It's in the grey area--it's ambiguous, it's debatable, it's complicated, it's hard to categorize. Plus, some sex revulsion, and seemingly lacking the close interplay between sexual pleasure and romantic intimacy that so many other people describe. But that's just my story... maybe somebody else will find it helpful too.

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I have in my first nick been basically first here when i was about 20 ish. again at 30 ish

 

i am now nearing 40.

i like to identify with umbrellas "ace spec, grey ace" )  as it is too much hard work for me and no use for others to present them my split fibres (or lables) but yet i am never entirely sure

 

I think i best fit the microlabel that  says i cant tell what attraction is what ,

and i am neurodivergent

i am also nonbinary

 

there are people whom i really like and whom when my libido pops up (usually only to hormonal high levels) i have sexual fantasies when by myself .

but when i am in their company i just enjoy their company (ie i actually can just sit there and enjoy their company something known in actually  autistic circles as "parallel play " )or / and to communicate with them and i am entirely happy with that and neither desire to touch or get physical with them. (in rare cases desire "a hug" but the end result is also meh at best)

a lot of people  i feel sth but i dont have any desires to them however i dont know what it is maybe just normal interaction?  , some i know am just entirely neutral to or i just like to chat to without any kind of other desires or anything.

 

i guessit also gets with most prob alexithemia

 

i have had sexual experiences and i feel at best about it like reading a paper, can be interesting (ie the observation is more interesting than the actual act  ) but can be boring and just "like brushing teeth" a mundane repetitive action that doesnt trigger any feelings even

with a person i actually had sexual fantasies about.

 

genders: weight tips towards male and masc  presenting people but can in fact be anyone. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Perfect Moniker

I know it's been years since this question went up but I can relate to parts of it. PIV is the least enjoyable part of sex. When I first started having sex, it didn't include PIV because I didn't want that. Years later, when I tried it, I was unimpressed. The thing is now that people want sex to head that way. Basically I don't engage sexually with people who insist upon it or call all other sex "foreplay". The foreplay is the sex. The touching, kissing etc. is all the sex. The PIV is just the disappointment some people want at the end.

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On 2/2/2019 at 2:30 PM, TrippleL said:

I identify as an asexual, but from many discussions I know my experience is somewhat different to other AVEN people, so I have a question:

 

*TMI warning*

 

I identify as a sex-neutral biromantic biaesthetic bisensual asexual (labels, shmables 🙂) because I neither like nor dislike sexual intercourse, I experience romantic, aesthetic and sensual attraction very intensely and I do not experience sexual attraction (if sexual attraction is defined as attraction leading to the desire to have sexual intercourse of any sort).

 

I spent most of my life believing I was heterosexual as I’m biologically male and I find women and female bodies attractive (I won’t discuss attraction to guys for the sake of this post, but it was there too, in the background).

 

So, I can look at a pretty woman and get aroused. I can look at a woman’s body and get aroused. I can touch a woman’s body and get aroused (that sounds creepy; I mean in a consensual way! 🙂). I therefore love foreplay and I get very aroused during it.

 

When foreplay comes to a close and intercourse is due, there’s like a killswitch; I completely lose interest. Don’t get me wrong, I enjoy orgasms, but the intercourse bit is completely “meh, whatever”. To deal with this in a relationship I have to move VERY quickly from foreplay to intercourse, then the physical stimulation keeps things working as they should.

 

I feel the physiological need to ejaculate 1-2 times per week. As long as I’m not “overdue” from a physiological point of view, I’d be quite happy having foreplay then going to sleep and not having sex or ejaculating.

 

Might be relevant: I’m sex-neutral when it comes to PIV; averse when it comes to any form of oral (giving or receiving).

 

So, question: Can anyone relate to this? If you can, do you identify as asexual/gray/other? (No wrong answers here, just curious)

I COMPLETELY RELATE TO THIS!! Omg I am new to the asexual community so still figuring some things out but a lot of this is also my story. I am a 26 year old woman, grew up believing I was heterosexual (only experienced sexual attraction once in a relationship but never again) and had sex because I thought I was supposed to or to make others happy. I started out sex positive as I had a pretty good experience within my relationship (didn’t really enjoy the sex mostly the closeness that came with it) but have now shifted to sex neutral after some other encounters. Also completely averse to oral (giving and receiving) and have a slight aversion to kissing. I think I other people’s bodily fluids freak me out. I am very much a sensual person though so I love hugs, cuddles, and other touches. Also enjoy foreplay but not what comes after, when I was still having sex I would have to get drunk or find other ways to disconnect from my body to get through it. I do experience romantic attraction so at first I thought I was Demisexual but now I just identify as a gray ace. Touches don’t necessarily arouse me but words do? Not sure if that makes sense. Still figuring things out though since this whole world is new to me, it’s so cool this forum exists since I don’t really know any other aces in real life.

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