Telecaster68 Posted January 9, 2019 Share Posted January 9, 2019 5 minutes ago, InquisitivePhilosopher said: Perhaps others who've online dated would know and/or confirm this, but, if you're worried about your profile coming across as too "pervy" to others, wouldn't adding other hobbies--like your favorite films--make it seem not like that? Just trying to help... It would help, but since apparently about 80% of the men are pretty much horndogs, they don't actually announce it blatantly, and women are used to reading between the lines, so any mention of 'I think sex is important' in context is like saying 'I just want to bang you in some club toilets preferably without any actual conversation'. For most people, it's a given that sex is important, so why mention it? Defences are up and women are (probably mostly rightly) skeptical about men's motives. Link to post Share on other sites
Telecaster68 Posted January 9, 2019 Share Posted January 9, 2019 Just now, zurzojomla said: *MGTOW Fair point. Yes. Link to post Share on other sites
anisotrophic Posted January 9, 2019 Share Posted January 9, 2019 10 minutes ago, Telecaster68 said: Because I don't want to get involved with another asexual, or even a sexual who isn't that bothered about sex, and I'm more aware of the risks and consequences of doing so than I was, so I'd rather knock out anyone in that boat as early as possible. It's been 11 months now, and with my hiatus, I've thought about what I've learned this last year ... about asexuality and sexuality. And I think one thing I learned this year is that sex is a very emotional experience entangled with many other things for many sexuals. To me and many of us, it's not about getting a generic need filled. Who we're having sex with matters to you. The relationship matters, it's not interchangeable with anyone else. And I don't think I'm making an unique insight -- the conversations in this subforum repeatedly dwell on the emotional nature of sex. Hell, your wife dismissed the emotions stuff as a guy thing or something? (so weird.) Anyway. My point is, your experience has led you to have a really visceral firsthand lesson in how emotionally important sex is for most partners -- that it happens, but also how it happens. Describing that experience may be a bit of emotional vulnerability, but to me the insight and experience are arguably be a contrast with horndog cishet sexually entitled dude that's just trying to get laid. Link to post Share on other sites
Telecaster68 Posted January 9, 2019 Share Posted January 9, 2019 1 minute ago, Sally said: Since having sex in a relationship is pretty much a given (because most people are sexual), it isn't necessary for sexuals to explicitly say they're going to want sex. It is, I think, necessary for asexuals to state up-front if they affirmatively DON'T want sex. Some asexuals are OK with having sex, so that explanation of their desires/non-desires wouldn't have to come immediately. Well this is the point of debate. Some asexuals are saying it's equally incumbent regardless of orientation. Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted January 9, 2019 Share Posted January 9, 2019 18 minutes ago, InquisitivePhilosopher said: Perhaps others who've online dated would know and/or confirm this, but, if you're worried about your profile coming across as too "pervy" to others, wouldn't adding other hobbies--like your favorite films--make it seem not like that? Yeah I like it when a guy speaks about all his passions and hobbies, a bit about his work (even if he just works in a post shop or whatever, if he makes a joke about that it's a way to make him more 'human' and relatable). And then having a 'deal breakers' section, or like 'We won't be a match if:' or 'most private thing I am willing to admit': then you clarify (in a polite and respectful way) that you have a high sex drive and seek a similar lady, or something of that sort. 13 minutes ago, Telecaster68 said: I'm the last person to start throwing round MGOW tropes, but truly women's experience of dating sites is vastly different to men's, purely because of market forces. Men typically send out dozens of crafted, specific messages and maybe get half a dozen replies, most of which will drop off the radar subsequently. We can't afford to front and centre anything less than extremely positive, because all the other dudes won't be and I won't even get to having a conversation in which to be clear and give some context and nuance. At the same time, I want to be clear about what I'm after because it's dishonest and counterproductive not to. It's just a tension that needs to be dealt with. Oh as a female on a dating site, I look at every man's profile who messages me and his profile has to stand out to get a response or to even grab my attention. That's the rule. If we are serious, we will definitely look at your profile, read it, and if we like what we see we'll obviously respond. But we need to really like what we see, the words you've used, and feel you've been honest and vulnerable. Pics are also important. A lot of guys seems to think pictures don't matter for some reason but I'll instantly bypass a profile without pics no matter how wordy it is. I'd rather see a fat guy with pimples than no pic at all. I also browse through men's profiles and message those who stand out to me, but I have surprisingly never got a response from a man I have messaged first (edit that's why I get sick to death of seeing men bitching about how women never message first. A lot of us do, and I'm certainly not the only woman who goes to the effort to message men first and never gets a response. Lol!) Link to post Share on other sites
Ceebs Posted January 9, 2019 Share Posted January 9, 2019 4 minutes ago, Sally said: It is, I think, necessary for asexuals to state up-front if they affirmatively DON'T want sex. Yep. I really don't understand any argument whatsoever to the contrary. Like it's actually ok to wait a little while or something. No, no it isn't. Link to post Share on other sites
Telecaster68 Posted January 9, 2019 Share Posted January 9, 2019 2 minutes ago, anisotropic said: Hell, your wife dismissed the emotions stuff as a guy thing or something? (so weird.) That sounded decidedly Trumpish.... Quote your experience has led you to have a really visceral firsthand lesson in how emotionally important sex is for most partners -- that it happens, but also how it happens. Describing that experience may be a bit of emotional vulnerability, but to me the insight and experience are arguably be a contrast with horndog cishet sexually entitled dude that's just trying to get laid. You're right. Deployed properly it could actually work in my favour, but that means not putting it in the profile, and potentially waiting till a few dates before talking about it, and judging the tone and nuance just right. All of which I don't mind, I'm not asking for this stuff to be easy. It's just a bit more complicated to actually execute than 'be upfront'. In its way, it's more tricky than a flat out 'I don't have sex', too. Link to post Share on other sites
Sally Posted January 9, 2019 Share Posted January 9, 2019 5 minutes ago, Telecaster68 said: Well this is the point of debate. Some asexuals are saying it's equally incumbent regardless of orientation. But not all of us, so recognize those who aren't. (And I know you said "some", but those of us who agree with you in some cases may feel a little left out when you disagree with us but don't ever agree. Of course by "those of us" I mean me.) Link to post Share on other sites
ryn2 Posted January 9, 2019 Share Posted January 9, 2019 11 minutes ago, Telecaster68 said: Well, yeah, there's that. But once bitten... Plus, it’s not clear your wife is ace; just (“just”) that she attaches a very different meaning and level of importance to sex than you do, in a way that has become more significant with age. So, the pool of women you are looking to avoid could be a good bit bigger than the 1% aces. Link to post Share on other sites
Telecaster68 Posted January 9, 2019 Share Posted January 9, 2019 4 minutes ago, Ficto. said: I like it when a guy speaks about all his passions and hobbies, a bit about his work (even if he just works in a post shop or whatever, if he makes a joke about that it's a way to make him more 'human' and relatable). And then having a 'deal breakers' section, or like 'We won't be a match if:' or 'most private thing I am willing to admit': then you clarify (in a polite and respectful way) that you have a high sex drive and seek a similar lady, or something of that sort. I was pretty much taking that stuff as read, tbh. I do think there are quite a few women who wouldn't want to respond to any profile even mentioning sex because they're aware that there's a good chance it means I'll just go straight to the dick pic and get pushy about meeting up the next day for sex. Have you looked at female profiles, Ficto? There are a lot making a really big deal about this stuff, and it can only be because they find it necessary. 7 minutes ago, Ficto. said: as a female on a dating site, I look at every man's profile who messages me and his profile has to stand out to get a response or to even grab my attention. That's the rule. If we are serious, we will definitely look at your profile, read it, and if we like what we see we'll obviously respond. But we need to really like what we see, the words you've used, and feel you've been honest and vulnerable. Pics are also important. A lot of guys seems to think pictures don't matter for some reason but I'll instantly bypass a profile without pics no matter how wordy it is. I've written to pay the bills since I was 18, so yeah, I use my words. And my pics are actually done to be amusing in themselves, on the basis that if you find them funny, we'll probably get on fine, and if you don't get the joke, we won't, so nothing lost. Link to post Share on other sites
LeChat Posted January 9, 2019 Share Posted January 9, 2019 2 minutes ago, ryn2 said: Plus, it’s not clear your wife is ace; just (“just”) that she attaches a very different meaning and level of importance to sex than you do, in a way that has become more significant with age. So, the pool of women you are looking to avoid could be a good bit bigger than the 1% aces. Yes. For some middle-aged women, menopause and aging reduces their sex drive. Link to post Share on other sites
Telecaster68 Posted January 9, 2019 Share Posted January 9, 2019 5 minutes ago, Sally said: But not all of us, so recognize those who aren't. (And I know you said "some", but those of us who agree with you in some cases may feel a little left out when you disagree with us but don't ever agree. Of course by "those of us" I mean me.) Fair enough. The AVEN 'some' pisses me off too sometimes. Link to post Share on other sites
Telecaster68 Posted January 9, 2019 Share Posted January 9, 2019 3 minutes ago, ryn2 said: it’s not clear your wife is ace; just (“just”) that she attaches a very different meaning and level of importance to sex than you do, in a way that has become more significant with age. She attaches no meaning and no importance to sex. She's never said anything that isn't entirely consistent with being an ace who liked sex when it happened but didn't see it as anything other than a happy coincidence and didn't understand it as part of a relationship. So no, she didn't identify, but if it quacks like duck, etc. Age and menopause reduced her libido. Her sex drive never required a partner to sate it, in the way that a sexual's does. Link to post Share on other sites
Philip027 Posted January 9, 2019 Share Posted January 9, 2019 Quote Philip and ryn2 are both arguing the position that asexuals don't ever have to come out to sexuals they are dating unless the sexual actually asks them whether they are asexual. Wrong again. I just said that the first date to me is a little bit early to bring up the subject of sex at all in most contexts (like, you're still just learning if you even like hanging out with each other; why the hell are you bringing up fucking each other?), unless like I said the relationship is clearly established as a casual hookup or something. That is not the same thing as saying "never have to mention it ever". Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted January 9, 2019 Share Posted January 9, 2019 10 minutes ago, Telecaster68 said: Have you looked at female profiles, Ficto? There are a lot making a really big deal about this stuff, and it can only be because they find it necessary. I'm not sure if you noticed but I've mentioned a few times that I actively seek sex with women on OkCupid so yes I read the ladies profiles However (take it from a female who has been using dating sites since 2013 Tele, I do know what I'm talking about!) We aren't referring to guys like you when we say stuff like 'fuck off I'm not interested in your dick' or something in our profiles. We get hundreds of messages every day that consist of 'hey baby wanna see me wank on cam?' 'can I fuck your titties?' 'ill show you my penis' 'damn baby girl nice smile I'd pound that face if I could' that kind of shit. It's a consent and never ending stream of sexual one-liners. And if you click on the guys profile there won't be any info or anything, maybe it'll just say 'im a fun guy like to laugh' at tops. That's why we get so aggro to the extent we have to bitch in our profiles about men who only look for sex. It's not that we are bored of seeing intelligent, funny, responsible men who clearly place importance on sex, we are just So. Fucking. Sick. of those poor excuses of men who actively go out of their way to make dating sites a bad experience for us!! Those are the guys we are almost exclusively referring to when we seem angry about how sexual so many men are. Seriously, it's exhausting Y_Y But we aren't alking about guys like you. Link to post Share on other sites
Telecaster68 Posted January 9, 2019 Share Posted January 9, 2019 It could. But it wasn't. Link to post Share on other sites
ryn2 Posted January 9, 2019 Share Posted January 9, 2019 7 minutes ago, Telecaster68 said: She attaches no meaning and no importance to sex. She's never said anything that isn't entirely consistent with being an ace who liked sex when it happened but didn't see it as anything other than a happy coincidence and didn't understand it as part of a relationship. So no, she didn't identify, but if it quacks like duck, etc. Age and menopause reduced her libido. Her sex drive never required a partner to sate it, in the way that a sexual's does. My point being: there could be plenty of people out there who do not ID as ace but who would be as incompatible with you as she is... so relying on “aces are rare enough that odds are good I won’t match with one” could be unwise. Link to post Share on other sites
Telecaster68 Posted January 9, 2019 Share Posted January 9, 2019 Just now, Ficto. said: I'm not sure if you noticed but I've mentioned a few times that I actively seek sex with women on OkCupid so yes I read the ladies profiles However (take it from a female who has been using dating sites since 2013 Tele, I do know what I'm talking about!) We aren't referring to guys like you when we say stuff like 'fuck off I'm not interested in your dick' or something in our profiles. We get hundreds of messages every day that consist of 'hey baby wanna see me wank on cam?' 'can I fuck your titties?' 'ill show you my penis' 'damn baby girl nice smile I'd pound that face if I could' that kind of shit. It's a consent and never ending stream of sexual one-liners. And if you click on the guys profile there won't be any info or anything, maybe it'll just say 'im a fun guy like to laugh' at tops. That's why we get to aggro to the extent we have to bitch in our profiles about men who only look for sex. It's not that we are bored of seeing intelligent, funny, responsible men who clearly place importance on sex, we are just So. Fucking. Sick. of those poor excuses of men who actively go out of their way to make dating sites a bad experience for us!! Those are the guys we are almost exclusively referring to when we seem angry about how sexual so many men are. Seriously, it's exhausting Y_Y But we aren't alking about guys like you. Well thankyou. I'm still not convinced those idiots haven't basically put off most women from any man who doesn't at least initially present as being basically asexual (ironically...). The female equivalent of the dick pic merchant seems to be the attention queen, from what I can tell. No actual intention of developing anything at all, but just up to harvest 'likes' and fawning conversation at the drop of a hat. There's quite a few of those. (And yep, I'm on Tinder. But at my age it doesn't seem to be about hookups, but more like a dating app. Or if it is about hookups, I'm entirely missing some epic coded messages). Link to post Share on other sites
Telecaster68 Posted January 10, 2019 Share Posted January 10, 2019 1 minute ago, ryn2 said: My point being: there could be plenty of people out there who do not ID as ace but who would be as incompatible with you as she is... so relying on “aces are rare enough that odds are good I won’t match with one” could be unwise. Yeah. I'm also filtering responses to the whole 'sex is really important' for implications that it's fine but not that important. I want whatever the equivalent is of enthusiastic consent. Link to post Share on other sites
Telecaster68 Posted January 10, 2019 Share Posted January 10, 2019 [relic of mreid related incident] Link to post Share on other sites
Telecaster68 Posted January 10, 2019 Share Posted January 10, 2019 [relic of mreid related incident] Link to post Share on other sites
Ceebs Posted January 10, 2019 Share Posted January 10, 2019 2 minutes ago, Telecaster68 said: Blimey mreid I do believe you're learning social skills. Ohhhhhh... fuck. Good lord, really? I should've picked up on that earlier... Link to post Share on other sites
Telecaster68 Posted January 10, 2019 Share Posted January 10, 2019 Clear your inbox, Ceebs. Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted January 10, 2019 Share Posted January 10, 2019 1 minute ago, Ceebs. said: Ohhhhhh... fuck. Good lord, really? I should've picked up on that earlier... Yeah I picked up on it before when I saw her commenting under someone's status update. She's almost instantly recognisable haha. Link to post Share on other sites
ryn2 Posted January 10, 2019 Share Posted January 10, 2019 6 minutes ago, Telecaster68 said: The female equivalent of the dick pic merchant seems to be the attention queen, from what I can tell. Here it’s the scammer looking for money, lol. Link to post Share on other sites
Ceebs Posted January 10, 2019 Share Posted January 10, 2019 1 minute ago, Telecaster68 said: Clear your inbox, Ceebs. Shit, sorry! Will do. Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted January 10, 2019 Share Posted January 10, 2019 The forward whatever you learn to me Ceebs, haha Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted January 10, 2019 Share Posted January 10, 2019 7 minutes ago, Telecaster68 said: Well thankyou. I'm still not convinced those idiots haven't basically put off most women from any man who doesn't at least initially present as being basically asexual (ironically...). Hah well it's quite odd, because for me, I need to know the guy has a capacity for boob worship and also to be open to having me suck his dick (or more) whenever *I* want it. But I'm also in the position of having to explain that very subtly in a way that doesn't come across like I'm hypersexual, because I'm actually very non-sexual in comparison to other people (that's why I hide that info far down in the profile where only people who actually bother reading it will find it). So even as a woman who has more of an inclination to less sexual men, I still need to see that a man has capacity for sexuality. I just also need to see that he places as much if not more interest in other exciting things. So even I will avoid profiles of men who seem too asexual, but you're right in that they can't come across as too sexual either haha. They need to strike that perfect balance between wit, intelligence, kindness, and being able to please a woman sexually in the way she wants without ever being to pushy or demanding about it. If you can craft your profile perfectly to reflect all of those qualities then I am sure you'll be fighting the ladies off with a stick Another tip, have yourself holding some kind of cute animal in your pain profile pic. A bunny, a kitten, a little doggie.. that's the fastest way to get a lady's attention. Seriously, moreso than if you steal a pic of someone's abs (I have no idea why guys think we'll fall for that) or even if you have a pic of yourself holding a wad of money. A cute little animal will get our attention faster than anything else because it shows you're vulnerable and kind and sweet and we automatically want to message you to say 'aaaaawh cute kitty' or whatever. Haha. My brothers actually started taking my mum's rabbits to the park on harnesses. They went from guys who couldn't get girlfriends to having flocks of girls hanging around them in the park to cuddle the rabbits. A little animal is always a great way to start a convo with a lady Link to post Share on other sites
Telecaster68 Posted January 10, 2019 Share Posted January 10, 2019 Just now, Ficto. said: I need to know the guy has a capacity for boob worship and also to be open to having me suck his dick (or more) whenever *I* want it. Those really don't strike me as onerous demands ... 1 minute ago, Ficto. said: If you can craft your profile perfectly to reflect all of those qualities then I am sure you'll be fighting the ladies off with a stick Thirty years of professional writing finally finds its ultimate purpose, in that case. 2 minutes ago, Ficto. said: have yourself holding some kind of cute animal in your pain profile pic I suspect us Brits might be a little cynical for that. Apparently 'man holding fish' is a cliche to the point of being funny, so my pics feature a disproportionately huge goldfish as well as me. Others include a deliberately shoddily photoshopped cycling pic (me on a Chopper bike), and a similar one in a crap car. Plus some non-funny ones. No pecs. Not entirely sure they work but at least they're different and specific rather than generic. Link to post Share on other sites
LeChat Posted January 10, 2019 Share Posted January 10, 2019 8 minutes ago, Ficto. said: …My brothers actually started taking my mum's rabbits to the park on harnesses. They went from guys who couldn't get girlfriends to having flocks of girls hanging around them in the park to cuddle the rabbits... Rabbits on harnesses, in a park...sounds hilarious! Link to post Share on other sites
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