James121

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MrDane

I think, I have not been lied to. My ace-wife didnt know until very long into the relationship. I think, she suspected thing to be wrong with either the world, her, her ability to losen up and enjoy sex, wrong with me, circumstances.

I think, she has been quite slow to find out and she talks about how it is a process, but she didnt tell me everything everytime or first time it occured to her. So I was not always in on her proces and where it went.

I think, once in a while, when I laid my head back and said “pfui, maaaan. That was nice!” And she didnt as would be typical, did not respond, but instead said “yes, it was” . I dont know how many of those times were “...for you. And good for that!” And if some of those were “...that it was over!” Or “...as in not awful, nor fantastic. But nice to be close. Just not so much the actual sex”

 

keeping important information about US-stuff to yourself deprives one part of coping with what is going on. Even if done out of love and concern.

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ryn2
2 minutes ago, MrDane said:

keeping important information about US-stuff to yourself deprives one part of coping with what is going on. Even if done out of love and concern.

Agreed, but sometimes you don’t even know you’re doing that until you look back.

 

”That was great [because I really enjoyed it!  I love feeling so close to you!]” and “yes it was [because it lasted half as long as I was afraid it might!]” are both true statements that feel like a conversation but leave out key information.  The problem isn’t so much the leaving out as it is the assuming.

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MrDane
1 minute ago, ryn2 said:

Agreed, but sometimes you don’t even know you’re doing that until you look back.

 

”That was great [because I really enjoyed it!  I love feeling so close to you!]” and “yes it was [because it lasted half as long as I was afraid it might!]” are both true statements that feel like a conversation but leave out key information.  The problem isn’t so much the leaving out as it is the assuming.

Agree, agree! And nobody wants to receive feedback on all levels of everything you do. “Wow, that was a 9.2 on the washing up-scale.”. I am not sure, that my lovely wife could have done it differently, without risking to inflict pain on other levels. 

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Serran
1 minute ago, MrDane said:

Agree, agree! And nobody wants to receive feedback on all levels of everything you do. “Wow, that was a 9.2 on the washing up-scale.”. I am not sure, that my lovely wife could have done it differently, without risking to inflict pain on other levels. 

Yeah. And honestly, its hard to go against social programming and say "It wasnt nice for me, but im glad you enjoyed it, so it is nice for me to see your happiness" or such. My partner can tell when I actually am fully into it or not and the one time I was not ... she got really upset I didnt say, but its really awkward to tell someone the sex was not good for you. It feels like giving them a huge insult, which is hard to wrap your head around being OK. 

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James121
3 hours ago, Winged Whisperer said:

Not only is this insulting, you're claiming to know the intention and motivation of others without ANY evidence whatsoever.

 

-"Hey I didn't know you're allergic to chocolate."

-"You actually did know and only want to comfort yourself now that you've put me in hospital tonight."

-"... Or maybe I really didn't know?"

 

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Oh please. Insulting? My comments have been taken out of context (common in aven) and manipulated in to something that makes certain people a victim (common in aven).

Quit the victim mentality where people and life have wronged you and accept what I said for what it is. 

Cancer victims **often** know that they are not well before they are diagnosed with a specific cancer.

Asexuals will **often** know that they don’t fit the norm with regards to sex before they marry. 

 

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ryn2
25 minutes ago, Serran said:

My partner can tell when I actually am fully into it or not and the one time I was not ... she got really upset I didnt say, but its really awkward to tell someone the sex was not good for you. It feels like giving them a huge insult, which is hard to wrap your head around being OK. 

I’m guessing - just guessing, please correct me if I’m wrong - this may be slightly easier to detect in same-sex relationships too because you know exactly what “this was at best okay” feels and looks like.

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Serran
8 minutes ago, James121 said:

 

Asexuals will **often** know that they don’t fit the norm with regards to sex before they marry. 

 

Except for all the mixed relationships over the years where aces didnt know until after years...

 

Its becoming more common now for aces to know early, because of vsibility. Without visibility though, you are stuck with trying to figure out the abscence of something that is often absent until you are close to someone and in the situation to have sex.. on top of NRE making sex OK even to those who end up being averse after it wears off. That isnt exactly as easy to figure out as "Oh I dont feel good, I should see a doctor"... 

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ryn2
11 minutes ago, James121 said:

Asexuals will **often** know that they don’t fit the norm with regards to sex before they marry. 

What are you basing this on?

 

I see a fair number of people saying “looking back, I now see...” but that’s not the same as knowing at the time.

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Serran
1 minute ago, ryn2 said:

I’m guessing - just guessing, please correct me if I’m wrong - this may be slightly easier to detect in same-sex relationships too because you know exactly what “this was at best okay” feels and looks like.

Not really. She can tell because... TMI

 



My body reacts to orgasm with tightening and loosening of the vaginal muscles. Meaning, if fingers are up there, it feels like squeeze and release, uncontrollable by me. Body just does it on its own. 

 

 

She also pays stupid close attention to my face, body language and general tone at all times to read my moods. I cant be upset or annoyed and hide it. I cant be quieter than normal and stressed without it being noticed. It is both sweet and frustrating, because I end up not even being able to hide a simple annoyance I want to keep to myself. 😛

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ryn2
1 minute ago, Serran said:

Not really.

Makes sense.  It seems someone who owns one might be more attuned to that, but maybe it’s just that she’s generally very attuned to little details.

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Telecaster68

Um, as a straight man... I can tell when a woman orgasms in the kind of situation described above. It's not a detail.

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Traveler40

Um, yes - I believe that’s a standard reaction during orgasm.  Oh, and yes, it can be faked simply by using your kegels. It would be a shame to have to fake it, but it’s been known to happen. 😬

 

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Telecaster68
9 minutes ago, Traveler40 said:

Um, yes - I believe that’s a standard reaction during orgasm.  Oh, and yes, it can be faked simply by using your kegels. It would be a shame to have to fake it, but it’s been known to happen. 😬

 

But deliberately faked. Orgasms tend not to be ambiguous or subtle.

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Traveler40

🤔 Well, perhaps my experience is limited generally, but I’ve never been with a man who could tell the difference.  

 

Edit: Admittedly sad from all angles, but at times it’s just.....kinder.

 

hmmm....Do you think he was faking his reaction to my faked orgasms?!? 

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Winged Whisperer

I don't who said what that prompted me to write this next point, but whatever: You don't have to explicitly say every little detail about yourself to your partner. As an individual you have a right to privacy. Just because I feel weird in some way, have a kink or fetish or crush on someone, suspect that I differ from the norm in some way, whatever really, doesn't mean I have to make an attempt to communicate that, otherwise we'd just be talking all day and do nothing else. That's not to say deception in any way is alright, or withholding critical information that affects the other person is fine, but we don't have to spill every dark (or not so dark) feeling and secret out. Some things people feel more comfortable to themselves. Obviously a person's sexual orientation is critical information in a relationship, but "YOU SUSPECTED SOMETHING!" really ought to be left to the individual to be relayed or not.

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Telecaster68

I don't doubt it. But the original point was that some lovers just can't read their partner well enough to know whether they're enjoying sex or not. I just meant it takes intentional deception to get an orgasm wrong... 

 

I'm not saying I could tell it's fake, just that it would need to be faked. 

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Serran
4 minutes ago, Traveler40 said:

🤔 Well, perhaps my experience is limited generally, but I’ve never been with a man who could tell the difference.  

 

Edit: Admittedly sad from all angles, but at times it’s just.....kinder.

Ive never tried faking one.. I just dont go "stop cause you cant get me off today", I just say stop. I feel bad saying why. 

 

Just now, Telecaster68 said:

I don't doubt it. But the original point was that some lovers just can't read their partner well enough to know whether they're enjoying sex or not. I just meant it takes intentional deception to get an orgasm wrong... 

 

I'm not saying I could tell it's fake, just that it would need to be faked. 

I never knew if I had experienced one when with my four previous partners. They asked me, but I was like I dunno. They couldnt tell, I couldnt tell. 

 

Now I have had one I know I hadnt with them. 

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Telecaster68
1 minute ago, Serran said:

They couldnt tell, I couldnt tell. 

 

Now I have had one I know I hadnt with them.

Personally, if my partner says she isn't sure, I'm pretty convinced she hasn't. As you say, you know.

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Traveler40

As Tele says - it’s unambiguous.  When you have one, there’s no missing it.  

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Serran
Just now, Telecaster68 said:

Personally, if my partner says she isn't sure, I'm pretty convinced she hasn't. As you say, you know.

Haha I had never had one so I had no idea. I was like sometimes I feel something ? Maybe ? Mostly I just felt annoyed at how long they spent trying. 

 

My last ex thought I had. 

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Telecaster68

I don't understand how anyone who's had an orgasm or seen a partner have one could mistake not having one for having one.

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Sally
6 minutes ago, Telecaster68 said:

I don't understand how anyone who's had an orgasm or seen a partner have one could mistake not having one for having one.

You may not understand it, but it happens.  Some sexuals may not pay as much attention as you do.  My partner didn't.  

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Telecaster68

Did they not know or not care?

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Traveler40

In my experience it was ego that got them...

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Sally

My partner didn't know.  I'm basing that on 1) what he told me, and 2) the shock he exhibited when I told him about learning about asexuality.  

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Telecaster68

Out of interest, were you consciously faking or over playing enjoyment? 

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ryn2
1 hour ago, Telecaster68 said:

I don't doubt it. But the original point was that some lovers just can't read their partner well enough to know whether they're enjoying sex or not. I just meant it takes intentional deception to get an orgasm wrong... 

 

I'm not saying I could tell it's fake, just that it would need to be faked. 

I didn’t mean orgasm specifically, I meant the path there.

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ryn2
1 hour ago, Sally said:

You may not understand it, but it happens.  Some sexuals may not pay as much attention as you do.  My partner didn't.  

Very much agreed.

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ryn2

It also sounds like people are talking about two different scenarios here... distinguishing orgasm from no orgasm, and distinguishing real orgasm from fake one.

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ryn2
2 hours ago, Telecaster68 said:

Um, as a straight man... I can tell when a woman orgasms in the kind of situation described above. It's not a detail.

Misunderstanding on my part... forgot serran had not orgasmed before this partner, thought this was some tiny thing happening along the way.  🤣

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