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Sexual Wife/Asexual Husband - It's A Hard Life


Wandering Around

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7 minutes ago, MrDane said:

This, I fear to ask my wife about, since I hope that she actually enjoys it, when the stars are enligned and the timing is rigth. I fear for her response.

It’s possible to enjoy doing something for the benefit it brings to others, without enjoying the thing itself.  E.g., attending a sporting event you don’t personally care for because  going (and sharing the experience with you) is something your partner really likes, having dinner at a restaurant that’s just not your thing because it’s your partner’s favorite, going on a beach vacation when you’d much rather be skiing because your partner has SAD and will really benefit from some time in a warm, sunny place.

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32 minutes ago, ryn2 said:

It’s possible to enjoy doing something for the benefit it brings to others, without enjoying the thing itself.  E.g., attending a sporting event you don’t personally care for because  going (and sharing the experience with you) is something your partner really likes, having dinner at a restaurant that’s just not your thing because it’s your partner’s favorite, going on a beach vacation when you’d much rather be skiing because your partner has SAD and will really benefit from some time in a warm, sunny place.

Thanks, yes you are rigth. This is where focus could be. But it sure would be nice with a mutually enjoyed experience. 

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34 minutes ago, MrDane said:

Thanks, yes you are rigth. This is where focus could be. But it sure would be nice with a mutually enjoyed experience. 

Everything I listed off would be best/ideal if shared with a partner who not only liked doing it for the joy it brought you but for the joy of doing it as well.  Even tolerating/mildly enjoying something isn’t going to be quite the same as really, really loving it.

 

The only way to achieve that, though, is to find someone who legitimately enjoys it just as much as you do.  Not too much more, because then you’re the one putting the brakes on.  Not too much less, because then you know they’re not really having fun.

 

In any relationship there are bound to be compromises.  It’s very rare to find someone who finds the same amount of true joy in all the same things that are important to you.

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BoneThugzN_mOO
On 9/11/2018 at 8:10 AM, Wandering Around said:

I know this sounds mean but he's so happy with a hug and kissing me on the forehead I could scream most days. I know that sounds harsh, but it's true. He's all smiles - fine and dandy - while I feel like something scraped out from under a rusted lawn mower. 

It like reading my thoughts on paper only they aren't mine. Up until this exact moment I thought I was the only person who was frustrated and at times hurt over some changes in my relationship. I had no clue as to what it was until I found myself up at 1am Googling what could be wrong or making my partner not want anything more than a hug and to kiss my forhead. I read about this site on Wiki and now I'm here. 

 

Im still in shock seeing I'm just now learning all this tonight and have had no time to let it sink in. Any advice for how to talk to my partner about this? I'm not sure what's appropriate and not. I don't want to upset him or make him think I'm judging or pointing fingers, etc. I love him just the same, I just don't know where I go from here. 

 

Thanks! 🐄🐄

 

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2 hours ago, BoneThugzN_mOO said:

Im still in shock seeing I'm just now learning all this tonight and have had no time to let it sink in. Any advice for how to talk to my partner about this? I'm not sure what's appropriate and not. I don't want to upset him or make him think I'm judging or pointing fingers, etc. I love him just the same, I just don't know where I go from here.

@BoneThugzN_mOO I started here & recommend this: https://theacetheist.wordpress.com/2014/03/24/what-to-do-if-you-think-your-partner-might-be-asexual/

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BoneThugzN_mOO

Thanks! I'll check it out here in a few. Against my better judgement I got back into bed after my comment and it was most definitely a poor choice on my part. Now, I'm sitting on the floor beside the couch in a corner not sure what to do. Especially as my partner gets ready for work without a care in the world. Mostly because in his world there's nothing wrong. 

 

🐄🐄

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Go easy on yourself.  Big revelations are very emotionally disruptive... give yourself some

time to process everything.

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18 minutes ago, BoneThugzN_mOO said:

Thanks! I'll check it out here in a few. Against my better judgement I got back into bed after my comment and it was most definitely a poor choice on my part. Now, I'm sitting on the floor beside the couch in a corner not sure what to do. Especially as my partner gets ready for work without a care in the world. Mostly because in his world there's nothing wrong. 

 

🐄🐄

When you've drawn breath, the first step is opening communication and helping him understand that there is indeed a huge, monumental, potentially relationship ending problem, but that together you as a couple can have a shot at resolving it.

 

The together bit is crucial, so on the one hand he doesn't feel like you're trying to cure him because you think he's broken, but on the other hand, he understand this requires you both making an effort, and doing it as team. 

 

Once that starts, you both need to find a compromise that you can both live with long term, and be brutally honest about it, because in the end one or other of you might not be able to sustain it. Probably, he'll need to compromise by having more sex and other physical intimacy than he would want, but being happy to do it for your sake (as opposed to thinking of it as the price to pay for you not leaving). You'll have to get your head round less sex, less intimacy than you want, and that it never, ever comes from him desiring you in that raw, sexual way, but doing it for you because he loves you and enjoys doing things to make you happy. Oh, and you need to swallow the resentment and insecurity, which is really hard, and you'll probably need to find another outlet for it (therapy, friend, martial arts...) but if he gets a whiff of it, he'll get even more anxious and quite probably close down more - this is based on what asexuals on AVEN have consistently said.

 

But for now - just start communicating.

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7 minutes ago, Telecaster68 said:

[...]but being happy to do it for your sake (as opposed to thinking of it as the price to pay for you not leaving).

This is something it may take him quite a bit of time to achieve, and that may require professional assistance.  It’s a natural worldview for some people, but not for everyone... and if it’s also true that you (OP) will leave without sex it may be difficult for him to forget that part and keep more pleasant motives in mind.

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4 minutes ago, ryn2 said:

This is something it may take him quite a bit of time to achieve, and that may require professional assistance.  It’s a natural worldview for some people, but not for everyone... and if it’s also true that you (OP) will leave without sex it may be difficult for him to forget that part and keep more pleasant motives in mind.

One way to square the circle here is to focus on the deal-breaker not being so much the lack of sex, but a lack of concern that this is a big problem for you.

 

You might end up deciding that without sex, despite his best efforts, you'll have to end the relationship, and that's where it gets tricky. To an asexual, who doesn't feel how sex is intrinsically entwined with emotional intimacy, it does just sound like 'sex is more important than our relationship'.

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9 minutes ago, Telecaster68 said:

One way to square the circle here is to focus on the deal-breaker not being so much the lack of sex, but a lack of concern that this is a big problem for you.

 

You might end up deciding that without sex, despite his best efforts, you'll have to end the relationship, and that's where it gets tricky. To an asexual, who doesn't feel how sex is intrinsically entwined with emotional intimacy, it does just sound like 'sex is more important than our relationship'.

Yeah, that only works if the deal-breaker *is* the lack of concern (and not (also, or only) the lack of sex).

 

The risk here is that an ace solution to “my dealbreaker is that I need to see you recognize this is very difficult for me and are appropriately sympathetic” is to amp up vocalizing the caring.

 

If you won’t actually be satisfied (from a dealbreaker standpoint) with more genuine sympathy and yet no more sex, backtracking is going to come across to the ace as a lie.

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That's where the teamwork thing comes in - it needs to be clear actual effort is needed, not just warm words.

 

And now we're back to our different perspectives on words vs action.

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No, it just sounds like lack of concern alone is not the actual dealbreaker.  Rather, it sounds like you’re going on to assume that the presence of real concern would somehow automatically lead to an urge to (not only be more sympathetic but also) find a way to provide you more sex.

 

I’m saying that - if that’s the case - it needs to be spelled out more explicitly when you’re working through your dealbreakers together.

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I.e., it sounds like the actual request is “I want your willingness to engage in more sex to come from a place of genuine compassion for how difficult a sexless life is for me, not from the fear that I will leave you without it.”

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+1 on all the above, and to take your time and learn about how he might experience things... not deciding his orientation for him either.

 

Also, realizing that he might have no idea how different your experience has been, he wasn't intending to hurt you. Focusing on wanting a relationship where you both care about each other sounds right, and can communicate unhappiness without it turning sour.

 

You'll be trying to understand yourselves better too, so... you might not fully understand what your needs are without trying to meet them. It's likely to take a long time, months, very unlikely to have any obvious single solution.

 

@ryn2 @Telecaster68 try to avoid having @BoneThugzN_mOO's thread into arguing with each other? (Edit to add: ah, originally @Wandering Around... I guess it's sad to see requests for advice seem to turn into other people rapidly firing off at each other.)  😕

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2 minutes ago, ryn2 said:

it sounds like you’re going on to assume that the presence of real concern would somehow automatically lead to an urge to (not only be more sympathetic but also) find a way to provide you more sex.

I am, because I think it should at least be tried, absent complete repulsion from the asexual. Refusal to even try does, to me, indicate an absence of real concern. Action over words. By the same token, the sexual should be willing to try having no sex, but mostly, they've already tried that, by default.

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2 minutes ago, anisotropic said:

@ryn2 @Telecaster68 try to avoid having @BoneThugzN_mOO's thread into arguing with each other? 😕

It's relevant discussion, I think, and more of a discussion than an argument. Also, vigilante modding is frowned upon on AVEN.

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2 minutes ago, Telecaster68 said:

vigilante modding is frowned upon on AVEN

Okay, fine, argue away. I only meant to voice my own sadness to see things get buried like this.

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4 minutes ago, Telecaster68 said:

I am, because I think it should at least be tried, absent complete repulsion from the asexual. Refusal to even try does, to me, indicate an absence of real concern. Action over words. By the same token, the sexual should be willing to try having no sex, but mostly, they've already tried that, by default.

Don’t disagree.  My point is that for the ace it’s not necessarily going to be a thought process that will naturally follow.  It needs to be carefully spelled out.

 

7 minutes ago, anisotropic said:

 @Telecaster68 try to avoid having @BoneThugzN_mOO's thread into arguing with each other? 😕

I didn’t think we were arguing?  At any rate it distills down to “because aces and sexuals may view even the simplest-sounding things completely differently, it’s important to talk (and listen) in considerable detail and not leave  things open to interpretation.”

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1 hour ago, ryn2 said:

I.e., it sounds like the actual request is “I want your willingness to engage in more sex to come from a place of genuine compassion for how difficult a sexless life is for me, not from the fear that I will leave you without it.”

That makes completely sense - to me.  I'm not sure it would to a person who doesn't experience sexual desire.   

 

 

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46 minutes ago, uhtred said:

That makes completely sense - to me.  I'm not sure it would to a person who doesn't experience sexual desire.   

 

 

It’s a good place to start a discussion.  Totally agreed that behind the scenes it’s going to be a stretch for some of us to really “get” it.

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Wandering Around
On 9/19/2018 at 3:43 AM, BoneThugzN_mOO said:

It like reading my thoughts on paper only they aren't mine. Up until this exact moment I thought I was the only person who was frustrated and at times hurt over some changes in my relationship. I had no clue as to what it was until I found myself up at 1am Googling what could be wrong or making my partner not want anything more than a hug and to kiss my forhead. I read about this site on Wiki and now I'm here. 

 

Im still in shock seeing I'm just now learning all this tonight and have had no time to let it sink in. Any advice for how to talk to my partner about this? I'm not sure what's appropriate and not. I don't want to upset him or make him think I'm judging or pointing fingers, etc. I love him just the same, I just don't know where I go from here. 

 

Thanks! 🐄🐄

 

I'm glad my words could help you @BoneThugzN_mOO I too found myself up late googling what on earth has made my husband have zero interest in me in this manner and it took over a decade to get to this point of where we could talk about it honestly and get somewhere. It's been an emotional rollercoaster ride I wish for no one... it's done damage to both of us but my mind and heart are  shattered in ways that this revelation cannot not instantly fixed.... I spent so many years thinking something was wrong with me. It's going to take time to undo that. 

 

I had to open the conversation 15 different ways before we actually started talking. It has not been an easy time... I know you are hurting right now and I wish you the best. Feel free to PM me. *HUGS* 

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  • 4 weeks later...
On ‎9‎/‎19‎/‎2018 at 8:43 AM, BoneThugzN_mOO said:

I know this sounds mean but he's so happy with a hug and kissing me on the forehead I could scream most days. I know that sounds harsh, but it's true. He's all smiles - fine and dandy - while I feel like something scraped out from under a rusted lawn mower. 

This sums up my life too - I would not wish this on anyone but it helps me to know that I am not the only one.  My 24 years of marriage have made me question everything that is wrong about me and I have felt that  the really strong love that we had originally, slowly diminish  (on my husbands part first and then one mine).  My husband remains keen that we should stay together.

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I'm in a bit of a cynical phase, so don't want to say too much for fear of giving you negative ideas, but:

 

  1. Hinging your self worth on an asexual finding you desirable is irrational.
  2. You'd be better off finding a partner who was into you. Whether you ditched this one or not.
  3. Repeated intentions that don't come through are lazy selfishness and you must draw the line somewhere.
  4. It is fine to have a limited relationship on a level that works while seeking another relationship, also on a level that works as long as you do it honestly. Talk to your partner about opening up your relationship.
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6 minutes ago, anamikanon said:

I'm in a bit of a cynical phase, so don't want to say too much for fear of giving you negative ideas, but:

 

  1. Hinging your self worth on an asexual finding you desirable is irrational.
  2. You'd be better off finding a partner who was into you. Whether you ditched this one or not.
  3. Repeated intentions that don't come through are lazy selfishness and you must draw the line somewhere.
  4. It is fine to have a limited relationship on a level that works while seeking another relationship, also on a level that works as long as you do it honestly. Talk to your partner about opening up your relationship.

Agree in principal.  I really do. But in practice:

 

1). Its really hard not to be hurt by a lack of desire from the most important person in the world to you - when desire is tightly tied to how you experience love

2).  Yes.  Just after a long time its difficult to leave. (it just gets worse with time because of the "why now" question.    If your spouse doesn't approve of open marriages, then cheating is a betrayal. 

3)  Here I agree. I think the problem is that the asexual sometimes doesn't want to open the issue because they can see where it might lead.  A: "I'm asexual and never want sex again".  S: "Are you OK with an open marriage?".  A: "No, I couldn't stand that, I love you, why do you need sex".   S: "Its just the way I am, I can't have a happy life without a good sex life".    Then like a chess game the next moves are:

 

A: "OK if its that important  to you, we can have sex more often".    S: " but we've had this conversation N times in the past and it never changes for long.   I can't live like this anymore. Its not your fault but I want a divorce". 

 

OR

 

A:  "OK if its that important to you, you can sleep with other men / women. (said with near tears).  S: "no, there is no point doing something that makes you miserable and resentful.  Look this just isn't working....

 

 

 

Its divorce in 2 moves. 

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On #3, also, there’s often a bit of what I like to call “the introvert’s problem.”  I.e., the person may make the commitment with heartfelt, honest intention... but, as the time to deliver approaches, following through feels more and more impossible.

 

E.g., and this is the “introvert’s” part, say one of my best friends invites me to go out and meet a group of people at a bar in six weeks.  I check my calendar and the day is free.  I haven’t seen him in years.  It sounds fun.  I commit.

 

As the weeks tick by, I feel more and more anxious.  My brain starts unhelpfully looking for workable excuses.  By the time I have to leave the office that day I would sell my soul for a flat tire along the way.  The only thing that gets me there is that (I’ve been through this tons of times, so I know my brain is playing games and things will actually be fine, but mostly) my friend is introverted too.  He goes through the same thing.  I have talked him down over and over, even for this very same event.  If I beg off there is no way he will believe me.

 

It took me decades to get there, and it wasn’t laziness.

 

Something with no fixed deadline is basically 100% doomed.  As long as it’s less painful to push it aside (not forget it, not for a long time), that’s what’s going to happen.

 

I can see why it might look lazy from the outside, though.

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20 minutes ago, ryn2 said:

On #3, also, there’s often a bit of what I like to call “the introvert’s problem.”  I.e., the person may make the commitment with heartfelt, honest intention... but, as the time to deliver approaches, following through feels more and more impossible.

 

E.g., and this is the “introvert’s” part, say one of my best friends invites me to go out and meet a group of people at a bar in six weeks.  I check my calendar and the day is free.  I haven’t seen him in years.  It sounds fun.  I commit.

 

As the weeks tick by, I feel more and more anxious.  My brain starts unhelpfully looking for workable excuses.  By the time I have to leave the office that day I would sell my soul for a flat tire along the way.  The only thing that gets me there is that (I’ve been through this tons of times, so I know my brain is playing games and things will actually be fine, but mostly) my friend is introverted too.  He goes through the same thing.  I have talked him down over and over, even for this very same event.  If I beg off there is no way he will believe me.

 

It took me decades to get there, and it wasn’t laziness.

 

Something with no fixed deadline is basically 100% doomed.  As long as it’s less painful to push it aside (not forget it, not for a long time), that’s what’s going to happen.

 

I can see why it might look lazy from the outside, though.

I like you. I really do, but the fact is that your priority is managing the situation and not addressing a very clearly stated need of your partner's. Like I said, maybe it is my pessimistic mood, but at least right now, it appears that if you know that your partner explicitly desires something to happen and you desire something to not happen and your partner respects your wishes, and you claim to want to address their desires no matter how infrequently and it doesn't happen.... there aren't a whole lot of interpretations here. You can get away with it, so you set it aside and deal with your priorities - finding justification.

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If this were a job where you told someone you'd get back to them and never did - over and over - you'd be fired.

 

If you were courting someone and hinting that you were getting serious, without ever actually taking things to the next level, eventually they'd find someone else.

 

Just because you run your con in a relationship you take for granted to run on your terms doesn't mean that sooner or later time won't run out.

 

I understand awkwardness. I understand not knowing what to do. But just like a sexual, who is in a relationship with an ace and on a steep learning curve - including how to ignore their deepest longings being ignored and still love, there doesn't actually appear to be a learning curve involved. At least with my ace. He gets understanding, he takes it and runs with it. Not in the least imagining that someone needs his understanding too. I don't know what you do, so can't comment, but if this sounds familiar, understand what I am saying and avoid hitting the rock bottom. There may be no going back to the way things were.

 

If you are averse, it is a different matter, but if you aren't, and are merely taking your own sweet time figuring things out, possibly hoping the problem goes away if you wait long enough. The problem may go away, but it could take the person along with it. To not be desired by a sexual is about as absurd a goal as hoping to be desired by an ace. It could happen, but probably not in the way you imagine a good ending.

 

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18 minutes ago, anamikanon said:

[...]the fact is that your priority is managing the situation and not addressing a very clearly stated need of your partner's.

Don’t disagree; just meant that it can be more than laziness.  Anxiety disorders can be very, very powerful motivators that are difficult for other motivators (especially vague, distant ones) to compete successfully with.  Not saying anyone is obligated to put up with anyone else’s mental health challenges.

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13 minutes ago, anamikanon said:

I don't know what you do, so can't comment, but if this sounds familiar, understand what I am saying and avoid hitting the rock bottom. There may be no going back to the way things were.

I’m not sure if this (and the rest of the post) was directed towards me or towards the OP/someone else upthread.

 

If it was for me, what you’re describing doesn’t parallel my own situation.  I was honestly just taking issue (in a mild way) with the word “lazy,” and my story about meeting my friend at a bar was literally a (true) story about a friend and a bar rather than a euphemistic way of talking about avoiding sexual commitments.

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