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For the sexuals and everybody, honest opinion: Is sex really all that great?


Tyger Songbird

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1 minute ago, James121 said:

Yet the latter IS DEPENDANT on an individuals life circumstances so when I have my doubts that the money would be turned down every time it is a perfectly reasonable doubt.

I doubt every single person would turn down the money.  I also doubt every single person would accept it.

 

That said, I think the issue above is that you expressed doubt about what a specific individual had directly said they would personally do.  Given that you don’t know them at all, that seems a bit presumptuous.

 

If a stranger says “no straight guy would ever have sex with another guy for $1M (or £M)” and you say “oh, I’ll believe that when I see it...,” that’s fair.  However, if that same stranger says THEY would never do it, why would you tell them you don’t buy it? 

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Just now, ryn2 said:

I doubt every single person would turn down the money.  I also doubt every single person would accept it.

 

That said, I think the issue above is that you expressed doubt about what a specific individual had directly said they would personally do.  Given that you don’t know them at all, that seems a bit presumptuous.

 

If a stranger says “no straight guy would ever have sex with another guy for $1M (or £M)” and you say “oh, I’ll believe that when I see it...,” that’s fair.  However, if that same stranger says THEY would never do it, why would you tell them you don’t buy it? 

I guess because I believe they would.

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Anthracite_Impreza
1 minute ago, James121 said:

Thank you for the advice about what I need to and don’t need to comment on. I’ll bare it in mind. But as per ryn2’s recent reply, my skepticism isn’t so ludicrous after all because it would depend on someone’s life circumstances as to whether they turned down the money. That’s they point I was making.

My point is why do you need to tell someone you doubt their conviction? I doubt things people say regularly, but unless they ask or it's a safety issue, I don't say anything. Saying to a trans person "I bet you'd expose yourself to gender dysphoria for £1M", just shows how little you understand gender dysphoria. Same for a sex-repulsed ace.

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anisotrophic

@James121 being trans is the opposite of invisible, and means one is taking a substantial risk of sacrifice already -- in losing friends, disrupting family relationships.

And financially: risking a multitude of discriminations that can easily affect our professional work. I don't know how I've affected my career, but I've taken a risk. I doubt I've actually sacrificed a million bucks to do it, because I don't think people are as negative about a "masculine woman". But I have an AMAB NB colleague that I think is more realistically risking a million bucks over it.

We're already living our choices here, it's not a speculation.

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10 minutes ago, James121 said:

But as per ryn2’s recent reply, my skepticism isn’t so ludicrous after all because it would depend on someone’s life circumstances as to whether they turned down the money.

Please don’t put words in my mouth.  I agree that how any given individual will respond depends on that person’s life circumstances.  I do not, however, agree that this means you (or any of us) know any specific stranger on the internet better than they know themselves.

 

If someone tells me their life circumstances dictate that they would not take the money, I’m not going to tell them I don’t believe them unless I know them

well enough to have good reason for that doubt.

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1 minute ago, Anthracite_Impreza said:

My point is why do you need to tell someone you doubt their conviction? I doubt things people say regularly, but unless they ask or it's a safety issue, I don't say anything. Saying to a trans person "I bet you'd expose yourself to gender dysphoria for £1M", just shows how little you understand gender dysphoria. Same for a sex-repulsed ace.

But those particular details were not part of this equation when I made my response.

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1 minute ago, ryn2 said:

Please don’t put words in my mouth.  I agree that how any

given individual will respond depends on that person’s life circumstances.  I do not, however, agree that this means you (or any of us) know any specific stranger on the internet better than they know themselves.

 

If someone tells me their life circumstances dictate that they would not take the money, I’m not going to tell them I don’t believe them unless I know them

well enough to have good reason for that doubt.

I didn’t put words in your mouth. It’s what you said wasn’t it? It depends on their life circumstances....

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4 minutes ago, anisotrophic said:

@James121 being trans is the opposite of invisible, and means one is taking a substantial risk of sacrifice already -- in losing friends, disrupting family relationships.

And financially: risking a multitude of discriminations that can easily affect our professional work. I don't know how I've affected my career, but I've taken a risk. I doubt I've actually sacrificed a million bucks to do it, because I don't think people are as negative about a "masculine woman". But I have an AMAB NB colleague that I think is more realistically risking a million bucks over it.

We're already living our choices here, it's not a speculation.

Being trans wasn’t part of the equation when I made my response.

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Anthracite_Impreza
54 minutes ago, James121 said:
15 hours ago, ElasticPlanet said:

The same money for going without kink or for not identifying/presenting as nonbinary: Nope. Keep your million...

Hmm, I’d believe it when I saw it

@James121 Erm, it literally was. What do you think nonbinary means?

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1 minute ago, Anthracite_Impreza said:

@James121 Erm, it literally was. What do you think nonbinary means?

Woops, must have missed that. However, before we go further, non binary does not necessarily disinterested in sex does it!

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33 minutes ago, ryn2 said:

Or you don’t think someone would turn down the money if it was offered in exchange for permanently giving up something really important to them?

 

[....]The latter would likely depend on the individual, their life situation, and what they were being asked to give up.

This is what I said.  It was a general statement; basically, that you can’t know what each and every person would choose because it’s going to differ from person to person.

 

I’m not saying your skepticism towards the above poster is warranted; I’m saying that your certainty is unwarranted because you don’t know their situations (whereas presumably they do).

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3 minutes ago, James121 said:

non binary does not necessarily disinterested in sex does it!

They said they would turn down a mil if it was offered to them in exchange for not presenting/identifying as enby.  What does having sex have to do with that??

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Anthracite_Impreza
3 minutes ago, James121 said:

Woops, must have missed that. However, before we go further, non binary does not necessarily disinterested in sex does it!

No, but EP didn't say anything about sex. That was me. You said I would have sex every week for £1M despite being a sex repulsed ace, as though you know me better than I do. As though I would suddenly be ok with sex for money. Can you not see why that is presumptuous (thanks @ryn2) and annoying (maybe even upsetting, because you're essentially dismissing my feelings)?

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2 minutes ago, ryn2 said:

They said they would turn down a mil if it was offered to them in exchange for not presenting/identifying as enby.  What does having sex have to do with that??

Sorry what is enby. This is what happens when people talk in code....it causes confusion.

 

 

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2 minutes ago, Anthracite_Impreza said:

No, but EP didn't say anything about sex. That was me. You said I would have sex every week for £1M despite being a sex repulsed ace, as though you know me better than I do. As though I would suddenly be ok with sex for money. Can you not see why that is presumptuous (thanks @ryn2) and annoying (maybe even upsetting, because you're essentially dismissing my feelings)?

EP?

 

 

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6 minutes ago, ☆゚°˖* ᕕ( ᐛ )ᕗ said:

Oh James.  Sometimes I just wanna shake you....and go HEEEEEY! LISTEN!

And give me a big fat cuddle?

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Anthracite_Impreza
3 minutes ago, James121 said:

Sorry what is enby. This is what happens when people talk in code....it causes confusion.

Non binary = NB = enby

 

1 minute ago, James121 said:

EP?

ElasticPlanet, the name of the enby.

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10 minutes ago, James121 said:

Sorry what is enby. This is what happens when people talk in code....it causes confusion.

 

 

Nonbinary.  NB.  They said if someone offered them a mill to NOT identify/present as nonbinary, they would turn it down.  I don’t see what that has to do with sex at all.  They were giving an example (sexual-supporting, ironically) of something important enough to them personally that a mill to quit it wouldn’t tempt them.

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ElasticPlanet
10 hours ago, James121 said:
On 4/24/2019 at 10:14 AM, ElasticPlanet said:

If someone offered me a million Generic Currency Units for going without something that I don't have any intrinsic desire for in the first place and have a few complicated ickyfeels about anyway, hell yeah!

 

The same money for going without kink or for not identifying/presenting as nonbinary: Nope. Keep your million...

Hmm, I’d believe it when I saw it

As @Anthracite_Impreza and @ryn2 have said, you imply that you know us better than we know ourselves. Which also implies that you understand yourself as a typical human which nearly everyone else will be basically similar to - unless they provide overwhelming evidence to the contrary. We're all built with some cognitive bias of this kind (which is part of how I didn't know I was asexual and agender until so obscenely late in life) but learning to keep this bias under control, and, you know, actually believing what people say about their experiences, is part of seeing and valuing the diversity in the human condition.

 

Also, you didn't originally say whether you were disbelieving the first bit, the second bit or both... So:

 

9 hours ago, James121 said:
9 hours ago, ryn2 said:

You don’t think someone who is ace would take $1M in exchange for never having sex again?

 

Or you don’t think someone would turn down the money if it was offered in exchange for permanently giving up something really important to them?

 

The former seems like a no-brainer.  The latter would likely depend on the individual, their life situation, and what they were being asked to give up.

Thank you!! Yes the former is ridiculous.

Yet the latter IS DEPENDANT on an individuals life circumstances so when I have my doubts that the money would be turned down every time it is a perfectly reasonable doubt.

Ace with some aspects of sex aversion, who hasn't had a sexual experience in nearly 20 years, accepting a million moneys for never trying it again = ridiculous? ... ... ... How so?

 

The latter (refusing an offer of being paid to go through the rest of my life as male or as vanilla) is dependent on my circumstances and the wiring of my brain - the person I am - which I took into account when saying I'd turn down the money. You rejected my answer without talking about those things. If you need to be certain that everyone who says they'd reject the money actually means it, before you believe anyone who says they would, you might want to think about the importance of how you use statistics to weigh up what you don't yet know.

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ElasticPlanet
8 hours ago, James121 said:

Woops, must have missed that. However, before we go further, non binary does not necessarily disinterested in sex does it!

It certainly doesn't. I thought I was keeping those two things separate when I first responded to your million dollars question, so I don't know why we're getting tangled up now... Oh well.

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21 hours ago, ElasticPlanet said:

Indeed. That's what my other examples (kink and nonbinary) were meant to say.

sorry, I missed that the first time I replied! :)

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9 hours ago, Anthracite_Impreza said:

No, but EP didn't say anything about sex. That was me. You said I would have sex every week for £1M despite being a sex repulsed ace, as though you know me better than I do. As though I would suddenly be ok with sex for money. Can you not see why that is presumptuous (thanks @ryn2) and annoying (maybe even upsetting, because you're essentially dismissing my feelings)?

Yeah and again I'm not even ace, and I'm very poor (living on the poverty line) supporting two kids on my own. And I would not take a million dollars in exchange for sex once a week under any circumstances. This has nothing to do with being ace or sexual, it's just what someone will or won't do for money. Some (evidently James) would prostitute themselves. Others won't but James clearly has no ability to comprehend that Y_Y ..And I've actually had sex in exchange for money in the past and for me, no amount of money would ever be worth going there again. A lot of people feel that way for varying reasons. Sadly people like James will never be able to understand that humans are actually quite nuanced and we certainly don't all think and feel like him (THANK GOD).

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That, and the underlying missed point wasn’t anti-sexual or even about sex.  It was “it’s a lot easier to commit to giving up something that’s meaningless (or distasteful) to you - or to doing something you would cheerfully do anyway - than it is to commit to giving up something that’s integral to your wellbeing/undertaking something painful.”

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26 minutes ago, ryn2 said:

That, and the underlying missed point wasn’t anti-sexual or even about sex.  It was “it’s a lot easier to commit to giving up something that’s meaningless (or distasteful) to you - or to doing something you would cheerfully do anyway - than it is to commit to giving up something that’s integral to your wellbeing/undertaking something painful.”

Indeed. 

 

I have had sex I didn't want. Over time, that wears you down. Sure, a million is great and to begin with you would find it a good exchange in most cases. But, over time the money will lose its novelty and the need to do something you dont want wears on you. And once you hit depressed over being forced to do something unnatural, the money wont matter. 

 

You cant change who you are for money. Even if that million would be nice. Money doesnt make you happy if other things make you miserable. 

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2 hours ago, CBC said:

Wholly unsurprised by this interaction, based on previous ones of my own... and I shall leave it at that. 🙃

I would say that I’m surprised that you’ve chipped in with..... well not a lot.

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Just now, CBC said:

Ah, but sometimes I'm a lady of few words. Especially when I've already got another post up for current disciplinary review. ;) 

Fair play. What did you do? Disagree with someone? Have your own opinion? 

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3 minutes ago, James121 said:

Only if you read it and assume that it means I was talking to you.

When someone says “I wouldn’t x” (not “most people won’t x” or “some people won’t x”), and another quotes that person and responds with “I’ll believe it when I see it,” that does look like the second speaker is referring to the former.

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5 minutes ago, James121 said:

Disagree with someone? Have your own opinion? 

No one cares if you disagree or have your own opinion.  They just don’t like having their own opinions negated.  Not countered, negated.

 

It’s the difference between...

 

”I like blue.”

”Ugh!  I hate blue”

 

...and:

”I like blue.”

”I doubt that.  No one likes blue.”

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