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NapoliGirl

"Something's Missing" and Asexual Partners

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NapoliGirl

For those sexual partners out there....just wondering what your experiences are or were with your asexual partners (wherever they are on the continuum) when you did/do have sexual relations.  When I finally forced myself to be completely honest about everything, and stop the denial, I realized that yes, something had always been missing.  No desire to change things up, to take the time to explore, to have those spontaneous occurrences, and when I did try to guide or suggest or change things up, I would be met with frustration, unkind words, and the accusation that I was unreasonable. Two incidences pop out in my memory because they were so incredibly hurtful and at the time they happened I really did think that I was to blame:  first, about one month into our marriage I suggested "wouldn't it be fun if we spent the entire weekend in bed, fooling around, watching TV, ordering food delivery".  At the time were so young, no obligations other than ourselves, in a brand new marriage.  He squashed that idea and told me I was being totally foolish and irresponsible.  Second incident:  on one (rare!) occasion we were in the midst of things and I asked him to do something completely reasonable because damn, it felt good.  He stopped immediately, told me I was acting like a traffic cop directing traffic, rolled over and proceeded to fall asleep.  

 

I know, I know, it's in the past but it still hurts.  I know, I know, I am in the process of separating and ultimately divorcing.  But today I am in retrospective mode and feeling awful, and was wondering what others have experienced, if you'd like to vent or share.

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SusannaC

Hi Napoli girl, 

ive been retrospective so I get it!   Sorry- cause it pains.....yes I look back and see more clearly through reality colored lenses.  Didn’t have but one pathetic experience with sex to base my husband against before we married  but he was always mechanical and un creative, not emotionally connected looking back.  I remember one time specifically  years ago and it was very painful, embarrassing and confusing:    I made a small laugh or chuckle, I think about a joyful sound he emitted, and he reacted almost viciously to me.... it seemed so shocking and unexpected and out of place.  Almost as if I had disrupted his personal space or meditation or shamed him in some way.  Can’t give too many details (TMI objectors are out there) but it ruined the moment for me for certain.   Sex was always awkward, looking back and always left me feeling a bit dissatisfied but not sure why

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SusannaC

Also- many times over the years his excuse was He had too much going on; for instance he couldn’t get involved with sex because he he had to prepare for work- ie, he had big day coming up or he needed to study something to prepare or he was just too tired, or he needed to watch a sporting event on tv.  Then those excuses also got sprinkled in with statements like if I “was nicer” he might want me....Looking back, it was never a blissful experience but I wanted it to work and just didn’t understand how we could be so different in our needs.  Wow- I was a confused, lost and lonely woman for many years, never able to put my finger on the problem and always wondering if it was ME!  Thank goodness I was able to let go of the resentment I harbored for years against him.  Now, only sadness remains

 

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SusannaC

Finally- I know I’m writing a lot, lol.  However I must recommend that you let go of your brooding thoughts today, or at least find some small thing to rejoice in.  I always have to remind myself- I  can NOT change thie past.  So live in the reality of today and the potential it offers.

Edited by SusannaC
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uhtred

I've run into this as well. Even when my wife does want sex, there is usually the sense that its a very fragile situation I'm always worrying that something I say or do will break the mood.   If I ask what she would like, she will almost never say.  If I tell her what I would like she will rarely do it - even if it is something she has done before. 

 

She has great difficulty relaxing and taking her time. She can't just lie back and enjoy intimate attention, it always has to be directed toward getting her an O.

 

Then thing is she is *trying*.  She does go out of her way to try to do things that I enjoy (as long as I don't ask). But there is not the sense of passion that I had in my brief sex life before marriage.  No sens that she *desires* me sexually.  Its difficult to put into words

 

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max9701

It generally felt pretty awkward. I think she wanted to like it, but just couldn't get into it for more than a minute or two before she "powered down." There was little to no response that I could detect. For a long time I just felt like I was failing in some way.

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NapoliGirl
12 hours ago, SusannaC said:

Finally- I know I’m writing a lot, lol.  However I must recommend that you let go of your brooding thoughts today, or at least find some small thing to rejoice in.  I always have to remind myself- I  can NOT change thie past.  So live in the reality of today and the potential it offers.

Getting there, every day it gets better as I take little steps forward.  

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anisotrophic

I guess it's nice to reflect on this stuff.

Over the years, I kept asking, "Do you have any fantasy? things you want? anything?" and ... he kept insisting there was nothing. I guess I never really believed it (or understood that this could be possible). Shortly after our marriage, I remember once putting on sexy lingerie and flirting, and getting a profoundly uninterested response (like "I'm busy"). A year or three later, I think, I remember finding out he was, um, masturbating rather than bothering with sex with me, and felt very hurt and upset. (He stopped after that, but it feels telling – as if he simply didn't realize I might care?)

I remember being frustrated that the only times he seemed to want sex felt when it was "convenient" for him – we were already naked and in bed, and he gets physically aroused – but never interested outside that situation (not responsively either) – I felt like a convenient target, interchangeable with masturbation. (In retrospect: yep.) Over the years, I asked him to say things that would make me feel attractive, compliment me, but he couldn't manage it.

He attributed difficulties to various things over the years (stress of a move, stress of job search, stress of work, stress of another move...) – I didn't question these explanations, but it never went away – and neither of us were aware of asexuality. Lately he tells me he thought sex was supposed to go away after marriage...

I've got a lucky situation. He's not avoiding discussion and wants to do what he can to make me happy. He's also not sex repulsed, capable of engaging in a typical variety of sexual acts and feeling some physical pleasure in them. So ... there's a lot of factors in our favor. It seems to be getting better, but I don't know.

I'm sorry there are many stories of spouses that seem to disconnect, can't communicate, are controlling, or defensive, or dismissive.

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uhtred
13 hours ago, anisotropic said:

I guess it's nice to reflect on this stuff.

Over the years, I kept asking, "Do you have any fantasy? things you want? anything?" and ... he kept insisting there was nothing. I guess I never really believed it (or understood that this could be possible). Shortly after our marriage, I remember once putting on sexy lingerie and flirting, and getting a profoundly uninterested response (like "I'm busy"). A year or three later, I think, I remember finding out he was, um, masturbating rather than bothering with sex with me, and felt very hurt and upset. (He stopped after that, but it feels telling – as if he simply didn't realize I might care?)

I remember being frustrated that the only times he seemed to want sex felt when it was "convenient" for him – we were already naked and in bed, and he gets physically aroused – but never interested outside that situation (not responsively either) – I felt like a convenient target, interchangeable with masturbation. (In retrospect: yep.) Over the years, I asked him to say things that would make me feel attractive, compliment me, but he couldn't manage it.

He attributed difficulties to various things over the years (stress of a move, stress of job search, stress of work, stress of another move...) – I didn't question these explanations, but it never went away – and neither of us were aware of asexuality. Lately he tells me he thought sex was supposed to go away after marriage...

I've got a lucky situation. He's not avoiding discussion and wants to do what he can to make me happy. He's also not sex repulsed, capable of engaging in a typical variety of sexual acts and feeling some physical pleasure in them. So ... there's a lot of factors in our favor. It seems to be getting better, but I don't know.

I'm sorry there are many stories of spouses that seem to disconnect, can't communicate, are controlling, or defensive, or dismissive.

Sounds depressingly familiar. It seems very difficult for asexuals to recognize the importance of sex to sexuals. After a recent "romantic" vacation (where we had no sex) at some point my wife initiated (she never accepts if I  initiate). I mentioned that it had been almost two months, and she made some comment about not having noticed. 

b

She has not fantasies whatsoever.   I'm pretty sure she masturbates  much more often than we have sex - the toys sometimes are moved from where I left them.  There is always a "reason" for no sex at the moment - but somehow those reasons never keep her from doing other things she wants to do. 

 

She has a bizarre habit of pretty much never doing what I as for in bed, even if it is something she has done before. A particularly bizarre case is oral.  In the past I've asked a few times and she basically said no, its disgusting.  Then suddenly she started doing it without my asking - and wanted to do it even one time when I suggested something else that I knew she enjoyed doing more. (???).  She will do something, say it was fun, then never do it again when I ask.   I think she somehow needs to be in complete control of the situation in order to have sex.  It has to be what she wants when she wants, without even any hints from me. 

 

 

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vega57
1 hour ago, uhtred said:

It seems very difficult for asexuals to recognize the importance of sex to sexuals.

It seems just as difficult for sexuals to recognize how unimportant sex is to asexuals.  The whole idea of "not interested" is almost unimaginable to sexuals.  

 

Quote

After a recent "romantic" vacation (where we had no sex) at some point my wife initiated (she never accepts if I  initiate). I mentioned that it had been almost two months, and she made some comment about not having noticed. 

Why say anything at all?  What were you hoping to gain by saying something?  

 

Quote

There is always a "reason" for no sex at the moment - but somehow those reasons never keep her from doing other things she wants to do. 

If you asked her if she wanted to do anything else that she's not interested in doing, she'd probably also tell you 'no'.  It's not just limited to sex.  Try asking her if she wants to run a marathon at that moment...or, go to the gym and lift some weights.  I'll bet she also says 'no'.  

 

Quote

She has a bizarre habit of pretty much never doing what I as for in bed, even if it is something she has done before.

How is this a "bizarre" habit?  Why look at this as "bizarre" instead of "interesting" or "different"?  

 

Quote

A particularly bizarre case is oral.  In the past I've asked a few times and she basically said no, its disgusting.  Then suddenly she started doing it without my asking - and wanted to do it even one time when I suggested something else that I knew she enjoyed doing more. (???). 

She may have realized how much *you* would enjoy it.  If she's asexual then she's probably not doing it because she *wants* to, as much as, because *you* would enjoy it.  Her enjoyment out of your enjoyment may be (slightly) more than her disgust with the act.  

Quote

She will do something, say it was fun, then never do it again when I ask. 

For many people, they can find complete enjoyment in doing something ONCE, and never doing it again.  If it's done more than once (or a handful of times) it becomes commonplace...and looses its 'luster'...and becomes boring.  

 

 

Quote

I think she somehow needs to be in complete control of the situation in order to have sex.  It has to be what she wants when she wants, without even any hints from me. 

It's not so much that she needs to be in control of the situation, but more like, she may need to feel in control of herself.  

 

And, in all honesty, there's nothing wrong with that.  

 

Look at this way.  If she DOES 'give' you sex without you asking, she is doing this voluntarily; not because you expect of it her.  I'd say that's a step in the right direction.  

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uhtred
6 minutes ago, vega57 said:

It seems just as difficult for sexuals to recognize how unimportant sex is to asexuals.  The whole idea of "not interested" is almost unimaginable to sexuals.  

 

Why say anything at all?  What were you hoping to gain by saying something?  

 

If you asked her if she wanted to do anything else that she's not interested in doing, she'd probably also tell you 'no'.  It's not just limited to sex.  Try asking her if she wants to run a marathon at that moment...or, go to the gym and lift some weights.  I'll bet she also says 'no'.  

 

How is this a "bizarre" habit?  Why look at this as "bizarre" instead of "interesting" or "different"?  

 

She may have realized how much *you* would enjoy it.  If she's asexual then she's probably not doing it because she *wants* to, as much as, because *you* would enjoy it.  Her enjoyment out of your enjoyment may be (slightly) more than her disgust with the act.  

For many people, they can find complete enjoyment in doing something ONCE, and never doing it again.  If it's done more than once (or a handful of times) it becomes commonplace...and looses its 'luster'...and becomes boring.  

 

 

It's not so much that she needs to be in control of the situation, but more like, she may need to feel in control of herself.  

 

And, in all honesty, there's nothing wrong with that.  

 

Look at this way.  If she DOES 'give' you sex without you asking, she is doing this voluntarily; not because you expect of it her.  I'd say that's a step in the right direction.  

A few details:  She often *talks* about wanting sex.  Suggests that we will have lots of time in the hotel room. Always wants to bring a sex toy.  But then never actually wants sex. 

 

The bizarre thing about oral is that one time I asked if she would do it. She told me in no uncertain terms just how horrible, disgusting and degrading it was.  Then a year or two later she just started doing it.  But then one time I suggested something that she enjoyed more because I wasn't in the mood for that, she still wanted to do oral.  (even though its still clear she doesn't really enjoy doing it - but doesn't seem to mind).  Isn't it normal to adjust one's behavior in bed to at least somewhat match what your partner wants at the moment?  

 

I think there is something wrong with too much control. Sex is normally a mutual act, each person trying to please the other. Disregarding your partner's interests seems to miss the point.  I suspect though that she really doesn't understand that people's sexual desires can change. She looks for the "best" way to do it.

 

She has pretty much only had sex when I didn't ask, its not a stop in the right direction, its where we have been for 30 years. 

 

To me communication and interaction is critical to sex.  Its not about a set of mechanical actions that are done the same way every time.  Its about interacting with you partner to find things that you both enjoy. 

 

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SusannaC

Uhtred- it almost sounds like manipulation and psychological torture. How can you stand to be “teased” by thinking you will have sex- and then nothing?  I’m sorry.

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Telecaster68

Uhtred - do you think she's trying to hone sex into the optimally efficient sequence to get it over with quickly? 

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uhtred
9 minutes ago, SusannaC said:

Uhtred- it almost sounds like manipulation and psychological torture. How can you stand to be “teased” by thinking you will have sex- and then nothing?  I’m sorry.

Yes, the thought that she is evil has occurred to me and I can't completely reject it. I don't think so, and I'm usually pretty good at reading people, but a small part of me wonders if I've been manipulated for most of my life.    Its a very nasty thought, but difficult to suppress completely. 

 

I think that its not intentional.  I think that she honestly expects that she will want sex -she imagines making love in our hotel in Venice, or Bora Bora, or whatever other romantic spot we are in.  It feels like the stuff of romance movies.  She loves me and greatly enjoys casual affection.  Its just that when there is a possibility of sex *now* she doesn't desire it, and doesn't know why she doesn't desire it - so she translates that feeling into "tired". 

 

But is is possible I've been played for all this time. That the occasional bursts of sexual activity are just to keep me from leaving. I did almost divorce her once, but just as I was about to ask for a divorce, she greatly stepped up our sex life  - for a little while.    No easy way to know for sure what she is thinking. 

 

 

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uhtred
11 minutes ago, Telecaster68 said:

Uhtred - do you think she's trying to hone sex into the optimally efficient sequence to get it over with quickly? 

Often yes.  I think she sees sex as a action designed to get both people an orgasm.  Sometimes she will let me take my time with her, but usually after a few minutes she will ask me to switch to doing something that will get her off quickly.  (and she is one-and-done).  

 

Its depressing. I like sex to be varied, fun , to her it seems like a chore to get done - even if she is enjoying it while it happens (as she seems to)

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Pan Ficto. (on hiatus?)

It sounds to me like she does want sex for an orgasm, but only when she wants it. And you wanting it is a bit of a turn off for her.

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Telecaster68

Another reading is that like my wife, she sees sex as an alternative form of masturbation, in which a partner is incidental and is more about the orgasm than partnered sex. Uhtred's needs are more of an inconvenience than a turn off. 

 

Either way, it's not good. 

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vega57
22 minutes ago, uhtred said:

No easy way to know for sure what she is thinking. 

 

 

Have you asked her directly?  

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vega57
22 minutes ago, uhtred said:

Sometimes she will let me take my time with her, but usually after a few minutes she will ask me to switch to doing something that will get her off quickly.  (and she is one-and-done).  

O.k.  Is that because she wanted to 'get off quickly' BEFORE, or because she had gotten to the point of excitement that staying at the same slow pace would have caused her to 'loose the moment' (which is pretty hard to get back, once it's lost!)

 

Quote

Its depressing. I like sex to be varied, fun , to her it seems like a chore to get done - even if she is enjoying it while it happens (as she seems to)

Maybe she's simply responding to how her body is responding.  For some people  (especially women), the window of opportunity for an orgasm can be very narrow.  Unless that orgasm occurs within a certain time frame (matter of moments, really), the opportunity is GONE. Taking  your time with her could feel like TORTURE to her, which is why she may be asking you to switch.   

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ryn2
1 hour ago, uhtred said:

I think she sees sex as a action designed to get both people an orgasm. 

I didn’t realize this wasn’t the case until I started reading posts here, and that’s despite decades of talking sex with people.

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SusannaC

Uhtred almost divorced her, and then she started wanting sex- for awhile.  So she must KNOW it’s IMPORTANT to you.  How can a caring partner control  this part of your relationship so unpredictably and allow you pleasure so infrequently then?      I don’t get it....

Excuses, lack of awareness, self centered behavior- this is what I see.

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ryn2
Just now, SusannaC said:

Uhtred almost divorced her, and then she started wanting sex- for awhile.  So she must KNOW it’s IMPORTANT to you.  How can a caring partner control  this part of your relationship so unpredictably and allow you pleasure so infrequently then?      I don’t get it....

Excuses, lack of awareness, self centered behavior- this is what I see.

Does the spontaneous return of sex (in uhtred’s life) follow threats to break up or similar discussions?  I got the (mistaken?) impression it was seemingly more random.

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SusannaC

Perhaps I misunderstood?  That would be nice

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ryn2
2 minutes ago, SusannaC said:

Perhaps I misunderstood?  That would be nice

 I may have as well.  Guess we’ll find out.  :)

 

I suppose the two alternative explanations are differently bad.

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SusannaC

Yes.  Makes me a bit nauseated, but then again so do so many of the situations I am reading about here.  Ugh.

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uhtred
2 hours ago, vega57 said:

Have you asked her directly?  

Yes, she is pretty much unable to talk about sex at all, always deflects the conversation, and / or gets extremely defensive. 

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uhtred
2 hours ago, vega57 said:

O.k.  Is that because she wanted to 'get off quickly' BEFORE, or because she had gotten to the point of excitement that staying at the same slow pace would have caused her to 'loose the moment' (which is pretty hard to get back, once it's lost!)

 

Maybe she's simply responding to how her body is responding.  For some people  (especially women), the window of opportunity for an orgasm can be very narrow.  Unless that orgasm occurs within a certain time frame (matter of moments, really), the opportunity is GONE. Taking  your time with her could feel like TORTURE to her, which is why she may be asking you to switch.   

Could be, though (with toys) she always seems to O pretty easily.   Her reaction though doesn't seem like "I'm too aroused I need an O now", its more like "I'm getting bored with the gentle things that you are doing that aren't going to get me off quickly". 

 

Its OK if that is what she wants, except for the unfortunate side effect that sex for us is both rare and brief. 

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uhtred
1 hour ago, SusannaC said:

Uhtred almost divorced her, and then she started wanting sex- for awhile.  So she must KNOW it’s IMPORTANT to you.  How can a caring partner control  this part of your relationship so unpredictably and allow you pleasure so infrequently then?      I don’t get it....

Excuses, lack of awareness, self centered behavior- this is what I see.

I don't know if she knew (or knows now) that I was about to divorce her.  I started explaining the situation, as I had done so before, and she changed before I made any mention of divorce.  Its not something I would ever threaten. If I have said it, I will go through with it.  If my unhappiness isn't enough for her to want to have sex, I don't want her to do it out of the threat of divorce. (she would be in  no financial trouble if divorced, she has significant independent personal wealth). 

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uhtred
2 hours ago, FictoVore. said:

It sounds to me like she does want sex for an orgasm, but only when she wants it. And you wanting it is a bit of a turn off for her.

Yes that matches.  The first make sense. The second seems strange to me - especially because when we do have sex she at least tries to do things for me as well. 

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vega57
17 minutes ago, uhtred said:

Yes, she is pretty much unable to talk about sex at all, always deflects the conversation, and / or gets extremely defensive. 

And when she tries to deflect the conversation and becomes defensive (having no idea whether or not what you said to her/how you said it to her may have caused her to feel defensive), have you explained (calmly) that you understand that she may be feeling defensive and/or uncomfortable, but this conversation must take place and be resolved, or there's no point in continuing the marriage?  

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