Started off as a sexual couple and 4+ years in wife decides that she is asexual

[Cobie]

 

Quote

... I’ve invested so much ...

@Sunandfun   Have a look at Serran’s signature:  “Don't cling to a mistake just because you spent a lot of time making it.” - Unknown  https://www.asexuality.org/en/topic/171689-started-off-as-a-sexual-couple-and-4-years-in-wife-decides-that-she-is-asexual/?do=findComment&comment=1062843775

 

 

 

[Sunandfun]

9 hours ago, Thea2 said:

 

@Sunandfun   Have a look at Serran’s signature:  “Don't cling to a mistake just because you spent a lot of time making it.” - Unknown  https://www.asexuality.org/en/topic/171689-started-off-as-a-sexual-couple-and-4-years-in-wife-decides-that-she-is-asexual/?do=findComment&comment=1062843775

 

 

 

Easier said then done.  I don’t necessarily find it to be a mistake either.  It’s obviously a huge rough patch.  But it really is the first we have truly had.  Is it epically bad?  Sure.  Do you throw away years of it being good for a few months of it being bad? I don’t think so.  I think I have shown I want to work though it and have hoped to come out better on the other side.  Honestly, I just need advice of how to get my wife to understand that or to let go.  I can’t make her mind up and I can tell her everything I feel and how much I want and desire her and to grow our family but until she comes to terms with what she wants/ needs and how she feels and then acts on those, I’ll be alone paddling the boat.   

[roland.o]

5 minutes ago, Sunandfun said:

 Honestly, I just need advice of how to get my wife to understand that or to let go.

You can't get your wife to do this or that. If she needs time to make up her mind, then that is so. You can bring up the topic again and again, with the risk of annoying her. You can stay silent about the topic, with the risk of her thinking that everything is OK again. You can hope, you can struggle, you can despair, you can set ultimatums for her or yourself. But in the end, this is your choice: are you willing to invest further into this relationship, or are you going to cut your losses? At the moment, you are apparently still willing to invest. That's OK. But you'll have to make that decision again and again, week for week, day by day.

 

Balance your investment against the return. If the relationship moves into the direction where you'd like it to go, continue to invest. If it moves into another direction, or moves so slowly that you don't expect you'll ever see a positive outcome, it's your call how long to endure or when to give up. There is no magic potion that will turn your wife into someone else, or that will change her mind in the blink of an eye. What kind of advice are you hoping for? Hypnotize her? Some way to let her make up her mind, so that she makes the decision that you don't feel up to?

 

22 minutes ago, Sunandfun said:

until she comes to terms with what she wants/ needs and how she feels and then acts on those, I’ll be alone paddling the boat.

Yes. How long do you intend to keep that up? How much time will you grant her? That is your choice, and yours alone.

[uhtred]

This may seem complex, but in some ways it is simple. 

 

She is not interested in sex with you and she cheated or attempted to cheat.  I don't think the reasons for those things are very important.  A happy and monogamous sex life is generally assumed to be part of a marriage unless alternatives have been discussed earlier. 

 

If she wants to go back to an active monogomous sex life, then you can choose to stay. If not, then regardless of the reasons, you would probably be happier leaving. 

[Cobie]

.

[Cobie]

.

[anamikanon]

23 hours ago, Thea2 said:

 

@anamikanon  Imho, it cannot work, to turn for help to the very person that causes the grief.  It will create a vicious circle.  It is of the utmost importance  to find an independent source of help for yourself from outside the relationship, e.g. therapy.

He didn't "cause" the grief. He is simply asexual. We've been through a lot in these years, and there is a lot of clarity that is hard to explain as a part of something else. Suffice it to say I'm not one to stay down for too long. There is no question of a circle here - vicious or not. It is simply a matter of recovering, transitioning and things are occasionally hard. It is actually less about "losing" him - even if one were to blame him for the "dumping".

 

We are still close and what we "lost" was neve really working enough to feel like we "had" it to lose. But there are other things to process, which usually aren't there when moving on from a lover, since I've never before lived with an ex. We are still in a QPR. He isn't out of sight and out of mind, which sort of results in a lot of adjustments and changes with how we are together. Some of them distressing. Neither of us have ever been in a QPR live in relationship. We are making things up as we go along, wanting the most we can share together, but wanting to leave out anything that isn't mutual.

[ryn2]

I’m still living with my husband as he tries to figure out if he can stay and it’s ending up feeling like a protracted series of breakups and reconciliations... much harder than the actual breakups I’ve endured because I keep getting my hopes crushed and can’t just move on.

[Telecaster68]

Who was it who said "the disappointments I can take, it's the hope I can't stand"? 

 

Is there anything you can do to finesse the situation? 

[ryn2]

I’m not sure.

[InariYana]

2 hours ago, ryn2 said:

and it’s ending up feeling like a protracted series of breakups and reconciliations... much harder than the actual breakups I’ve endured 

To me, in the end it felt like a mental torture draining my energy, this horrible tension... Now, when I'm out of those relationships, away from it all, I discovered actual peace. Wow, I thought I'd feel very lonely, but I'm actually pretty content. There's no pressure or tension in my life now, really, no destructive ups and downs that were pushing me towards depression, no more "compromise" that wasn't working for me or my partners long-term. I feel more open, playful, I socialise more now... and it feels so good. I didn't notice back then how crushed I was by the constant tension.   

My friends don't put any pressure on me... it's all nicely free-flowing and that's how I like my human connections I guess    

[ryn2]

5 minutes ago, InariYana said:

To me, in the end it felt like a mental torture draining my energy, this horrible tension... Now, when I'm out of those relationships, away from it all, I discovered actual peace. Wow, I thought I'd feel very lonely, but I'm actually pretty content. There's no pressure or tension in my life now, really, no destructive ups and downs that were pushing me towards depression, no more "compromise" that wasn't working for me or my partners long-term. I feel more open, playful, I socialise more now... and it feels so good. I didn't notice back then how crushed I was by the constant tension.   

My friends don't put any pressure on me... it's all nicely free-flowing and that's how I like my human connections I guess    

Yeah, I know life will be ultimately be better again whether we stay together or not.   It’s just this protracted limbo that’s killing me.  In a way I wish it was clearly better *for me* for it to end so I could just make that choice instead of waiting for him to.

[Sunandfun]

Ultimately I can’t make her decide this or that. But I am get ideas of what to say or how to convey in ways she may understand by drawing off your experiences and getting ideas that way.  I plan to have her read this if she hasn’t already because I hope it conveys a desire to move forward and overcome with a bit of effort from her.  I can’t force her or anything.  It’s just helpful to me and my situation. 

[Chamomile_Serenity]

Truly,  the only people who know what's going on in your house are you two,  so it feels complicated to say 'you should do this' or 'you should do that' after reading some of your perspective, I am wondering if checking out videos on codependency might be a good starting place for you to get some clarity about some of things you mentioned...

[anamikanon]

On 6/1/2018 at 3:30 PM, ryn2 said:

I’m still living with my husband as he tries to figure out if he can stay and it’s ending up feeling like a protracted series of breakups and reconciliations... much harder than the actual breakups I’ve endured because I keep getting my hopes crushed and can’t just move on.

Yeah. It is a change in the nature of the relationship and both of us are adjusting. It is very unpredictable. And... odd. I am sexual, but I've moved on from the sex, but the ace partner actually initiated and wanted sex to feel close and it was good. It doesn't mean we are back to having sex or anything. We are just taking each day as it comes, exploring configurations of the relationship, so to say.

 

I am at a point where I am indifferent to whether the relationship is sexual or not. The partner is missing the closeness from when it was sexual and oddly, wanting the sex for the other side effects and generic closeness. I am finding that while I don't expect the relationship to be sexual, when he WANTS it, for whatever reason, still feels special. So there is this new element. 

 

Only thing guaranteed at this point is change. Neither of us are even thinking of settling into a definition, just living in the moment and doing what feels right and seeing where it takes us when it works and resolving issues when it doesn't.

 

For example, the sex worked and I was all glowy all day and he was all cuddly, etc. Then the first chance we get to talk about it, he talks about it like it is an exception and I lose it and he discovers that I KNOW he isn't into sex to the point of not expecting sex from the relationship at all, but LAST thing I need is him initiating sex and then telling me how he doesn't really want it. Don't want it? Don't do it. Period. 

 

So... it is a state of flux. I think it will be a while till anything settles. The protracted break up kind of feeling truly sucks, but it seems there is light at the end of the tunnel as long as you are working at it. But it will only work with certainty that you want to make it work. If one of you is trying to figure out whether it is worth it or to dump it, it will be torture and I don't see when you can stop waiting for the other shoe to fall, if him being with you is no guarantee of him wanting to be with you.

 

IMO, if he's trying to decide whether he can stay, you don't owe him any hanging around to find out.

[ryn2]

2 hours ago, anamikanon said:

IMO, if he's trying to decide whether he can stay, you don't owe him any hanging around to find out.

Agreed, but breaking up means taking out a new mortgage and undoing 20 years of shared investments/finances so it’s not something I can enter into lightly.

[anisotrophic]

On 5/30/2018 at 4:03 PM, Thea2 said:

Ha, ha, that seems so funny to me. You can’t “work” on a marriage, if work is needed, you are imho simply not compatible. A marriage is to be enjoyed. 

I'm… confused. Have you been married? Stayed married? A marriage – even a good one – means compromise for both.

 

It's not super enjoyable to come to terms with my spouse's orientation. So yeah, it's "work". My love and commitment sure as hell doesn't mean I'll cut and run when I'm not enjoying it. Of course it's a mistake to persist with a sunk costs fallacy. All in moderation. Deciding "when" is unique to someone's situation...

 

On 5/31/2018 at 12:05 AM, Thea2 said:

 

@anamikanon  Imho, it cannot work, to turn for help to the very person that causes the grief.  It will create a vicious circle.  It is of the utmost importance  to find an independent source of help for yourself from outside the relationship, e.g. therapy.

I sure as hell did, and it meant a lot – it assured me that he loved me, that it wasn't because he'd lost affection/trust/love for me. That he cared about how it felt to be in my shoes.

 

I tried to talk to a couple people I knew, but it was useless or worse.

 

I also have a therapist who, I'm sorry, has been a bit crap beyond the initial observation – which was useful and perspicacious – that my spouse may be asexual. Therapy is not a magical amazing thing. Some wins, but mostly an interminable meandering of attempted insights. My therapist has not suggested that it is bad to turn to my partner in my grief over his asexuality.

[anisotrophic]

3 hours ago, anamikanon said:

For example, the sex worked and I was all glowy all day and he was all cuddly, etc. Then the first chance we get to talk about it, he talks about it like it is an exception and I lose it and he discovers that I KNOW he isn't into sex to the point of not expecting sex from the relationship at all, but LAST thing I need is him initiating sex and then telling me how he doesn't really want it. Don't want it? Don't do it. Period. 

Argh. Something similar happened to me, I flipped out in slow motion (and hard) when he said he wanted us to keep having sex. (But me still always initiating – that's how it's been going since we married, I just didn't understand why.) The apparent contradiction of "not attracted to me" and "wants us to have sex (in abstract)" tore me apart.

Once he saw how this was really messing me up, he backed off, said he was okay with if we never did it again. Thank god.

So, now we do, but it's because I want it – no sense that it's because he thinks I should be doing it. Maybe I'm drawing on my gender transition stuff, taking a more stereotypically masculine mindset: I have desires that my partner satisfies, tell my partner they're attractive, make the requests, time it to when my partner is amenable, thank my partner for it. (Is this a male approach? Or am I just using that as a convenient framework for renegotiating my thinking around intimacy?)

I chew a lot over "why are you doing this if you aren't attracted to me". Recently I thought about how I enjoy taking our children to the playground (or other activities). I would never want to do it on my own. I do the things they ask (e.g. push a swing), and try to join in sometimes, and I like to do it because it makes them happy. (And in retrospect, I can see that if my kid said "I don't want to go to the playground because you don't want to go the playground" I'd feel pretty sad. It's an imperfect analogy, but I keep trying to find explanations that help me understand.)

I'm glad I don't have any sense of slow motion break-up. I'm sorry, that sounds awful, I hope things get better for others – acknowledging that "better' may mean the arduous task of moving on.

[Sally]

On 5/30/2018 at 3:14 PM, Telecaster68 said:

I'm going by your posts. 

 

So how are you willing to compromise to do your part in working on your marriage? 

Tele, you're getting a little much with this.  MsMolly is not the OP; she was posting to the OP, not  asking you to psychologize her.

[Cobie]

3 hours ago, anisotropic said:

I'm… confused. Have you been married? Stayed married? ...

Yes, I was very happily married for 25 years untill my husband died of cancer.  Anyway, it was just a personal opinion, but I have removed that post now. Because everyone is different, doing the best they can do in their particular circumstances. Peace. 🍰

 

[Telecaster68]

1 hour ago, Sally said:

Tele, you're getting a little much with this.  MsMolly is not the OP; she was posting to the OP, not  asking you to psychologize her.

If people post stuff, anyone gets to react to it however they like. That's how forums work. 

[ryn2]

5 hours ago, anisotropic said:

I chew a lot over "why are you doing this if you aren't attracted to me". Recently I thought about how I enjoy taking our children to the playground (or other activities). I would never want to do it on my own. I do the things they ask (e.g. push a swing), and try to join in sometimes, and I like to do it because it makes them happy. (And in retrospect, I can see that if my kid said "I don't want to go to the playground because you don't want to go the playground" I'd feel pretty sad. It's an imperfect analogy, but I keep trying to find explanations that help me understand.)

As the ace partner this feels like an excellent analogy.

 

5 hours ago, anisotropic said:

I’m glad I don't have any sense of slow motion break-up.

For me this is because my husband is still at 1) no sex if you don’t desire me, 2) no sex if you can’t fulfill very specific things from my fantasies even if they are not “you” at all, and 3) no sex is not okay/sustainable anymore.

 

The first two cause him to believe no compromise is possible, but he’s not 100% ready to leave yet.

[Sunandfun]

I’ve been conspicuously absent on this due to a few factoring reasons.  My wife has continued to be silent and only talk small talk and is usually nose deep into drawing pictures or something on her phone.  We sit together on the couch and watch tv shows but she lives in her phone.  We have not been had Any physical activity since 5/7.  We have gone on a couple of dates.  We hold hands.  She very rarely initiates a kiss and sometimes forgets to even say I love you. I do feel like a roommate instead of a husband.  She hasn’t mentioned asexuality again.  She does, however, tell her friends all kinds of things that she does not and and for some reason will not communicate to me.  For example, we were to have dinner with her distant friends and she 30 minutes after asking them where we were going to eat instead canceled and told me it’s because they always cancel on her or us ( they usually do and have for years).  She then told them it was a bad time and maybe next time she could go alone.  

 

I have a medical condition that I am going to the hospital for a week for testing.  She told her friends that she was frustrated that she might waste her vacation time if the hospital doesn’t figure it out.  

 

I feel that its more more self serving and two faced then actual concern.  I need to  be worrying about my medical problem not my relationship right now and it bothers me she doesn’t seem to want to share her concerns for me.  I feel that is bad and is only leading deeper and closer to divorce. 

[ryn2]

Sorry you’re going through a crappy time and medical issues all at once.  I hope the outcome of your testing is the best news possible.

[Sunandfun]

I hope so too.  If so I can finally have direction on my medical condition and then I can focus on pushing direction on my relationship. Separation may be the course we take.  I just wish she’d stop saying things like she wants us to be together and thinks it’s best for our family when her actions show distance and a “me” mentality.  I just want us.  I hate that it feels the way it does.  Like being strung along.