I need advice: One of my managers is probably a rapist (I would love some sexual people to comment as this is a situation without asexual people)

[Evren]

So I have this manager, let's call them R, who moved away for a while and recently came back. R is an assistant manager. They told one of my coworkers that they had gotten a DUI while they were away and could be facing up to 20 years in prison. My coworker knew that you couldn't go to jail with a DUI for 20 years so she looked up Rs name and where they moved to and found an article that said they were accused of third degree rape (got person drunk, they woke up to R raping them). The coworker asked them about it and their defense was that the victim wouldn't have told unless their friend told them to. (which is not a defense). My coworker then told my general manager and eventually me and one other person. My general manager prefers to pretend these things don't actually exist so I told one of my other managers who I knew would actually understand my concerns, let's call them M. M told two other people and I told two other workers, because they're both women and could be there alone with R. 

The biggest problem is the fact that one of my co-workers (L) is going out with R and getting drunk with him, I'm sure they're having sex, consensual sex. However, I feel like L should know about this article. My sexual co-workers are telling me that, even if L gets really drunk and wakes up to R having sex with them, it probably won't bother L, because it wouldn't bother them. (However these same co-workers are talking about how they don't understand how someone in a relationship could be raped) Some of my co-workers are saying that I shouldn't tell L because they could get angry with R and R might hurt them. I'm concerned about R raping L, however. They are also saying that I could get in trouble for slander and if my District manager finds out then we could all get fired and I should just leave it alone. 

They are also saying that my General Manager is going to do something about it, he is just waiting for this one thing to happen, but my general manager doesn't do anything about things like this he just likes to avoid them. 

Meanwhile all of the women who work there are now really uncomfortable, because they know about R. They're asking the other male workers to stay and wait with them so they don't have to be alone with R. And as an AFAB person myself, I'm pretty freaked out too.

[Norellia]

It isn't slander if it is true. As long as you state he is accused of raping a girl than I do not see how that would be slander. Rape can very well happen in relationships, so I think you should tell L. I would just give her the article and let her decide what to do. I don't know the social situation with L, but if she has family or other friends she can probably ask them for help if she feels scared getting out of the relationship. She should know if she is in a potentially dangerous relationship. 

[Epitaph]

First off before you make any sort of move you should verify the source of information that confirms if R is in fact a rapist. Word of mouth from a collegue isn't good enough. You need to see information with your own eyes.

[Telecaster68]

I think you should tell L. For one thing, what if he does rape her, even though they're in a relationship (which is obviously possible)? For another: if you were her, wouldn't you like to know, and wouldn't you expect a friend to tell you?

 

And as Norellia said, it's not slander if it's true - so it's important to differentiate between 'faces charges of...' and 'is a...'. I'm not a lawyer but I do lecture in media law. 

[Telecaster68]

3 minutes ago, E is for E said:

First off before you make any sort of move you should verify the source of information that confirms if R is in fact a rapist. Word of mouth from a collegue isn't good enough. You need to see information with your own eyes.

This is a good point. 

[Evren]

Just now, E is for E said:

First off before you make any sort of move you should verify the source of information that confirms if R is in fact a rapist. Word of mouth from a collegue isn't good enough. You need to see information with your own eyes.

I have the article, its R's real name and R was in the state it's from. However R hasn't gone to trial yet so I can't find anything else. I am concerned about the validity of the information because I don't want to ruin R's life without having real proof. I trust my co-worker but R could be stupid enough to pretend it's something R did or my co-worker could have misunderstood R. I hadn't really thought of that so much, one of my other co-workers said R was already in the states sex offender registry but I just went and looked and R isn't there. (And I have found lately the second co-worker has lied to me multiple times lately)

[Telecaster68]

Contact the court and ask for date and charges. It's public information so they ought to tell you.

 

Or, go to R, tell him what you know and give him a week to tell L. 

[LeChat]

Hi. I know you specifically asked for responses from sexual people, but even though it doesn't involve asexual people in this situation, there are asexual people here who've experienced domestic violence from a partner, etc., and might have some advice.

 

Perhaps you could ask L if her relationship is okay.

[Epitaph]

4 minutes ago, Evren said:

I have the article, its R's real name and R was in the state it's from. However R hasn't gone to trial yet so I can't find anything else. I am concerned about the validity of the information because I don't want to ruin R's life without having real proof. I trust my co-worker but R could be stupid enough to pretend it's something R did or my co-worker could have misunderstood R. I hadn't really thought of that so much, one of my other co-workers said R was already in the states sex offender registry but I just went and looked and R isn't there. (And I have found lately the second co-worker has lied to me multiple times lately)

It smelled like workplace politics to me. That's good that you have something at least. Any visual confirmation? You'll find that a lot of people in the world share identical names. If your coworker was getting inventive with shit stirring it would be easy to find somebody in the same state with matching names.

 

If you want my honest opinion? In your shoes I wouldn't make a move unless I knew more. You're treading on some serious treacharous ground. Either find more info, or wait and see. The rumor is circulating now. Somebody else in the workplace with loose lips will likely let it slip to R's partner. You're already in the red zone for passing the rumor along. I wouldn't push it further unless you absolutely know for certain.

[Evren]

8 minutes ago, Telecaster68 said:

Contact the court and ask for date and charges. It's public information so they ought to tell you.

 

Or, go to R, tell him what you know and give him a week to tell L. 

Court records cost money to access and you have to sign something saying your impartial and not going to use the information against someone you know, I'm not even going to touch that. 

I don't want to confront R, because I'm not sure it's true.

5 minutes ago, E is for E said:

It smelled like workplace politics to me. That's good that you have something at least. Any visual confirmation? You'll find that a lot of people in the world share identical names. If your coworker was getting inventive with shit stirring it would be easy to find somebody in the same state with matching names.

 

If you want my honest opinion? In your shoes I wouldn't make a move unless I knew more. You're treading on some serious treacharous ground. Either find more info, or wait and see. The rumor is circulating now. Somebody else in the workplace with loose lips will likely let it slip to R's partner. You're already in the red zone for passing the rumor along. I wouldn't push it further unless you absolutely know for certain.

That's what I keep thinking. I'm concerned about how little true proof I have of this. I don't like R, but that doesn't mean he deserves to be crucified for something I don't even know he did.

20 minutes ago, InquisitivePhilosopher said:

Hi. I know you specifically asked for responses from sexual people, but even though it doesn't involve asexual people in this situation, there are asexual people here who've experienced domestic violence from a partner, etc., and might have some advice.

 

Perhaps you could ask L if her relationship is okay.

I was asking if sexual people could respond mostly because my co-workers and I seemed to have a different definition of sex while drunk when your in a relationship. One of my female co-workers said that she wouldn't count that as rape and that she has in fact had, sex while blackout drunk before because the consent was in place. To me that's rape, to her it's not. I am completely aware that asexual people can be abused seeing as how I was. 

[LeChat]

@Evren

 

Oh. Okay. Now I understand; no problem. I only mentioned that to explain why I was responding to your post (since I think I saw only one other asexual post a reply), in case it made you wonder, "Why is an asexual person replying when I specifically asked for sexual people to respond, only?"

 

Educational websites devoted to information about sexual assault, (with information about how to support your friend if you suspect they're being sexually assaulted, but aren't sure), mentioned that it's okay to ask your friend if they're okay. But, since you mentioned your other sexual co-workers thinking they're not being raped when drunk, I suppose it could be possible that, even if L were asked that question, they might not realize there's anything wrong if that's happening in their relationship with R.

[Telecaster68]

22 minutes ago, Evren said:

Court records cost money to access and you have to sign something saying your impartial and not going to use the information against someone you know, I'm not even going to touch that. 

Sure about that? Transcripts do, but just checking a court date doesn't as far as I know. 

[Evren]

1 minute ago, Telecaster68 said:

Sure about that? Transcripts do, but just checking a court date doesn't as far as I know. 

Mostly what I'm concerned about now is if its really R in the article. He has a very common name and the more I think about it everything else that I know about this situation has been told to me by other people, one of which I know is lying to me. I'm sure that the case exists but I have no idea if it's really him. I'm fairly sure that R hasn't been to court yet for his "DUI" if that's what it is. The article that I have said the case happened in January of this year so I don't think it's been to trial yet.

[Telecaster68]

You could try confirming his birth date. 

[Evren]

Just now, Telecaster68 said:

You could try confirming his birth date. 

I don't know what it is. Were not really friends or anything. I keep trying to think of a way to confirm it but I don't think I have one without going up to him and asking straight out and I'm not sure if I want to do that. I wish the article had a picture or something, but there isn't even a mug shot.

[Telecaster68]

His boss will know it. Then just confirm it with the court, tell them you want to make sure it's the right person. 

 

Justice is meant to be open - they should help people wanting to check stuff like this.

[Guest]

9 minutes ago, Evren said:

Mostly what I'm concerned about now is if its really R in the article. He has a very common name and the more I think about it everything else that I know about this situation has been told to me by other people, one of which I know is lying to me. I'm sure that the case exists but I have no idea if it's really him. I'm fairly sure that R hasn't been to court yet for his "DUI" if that's what it is. The article that I have said the case happened in January of this year so I don't think it's been to trial yet.

Court records are public record (in U.S and UK? anyway), they don't cost anything. You just have to check the county clerk thing in your area. However, if it's not been to court, you can't check anything.

 

As for what to do in this situation - I'd say share the article with her and let her know it could be nothing, it could be not him, but you heard about this and the name and times match so you felt she should know so she could decide what to do with it, cause you are concerned about her as a friend. And leave it at that. 

 

Cases like this take a very long time to go through the courts. So, it could be a year or more before you get any more info than that. But, she can ask him about it, if she knows of the article. 

 

Also, as for consent in place before drunk thing... it's a grey area. Some people are OK with saying "yes we can" before something, others aren't. Technically, consent can be withdrawn at any time, so if they don't know what they're doing, it should still be off limits. But, a lot of people in long-term relationships do give long standing prior consent to sexual activities. But, that's up to each couple. 

[Telecaster68]

It's a bit more complicated in the UK, but people make calls to court administration like this all the time. They're on very dodgy legal ground if they withhold the basics of court appearances 

[Guest]

In U.S., it depends on the county... some have websites you can just search court records via a search engine. Others you have to call. Some you have to come in and fill out a form.

[Goonie]

6 hours ago, Evren said:

I was asking if sexual people could respond mostly because my co-workers and I seemed to have a different definition of sex while drunk when your in a relationship. One of my female co-workers said that she wouldn't count that as rape and that she has in fact had, sex while blackout drunk before because the consent was in place. To me that's rape, to her it's not. I am completely aware that asexual people can be abused seeing as how I was. 

Everyone is different. There will be some who view sex during blackout drunk as rape (some states this is considered a law). There will be some who have different views if in various stages of the relationship. Some people might view it as ok if consent was given prior to being blackout drunk. I can only give you a theoretical answer on how I'd feel as I don't get blackout drunk.

 

My personal opinion for what it is worth, stay away and out of this boiling pit of a hot mess if you can. There's no court case yet. Work place drama and rumor mill tends to take a life of it's own and then explodes over all those innocent near by.

[uhtred]

Its not completely clear if this is true or made-up slander. I think its a good idea to let L know, but be clear that you don't have real verification. That will let L be cautious.

 

As far as drunken sex: Exactly when someone is too drunk to consent is not all that clear, but if they are passed out, that is to drunk to consent and it is rape UNLESS there was a clear agreement beforehand. 

 

There is a very broad and dangerous grey area where consent is not clear, or where the two parties have very different ideas of consent.  Personally I think this is a very good reason to not become highly intoxicated before sex - or at any time. 

[Evren]

Update: R is no longer on the schedule at work and we are officially not allowed to talk about it at all or we get fired. I'm glad I left it alone. 

[Epitaph]

Pat yourself on the back doc. You dodged a big bullet.