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Question for sexuals


ev13

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11 minutes ago, anamikanon said:

Well, I suppose, if I lost my sex drive, with an ace partner, I should count myself lucky.

LOL!  Now, now, I didn't say anything about having an ace partner!  Of course, I haven't read the rest of your post yet, so I COULD be chewing on my words in a few minutes, lol!  


 

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This is a hard question to answer without sounding like I am contradicting myself. If I couldn't have sex anymore, and I didn't feel a need to have sex (as opposed to want but can't) losing sex would not have much of an impact on the relationship. Would be how an ace sees the absence. In the absence of a "want", the can't is not a problem. But if I wanted and couldn't, the longer we went without, the feeling of lack would grow. The relationship would become lacklustre and discontented. An easy (and non-traumatic) close example I can think of is how pregnancy can torpedo the sex life of people - a lot of cultures think this is harmful or men suddenly start seeing her as more of a mother figure than a sexual partner. Or whose doctors recommend against it for health reasons (a history of miscarriages can be one). Or the woman feels to nauseated and under the weather to want sex, but the man is horny and frustrated.


 

You're right.  It is a hard question to answer.  You gave me a certain set of circumstances, but that wasn't what I was asking.  

 

if you--as a sexual---couldn't have sex anymore--for whatever reason--would you feel that you could no longer love your partner, and/or that, your partner could no longer love you?  

 

 

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1 hour ago, vega57 said:

But does being unhappy talking about aliens mean being unhappy talking period?  

I said 'unhappy taIking about any of the things I have interest in', again, aIiens was onIy one exampIe of many. I am onIy interested in being in a reIationship with someone who has the same interests me (and incapable of being happy in a reIationship otherwise).

 

If suddenIy they onIy want to taIk about Trump, sports, and farming then I'd be just as unhappy as I wouId if they didn't want to taIk about anything at aII. That wouId show massive iincompatibility in the same way a partner suddenIy not wanting sex wouId, and I wouId go from happy to not happy very quickIy!

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3 hours ago, vega57 said:

If you--as a sexual---couldn't have sex anymore--for whatever reason--would you feel that you could no longer love your partner, and/or that, your partner could no longer love you?  

"No longer love" is a very broad term. Let me put it like this, it would be the same answer as it would be for an ace - if you felt that you had to have sex - for whatever reason - would that mean you would no longer love your partner? The answer will obviously depend on a lot of factors. Neither the presence nor absense of sex is the sum total of the relationship.

 

But if me not being able to have sex anymore resulted in a mismatch on the sexual front, I would definitely be worried about the relationship. Not from a sense of "no longer love" so much as "no longer as close as we used to be". I may not fear being dumped, but I would definitely think that I may not be privy to their most intimate considerations (even on an emotional level). I would see myself as a dependent because of whom my partner has to sacrifice something important and a dependent relationship is not one of equals. So I'd think of him treating me with kid gloves, as opposed to honestly letting me know what he needs and trusting me to have his back, so to say. I'd feel like I wasn't pulling my end of the relationship if he had to give up important things to be with me. For me, a lot about love is equality and deep trust.

 

If there was no mismatch as a result of my not being able to have sex, I'd be fine. I'd STILL be aware of it as a relationship that is "sedate" of sorts, but if we were both fine with it, I'd see it as more of a phase in life or simply the nature of the relationship not being very passionate. I would still think of "the good old days, when passion made everything dazzle" - even if not as something I want now, it is something once lived, can't be unlived. You know what is possible, and anything less, you know is relatively dull, even if it is "enough" for your needs. But yes, the doubts about love wouldn't happen if there wasn't a mismatch.

 

Trying yet another angle. Think of it as a team building exercise, where you and your partner are a team. The more you are vulnerable and successfully interdependent (as opposed to the unhealthy co/dependence that you see), the more solid you are as a team. It isn't about whether you can handle your sexual needs solo, it is about the experience being better with a parnter, and you are compatible enough and in each other's trust zones to opt for better rather than "enough". It isn't about whether you are able to cook or not, but a complex calculation of who is the better cook and enjoys cooking more, who has more time, who may be closer to the guests arriving and prefer to talk than cook... - rather than "don't depend, feed yourself". Or who can afford to spend more on mutual needs rather than "pay equal share and no more, even if that is the entire income of one partner and a fraction of the other's". The give and take between people within a trusted zone allows them to do MORE with the same kind of resources (whether emotional or material). It is because it adds resilience to you as a TEAM - which is what a couple essentially is. If you want to be solo and see depending on a partner for your needs as unhealthy, what is the point being a part of a couple? ANYTHING you need from a partner would be unhealthy - beginning right from consent to be in the relationship itself. Why only sex? Being a part of a couple IS about merging resources and sharing them (emotional, physical, material... whatever). You become a team which is able to do a lot more together than solo. If your considerations being within a couple are still solo, it is a waste of effort. You'd be happier single!

 

So yes, to someone who has felt that harmony and closeness, it would be a devastating blow to know that their partner were sexually frustrated and longing for them and they could do nothing about it. Yes, they could connect emotionally and console, but they could not fulfill the need. That would feel liks a loss and a deterioration of an equal relationship to one that is less equal or more caretaking or tiptoeing around a mismatch and so on.

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Telecaster68

It's a struggle to try to describe exactly what sex brings to a relationship, and therefore how its absence will affect the relationship.

 

A long time ago, a poster on here who'd identified as asexual then discovered her sexuality, described the difference as like having another gear. You can have a perfectly good car with only four gears - it'll get you round just as well. But with the extra gear, you can go faster, and even if you're not going faster, it's easier to do the same speed in that extra gear. If you only ever drive a car with four gears, you probably won't miss the fifth one. But if you've had a car with five gears, you miss that top one - it's just not as good a drive.

 

Edit: having been in that exact situation, I remember I was constantly instinctively reaching for the gears to go up into fifth, which works for the analogy as well. And further extension of a strained metaphor: most people learn to drive in cars with five gears.

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To push the car metaphor still further, you may still settle for the one with 4 gears for other reasons. Maybe it is spacious enough to fit all your equipment for something specific. Maybe it is super comfortable. Maybe you can't afford a new car, or this one has sentimental value. Or maybe you can't handle it or avoid using it or opt for public transport or walk around or you trade it in for a better model... but while you have that car with 4 gears, you'll miss the fifth. You may go to the garage and find out if it is possible/feasible to keep the same car but fix the gears issue.

 

And the car would prefer you didn't want the fifth gear at all - it is perfectly possibel to drive with 4 gears, and it thinks you're being a precious snowflake and doesn't believe that one gear can make that much of a difference and you want to get to office, so how does it matter what gear you used to get there? It has never heard of anyone who completed a ride and spent their work day discussing missing gears.

 

You discuss fuel consumption and the car asks you whether you'll save enough on fuel to make a new car look cheaper. You don't really know. You do drive quite a bit...

 

The car would really prefer it if you stopped trying to yank it to a gear that isn't there and causing it to stall over and over on the road.... Is your drive improved by stalling on the road instead of driving? Why you do this? And you be like "I don't do it on purpose, I'm just used to shifting to the fifth for a better ride once I get into the flow."

 

Car thinks you have an unhealthy obsession with the fifth gear. You get pissed and think it isn't even a real car...

 

You're headed for transportation breakdown unless you are able to sort this out....

 

Um... I think I'll stop now. But that car doesn't really think ANY car has five gears. It just thinks it is an advertising gimmick and you are stupid to fall for it and not value all that your car has made possible for you.

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On 3/25/2018 at 11:44 PM, anamikanon said:

It is a powerful sense of "belonging"? If you have not felt it, you don't miss it, but if you have felt it, you will measure the closeness of every relationship against it

This makes me sad. I guess this is why many aces don't get a chance with sexuals when the sex comes out of the picture. No blame and not all sexual asexual relationships aren't given a chance, but when it does happen this way, it makes me sad. We don't get a chance because we won't be able to give that feeling of completeness and belonging to that sexual person even when we can get that from them without sex. Not anyone's fault. Just a sad predicament.

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22 hours ago, GLRDT said:

This makes me sad. I guess this is why many aces don't get a chance with sexuals when the sex comes out of the picture. No blame and not all sexual asexual relationships aren't given a chance, but when it does happen this way, it makes me sad. We don't get a chance because we won't be able to give that feeling of completeness and belonging to that sexual person even when we can get that from them without sex. Not anyone's fault. Just a sad predicament.

If you think of it as an orientation or even gender, then it really isn't so bad.   I'm a straight male.  I have some very good male friends - guys I enjoy talking to, spending time with etc.  But I can never have a romantic relationship with them because I simply don't have romantic feelings for other men.   The relationships can never go beyond "friends".

 

Similarly an asexual person probably cannot have a successful romantic relationship with a sexual person.  They are as incompatible in romance as two straight men would be.  OTOH they might have a wonderful relationship with another asexual person because they are compatible. 

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58 minutes ago, uhtred said:

If you think of it as an orientation or even gender, then it really isn't so bad.   I'm a straight male.  I have some very good male friends - guys I enjoy talking to, spending time with etc.  But I can never have a romantic relationship with them because I simply don't have romantic feelings for other men.   The relationships can never go beyond "friends".

 

Similarly an asexual person probably cannot have a successful romantic relationship with a sexual person.  They are as incompatible in romance as two straight men would be.  OTOH they might have a wonderful relationship with another asexual person because they are compatible. 

I see what you're saying but it's also not quite the same because I can fall in love  romantically with a straight guy and he can fall in love with me, a straight female. And yet, I'm gray asexual and he's sexual. In your example if the gay man fell in love with the straight man, the straight man wouldn't be able to feel in love back in the same way because he isn't attracted to men romantically or in any way. So because of their different sexual attractions/orientations, it automatically keeps them apart but for two straight people they can both be attracted to each other in many ways and romantically fall in love with each other. But then there is a sexual incompatibility but the sexual incompatibility has nothing to do with gender/attraction  in this example like it does in the gay and straight man example. It's more to do with I never want sex and the guy does. So I feel it's a little different. The problem is not that an asexual and sexual cannot be compatible in romance. They issue is that they are incompatible specifically in their desire or lack of desire for sex. I have romantically fallen in love with quite a few sexual men and them with me. It's the sex that got in the way.

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2 hours ago, GLRDT said:

I see what you're saying but it's also not quite the same because I can fall in love  romantically with a straight guy and he can fall in love with me, a straight female. And yet, I'm gray asexual and he's sexual. In your example if the gay man fell in love with the straight man, the straight man wouldn't be able to feel in love back in the same way because he isn't attracted to men romantically or in any way. So because of their different sexual attractions/orientations, it automatically keeps them apart but for two straight people they can both be attracted to each other in many ways and romantically fall in love with each other. But then there is a sexual incompatibility but the sexual incompatibility has nothing to do with gender/attraction  in this example like it does in the gay and straight man example. It's more to do with I never want sex and the guy does. So I feel it's a little different. The problem is not that an asexual and sexual cannot be compatible in romance. They issue is that they are incompatible specifically in their desire or lack of desire for sex. I have romantically fallen in love with quite a few sexual men and them with me. It's the sex that got in the way.

Many sexual people can't have a romantic attachment without sex.  Just the way that they are wired.  So an asexual person can have romantic feelings for a sexual person, but in many cases it doesn't work in the other direction. 

 

As a straight sexual male, I might be attracted to you, might start a romantic relationship, but without sex it would not last. (the romance wouldn't last, but the relationship might - even though I wouldn't be happy)

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2 hours ago, uhtred said:

Many sexual people can't have a romantic attachment without sex.  Just the way that they are wired.  So an asexual person can have romantic feelings for a sexual person, but in many cases it doesn't work in the other direction. 

 

As a straight sexual male, I might be attracted to you, might start a romantic relationship, but without sex it would not last. (the romance wouldn't last, but the relationship might - even though I wouldn't be happy)

I agree to some extent. I've seen that some sexual people put romance and sex together and some can separate it a bit more. I think it depends on the person. And I think it depends if the people in the couple had been having sex and then the asexual realizes they can't do it anymore and they've already built a romantic relationship together.

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On 26/3/2018 at 7:57 AM, vega57 said:

LOL!  Now, now, I didn't say anything about having an ace partner!  Of course, I haven't read the rest of your post yet, so I COULD be chewing on my words in a few minutes, lol!  


 

You're right.  It is a hard question to answer.  You gave me a certain set of circumstances, but that wasn't what I was asking.  

 

if you--as a sexual---couldn't have sex anymore--for whatever reason--would you feel that you could no longer love your partner, and/or that, your partner could no longer love you?  

 

 

If I -as a sexual- couldn’t have sex anymore - for whatever reason... ? Well! The reason is quite important to how I would/could react.

 

-I love you, but I dont want to give you the sex which I know you like. It is to many minutes of my life to spend on shaking your willy. I dont care if you get depressed. Go fuck yourself and dont fuck anyone else.

 

-I really wanted to keep giving you sex, but I have started to feel a pain in my head, my heart and my vajajaj. I am so sorry (insert heartfelt cry) I can understand if this makes you want to leave me.

 

-the doctors said that you will never be able to feel anything from your waist down.

 

-no, not tonigth either. Go sleep on the couch and by the way, I rather want you to stay home on our holiday. I gave your ticket to my mom.

 

-well, mr.Dane. after the medication, you will not be able to enjoy sex. This is part of getting old and popping a ton of pills, but you get to live longer and without pain.

 

-honey, I think, that I am getting to stressed about our sex dates. I would like the stress to stop. Can we cancel our future sex dates? Think about it and lets talk about in a few days.

 

-did you chop off your penis, while cooking naked? Damn!

 

 

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On 30/3/2018 at 10:32 PM, GLRDT said:

I agree to some extent. I've seen that some sexual people put romance and sex together and some can separate it a bit more. I think it depends on the person. And I think it depends if the people in the couple had been having sex and then the asexual realizes they can't do it anymore and they've already built a romantic relationship together.

This is not a response for you, @GLRDT just building a thougth upon your words.

 

I think most sexuals knows and sees the difference between sex and romance. We also understand them as “one can exist without the other”. The same goes for love.  Most sexuals also understand how each component can affect and vitalize the others. 

 

I tend to feel like some asexuals say that “all sexuals have no heart, but only lust”. I think most sexuals on AVEN is here to discuss and vent issues that are directly linked to asexuality. If I wanted to discuss world politics, religion, my wife and her cooking or any other matter, I would go to a forum outside of AVEN. I could even discuss this with colleagues and friends and even my wife, who I consider my best friend ever. 

 

I have, prior to AVEN, tried to look up issues about loss of sexual desire. Most magazines describes this as either “try to do more around the household and then she will want you again” or “show her, that you are a man and she will drag you to the bedroom” or “buy her flowers and lingerie” or “love is gone. Move along”. This fits well, with the “lust”-sexual.  But it doesnt adress the issue of asexuality.

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29 minutes ago, MrDane said:

I tend to feel like some asexuals say that “all sexuals have no heart, but only lust”.

If you listen to sexuals talking among themselves...if you read some of the more popular magazines...if you talk to some therapists, people in the media, people in the medical profession, your peers, your friends, your school mates, your relatives...your parents...your partner, and MOST of them say the same things over and over again...plus you have your own experiences with sexuals who want to get in your pants as soon as they can,  you kinda get the idea that MOST sexuals are pretty lustful!  

 

Heck, I just read an internet article this evening where the writer wrote that "sex quickly becomes addictive for MOST men".  http://www.interchangecounseling.com/blog/why-men-are-so-obsessed-with-sex/

 

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I think most sexuals knows and sees the difference between sex and romance. 

But it also seems that  a lot of those sexuals don't know the difference between sex and intimacy.  They see them as one in the same.  

 

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I have, prior to AVEN, tried to look up issues about loss of sexual desire. Most magazines describes this as either “try to do more around the household and then she will want you again” or “show her, that you are a man and she will drag you to the bedroom” or “buy her flowers and lingerie” or “love is gone. Move along”. This fits well, with the “lust”-sexual.  But it doesnt adress the issue of asexuality.

Yup.  Because asexuality is considered to be so rare.

 

I still believe that it's more common than we think.  

 

 

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Hm I'm sexual but I don't get antsy or annoyed when I don't get anything but I...get enough taking care of my own needs. 

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11 hours ago, vega57 said:

If you listen to sexuals talking among themselves...if you read some of the more popular magazines...if you talk to some therapists, people in the media, people in the medical profession, your peers, your friends, your school mates, your relatives...your parents...your partner, and MOST of them say the same things over and over again...plus you have your own experiences with sexuals who want to get in your pants as soon as they can,  you kinda get the idea that MOST sexuals are pretty lustful!  

 

Heck, I just read an internet article this evening where the writer wrote that "sex quickly becomes addictive for MOST men".  http://www.interchangecounseling.com/blog/why-men-are-so-obsessed-with-sex/

 

But it also seems that  a lot of those sexuals don't know the difference between sex and intimacy.  They see them as one in the same.  

 

Yup.  Because asexuality is considered to be so rare.

 

I still believe that it's more common than we think.  

 

 

I see your point, but...

 

I was just trying to adress the fact that sexuals are more than just their sexuality, and all is not about having sex. We can also enjoy watching Netflix and chill, without a sexual agenda.

 

we, the sexuals, are on aven because we have encountered some challenges in our life regarding sex. We may have other challenges. We usually do. But this specific challenges emerges from a divide in our approach to sex since we are in so-called mixed relationships.  

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5 hours ago, MrDane said:

I see your point, but...

 

I was just trying to adress the fact that sexuals are more than just their sexuality, and all is not about having sex. We can also enjoy watching Netflix and chill, without a sexual agenda.

LOL!  That's ironic.  Watching "Netflix and chill"--in the single world--usually  means, "Let's start watching Netflix" and the "chill" part is "...and then have sex". I'm sorry to say, but the single world often overlaps the married/in a relationship world.  If someone wants to do "Netflix and chill" BEFORE marriage, and to them the "chill" part means have sex, why would I think that it would mean anything different after marriage?  

 

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we, the sexuals, are on aven because we have encountered some challenges in our life regarding sex. We may have other challenges. We usually do. But this specific challenges emerges from a divide in our approach to sex since we are in so-called mixed relationships.  

Did you read the link I posted earlier?  It explains a lot.  

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2 hours ago, vega57 said:

and the "chill" part is "...and then have sex

wait, what? 'ChiII' IiteraIIy means do nothing, IoI. I have never in my Iife heard anyone (not even my hypersexuaI ex) use the word 'chiII' as a euphemism for having sex :P

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15 minutes ago, FictoVore. said:

wait, what? 'ChiII' IiteraIIy means do nothing, IoI. I have never in my Iife heard anyone (not even my hypersexuaI ex) use the word 'chiII' as a euphemism for having sex :P

From Googling "What does netflix and chill" mean?

 

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"Recently, in teenage internet circles, the phrase "Netflix and chill" has been inescapable. It's a phrase that means, roughly, "hooking up." But it's a lot more complicated than that. "Netflix and chill" is a classic case of social media-fueled semantic drift.Aug 27, 2015"

 

And we DO know that "hooking up" means sex!

 

Also, from Wikipedia "Netflix and Chill":  "Netflix and chill is an internet slang term used either as an invitation to watch Netflix together or as a euphemism for some form of sex, either as part of a romantic partnership or as a "booty call"."

 

 

 

 

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Maybe it’s a US thing but I’m an old lady and where I live “Netflix and chill” has totally picked up the meme-y booty-call meaning.:D

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On 4/2/2018 at 7:18 PM, vega57 said:

From Googling "What does netflix and chill" mean?

 

 

And we DO know that "hooking up" means sex!

 

Also, from Wikipedia "Netflix and Chill":  "Netflix and chill is an internet slang term used either as an invitation to watch Netflix together or as a euphemism for some form of sex, either as part of a romantic partnership or as a "booty call"."

 

 

 

 

 

On 4/3/2018 at 1:07 AM, ryn2 said:

Maybe it’s a US thing but I’m an old lady and where I live “Netflix and chill” has totally picked up the meme-y booty-call meaning.:D

Yeah I'm in NZ and I've certainly never heard of that, here we say 'chill' to mean 'relax and do nothing', sex is kind of the opposite of chilling!! ..it's probably lucky I didn't say to anyone in the US "hey want to hang out and watch some Netflix, chill for a bit?" ..because I'd literally mean just watch Netflix and do nothing else (other than maybe drink beer), sex certainly wouldn't be on the agenda but they might get totally the wrong idea haha :P

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That’s what “chill” normally means here, too... to relax, to do nothing.  If you said “I’m sick of sightseeing, I just want to chill,” people would figure you wanted to laze in front of your hotel room TV with a book and a beer.

 

It’s only when you add Netflix that it gets... steamy.

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