Question for sexuals

[ev13]

A little background: I am in a relationship with a sexual with a very high sex drive, and we have compromised to have sex a couple times a week. 

 

I have noticed though that if there's even a slightly extended period of less to no sex, let's say a week or so, mostly when i'm stressed or tired, my partner gets kinda anxious and having sex is their priority number one. This sometimes gets to a point that nothing gets done before sex is being had. They don't want go to the gym, supermarket and other "normal" life type of stuff, even physical touching (hugging, kissing, holding hands etc.) gets brushed aside.

 

I don't understand this, so I'd like to know and hear other views if this is a normal thing for people with high sex drives that lack of sex results in this kind of "depression" in lack of a better word? 

 

 

[anamikanon]

Frankly, yes. I imagine the frequency is different for different people, but whenever I feel like I haven't had sex in a while and I really want it, it can get pretty distracting and I get quite unhappy and frustrated and depressed and not really interested in anything till that big red flag is addressed. I feel neglected and unloved and etc. The sex itself is not that big a deal as feeling like my ace doesn't care and doesn't see anything missing while I am starving here (yeah, those moods can be pretty dramatic, lol).

 

YMMV, but in my case, I am usually able to get a full "dose" of sexual contentment with my partner masturbating me - or even me masturbating myself with extensive before and after cuddling and loving touch during, so to say. The "extent" of his participation is not so much an issue for me as his presence and if he is really stressed, I can "make do" with masturbating privately and then just a lot of cuddling to sleep. Him being there and caring. It is more about intimacy than the specifics of sex, but for us, sex is entwined with intimacy, so as long as I get off while we are intimate, it somehow totals to "ok good". My ace is pretty good at this, when he remembers. We don't have PIV sex often.

 

Would I prefer him doing me half a dozen times a day? Sure, but not getting that won't make me all sulky like him not noticing I am feeling unloved will. Because sex is a very loving act for me. Even when it is an illusion and masturbating me is more like cuddling to him than sex.

 

So worth trying may be acts of affection, asking them to masturbate themself while you are generally cuddling them, etc when you can't bring yourself to offer. I wouldn't recommend forcing yourself. At least for me, I can sense his reluctance and I don't like having sex like that. Also, if your partner can't, you could be setting expectations that are hard to fulfill longterm.

[Telecaster68]

Yes, in a word, although it behoves an adult not to be an arse about it. It's no more beyond a sexual's ability to control whether they act on being horny than whether they act on being hungry. But in the same way, if someone's hungry, you'd understand why they might get irritable or keep agitating to find some food, but not in work meeting. 

 

Your partner has become used to sex a couple of times a week, and when it doesn't happen, they miss it. To a sexual person, having sex isn't something you do instead of a normal thing, it is a normal thing, and an important one. 

 

Edit... In a relationship with two sexual people, either of them *not* being keen to have sex after a longer period than usual would probably be a concern. Wanting sex fairly soon after someone returns from a few days away is effectively saying 'hey, welcome home, I really missed you'. 

[ev13]

Thank you for your answers.

 

Actually it's a relief to hear that this is a normal thing for sexuals, rather than a characteristic because to be honest, sometimes it has felt like some mind games to make me feel bad, and that i'm worth nothing without sex. Now that I get their point of view a little better i can try to find a way with them to fulfill their needs better without forcing myself to something. 

 

Edit:... Also sometimes the roles are reversed and they're the one who's too tired or stressed, there's no issue obviously. So i guess that's why it has felt unfair that it has lead to anxiousness only when i'm the one holding the sex, but after hearing the sexual point of view it's understandable.

 

 

49 minutes ago, anamikanon said:

So worth trying may be acts of affection, asking him to masturbate himself while you are generally cuddling him, etc when you can't bring yourself to offer. I wouldn't recommend forcing yourself. At least for me, I can sense his reluctance and I don't like having sex like that. Also, if your partner can't, you could be setting expectations that are hard to fulfill longterm.

This is a good recommendation. I'll talk to them if this would be an acceptable solution instead of doing nothing or forcing it. She does masturbate when i'm not home, but that probably does not fill the need, especially about feeling wanted and loved. 

 

47 minutes ago, Telecaster68 said:

 It's no more beyond a sexual's ability to control whether they act on being horny than whether they act on being hungry. But in the same way, if someone's hungry, you'd understand why they might get irritable or keep agitating to find some food, but not in work meeting. 

This is an eye opening quote. I guess for me it's just been something that you do at the end of the day when all other tasks are done, and in my past relationships with people with less sex drive it's been somewhat the same way for them. So this is the first time i've seen this and it's been hard to understand. 

 

And if it feels the same way as being hungry, i feel bad for everyone that has to go through that without having the chance to have a bite.

[anamikanon]

19 minutes ago, ev13 said:

I'll talk to them if this would be an acceptable solution instead of doing nothing or forcing it. She does masturbate when i'm not home, but that probably does not fill the need, especially about feeling wanted and loved. 

You will have to talk a lot. Find out what her bare minimum is, what her preference is. For example, privately masturbating is something I do when I know my ace is stressed and unlikely to appreciate me being sexual. I do it more to get the edge off and be able to be with him without my sexual desire bleeding into the platonic touch he needs. It won't work long term. On the other hand, him masturbating me, or being with me during still gives me the feeling of intimacy and works. 

 

This may not be the same for her. You will need to find out.

 

My golden rule for adapting in a relationship is find out what is the minimum needed, find out the preference is (on anything, not necessarily sex). If I can't meet the minimum, I understand that the relationship is not realistic. If I can, I aim to offer slightly more than the minimum at least (nothing screams "grudging" like offering the bare minimum) and keep in mind that this is something they love, so when I want to delight my partner, I'll do it all they want till they say "enough". Usually, this is for film watching on my end. I'm not really into passively watching anything, but I watch the occasional films (even one or two a month keeps him from feeling like I "never" watch films with him), and will sometimes find a really interesting subject to binge watch films - bonus points if he hasn't seen them before AND loves them. AND I'll go all the way and line up snacks he loves (that I make at home) to last all through the film watching.

 

I get really good sex from my ace after that, because he knows that is my preferred treat  

 

The film watching example is because it really doesn't come naturally to me at all. I can't for the life of me remember actors or directors and such beyond short term memory, so I artificially prepare - I will read up the wikipedia page for the film and also the "trivia" on IMDB and such and remember interesting bits - because he likes to discuss the films. I actually have knowledge of film making, so I'll bring those unique observations in. By next week, I'll have forgotten most of what I learned by rote (including the names of the films we watched), but he won't and he will treasure it. Point is, when I am offering, I offer as complete and delightful an experience as I can. There is absolutely no doubt that I really want to do this. That really makes him feel like I care.

 

On his part, he's actually read up a bit and tried to introduce interesting sexual experiences he thought I might enjoy (and also he felt he could offer more easily). Expecting very special, but routine sex, I was stunned each time and those are actually some of my most special memories of us together on the sex front - and in most of them I didn't even climax, because... well, it was new, unfamiliar and my ace sometimes doesn't "get" sex the way I do. But it was STILL special.

[ev13]

We have talked a lot about this, but obviously need to talk more, AND see if we can act like what we've agreed.  Kinda just needed to have other peoples opinions and views on this as well.

 

Your story about watching movies with your partner is also something that would be very welcomed on my part, and I think I need to express my needs better too in other areas of our lives that would likely lead to me being more comfortable giving her what she needs, because for me it's harder to make the initiative for intimacy if there's friction between us and her shutting down until sex is being had. Plus already being stressed and stressing about this on top of that really is an endless cycle. 

[anamikanon]

Feel free to message me if I can help with general conversation and perspective. Given that I'm very sexual and with an ace, and currently doing fabulously (this is like the weather), sort of puts us on different sides of a similar equation.

[uhtred]

Yes, its pretty normal for sexuals. The frequency they need depends on the person  

 

I can say for myself that sex makes me happy. Not just when it happens, but it leaves me in a good mood for several days.  That gradually fades, and turns to a generally unhappy mood after a week or so.  That doesn't mean that I can't enjoy other things but its sort of like the whole world has just gotten a little darker and grayer.   It will vary with the person, but for me its not physical - taking care of myself doesn't fix it, its somehow associated with intimacy with my partner. 

 

Its not rational - but lets face it, there is very little in human relationships that IS rational. 

 

It makes sexual / asexual relationships very difficult because many seuxals really cannot be happy without sex - but that is something very difficult for asexuals to imagine - it just looks like selfishness. 

 

 

[vega57]

1 hour ago, uhtred said:

I can say for myself that sex makes me happy. Not just when it happens, but it leaves me in a good mood for several days.  That gradually fades, and turns to a generally unhappy mood after a week or so.  That doesn't mean that I can't enjoy other things but its sort of like the whole world has just gotten a little darker and grayer.   It will vary with the person, but for me its not physical - taking care of myself doesn't fix it, its somehow associated with intimacy with my partner. 

This is something I never understood.  How can one go from "happy" to "unhappy" in such a short period of time because of the lack of sex?  I mean, if everything else in your life is going pretty well, why the extreme change in mood?  So many sexuals have described how they feel about the lack of sex as "depressed", "grumpy", "unhappy" and even "miserable" or "going crazy" or "going insane".  They could have money in the bank, and nice place to live, brand new cars, healthy family, good friends, a job that they love, even a 'wonderful' partner...and they'd STILL report being "miserable", "depressed" etc. without sex!  

 

I

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t makes sexual / asexual relationships very difficult because many seuxals really cannot be happy without sex - but that is something very difficult for asexuals to imagine - it just looks like selfishness. 

You're right.  It often does look like selfishness.  It can also look like neediness, insecurity and an unhealthy kind of dependence.

 

In all honesty, how do sexuals deal with themselves (their "mood") if they're not in a relationship, or at least not getting a steady stream of sex from someone?   

[anamikanon]

6 hours ago, ev13 said:

They don't want go to the gym, supermarket and other "normal" life type of stuff,

and

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even physical touching (hugging, kissing, holding hands etc.) gets brushed aside.

These are actually two completely different things from the perspective of a sexual!

 

Disinterest in the gmy, supermarket, etc can be because of feeling depressed, neglected, etc.

 

On the other hand, physical touching - hugging, kissing, holding hands.......... is like pouring gasoline on a flame for a sexual when they are frustrated!!!! If it seems that sex is not going to happen, physical touch can seem like an invitation for more frustration. At least for me, I'll actively shy away from touch if I am feeling frustrated and know that he is not going to want sexual touch. If sex is not going to be on the menu, and obviously, we both want physical contact, I'd at the very least need some good private time to masturbate before being ok with it. Frankly, it won't work too well beyond a temporary measure.

 

I suppose it bothers aces, though mine doesn't seem that bothered, but we are attracted to you, so we basically get tempted and want sex when such things happen. Normally, it is ok. It is that added zing of attraction in daily life. Feels nice even and doesn't have to be satisfied every time. But when frustrated, it can become a mountain. lol

 

If this goes on too long with constant frustration, I start seeing the partner as a "no sex zone" and stop feeling desire. This may not be reversible if my partner changes his mind. I can't lose sexual attraction without losing attraction overall, so basically it means that the relationship is in trouble. It isn't intentional, but it is simply how the mind operates, or I'd simply have gone through enough frustration to leave my ace alone and have a nice non-sexual relationship. But it won't work that way.

 

So, in a sense, the frustration, at least for me, is good news. It means that I am still interested in my partner.

 

37 minutes ago, vega57 said:

This is something I never understood.  How can one go from "happy" to "unhappy" in such a short period of time because of the lack of sex?

If you are a cuddler, try going two days of your partner refusing affectionate touch/hugs/cuddles  you will understand. you were fine two days ago, so why do you feel lonely?

 

Sadly, if you aren't a cuddler, the other example is food, which isn't so exact, but still. You were full 5 hours ago, what is the big deal if you don't eat a meal now?

 

The period will vary for people, but whatever the period is, in that period, you need to touch base in a specific way. If you are a frequent cuddler, you want your hug/nuzzle/whatever every few hours. If you like sleeping in your partner's arms, not doing it even for a single night will be disappointing. And so on. If you are sexual and you need sex once a day/week/whatever to feel very close to your partner, not getting it will make you feel like there is distance.

 

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 I mean, if everything else in your life is going pretty well, why the extreme change in mood?

We don't call it everything going well!!!! As in even everything "else". If I am feeling unloved and neglected by my partner, my whole mood will be down. I can't focus on work, I keep feeling like there is some problem in our relationship that needs to be addressed, I will keep feeling like my needs are an imposition on him and I should not count on him, I will keep feeling distracted by thoughts about him and then feeling slapped by the knowledge that he couldn't care less.... it is hardly a picture of "everything else going well" - inherently, the feeling is loneliness. How can you feel lonely and experience everything else going well? That is reserved for the ace, who dont' even notice it when sex goes missing, and life is beautiful and there is no problem unless the sexual nags.

 

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You're right.  It often does look like selfishness.  It can also look like neediness, insecurity and an unhealthy kind of dependence.

It is hard to feel secure if your partner is oblivious to your needs. Whether once a week or day or month or year, it is your need and if it doesn't matter to them, you dont' really feel safe about your needs being met in the relationship. Your mind is constantly keeping an eye out for potential deprivation.

 

The converse also could be said if we make no effort to understand the opposite perspective. An ace getting into a sexual relationship is neediness, insecurity and an unhealthy kind of dependence on some person. Why depend on a relationship that has things you don't like in it? Live solo if no platonic partner seems suitable? Doesn't work that way. We are all people, balancing complex and sometimes conflicting desires.

 

It is about as healthy or unhealthy a dependence as wanting to share a home with someone. Or feeling bugged if your partner doesn't tell you s/he loves you since they proposed 2 years ago, because there is no change in status, so no need. A relationship inherently is a sort of counterdependence. If you can't count on your partner, you don't feel secure. That is why we try so hard to find middle ground we can count on, and thus feel secure. That middle ground may be once a week sex. 

 

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In all honesty, how do sexuals deal with themselves (their "mood") if they're not in a relationship, or at least not getting a steady stream of sex from someone?   

For those who see sex as intimacy, when not in a relationship, there is no one to be attracted to or need that intimacy from, so there is no distress that your partner whom you love and desire doesn't reciprocate or care about being close to you.

 

For those who see sex as a physical need, they will have their ways of managing when single. Casual sex, sex workers, friends with benefits, and so on. Or they may long for the state of being in a relationship if only for the sex, even when they are not attracted to anyone currently.

[anamikanon]

40 minutes ago, vega57 said:

 It often does look like selfishness.  It can also look like neediness, insecurity and an unhealthy kind of dependence.

Frankly, I have a firm belief that if you think your partner is malicious (selfishness at your cost would count as that), then there is no relationship worth saving and best avoid unnecessary distress for all concerned and end it. At the very least, the person we will be making complex efforts for should be worth it, not some selfish user.

 

At the very least, there should be a belief that your partner does desire the best for you, even if there are complex difficulties you both negotiate together.

 

This sort of a sentence is hurtful and insensitive when referring to a partner. What you are essentially saying is that it isn't selfishness, neediness, insecurity or unhealthy dependence to get into a relationship with a sexual because you need the relationship, even if you don't accept them as they are. But the other person getting into the relationship having their own preference on the sexual front is selfish. Basically, you are setting the norm for the relationship unilaterally with no respect for your partner's needs.

 

This sentence is about as enriching for a relationship as a sexual calling an ace's lack of interest in sex selfishness, neediness, etc.

 

If things are reaching a point where you cannot see good intentions in a partner, what is left to save about them in your lives? What is the point of even keeping a toxic person in your life?

[vega57]

1 minute ago, anamikanon said:

If you are a cuddler, try going without two days of your partner refusing affectionate touch/hugs/cuddles  you will understand. you were fine two days ago, so why do you feel lonely?

I DO enjoy cuddling, but I was with a partner for over 4 years who wasn't into it.  I can't say I "missed" it when it didn't happen, so I didn't feel "lonely" without it.  

 

In fact, I can honestly say that I've never felt "lonely" in my life.   

 

I haven't been in a relationship for a number of years.  I was a full-time live-in caregiver for my mom for over 5.5 years until she passed away 6 weeks ago.  I 'inherited' her cat.  I have no other family.  BUT...I'm not "lonely".  

 

I have friends and I have no problem talking to strangers.  My mom lived in an apartment complex with about 90 apartments.  I probably know about half the people who live there.  I was one of the younger people who lived there, and I was often counted on to do favors for the tenants.  Whether it was helping them figure out how to use the computer, pay a bill online or with their new Obama phone, going grocery shopping for them, doing their laundry, taking care of their pet while they were in the hospital, interpreting a letter they received from Social Security, or just listening to them talk about their lives, I LOVED doing it all.  I did it willingly, without the exectation of anything in return.  I knew that most of them had limited resources.  

 

The day I moved, I went to each person to say good-bye.  It was a senior complex, and I'm not old enough to stay there, so I had to move.  Some of the tenants went to management and PROTESTED that I had to leave.  I was supposed to leave 2 weeks after my mom passed, but *I* was granted a full month, simply because of what I had done for the 'community'.  

 

The day I moved, I went to each tenant to say good-bye.  Took me several hours.  But the outpouring of tears, hugs, encouragement, companionship and LOVE that I felt from those people was MORE than I ever received from all of the intimate partners that I've ever been with.  

 

All I have to say is, "What?  ME??  Lonely???"  

 

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Sadly, if you aren't a cuddler, the other example is food, which isn't so exact, but still. You were full 5 hours ago, what is the big deal if you don't eat a meal now?

 

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The period will vary for people, but whatever the period is, in that period, you need to touch base in a specific way. If you are a frequent cuddler, you want your hug/nuzzle/whatever every few hours. If you like sleeping in your partner's arms, not doing it even for a single night will be disappointing. And so on. If you are sexual and you need sex once a day/week/whatever to feel very close to your partner, not getting it will make you feel like there is distance.

See the first part of this post.  

 

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We don't call it everything going well!!!! As in even everything "else". If I am feeling unloved and neglected by my partner, my whole mood will be down. I can't focus on work, I keep feeling like there is some problem in our relationship that needs to be addressed, I will keep feeling like my needs are an imposition on him and I should not count on him, I will keep feeling distracted by thoughts about him and then feeling slapped by the knowledge that he couldn't care less....

But even if sex is missing...and everything else is going well, why say that NOTHING is going well?  Once again, why the 'extreme'?  

 

Why feel "neglected" by your partner because you haven't had sex with them in a few days, or even a few weeks?  I mean, I understand that you feel that way, but what I don't understand is WHY.  

 

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it is hardly a picture of "everything else going well" - inherently, the feeling is loneliness. How can you feel lonely and experience everything else going well? That is reserved for the ace, who dont' even notice it when sex goes missing, and life is beautiful and there is no problem unless the sexual nags.

Like I've described above, I just don't get the feeling of "loneliness".  I mean, your partner is THERE.  They're in the same room, perhaps sharing a meal...conversation...connection through conversation.  How do you feel "lonely"?  

 

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It is hard to feel secure if your partner is oblivious to your needs. Whether once a week or day or month or year, it is your need and if it doesn't matter to them, you dont' really feel safe about your needs being met in the relationship. Your mind is constantly keeping an eye out for potential deprivation.

It may not be because your partner is "oblivious" to your "needs".  They may see your "needs" as "wants", exaggerated by you saying that they're "needs".  So, they may not see them as "important" as *you* do.  

 

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The converse also could be said if we make no effort to understand the opposite perspective. An ace getting into a sexual relationship is neediness, insecurity and an unhealthy kind of dependence on some person.

You're right, but they may have all those things because of something else...not sex.  Neither is healthy.  

 

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Why depend on a relationship that has things you don't like in it?

Because people often don't have any clue that the relationship doesn't have what they want until after they're in the relationship for a while.  There may be other things they depend on their partner for that override what they may not like about it.  An emotionally abused woman (for example) may enjoy that her partner has money, and spends the money on vacations, cars, etc.  The abused partner may be willing to put up with the insults, put-downs etc. that have more 'value' to them.  I'm sure you've heard that some men would be willing to put up with a woman who calls him names, insults him, tells him he's 'worthless'...but if the sex is "great", he'll stay...at least for a while...

 

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Live solo if no platonic partner seems suitable? Doesn't work that way. We are all people, balancing complex and sometimes conflicting desires.

Yes, you're right.  So maybe the solution is to figure out what those conflicting desires are and to 'solve' them...

 

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It is about as healthy or unhealthy a dependence as wanting to share a home with someone. Or feeling bugged if your partner doesn't tell you s/he loves you since they proposed 2 years ago, because there is no change in status, so no need. A relationship inherently is a sort of counterdependence. If you can't count on your partner, you don't feel secure. That is why we try so hard to find middle ground we can count on, and thus feel secure. That middle ground may be once a week sex. 

But what does having sex (X) amount of times per week have anything to do with whether or not you can count on your partner?  Does that mean that if you can't count on your partner for sex (X) amount of times per week, you can't depend on your partner for ANYTHING?  

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For those who see sex as a physical need, they will have their ways of managing when single. Casual sex, sex workers, friends with benefits, and so on. Or they may long for the state of being in a relationship if only for the sex, even when they are not attracted to anyone currently.

O.k., this again is part of what bothers me.  

 

A sexual can be in an intimate loving relationship for a 'while'.  They use sex as a way to express their love for their partner, and to feel love from their partner.

 

And yet...

 

So many of them would just as soon dump their asexual/low sexual/non-sexual partner and DO the casual sex, sex workers and FWB 'thing'.  

 

This becomes confusing to the low-drive partner.  After all, if sex is about "love", why have sex with someone who you obviously DON'T love?  Here's a typical scenario:  High Drive partner is with Low Drive partner for um-teen years.  The HD partner claims to 'love' his or her partner.  Desperately, madly, passionately, deeply, etc.  BUT, the sex is missing.  They divorce.  The HD partner finds another partner who is also HD.  They're happy with this new partner, but they don't necessarily "love" this new partner.  The LD ex-partner gets wind of this and thinks, "I guess it wasn't *me* s/he loved, but SEX s/he loved!"  

 

[vega57]

1 hour ago, anamikanon said:

Frankly, I have a firm belief that if you think your partner is malicious (selfishness at your cost would count as that), then there is no relationship worth saving and best avoid unnecessary distress for all concerned and end it. At the very least, the person we will be making complex efforts for should be worth it, not some selfish user.

I agree.  Unfortunately, some people don't realize that their partner IS malicious until it's "too late".  

 

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At the very least, there should be a belief that your partner does desire the best for you, even if there are complex difficulties you both negotiate together.

 

This would be ideal...

 

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This sort of a sentence is hurtful and insensitive when referring to a partner. What you are essentially saying is that it isn't selfishness, neediness, insecurity or unhealthy dependence to get into a relationship with a sexual because you need the relationship, even if you don't accept them as they are. But the other person getting into the relationship having their own preference on the sexual front is selfish. Basically, you are setting the norm for the relationship unilaterally with no respect for your partner's needs.

I DID say that it can look like this.  I didn't say that it IS this.  

 

People get into relationships for the wrong reasons every day.  Some do it because they 'don't want to be alone'...or because they want a steady stream of sex...or because they want someone to financially support them...or because they want someone to watch over their kids...

 

Notice how all of the above has to do with what someone can get from a relationship, and not what they can give to one?  I'm sorry to say, but some people DO get into relationships for selfish reasons, including being sexually selfish.  

 

Personally, I don't want to get into a relationship in order to "get my 'needs' met".  I'd rather get into one because of what I can give.  I mean, isn't love about what we can give and not what we can get?  

 

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This sentence is about as enriching for a relationship as a sexual calling an ace's lack of interest in sex selfishness, neediness, etc.

Like I said, it can be seen this way.  

 

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If things are reaching a point where you cannot see good intentions in a partner, what is left to save about them in your lives? What is the point of even keeping a toxic person in your life?

Wanting sex does not necessarily make someone 'toxic'.  You know that.  *I* know that.  It's just....geez...it seems like sex is so important to some people that they'll do ANYTHING to get it.  They'll lie...cheat...steal...lie some more.  They'll claim they 'love' you, just for that 8 second orgasm.  And so often, we don't see that because of the other 'good' in them.  We have no idea that they're doing things for us or even with us in order to get sex from us.  It's their motive.  They often protest, "I clean the kitchen!  I take care of the kids!  I work 60 hours a week!  I buy her things!  And STILL NO SEX!"  

 

Do I have to tell you how many of relationships are like this, AND, WHO is the 'toxic' person in this 'dance'?  

 

ETA:  I'm not trying to be obtuse here.  I'm TRYING to understand.  So much of what sexuals say is hypocritical and contradictory, and I'm HOPING that you can help to sort it all out.  

[anamikanon]

1 hour ago, vega57 said:

All I have to say is, "What?  ME??  Lonely???"  

Got it. You don't feel lonely. 

 

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But even if sex is missing...and everything else is going well, why say that NOTHING is going well?  Once again, why the 'extreme'?  

The extreme is yours. You said everything else is going well. I simply said, it doesn't feel like everything else is going well and gave examples of things that don't go well. So you promptly proceeded to assume nothing is going well. Now you want an explanation from me for why the extreme. How would i know?

 

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Why feel "neglected" by your partner because you haven't had sex with them in a few days, or even a few weeks?  I mean, I understand that you feel that way, but what I don't understand is WHY.  

Let me put it like this. Sex, is one of the most primitive ways you can be intimate with someone. It feels good, it is way closer than hugs and cuddles and it has a powerful physical and emotional impact that raises endorphins to very nice levels and when those levels drop, you want them at those nice highs again, because that is how you understand bonding with a partner on a physical and emotional level. I can cuddle my son, hug my friends. None of them would be allowed in the intimate zone that I reserve for my partner. The manner of touch, the level of unguarded pleasure shared, the trust in the nature of contact allowed and the nature of pleasure that results in. This is an exclusive zone. Where everyone with cuddle access to me can't enter.

 

In turn, someone I have experienced such intense pleasure with also becomes someone I am hormonally inclined to care more about in addition to the psychological bonding of an exclusive and intense experience. So yeah, what you feel for your partner does get dimmed if sex hasn't happened in a while. For example, oxytocin is also the hormone that encourages bonding between women and child with a strong interest in ensuring the well being of the person you have experienced them with. All this gets loaded into the relationship. Your feelings are more vivid, you care a lot more about the person you have pleasurable sex with than someone you hug, and so on. On a completely chemical level here.

 

To put it very bluntly, to a sexual, asexuality comes across as a disability on the front of intimacy when they are subjected to its limitations. Obviously the ace does not see it like that. I don't see an ace as disabled either, since they don't feel it. But if I am capable of feeling intense pleasure and bonding, not feeling it is definitely a handicap on my experience of a relationship. In terms of sharing body contact, you feel limited to a zone you would share with friends.

 

That is why you feel lonely, because you signed on for an intimate partner you expect to feel all that intense chemistry with, who is parked in the friend zone.

 

Like inviting someone home, but they decide to stand at your door and talk to you for hours like that, so you can't go in and sit comofrtably while you talk and they don't want to come in and sit, so they are fine.

 

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Like I've described above, I just don't get the feeling of "loneliness".  I mean, your partner is THERE.  They're in the same room, perhaps sharing a meal...conversation...connection through conversation.  How do you feel "lonely"?  

That is not the connection I want. Or rather, that limited scope of connection is not what is acceptable in an intimate partner. It is like giving the keys to your home to someone who doesn't want to enter it. They don't want to come in, no point giving the keys. It is fine in a colleague. And remaining limited at that level will invariably result in the relationship being downgraded to something similar to a colleague, and I'll find what I need elsewhere.

 

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It may not be because your partner is "oblivious" to your "needs".  They may see your "needs" as "wants", exaggerated by you saying that they're "needs".  So, they may not see them as "important" as *you* do.  

This is something every individual has to decide for themselves. Be too gullible, and you'll get used. Be too skeptical and you'll undermine your relationship by dismissing something the partner really needs to feel close to you. For example, I completely fall out of love if rejected for too long. I simply no longer care about the person. And I don't feel interested in repairing the relationship either. Now my partner thinks of me as the one thing that went right in his life. He fought with tradition, convinced orthodox parents, shuttled by air for 3 years between two cities every month and finally moved from a city he adored to a place that has nothing to say for it except I live here. Dismissing my needs would be a loss to him just as it would be to me if I stopped caring. So this arrogant dismissal of stated needs as wants and not important may not be in anyone's interest.

 

I go to the extent of saying that ok, it may be a want - I tend not to fudge the two, but let us go by your assessment. But if I can't express a want to the most intimate person in my life, who can I do it with? The neighbour? Dismissal of it will still undermine the relationship. Differences must be discussed and negotiated, not judged and dismissed. A need that seems surreal or exaggerated can be questioned, but it still has to be a mutual thing! Would you appreciate an asexual's need for space from pressure for sex being talked about as a want rather than a need for their well being? Why cater to it? They can say no a dozen times a day.... The end result would be the same. A legit need being dismissed would make the person unhappy in the relationship and wanting out. The other person in the relationship is also a human being.

 

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Because people often don't have any clue that the relationship doesn't have what they want until after they're in the relationship for a while.

Sure, so they can stop the unhealthy depending and give up the relationship once they realize the "oops"?

 

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There may be other things they depend on their partner for that override what they may not like about it.  An emotionally abused woman (for example) may enjoy that her partner has money, and spends the money on vacations, cars, etc.  The abused partner may be willing to put up with the insults, put-downs etc. that have more 'value' to them.  I'm sure you've heard that some men would be willing to put up with a woman who calls him names, insults him, tells him he's 'worthless'...but if the sex is "great", he'll stay...at least for a while...

How is this different from an unhealthy dependence?

 

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But what does having sex (X) amount of times per week have anything to do with whether or not you can count on your partner?  Does that mean that if you can't count on your partner for sex (X) amount of times per week, you can't depend on your partner for ANYTHING?  

O.k., this again is part of what bothers me.  

Since you don't get relationships and emotions, let's talk plain cold "what happens". We all have our various needs from a relationship. Things we wanted, which is why we decided to get into it. Whether it is sex or cuddles or financial security. If that requirement is not met, the relationship does not seem viable. Sexuals find sex pleasurable. Aforementioned endorphins, pleasure, health, bonding, sense of well being, etc. Sex gives you a high. Then the high wears off. You want it again. To a sexual who wants sex in a relationship, this puts the "intimate" in the "intimate relationship".

 

Intimate can vary. But generally, for all people in the relationship, the idea of "intimate" will be influenced by the closest they can pleasurably get to another person. This may vary from being in the same room to body parts entering another person's body. Still others will add mind benders to it with kink or BDSM to emphasize the closeness and make it appear still more intense. But the common factor will be that "intimacy" is the closest they can get pleasurably and not less than that,  though they can enjoy it. Which is how you have an ace-ace relationship on one of the threads here, but one likes kissing and one doesn't, so there is not enough kissing going on, therefore a discontentment happens. Both don't like or want sex, but the same problem as sexual - ace plays out, except the sex is kissing. One can get as close as cuddles, another can get as close as kissing, either the first figures out kissing, or the kisser will be discontented, because their "intimate" is kissing.

 

Sexuals can get as close as sex. So that is their desired intimacy - the closest they can get to a partner. Intimate = close. That makes sense?

 

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A sexual can be in an intimate loving relationship for a 'while'.  They use sex as a way to express their love for their partner, and to feel love from their partner.

 

And yet...

 

So many of them would just as soon dump their asexual/low sexual/non-sexual partner and DO the casual sex, sex workers and FWB 'thing'.  

 

This becomes confusing to the low-drive partner.  After all, if sex is about "love", why have sex with someone who you obviously DON'T love?  Here's a typical scenario:  High Drive partner is with Low Drive partner for um-teen years.  The HD partner claims to 'love' his or her partner.  Desperately, madly, passionately, deeply, etc.  BUT, the sex is missing.  They divorce.  The HD partner finds another partner who is also HD.  They're happy with this new partner, but they don't necessarily "love" this new partner.  The LD ex-partner gets wind of this and thinks, "I guess it wasn't *me* s/he loved, but SEX s/he loved!"  

 

You need to read what you replied to again. It spoke of two different kinds of needs for sex. One is with a person, which vanishes if there is no person, the other is for the act, which can be fulfilled in other ways.

 

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Notice how all of the above has to do with what someone can get from a relationship, and not what they can give to one?  I'm sorry to say, but some people DO get into relationships for selfish reasons, including being sexually selfish.  

 

Personally, I don't want to get into a relationship in order to "get my 'needs' met".  I'd rather get into one because of what I can give.  I mean, isn't love about what we can give and not what we can get?  

Behaviorists call this the "need to be needed". In other words, you'd still be getting into the relationship for what you get out of it - the opportunity to give, which is what you feel a need to do.

 

Also, a relationship is a mutual thing. A partner who wants nothing from us is not actually an attractive thing, because giving is rewarding for your partner too, just like you feel the need to do it. A lot of the closeness in a relationship comes from caring for each other. If one of the two wants nothing, it effectively becomes a rejection of the caring and the relationship becomes a one sided thing. Most people don't feel comfortable being seen as the only people getting something out of a mutual situation - which essentially is how you would be seeing them, yes?

 

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Wanting sex does not necessarily make someone 'toxic'.  You know that.  *I* know that.

I never said wanting sex makes someone toxic. This is why you need to read the explanations you seeked a little slower, absorb the meaning, what the person is trying to say. Wanting something at the cost of your partner's well being is toxic. Which, it is, if a sexual person presents their wants as needs, because that puts pressure on the ace to fulfill them usually at the cost of their own discomfort. This is not loving behavior. It is toxic. If you believe a partner is not being truthful in ways that harm your well being, then that partner is toxic.

 

However, there also is an element of legit needs, which you don't appear to recognize, but addressed earlier.

 

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It's just....geez...it seems like sex is so important to some people that they'll do ANYTHING to get it.  They'll lie...cheat...steal...lie some more.  They'll claim they 'love' you, just for that 8 second orgasm.  And so often, we don't see that because of the other 'good' in them.  We have no idea that they're doing things for us or even with us in order to get sex from us.  It's their motive.  They often protest, "I clean the kitchen!  I take care of the kids!  I work 60 hours a week!  I buy her things!  And STILL NO SEX!"  

 

Do I have to tell you how many of relationships are like this, AND, WHO is the 'toxic' person in this 'dance'?

A toxic person STILL is one who enforces their wishes without regard to the well being of a partner. Whether it is the lying cheating sexual, or the asexual who sees no need to compromise and thinks their partner's needs are just wants and not important. You appear to exclusively see sexuals as some kind of evil creatures. It is your loss. They are people. Just like anyone else.

[anamikanon]

1 hour ago, vega57 said:

ETA:  I'm not trying to be obtuse here.  I'm TRYING to understand.  So much of what sexuals say is hypocritical and contradictory, and I'm HOPING that you can help to sort it all out.  

If you are trying to understand, it may be useful to not dismiss what you don't understand immediately, off the bat, but spend some time thinking it through. Obviously, we think in very different ways. If I am making an effort to detail and explain at length, you may want to experiment with trusting that I'm trying to help you think things through rather than simply take explanations and dismiss them and end with "want to understand". I have no idea of what you will understand. The difference between how aces see sex/relationships and how sexuals see them is considerable. I am trying to explain how I see it to the best of my ability.

[uhtred]

12 hours ago, vega57 said:

This is something I never understood.  How can one go from "happy" to "unhappy" in such a short period of time because of the lack of sex?  I mean, if everything else in your life is going pretty well, why the extreme change in mood?  So many sexuals have described how they feel about the lack of sex as "depressed", "grumpy", "unhappy" and even "miserable" or "going crazy" or "going insane".  They could have money in the bank, and nice place to live, brand new cars, healthy family, good friends, a job that they love, even a 'wonderful' partner...and they'd STILL report being "miserable", "depressed" etc. without sex!  

 

I

You're right.  It often does look like selfishness.  It can also look like neediness, insecurity and an unhealthy kind of dependence.

 

In all honesty, how do sexuals deal with themselves (their "mood") if they're not in a relationship, or at least not getting a steady stream of sex from someone?   

I think some things cannot be understood if they are not experienced. Someone who doesn't like crowds will have difficulty understanding why some people enjoy going to crowded clubs. Someone who is afraid of heights can't understand why someone would want to go skydiving.

 

Is the unhappiness from lack of sex chemical? No idea.  Its difficult to say why people enjoy sex in the first place - and of course some never do. 

 

For me sex is necessary but not sufficient for happiness. I have a beautiful wife that I love, money in the bank,  a nice house, good friends, a job I enjoy, even my own frickin airplane. I travel all over the world, have my favorite gelato shop in Rome, and my favorite hotel in the Alps.  Yet I spend a lot of my life unhappy. There is no fix but to leave my wife of 30 years - for something that like the previous poster, she simply cannot understand. 

 

Is it dependence - yes.  Is it unhealthy: yes in a mixed relationship, but no in a typical one.  In a typical relationship frequent sex brings a couple closer together - results in shared happiness and enhances love. 

 

Sexuals are often unhappy if they don't have partners.  This is why some will go to such great lengths to get the.  Sometimes they start wars over this. 

 

 

 

[MrDane]

On 16/3/2018 at 4:51 PM, uhtred said:

Yes, its pretty normal for sexuals. The frequency they need depends on the person  

 

I can say for myself that sex makes me happy. Not just when it happens, but it leaves me in a good mood for several days.  That gradually fades, and turns to a generally unhappy mood after a week or so.  That doesn't mean that I can't enjoy other things but its sort of like the whole world has just gotten a little darker and grayer.   It will vary with the person, but for me its not physical - taking care of myself doesn't fix it, its somehow associated with intimacy with my partner. 

 

Its not rational - but lets face it, there is very little in human relationships that IS rational. 

 

It makes sexual / asexual relationships very difficult because many seuxals really cannot be happy without sex - but that is something very difficult for asexuals to imagine - it just looks like selfishness. 

 

 

Well said. I also drift off into a mild depression when sex is to far away. I think it is important for the asexual to keep their part of the sexual contract. If the agreement is once a week, then it should be once a week, or a new agreement should be made. I really hate feeling forgotten and unloved and unwanted and hate having to remind my ace. If she is fine with once a week, then that is what I am setting my mind and body up to. I love it when she also enjoys it, but frankly I feel hurt when it isnt important for her to remember what is important to me. 

 

It does remind me of riding a bike with a flat tire. You pump it up. Knowing that there is a hole. You ride on. Gradually air comes out and you need to pump it again. If you skip your sex, then it is like riding on flattening tires. Sometimes masturbating just makes more air come out. 

[uhtred]

On 3/16/2018 at 12:05 PM, vega57 said:

snip

ETA:  I'm not trying to be obtuse here.  I'm TRYING to understand.  So much of what sexuals say is hypocritical and contradictory, and I'm HOPING that you can help to sort it all out.  

There are a lot of sexuals. (billions in fact).  They have different thoughts / needs / feelings. There is not one-size-fits-all way to look at how they think.  Anytime you try to get an opinion of a group of people, it will look contradictory because there are actually many different opinions within that group. 

 

Some sexuals want sex as an integrated part of love and romance.  Others just want to get off. Some actively desire to use sex to hurt / humiliate their partners- though hopefully the last are very rare. 

[Telecaster68]

34 minutes ago, uhtred said:

Some sexuals want sex as an integrated part of love and romance.  Others just want to get off

And sometimes the same person wants sex as part of an intimate relationship, and other times to get off. There are no universally applicable rules. 

[anamikanon]

On 17/03/2018 at 12:35 AM, vega57 said:

I'm TRYING to understand.  So much of what sexuals say is hypocritical and contradictory, and I'm HOPING that you can help to sort it all out.  

You sort it out the same way you sort it out when an ace is hypocritical and contradictory - with clarity or with avoiding the person. That said, it isn't really contradictory to like sex whether as intimacy with a partner or the act for itself. It is like some aces are sex neutral and some are sex repulsed and neither are hypocritical.

 

As someone on the graysexual spectrum myself, I don't really get recreational sex - sex for the sake of horny is best handled solo - fast, efficient, low maintenance, zero headaches. But then as someone who is hypersexual when in a relationship, I totally get the "WORLD IS ENDING" calamity-grade panic at the thought of never having sex with a partner. Heck, even once a week feels like the Sahara here. Sex is literally a part of daily contact to my mind. I'm not hypersexual in the sense I'd force my partner, but I can get pretty miserable if it vanishes for days on end while he is still here. On the other hand, I'm not at all fussed that it must be PIV sex. If it made my partner happy to never ever have PIV sex, I'd immediately agree as long as he'd still touch me and get me off. We don't do PIV AT ALL unless he brings it up. 

 

In the sense, it isn't hypocritical, so much as everyone being special snowflakes. We all have specifics we like or dislike or things that matter more than others. Just like aces - some are sex averse, others may even be aromantic and/or touch averse, still others don't mind, though not wanting it.

 

Many sexuals here, unlike me, would prefer PIV sex but would probably happily settle for once a week - I can't even imagine agreeing to that without a gun to my head (partner's misery would do it though - all the way down to total zero)

 

I'm in a bubbly mood, because the partner has totally delivered on "stimulating you is like giving a backrub, I don't mind at all, as often as you want" with a binge of offering over this weekend, so I am ultra-blissed. I may be less magnanimous on another day  

 

Edit: He says sex does nothing to him, but the smugness on his face sure says it does something to his ego, even if not his sex drive. lol. He may not be into sex, but he sure enjoys pampering me. He gets a proper high from it to know that he is the cause of that silly grin on my face. In the sense, he's not at all unhappy literally screwing my brains out - even if it isn't with his penis - does that make him "hypocritical" for claiming to not want sex? Lots of aces do it - to make their partners happy. So?

[vega57]

2 hours ago, Telecaster68 said:

And sometimes the same person wants sex as part of an intimate relationship, and other times to get off. There are no universally applicable rules. 

It's not so much that sexuals want sex as part of an intimate relationship.  It's how they feel and react when they don't get it.   

[Guest]

On 3/17/2018 at 5:43 AM, vega57 said:

This is something I never understood.  How can one go from "happy" to "unhappy" in such a short period of time because of the lack of sex?  I mean, if everything else in your life is going pretty well, why the extreme change in mood?  So many sexuals have described how they feel about the lack of sex as "depressed", "grumpy", "unhappy" and even "miserable" or "going crazy" or "going insane".  They could have money in the bank, and nice place to live, brand new cars, healthy family, good friends, a job that they love, even a 'wonderful' partner...and they'd STILL report being "miserable", "depressed" etc. without sex!  

 

On 3/17/2018 at 7:40 AM, vega57 said:

I DO enjoy cuddling, but I was with a partner for over 4 years who wasn't into it.  I can't say I "missed" it when it didn't happen, so I didn't feel "lonely" without it.  

 

In fact, I can honestly say that I've never felt "lonely" in my life.   

Hmmm, well if someone (someone who is different from you I mean) really loves cuddles and physical contact, and doesn't actually want to be in a relationship without those things, then I can see why suddenly not having them from their partner would be upsetting  For example, I really like being able to have conversations about aliens, conspiracies, alternative theories of evolution, energy healing, all sorts of weird stuff. I'd be happy with a partner who enjoys talking about those things, but if my partner then suddenly didn't want to talk at all anymore, I can see how I could go from happy one day to quite upset after a few days of no talking, because I'd be wondering 'do they even like me?' 'why do they want to be with me if they suddenly don't want to talk?' 'were they only pretending to be into that stuff to get with me?' and I would wonder if I even want to be in a relationship with someone like that as talking about those things is very important to me. If we live apart, I don't mind if we go for a week without talking, but when we DO talk, I'm not going to be happy if my partner literally only wants to talk about anime or something I have no interest in. I need them to be on MY wavelength, and for them to actively want to be there, or I'm just going to be bored and wonder if we should be together. So if cuddles make someone happy, and not getting them makes someone unhappy (to the extent they may even consider leaving the relationship) I can see why that would just as easily apply to sex as well. If sex with your partner makes you very happy, and it's something you actively want in a relationship... I can see why not getting could make you go to sad and frustrated quite quickly (in the same way I'd get frustrated and annoyed quite quickly if my partner only wanted to talk about anime or music or something I have no interest in, even though I might have been happy the day before when they were able to talk with me for 3 hours about something I enjoy) 

 

[anamikanon]

2 hours ago, vega57 said:

It's not so much that sexuals want sex as part of an intimate relationship.  It's how they feel and react when they don't get it.   

Like I said, "intimate" is the closest we can pleasurably get to another partner. Sexuals are able to get as close as sex. So, for a sexual, sex puts the "intimate" in an intimate relationship, even though they may enjoy other forms of closeness as well. For an ace who really likes kissing, kissing would put the "intimate" in an intimate relationship though they would enjoy going on walks together or cuddling. And so on.

 

Whatever our desired form of intimacy is, it going missing can make an intimate relationship look like it is on paper only. So, in terms of feelings it is a lot like being cheated or deprived. It is like "You got into an intimate relationship with me and now you are refusing to be intimate." It feels like a rejection. Causes hurt, anger and what not nasty stuff. For a sexual, it feels like you wanted to be sexual with us when you chose us, but now you no longer like us that much. Just like you getting into a chess practice relationship with someone who refuses to play chess with you, but your "chess buddy" is happy to watch films, go on walks, go on lunch dates, heck even cook together and what not - everything other than playing chess with you - would piss you off. Or you joining a forum expecting to discuss but discussions are not allowed.

 

It is the nature of the contract that a relationship is. Unless asexuality has been mentioned, the understanding of an intimate relationship includes sex for most people, given that most people are sexual.

 

It is not the be all and end all of a relationship, but when it comes to feeling CLOSE (=intimate) with a partner, sex matters a lot. Not getting sex feels a lot like being emotionally scammed, even when logic gets it and emotions are purring approval on other fronts. Because it feels like this awesome person, whom you like so much does not want to be close to you. They don't like you as much as you like them. Logic works about as much as feeling hungry and explaining to yourself that there is no food around. You understand there is no food. That doesn't mean you don't feel hungry and all the emotions the frustrated hunger will cause - from being furious with whoever fucked up so food is not available to feeling furious with yourself for depending on them combined with a pathetic willingness to beg or bargain for a meal.

[vega57]

3 hours ago, FictoVore. said:

For example, I really like being able to have conversations about aliens, conspiracies, alternative theories of evolution, energy healing, all sorts of weird stuff. I'd be happy with a partner who enjoys talking about those things, but if my partner then suddenly didn't want to talk at all anymore, I can see how I could go from happy one day to quite upset after a few days of no talking, because I'd be wondering 'do they even like me?' 'why do they want to be with me if they suddenly don't want to talk?' 'were they only pretending to be into that stuff to get with me?' and I would wonder if I even want to be in a relationship with someone like that as talking about those things is very important to me.

Waaaaaait a second...

 

There's a big difference between not wanting to talk about aliens et al anymore to not wanting to talk AT ALL anymore.  Plus, if almost EVERY conversation we had involved aliens, et al, I'd wonder if he thinks about anything else BUT aliens et al.  I'm pretty sure you've either been with or heard of people who seem to have a one track mind.  Every time you talk to to them, they somehow steer the conversation to their kids...or their pets...or a certain hobby that they have.  And if you asked them not to talk about it, they would have NOTHING else to talk about.  

 

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If we live apart, I don't mind if we go for a week without talking, but when we DO talk, I'm not going to be happy if my partner literally only wants to talk about anime or something I have no interest in. I need them to be on MY wavelength, and for them to actively want to be there, or I'm just going to be bored and wonder if we should be together.

 Yes!  Exactly!  If someone ONLY or MOSTLY wanted to talk about aliens et al, THAT can get boring, too!  

[vega57]

2 hours ago, anamikanon said:

Like I said, "intimate" is the closest we can pleasurably get to another partner. Sexuals are able to get as close as sex. So, for a sexual, sex puts the "intimate" in an intimate relationship, even though they may enjoy other forms of closeness as well. For an ace who really likes kissing, kissing would put the "intimate" in an intimate relationship though they would enjoy going on walks together or cuddling. And so on.

Intimate, for me, is how emotionally close I am to someone.  I've also heard (from other sexuals) that no matter how emotionally close they are to someone, having sex with that person won't bring them any closer emotionally.  So, I'm scratching my head here wondering what's going on.

 

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Whatever our desired form of intimacy is, it going missing can make an intimate relationship look like it is on paper only. So, in terms of feelings it is a lot like being cheated or deprived. It is like "You got into an intimate relationship with me and now you are refusing to be intimate." It feels like a rejection. Causes hurt, anger and what not nasty stuff. For a sexual, it feels like you wanted to be sexual with us when you chose us, but now you no longer like us that much.

How does one get from not liking sex to not liking the rest of you?  I mean, just because I don't want to eat dessert doesn't mean I don't want to eat at all!  But then, sexuals seem to treat dessert like it's the entire meal.  And, if you can't have dessert, you don't want to eat at all.  Sexuals will often say that sex is a small "but important" part of a relationship.  Then why are they so willing to throw away the entire relationship if they're not getting that small "but important" part?  When a sexual does that, it seems like the entire relationship was based on sex.   

 

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It is the nature of the contract that a relationship is. Unless asexuality has been mentioned, the understanding of an intimate relationship includes sex for most people, given that most people are sexual.

Once again, the 'nature' of the 'contract' doesn't specify how often and what kind.  This is why sexuals have issues between themselves.  And it's the lower-drive person who's often faulted.  

 

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It is not the be all and end all of a relationship, but when it comes to feeling CLOSE (=intimate) with a partner, sex matters a lot.

 

 

 

Really?  Then why do so many relationships end because of it?  I've heard many sexuals say this, but then they act like it is the be all and end all of it.  

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Not getting sex feels a lot like being emotionally scammed, even when logic gets it and emotions are purring approval on other fronts. Because it feels like this awesome person, whom you like so much does not want to be close to you. They don't like you as much as you like them. 

 

 

What if it was you who couldn't have sex anymore.  Does that mean that you don't like them as much as they like you?      

[Guest]

...I didn't say 'only aliens', that's a bit of a strawman @vega57 :/

 

To clarify, I (quite clearly) meant I want someone who is interested in talking about the same things as I am (one of which is aliens). If we often have wonderful, in-depth, intense conversations about the types of things I am passionate about, I'll be happy. If then they suddenly don't seem interested in any of those things and want instead only to talk about anime or music, I'll be disappointed and feel like I was possible even 'tricked' into the relationship by them pretending to be interested in talking about the same types of things that I am interested in. Second clarification: I ONLY want to be in a relationship with someone interested in the same things as I am, or I won't be satisfied. So while aliens may sound boring as hell to you, that's a good reason for us not to get into a relationship together  But aliens were only one of the things I mentioned in my fields of conversational interest. I'm just saying, I would be very happy if my partner and I could have discussions that are interesting and thought-provoking. I would be unhappy and frustrated quite quickly (it would only take a few days) if my partner suddenly showed a total lack of interest in having any meaningful conversations with me. So if someone enjoys sex as much as I enjoy yabbering, then they have just as much reason to be unhappy quite quickly if their partner suddenly seems quite uninterested in sex

 

 

[Guest]

4 hours ago, vega57 said:

I've also heard (from other sexuals) that no matter how emotionally close they are to someone, having sex with that person won't bring them any closer emotionally.

Some other sexuals though feel closer intimately to their partner through sex than they do through any other means of intimacy. It totally depends on the individual. Like how some people are deeply depressed and miserable if they have no friends, whereas I feel almost physical repulsion at the idea of friends. Different strokes for different folks

[anamikanon]

3 hours ago, vega57 said:

What if it was you who couldn't have sex anymore.  Does that mean that you don't like them as much as they like you?      

Well, I suppose, if I lost my sex drive, with an ace partner, I should count myself lucky.

 

This is a hard question to answer without sounding like I am contradicting myself. If I couldn't have sex anymore, and I didn't feel a need to have sex (as opposed to want but can't) losing sex would not have much of an impact on the relationship. Would be how an ace sees the absence. In the absence of a "want", the can't is not a problem. But if I wanted and couldn't, the longer we went without, the feeling of lack would grow. The relationship would become lacklustre and discontented. An easy (and non-traumatic) close example I can think of is how pregnancy can torpedo the sex life of people - a lot of cultures think this is harmful or men suddenly start seeing her as more of a mother figure than a sexual partner. Or whose doctors recommend against it for health reasons (a history of miscarriages can be one). Or the woman feels to nauseated and under the weather to want sex, but the man is horny and frustrated.

 

The desire for sex can still be there, indeed enhanced due to the emotional closeness of having created a child together or the rampaging hormones (pregnancy can be one crazy time), but being denied sex can make both the woman and her partner extremely moody and irritable depending on who or both feel irritated.

 

Doctors too explicitly allow sex for healthy women to avoid this ignorance related frustration when the woman is healthy. After childbirth hormones, stress, time availability can kill the sex.

 

Does that reduce the love between a couple? You could probably google for the number of couples whose relationship collapses after the stress of a child - basically meaning no longer having time to "do things together" read sex - most of the stories will explicitly mention sex vanishing altogether. This is how there are so many single parents of young kids - they loved each other enough to want to make a child together - psychologically, it is a major commitment and then they didn't love each other enough that the marriage collapsed. Many other marriages may not end in separation or divorce, but the couple noticeably goes from "into each other" to "bringing up kids together" - affection can drop visibly. If sex didn't matter, the emotional high of sharing an adorable child would cement the relationship like few other things can. And it does - if they can find middle ground on sex. But it matters, and this prime time of sexual incompatibility can be one major storm in a marriage.

[vega57]

3 hours ago, FictoVore. said:

...I didn't say 'only aliens', that's a bit of a strawman @vega57 :/

 

To clarify, I (quite clearly) meant I want someone who is interested in talking about the same things as I am (one of which is aliens). If we often have wonderful, in-depth, intense conversations about the types of things I am passionate about, I'll be happy. If then they suddenly don't seem interested in any of those things and want instead only to talk about anime or music, I'll be disappointed and feel like I was possible even 'tricked' into the relationship by them pretending to be interested in talking about the same types of things that I am interested in. Second clarification: I ONLY want to be in a relationship with someone interested in the same things as I am, or I won't be satisfied. So while aliens may sound boring as hell to you, that's a good reason for us not to get into a relationship together  But aliens were only one of the things I mentioned in my fields of conversational interest. I'm just saying, I would be very happy if my partner and I could have discussions that are interesting and thought-provoking. I would be unhappy and frustrated quite quickly (it would only take a few days) if my partner suddenly showed a total lack of interest in having any meaningful conversations with me. So if someone enjoys sex as much as I enjoy yabbering, then they have just as much reason to be unhappy quite quickly if their partner suddenly seems quite uninterested in sex

But does being unhappy talking about aliens mean being unhappy talking period?  

[anamikanon]

What I am trying to say is that sex makes a relationship vibrant in ways that are hard to describe. A couple with a "happening" sex life can often be visibly noticed from their being completely in sync and in each other's trust zones solidly on unrelated and even public matters and even while in disagreement on something else. It is a powerful sense of "belonging"? If you have not felt it, you don't miss it, but if you have felt it, you will measure the closeness of every relationship against it. This is also why a partner is generally considered much more close to us than a close friend - even when you have "no secrets" from the friend who accepts you as you are and knows you in and out and you love each other to bits. Your partner occupies a zone that goes beyond all that if you are sharing a vibrant sexual relationship. I mean, think of it like this, you are so close to each other that you are routinely touching parts others don't even get to see AND that exclusive intimate it brings pleasure to both.

 

My ace, in come ways is lucky enough to get it in an indirect manner. He doesn't enjoy sex, but he finds great intimate pleasure in bringing me pleasure as only he can. And it does make our relationship very solid and affectionate and parked in each other's trust zones - for BOTH of us - as opposed to the strained grumpiness when we aren't having sex. And this happens from the closeness, even when he is not able to feel sexual desire at all, and sex does not actually give him any kind of a sense of fulfillment on its own. But sharing it with me still brings a deep sense of acceptance for him too. To the point where he has often wished that he could "experience the full deal and feel everythingI that could be felt from it".