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A question for asexuals


anamikanon

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2 minutes ago, anamikanon said:

speak with exactly 8 people on a daily basis. 3 family, 2 employees, 3 shopkeepers

Wait, do you mean this is extroverted or introverted for you? :o (and we're not including AVEN or our partners, I assume?)

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@FictoVore. you are actually making my point. The partner doing what I need is what is pure gold, not what they need. Your partner needed you to orgasm. You didn't. See what I'm saying here? You didn't want to get off, they were trying to make you do it. Yuck. I WANT to get off, he will patiently and lovingly do what I need to get there. Jackpot!

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8 minutes ago, FictoVore. said:

I'm actually incapable of experiencing the emotion of loneliness (as is he) so we might be slightly different than others because of that?

I am jealous of this, I have to say. :lol:

 

It's less now, but fresh out of my marriage, sleeping in my bed by myself in my apartment by myself, having to do everything by myself, was pretty bleak.

 

I regret none of it and would change absolutely nothing, though, because as painful as it has been, it has also been outrageously empowering. I've known for a while I can take care of myself, but given that I had been in that relationship since I was 15, it's nice to prove to myself that I meant it when I said it. :lol:

 

8 minutes ago, anamikanon said:

I leave "introvert" in the dust when I say I am asocial. I speak with exactly 8 people on a daily basis.

That is about 5 people more than I do on an average day, coworkers, students, and family included - and I am an extroverted introvert. :lol:

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2 minutes ago, FictoVore. said:

Wait, do you mean this is extroverted or introverted for you? :o (and we're not including AVEN or our partners, I assume?)

This is normal - whether extrovert or introvert. I converse only with my partner. i transact with the others (kid doesn't speak).

 

can talk to people, but I don't like to. Many reasons. Mostly intellectual.

 

My asocial nature doesn't kick in about online conversations - I am actually quite vocal online. But again, that is less interaction (other than spaces like this) and more simply saying what I wish to whoever wants to hear. It is completely on my terms and I can engage or not as I wish.

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Just now, anamikanon said:

@FictoVore. you are actually making my point. The partner doing what I need is what is pure gold, not what they need. Your partner needed you to orgasm. You didn't. See what I'm saying here? You didn't want to get off, they were trying to make you do it. Yuck. I WANT to get off, he will patiently and lovingly do what I need to get there. Jackpot!

Hah but, for example, me and your partner would be UTTERLY incompatible because imagine if he was with me.. he'd be literally a mess in the corner if he hadn't managed to escape already.. there'd probably be a man-shaped hole in the wall because he ran out so fast he missed the door :P While it's definitely good to have someone who can do 'exactly what you want', that comes in all sorts of different shapes and sizes, was more the point I was making. But yeah, because of the 'aceness' aspect of my partner, I definitely have a better sex life than I would with any regular sexual person. Obviously my partner *isn't* ace (or he couldn't enjoy any of the stuff I want) but that 'aceness' aspect of not really having his own needs is definitely what makes this work!

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13 minutes ago, FictoVore. said:

So yeah I can totally see why what you said would be amazing for some women, but I love making HIM cum, as many times as possible, when *I* want, and that's what gets me off most :P It's a catch 22 for me though because I can't enjoy any of that (or even want it) unless he is 100% happy to NOT have sex with me, ever (and when I met him, he was identifying ace and had never even considered actually wanting sex with someone else, lol).

Must read this out to my partner. I suspect he may recognize this. At least I clearly see him take considerable joy in getting me off and leaving me totally limp without being even aroused. It used to feel damn creepy initially, but I've started realizing it is what it is.

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1 hour ago, Chimeric said:

That is about 5 people more than I do on an average day, coworkers, students, and family included - and I am an extroverted introvert. :lol:

That's what I was thinking, haha! I literally will go weeks without talking to anyone (other than blabbing on AVEN when I'm trying to get my point across, I can't handle PMs too well though, as soon as it's personal I fall apart a bit). The last family member I spoke to was my dad, er, a week ago? On the phone. and I intentionally do not have friends specifically so I can avoid having to talk to anyone other than my dad, and he only rings me every now and then. My mum forces herself upon my life sometimes but I've decided I can't let that happen anymore so have been actively ignoring all her messages etc for a while now, until she gets the message I just don't have the emotional energy for her. Even my partner and I haven't spoken on call in.. hmmm... 4 days now? and it was over a week we went without talking before that. Please, the less people talking at me the better :lol:

 

1 hour ago, anamikanon said:

This is normal

oooh okay, i thought you were saying you were super asocial because you only talk to 6 people a day and I was like ''SIX?!'' (EDIT, I just re-read your original comment and you actually said 8, haha, fail, but EIGHT?! how do you not explode?) which is more than I talk to in a month, haha! Again, I'm quite extreme though. Don't experience platonic emotions or anything like that, so never had a draw to have friends or anything.

 

1 hour ago, anamikanon said:

My asocial nature doesn't kick in about online conversations

Yeah same for me, as long as it's not private. It's so weird because I actively enjoy talking with some people in forums/online, like Chimera for example, but it's soooooo hard maintaining private convos with anyone and I just end up seeming really rude because I ignore so many people. It's like a physical force that stops me being able to even open my inbox, let alone start a response to someone. I have no idea whyyyyyyyyyyy I'm like this but I've just learned to accept it instead of fighting it, when I tried to 'be normal' I ended up having to drink 24/7 to deal with the constant burn-out, not cool!

 

1 hour ago, Chimeric said:

It's less now, but fresh out of my marriage, sleeping in my bed by myself in my apartment by myself, having to do everything by myself, was pretty bleak.

 

I regret none of it and would change absolutely nothing, though, because as painful as it has been, it has also been outrageously empowering. I've known for a while I can take care of myself, but given that I had been in that relationship since I was 15, it's nice to prove to myself that I meant it when I said it. :lol:

yeah I can see how difficult it would be if you'd been in relationships all that time, probably having come straight from living with your parents, being 'alone' would be such an alien concept :o Whereas I'm the opposite and wanted to get away from my family so badly that as soon as I was old enough (like, 17) I went straight to living on the streets. No money, no idea how to get a flat or anything, but none of that mattered because I was on my own. I slowly built up my skills for how to find a job, how to rent a house etc, but started off from scratch sleeping on riverbanks and in abandoned buildings etc. Was still happier like that than I ever was having to live with other people! I always felt safer relying solely on myself and my own survival skills. Having kids is scary because I can't just dump everything and crash in the woods or wander off into a cave or whatever like I once would have, I have a responsibility now to hold down a house, a job (though I'd only ever work from home), keep food on the table etc. Having kids has been the biggest learning experience for me, because suddenly there are people around me with needs that literally MUST be met, no matter what. Whereas my own needs were just never a 'thing'. It's a super weird experience going from what I was to what I am now, but like you said, it's pretty empowering learning these kinds of skills! My ex was kind of an in between stage because I was still utterly on my own with him, even though I had to share a house with him (and his other girlfriend for a time). I could never have relied on him for anything though, so I was still on my own, just living with someone who expected sex from me and pushed me into some pretty nasty work. It's all a learning experience though and I wouldn't change anything. I wouldn't be who and what I am now without all that in my past :)

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1 hour ago, FictoVore. said:

i thought you were saying you were super asocial because you only talk to 6 people a day and I was like ''SIX?!'' (EDIT, I just re-read your original comment and you actually said 8, haha, fail, but EIGHT?! how do you not explode?) which is more than I talk to in a month, haha! 

Wow. I'm amazed. 8 is my minimum. The 2 employees need to be told if there is anything specific to do, mom won't leave me alone and the three shopkeepers... well, if I want smokes, groceries... I have to ask for them, right?

 

My ace is with me all the time unless traveling for work.

 

There are actually additional people that pop up, but aren't a daily thing. Courier delivery, restaurant food delivery, occasional meetings with people for work/friends - like once a month.

 

Most people find that super asocial. I can finally tell them what real asocial people are like and tell them to stop making too much drama. At least I interact with some :D

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8 minutes ago, anamikanon said:

Most people find that super asocial. I can finally tell them what real asocial people are like and tell them to stop making too much drama. At least I interact with some

Haha, do you mean they find the fact that you only talk to 8 people a day asocial, or the fact that you don't really like it? (Only because 8 seems like a lot, even for an extrovert it seems like a lot!!! but I can understand why they'd think it's asocial if you'd rather not talk to any of those 8 people, lol)

 

8 minutes ago, anamikanon said:

The 2 employees need to be told if there is anything specific to do, mom generally likes to irritate me and the three shopkeepers... well, if I want smokes, groceries... I have to ask for them, right?

 I don't really include shop keepers, employees etc as social contact because that's a necessity, not something you'd get lonely without or whatever, but I don't even talk to them thankfully as I employ only myself and do all my groceries online and they get delivered to my door. I just wait for the delivery person to knock then sneak out and get my groceries after they've left (they always just leave them on the doorstep because I make a point to add a reminder that says ''If I don't answer the door just leave the food on the doorstep'') :lol:

 

taking away the employees, your mum, and shop keepers, do you enjoy interacting with the other people that are left or would you rather not if given the choice? (I'm just asking because it seems so awful to me having so many people forced on you like that!!) :o

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1 hour ago, Chimeric said:

That is about 5 people more than I do on an average day, coworkers, students, and family included - and I am an extroverted introvert. :lol:

I have two dependents I need help with. I run the home, so getting supplies is my responsibility. It is what it is. Though I admit dumping the extras is sounding tempting :D

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4 minutes ago, FictoVore. said:

taking away the employees, your mum, and shop keepers, do you enjoy interacting with the other people that are left or would you rather not if given the choice? (I'm just asking because it seems so awful to me having so many people forced on you like that!!) :o

Taking away the employees, mom and shopkeepers, it is just partner and kid left. I adore both to bits :D

 

I think I should stop describing it like that. Shopkeepers arent' social contact. True. Also I don't go to the shops daily and depending on what is needed there can be other shops. Point is, other than partner and kid, I don't really prefer to interact with anyone, though of course I can. It doesn't traumatize me or anything. I just don't like it. I tend to be very attentive to conversations and such (you can see from the detail I add to the partner's POV or general observations on human interactions) - absorbing that kind of input all the time can get exhausting and it is useless unless there is a reason. Besides, I have better things to do.

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Just now, anamikanon said:

Taking away the employees, mom and shopkeepers, it is just partner and kid left. I adore both to bits :D

Hah yeah I have two kids who I obviously spend a lot of time with but I don't count them as 'social time' if that makes sense, because they're something I don't have a choice about, I MUST interact with them and care for them. But they would count as two people if I had to include them :P I look at socializing more as the people you'd choose to spend time with if you had a choice, so like friends and meeting people at the pub etc. For me that's 0 and that's the way I need it to be to maintain any level of sanity! My partner and I have a very strong and healthy relationship, and also a lot of intimacy even though it's only through words, but we have no need to be in each other's physical vicinity to make it work. Different strokes for different folks! ^_^ 

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5 minutes ago, FictoVore. said:

I look at socializing more as the people you'd choose to spend time with if you had a choice, so like friends and meeting people at the pub etc. 

Zero for me too. I am asocial. Why in the world would I deliberately go to meet people? I don't. In fact, even necessary meetings, I generally avoid unless I can't.

 

Wait. It is 1. My partner is also family. I do enjoy spending time with him and choose to do things with him and such. Though "socializing" is a strange term to use for a family member. I was simply listing people I interact with at all.

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22 hours ago, Telecaster68 said:

It's completely appropriate and every time I mention it I say so. It's slightly annoying that it routinely gets brushed over, to the extent of being accused of wanting marital rape legalised. But it's logically, unavoidably the case that in gatekeeping your own body, you're gatekeeping sex within the relationship.

I've never accused you of such, so it's slightly annoying that you mention it in a reply to my post.   And of course there's gatekeeping within the relationship; sexuals gatekeep with their desire for sex which most asexuals do pay attention to (as in try to comply with what the sexual wants).  I certainly did for decades, and most other sexuals I've read (over a longer period than you've been on AVEN, Tele) have attempted to do, also.   Every time we have sex with our partner is a time when we really didn't want to, but did so because of our paying attention.   Those other times when we just couldn't do so were not times when we merrily went on our way thinking everything was hunky-dory.   It's more than slightly annoying to hear that from you and some other sexuals.  

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4 minutes ago, Sally said:

I've never accused you of such, so it's slightly annoying that you mention it in a reply to my post.   And of course there's gatekeeping within the relationship; sexuals gatekeep with their desire for sex which most asexuals do pay attention to (as in try to comply with what the sexual wants).  I certainly did for decades, and most other asexuals I've read (over a longer period than you've been on AVEN, Tele) have attempted to do, also.   Every time we have sex with our partner is a time when we really didn't want to, but did so because of our paying attention.   Those other times when we just couldn't do so were not times when we merrily went on our way thinking everything was hunky-dory.   It's more than slightly annoying to hear that from you and some other sexuals.  

Yeah I tried to explain that in this thread (for days) but it didn't seem to get through :/ Apparently no matter how much sex the asexual gives (even if it's every or almost every time their partner wants sex) in the hopes of keeping their partner happy, it's still the asexuals who gatekeep the sex in their relationships with sexuals. Every time. Without exception. Even if the ace gives sex they don't want for decades. *sigh*

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2 hours ago, Chimeric said:

When I said "decided no sex," what I meant was "your partner was suffering due to the sex and eventually worked up the gall to tell you they really are strongly averse to sex, despite attempting to appease you," as is often the case for asexual-sexual couples.

If I was that oblivious to his comfort that he had to work up the gall to tell me something as simple as him not enjoying it and therefore not to do it, frankly, I wouldn't trust myself to not hurt him, so the sex side of things would be over. The relationship would continue or not depending on whether he was willing to forgive me. I understand that you say they would have willingly tried, but at least I can sense reluctance in him. Damn right I would spot aversion before he had to find courage and voice it. So if I chose to ignore it over and over till we reached this point, I would consider myself guilty even if he didn't. Guilty of being a terrible lover, if nothing else, but frankly, more guilty of not caring enough for him. I'd have breached the basic agreement of our relationship - that we could care for the well being of the other.

 

I know the restraint of sexuals is considered somewhat overrated here, but I can confidently say that we have not been intimate without there being pleasure in it for both. Emotional and other kinds of pleasure for him if not sexual. I would be devastated to know he had to work up courage to say something like this, when something as small as him hesitating or withdrawing in the slightest is respected.

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honestly, probably not. if sex is their necessary form of intimacy, and i'm agreeing to do that with them (even though i have absolutely no interest in it myself), then i'd expect them to make similar accommodations for me. if they're not willing to do that, the likelihood of me having them as a sexual partner is pretty much zero.

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23 hours ago, FictoVore. said:

I don't know anything about gaogao (or even what their sexual orientation is)

Hello! I'm an asexual person in a lesbian relationship - hence I call myself an asexual lesbian. My partner knew before we got together that I was asexual but neither of us were hugely clear with what we wanted (or didn't want) sexually at the start of the relationship.

 

To a certain extent I did feel pressure to be sexual for my partner at first but now I know what it means to her and I'm trying to understand her needs, just as she's trying to understand mine.

 

Atm ... She knows it's not something I really want or have drive to do but she accepts that and makes do with what I can offer her - which is scheduled pre-agreed sex which I remind myself to initiate. 

 

Is this confusing? 

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My partner is very uninterested in any kind of physical contact.  We don't kiss or snuggle at all anymore and all of my tears and hurt feelings will not change her lack of interest.  Tomorrow is our anniversary and celebrating isn't on my mind.  Wondering how I'm supposed to look down the barrel of the rest of my life with no intimacy is hard enough.  But when simple affection isn't available either that future just looks bleak.  I have no desire to leave her but I'm beyond tired of being someone's roommate.  Starting over is a bleak view but I'm almost ready to face that rather than this feeling.  I'm just sad

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On 3/11/2018 at 8:06 AM, gaogao said:

Hello! I'm an asexual person in a lesbian relationship - hence I call myself an asexual lesbian. My partner knew before we got together that I was asexual but neither of us were hugely clear with what we wanted (or didn't want) sexually at the start of the relationship.

 

To a certain extent I did feel pressure to be sexual for my partner at first but now I know what it means to her and I'm trying to understand her needs, just as she's trying to understand mine.

 

Atm ... She knows it's not something I really want or have drive to do but she accepts that and makes do with what I can offer her - which is scheduled pre-agreed sex which I remind myself to initiate. 

 

Is this confusing? 

Sorry, I missed this!!

 

 I always wished I could experience romantic attraction to women because that would have made everything in my life easier - even when I was 'most' asexual I could still easily have sex with women. I never got pleasure out of it, but not having to have things stick inside you makes sex sooo much easier and less painful, and less complicated too. I can understand what you're saying because for me, it would be the same.. it would be much easier to have sex with a woman on schedule or when she wanted (as long as she didn't want to give me oral or expect me to orgasm) no matter how asexual I was. Alas, I am not romantically attracted to women in any way (even though I find them much more physically attractive than men and find sex with women a lot easier *sigh*) but yeah, I can see what you're saying, definitely not confusing :) Thanks for replying to me (even though I totally missed your response for ages, haha)

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On 3/14/2018 at 6:36 AM, RAZS said:

My partner is very uninterested in any kind of physical contact.  We don't kiss or snuggle at all anymore and all of my tears and hurt feelings will not change her lack of interest.  Tomorrow is our anniversary and celebrating isn't on my mind.  Wondering how I'm supposed to look down the barrel of the rest of my life with no intimacy is hard enough.  But when simple affection isn't available either that future just looks bleak.  I have no desire to leave her but I'm beyond tired of being someone's roommate.  Starting over is a bleak view but I'm almost ready to face that rather than this feeling.  I'm just sad

If you're at that point it does sound like leaving would be better for both of you, even if it seems like a lot of effort to break up. No one wants to face misery for the rest of their life, and it can't be nice for your partner either knowing how unhappy you are but not being able to give the kind of intimacy you need :o Maybe if you broke up you could remain friends? :cake:

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6 hours ago, FictoVore. said:

Sorry, I missed this!!

 

 I always wished I could experience romantic attraction to women because that would have made everything in my life easier - even when I was 'most' asexual I could still easily have sex with women. I never got pleasure out of it, but not having to have things stick inside you makes sex sooo much easier and less painful, and less complicated too. I can understand what you're saying because for me, it would be the same.. it would be much easier to have sex with a woman on schedule or when she wanted (as long as she didn't want to give me oral or expect me to orgasm) no matter how asexual I was. Alas, I am not romantically attracted to women in any way (even though I find them much more physically attractive than men and find sex with women a lot easier *sigh*) but yeah, I can see what you're saying, definitely not confusing :) Thanks for replying to me (even though I totally missed your response for ages, haha)

eheh it's ok. 

 

Honestly I don't know if it's easier? ;; but to be fair being in a sexual relationship of any kind was always going to be hard for me... With a girl I found it hard because I had to do something to make my partner orgasm -- at first I was super super uncomfortable with taking any kind of active role in sex because it does not do ANYTHING for me and just makes me uncomfortable and uncertain... like "wtf am I doing? how can this feel good?" -- but once I learned what it means to her and tried to understand, it was definitely easier.

 

The irony is that at first I actually thought it'd be easier with a guy because I thought I could have just starfished and gotten it over with when he wanted, but now I realise that it'd have been crap and painful >_> anyway, I find it hard to trust guys and I'm actually glad that I've never really been attracted to any of them lol

 

The most difficult thing is my family + homophobia but that's a different story /shrug

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 3/8/2018 at 8:49 AM, GLRDT said:

This wuz me!

Same.  While it would be wrong (or at least misguided) for me to enter into a new relationship with a sexual now without disclosing my status, I didn’t know my status until nearly 15 years into my marriage.  I can certain see how it could feel like a bait-and-switch but I had no idea at the time.

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8 hours ago, ryn2 said:

Same.  While it would be wrong (or at least misguided) for me to enter into a new relationship with a sexual now without disclosing my status, I didn’t know my status until nearly 15 years into my marriage.  I can certain see how it could feel like a bait-and-switch but I had no idea at the time.

Yeah same. I didn't know anything about asexuality the whole time I was with my sexual ex (5 years) ..I knew I didn't like or want sex but assumed it was sort of normal to feel that way then I started figuring it must just be something wrong with me specifically but that there would be no one else like me :o It wasn't until two years after I left him that I learned about asexuality, in 2013!

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On 1/3/2018 at 12:37 PM, Telecaster68 said:

Yes, I know. That's my point, and what I explicitly said. You, Serran, and Vega57 cite your past partners as continually trying it on. It's clear other asexual posters compromise too, and I have acknowledged that in my posts. By the same token, plenty of sexual posters on AVEN (most, in fact), aren't like the past partners you, Serran and Vega57 quote, as you say yourself. Being tarred with that brush is hurtful too.

 

My blanket statement isn't about all sexuals. It's about the nature of all sexual relationships, and short of rape, the partner who says 'no' simply does have the power to prevent the other partner having sex. Always. That is gatekeeping. Similarly with any kind of physical affection.

 

I agree - but asexual partners who say no aren't 'giving sex', so logically, they're not pain from it. They might feel distressed because they're saying no, but they're not in pain from not saying no. They're in pain because they've exercised their agency, at the expense of their partner's agency, and recognise the pain their decision has caused.

 

I completely agree with the statement of @Telecaster68! In a normal, average relationship, there is a mutual understanding that ‘stop’ and ‘no’ means that the action will not take place. It requires two accepting individuals. If one says ‘no’, it will not happen until two agrees that it is okay. This is ‘gatekeeping’. 

The next aspect is how things evolve from the ‘no’. I think, most sexuals would try to persuade their partner, have another go at getting a ‘yes’ or perhaps just be a bit irritated. Perhaps a lot irritated, which could lead to being sad, hurt, depressed, stressed, rejected, feeling lonely...

The asexual can also feel irritated, stressed, sad... but the sex is off untill both agrees to put it on.

 

To the OP: I understand how the hug and cuddle and kissing can be hard to not get if you want intimacy/connection like this. I have for years, 15+, used this as a nice way to be with my spouse and while in the ‘hug’ also trying to feel if she perhaps was up for sex later. Turned out to be a wrong thing to do with this perticular asexual.  Today I limit my hugs and kisses and only expect things to happen on our scheduled, pre-agreed dates. 

 

 

 

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6 hours ago, FictoVore. said:

Yeah same. I didn't know anything about asexuality the whole time I was with my sexual ex (5 years) ..I knew I didn't like or want sex but assumed it was sort of normal to feel that way then I started figuring it must just be something wrong with me specifically but that there would be no one else like me :o It wasn't until two years after I left him that I learned about asexuality, in 2013!

That’s what I thought (along with “maybe I haven’t found the right person” and “maybe he’s just bad at this”) with all my prior partners.

 

With my current SO - who has significant ED - I stupidly thought we were both happier without the stress of trying.  Wrong!

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  • 1 year later...

Cuddling on their terms?

Yes, I was raised to ask anyway.

 

Cuddling practically never? 

No.

 

I don't need very long, just a little contact on occasion, you wouldn't even have to like it 😆. I would be happy to negotiate what kind of contact was okay and how often. I don't like people surprising me with contact. However, my hormones kick in during my period and I glue myself to someone's side. Lying next to each other with minimal contact would be sufficient. 

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