had a great "partner"

[frednsa]

so here I sit after a half-century of marriage to a "great" partner.  sexless as a stone but viewed as so "warm" by those not craving intimacy with her.

I'm dying but healthy at the moment and so resentful and angry over so much time in this marriage hoping that something will change.  50+ years, huh ?

 

insane, maybe.............but the awareness that the window is closing and there's virtually no hope of change.  i guess if it hadn't been for my prior (60 years ago) relationship in school being with such a sexual girl, i wouldn't know better.  got sucked in by my wife's wonderful (out-of-bed) personality and family and believed her statements that after our pre-marriage celibacy imposed by her (remember asexuality was unknown by me) that she would really warm up after marriage.  if she believed this she was a fool.  But no more a fool than me for staying past the wedding night !

OK, Pity pot stored again - hope everyone has a nice day.............

[Cobie]

35 minutes ago, frednsa said:

... I'm dying but healthy at the moment and so resentful and angry over so much time in this marriage hoping that something will change.  50+ years, huh ?

Maybe more a topic for Tea and Sympathy? I see no question to be answered. 🤔

 

As I see it, nothing will ever change unless you make a change, i.e. you leave her. Life is finite, and all too soon now, you will be physically dying. 🍀

[Traveler40]

Frednsa,

 

You are more than welcome to vent any time in the sexual section of this site as that’s why it’s here - IN SUPPORT of sexuals in relationships with asexuals.

 

With that said, your situation is exactly my fear.  It was neither easy nor clearcut for you.  It’s that way for many of us, thus we look for answers, alternatives and thought share. 

 

Now, as you look back, you lament.  What do you want to do about it?  Your life isn’t over yet, and it sounds like you have a great partner in wonderful ways that matter.  Sexually, there are options of course.  

 

As we age, I wonder if the bitterness ends up being about the lack of a partner who is sexual, or that nothing was done about it?  To me, it’s a trade off: I fully understand and accept my husband at this time, and I choose my family.  I am making conscious, aware decisions and opt to work with and around my husband’s asexuality in honesty. My husband is worth it and so is my family. It sounds like that was the case for you as well, correct? 

 

I feel for you and understand your predicament.  Leaving is not at issue, however, Thea’s last point is relevant as well.  I wonder if you’ve thrown in the towel sexually or if you realize there’s still time? There is - It’s not over until “the fat lady sings”.

[banoffeepie]

You must have known things were unlikely to change after .... 20 years?    surely.

Maybe you chose to stick with it because she's been wonderful for you in every other way.  Maybe not, I don't know, you haven't said why you really stayed.

 

I'm sure that to be together for 50 years there must have been some reason other than ... I was waiting for her to get turned on.

 

As the only good words you have to say about her are in quote marks, it seems like you have real bitterness boiling up inside you now. I'm sorry that's how it's making you feel. that's a horrible feeling and a great shame. It seems like you should talk or leave pretty quickly. Before you become worse.

My ex left after 23 years, and she was pretty bitter towards me by the time she talked to me about it.

Now she's tried to start new relationships but they've been failing and now she still has no sex ... and she's lost her best friend. So it's something you've got to think really carefully about I guess. I you choose to stay and live a sexless life... don't be bitter about it. Celebrate what you have together.

 

Good luck.

[soda59]

On 2/23/2018 at 11:23 AM, banoffeepie said:

You must have known things were unlikely to change after .... 20 years?    surely.

Maybe you chose to stick with it because she's been wonderful for you in every other way.  Maybe not, I don't know, you haven't said why you really stayed.

 

I'm sure that to be together for 50 years there must have been some reason other than ... I was waiting for her to get turned on.

 

As the only good words you have to say about her are in quote marks, it seems like you have real bitterness boiling up inside you now. I'm sorry that's how it's making you feel. that's a horrible feeling and a great shame. It seems like you should talk or leave pretty quickly. Before you become worse.

My ex left after 23 years, and she was pretty bitter towards me by the time she talked to me about it.

Now she's tried to start new relationships but they've been failing and now she still has no sex ... and she's lost her best friend. So it's something you've got to think really carefully about I guess. I you choose to stay and live a sexless life... don't be bitter about it. Celebrate what you have together.

 

Good luck.

It may be regret from being older and looking back ,thinking about all the sex he could have had, but is 'too old' to now. I felt similar to OP , but towards a profession choice. I love what I am doing, but have to make so many sacrifices I think about everything I missed out on ...and wonder if it was right  choice after all. Maybe they have hit a low point in the marriage, who knows?  It doesn't even necessarily seem aimed at the wife, but more so 'what could my life have been' which is pretty common.

[James121]

Sounds like a great partner.....who had zero interest in what was important to you.

 

Any children?

[anamikanon]

On 23/02/2018 at 6:31 PM, frednsa said:

so here I sit after a half-century of marriage to a "great" partner.  sexless as a stone but viewed as so "warm" by those not craving intimacy with her.

I'm dying but healthy at the moment and so resentful and angry over so much time in this marriage hoping that something will change.  50+ years, huh ?

 

insane, maybe.............but the awareness that the window is closing and there's virtually no hope of change.  i guess if it hadn't been for my prior (60 years ago) relationship in school being with such a sexual girl, i wouldn't know better.  got sucked in by my wife's wonderful (out-of-bed) personality and family and believed her statements that after our pre-marriage celibacy imposed by her (remember asexuality was unknown by me) that she would really warm up after marriage.  if she believed this she was a fool.  But no more a fool than me for staying past the wedding night !

OK, Pity pot stored again - hope everyone has a nice day.............

You don't seem to like her Pity you spent 50 years with her. 50 years worth resentment is a lot of bitterness to add to your life. For something she can't help. If it mattered to you, you should have acted or come to terms with it. For that matter, you can still act or come to terms with it before it is too late for your sex drive or too late to appreciate her for what she is rather than grudge her for what she isn't.

[anamikanon]

My father spent most of my life talking my mother down for her inadequacies and wishing her ill. She has psychiatric problems, is rather simple minded and often irritating, but never malicious. He spent the last year of his life bed ridden and she cared for him around the clock, when all the people he spoke well of and held in high esteem never so much as bothered to enquire after his well being. He saw what she did for him when he was helpless, but he neither had the vocabulary to appreciate her from a long habit of only speaking ill and nor was he able to speak for long and finally he died. She sat with him, giving him courage as he breathed his last.

 

For some reason I was reminded of them as a couple when I read your post. I pondered whether to post about it, and finally did. It is among my big life fears. That I will fail to appreciate what matters if blinded by grudges over what is missing.

 

This is not at all to say you ill treat your wife as my father did his, but to simply note that you didn't seem to say a single good thing about someone you stayed with for 50 years other than to describe good qualities others saw in her that you didn't experience.

[frednsa]

On 2/25/2018 at 12:03 PM, anamikanon said:

My father spent most of my life talking my mother down for her inadequacies and wishing her ill. She has psychiatric problems, is rather simple minded and often irritating, but never malicious. He spent the last year of his life bed ridden and she cared for him around the clock, when all the people he spoke well of and held in high esteem never so much as bothered to enquire after his well being. He saw what she did for him when he was helpless, but he neither had the vocabulary to appreciate her from a long habit of only speaking ill and nor was he able to speak for long and finally he died. She sat with him, giving him courage as he breathed his last.

 

For some reason I was reminded of them as a couple when I read your post. I pondered whether to post about it, and finally did. It is among my big life fears. That I will fail to appreciate what matters if blinded by grudges over what is missing.

 

This is not at all to say you ill treat your wife as my father did his, but to simply note that you didn't seem to say a single good thing about someone you stayed with for 50 years other than to describe good qualities others saw in her that you didn't experience.

i certainly recognize her fine points and there are many................my libido has always been very high, so that tends to overshadow much of her good.  overall, others would judge our marriage to be 'one of the great ones'  ............i guess i have made my trade but do have some regrets............so who's life is perfect /

[ryn2]

I think as we get older many of us look back on some of our choices (inaction is still a choice) with a bit of regret, whether we’re talking sex or jobs or a whole host of other things.

 

The tricky part is that we can’t change one aspect of our lives in a vacuum.  If we went to a different school, pursued a different vocation/career, made different decisions in regards to health and lifestyle, chose a different partner (or no partner at all), lived in a different community, traveled more (or less), etc., we would be different people with wholly different lives.  There’s no way of knowing if we would have enjoyed those different lives more or less than the ones we ultimately ended up with.

 

It’s not as simple as picturing the lives we have “as is,” just with more (or less) sex.  With a different partner would (have) come a different life.  Maybe better, maybe worse, maybe equally but differently challenging.

[James121]

Another one. Roped in by lies that continued for years!

[gaogao]

44 minutes ago, James121 said:

Another one. Roped in by lies that continued for years!

Why are you so convinced asexuals are deliberately lying to sexual people to entrap them? It's so unhelpful and upsetting to see.

 

No one would want to lie to someone they love and care about. You talk about DARVO but you are the one who is DARVO'ing now - how bitter are you?

 

There just isn't enough information about asexuality out there, so neither sexuals nor asexuals recognize the signs - both sides stay in denial and make the same mistakes over and over again until they wind up here when it's too late. None of it is deliberate, no one is "roping people in".. I get it's frustrating but it's an unfortunate misunderstanding, not something people set out to do.

[James121]

17 minutes ago, gaogao said:

Why are you so convinced asexuals are deliberately

It’s not just asexuals. This happens with low libido partners too. It’s cruel.

Read the OP’s account. Celibacy during engagement with an assurance it would be different once the wedding had taken place. Just lie after lie.

No doubt the OP has been given the “I’m too tired tonight sweetheart” or the “I have a headache” excuses for god knows how many years.

Its a disgrace. Sexual or asexual, this behaviour is criminal.

 

What have I DARVO’d?

 

D - deny problem exists.....well that’s not me so I’m out at stage one.

[gaogao]

*edit because it posted when I pressed enter to add in a name instead of going to the next line. Working on a reply, brb*

 

*edit reply below*

 

@James121 If that's the way you see it, then I can see no way for someone to compromise with you on anything.

 

You aren't looking at what the reasons might be for someone to have to make those excuses, or the misunderstandings that an asexual person might have about sex and what role it plays in a relationship. Anti-sex culture which praises celibacy before marriage and looks down on people for having sex makes asexuality even more invisible than it would otherwise be, especially for older generations. 

 

This sort of relationship hurts us asexuals a lot too - we don't go into this deliberately. We love someone, and think that sex is something that is supposed to come naturally later because we love them - because that's what everyone tells us - but it never does. Maybe we need to give it more time - so tonight i'm tired, tomorrow I have a headache, but maybe next week or next year I'll want to have sex with the man/woman I know I really love. In the meantime, that person we love gets more and more frustrated, and we still don't know why that desire isn't there - not for a long time and not until it's too late...

How can you not see why this might be the reason for those excuses, rather than something deliberate?

 

(ps) 

 

I mean, personally that isn't what happened in my relationship because my partner knew i identified as asexual. She just didn't know what it meant.

[ryn2]

50 years ago asexuality wasn’t on much of anyone’s radar and waiting until after marriage to have sex was common in a lot of areas.  It’s possible both parties went into the marriage honestly expecting to have a sexual relationship.  Ultimately the only one who knows the answer to that is the OP’s wife.

 

I doubt many people of any orientation are out there deliberately, willfully, and/or maliciously saddling themselves with a lifetime of deception and derision, but that’s just me.  Others appear to feel differently.

[James121]

21 minutes ago, gaogao said:

@James121 If that's the way you see it, then I can see no way for someone to compromise with you on anything.

The OP has been married for decades. What compromise was on offer. I missed it!

[gaogao]

Just now, James121 said:

The OP has been married for decades. What compromise was on offer. I missed it!

I'm not talking about OP, i'm talking about you.

[gaogao]

50 minutes ago, James121 said:

 

What have I DARVO’d?

 

D - deny problem exists.....well that’s not me so I’m out at stage one.

 

Deny the issue exists : We've pointed out to you that your attitude is a problem in understanding how to make a mixed relationship work. You're categorically denying that your attitude, as pointed out, is a problem.

 

Attack the person who suggests it does: You are attacking me right now. You are attacking asexuals for saying that we don't do these things deliberately.

 

Reverse the 

Victim and

Offender:

 

Aseuals are victims too - not the only victims, because I appreciate the difficulty my sexual partner has had....  but we both have troubles nonetheless. I've done my best to explain the situation and how we might be tricked into thinking that we are normal and why we might persist and try to continue on as we are... whether it's because celibacy before marriage is celebrated, or because in the ideal relationship, sexual desire is something that's supposed to come after love and attraction -- but you repeatedly say we are lying, even though you don't know what it's like to believe wholeheartedly that one day, you're going to figure out what this whole sex thing is about, because everyone else does, and in the effort of doing so forcing yourself to do something you dislike until you actually can't any more and give up and hurt the person you love irrevocably for reasons you can't fully comprehend. 

 

I understand you've been hurt, but both sexuals and asexuals in a mixed relationship are victims. Victims of how few people know what asexuality is and what it means. There is no offender - except maybe sex-shaming culture for making people so embarrassed to talk about how important sex is for them.

 

Regarding OP - he is understandably regretful and bitter, but I don't think it's helpful for him to believe that his partner has been lying to him deliberately all these years. If the rest of their relationship has been good, It's quite likely that she did love him, but in her own way that he was never able to understand. 

 

In the end, it's okay to be bitter! It's okay to mourn the loss of something you wish you had! It's okay to look back and regret your choices! but as ryn says, you'd be a very different person if you hadn't stayed, so it's hard to say, categorically, that things would be better if you had/had not done something. Look at the good of what you have now, and think about whether there's anything you can realistically do to make it better.

 

There's no sense on dwelling in the past and forgetting about the present - It's ok to vent, but i hope you will work towards making your future better. Even if you feel time is running out, at least those thoughts might actually be constructive...

[James121]

31 minutes ago, gaogao said:

I'm not talking about OP, i'm talking about you.

I was talking about the OP so you have misunderstood the post.

[James121]

16 minutes ago, gaogao said:

Deny the issue exists : We've pointed out to you that your attitude is a problem in understanding how to make a mixed relationship work. You're categorically denying that your attitude, as pointed out, is a problem.

 

Attack the person who suggests it does: You are attacking me right now. You are attacking asexuals for saying that we don't do these things deliberately.

 

Reverse the 

Victim and

Offender:

And we sexuals have pointed out the credibility of someone ‘not knowing’ all these years . You have denied that possibility, attacked it and RVO.

 

This could go round and round in circles but look, ask yourself honestly....

 

The OP says he went without sex before the marriage as per her wishes! Then, 50+ years down the line he has had enough. Still no or obviously very little sex. So much so he is here.

 

Do you not think his wife after 2 or 3 years of saying “not tonight babe i’m ________________” fill in the bs excuse, do you not think she should have said, I’m not offering this man sex. I know he wants it. I should really offer him an explanation and or solution. Do you not think she owed him that? It’s this that annoys me. No one ever expects anything if the refuser. We are always told that the refused can “simply leave” but that isn’t fair. What about the liar who married someone under false pretences?

[gaogao]

9 minutes ago, James121 said:

I was talking about the OP so you have misunderstood the post.

At this point you're just deliberately ignoring all of my points, so I don't foresee this being a remotely productive conversation.

[James121]

2 minutes ago, gaogao said:

At this point you're just deliberately ignoring all of my points, so I don't foresee this being a remotely productive conversation.

I could say the same 

[gaogao]

13 minutes ago, James121 said:

And we sexuals have pointed out the credibility of someone ‘not knowing’ all these years . You have denied that possibility, attacked it and RVO.

I've already acknowledged that there is a problem. I've also already said that sexual partners are victims, so how can you say I am Denying anything or Reversing the Victim / Offender? I've said already that in my opinion, there is no Offender here. There are only Victims.

 

Again, you're deliberately ignoring what I'm saying. You keep saying  you don't think it's credible for someone to 'not know'. I'm saying we can. We do. Regularly. And I'm also saying it is a Problem. I know this from Experience. I know this because I also didn't know for years (even though i, luckily, never loved anyone until after I had an inkling of what I was - many people are not so lucky). You genuinely don't think it's credible despite all the testimonies of people on this forum who say that they have tried, that they didn't know, that it was a revelation that they found out after so long - so since I can't get you to even acknowledge that you are Denying a Problem  - it's impossible to proceed.

 

Thank you and goodnight.

[James121]

5 minutes ago, gaogao said:

You keep saying it is impossible for asexuals not to know we are asexual.

This is where you all misunderstand me. Someone can go their entire life without knowing that they are asexual. They might not even hear that word...asexual.

 

What they sure as hell did know was that they didn’t....like......sex. 

 

But they get married regardless. They tell their husband to be....”only when we are married”. He believes it and patiently waits. 50 years down the line this man has lost his patience and is here. Tell me what part of this involves her being a victim. Please!!!

Shes had 50 years of a mans life and the relationship has been as she wished. Why is she a victim?

 

 

[ryn2]

1 minute ago, James121 said:

What they sure as hell did know was that they didn’t....like......sex. 

This is (subtly) not accurate in at least some cases.

 

At least in settings where people don’t talk frankly and openly about sex, it’s hard to know one’s own experience is unusual.  If you don’t realize your experience is unusual, you don’t know there’s anything *to* “confess.”  When you do mention it to anyone, you get told you just need someone with mad skilz/more lube/a nice bath first/a partner who will shoulder more of the chores/etc.  You still think your experience isn’t unusual, and there’s a fix out there somewhere.

 

It’s not until you start having really frank conversations with other people who experience sex differently - and that’s a whole lot easier nowadays with the internet than it was 50 years ago - that you start to realize “hey, there’s something fundamentally different going on here.”

[ryn2]

13 minutes ago, James121 said:

This is where you all misunderstand me. Someone can go their entire life without knowing that they are asexual. They might not even hear that word...asexual.

This may also be where you are misunderstanding “all of us.”  When we’re saying “I did not know I was asexual,” we’re not saying “I knew all along that I had this nameless thing, but I just learned the word for it recently.”

 

We’re saying we didn’t realize we weren’t the same as everyone else.  We didn’t realize we experienced sex differently than other people or, if we hadn’t had it yet, we didn’t realize we would not much care for it when we had it.  We didn’t know we would never want it with any partner just because it wasn’t great with our last one.

 

For the older aces among us, we didn’t know that what’s now called asexuality was a thing that existed, or that it might apply to us.

 

It’s not the word we didn’t know. We didn’t recognize our orientation.

[ripley]

On 2/23/2018 at 1:01 PM, frednsa said:

so here I sit after a half-century of marriage to a "great" partner.  sexless as a stone but viewed as so "warm" by those not craving intimacy with her.

I'm dying but healthy at the moment and so resentful and angry over so much time in this marriage hoping that something will change.  50+ years, huh ?

You stayed in the relationship that long even though you've been so bothered about there being little to no sex? If you're so resentful and angry, what made you even stay for so many years? I'm honestly curious, since you haven't said anything much about what it is about your partner that you love, or that you appreciate, or that makes you happy. Remember that at any time you could have left your relationship. Unless there were other things it was providing you that made you both happy or that meant more than the sex, staying that long in an unhappy situation that made you bitter seems ... daft. 

 

On 2/23/2018 at 1:01 PM, frednsa said:

insane, maybe.............but the awareness that the window is closing and there's virtually no hope of change.

You can't pick and choose what part of a person to love. Just as your partner can't pick and choose what parts of you to love. You don't spend so many years simply hoping someone can change, you either communicate with one another and find a way that'll work for both of you, or if you're really unhappy you decide what might be best for the situation. Sometimes no matter how much people love each other, for one reason or another they realise they're happier apart than together. And other times after realising where the other person is coming from, they can work out a way to please each other. 

 

On 2/23/2018 at 1:01 PM, frednsa said:

 i guess if it hadn't been for my prior (60 years ago) relationship in school being with such a sexual girl, i wouldn't know better.

It's a bit unfair to compare such a long time of marriage with a high school relationship of so long ago. One way or another, you likely would have worked out if you were overly sexual or not - even without known labels it's a discovery people make about themselves. 

 

On 2/23/2018 at 1:01 PM, frednsa said:

got sucked in by my wife's wonderful (out-of-bed) personality and family and believed her statements that after our pre-marriage celibacy imposed by her (remember asexuality was unknown by me) that she would really warm up after marriage. 

Maybe your wife thought things would change after marriage too. Maybe she thought she'd become more sexual, but then once you were married realised that she still felt the same way about sex. Maybe it's something that's bothered her, if she knows it's something you've been upset about, and maybe she's felt broken that she can't provide something that will make you happy. It's not so much that she's lied to you all these years. And if you feel like she has, it's likely that she never intended to. 

[James121]

20 hours ago, ryn2 said:

This may also be where you are misunderstanding “all of us.”  When we’re saying “I did not know I was asexual,” we’re not saying “I knew all along that I had this nameless thing, but I just learned the word for it recently.”

 

We’re saying we didn’t realize we weren’t the same as everyone else.  We didn’t realize we experienced sex differently than other people or, if we hadn’t had it yet, we didn’t realize we would not much care for it when we had it.  We didn’t know we would never want it with any partner just because it wasn’t great with our last one.

 

For the older aces among us, we didn’t know that what’s now called asexuality was a thing that existed, or that it might apply to us.

 

It’s not the word we didn’t know. We didn’t recognize our orientation.

At some point, a few years in maybe, surely someone is going to think, “this has been the same for years now and I still have no desire for any sex. Perhaps I should see someone or say something to my husband”. 

Had this mans husband had approached him after 2-3 years of this and said “I don’t think this is ever going to change” he probably would have cut his losses.

 

[ryn2]

I was about 15 years into my marriage (17 years into the relationship) when I realized I might be ace.  If I hadn’t happened upon the hobby that led me there, I might still not know I was in any way unusual.

 

By your logic I must be exceptionally clueless.

[James121]

20 hours ago, ryn2 said:

I was about 15 years into my marriage (17 years into the relationship) when I realized I might be ace.  If I hadn’t happened upon the hobby that led me there, I might still not know I was in any way unusual.

 

By your logic I must be exceptionally clueless.

Hmm, I’ll refrain from the use of the term ‘clueless’ but what I would ask is this.

 

For 17 years did you not realise that you preferred not to have sex with your partner?