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The Alt-Right: We should take them seriously


Tarfeather

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1 hour ago, Nevyn said:

 If that's treason then guess what? Everyone in the US and Canada are traitors to England and France. And yes, amnesty does in fact change their status legally. You can continue to think whatever you want, just be aware that it's not lining up with reality.

If I murder someone, and then receive amnesty for my crime, that doesn't make me "not a murderer"; there's still a dead body, and I still murdered someone. It just means I don't have to face any legal consequences

 

Yeah, when the US rebelled against Britain they were traitors to the crown, and that's how the British characterized the war.

 

And Canada never fought a war for their independence, from England or from France, so I don't know what you're on about with that. It was the British that kicked the French out of Lower Canada, and eventually Canadians asked for independence from Britain and were granted it. No treason required.

 

By the by, crimes committed by the father do not pass to the son. The Confederates being traitors does not mean their descendents are, same as with Americans who fought during their War of Independence.

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Murder is a bit of a bad example. Amnesty applies to political crimes. You can't be granted it for civil crimes. You're talking about a pardon. A pardon would reverse a murder conviction making you not a murderer. Anyone who called you that afterwards would be subject to libel or slander laws depending on the form it took and if you were willing to pursue it. It would be an interesting case but the law is the law independent of personal feelings involved and murder is one legal classification of killing someone. There are plenty of killings that are not murders. You could be called a killer in that situation and it would be accurate without the legal liability.

 

The same situation applies to treason. No trials and no convictions means no treason. I'm also not sure why you feel the need to mention crimes not being inheritable. It's beside the point that if you receive amnesty for a political crime you are defacto not guilty of it anymore.

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2 minutes ago, Nevyn said:

A pardon would reverse a murder conviction making you not a murderer. Anyone who called you that afterwards would be subject to libel or slander laws depending on the form it took and if you were willing to pursue it.

If you're not a murderer, what have you been pardoned for?

 

If I fart, and apologise, and someone pardons me for it, it doesn't mean I haven't farted. It means I've been forgiven for it.

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The murder charge you beat that can no longer be held against you. Legally it's like you didn't commit a crime at all.

 

Edit: Ok, I looked it up a little further. It does not reverse convictions, just removes the penalties. It still doesn't apply to treason. How many Confederates were tried and charged with treason? The answer is very few.

 

Also, you should be careful of who you fart in front of. Some peopel may not be as lenient. :rolleyes:

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1 minute ago, CaptainYesterday said:

You're still failing to understand the issue at hand.  I have tried really hard, but you're just not getting it.

I understand the argument you're trying to make. It just so happens to be a really bad argument.

 

26 minutes ago, Nevyn said:

Edit: Ok, I looked it up a little further. It does not reverse convictions, just removes the penalties. It still doesn't apply to treason. How many Confederates were tried and charged with treason? The answer is very few.

They didn't charge anyone with treason in the interest of reconciliation. Doesn't mean they weren't traitors.

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It means exactly that. No charges or convictions of treason = no traitor. There were people successfully charged afterwards. Feel free to call those ones that but you can't apply another blanket term to everyone involved just because you want to. These were real legal matters of the times and you don't get to rewrite that because on your feelings.

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1 hour ago, Nevyn said:

It means exactly that. No charges or convictions of treason = no traitor. There were people successfully charged afterwards. Feel free to call those ones that but you can't apply another blanket term to everyone involved just because you want to. These were real legal matters of the times and you don't get to rewrite that because on your feelings.

"Traitor" is not defined primarily or exclusively as "someone charged with treason". One can be a traitor without ever being charged. One can be a traitor without ever being discovered.

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In this situation it’s a political and legal term. One being applied by you to talk about people that are long gone from this earth. You can use whatever terms you want, they are beyond caring what you think of them. The only thing it does is show your own political leanings. 

 

You’re not the only one who can do that. For instance I believe antifa and it’s members to be nothing more than spoiled children who don’t have the cahones to actually do anything but show up and disrupt people who, while I may not like them or their ideals, at least have the balls to take an actual stand on something and not hide behind masks and shit tactics. They’ve already assigned themselves to the trash heap of forgotten history because no-one will remember them as anything other than pathetic.

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20 minutes ago, Nevyn said:

In this situation it’s a political and legal term. One being applied by you to talk about people that are long gone from this earth. You can use whatever terms you want, they are beyond caring what you think of them. The only thing it does is show your own political leanings.

No, in this situation I'm using it to describe their behaviour and choices, not the legal consequences they faced for them.

 

And at what point did correctly identifying traitors as such start "revealing my political leanings"? (oh, what a silly question, it was when racists started pushing Lost Cause propaganda and insinuated themselves in the political right-wing).

 

Wow. From this thread, you have confirmation that I'm anti-Nazi and anti-traitor. Those sure are some controversial political stances to take.

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You’re entitled to believe whatever you want. I was merely pointing out how it’s innacurate. Round-dogging the same responses doesn’t quite serve as an argument though. 

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4 minutes ago, Nevyn said:

You’re entitled to believe whatever you want. I was merely pointing out how it’s innacurate. Round-dogging the same responses doesn’t quite serve as an argument though. 

Claiming that I was using the word "traitor" in a particular manner that I was not, in fact, using it in - as my prior posts clearly establish - is nothing more than a transparent attempt to score points on a fabricated technicality.

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Score points with who? Are there prizes? I’d like a plushie pony please. 

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