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Sex with asexual, feeling manipulated


reid113

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Ok so I'm trying to be less ignorant about this, but emotions are bringing me down and I'm just hoping someone can clear this up.

 

I'm a girl who's not attracted to most people, but am very sexual anyway.  There was this one guy friend I had who I couldn't get out of my mind...we'd hang out all day and all night long, go on adventures, watch movies.  I became attracted to him, he was different from other guys in that he didn't watch porn or chase girls around or make sexist jokes.   So, I directly confronted him one night and stated that I wanted to have sex with him, and was surprised when he consented.  I was overjoyed and so very nervous, and I could tell he was pretty nervous...While we were both in our early 20s, I was his first while he was my 21st person.   So that one night, I took his virginity, and I won't go into details but I thought that my job was pretty well done.  Sex was the only thing I was best at; in my friend group, they consider me the slut.  It shocked me that this innocent, seemingly asexual person would go for that, but it made me happy because I liked him to a painful, heartbreaking extent.

 

Why is it heartbreaking?

 

We met up and had sex several times until one day we had a conversation where he revealed to me that he wanted to stop doing it, it wasn't his thing, it made him feel bad (this was something he was vague about) and I'm pretty sure that he was articulating that he was asexual.  He confessed he had only had sex with me because society is centered around it, and that before when he had the opportunity to do so the person had been unattractive or something, and I was a fitting person to do it with because I was both physically attractive and a trustworthy friend.  But now I feel fucking manipulated, and humiliated, and ruined, because when we were intimate he seemed to be enjoying everything and there were sparks going off in my frontal lobe signaling to me that our time was magical...only it wasn't.  This whole time, it was all an act, a lie, in attempt to fit in with society when in fact what we were doing repulsed him.  I...to the person I wanted the most....was repulsive.  He didn't say this, but isn't that true?  He's an asexual, I'm the sexual demon that introduced him to sex and will now only ever be associated with an act which is of zero interest to him.

 

Furthermore, I feel disgusted with myself.  Usually I'm relatively pro at reading people, but I couldn't even tell that internally he wasn't enjoying sex like I was.  Sure, he responded sexually to my advances, initiated sex,  climaxed, and vocalized that it was great fun and we should do it again (while we were still doing it) but the reality was that the entire time, he wasn't truly attracted to me nor enjoying everything I was doing for him, and I couldn't even realize it because of my own stupidity.  So I can't help but feel bamboozled, tricked, conned.  Am I in the wrong here though because I took the virginity of an asexual, or is it him because of how slyly he played on my emotions to fulfill his conformist agenda?  I honestly would have preferred that he turn me down so I wouldn't have the memories of us like that together, but at the same time I'm glad he chose to do it with me if he's never going to do it again for 'fun'.  (That is to say, he had revealed in a conversation that he might someday want to reproduce, and would have sex with a partner with tenuous frequency for the purposes of contributing to evolution and keeping the marriage alive).

 

Opinions?  Thoughts?  Bring it on, I have nothing to lose, just want some clarification/help from someone other than my mind.    

 

 

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It's no ones fault. He wanted to try it with someone he thought very highly of. He may even have had romantic feelings for you, but if someone isn't attracted to another person sexually and they've never tried it before, then they wouldn't know any better. They'd probably think that they could get into it when they started, but found that they couldn't and were sexually repulsed.

It's nothing against you, and they said themselves that they think very highly of you, and think you're beautiful and trustworthy, and someone he was willing to take that risk for. But ultimately, it wasn't for him. And that's neither your fault nor his. It's just the way it worked out. He doesn't think your repulsive, in fact he respects you an awful lot to be able to rely on you to try something so intimate with, especially his first time.

I don't think he played with your emotions, I think he honestly believed that if he had to go with anyone to try his forst time with, he'd trust you to be that person. It's not wrong of you to have had sex with him, nor was it wrong of him to try and have sex with you, it's just how things happened. It may seem like a bad thing now, but it will be another experience in life, and it shows just how much he values you as a person. It may not work out romantically, but he probably still has a lot of trust in you. You could still get back to being friends if that's what you want.

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People use each other in all sorts of ways.

 

If your the sexual person you claim, i think you should see this. One can never tell for sure, why another is liking you, or what they get out of it.

 

I think both of you probably got it wrong. I think, you like this person alot as you said, and your brain is trying to hate him in some way for him doing this.

 

I think also you have to appreciate that asexuals are very different, just like sexuals are.

 

One bit of advice i would say.

 

If your sexual, and you say you are. People use each other alot in what you like to do. You have to accept this.

 

There is a number of reasons why he may of done this, maybe he thinks that you being sexual, your better of with a man, that wants what you want.

 

I think, you probably have understood that you like him more, then your usual shags, and your brain is just trying to hate him for doing what he did.

 

If your sexual, you live and learn, as i am sure, you know, that most people you meet and like, it will only be fleeting, but it sounds like you liked this bloke more. Maybe, if he really was asexual, you helped him understand something about himself, and maybe, he thinks that the best thing would be if your with a man, whom wants the things you want, ie sexual relations.

 

I think being a sexual like you claim, you should understand and i am sure you do understand, if your as sexually active as you claim, that people use each other for all sorts of reasons.

 

You should think back, on how you felt back when you had your first experience of it, and try to appreciate his view.

 

Remember he may of done this for all sorts of reasons. I just think you liked him more then most of your partners, and you regret that he is not wanting more, like you do.

 

If he was asexual, remember it was you that initiated this. I just think, you like him alot, and want to hate him.

 

Just remember like you should know by now, if you had all the partners you claim, people use each other for all sorts of reasons.

 

Probably if you did not have sex with him, you two probably would of felt haunted by each other. You probably would of thought about him alot over the years. What happened happened, and you got it out of your system like.

 

Some people in your life, will connect with you more then others, and some will haunt you, no matter what in life, and for what ever reason, you connect. But like i said, i think you really liked him, and now what he did, your just trying to find a way to hate him, for being who he was.

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41 minutes ago, reid113 said:

He confessed he had only had sex with me because society is centered around it, and that before when he had the opportunity to do so the person had been unattractive or something, and I was a fitting person to do it with because I was both physically attractive and a trustworthy friend. 

 

41 minutes ago, reid113 said:

So I can't help but feel bamboozled, tricked, conned.  Am I in the wrong here though because I took the virginity of an asexual, or is it him because of how slyly he played on my emotions to fulfill his conformist agenda?

 

 

Heyyo, 

 

I don't feel like you should take it too personally. I know that sounds weird, but there are many times that asexuals want to try sex because it's something that some people start enjoying after they've tried it. Some feel that they can't know for sure until they've tried it at least once with someone they trust, not just a ons. It sounds like he no way intended for you to be hurt but he wanted to inform you on why he doesn't want to continue his sexual relationship with you. Would you have just felt better if he would have just said "no more" or are you happy he gave some sort of explanation on why he doesn't want to continue? Although I can see your point on why you feel manipulated, it's highly unlikely that he went out of his way to do that to you, especially if you guys are trusted friends. 

 

If you truly are uncomfortable with it, you should explore the topic more with him. 

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Well, I actually think it was a jerky thing of him to do if he KNEW he was only doing it to conform, but gave you the impression it was something different. He seems to have been well aware of what he was doing as he said he turned another woman down due to her not being physically appealing (not at all shallow if you're not even interested in the person themselves in the first place and only want sex to see what it's like... Ahem).. Almost seems to me like he wanted to be able to say he'd had sex, and also be able to brag about it being with someone attractive if it came to that. Look, I have absolutely no problem with asexuals having sex to see what it's like, but it seems to me that he did this in a manipulative and dishonest way. If he'd said 'okay but the truth is I think I'm asexual so mainly I just want to try to sex to be able to say that I've had it, to fit in, you know?' that'd be totally different. You'd possibly have actually still been happy to have sex with him in those circumstances, you just wouldn't have had false assumptions about what he was actually thinking and feeling. I'd feel used if I was you too, used, angry, manipulated. It was wrong of him to not be honest about his motivations when he consented to sex with you.

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I think you're angry with him because he didn't feel about the sex as you did.  But he didn't know that before it happened, and he probably wasn't sure until you'd had sex several times.  And then he was honest with you, because by then he knew he didn't really want sex, and having it made him feel bad because he didn't want it.  He didn't say he didn't want you as a person, and he didn't say you repulsed him -- that's your anger telling you that, I think.  Anger can be kind of a protective response.  I'm asexual, but didn't really know what that meant until I'd had sex with my husband and then my partner.  It took me years to realize that it wasn't going to get any better, and it wasn't a case of me not trying hard enough.  I was NEVER repulsed by either man, and I loved both of them, which was why I tried so hard.  

 

Don't be hard on him.  It took some courage for him to tell you what he did.  

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nothinbuttrouble

In the past, I had plenty of sex because first and foremost, when I like a person, I want to please them. Also, in this society sex is treated as a duty that people owe to each other in certain circumstances. I didn't realize I bought into this, but I did. I felt that if I let someone else get emotionally close to me (which is something I enjoy) I was leading them on if I then refused sex.  So if I wanted to experience intense emotional closeness with someone (which I'm also prone to) and didn't want to be a total jerk, I had to have sex with them if they got that idea about us because of my behavior. I also didn't really believe I was asexual and thought eventually I'd get into sex if I just kept trying it.

 

Sounds like your buddy just figured things out quicker than I did.

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First response pretty much covers everything I would have said.

 

Quote

Look, I have absolutely no problem with asexuals having sex to see what it's like, but it seems to me that he did this in a manipulative and dishonest way.

How so, exactly?  It was the OP that propositioned it, not him.

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Shadowstepper
On 11/17/2017 at 6:07 PM, reid113 said:

.  I...to the person I wanted the most....was repulsive.  He didn't say this, but isn't that true?  He's an asexual,

Based on what you've said, no, it isn't true.

As an asexual, I am not repulsed by sex or people that want sex. I just have no particular desire for it.

 

According to what you've said, he selected you because he found you attractive and trustworthy. If anything, you were the only person he felt was worth having sex with. That sounds like the opposite of finding you repulsive.

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Okay, all of your responses are enlightening and helpful in some way.  I could never hate him for being asexual, as that is who he is, and would even still consider dating him without sex if it's what he wanted, as sex isn't necessary in relationships. But that's probably unrealistic if he thinks I'm better off with a sexual person than an asexual person...anyway, it's also helpful to hear from the ace community that a person an asexual's been in sexual contact with isn't repulsive.  I was worried that, after the intercourse, he viewed me as repulsive, but the general consensus you guys provided seems to be that being sexual or having sexual memories with a person doesn't make said person repulsive to the asexual.  

Thank you.

 

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14 hours ago, Philip027 said:

How so, exactly?  It was the OP that propositioned it, not him.

 

On 11/18/2017 at 12:07 PM, reid113 said:

He confessed he had only had sex with me because society is centered around it, and that before when he had the opportunity to do so the person had been unattractive or something, and I was a fitting person to do it with because I was both physically attractive and a trustworthy friend. 

If he knew exactly WHY he was having sex with her, and had even thought about it before but turned that woman down because she wasn't hot enough, then he clearly went into it not being honest about what exactly he was after. He gave her the false idea he was legitimately interested in her when he should have just said ''Okay I will, but I'll let you know I'm asexual and am only doing this because society is quite centered around it, and you're more attractive than some ugly girl that asked me a while ago so yeah okay, let's go!'' ..At least that would have been honest.

 

Oh and just because one person propositions another for sex doesn't mean the one who agrees to it isn't being manipulative, lying, whatever. If she asked him for sex and it turned out he was married, he'd still be a dirty cheat even though it was her who propositioned him.

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If he knew exactly WHY he was having sex with her, and had even thought about it before but turned that woman down because she wasn't hot enough, then he clearly went into it not being honest about what exactly he was after. He gave her the false idea he was legitimately interested in her when he should have just said ''Okay I will, but I'll let you know I'm asexual and am only doing this because society is quite centered around it, and you're more attractive than some ugly girl that asked me a while ago so yeah okay, let's go!'' ..At least that would have been honest.

I wasn't aware people had any sort of obligation to disclose why they are having sex every time they agree to do it.

 

It was the OP's idea so I doubt he was "after" anything, and the OP made no such inquiry as to why he was agreeing, therefore he was under no sort of obligation to provide an answer.
 

Quote

Oh and just because one person propositions another for sex doesn't mean the one who agrees to it isn't being manipulative, lying, whatever. If she asked him for sex and it turned out he was married, he'd still be a dirty cheat even though it was her who propositioned him.

 

Well yeah, but somehow I don't think this is the situation at hand here.

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11 hours ago, FictoVore. said:

 

If he knew exactly WHY he was having sex with her, and had even thought about it before but turned that woman down because she wasn't hot enough, then he clearly went into it not being honest about what exactly he was after. He gave her the false idea he was legitimately interested in her when he should have just said ''Okay I will, but I'll let you know I'm asexual and am only doing this because society is quite centered around it, and you're more attractive than some ugly girl that asked me a while ago so yeah okay, let's go!'' ..At least that would have been honest.

 

I dunno, it takes a lot for someone to be that 100% aware of what they are thinking/feeling at the time... especially under the pressure of being propositioned for sex by someone you really like and respect. In my experience, it's hard to break down your thoughts and explain what motivates you to try something that society is pressuring you to do in that moment -- it also takes a lot of self-reflection to be able to verbalise what you were thinking in that exact way.

 

So to me, the sort of explanation OP's friend offered strikes me as something he only realised later by asking himself 'Why did I agree to having sex with OP but not that other girl who asked me?' and 'I've tried a lot of times and everything tells me that I should really enjoy sex, but why do I not enjoy it and why did I think I would?'

 

I would say it's natural for OP to feel used, but I wouldn't say her friend was as manipulative or dishonest as you seem to imply. Of course, I don't think OP should feel bad for this situation - I don't think she acted unreasonably and I think the feelings she describes are a lot like what my girlfriend said she felt when I finally found the words to explain to her exactly how I felt about sex.... So... I think this is all normal.

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Shadowstepper
31 minutes ago, gaogao said:

I dunno, it takes a lot for someone to be that 100% aware of what they are thinking/feeling at the time... especially under the pressure of being propositioned for sex by someone you really like and respect. In my experience, it's hard to break down your thoughts and explain what motivates you to try something that society is pressuring you to do in that moment -- it also takes a lot of self-reflection to be able to verbalise what you were thinking in that exact way.

 

So to me, the sort of explanation OP's friend offered strikes me as something he only realised later by asking himself 'Why did I agree to having sex with OP but not that other girl who asked me?' and 'I've tried a lot of times and everything tells me that I should really enjoy sex, but why do I not enjoy it and why did I think I would?'

 

I would say it's natural for OP to feel used, but I wouldn't say her friend was as manipulative or dishonest as you seem to imply. Of course, I don't think OP should feel bad for this situation - I don't think she acted unreasonably and I think the feelings she describes are a lot like what my girlfriend said she felt when I finally found the words to explain to her exactly how I felt about sex.... So... I think this is all normal.

I would agree with pretty much all of this assessment.

 

The first time I had sex I didn't know I wasn't going to like it, or that I had no real desire for it. These are not things I really thought about before that. I didn't have sex before that because I just didn't.

 

There was no malice in my action to finally have sex. I wasn't trying to take advantage of her. I had no ulterior motive. Here was someone that wanted to have sex with me and I felt strongly enough about her to do it, where I hadn't felt strongly enough about anyone else before her.

 

It wasn't until (much) later that I was able to analyze the situation and figure out how little I actually wanted it. I wouldn't change the fact that it happened though.

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I have consented in the past to protect womens' feelings, even tho the act was very neutral.  Some women have extremely fragile egos, and don't handle rejection well as they are considered gatekeepers of sorts.  I usually have tried to steer the interaction away from sex, but at times they have been extremely blunt, and I have consented to prevent hurting a friend.  I reject all women who's feelings I don't particularity care about.  I am usually upfront that this is a once in a lifetime occurance, and that they should not have any expectation of it happening again.

 

Perhaps, in an attempt to protect you, he actually hurt you.  Perhaps instead of being manipulative he was actually attempting to be accommodating.  Two sides to every coin.

 

Also you helped him discover a profound aspect of himself.  He might not have known he was asexual, trusted you, and you revealed to him his true self.  That is an honor.

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On 17/11/2017 at 5:07 PM, reid113 said:

I directly confronted him one night and stated that I wanted to have sex with him, and was surprised when he consented.

 

I took his virginity

 

I liked him to a painful, heartbreaking extent.

 

he wanted to stop doing it, it made him feel bad

 

he had only had sex with me because society

 

I was a fitting person to do it

 

 But now I feel fucking manipulated, and humiliated, and ruined, because when we were intimate he seemed to be enjoying everything and there were sparks going off in my frontal lobe signaling to me that our time was magical

 

the person I wanted the most.

 

he responded sexually to my advances, initiated sex,  climaxed, and vocalized that it was great fun and we should do it again

 

I took the virginity of an asexual

 

how slyly he played on my emotions to fulfill his conformist agenda

 

I'm glad he chose to do it with me if he's never going to do it again for 'fun'. 

I mean... you proposed the idea of having sex to him, so you shouldn't feel betrayed now because he is not into it. If it would have been like that guy was "I'm gonna have sex with you" and later "you know what, maybe not" it would be a different situation.

 

Also, it is kind of uncomfortable, at least for me looking it from an asexual aromantic side, that you talk about "taking his virginity" like is something that for an asexual would matter to not remain pure or something. Or as if it's something he should be thanking you about ("I did a good job"), when is not like that at all. He is your friend, he's not suppose to owe you something  now because you both consented on having sex for the sake of having a good time and probably fulfill a dream you had with him. "To the person I WANTED", what did you wanted from him exactly?

 

He he said he only had sex with you because society (tradition if you will) and, implicitly, because you contributed to that pressure too, expecting something in return for the sex were good sex=validation=love. He lied to you because of this formula and it's the only way it's suppose to go when you have sex because it's very VERY important to some, because can you imagine for a second if he immediately said "i didn't liked it nor enjoy it and this is not for me, sorry, but let's be friends"? I used to lie to my partner too because of the same reason, and he asked me to tell the truth. From then on I would say the truth and you know what happened? He would get depressed. He couldn't accept that I wasn't enjoying it nor did I care about sex so he would ask me again to "REALLY tell the truth", he wanted me to lie that I was enjoying it but he would get mad for me to lie about lying and then tell me to lie and get angry anyways. WTF. Certainly I wanted to give back something for him in the form of the sex he wanted. So what is best then? Live a lie where both are happy or have the truth where none of you are. You demand sex enjoyment from a person that can't. Like asking a penguin to learn to fly and enjoy it (even if they have "wings" doesn't mean they will fly). What do you think is best then and if it's so important then that relationship is doomed to fail.

 

It is common that you being asexual that never had sex want to at least be sure about it. You and him, friends, had sex without compromise. He didn't like it not because you didn't do a "good job" but because he is not sexual, he is asexual. Just like a gay guy that never had sex with anyone, thinks that he is hetero right until he has sex with a girl and discovers he not, that he is gay, and girls don't really do anything for him.

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On 11/29/2017 at 9:32 AM, Zacharie said:

it is kind of uncomfortable, at least for me looking it from an asexual aromantic side, that you talk about "taking his virginity" like is something that for an asexual would matter to not remain pure or something. Or as if it's something he should be thanking you about ("I did a good job"), when is not like that at all. He is your friend, he's not suppose to owe you something  now because you both consented on having sex for the sake of having a good time and probably fulfill a dream you had with him. "To the person I WANTED", what did you wanted from him exactly?

 

He he said he only had sex with you because society (tradition if you will) and, implicitly, because you contributed to that pressure too, expecting something in return for the sex were good sex=validation=love. He lied to you because of this formula and it's the only way it's suppose to go when you have sex because it's very VERY important to some, because can you imagine for a second if he immediately said "i didn't liked it nor enjoy it and this is not for me, sorry, but let's be friends"? I used to lie to my partner too because of the same reason, and he asked me to tell the truth. From then on I would say the truth and you know what happened? He would get depressed. He couldn't accept that I wasn't enjoying it nor did I care about sex so he would ask me again to "REALLY tell the truth", he wanted me to lie that I was enjoying it but he would get mad for me to lie about lying and then tell me to lie and get angry anyways. WTF. Certainly I wanted to give back something for him in the form of the sex he wanted. So what is best then? Live a lie where both are happy or have the truth where none of you are.

 

You demand sex enjoyment from a person that can't. Like asking a penguin to learn to fly and enjoy it (even if they have "wings" doesn't mean they will fly). 

 

 

I'm not saying he was less pure, I guess I should have clarified that his personality is one that can be described as innocent and curious, relatively sex-averse (which although attracted me to him, should have been a sign that I should have left it alone...hindsight bias, right?)..."Taking his virginity" refers to the fact that I was his first, I introduced him to an experience he had not had before, not trying to generalize it to the entire asexual population here.  It's not that he's less "pure," as purity and virginity should not even be associated with one another, I'm just trying to articulate that I was the person he chose to have an apparently meaningless sexual experience with when he had past opportunities to do so with others.  If anything, I found it flattering, and thought he had agreed to the proposition because he liked me, not because I was an experiment for his sexuality.  Obviously you don't owe someone anything for having your virginity taken...when mine was taken, I felt no obligation to follow up with any sort of love or affection, so the same logic applies.  What I was bitter about was that he really pretended to desire and enjoy it, even communicating to me when we were apart that we should continue doing it.  And it wasn't to fulfill some dream, it was to fulfill curiosity that went both ways.  He had told me he had thoughts of being sexual with me before we even had sex...so it's not like it was a one-way street, unless he was lying which I'm trying to figure out.  

 

What I wanted from him was just to be closer and be with him, spend more time together.  If sex wasn't part of the equation, it wasn't a dead-end for me.  Sex is simply not important compared with everything else about our friendship.  Yeah, I developed feelings for him, which is crushing because at this point I doubt they're all that mutual.  I'm really sorry that your partner would make you lie about enjoying sex and seemingly pressured you into having it.  It wouldn't feel quite right to pressure someone into having sex knowing they don't care for it nor enjoy it.  (How do you cope with that???) But, with that said, I could never "demand sex enjoyment" from someone who can't.  I never did demand it.  At first, I thought he might enjoy it because a large number of men do partake in that activity, and when women proposition sex some find it difficult to reject them for a number of reasons and in this case I hoped it would be that he would accept because he was attracted to me.  Sure, I'm sad that it had to end, but I'm more glad that in ending it he got to understand his sexual identity and that it wasn't entirely my "being repulsive" that caused him to not want sex.  Immediately after he told me...well, alluded to, more like...That he was asexual, it was over.  The expectation that sex would occur between us again was over.  I was just hoping that he had the same possibly romantic feelings about me that I had for him, and that seemed to not be the case, so I felt misled and like I couldn't trust anyone.  I did not know that he was asexual while we had sex, anyone who would have been there to witness wouldn't be able to tell.  There was no freaking way to tell.  It seemed so much like we were becoming a thing and that he felt strong affection.

 

So let me break this down: consenting to sex=mutual.  enjoying sex=one sided (mine).  agreeing to stop=mutual.  feeling intense emotions for person=one sided (mine, though it appeared otherwise) so idk, suppose I'm attempting to rationalize a way to dislike him to cope with pain, but can't seem to find success in doing so, especially since learning that asexuals don't think people who have sex are repulsive nor that their partners are associated with negative sentiments because they are sexual..like, I have no legitimate reason to dislike him anymore after consulting this forum. I'm just hurt because I feel misled and upright lied to by him.  You can't just tell someone who cares so much about you that you enjoy something when you really don't.  That's like telling a colorblind person who is looking for a green hat that a red hat with the smallest green tassel is actually entirely green, that they should get it, and then proceed to tell them in line at the checkout that it's wrong, find a new one on your own.  Yes, the analogy sucks, but the comparison of what it's like in my perception seems spot on.  I invite you to contradict me on anything you disagree with in my response.

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