Questions about Gray-Sexuality

[WaterLover]

On 11/30/2017 at 12:22 AM, Baam said:

Slapping a label on yourself isn't a trophy so that you can say 'hey look i have all these things that are bad and harder about my life'. If the label helps to describe you, use it. If it just causes you to have to explain yourself further don't. It doesn't matter about any 'privilege' you may or may not have. It's not about being a good or bad ally. The only thing that matters is whether or not it's a useful word for you to use to help describe yourself (particularly to others imo). 

 

If you need more than 2 or 3 'buts' when saying 'I'm grey-sexual', then you're probably not grey-sexual. The same with grey-romantic. It really is up to you, if it doesn't seem right then don't. But nothing you've said suggests to me that you're not 'allowed' to claim it. : P Anyone is allowed to.

 

Oh and welcome, by the way.

Thanks for the response! I definitely don't want to use it like a trophy. The 'buts' are 50/50 on both sides, though. But being in the middle between allosexual and asexual, grey-heterosexul does feel right to me. Thank you again.

[WaterLover]

On 11/30/2017 at 11:51 AM, 🎄Ryan🎄 said:

Welcome to AVEN  

 

I'd recommend exploring the forum to see if any other people's experience might seem similar to you, I know some sexual people go through dry spells of just not being interested in anyone due to life being busy or just not meeting the "right people". I am not sure if grey asexual or just sexual is the best fit of label for you, I think you are the best judge of that personally. I can tell you asexuals and grey asexuals do masturbate as the libido isn't connected to sexual attraction. Also some sexual people might not be attracted to many people, it does happen. If you choose to uses a label just remember it isn't permanent, so say you decide to identify as grey A, but two years from now your life experiences makes you realize that isn't the best label, then it's fine to change it. I personally identified with the asexual label years ago, but have changed it because I feel a grey/Demi fits me much better these days.  If you want to just hold off on the label and not label yourself for a period to let yourself discover more about yourself that is cool too, you are still welcome here. 

 

If you have any questions or need any help feel free to PM antime

 

-Ryan

Thank you for the reply! I think I needed some people to tell me to trust myself, because gray-heterosexual really does feel right. Thanks again.

[Spiderman]

Haha, yeah there is more. It's complicated. I guess the kind of attraction I'm talking about is aesthetic. 

~MAB:)

[Spiderman]

15 hours ago, roland.o said:

Hello Spiderman, welcome to the AVEN forums! Have some cake...

 

Maybe you're just not looking at people to judge their attractiveness, be it aesthetic, sexual, or otherwise...

https://secondlina.deviantart.com/art/Sketchcomic-types-of-Attraction-298804729

 

I'm not a judge of what's normal. Though if that is the only symptom that makes you feel different, I wouldn't worry too much.

But I suppose there's more to your story, isn't there?

 

All the best to you!

Haha, yeah there is more. It's complicated. I guess the type of attraction I'm talking about is aesthetic attraction. I have other "symptoms" of being asexual - I was just wondering if this counted as one.

~MAB:)

[GLRDT]

On 11/29/2017 at 11:34 AM, Deus Ex Infinity said:

I know that it's quite random but I was actually wondering  if gray-A and ace could work out for a serious roamntic relationship in the long term?

I'd be cool with that. As long as they like to cuddle! I don't need sex but I need cuddles!

[Puck]

4 minutes ago, GLRDT said:

I'd be cool with that. As long as they like to cuddle! I don't need sex but I need cuddles!

Cuddles are the best! Preferably next to a fire, watching a good movie, with a dog curled up hear by

[GLRDT]

5 minutes ago, Puck said:

Cuddles are the best! Preferably next to a fire, watching a good movie, with a dog curled up hear by

Yaaaaaaas.

[Snao Cone]

On 1/3/2018 at 3:51 PM, Puck said:

Cuddles are the best! Preferably next to a fire, watching a good movie, with a dog curled up hear by

Just cuddle with the dog.

[Guest]

Hello, I am new here!
I've had problems with communication with boys/men all my life. I've always been either lonely or stuck in some unresolvable love drama. Lately I've been thinking that my loneliness is partially due to the fact that I really don't want to have sex. Well, if I did want to have actual sexual relationship, I would've gontten one. Thinking of myself as asexual (or demisexual mayyyyybe) instead of just "too shy to have sex" is so liberating. Recently I realized that I don't even want to try to have sex ever again. The very thought of it makes me nervous rather than excited. For years I felt confused, dissapointed with myself or even guilty that I don't do what others do. I do find some guys attractive, I am heteroromantic, but I will most likely not have real relationships. Anyway, I am in my late 20's and I think it's high time to just do what I want and not what I have to (wow, I sound like a confident person). 
 

[Snao Cone]

Hi @OrangeSky, and welcome!

 

I'm glad to hear that it was liberating for you to identify as asexual. I felt the same way when I came to this conclusion a few years ago, in a similar way.

[Kerrylouise]

Have absolutely no libido. 

[JustmeV]

On 1/4/2018 at 8:05 PM, OrangeSky said:

I've had problems with communication with boys/men all my life. I've always been either lonely or stuck in some unresolvable love drama.

I can totally relate.

[Emberse]

I recently found this site and it has helped me so much with coming to terms with what I'm feeling. I am a grey-ace female and am so happy that I finally have a label to put with my feelings... My current issue is that I don't know how to tell my boyfriend about my sexuality without him getting, well idk, upset or something..? I love him and we have done sexual things but I always fake my enjoyment for his sake... I don't really feel anything, it's almost as if I am separated from it while its happening and zone out to ignore it? I don't enjoy sexual acts but always thought that it was normal to do them so I did. I have never had sex but my bf is strongly pushing me that direction and I have only told him that I don't want to until I'm married (religious reasons) and that I want to stick to my morals. I don't know how to tell him that his advances make me uncomfortable without upsetting him

[roland.o]

Hello and welcome to the AVEN forums, Emberse. Have some cake... :-)

 

1 hour ago, Emberse said:

I don't know how to tell my boyfriend about my sexuality without him getting, well idk, upset or something..?

For starters, don't use labels such as grey-ace with him. Because then you'd have to explain the label, instead of how you feel.

 

Tell him how you feel about sexual things. Tell him that you don't enjoy them. Tell him whether or not you are neutral or repulsed by them.

 

Maybe he'll be upset about it. Maybe he'll get over it. Or maybe not. Maybe he'll break up with you. But if that is so, it can't be helped. Better now than in a few years, after you're married and have kids. Be honest to yourself: you're not going to like this any better when you're married. And then be honest to him, and give him a choice. You don't want to deceive him into marrying you. And you don't want to spend the rest of your life pretending. Some upsetting is a small price to pay, compared to the alternatives.

[Spiderman]

23 hours ago, Emberse said:

I recently found this site and it has helped me so much with coming to terms with what I'm feeling. I am a grey-ace female and am so happy that I finally have a label to put with my feelings... My current issue is that I don't know how to tell my boyfriend about my sexuality without him getting, well idk, upset or something..? I love him and we have done sexual things but I always fake my enjoyment for his sake... I don't really feel anything, it's almost as if I am separated from it while its happening and zone out to ignore it? I don't enjoy sexual acts but always thought that it was normal to do them so I did. I have never had sex but my bf is strongly pushing me that direction and I have only told him that I don't want to until I'm married (religious reasons) and that I want to stick to my morals. I don't know how to tell him that his advances make me uncomfortable without upsetting him

If he doesn't respect your morals, no matter the reason why, then you deserve someone better than him who will respect you. I don't know how deep your feelings are for him, but dealing with him being upset/him breaking up with you is probably going to be preferable to pretending you're something you're not. I wish you the best of luck! I hope everything turns out for the best!

~MAB:)

[Cnyb]

Hello, this all can get confusing, can't it?  I have enjoyed sex, I have had sex that really took me someplace, but nonetheless, it's generally a hassle for me to initiate if I'm with someone (of similar low-drive as myself), awkward if I'm with someone with an ordinary-strength sex-drive, and I really would generally rather enjoy cake with a partner.  I've realized pursuing sex has always been a pressure or hassle about something other than sexual attraction to a person.  I'm willing to please someone who I want to spend time with, and under the right conditions, sex is a release that can be pleasant. TMI:

 

Spoiler

When I was younger and the social pressures to be dating and sexual were tremendous, I was miserable, and I pushed myself at times to be like others, but I still had difficulty spending much time trying to date and mostly only had relationships when they fell in my lap.  The sexual explorations were with tensions of fitting in, awkwardness.  The girlfriend that I stumbled upon I eventually pressured to have sex and the condom was on backwards so whatever, didn't pursue it farther and was relieved when some months later she broke up with me.  I avoided a girl who was a bit forward with me, no she wasn't teasing me but I just couldn't take myself sexually seriously I suppose.  I wondered what was wrong with me.  I didn't properly masturbate until I was 19.  In my 20's I pushed myself to experiment with guys, awkward, tense.   Eventually met up with an AFAB  similar in some important ways to myself, and we did take advantage of our relationship to have sex for release a lot in the early part of the relationship.  At my most active, we were in an open relationship, my sex drive was still lower than the typical sexual person I think.  I was still trying to explore things with guys to see what would feel natural to me, satisfying, connected.  But as my 20's rolled on I became less active, none of what I experienced was enough to drive me to continue to seek it or care for it all that much, I didn't miss it, where is the cake, I guess, is how my brain is wired.

 

So anyhow, there has been some really orgasmic times, yet I can do without them.  And I can especially do without them if I have some cuddling/massage, etc. outlet.  Sex doesn't feel essential to me, I can't identify as gay or straight or bi, maybe it's just low sex-drive and feeling like I'm looking from the outside in on any societies/cultures, even the more open/alternative ones.

 

My long-term partner and I would forget we were in a sexual relationship, for months.

 

Spoiler

From time to time it was like 'oh yeah, we could masturbate side by side to relieve tension', but sometimes we really got aroused and enjoyed ourselves completely.  Felt more like best friends than a couple, though.

 

Outside of that relationship, I went through a period trying to hook up with people, thinking it'd satisfy, but it was all a hassle I can do without, it wound up ultimately turning me off even more to dating/sexual culture.

 

I could please someone, I could get a physical release that felt good, but the hassle involved made it not really worth it.  So whatever attractions or drives I may have, I just don't see myself as a sexual person, I'm apparently asexualish for someone who's messed around so much.  I've become more asexualish and more comfortable about it, to the point where I'm feeling relief at new possibilities.

 

In recent years I have avoided seeking closer friendships or cuddling and other sensual things with anyone because I felt it would involve the hassles and complications of dating, relationships, sex compatibility, sex-drive differences, etc., stuff that I didn't want.  Now I'm thinking maybe I can find someone else who isn't looking for a sexual relationship, maybe I can put out some feelers.

 

TLDR; not looking for sex, tired of the hassles, regardless of what might float my boat or attract me.  Whatever that means.

[Snao Cone]

Hi all recently introduced people. I'm glad you're all sharing your experiences here. It can be difficult to discuss these problems, but I'm glad this is a space where people are comfortable talking about them.

[smokemeakipper]

...

[Snao Cone]

Welcome, @smokemeakipper!

 

I'm putting my response in a spoiler because it gets specific.

 

I relate a lot to what you're saying. I've always found all genders aesthetically attractive (especially androgyny), and in my younger years I started to consider myself bi - but then I realized I wasn't keen on giving or receiving cunnilingus, so I thought that I was straight. I didn't have any aversion to penises so I thought PiV was what I wanted, except I needed to force myself into situations of having it, with the help of alcohol and other loosening factors like partying away from home. This is different from your long term relationship experience, but I think there's a common element of how the appeal wore off. I very rarely pursued sex, and it wasn't until I was 30 that I started to notice that it was out of boredom/disinterest than the other excuses I'd been using. Libido was also a confusing factor, as I knew what it was like to feel aroused and want sexual pleasure, but that never translated into wanting sex with another person.

 

TMI stuff aside, when I found AVEN I first identified as grey, but now I'm simply going with asexual. Labels are useful for a mix of figuring out what you really want, and expressing your identity to others. I personally find that aro ace is all I need to express to people that I'm not looking for relationships because it's just innate to who I am. If you think gray and/or pan prefixes will help you express your feelings and your desires, then go for it! You may also find yourself wanting to give a simpler "basically asexual" from time to time, though, if that helps to dodge the occasional prying question.

[smokemeakipper]

...

[Snao Cone]

4 minutes ago, smokemeakipper said:

I guess one difference is that I'm not necessarily looking for a relationship but I'm also not not looking for one either. Being single after twelve years is certainly rewarding in its own way, given that I like my independence and space, but I think I could have a happy life with or without a long-term partner. I suppose I feel that in order to be honest with myself and them, it would be good to have a slightly clearer idea of where I'm at with all of this. I would basically need to be friends with someone before I could be with them romantically and/or sexually.

This sounds pretty solidly demi (both sexual and romantic) to me, tbh. If you feel like you're basically asexual and aromantic but there could be a chance that you develop a strong enough bond with someone to spark a sense of sexual or romantic desire, that's a common way demi folks describe their experiences. A lot of people who coming out of relationships like to have a taste of freedom before dating again, but being demi is basically feeling content without sex and romance for the rest of your life - though if you happen to find someone who does spark these things after a special bond has formed, you want to be with them.

 

I'm sure some demi people can explain it better than me, but that's my understanding of demisexuality and demiromanticism. Basically aro ace until special circumstances prove otherwise.

[smokemeakipper]

...

[Snao Cone]

24 minutes ago, smokemeakipper said:

Thanks for clarifying If using terms like asexual and aromantic, or demisexual and demiromantic, where does the sexual orientation come in? It seems confusing to have the -sexual suffix for two different aspects, e.g. pansexual asexual aromantic. Also, given that I have a take-it-or-leave-it view even if I am in a relationship, I feel like both demi and grey both apply. Are they both types of asexuality or just along an asexuality spectrum? Sorry if I'm misunderstanding anything

The way I see it is that the base orientations are hetero-, homo-, bi-, pan-, and a-. To me, gray- and demi- are added onto one of the first four, to indicate they're very close to a- but not quite. For example:

 

Demi-pansexual (or pan-demisexual, which sounds kind of like panda ) = pansexual in a technical sense, but it takes so much to form sexual bonds that in a practical sense it feels close to asexuality outside of the right relationship.

 

Gray-heterosexual = the level of sexual attraction/desire is so low and infrequent that it hardly has an effect on the person's life, but when it does it's towards the opposite gender.

 

These are just two examples; take your pick on any other combination.

 

There's a bit of a semantic debate on "gray-sexual" versus "gray-asexual" that pops up from time to time. I think gray-sexual makes more sense, because asexuality being a lack of sexuality makes it more of a fixed point that gray or demi people happen to be very very close to. The "spectrum" of these identities is not asexual in itself - this is a set of sexualities at or very close to the asexual end of a primarily sexual spectrum.

 

Anyway, I'm sort of rambling into can-of-worms territory here, so I'll stop myself before it gets any more complicated. I would say if you want to fully explain yourself, something like "demi-pan(sexual/romantic)" is one way to answer it. If you want to keep it short "basically asexual" might help curb further questions.

[Puck]

1 hour ago, smokemeakipper said:

Thanks for clarifying If using terms like asexual and aromantic, or demisexual and demiromantic, where does the sexual orientation come in? It seems confusing to have the -sexual suffix for two different aspects, e.g. pansexual asexual aromantic. Also, given that I have a take-it-or-leave-it view even if I am in a relationship, I feel like both demi and grey both apply. Are they both types of asexuality or just along an asexuality spectrum? Sorry if I'm misunderstanding anything

@Snao Cone is doing a FANTASTIC job, but to maybe help clarify more, here is the difference between romantic orientation vs sexual.

 

Sexual orientation explains who you want to have sex with.

 

Romantic orientation explains who you want to date.

 

For most people, they are aligned so they don't need to differentiate. For example, someone who is gay is probably homosexual and homoromantic, but there is not reason for them to say both. There are times when they are not aligned, the easies example being when someone is, say, homosexual but aromantic. That would mean that they liked to have sex with those of the same gender but didn't want to date anyone. They might just want hook-ups and so forth.

 

It comes out most in asexual communities because asexuals don't wish to have partnered sex but most still want a dating relationship. In order to express who they wish to date, they have to mention their romantic orientation. 

 

There are not "types" of asexuality and there is also not an asexual spectrum. There is a sexual spectrum with "sexual" on one end, "asexual" on the other and a gray area in-between. This spectrum is depicted by the triangle in the top left of the AVEN website. The bottom (where it's black) is asexual, the top is sexual and includes a corner for homo- and hetero-sexuality and the gradient in the middle represents the gray area. Gray/demi/other orientations are at times kind of "looped in" with asexuality because people feel closer to asexual than sexual. If someone is gray and has only ever felt sexual attraction once in their life, they will probably find more kinship amongst asexual than sexuals, even if they aren't actually ace. That's one of the reasons you find a lot of sexuals on this site; many of them are not ace but feel closer to it than not.

 

Hope that helps

[Cnyb]

Of course there are different types of asexuals.  Some are so asexual they never even masturbate.  Some may be so asexual they do not have sexual organs.

[Puck]

15 minutes ago, Cnyb said:

Of course there are different types of asexuals.  Some are so asexual they never even masturbate.  Some may be so asexual they do not have sexual organs.

That's not really kinds  It just describes different behaviors/experiences of those who use the ace label.

 

Some sexuals don't masturbate. Some want sex all the time, some only a few times a month... they aren't different kinds though, it just shows that the label explains what kind of partnered sexual relationship one wants and not much more.

[Cnyb]

Well it seems to me that sex isn't as important for sexuals as many tend to think...

 

...and likewise, that self-identified asexual human beings don't seem to be completely asexual, so perhaps all are some kind of gray.

[Puck]

15 minutes ago, Cnyb said:

Well it seems to me that sex isn't as important for sexuals as many tend to think...

 

...and likewise, that asexual human beings don't seem to be completely asexual, so perhaps all are some kind of gray.

It's true, not all sexuals are as sexual as most people tend to assume. And yes, there are lots of people who ID as ace who are actually willing to enter a sexual relationship.

 

I think you are right, people are more gray than most realize. I honestly think that the "asexuality movement," if you will, is exposing a glaring flaw in societies current ideas of sex; that there is so much more nuance than the idea that people just want to have sex with any attractive person they see on the street. It takes connection and experience and bonding in most people's cases.

 

However, there are indeed asexuals who have never and will never want sex. The reason the label is important is that it needs to express that asexuals are people who aren't willing to be in a sexual relationship. To then, sex isn't gray, it's black and white. It's no and yes, and they have very firmly said no.

 

Edit: For the record, your mentality there is actually a big reason people like to put the like at asexual and sexual. Even grey-sexuals are sexuals, some are more "normal" than they realize... This isn't to say their experiences aren't valid and unique, just saying that society probably made them more confused about what "normal" sexuality is than need be...

[Cnyb]

Yes, labels can still be meaningful, can still express something important and clear enough, in context.

 

At birth sexual meant that I had nads.  At the beginning of puberty sexual meant I had hormones.  At 16 sexual meant I tried to fit in but failed and didn't bother to follow up.  At 19 sexual meant I tried masturbation. Sometime after that sexual meant something other people were or that other people identified as, that I didn't "get" and struggled to understand or to try to fit into.  And then later on accepting myself, sexuality meant something I didn't have to try to fit into, something I rejected, something not identified with, thankfully with more inner peacefulness.

[Puck]

1 minute ago, Cnyb said:

Yes, labels can still be meaningful, can still express something important and clear enough, in context.

 

At birth sexual meant that I had nads.  At the beginning of puberty sexual meant I had hormones.  At 16 sexual meant I tried to fit in but failed and didn't bother to follow up.  At 19 sexual meant I tried masturbation. Sometime after that sexual meant something other people were or that other people identified as, that I didn't "get" and struggled to understand or to try to fit into.  And then later on accepting myself, sexuality meant something I didn't have to try to fit into, something I rejected, something not identified with, thankfully with more inner peacefulness.

That's a beautiful journey, glad you have found and understanding that means you understand yourself as best you can