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Telecaster68

What sexuals are really thinking

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JDP
Just now, Telecaster68 said:

That would make sense. The reason it's not standard is that sexual desire is the norm, and hence expected.

The vow to stick together for better or worse I always construed as consideration for eventual sexual differences and problems.

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Telecaster68
1 minute ago, asexjoe said:

How would you define intimacy in legal terms?

Something doesn't have to be legally defined to be a reasonable expectation.

 

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people in their sixties complaining about lack of sexual desire. [in Reddit's DeadBedrooms]

Most aren't. Most are in their 20s, 30s, and 40s.

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Gleep
Just now, asexjoe said:

How would you define intimacy in legal terms?

I don't do legal terms.

 

Passion is shagging on the kitchen counter cause you can't be bothered and can't wait as far as the bedroom.

Intimacy is not having boundaries on your innermost thoughts and feelings. I don't have anything I HAVE to hold back from my lover. I don't have to go "No, he won't appreciate it if I kiss him or touch him or hold him or ...." I don't have to hold back. I don't have to sensor myself.

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Telecaster68
Just now, asexjoe said:

The vow to stick together for better or worse I always construed as consideration for eventual sexual differences and problems.

Or lots of things that are now taken by the courts to be reasonable causes for ending the marriage. Your reasoning seems to be that doesn't include one partner being miserable if it happens to be because of sex.

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Homer
3 minutes ago, Gleep said:

Intimacy is not having boundaries on your innermost thoughts and feelings. I don't have anything I HAVE to hold back from my lover. I don't have to go "No, he won't appreciate it if I kiss him or touch him or hold him or ...." I don't have to hold back. I don't have to sensor myself.

:wub:

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JDP
21 minutes ago, Telecaster68 said:

You expected her to be part of 1% of the population in other words. Reasonable expectation?

Actually the percentage is closer to 99 percent of the population.

 

The machinery and brain chemistry behind sexual reproduction is completely unnecessary after menopause.

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Telecaster68
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Actually the percentage is closer to 99 percent of the population.

You expected her to be asexual, in essence. That's 1%.

 

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The machinery and brain chemistry behind sexual reproduction is completely unnecessary after menopause.

And yet about two-thirds of women find their libido is the same or greater after menopause. There are lots of things that are completely unnecessary about humans, but they're still real.

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JDP
23 minutes ago, Gleep said:

I don't do legal terms.

 

Passion is shagging on the kitchen counter cause you can't be bothered and can't wait as far as the bedroom.

Intimacy is not having boundaries on your innermost thoughts and feelings. I don't have anything I HAVE to hold back from my lover. I don't have to go "No, he won't appreciate it if I kiss him or touch him or hold him or ...." I don't have to hold back. I don't have to sensor myself.

You are talking about physical and emotional intimacy, not sexual intimacy.

 

Talking about innermost thoughts and feelings would also include talking about feelings and thoughts that no longer occur, correct?

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Telecaster68
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You are talking about physical and emotional intimacy, not sexual intimacy.

Physical and emotional intimacy is the major part of sexual intimacy for 99% of the population.

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JDP
1 minute ago, Telecaster68 said:

You expected her to be asexual, in essence. That's 1%.

 

And yet about two-thirds of women find their libido is the same or greater after menopause. There are lots of things that are completely unnecessary about humans, but they're still real.

No, I expected her to be normal. 99 percent.

 

I don't understand why people would even want to get married if they wanted sex that badly, all the time.

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JDP
Just now, Telecaster68 said:

Physical and emotional intimacy is the major part of sexual intimacy for 99% of the population.

OK so you're saying without sex it's impossible to have either physical or emotional intimacy?

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Perkins
1 minute ago, asexjoe said:

I don't understand why people would even want to get married if they wanted sex that badly, all the time.

For most of the population, sex is assumed to be part of the process unless stated otherwise

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Telecaster68
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No, I expected her to be normal. 99 percent.

This is the normal that is, according to one of the longest running, most robust sociological surveys there's ever been, means: sex 2-3 times a week in her 20s, 1-2 a week in her 30s, 5-6 times a month in her 40s, and continuing sex into her 70s.

 

That's not what you said you expected.

 

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I don't understand why people would even want to get married if they wanted sex that badly, all the time.

Because sex is universally accepted as being part of marriage. And 5-6 times a month isn't 'all the time'. 2-3 times a week isn't even 'all the time'.

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JDP
Just now, Perkins said:

For most of the population, sex is assumed to be part of the process unless stated otherwise

I always thought more of marriage than just sex. I guess I was wrong.

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Telecaster68
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OK so you're saying without sex it's impossible to have either physical or emotional intimacy?

For sexuals, there's no other physical or emotional intimacy that provides anything remotely similar, or intense.

 

Massages, deep conversations, watching sunsets together... all those things... are a sort of decaffeinated version of what we get from sex.

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Perkins
Just now, asexjoe said:

I always thought more of marriage than just sex. I guess I was wrong.

Well of course marriage is more, but sex is a part of it for most people.

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Telecaster68
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I always thought more of marriage than just sex. I guess I was wrong.

I always think of cars as more than their engine, but I wouldn't want a car without an engine.

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Gleep
Just now, asexjoe said:

You are talking about physical and emotional intimacy, not sexual intimacy.

 

Talking about innermost thoughts and feelings would also include talking about feelings and thoughts that no longer occur, correct?

It's like a three legged stool. Knock out the sexual intimacy from a relationship where both partners are not aces, then the whole thing falls down. Remember how you said that if one person doesn't want sex, it's basically rape? That doesn't feed what we need. I don't want to be a burden on my lover because I crave and desire him. I don't want to bother him or repulse him because I want to kiss him passionately sometimes. Or be told "QUIT IT!" when I tweak his butt. But those are knee jerk reactions. So I have to stop and censor myself. No, I can't talk to him about that because he'll find it repulsive or he'll feel obligated to or he'll .. something.

 

I'm playful. Can't help it. If I'm in a relationship, I will tease and tickle and pet and cuddle. It just happens. I can't stop myself in time... but I have to. Eeew. Stop. Quit it. GODDAMIT STOP. I'm sorry, I didn't want to... I just wanted to play. So I have to stop petting. I have to stop the almost instinctual reaction that I want to put my hand on his thigh while driving. That I'm in a good mood and want to be playful in bed.

 

Part of who I am, part of the core of what makes me, me, is unacceptable.

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JDP
1 minute ago, Telecaster68 said:

For sexuals, there's no other physical or emotional intimacy that provides anything remotely similar, or intense.

 

Massages, deep conversations, watching sunsets together... all those things... are a sort of decaffeinated version of what we get from sex.

OK, so I'm neither sexual or asexual.

 

I wish I had known that earlier. I wasted a lot of time with this intimacy nonsense.

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Serran
1 minute ago, asexjoe said:

OK, so I'm neither sexual or asexual.

 

I wish I had known that earlier. I wasted a lot of time with this intimacy nonsense.

I'm neither sexual or asexual, but I still enjoy this intimacy stuff ;) though I disagree with the versions of intimacy described in this thread. 

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JDP
2 minutes ago, Gleep said:

It's like a three legged stool. Knock out the sexual intimacy from a relationship where both partners are not aces, then the whole thing falls down. Remember how you said that if one person doesn't want sex, it's basically rape? That doesn't feed what we need. I don't want to be a burden on my lover because I crave and desire him. I don't want to bother him or repulse him because I want to kiss him passionately sometimes. Or be told "QUIT IT!" when I tweak his butt. But those are knee jerk reactions. So I have to stop and censor myself. No, I can't talk to him about that because he'll find it repulsive or he'll feel obligated to or he'll .. something.

 

I'm playful. Can't help it. If I'm in a relationship, I will tease and tickle and pet and cuddle. It just happens. I can't stop myself in time... but I have to. Eeew. Stop. Quit it. GODDAMIT STOP. I'm sorry, I didn't want to... I just wanted to play. So I have to stop petting. I have to stop the almost instinctual reaction that I want to put my hand on his thigh while driving. That I'm in a good mood and want to be playful in bed.

 

Part of who I am, part of the core of what makes me, me, is unacceptable.

I'm sorry you have to hold yourself back like that. Are you out of that mixed relationship now?

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Telecaster68
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I wasted a lot of time with this intimacy nonsense

See, seeing intimacy as a time-wasting nonsense is the bigger problem in a relationship, more than the lack of actual sexual acts. 

 

You're not the only one though - it seems to be a common subtext on AVEN.

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JDP
1 minute ago, Serran said:

I'm neither sexual or asexual, but I still enjoy this intimacy stuff ;) though I disagree with the versions of intimacy described in this thread. 

Yeah, me too. I crave intimacy but I can't get it through sex. I'd rather have a long, soulful, loving conversation.

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Gleep
Just now, asexjoe said:

I'm sorry you have to hold yourself back like that. Are you out of that mixed relationship now?

No. This is my daily life and has been for twelve years. This is what we CHOOSE to face when we say "Okay, I understand you're ace. I love you and we'll try to work through this."

 

I can't imagine life without him. He's my joy and the center of my universe. But this is what the sexuals are thinking.

 

"I'm sorry. I don't want to be a burden. Please let's not fight. I won't be as selfish. You're absolutely right."

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Telecaster68

Uh?

 

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I wasted a lot of time with this intimacy nonsense.

or...?

 

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 I crave intimacy

 

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JDP
Just now, Gleep said:

No. This is my daily life and has been for twelve years. This is what we CHOOSE to face when we say "Okay, I understand you're ace. I love you and we'll try to work through this."

 

I can't imagine life without him. He's my joy and the center of my universe. But this is what the sexuals are thinking.

 

"I'm sorry. I don't want to be a burden. Please let's not fight. I won't be as selfish. You're absolutely right."

I'm sure my wife thinks the same thing. She won't talk about it, though. She's not strong enough for that.

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Telecaster68
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She won't talk about it, though. She's not strong enough for that.

Or she's realised there's absolutely no point.

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JDP
1 minute ago, Telecaster68 said:

Uh?

 

or...?

 

 

I define it somewhat differently. I agree a lot with what Gleep says, about openness and being able to share anything, but I've never known a woman that really meant it.

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JDP
1 minute ago, Telecaster68 said:

Or she's realised there's absolutely no point.

Yes, probably. To her credit.

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Gleep
1 minute ago, Telecaster68 said:

Or she's realised there's absolutely no point.

It gets to that point. We get to where we have to censor ourselves for so long, where it's the same stupid useless pointless fight, over and over again, it's just not worth it.

 

You get the point. "I know you don't want all of me, so I'll back off." You learn how to function where you don't share that intimacy, and you lose the feeling of the two of you inside the sanctuary walls against the rest of the world because you've had to spend years placing that wall between you. Brick by brick. Rejection by rejection.

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