vega57 Posted July 16, 2017 Share Posted July 16, 2017 52 minutes ago, BionicPi said: I think the issue is sometimes people use religion as an excuse to dictate lifestyles to other people. Why should women in marriage have lots of children? The mortality rate in Demographic Transition Stage One societies is so high that really high birth rate is the only way to keep the population stable. Being chaste before marriage reduces the likelihood of a succession crisis. There are reasons why these things are said in a book. Hmm.... More interested in what you have to say. Please continue.....whether on this thread or by PM.... Link to post Share on other sites
AVEN #1 fan Posted July 16, 2017 Share Posted July 16, 2017 I still don't believe how religious people can work as soldiers and kill people. .. it's nonsense. Link to post Share on other sites
vega57 Posted July 16, 2017 Share Posted July 16, 2017 4 minutes ago, AVEN #1 fan said: It's never justifiable, you are just giving extremist Muslims the right to kill you for not being an extremist Muslim. It's like giving the jews the right to kill Jesus. Giving Hitler the right to kill jews , gypsis , gays and Trans. You know , these people had their justifications to do what they wanted to. And yeah I'm pretty sure the bibles says does not murder or judge and it's all in vain, religious people still do it. Are. You. Kidding. Me.??? You got THAT out of what I've written? Yes, "religious" people do it. But are they TRUE religious people? Probably not. Link to post Share on other sites
BionicPi Posted July 16, 2017 Share Posted July 16, 2017 17 minutes ago, vega57 said: Ever heard of "justifiable homicide?" I assume you're referring to this? Quote Voluntary manslaughter is the killing of a human being in which the offender had no prior intent to kill and acted during "the heat of passion", under circumstances that would cause a reasonable person to become emotionally or mentally disturbed. 4 minutes ago, AVEN #1 fan said: It's never justifiable, you are just giving extremist Muslims the right to kill you for not being an extremist Muslim. It's like giving the jews the right to kill Jesus. Giving Hitler the right to kill jews , gypsis , gays and Trans. Voluntary manslaughter is a legal definition, so like if you act in what you believe is self defense, and kill someone, but it isn't legally considered self defense, it may be considered voluntary manslaughter rather than homicide. Link to post Share on other sites
QuirkyGeek Posted July 16, 2017 Share Posted July 16, 2017 6 minutes ago, vega57 said: Have you read the bible? If not, I recommend reading it from cover to cover. Seriously, if you do, you will be amazed at the misinterpretations you will read. If you read it and actuay STUDY it, you'll be armed against people who try to judge you and tell you're "wrong" for being asexual. I've read some of the bible. I started reading a little bit of the Old Testament every night and found some things interesting that no one in the church had ever mentioned. Then I switched to the New Testament and reading a little bit of that every night due to a church program. I've finished the New Testament, but I kind of cheated because the person in charge of the program wanted me to have completed the New Testament, so instead of letting me to continue to read it on my own time, I was told to finish half of it by the end of the month. That's when I got audio books and ran them back to back and wasn't really listening. I guess I've read quite a bit of the beginning of both books, but not the whole thing. Link to post Share on other sites
AVEN #1 fan Posted July 16, 2017 Share Posted July 16, 2017 Just now, vega57 said: Are. You. Kidding. Me.??? You got THAT out of what I've written? Yes, "religious" people do it. But are they TRUE religious people? Probably not. Yeah. .. like many religious peopel haven't condemned me to go to hell bc they judge being queer is wrong. But still, mass murder is not justifiable, the only exception being self defense. Link to post Share on other sites
vega57 Posted July 16, 2017 Share Posted July 16, 2017 5 minutes ago, QuirkyGeek said: I've read some of the bible. I started reading a little bit of the Old Testament every night and found some things interesting that no one in the church had ever mentioned. Then I switched to the New Testament and reading a little bit of that every night due to a church program. I've finished the New Testament, but I kind of cheated because the person in charge of the program wanted me to have completed the New Testament, so instead of letting me to continue to read it on my own time, I was told to finish half of it by the end of the month. That's when I got audio books and ran them back to back and wasn't really listening. I guess I've read quite a bit of the beginning of both books, but not the whole thing. Great! And what did you learn...? Link to post Share on other sites
vega57 Posted July 16, 2017 Share Posted July 16, 2017 5 minutes ago, AVEN #1 fan said: Yeah. .. like many religious peopel haven't condemned me to go to hell bc they judge being queer is wrong. But still, mass murder is not justifiable, the only exception being self defense. If they judge you for being "queer"...whateverthehellthatmeans...it doesn't mean that GOD judges you. God is merciful...above everything. Please believe that. Link to post Share on other sites
QuirkyGeek Posted July 16, 2017 Share Posted July 16, 2017 3 minutes ago, vega57 said: Great! And what did you learn...? One thing that surprised me quite a bit was David and Jonathan together. I was reading it and wondering if it was romantic, which I thought was funny since the church had never mentioned Jonathan and deemed homosexual/romantic acts as wrong. Link to post Share on other sites
AVEN #1 fan Posted July 16, 2017 Share Posted July 16, 2017 Just now, vega57 said: If they judge you for being "queer"...whateverthehellthatmeans...it doesn't mean that GOD judges you. God is merciful...above everything. Please believe that. yeah, but the point is that these people still judge , still sin and can't stop it even if their sacred books say it's wrong. Link to post Share on other sites
vega57 Posted July 16, 2017 Share Posted July 16, 2017 9 minutes ago, BionicPi said: I assume you're referring to this? Voluntary manslaughter is a legal definition, so like if you act in what you believe is self defense, and kill someone, but it isn't legally considered self defense, it may be considered voluntary manslaughter rather than homicide. Oh geez... Murder is one thing. Was there a lot of killing in the Old Testament? Yes there was. Was it justifiable? Well, it depends on *your* definition of "justifiable" and "murder". God is not bound to *our* definitions. (which probably just confused the hell out of you, lol1) Link to post Share on other sites
BionicPi Posted July 16, 2017 Share Posted July 16, 2017 3 minutes ago, vega57 said: Oh geez... Murder is one thing. Was there a lot of killing in the Old Testament? Yes there was. Was it justifiable? Well, it depends on *your* definition of "justifiable" and "murder". God is not bound to *our* definitions. (which probably just confused the hell out of you, lol1) Could you reference some examples? Link to post Share on other sites
AVEN #1 fan Posted July 16, 2017 Share Posted July 16, 2017 Just now, QuirkyGeek said: One thing that surprised me quite a bit was David and Jonathan together. I was reading it and wondering if it was romantic, which I thought was funny since the church had never mentioned Jonathan and deemed homosexual/romantic acts as wrong. Funny how murdering, judging, eating pork or sea food, having pets , planting different seeds together, using different fabrics together, letting women to be pastors, praying with jewels, cutting your hair, reading a map or the horoscope, loving the same sex, not marrying virgin, entering a church without your genitals intact , saying god's name, being proud of yourself , etc are sins according to sacred books BUT there's exceptions when god's desires or other excuses appear. Link to post Share on other sites
vega57 Posted July 16, 2017 Share Posted July 16, 2017 4 minutes ago, AVEN #1 fan said: Funny how murdering, judging, eating pork or sea food, having pets , planting different seeds together, using different fabrics together, letting women to be pastors, praying with jewels, cutting your hair, reading a map or the horoscope, loving the same sex, not marrying virgin, entering a church without your genitals intact , saying god's name, being proud of yourself , etc are sins according to sacred books BUT there's exceptions when god's desires or other excuses appear. Why are you sticking with the Old Testament rules? The New Testament did away with many of those rules... Link to post Share on other sites
AVEN #1 fan Posted July 16, 2017 Share Posted July 16, 2017 Just now, vega57 said: Why are you sticking with the Old Testament rules? The New Testament did away with many of those rules... See. .. ^ There's always excuses to justify wrong deeds. Specially when people say they're only humans. Link to post Share on other sites
vega57 Posted July 16, 2017 Share Posted July 16, 2017 WOW! I never expected that my comments on someone else's thread would gain so much attention. I seriously can't answer all of the posts all at once! I'm sorry that it's seems to be such a hot-spot for so many people. But after reading the bible, I really DO believe that so many people got it WRON about sexuality! And...it makes sense to me. My postulates won't make sense to sexuals...or even some asexuals. After all, sex is somehow "supposed" to be a "given" to so many people. But if people actually READ the bible, and understand everything in it, they would discover a completely different avenue of life...which does NOT include sex for "pleasure" as a 'street'.. Link to post Share on other sites
vega57 Posted July 16, 2017 Share Posted July 16, 2017 3 minutes ago, AVEN #1 fan said: See. .. ^ There's always excuses to justify wrong deeds. Specially when people say they're only humans. OH...lol! I've dealt with people before who have said this...Most of the time, it's because they don't WANT to have any self-control. Link to post Share on other sites
vega57 Posted July 16, 2017 Share Posted July 16, 2017 19 minutes ago, BionicPi said: Could you reference some examples? Would love to. But I'm so friggin' tired right now.... Could we postpone this until tomorrow? PLeeeeeez????? Link to post Share on other sites
BionicPi Posted July 16, 2017 Share Posted July 16, 2017 Just now, vega57 said: Would love to. But I'm so friggin' tired right now.... Could we postpone this until tomorrow? PLeeeeeez????? Yep. I PM'd you, hopefully that went through. Link to post Share on other sites
AVEN #1 fan Posted July 16, 2017 Share Posted July 16, 2017 Just now, vega57 said: OH...lol! I've dealt with people before who have said this...Most of the time, it's because they don't WANT to have any self-control. But yeah, when people bring the "things changed" argument about the new testament they are literally saying stuff like "guys, women who didn't marry virgins does not need to be stoned to death anymore, now because the divine rules changed, yay" And the same people say that marrying the sex/gender is wrong bc "there divine doesn't want that to happen", even though things changed in society. but also the "divine" didnt want women to be pastors, and now they are, and their excuse for it is "things changed", but when we talk about queer acceptance "things cannot change ". The hypocrisy there makes me cringe so hard. Link to post Share on other sites
vega57 Posted July 16, 2017 Share Posted July 16, 2017 5 minutes ago, BionicPi said: Yep. I PM'd you, hopefully that went through. Thanks...Can I read it tomorrow..pleeeeeez? LOL! Link to post Share on other sites
erf Posted July 16, 2017 Share Posted July 16, 2017 It sucks being a Christian in this community. I question myself why I'm still get on here. There is always that one person who is like "Christians do this and that" (quoting stuff from the old testament and say that the old testament is an excuse Christians come up with). These people are honestly more insulting than the so called Christians who hate on Asexuality. I do not care what you believe in but I don't like people shaming Christians or any other religious groups. The Bible actually says not marrying and not having sex is okay. Read 1 Corinthians Chapter 7. I think I may have made some enemies on this thread but I still love you. Link to post Share on other sites
vega57 Posted July 16, 2017 Share Posted July 16, 2017 5 minutes ago, AVEN #1 fan said: But yeah, when people bring the "things changed" argument about the new testament they are literally saying stuff like "guys, women who didn't marry virgins does not need to be stoned to death anymore, now because the divine rules changed, yay" And the same people say that marrying the sex/gender is wrong bc "there divine doesn't want that to happen", even though things changed in society. but also the "divine" didnt want women to be pastors, and now they are, and their excuse for it is "things changed", but when we talk about queer acceptance "things cannot change ". The hypocrisy there makes me cringe so hard. O.k. ONE MORE POST before I go to bed (yeah..us Christian "rebels" have to sleep SOMETIME. lol) Change is inevitable throughout time. But some things do not change. If you're LBBT or asexual, you can never have children "naturally". That has never changed since the advent of time. But what exactly does that mean? Do we really believe that all people who adopt children, who are LGBT are somehow going against God's "laws"? After all...Jesus was ADOPTED. Oh man...you all gave me so much to think about. And I feel really bad about hijacking this original post...but I feel that there's soooo much that needs to be said about this dimma, that I just need to say SOMETHING about it. Thank you, OP. I will pray for you tonight. You gave me an avenue. I only hope that what I have to say to you and others will help you and the to not feel so guilty about their orientation. Link to post Share on other sites
vega57 Posted July 16, 2017 Share Posted July 16, 2017 19 minutes ago, Carson4 said: It sucks being a Christian in this community. I question myself why I'm still get on here. There is always that one person who is like "Christians do this and that" (quoting stuff from the old testament and say that the old testament is an excuse Christians come up with). These people are honestly more insulting than the so called Christians who hate on Asexuality. I do not care what you believe in but I don't like people shaming Christians or any other religious groups. The Bible actually says not marrying and not having sex is okay. Read 1 Corinthians Chapter 7. I think I may have made some enemies on this thread but I still love you. *yaaaaaaawn* I am soooooo tired of the Corinthians verses to justify sex for the sake of sex, I'm....well..I'm...just tired. The people who quote this passage always forget the last sentence of the passage. And that is, that Paul says what he says as way of CONSESSION; NOT as "command". That is, that Paul is speaking from his own 'heart'...what HE thinks "should" be. There is no "commandment". Yet, many Christian believe that it is. What a shame... Link to post Share on other sites
erf Posted July 16, 2017 Share Posted July 16, 2017 5 minutes ago, vega57 said: *yaaaaaaawn* I am soooooo tired of the Corinthians verses to justify sex for the sake of sex, I'm....well..I'm...just tired. The people who quote this passage always forget the last sentence of the passage. And that is, that Paul says what he says as way of CONSESSION; NOT as "command". That is, that Paul is speaking from his own 'heart'...what HE thinks "should" be. There is no "commandment". Yet, many Christian believe that it is. What a shame... I'm not sure if I am understanding this right but if I am, that's the point I'm making. Link to post Share on other sites
vega57 Posted July 16, 2017 Share Posted July 16, 2017 1 hour ago, Carson4 said: It sucks being a Christian in this community. I question myself why I'm still get on here. There is always that one person who is like "Christians do this and that" (quoting stuff from the old testament and say that the old testament is an excuse Christians come up with). These people are honestly more insulting than the so called Christians who hate on Asexuality. I do not care what you believe in but I don't like people shaming Christians or any other religious groups. The Bible actually says not marrying and not having sex is okay. Read 1 Corinthians Chapter 7. I think I may have made some enemies on this thread but I still love you. I agree with what you're saying. People will use whatever they can to justify their beliefs/behavior. If they really read and understood what Corinthians says, they wouldn't smugly try to apply it to their own--and other people's lives. Have you read the verse I'm talking about? Link to post Share on other sites
ItWasNiceKnowingYou Posted July 16, 2017 Share Posted July 16, 2017 @vega57 tbh (speaking as a Christian but not Catholic) there are many things the bible says that really are simple guidelines, giving examples (some outdated but the underlying "moral of the story" is the same) of what went right & what went wrong..... But humans have messed it up & taken it out of context numerous times over the course of history. I mean are there parts I don't think apply currently? Yes because time & culture changes,but the underlying life lessons still matter. And as long as those life lessons (ie Wisdom, Knowledge, Understanding, Agape Love, Self-Reflection, Self-love, etc) are being recognized & applied to one's own life & how one treat others, then things will go much more smoothly.... At least as far as growing spiritually is concerned. It's actually kinda heartbreaking how many of the people i talk to are surprised I'm talking to them because of me being religious. I have the best of friends who were surprised i wasn't constantly pushing their "faults" in their faces. Why tf would i do that? That's not my job. My job is treat you like i would want to be treated. If you can respect that i am religious, then i can respect that you aren't and/or of a different faith than me. But just like i am not shoving "my religion" down your throat, then don't try to shove your disbelief down mine or make me think i am wrong or can't coexist with you JUST because I am Christian. (Which i have had people do) Link to post Share on other sites
TheAP Posted July 16, 2017 Share Posted July 16, 2017 Moved from Intersectionality to Philosophy, Politics and Science. TheAP Intersectionality Moderator Link to post Share on other sites
ItWasNiceKnowingYou Posted July 16, 2017 Share Posted July 16, 2017 12 hours ago, arekathevampyre said: This is just upsetting . Then again , who are they to judge . I mean God/whichever religion you believe in don't/won't even judge you so who are they to say Yeah well I've also been told vulgar things by non-religious people (some things even worse than from religious folks)..... So really both "sides" can learn a thing or two about leaving people alone/ not being so quick to pass judgement. Eh it's always a lose-lose situation Link to post Share on other sites
Yatogami Posted July 16, 2017 Share Posted July 16, 2017 I don't really consider ignorance discrimination, since discrimination requires understanding. So no not really. I mean, I have had people reject the idea of Asexuality, and honestly I cannot blame them. It doesn't make sense to an outsider perspective, or a biological perspective. Then you have people confirming their beliefs constantly. (eg: Asexuals claiming they love sex looks terrible to an outsider) Then in a lot of religions, having children is a duty. Which is why unless you are becoming a priest, it's considered wrong to not have kids. Priests don't have sex, because sex is temptation. It's the same reason they don't allow for masturbation. Learning to resist temptation, and suffering through it, is the whole point. Asexuals kind of have a "cheat code" for that. So it makes the entire experience seem unfair. Link to post Share on other sites
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