vegan tells me I am an addict

[Skycaptain]

@Gizamaluke, in some parts of the world people have lived a vegan or near-vegan life since the year dot, simply because of a lack of meat in their environment. Sizeable chunks of India are a good example of this 

 

@Aebt, humans are almost unique amongst mammals in not developing lactose intolerance as part of the weaning process. Contrary to @Gizamaluke's statement we have/are evolving to tolerate dairy 

 

[Gizamaluke]

3 hours ago, Sleighcaptain said:

@Gizamaluke, in some parts of the world people have lived a vegan or near-vegan life since the year dot, simply because of a lack of meat in their environment. Sizeable chunks of India are a good example of this 

 

@Aebt, humans are almost unique amongst mammals in not developing lactose intolerance as part of the weaning process. Contrary to @Gizamaluke's statement we have/are evolving to tolerate dairy 

 

Couldn't find any studies to support ancient vegans, but I found three linking it to ecofeminists, and two linking it to colonialism. And one which stated, "regarding veganism as people in India do not generally know about the concept and they are following it just as to be the part of the motion."

 

I was wrong too, the same article states Veganism started in 1944, so Vegans could exist more that thirty years ago.

[Alawyn-Aebt]

6 hours ago, Sleighcaptain said:

simply because of a lack of meat in their environment.

Not saying that certain areas historically always did this, but there is evidence that ancient humans would bring animals with them if there was a lack of meat. Animals could also be a permanently-movable food source via its milk, which can be preserved in so many differing ways, crucial for some nomadic groups.

I am pretty sure ancient humans were not vegan, and possibly could not be vegan, otherwise what would explain many society's preponderance for bringing and having animals?

(These are generalizations, Anthropological statements like these probably have a few instances in which it could be proved wrong, but those statements are based on ancient humans in general.)

[Gizamaluke]

4 hours ago, Aebt said:

Not saying that certain areas historically always did this, but there is evidence that ancient humans would bring animals with them if there was a lack of meat. Animals could also be a permanently-movable food source via its milk, which can be preserved in so many differing ways, crucial for some nomadic groups.

I am pretty sure ancient humans were not vegan, and possibly could not be vegan, otherwise what would explain many society's preponderance for bringing and having animals?

(These are generalizations, Anthropological statements like these probably have a few instances in which it could be proved wrong, but those statements are based on ancient humans in general.)

True, a good example is rabbits which were brought everywhere by the Vikings, and another example of the lack of food available to ancient Britons.

[Epitaph]

Explain it in mathematics. A human body needs power to function.

 

You can get power from dead animals or dead plants.

 

Take your pick.

[Tanwen]

On 12/7/2018 at 10:48 PM, Aebt said:

 

then it seems quite militant, which will not help advance your cause but rather turn everyone away from helping to solve the underlying problems.

I am not the militant - that prerogative belongs to the vegans who attack butchers shops, who threaten farmers and their families, who take their protest into a restaurant where people are LEGALLY having a meal.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6433151/Vegan-activists-storm-steakhouse-force-diners-listen-sounds-slaughter.html

 

[Tanwen]

On 12/8/2018 at 6:52 AM, Sleighcaptain said:

@Gizamaluke, in some parts of the world people have lived a vegan or near-vegan life since the year dot, simply because of a lack of meat in their environment. Sizeable chunks of India are a good example of this 

 

@Aebt, humans are almost unique amongst mammals in not developing lactose intolerance as part of the weaning process. Contrary to @Gizamaluke's statement we have/are evolving to tolerate dairy 

 

Not necessarily because of lack of meat, tigers are cats - obligate carnivores - so there must have been sources of meat. There's also the religious aspect 

Neanderthals (and other early humans) were lactose intolerant because they weren't farmers. We still have Neanderthal DNA in our make up  

[Alawyn-Aebt]

4 hours ago, Frankentan said:

Neanderthals (and other early humans) were lactose intolerant because they weren't farmers.

I will point out, it was not because they were not farmers, but because the domestication of cattle had not happened yet. One could make an argument that lactose intolerance was important in the extinction of certain pre-historic humans.

4 hours ago, Frankentan said:

We still have Neanderthal DNA in our make up

We do, but not much. Even people with Red hair (such as myself), a trait inherited only from Neanderthals, don't have much Neanderthal in them.

 

[The Dryad]

I'm vegan and before that I was a vegetarian, and I've both bought the manufactured mass produced vegan food, which is just a bad for you and bad for the environment as meat and dairy, but I've evolved to a whole foods based diet, and let me tell you, I can eat off of $50 dollars a month, sometimes less.

 

I buy bulk lentils, beans, oats, soy sauce, tvp, quinoa, seeds/nuts etc. Buy fruit that's on sale and freeze it. And I tend to eat pasta and salad a lot, with iceberg lettuce because it's cheap and filled with water. I tend to buy store brand sourdoughs (which tend to be more natural and filled with less chemicals) and freeze them. Things I tend to not buy are veggie burgers, burritos, meals, cheeses, faux artisan meats etc. but I do like french fries and vegan butter.

[The Dryad]

30 minutes ago, Aebt said:

I will point out, it was not because they were not farmers, but because the domestication of cattle had not happened yet. One could make an argument that lactose intolerance was important in the extinction of certain pre-historic humans.

We do, but not much. Even people with Red hair (such as myself), a trait inherited only from Neanderthals, don't have much Neanderthal in them.

 

I was under the impression that neanderthals weren't human and neither were denisovans and other species in that time because they weren't homo sapiens but they were other compatible primates with humans.

[The Dryad]

13 hours ago, E said:

Explain it in mathematics. A human body needs power to function.

 

You can get power from dead animals or dead plants.

 

Take your pick.

Technically raw vegans eat living foods, especially sprouted things. That's why they dehydrate things, so as to not kill the "life" in food.

[Alawyn-Aebt]

1 minute ago, The Dryad said:

I was under the impression that neanderthals weren't human and neither were denisovans and other species in that time because they weren't homo sapiens but they were other compatible primates with humans.

You might be right.  Although I do think that since they were of the same genus as us they should also be called humans, but a distinction must drawn between modern humans and extinct humans.

[The Dryad]

7 minutes ago, Aebt said:

You might be right.  Although I do think that since they were of the same genus as us they should also be called humans, but a distinction must drawn between modern humans and extinct humans.

I think they're/we're called hominids? Or hominids were all early ancestral primates? Not sure, but I think scientifically there's a distinction between "human" homo sapiens and all other hominids.

[Alawyn-Aebt]

1 minute ago, The Dryad said:

I think they're/we're called hominids?

Hominids are all great apes,  Hominins are all members of the species Homo, but possibly also Pan (Chimpanzees).

[The Dryad]

6 minutes ago, Aebt said:

Hominids are all great apes,  Hominins are all members of the species Homo, but possibly also Pan (Chimpanzees).

Ah.

[Gizamaluke]

A little off topic, but the earliest human ancestor was believed to be discovered recently in China, some kind of bag with teeth.

Hiding it coz it's disturbingly ugly.

 

Spoiler

 

[Epitaph]

5 hours ago, The Dryad said:

Technically raw vegans eat living foods, especially sprouted things. That's why they dehydrate things, so as to not kill the "life" in food.

Dead animals or dying plants then. Sound more wholesome then?

[Guest]

5 hours ago, The Dryad said:

Technically raw vegans eat living foods, especially sprouted things. That's why they dehydrate things, so as to not kill the "life" in food.

It's still at the very least dying once you've yanked it from the earth or from the vine and are munching the fuck out of it  

[Skycaptain]

If it gets the fuck munched out of it, at least it'll die happy 😋 😋 

[The Dryad]

17 hours ago, E said:

Dead animals or dying plants then. Sound more wholesome then?

Lol.

[The Dryad]

21 hours ago, Gizamaluke said:

A little off topic, but the earliest human ancestor was believed to be discovered recently in China, some kind of bag with teeth.

Hiding it coz it's disturbingly ugly.

 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

Wow, was not expecting those stacked teeth, so if a person has stacked teeth is that where it comes from?

[Tanwen]

On 12/9/2018 at 4:07 PM, The Dryad said:

I was under the impression that neanderthals weren't human and neither were denisovans and other species in that time because they weren't homo sapiens but they were other compatible primates with humans.

THey must have been pretty compatible as they interbred  . I have the .Neanderthal bump' on the back of my skull, and I'm shorter than average - not sure about the 'barrel shape' - that could be down to needing to lose weight.

[The Dryad]

22 hours ago, Frankentan said:

THey must have been pretty compatible as they interbred  . I have the .Neanderthal bump' on the back of my skull, and I'm shorter than average - not sure about the 'barrel shape' - that could be down to needing to lose weight.

From what I remember about classes that took, all giant primates that early humans were-were called hominins? Not just homonids, but because of the prevalence of the sapiens vs neanderthals or denisovans, sapiens were coined "human", but also because of the social structures and adaptability that homo sapiens possessed- most humans are made up of mostly homo sapien DNA, with only slight DNA measuring of other primates like neanderthals or denisovans, and I'm sure that also accounts for why homo sapiens are coined humans more regularly than the other ancestral primates. Technically speaking though, they had to be humans because overwise "hybrids" couldn't reproduce to make modern day humans, so IDK.

 

 

I've honestly never heard of the 'neaderthal bump' before, but stranger things have happened in modern human DNA variance.

 

 

https://vegnews.com/2018/12/scientists-discover-37-million-year-old-vegan-fossil

 

But👆 that's super interesting, *cough cough, people who say veganism is new, *cough.

[Gizamaluke]

Random question but I have a vegan friend and I was wondering how to make a cake for them. Cakes are basically flour and eggs, water and sugar. Then I thought, what if I just used treacle or syrup and that way I could cut out the eggs and the sugar.

 

Anyway, is treacle and syrup vegan friendly?

[Guest Jetsun Milarepa]

On 12/9/2018 at 2:30 AM, E said:

Explain it in mathematics. A human body needs power to function.

 

You can get power from dead animals or dead plants.

 

Take your pick.

True.

I know the Dalai Lama has to eat meat because he gets sick if he sticks to a vegan diet. He keeps trying and failing to be vegan. We're all different.

My daughter eats like @The Dryad - no processed food at all. Beans , pulses, vegetables (she's not a fruit eater).

As for me I'm mainly vegetarian but have a splash of milk in my tea and the occasional mac and cheese!

 

Never catch the cold or flu...people were talking about how the latest bug is decimating the workforce here and I was asked whether I'd had flu...'yes- once- back in 1968'  - that seemed to get a belly laugh! It's true though...

[The Dryad]

4 hours ago, chandrakirti said:

True.

I know the Dalai Lama has to eat meat because he gets sick if he sticks to a vegan diet. He keeps trying and failing to be vegan. We're all different.

My daughter eats like @The Dryad - no processed food at all. Beans , pulses, vegetables (she's not a fruit eater).

As for me I'm mainly vegetarian but have a splash of milk in my tea and the occasional mac and cheese!

 

Never catch the cold or flu...people were talking about how the latest bug is decimating the workforce here and I was asked whether I'd had flu...'yes- once- back in 1968'  - that seemed to get a belly laugh! It's true though...

So true, I'm serious, I don't get sick anymore, but what affects me is seasonal pollen or dust, but it's still not as bad as most people ... I feel that I can say that safely without being superstitious either lol.

[The Dryad]

14 hours ago, Gizamaluke said:

Random question but I have a vegan friend and I was wondering how to make a cake for them. Cakes are basically flour and eggs, water and sugar. Then I thought, what if I just used treacle or syrup and that way I could cut out the eggs and the sugar.

 

Anyway, is treacle and syrup vegan friendly?

Had to look up "treacle" yes molasses is vegan and so is syrup, unprocessed sugar is vegan and organic maple syrup is vegan (I've heard that unorganic can sometimes have lard added when it's boiled)

 

The simplest vegan friendly cake is a wacky cake- which was created in wartime rationing time I think....or the great depression....not sure, but there are many varations, chocolate, vanilla, pumpkin spice, and the last time I made a wacky cake I made a simple sugar glaze to top it.... nothing too special. Hope this helps!

[Guest Jetsun Milarepa]

I noticed an egg substitute in a local health food shop recently, it seemed to be a thickening agent like cornflour. Undecided. I think the wacky cake sounds great. I wonder if we went back to the WWII ration diet, we'd be better off ( and so would the planet).

[Jusey1]

Sounds like your friend is a terrible person and should become an ex-friend... He would if I was in your situation. I have a strong belief that everyone is free to make their own choices, no matter what you may think of those choices.

 

I personally don't agree with vegans and consider meat to be important to eat, and I will gladly eat it. (Though, I am also a raptor from a frozen moon, so it is in our frozen blood to hunt and enjoy meat).

[Alaska Native Manitou]