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Tarfeather

"Kinky" stuff instead of sex?

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Tarfeather

TMI ahead warning: Some explicit sexual stuff

 

When I started out in the relationship with my asexual partner, I had no clue about sex. Well, I still mostly don't, but bear with me here. What I thought at first was that I'd desire genital contact with her. Basically what you think of when you hear sex. I thought this for a really long time, because it was not something she was ready for, for almost 2 years.

 

But when she did become okay with it and we experimented with me touching her genitals, while at first it was exciting and interesting to me, I quickly realized that she didn't have much of a reaction to it, and quite frankly.. it became boring.

 

We haven't stopped experimenting, however, and I noticed that maybe my preconceptions were wrong. See, because of her asexual and very "innocent" nature, I thought it'd be best to focus on "vanilla sex", as that in general is seen by society as the "innocent" and "okay" stuff. I thought it'd be best to take it very slow and draw it out, so that she has as much time as possible to get used to it and maybe learn to enjoy it.

 

However, of course, as an asexual person, she can't draw enjoyment out of the genital stuff itself, and actually drawing it out is making her less comfortable with it and basically just expending her good will, while I don't get much out of it. Through experimentation I've slowly learned that a different approach works much better for us.

 

One thing that's been really enjoyable for me, and not too much of a stress for her, has been lingeree. Just watching my partner put on something like that, and knowing it's purely for my sake, gives me a sense of satisfaction. Another has been her during our sexytimes assuming, well, "vulnerable" positions and me touching her at that. And by touching I don't necessarily mean sexual / genital, but actually I found that stroking / massaging her, or even tickling her, works out really well, and is enjoyable for both of us. The part of her being vulnerable, gives me a sense of being empowered, and also of her trusting me a lot, both of which feel satisfying to me in a sexual way.

 

The important part is to keep these sessions short. 15 minutes, 30 at most. Then back to regular cuddling and doing other things together. When we do it like that, at worst it'll be a slightly uncomfortable experience for her, made up for by the other stuff we do on that day, but sometimes she actually enjoys it. Specifically, I think she also gets some sort of satisfaction out of trying new things, out of making herself vulnerable and putting trust in me, so it ends up working out for both of us.

 

This has been a slow process for me to become consciously aware of, but lately it's really hit me, and made me wonder about the consequences. I know very little about concepts like fetishes, kink and BDSM, but the very little I heard makes me think that those concepts might encompass what's working for me and my partner. And if that's so, maybe I should properly research those subjects and start introducing what I learn to my partner?

 

It just seems weird, because that kind of stuff is usually frowned upon by mainstream society, particularly in those areas where Christian tradition still defines moral values. And yet, it seems that for an "innocent" asexual, these things might actually work out better than normal, "innocent" sex? Hmm..

 

Thoughts?

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_V_
1 hour ago, Tarfeather said:

maybe I should properly research those subjects and start introducing what I learn to my partner?

Learning is always a good idea. If you're willing to take the time, most definitely read up on things, ask other people about their experiences, and talk with your partner. You should both do what satisfies you, whatever that may be. I wouldn't worry about the opinions of other people. They're not in your home with you, and most people have a few "dirty" interests of their own. As long as both of you are okay with trying things, I see no harm in it.

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Moophie

I think this is absolutely fantastic!

 

There's a mistaken belief that sex is incomplete unless someone climaxes. And that couldn't be more wrong. It can be about nothing but the sensation of touch. Physical or even not. 

 

Kinks are not bad or weird as some people would have you believe. Some simply don't work for some and work well for others. And they're an excellent, excellent way to experience new sensations and feelings.

 

Even if you don't want to call it sex, understandable, what you have is quite possibly one of the best interpretations of it I've ever heard. You've found a way that seems to work for your asexual partner to enjoy something comparable to sex while not being made to feel uncomfortable. Something that's been crafted just for her. How wonderful!

 

While I understand concern at the thought of what's frowned upon by society; ignore them. I don't think it's the intention, but societal expectations only succeed in doing one thing: hold people back. Prevent us from understanding those who are different, make us feel shame about something as normal as sex, and keep us all in the same, useless box.

 

I wish more people were as imaginative and explorative as you!

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Naosuu

So first, major props to your progress, patience and willingness to try things out with your partner. Here's some cake :cake: It sounds like everything you've tried so far has been in the right direction.

 

Just keep in mind is that every couple's sex life is very particular to that couple. I personally have no doubt that some couples only have PIV sex whereas others don't even go near it. So whatever you think you should be doing according to "society"? Utter nonsense. You're doing yourself a major disservice by trying to be "normal" by "society's" standards; because the greatest secret is that we're all a little crazy ;). Ultimately, what goes on between you and your special one is between you two. The sooner you realize you aren't living up to anyone's standards but your own, the better.

 

In regards to the kinky things, you could definitively try it out. The important thing is to find out what works for both of you. Honestly, the rabbit hole goes pretty deep if you so please; a popular resource is Fetlife. Buuuutt maybe you could also take a look at the Gray area? It's probably a lot less intimidating than going on Fetlife and a lot of people who post there talk about their kinky tendencies. It could be a good baby pool to dip into.

 

Keep it up. It's always so refreshing to hear a good mixed relationship working out :cake:

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Serran

It sounds like you're dipping your toes into a potential dom/sub dynamic and if the empowerment / trust thing is what sparks interest in both of you, then you should probably research it more. There are a lot of ways to do dominant / submissive play without sex being involved. And yes, some asexuals are more comfortable with that than "vanilla sex". 

 

Personally, I don't think I'd be into the idea of having "traditional" sex with any frequency anymore. It's long, it's boring, it's messy and my tolerance for it has just been destroyed. But, certain aspects of BDSM can be OK. Dressing up is like playing with costumes. Being tied up and powerless means I'm not expected to react / participate as much, just put my trust in someone else. Being the one doing the tying up can be like a game, rather than some stressful "lets get to this point and have sex" ordeal. Especially if sex itself is never the end game in it. 

 

I still am not interested in it for myself. If I was with someone not into it, I wouldn't care and it wouldn't be a thing. However, if I was with a partner that wanted BDSM/fetish stuff, it'd be easier (depending on the fetish) than traditional sex just because it's ... less boring, less pressure on me to be sexual, more stuff to distract myself with (like how fancy can I get with the knots? Planning elaborate costumes, etc). And I am capable of trusting a partner, so I can give the ultimate trust that is so important to a BDSM scenario. I can't give sexual desire, which is important to a traditional sexual scenario. 

 

Before you do anything though, please do research how to do it safely. Safe words are key if you try any sort of kink/fetish. Even if it's a tame one, that way if either of you feel uncomfortable it ends right there, one word or non-verbal action. 

 

And there is nothing dirty, nasty, or bad about any of it btw. It's totally fine to be interested in fetish/kink play. 

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Tarfeather
55 minutes ago, Moophie said:

There's a mistaken belief that sex is incomplete unless someone climaxes. And that couldn't be more wrong. It can be about nothing but the sensation of touch. Physical or even not.

But I like being technically-a-virgin. ;(

 

55 minutes ago, Moophie said:

While I understand concern at the thought of what's frowned upon by society; ignore them. I don't think it's the intention, but societal expectations only succeed in doing one thing: hold people back. Prevent us from understanding those who are different, make us feel shame about something as normal as sex, and keep us all in the same, useless box.

Thing is, she was brought up in a rather Christian family. Which is confusing to me, because she doesn't actually seem to have any conservative Christian values. But she does say she believes in God and whatnot. Just apparently her very own version of it. I'm very certain though her father, who is a very cool guy otherwise, would not be okay with some of the stuff we've been doing. No matter. He need never know. :3

 

54 minutes ago, Naosuu said:

In regards to the kinky things, you could definitively try it out. The important thing is to find out what works for both of you. Honestly, the rabbit hole goes pretty deep if you so please; a popular resource is Fetlife. Buuuutt maybe you could also take a look at the Gray area? It's probably a lot less intimidating than going on Fetlife and a lot of people who post there talk about their kinky tendencies. It could be a good baby pool to dip into.

Thanks for the pointers, I will return to this post when I'm in the mindset to start delving into this.

 

Also, thanks for the praise, but actually I've been doing a lot of bad things in this relationship, and I've also made some mistakes with regards to our "sex life" (hah funny term). I'm trying to better myself for sure, though, and the latest development are certainly a result of me having made progress with regards to accepting her "no" and looking out more for her needs. She wouldn't trust me this much otherwise. But I'm definitely prone to making mistakes.

 

@Serran: Yeah, I remember you writing a little about those things, I think what I learned from you is part of why I'm thinking of it in these terms lately. So thanks for that, and thanks for giving me feedback here.

 

53 minutes ago, Owly McOwlFace said:

I still am not interested in it for myself. If I was with someone not into it, I wouldn't care and it wouldn't be a thing. However, if I was with a partner that wanted BDSM/fetish stuff, it'd be easier (depending on the fetish) than traditional sex just because it's ... less boring, less pressure on me to be sexual, more stuff to distract myself with (like how fancy can I get with the knots? Planning elaborate costumes, etc). And I am capable of trusting a partner, so I can give the ultimate trust that is so important to a BDSM scenario. I can't give sexual desire, which is important to a traditional sexual scenario.

Yep, she's actually a little different in that respect.. although so slightly so it's hard to notice. For instance, sometimes during our sexytimes she'll talk about being "excited" or "hot", so I think there's something she does experience, it's just very rare and easy to miss. Also

 

TMI

Spoiler

The first time she touched my penis, it actually felt to me like she was enjoying herself, and when I asked her about it afterward she said that it was a pleasant experience to her.

 

So.. she might actually be "gray", I guess? Just her reactions happen so rarely, to me as someone who desires sex regularly it feels like she's asexual because it's so subtle.


 

Quote

Before you do anything though, please do research how to do it safely. Safe words are key if you try any sort of kink/fetish. Even if it's a tame one, that way if either of you feel uncomfortable it ends right there, one word or non-verbal action. 

 

Hmm.. interesting point. I don't think it'll come up, but I guess this is kinda like a seatbelt.. You don't expect to crash your car, but it's still worth to put on the seatbelt just in case. Having a safeword would be similar for us, as usually I can tell by her bodylanguage when she's uncomfortable. But it's a good idea, I'll definitely make sure to establish that with her if we ever do anything in that direction.

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Moophie
14 minutes ago, Tarfeather said:

But I like being technically-a-virgin. ;(

 

Thing is, she was brought up in a rather Christian family. Which is confusing to me, because she doesn't actually seem to have any conservative Christian values. But she does say she believes in God and whatnot. Just apparently her very own version of it. I'm very certain though her father, who is a very cool guy otherwise, would not be okay with some of the stuff we've been doing. No matter. He need never know. :3

 

Hey, whatever you like! It's convenient anyway; virginity being a myth, it's perfectly safe in your head. Hee hee, sorry, I'm being naughty today.

 

Meh, that's cool. I'm atheist but lots of my religious-background friends are like that. I'm definitely on the 'who cares what others say' side of things, but different things are important to different people. But lookit you bein' all sneaky-like! ;p

 

On another note: as long as you've learned from your mistakes, don't be too hard on yourself.

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Serran
22 minutes ago, Tarfeather said:

 

Hmm.. interesting point. I don't think it'll come up, but I guess this is kinda like a seatbelt.. You don't expect to crash your car, but it's still worth to put on the seatbelt just in case. Having a safeword would be similar for us, as usually I can tell by her bodylanguage when she's uncomfortable. But it's a good idea, I'll definitely make sure to establish that with her if we ever do anything in that direction.

Yeah, it kind of is like that. In most cases, the safe word is never going to be used. The dom/sub discuss hard limits/soft limits before hand. There is a large amount of trust involved. People tend to think of BDSM as a violent, or "abusive" fetish for some reason but, really it's all about complete and total trust in your partner. Allowing yourself to submit to them, enjoying that they trust you to hold their limits as they submit to you, etc. The safe word is just there because sometimes it can get really intense and you might need it to stop and you know you can make it do so at any point, by just doing your safe word/action, so it's a layer of comfort more than anything. Unless you're doing something more extreme, in which case, it's for personal safety as well. 

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Tarfeather
37 minutes ago, Moophie said:

Hey, whatever you like! It's convenient anyway; virginity being a myth, it's perfectly safe in your head. Hee hee, sorry, I'm being naughty today.

A myth?! Oh no, so I won't become a wizard on my thirtieth birthday? :(
 

Quote

Meh, that's cool. I'm atheist but lots of my religious-background friends are like that. I'm definitely on the 'who cares what others say' side of things, but different things are important to different people. But lookit you bein' all sneaky-like! ;p

 

Agnostic atheist here. Yeah, I tend to agree, but when there's someone you have a lot of respect for and whose judgement you value, and you know there's an aspect of your life they'd take issue with, that kind of stinks. It's actually helping me a lot, having the people here, who I know are by no means sex crazed lunatics, assure me that this kind of thing is fine. Thanks, guys. ^^

 

Quote

On another note: as long as you've learned from your mistakes, don't be too hard on yourself.

Aww, that's sweet of you. I try. Some, it appears, would hold my mistakes against me for the rest of my life, but luckily I have the option of cutting those people out of my life. And my partner's always the first to be understanding of me and forgive me, something I'm really grateful for.

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Lara Black

Hello, Tar.

That’s a very interesting concept – achieving shared intimacy not by genital contact, but through other means.

I think, my partner and I have something similar - without any form of traditional sex he makes me feel completely open, trusting, vulnerable - just by touching and kissing me. And for me these feelings seem to be closely linked with his asexuality – it’s as if we’re walking the edge every time, and I feel him pushing his boundaries for me. To tell you the truth, this feeling of “danger”, emotional “nakedness” is significantly more thrilling for me than years of casual marital sex used to be (and even than trying out some really kinky stuff with a sexual person).

The way I see it, physical intimacy is achieved through "offering" your body to the partner, true openness and maybe a bit of good fear and excitement that come with that. How you reach these feelings – through traditional sex or otherwise – is much too personal a matter for outsiders to judge.

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Law of Circles

That sounds like a fun and creative way to approach physical intimacy. :)

 

Kink is often depicted as a very sexual thing - and for many people, it is - but I feel like it can afford more options than "traditional sex" as far as deriving non-sexual enjoyment goes, given that everyone involved is into it. Being tickled isn't sexual to me, for example, but it still gives me a really pleasant non-sexual rush. Some forms of kink require creativity and imagination, like dressing up and enacting elaborate role-playing scenes. Rope bondage can be very artistic and crafty as well, both on a tactile and an aesthetic level. Learning new rope ties and knots can sometimes feel like having a naughtier version of crocheting for a hobby. :P

 

Anyway, there are lots of resources on the internet for learning about kink. To some extent, where to look depends on what you want to try. Generally speaking, communication is important to any kind of kink. Someone above already mentioned safe words, which is great, but have you heard of aftercare yet? Aftercare refers to the ways in which partners take care of each other after a scene. Kink can get very intense sometimes, and aftercare provides a way for both partners to wind down and discuss how they felt about what happened. It often involves cuddling and conversation (it sounds like you are already doing some of this anyway), but exactly what works best depends on you and your partner's needs. I feel like good aftercare practices could be especially important in a mixed relationship scenario like yours, since both partners could potentially be having very different internal experiences during kinky play, and it's good for each person to get a sense of what's going on in the other person's head.

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Moophie
6 hours ago, Tarfeather said:

A myth?! Oh no, so I won't become a wizard on my thirtieth birthday? :(
 

Agnostic atheist here. Yeah, I tend to agree, but when there's someone you have a lot of respect for and whose judgement you value, and you know there's an aspect of your life they'd take issue with, that kind of stinks. It's actually helping me a lot, having the people here, who I know are by no means sex crazed lunatics, assure me that this kind of thing is fine. Thanks, guys. ^^

 

Aww, that's sweet of you. I try. Some, it appears, would hold my mistakes against me for the rest of my life, but luckily I have the option of cutting those people out of my life. And my partner's always the first to be understanding of me and forgive me, something I'm really grateful for.

LOL. No, no sorry. No wizarding school for you. I wanted to be a dragon through most of my adolescence, and if I can't haz dat you can't haz ur spellz!

 

Indeed. It must weigh more heavily when you actually care for the person who's opinion may be less than open. I told mine to eat it. But then they are all bitches. Also, you're welcome! ;p

 

Well, you're hardly the only one to make mistakes. Sometimes there's only one way to know better. It's awesome you two seem to have such a stellar relationship!

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Tarfeather

Looking at fetlife right now, but apparently you need to sign up before you can even view anything there? Is signing up worth it if I don't intend to participate in the community?

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helana12_03
On 1/21/2017 at 8:45 AM, Tarfeather said:

TMI ahead warning: Some explicit sexual stuff

 

When I started out in the relationship with my asexual partner, I had no clue about sex. Well, I still mostly don't, but bear with me here. What I thought at first was that I'd desire genital contact with her. Basically what you think of when you hear sex. I thought this for a really long time, because it was not something she was ready for, for almost 2 years.

 

But when she did become okay with it and we experimented with me touching her genitals, while at first it was exciting and interesting to me, I quickly realized that she didn't have much of a reaction to it, and quite frankly.. it became boring.

 

We haven't stopped experimenting, however, and I noticed that maybe my preconceptions were wrong. See, because of her asexual and very "innocent" nature, I thought it'd be best to focus on "vanilla sex", as that in general is seen by society as the "innocent" and "okay" stuff. I thought it'd be best to take it very slow and draw it out, so that she has as much time as possible to get used to it and maybe learn to enjoy it.

 

However, of course, as an asexual person, she can't draw enjoyment out of the genital stuff itself, and actually drawing it out is making her less comfortable with it and basically just expending her good will, while I don't get much out of it. Through experimentation I've slowly learned that a different approach works much better for us.

 

One thing that's been really enjoyable for me, and not too much of a stress for her, has been lingeree. Just watching my partner put on something like that, and knowing it's purely for my sake, gives me a sense of satisfaction. Another has been her during our sexytimes assuming, well, "vulnerable" positions and me touching her at that. And by touching I don't necessarily mean sexual / genital, but actually I found that stroking / massaging her, or even tickling her, works out really well, and is enjoyable for both of us. The part of her being vulnerable, gives me a sense of being empowered, and also of her trusting me a lot, both of which feel satisfying to me in a sexual way.

 

The important part is to keep these sessions short. 15 minutes, 30 at most. Then back to regular cuddling and doing other things together. When we do it like that, at worst it'll be a slightly uncomfortable experience for her, made up for by the other stuff we do on that day, but sometimes she actually enjoys it. Specifically, I think she also gets some sort of satisfaction out of trying new things, out of making herself vulnerable and putting trust in me, so it ends up working out for both of us.

 

This has been a slow process for me to become consciously aware of, but lately it's really hit me, and made me wonder about the consequences. I know very little about concepts like fetishes, kink and BDSM, but the very little I heard makes me think that those concepts might encompass what's working for me and my partner. And if that's so, maybe I should properly research those subjects and start introducing what I learn to my partner?

 

It just seems weird, because that kind of stuff is usually frowned upon by mainstream society, particularly in those areas where Christian tradition still defines moral values. And yet, it seems that for an "innocent" asexual, these things might actually work out better than normal, "innocent" sex? Hmm..

 

Thoughts?

As an asexual that isn't touch adverse I would be perfectly ok with many "kinky" things that don't involve touching or seeing genitals. I found some of these things exciting when I first tried them because these things were new to me and I was perfectly comfortable doing them. Unfortunately based on my experience overtime sexuals often want more and get frustrated at some point because the sex part never happens. If it works for you than that's awesome :). But you probably want to make sure your partner is actually comfortable with everything you're doing because asexuals often aren't comfortable with many things that sexuals are very comfortable with. For example, many asexuals are extremely uncomfortable with french kissing, sexy lingerie and breast touching. Like I would be comfortable wearing lingerie that doesn't show too much. I wouldn't be comfortable wearing anything too revealing.

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Ettina

Sex-repulsed ace here. I could see myself liking touching another woman's breasts or a man's chest, but nothing below the belt, and no kissing. (Except maybe me kissing them, on the neck or someplace similar.)

I am interested in fetish fics involving magical mind control and regression (but no actual sex), but I don't think I'd enjoy role-playing any of that. It would just feel too weird and fake, I think. I could see myself enjoying it if I actually had real mind control, but then there would be serious ethical issues with that.

Even if it's not technically a turn on for them, I could see an asexual enjoying kinky sex more because it's simply more interesting. Vanilla sex is just sexual, while kinky sex could include the ace's nonsexual interests. And some kinks don't even require doing anything that would normally be considered sexual.    

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CozyPosie
On 1/22/2017 at 0:09 PM, Tarfeather said:

Looking at fetlife right now, but apparently you need to sign up before you can even view anything there? Is signing up worth it if I don't intend to participate in the community?

I'm a member of fetlife, and there is a plethora of information through groups that have interests in various kinks. I find that many of the members are helpful, insightful, and accommodating and non-judgemental to newbies.

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_Keenan

On some level, I think certain kinks and practices (rope and Shabiri) can be very sensual and bring me closer to a partner on a deeper level (more so than sex, in my eyes). Ultimately, it's about finding out what works for you. I, personally, like the feeling of rope being wrapped around me and putting trust in my partner - it's a wonderful feeling. [I separate kink from sex.]

--

And yes, FetLife is great for exploring and learning the ropes (tehe). There are munches (kinky gatherings) and events you can find in your local area to help with education on the topic.

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