Master Trump Thread

[hydepark123]

In the last couple of days I've learned:

 

-  Trump in December was going to install Kash Patel (ex Nunes aide known for helping obstruct the Mueller probe and 1st impeachment) into the non-Senate confirmed position of deputy CIA director, then fire Gina Haspel the next day so Patel would then become de-facto head of the CIA.  Didn't happen because Haspel threatened to resign and the subsequent media stink would've defeated whatever the object was.

 

https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2021/01/embedding-with-pentagon-leadership-in-trumps-chaotic-last-week

 

https://www.axios.com/kash-patel-cia-gina-haspel-757b92c0-82a5-457b-bde8-d0d683ee222e.html

 

-  Trump in early January, before the insurrection, tried to oust Jeffrey Rosen as acting attorney general, and install Jeffrey Clark, who apparently is a known Trump loyalist who was prepared to announce that the DOJ was investigating irregularities in Georgia,  The US attorney in Georgia was forced out anyway.  Clark's appointment didn't go through because four or five leading DOJ heads threatened to resign and Trump didn't want that publicity.

 

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/01/22/us/politics/jeffrey-clark-trump-justice-department-election.html

 

-  Some of the insurrectionists were receiving real time information as to the location of the likes of Pelosi and Pence.

 

https://uk.finance.yahoo.com/news/pelosi-weighs-charges-that-gop-members-gave-aid-and-comfort-to-rioters-193221403.html

 

And yet attitudes seemed to have hardened amongst GOP senators who are likely to acquit Trump,citing unity etc. 

 

 

[Fraggle Underdark]

15 hours ago, Unleash the Echidnas said:

Feminism isn't my field but I don't think there's anything particularly deep here.

The article talked about "truth-telling principles and practices" so I was kind of curious what those are. My leading hypotheses are something about sharing honest experiences of sexism and increased difficulties, or being particularly honest in general as a tool against sexist oppression, or some amalgamation of those.

[Tabula Rasa]

The problem goes deeper than the former president. The problem is a fundamental belief in a white supremacist utopia. Whatever or whoever gets in the way of this fantasy is deemed the enemy. It's a blight that has spread for over 400 years.

 

What I wonder about now is where moderate conservative Republicans will go from here. They're in a social and political wilderness.

[hydepark123]

22 minutes ago, Tabula Rasa said:

The problem goes deeper than the former president. The problem is a fundamental belief in a white supremacist utopia. Whatever or whoever gets in the way of this fantasy is deemed the enemy. It's a blight that has spread for over 400 years.

 

What I wonder about now is where moderate conservative Republicans will go from here. They're in a social and political wilderness.

As Barack Obama said:

 

“America is the first real experiment in building a large, multiethnic, multicultural democracy. And we don’t know yet if that can hold. There haven’t been enough of them around for long enough to say for certain that it’s going to work.”

[Tja]

Disgusting how these republican deplorables in the government are still saying the election was rigged.

All to put on a show to "investigate", then say they've not found any fraud. To cover their lies, and their asses.

 

Also, their complaining of Democrats "dividing" the nation, when that's all they've supported, and participated in, for 4 years.

 

Bunch of trumpholes. ( . )

[Fraggle Underdark]

As everyone knows, unity means ignoring any consequences or responsibility for anyone's actions. (Sorry, that was silly. it's actually just about avoiding consequences for my actions.)

[Unleash the Echidnas]

Updates on what I suppose might be called grassroots Trumpism.

 

Right-wing extremists stage ‘meme war’ to compete for Trump supporters

Quote

“This has been very energizing for far-right movements,” Lindsay Schubiner, program director at Portland, Ore.-based Western States Center, said of the Capitol attack. “We are still concerned that they will bring that energy home to conduct anti-democratic activity targeting state legislative sessions and capitals.… The core of these movements is likely to become even more hardcore and violent.”

 

Violent attacks by right-wing extremists have become rallying cries in the past. The wife and son of white separatist Randy Weaver were lauded by some as martyrs when they were killed in a siege at Ruby Ridge in Idaho in 1992. Three years later, Timothy McVeigh’s bombing of the federal building in Oklahoma City, which killed 168 people, inspired numerous attempted copycats, according to FBI records. The 2014 showdown over land rights between Nevada rancher Cliven Bundy and federal officials, and another standoff two years later at an Oregon wildlife refuge, where supporter Robert LaVoy Finicum was fatally shot, spurred a wave of outrage on the right.

 

Schubiner, who tracks activity by right-wing extremists, said some have chosen to work within the political system, shifting their focus from disputing Trump’s loss to joining local races.

 

“They are spreading bigotry to build political power. Many times that looks like running for local or even state-level offices,” she said, with some already running for school boards, city councils and Republican Party precinct slots.

 

National Terrorism Advisory System Bulletin - January 27, 2021

Quote

• DHS is concerned these same drivers to violence will remain through early 2021 and some DVEs may be emboldened by the January 6, 2021 breach of the U.S. Capitol Building in Washington, D.C. to target elected officials and government facilities.
• DHS remains concerned that Homegrown Violent Extremists (HVEs) inspired by foreign terrorist groups, who committed three attacks targeting government officials in 2020, remain a threat.
• Threats of violence against critical infrastructure, including the electric, telecommunications and healthcare sectors, increased in 2020 with violent extremists citing misinformation and conspiracy theories about COVID-19 for their actions.

 

‘Trump Just Used Us and Our Fear’: One Woman’s Journey Out of QAnon

Quote

“At some point I realized, ‘Oh, there’s a reason this doesn’t fit,’” she said. “We are being manipulated. Someone is having fun at our expense.”

 

Her journey out of that world could be instructive: As the country begins to sort through the political fallout from four years of Donald J. Trump, one looming question is what will happen with the followers of QAnon and other anti-establishment conspiracy theories that have been bending Americans’ perceptions of reality.

 

There are signs that some have lost faith: Mr. Trump left Washington last week, blowing a hole through a key QAnon belief — that Mr. Trump, not President Biden, was the one who would be inaugurated on Jan. 20. But others are doubling down, and experts believe that some form of the QAnon conspiracy theory will remain deeply embedded in the nation’s culture by simply morphing to incorporate the new developments, as it has before.

 

I called Arizona for Biden on Fox News. Here’s what I learned

Quote

Whatever the platform, the competitive advantage belongs to those who can best habituate consumers, which in the stunted, data-obsessed thinking of our time, means avoiding at almost any cost impinging on the reality so painstakingly built around them. As outlets have increasingly prioritized habituation over information, consumers have unsurprisingly become ever more sensitive to any interruption of their daily diet.

 

The rebellion on the populist right against the results of the 2020 election was partly a cynical, knowing effort by political operators and their hype men in the media to steal an election or at least get rich trying. But it was also the tragic consequence of the informational malnourishment so badly afflicting the nation.

 

When I defended the call for Biden in the Arizona election, I became a target of murderous rage from consumers who were furious at not having their views confirmed.

 

[hydepark123]

History doesn't necessarily repeat, but it often rhymes:

 

https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2021/01/30/heres-what-happens-to-a-conspiracy-driven-party-463944

 

EDIT - Should have said when posting:  Article examines similarities between the "Know Nothing" movement of the 1840s/1850s and Trumpism.

[Unleash the Echidnas]

On the tenth day of Biden, the Authoritarian Party brought to me

One mini-Trump

And a Jewish space laser conspiracy

 

Greene might turn out to be kind of an interesting test case for the current political mood and the locality discussed in the article @hydepark123 linked above. The questions she prompts about the intersection of elected authority, party processes, and congressional structure aren't new but the workplace safety aspect is different from usual.

 

As Democrats Call For Marjorie Taylor Greene's Removal, Republicans Stay Silent

Quote

Some Republicans outside of Congress have condemned Greene. After the liberal group Media Matters reported this week on another conspiracy theory Greene had endorsed — that the November 2018 wildfires in California may have been caused by lasers from space linked to the Rothschild company — the Republican Jewish Coalition said it was "offended and appalled." Other Jewish leaders have also vigorously condemned Greene's embrace of "antisemitic canards."

 

House Republicans have long known that Greene could be a problem for their party. "Everybody was well aware of her previous persona and who she is," John Cowan, who challenged Greene during last summer's primary runoff, told Axios. "Maybe they just assumed that the awe of winning an election would calm her down a little bit, and so she would actually be interested in governing and be interested in policy, and she's just clearly not."

 

Expelling Marjorie Taylor Greene Is Just Crazy Talk (opinion piece but more in depth than most)

Quote

What treatment does Greene deserve? Congress has avoided the nuclear option of expulsion over the years, preferring instead to coax misbehaving members into resigning or not running again. By avoiding expulsion, Congress seems to have endorsed the idea that feral congresscritters like Greene are not their problem but one that belongs to the voters. It’s up to them, not other legislators, to swing the disciplinary rod by voting them out of office, as they ultimately did Steve King. (The Constitution does not allow for the recall of senators and representatives by voters.) In a case like Greene’s, where she appears to have broken no laws—notice the craft in her statement where she avoided directly saying that somebody should be murdered—and so far has not violated any congressional rules, it seems likely that Congress will bow to tradition and let the voters police her speech. This means we’ll have to wait until 2022 for resolution, when voters get their opportunity to hit the ejection button.

 

But will Georgia voters can Greene? Probably not. Her district is overwhelmingly Republican, and thanks to an endorsement by Donald Trump she won her Republican primary run-off handily in 2020 and obliterated her general election opponent, who unofficially withdrew. CNN visited her district on Thursday and interviewed voters who still support her. That support appears to run deep. As the New Yorker reported in the fall, Greene represents a bright-red part of Georgia that a generation ago repeatedly sent Larry McDonald to Congress. McDonald did not merchandise the same weirdo politics as Greene does, but he came close. [...] Georgia probably would have continued sending McDonald to Washington had he not been on the Korean Airlines Flight 007 the Soviets shot down in 1983.

[Gentle Giant]

Ugh! We just finally get rid of Trump and now we get Greene, another rotten despicable person!

[Unleash the Echidnas]

Legislation seeking to change voter turnout tripled in January. Bills are mapped in the report, including vote restriction attempts in Arizona, Pennsylvania, and Georgia. I don't have a baseline for electoral vote allocations or NIPVC adoption.

 

Voting Laws Roundup 2021

Quote

In a backlash to historic voter turnout in the 2020 general election, and grounded in a rash of baseless and racist allegations of voter fraud and election irregularities, legislators have introduced three times the number of bills to restrict voting access as compared to this time last year. Twenty-eight states have introduced, prefiled, or carried over 106 restrictive bills this year (as compared to 35 such bills in fifteen states on February 3, 2020).

 

Of course, other state lawmakers are seizing on an energized electorate and persistent interest in democracy reform (which is likewise reflected in Congress). To date, thirty-five states have introduced, prefiled, or carried over 406 bills to expand voting access (dwarfing the 188 expansive bills that were filed in twenty-nine states as of February 3, 2020). Notably 93 such bills were introduced in New York and New Jersey.

 

With unprecedented numbers of voters casting their ballots by mail in 2020, legislators across the country have shown particular interest in absentee voting reform, with more than a quarter of voting and election bills addressing absentee voting procedures. Only seven of the forty-one states that have introduced election bills have not proposed policies to alter absentee voting procedures in some way.

 

Also in reaction to 2020, four states have proposed legislation that would modify how presidential electors are allocated, and eleven states have introduced bills to adopt the national popular vote compact.

 

[daveb]

A related news story from Associated Press: GOP lawmakers seek tougher voting rules after record turnout

One of the disturbing things they are trying to do in Arizona is to "allow lawmakers to overturn presidential election results", according to the article.

One justification/talking point for these laws is that voters have doubts about the system. Yeah, some do, because some Republicans invented doubts, stirred them up, and practiced some shady things themselves.

 

Meanwhile, T***p seems to be having a hard time keeping lawyers.

[LeChat]

26 minutes ago, daveb said:

A related news story from Associated Press: GOP lawmakers seek tougher voting rules after record turnout

One of the disturbing things they are trying to do in Arizona is to "allow lawmakers to overturn presidential election results", according to the article...Meanwhile, T***p seems to be having a hard time keeping lawyers.

I hope that doesn't pass; it sounds unconstitutional, to have the power to overrule voters.

 

"TP" ("toilet paper") sounds like a good acronym. 

 

 But, yeah; it doesn't look like TP's going away, wanting to continue to mess with politics and try to "help" elect Republicans for 2022 elections.

 

Trump Vows To Help House Republicans Win 2022 Election In McCarthy Meeting (forbes.com)

[Unleash the Echidnas]

Sounds familiar.

 

Myanmar’s military stages coup d’etat: In a series of morning raids the military arrests senior government members and declares a state of emergency.

Quote

A video broadcast on military-owned television said power was handed to Senior General Min Aung Hlaing, commander-in-chief of the armed forces, citing “huge irregularities” in November’s vote.

 

[Gentle Giant]

18 hours ago, LeChat said:

"TP" ("toilet paper") sounds like a good acronym. 

Yes. Though I’ve been reading T***p as Twerp.

[Rockblossom]

12 minutes ago, Gentle Giant said:

Yes. Though I’ve been reading T***p as Twerp.

I've been pronouncing it in my head as "Turnip"

[Unleash the Echidnas]

While I'm happy he got and shared a clue I also kind of want to facepalm that this wasn't obvious.

 

[Homer]

 

[Unleash the Echidnas]

After Record 2020 Turnout, State Republicans Weigh Making It Harder To Vote

Quote

"This unhinged set of voter suppression bills from a radical Senate Republican leadership appears intended to appease conspiracy theorists like those who stormed the Capitol last month," said Seth Bringman, spokesman for the voting rights group Fair Fight. "The bills are unnecessary by Republicans' own assessments of the 2020 election and designed to limit access and help Republicans stop losing elections in Georgia. Republicans wrote Georgia's election laws, but they were humiliated on Nov. 3 and Jan. 5, so they are seeking to silence Georgians, particularly communities of color, who exercised their power to change Georgia."

[...]

Another separate proposal by GOP Rep. Shawnna Bolick would allow the [Arizona] legislature to simply override the will of the voters by allowing legislators to overturn the certification of presidential electors by a simple majority vote at any time before the inauguration.

 

[iff]

I know I posted this before but in October, utah senator and covid-19 super spreader Mike lee tweeted "democracy was not the objective for the USA" 

 

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/oct/08/republican-us-senator-mike-lee-democracy

 

 

The last few months has shown that many others in his party agree with him

[Unleash the Echidnas]

"Those facts would not do for Defendants. So, the Defendants invented new ones."

[Fraggle Underdark]

I'm loving our anti-defamation laws right now. The Lincoln Project also recently sued Giuliani for repeatedly saying they were involved in the Jan 6th insurrection (or gave him the option of publicly apologizing and retracting his statement).

[Guest]

I see him getting acquitted.

 

His lawyers can easily dispute the fact he did mention "peacefully protest as patriots".

 

Something the left media seems to leave out. 

 

He did mention "bring hell", which contradicts his later more peaceful statement.

 

Nevertheless, I don't see him even getting slapped on the wrists and wouldn't be surprised to have him attempt a second run in 4 years. 

[Unleash the Echidnas]

 A look at one of the Authoritarian Party's bedfellows.

 

‘I Miss My Mom’: Children Of QAnon Believers Are Desperately Trying To Deradicalize Their Own Parents

Quote

[...]

r/QAnonCasualties

 

[daveb]

5 hours ago, Perspektiv said:

I see him getting acquitted.

I do, too. But not on the merits of the case. Just because there aren't enough Republicans who will vote to convict. Whatever anyone thinks of their motives. It doesn't matter how bad his lawyers are or could be. I'm not even sure any evidence would be enough. It would have to be super damning and pretty much un-ignorable.

[Guest]

11 hours ago, daveb said:

I'm not even sure any evidence would be enough. It would have to be super damning and pretty much un-ignorable.

Trump had a good point. He could literally gun down someone and essentially get away with it (early in his campaign).

 

This is no different, regardless of whether the weapon wasn't his but the message kickstarting the unfolding of events resulting in the trigger being pulled in the first place. 

 

He has created enough hatred for the left. The fact they are putting together this sappy sad story and trying to pull at heart strings, vs putting all facts on the table, including the fact he requested a peaceful protest, will make many roll their eyes even if some were on the fence due to their disgust at the unfolding events.

 

Personally, I can't stand Pelosi as much if not more than me being unable to stand Trump. 

 

This being so politically charged when lives were lost, won't help the cause.

 

[Fraggle Underdark]

3 hours ago, Perspektiv said:

 vs putting all facts on the table, including the fact he requested a peaceful protest

hah right, like he asked the insurrectionists to "stay peaceful"

 

If beating a police officer with the American flag while a mob drags him down the stairs is "peaceful" then I shudder to think what NOT peaceful looks like!

[Guest]

50 minutes ago, fragglerock said:

hah right, like he asked the insurrectionists to "stay peaceful"

 

If beating a police officer with the American flag while a mob drags him down the stairs is "peaceful" then I shudder to think what NOT peaceful looks like!

It cannot be proven legally that he got people to commit any crimes.

 

He got people on the capitol hill.

 

Any criminal activity is their choice. 

 

It cannot be proven legally, otherwise.

 

You're otherwise blaming the gun store for selling guns to a college shooter of legal age to buy guns.

 

He can easily point to the peaceful protest statement I mentioned. 

 

Democrats can try to play violins and the like, but will have a highly difficult time drumming up sympathy outside of their political circle.

 

Fact of the matter is a bunch of idiots went over the edge as is the norm for when there are politically charged protests.

 

He will never accept responsibility, and will distance himself from it as will his legal team which has a leg to stand on.

 

This isn't severe enough to break loyalties within his party as wished by Pelosi. If anything, cements it.

 

He literally walks off without even a scratch from all this, and demonizes the left even further, emboldening the moment he will fan the flames of for the next 4 years.

 

This honestly gives him free press to do what he is best at.

 

Garnering attention for himself, gaslighting detractors and getting support from his base.

[Acing It]

22 hours ago, Perspektiv said:

I see him getting acquitted.

 

His lawyers can easily dispute the fact he did mention "peacefully protest as patriots".

 

Something the left media seems to leave out. 

 

He did mention "bring hell", which contradicts his later more peaceful statement.

 

Nevertheless, I don't see him even getting slapped on the wrists and wouldn't be surprised to have him attempt a second run in 4 years. 

Putin pre-empted all this. Apparently he's untouchable now.

[Fraggle Underdark]

5 hours ago, Perspektiv said:

It cannot be proven legally that he got people to commit any crimes.

 

He got people on the capitol hill.

 

Any criminal activity is their choice.

Right, right. Which is why it's not a crime to instigate violence, because no matter what you say it's always someone's choice to act on it or not.

 

Wait never mind, incitement of a violence is a crime.

5 hours ago, Perspektiv said:

He can easily point to the peaceful protest statement I mentioned.

Sure, he can point to a single statement he made once about peaceful protest, and hope that everyone forgets about the constant lying about election fraud, the attempt to overturn the election through all legal and illegal means (among so many other things, Georgia officials are looking into his calls to officials there as a crime), or telling people to "fight like hell or you're not going to have a country anymore". He can also point at the moon, and a nearby dog.

 

5 hours ago, Perspektiv said:

Fact of the matter is a bunch of idiots went over the edge as is the norm for when there are politically charged protests.

Of course, it's pretty typical for an armed mob to overtake seats of American government, lead on by outright lies by the leader of the country, while they chant about hanging the Vice President and beat a cop to death.

5 hours ago, Perspektiv said:

This isn't severe enough to break loyalties within his party as wished by Pelosi. If anything, cements it.

Let's be clear it's not just Pelosi that wishes that. It's anyone who wants a reasonable conservative movement in the US. The party as a whole has, through malice or spinelessness, decided to go down with the Trumpian ship.

5 hours ago, Perspektiv said:

He literally walks off without even a scratch from all this, and demonizes the left even further, emboldening the moment he will fan the flames of for the next 4 years.

Nah, on the contrary this makes the Autocratic party look even worse than it already did.

5 hours ago, Perspektiv said:

This honestly gives him free press to do what he is best at.

Tweet? That'll be hard since he's permanently banned.