Master Trump Thread

[IronHamster]

1 hour ago, sithgirlix said:

I don't want to say that I liked everything Obama did (I was in high school, I didn't really pay attention to politics), and I can certainly say that after the fact I didn't like a lot of what he did. It's the reason I didn't want to vote for Hillary: she offered no change and seemed like she'd be another Obama if not worse.

However, a crappy healthcare bill is better than anything Trump has done. At least Obama took a tip-toe in the right direction. Do you remember the trainwreck that was Trump-Care? 

(Also, this isn't be deflecting with What-About-ism, this is a thread about Trump after all.)

Obamacare was the wrong direction.   Obama also raised taxes and increased regulation which were also the wrong direction.   Trump got rid of the mandate and has decreased regulation and taxes.  All good things.  

[ColeHW34]

I agree we have to get back on topic.

 

Go start a new thread if you want to talk about obama or whatever.

[IronHamster]

21 minutes ago, ben8884 said:

Anyways back on topic...

I wonder how badly the shutdown will have to be before Trump starts claiming its Pelosi's? 

Trump is the only party with proposals.  So, you would be correct to say Pelosi is the cause of the shutdown.  

[IronHamster]

53 minutes ago, The Dryad said:

Exactly, biologically I'm 60% white, but no one walking down the street is going to call me a white woman are they? 

 

Just because Obama was raised by his wealthy white family doesn't mean he hasn't experienced being black, are you honestly going to say that about a man who has black daughters and a black wife, and has racist caricatures and memes posted about him daily? Never mind the fact that he looks black, he's not white passing.

 

I can't believe I have to explain this.

 

But this was what I was thinking. 😂

 

 

When I was in school, I had a friend that was Jamaican and a friend from Zimbabwe Rhodesia, and neither were considered "black ". 

[Guest]

32 minutes ago, ben8884 said:

I wonder how badly the shutdown will have to be before Trump starts claiming its Pelosi's? 

Once the domino effect starts to make themselves felt. 

 

He only owns it if he looks good to his base. 

 

Very hard to do, if you start to hurt the airports and tourism, costing jobs you promised to bring to the US.

[ben8884]

Well, Ann Coulter turned on him so, can't be long until he starts blaming others 

[SithLord]

1 hour ago, IronHamster said:

Trump is the only party with proposals.  So, you would be correct to say Pelosi is the cause of the shutdown.  

Trump isn't a party. He's a man out for his self interests who has no interest in improving other people's lives unless it makes him profit, financially or otherwise. 

 

He is the cause of the shutdown. He's been after this wall for years and has had shifting goals for it the entire time. First he says Mexico will pay for it (even if he meant through tariffs or something, that was always impossible). Then he says it's going to be a fraction of the cost of what actual contractors say it would. Now he wants billions for it.  

 

If he had a firm goal and vision from the beginning, it wouldn't have been this bad. People could discuss differences with him like adults instead of him trying to get his base to buy fake bricks to send to his political opponents. 

 

Not to mention that people keep trying to tell him that this is a waste of time since it won't accomplish his goals anyway. It's a money drain. I thought republicans always claimed it was democrats doing the unnecessary spending. 

[Prufrock, but like, worse]

I'll give you that Dem officials are a bunch of spineless cowards whose paychecks depend on not seeing solutions that inconvenience their donors (which are the only solutions that will solve anything).

 

"No proposals" is still a vastly better place to be than "a single-minded, cruel, racist, wasteful proposal."

[Sally]

3 hours ago, ben8884 said:

Anyways back on topic...

I wonder how badly the shutdown will have to be before Trump starts claiming its Pelosi's? 

He started claiming that when it started.  

[Sally]

3 hours ago, IronHamster said:

Trump is the only party with proposals.  So, you would be correct to say Pelosi is the cause of the shutdown.  

The Democrats have put forward many proposals, both before and after they took  the House.  The Republican Senate leader would not bring them to a vote in the Senate because he said Trump wouldn't sign them.  

[njosnavelin]

1 hour ago, sithgirlix said:

Trump isn't a party. He's a man out for his self interests who has no interest in improving other people's lives unless it makes him profit, financially or otherwise.  

 

I mean he is the most powerful person in the United States and leader of the world. Of course there is are self interest that will be attached to the position. It is Washington DC and we live in a capitalist system. Money is the fluid to make Washington work.  It doesn’t matter what side of the political isle people are on. Everyone is in Washington looking out for their own self interest. You want to get an agenda done in Washington the money better be flowing to persuade.

 

Former President Obama is rather wealthy now. He isn’t living a modest life. He has absolutely profited benefited by being the President of the United States. According to opensecrets.org Nancy Pelosi is valued at $100 million. Say what you wish about President Trump profiting from his position  but everyone is in Washington. It goes with the territory.

 

I don’t care this happens because this is the system we have created for our government to work. We want to believe our leaders are in Washington for altruistic reasons; they aren’t.

[SithLord]

9 minutes ago, njosnavelin said:

I mean he is the most powerful person in the United States and leader of the world. Of course there is are self interest that will be attached to the position. It is Washington DC and we live in a capitalist system. Money is the fluid to make Washington work.  It doesn’t matter what side of the political isle people are on. Everyone is in Washington looking out for their own self interest. You want to get an agenda done in Washington the money better be flowing to persuade.

 

Former President Obama is rather wealthy now. He isn’t living a modest life. He has absolutely profited benefited by being the President of the United States. According to opensecrets.org Nancy Pelosi is valued at $100 million. Say what you wish about President Trump profiting from his position  but everyone is in Washington. It goes with the territory.

 

I don’t care this happens because this is the system we have created for our government to work. We want to believe our leaders are in Washington for altruistic reasons; they aren’t.

Of course politicians are rich. We live in an oligarchy after all. But that wasn't what I meant.

 

I meant he's been out for himself since Day 1. Since the day he was born. He's a narcissist who can't take an ounce of criticism and isn't concerned about the plight of every day Americans. 

Yes, politicians are rich and need their constituents to like them enough to be reelected and keep their jobs, but can you really say Trump is in favor of the coal workers when he supports the coal mine owners? Can you say he wants to help those who can't afford healthcare when he wanted to dismantle what little there was? Can you say he's in favor of humans continuing to live on this planet when he withdraws from the Paris Agreement?

 

He just wants his name out there. He wants to be remembered. He wants the wall to be remembered as Trump's wall. He worked on dismantling everything Obama left behind because he's petty. 

 

It's not because he's a politician. It's because he's an awful human being.

[Asexual_Goddess]

If you want to talk about Trumps ban on transgender troops in the military, click this link:https://www.asexuality.org/en/topic/181005-thoughts-on-trumps-ban-on-transgender-military-troops/?tab=comments#comment-1063166309

 

Edited January 23, 2019 by ConfusedQueer1

[The Terrible Travis]

7 hours ago, Telecaster68 said:

Those would both (I think) come under the 'least shitty option', from what I know. Not to particularly defend him, but by way of pointing out it's not a simple decision: The US needs Saudi Arabia alliance for oil and influence in the Middle East, and selling arms is all part of that deal. Plus, Saudi would still get the arms from somewhere, so the end result would be the same; and at least the US gets some income and influence by being the vendor.

  

 If he'd refused to sell arms, Saudi would've completely ignored the US and bought the arms from Russia or somewhere else, and Iran etc. would've moved in to increase the tension between Saudi and the US, probably leading to the regional situation getting even worse.

  

I don't know anything about the whistleblower stuff.

I strongly disagree. Saudi Arabia supplies only about 11% of our imported oil - it's not like we rely on them for oil. We get the vast majority of it from Canada. And I don't believe that "well, if we didn't do it, someone else would've" is a good justification for selling weapons to a massive human rights violator committing war crimes in Yemen. Rather, our selling of weapons to them makes us complicit in those human rights violations and war crimes. 

 

U.S. "influence" means nothing. Our "influence" hasn't stopped them from systematically violating the rights of women and LGBT+ people, committing war crimes in Yemen, nor murdering an American journalist. Rather, our alliance with them only serves to embolden them - because they know that they have the backing of the most powerful country/military in the world and that they can commit virtually any atrocities they want without ever having to worry about losing our support. 

[IronHamster]

Ok, sithgirlix, it is people like you that make me wonder why I ever left my world to inhabit this shithole planet.   Please google "party definition."  English is your first language and I should not have to take time teaching it to you.  

 

Only 11%?  Oh dear, you should crack open an economics book to see what an 11% disruption of any commodity would do to the world's economy, or, ours.  By the way, fuck Yemen and their Iranian backed terrorists.  Shit happens in wars, like death and destruction.  I know you don't like it, but one of my favorite parts was disemboweling the fools that thought they could take us on.  The Sauds have gotten soft and won't even do that anymore.  

[Sally]

55 minutes ago, IronHamster said:

I know you don't like it, but one of my favorite parts was disemboweling the fools that thought they could take us on.  The Sauds have gotten soft and won't even do that anymore.  

I believe they did just that with Kashoggi.  

[pickles.]

7 hours ago, The Dryad said:

Just because Obama was raised by his wealthy white family doesn't mean he hasn't experienced being black, are you honestly going to say that about a man who has black daughters and a black wife, and has racist caricatures and memes posted about him daily? Never mind the fact that he looks black, he's not white passing.

 

I can't believe I have to explain this.

Word.

[Skycaptain]

A public disemboweling of the fool in the White House would greatly enhance the United States standing in the world at the moment. Making policies based on xenophobia and institutional racism ultimately helps nobody. Previously most of the West was dependent on the USA as an export market, but now there's China instead 

[Prufrock, but like, worse]

47 minutes ago, Skycaptain said:

A public disemboweling of the fool in the White House would greatly enhance the United States standing in the world at the moment. Making policies based on xenophobia and institutional racism ultimately helps nobody. Previously most of the West was dependent on the USA as an export market, but now there's China instead 

But how can you disembowel someone who is 100% bowel?

 

11 minutes ago, Telecaster68 said:

And as IH points out, 11% of the US's oil is a lot of oil and not easily replaced especially when the government is reducing support for green energy, as it is now. 

That's true, the US's hand is being forced by energy policy, a circumstance that it has absolutely no control over.

[IronHamster]

5 hours ago, Sally said:

I believe they did just that with Kashoggi.  

They only cut him up for easier transportation.   Kashoggi was a terrorist sympathizer.   Middle east politics get complicated, because good guys are only relatively good compared to the alternative.  In this way, it is much like Washington DC, but with differing degrees of lethality.  

[Skycaptain]

3 minutes ago, IronHamster said:

They only cut him up for easier transportation.   Kashoggi was a terrorist sympathizer.   Middle east politics get complicated, because good guys are only relatively good compared to the alternative.  In this way, it is much like Washington DC, but with differing degrees of lethality.  

The ultimate insult for a Muslim, feed the corpse to pigs 

[IronHamster]

3 hours ago, J. ALFRED PRUFROCK said:

But how can you disembowel someone who is 100% bowel?

Why not try it on yourself and let us know how it goes.  

 

 

1 minute ago, Skycaptain said:

The ultimate insult for a Muslim, feed the corpse to pigs 

He got what he had coming to him, and the sandals on his feet in hell are so hot they make his brain boil.  

[Prufrock, but like, worse]

7 hours ago, Telecaster68 said:

Some control, but not complete control. He can't control OPEC prices for example.

 

Again, it's easy to oversimplify for a rhetorical flourish. Campaign in poetry, govern in prose. Life is more complicated when actual real decisions are involved.

Is it though? We're smoothing over some details, sure. But the counterarguments you've brought up are fairly weak.

 

IMO it's more a logistical problem than anything else. It's definitely not feasible to just cut oil usage by 11% instantly. The fact that it isn't even a goal, however, is worthy of criticism, especially when the resources are already there. And double especially since it's clear we have to cut usage by just about 100% in a very short timespan or we're toast.

 

What is the actual tradeoff with decommissioning some aircraft carriers? We burn less fuel, waste less money, and pollute less in exchange for having less capacity for murder? Brilliant. That's objectively a win-win.

[The Dryad]

Donald Trump's birther movement is affecting Kamala Harris now....🙄

 

Maybe this is just the new thing affecting black people? Instead of, "go back to Africa" it's "prove you were born here"..😒

 

I wonder how long it will be before Donald Trump has "proof" Kamala Harris wasn't born here hmm?

 

https://mobile.twitter.com/JacobAWohl/status/1087736259517108224

 

https://mobile.twitter.com/Guruleaks1/status/913055706865180673

 

https://www.theroot.com/maga-troll-reboots-birther-conspiracy-for-kamala-harris-1831964970/amp

 

https://www.newsweek.com/ana-navarro-cnn-blasts-jacob-wohl-conspiracy-kamala-harris-birther-1300573

 

Edited January 23, 2019 by The Dryad

[The Terrible Travis]

14 hours ago, Telecaster68 said:

Well, you disagree with his decision, but it's not a cut and dried 'selling arms is bad end of story' argument. There's pros and cons whatever you do. That was my point. 

 

[Gentle Giant]

19 hours ago, The Dryad said:

Donald Trump's birther movement is affecting Kamala Harris now....🙄

 

Maybe this is just the new thing affecting black people? Instead of, "go back to Africa" it's "prove you were born here"..😒

 

I wonder how long it will be before Donald Trump has "proof" Kamala Harris wasn't born here hmm?

 

https://mobile.twitter.com/JacobAWohl/status/1087736259517108224

 

https://mobile.twitter.com/Guruleaks1/status/913055706865180673

 

https://www.theroot.com/maga-troll-reboots-birther-conspiracy-for-kamala-harris-1831964970/amp

 

https://www.newsweek.com/ana-navarro-cnn-blasts-jacob-wohl-conspiracy-kamala-harris-birther-1300573

 

Oh no, not that birther crap again!  I’ve been seeing Kamala doing interviews and she impresses me. She’s going to have a televised town hall meeting next Monday on CNN. I’m planning to watch it.

[Tabula Rasa]

19 hours ago, The Dryad said:

Donald Trump's birther movement is affecting Kamala Harris now....🙄

 

Maybe this is just the new thing affecting black people? Instead of, "go back to Africa" it's "prove you were born here"..😒

 

 

That’s what it is. It’s “Make America White Again” as if it was.

[Tabula Rasa]

So as some of you know, I interpret phone calls for the hearing impaired. Whenever I get a call that involves people talking about their support for Trump, the conversation inevitably degenerates to racism.

 

Today I got a call in which the people who support Trump said it’s all because of minorities that the country is going to ruins, and they even talked about assassinating Kamala Harris, and there hasn’t even been a presidential nomination yet.

 

I get calls like this about once or twice a week, and I’ve been interpreting private phone calls for about two years. Also I am one out of over 400 employees, So that gives you an idea of how much Trump has kindled resentment of people of color and how widespread it is becoming..

[Gentle Giant]

@The Bookworm That is terrible! Especially talking about assassinating Kamala Harris! 

[The Dryad]

@The Bookworm I'm truly not surprised because I remember how much resentment Obama's election caused, even as I was in middle school, I remember some of the racist things that were spouted.

 

Trump gives racism an "okay" pass, for people who resent "PC" culture, aka "being a decent human being", and he glorifies white exceptionalism instead of a global attitude....but if we're truly bring honest with ourselves, Trump didn't make America this way, America made Trump and his supporters this way, especially with Steve King's comments on white supremacy in the past representing how many white people feel- because they're represented in history books they feel exceptional... because history tells them so, but if history were honest you would see the slaves who invented things that were patented by their masters, the free black businessmen and politicians, Mexicans, Chinese, and women in general who were ignored by American history to create a.... certain narrative.

 

 

I honestly feel like everyone needs to be re-educated.