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skullery

Wanting To Have Sexual Intercourse For The Purpose of Having A Baby Is Still Sexual Desire

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Float On

Desiring sex != sexual desire, if that hasn't been made clear already.

it just hasn't, unfortunately. a lot of AVENites think they are the same!

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Float On

This has probably been said a million times, but...

A desire for sex is getting sad or upset when sex is absent from your life (simplified, opnions will differ).

A desire for children is getting upset when you will not have children.

A desire for sex to satisfy the desire to have children is getting upset when you cannot have children through standard sex and need another method.

If you do not mind using another method to get pregnant, but simply choose having sexual intercourse because it may be easier or less scary in any way, then that is a preference, not a desire. Because in the end, if you had to do it through other methods, you will not be upset if the intercourse has not been part of getting pregnant.

agreed. but do note please, that these are all examples, and not every single case.

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Telecaster68

"Desiring sex != sexual desire"

Well, not on AVEN.

Tell me again, why is it that many people don't take asexuals seriously?

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Philip027

Well, the person who said that isn't actually asexual, so I dunno.

I found the statement odd, myself.

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Snao Cone

"Desiring sex != sexual desire"

Well, not on AVEN.

Tell me again, why is it that many people don't take asexuals seriously?

Because we talk about sex too much? (I mean, how else would we get to the point where we'd need to distinguish such technicalities?)

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Telecaster68

I thought the rest of the world was uncomfortably saturated by sex?

Actually it's more AVEN than asexuals i suppose. Like any forum, it's a self selecting community of people analysing something to death (hence differentiating sexual desire from desiring sex, enjoying sex from finding sex enjoyable, finding someone attractive from being attracted to them, etc).

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Sally

I thought the rest of the world was uncomfortably saturated by sex?

Actually it's more AVEN than asexuals i suppose. Like any forum, it's a self selecting community of people analysing something to death (hence differentiating sexual desire from desiring sex, enjoying sex from finding sex enjoyable, finding someone attractive from being attracted to them, etc).

Not all of us. There's no entrance test for asexuals to get into AVEN.

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Telecaster68

Sorry, I forgot the requisite qualifier.

AVEN could do with a script that detected all nouns in every post and automatically inserted 'some' in front of them.

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Tarfeather

Better yet, Telecaster, spend more time talking and giving credit to the exceptions, rather than only focusing on the majority. There's so much more to learn from people who don't fit within the norm.

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Telecaster68

I agree. But people who want to be accepted by the norm need to start by understanding how the norm sees them.

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Snao Cone

I thought the rest of the world was uncomfortably saturated by sex?

A lot of people on AVEN seem to think this is the case, but they also assume that the prominence of sex in popular culture reflects the amount of sex people have in real life...

There's a scene in an episode of The Simpsons where Marge is staying at her sisters' place for the night. They're having a girls' night and watching their world's version of Sex and the City thats just four women saying "I had so much sex last night." Patty and Selma say "Wow, it's like they took our lives and put it in a TV show" even though that is notably not the case.

People who come to AVEN without much life experience may assume that sex is as prominent as such entertainment would say. People with more life experience, sexual or asexual, may have more knowledge to go by.

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m4rble

"Desiring sex != sexual desire"

Well, not on AVEN.

Tell me again, why is it that many people don't take asexuals seriously?

Because we talk about sex too much? (I mean, how else would we get to the point where we'd need to distinguish such technicalities?)

There's a lot of talk about sex on Aven, but it's mostly done in order to form categories and to satisfy semantic and scientific curiosity, rather than in order to necessarily apply it or satisfy sexual needs.

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Snao Cone

That's why I like talking about sex so much more on AVEN than anywhere else :D

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m4rble

That's why I like talking about sex so much more on AVEN than anywhere else :D

I'll admit I took the "apply it" part of my response from you. I don't think the way Aven talks about sex is similar to very many places on the internet. It's likely much more analytical, for one thing.

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Sally

That's why I like talking about sex so much more on AVEN than anywhere else :D

I'll admit I took the "apply it" part of my response from you. I don't think the way Aven talks about sex is similar to very many places on the internet. It's likely much more analytical, for one thing.

Probably because most of us are not slavering at the thought of it. ^_^

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Telecaster68
I'll admit I took the "apply it" part of my response from you. I don't think the way Aven talks about sex is similar to very many places on the internet. It's likely much more analytical, for one thing.

Analytical? Speculative, more like.

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m4rble
I'll admit I took the "apply it" part of my response from you. I don't think the way Aven talks about sex is similar to very many places on the internet. It's likely much more analytical, for one thing.

Analytical? Speculative, more like.

Analytical in the sense that people want to analyze it, that doesn't necessarily mean they have the means to do so.

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Nidwin

Isn't sexual desire an urban legend, in most cases?

The fact desiring sex for the sake of having sex.

Aren't peeps sexually intimate for reason x,y,z and not for the sake of having sex?

Tele often says that what he really misses is that bond, that feeling of sharing something special, that he had back then with his wife.

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Telecaster68

I do, but the desire for sex just because you want sex exists too.

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skullery

Isn't sexual desire an urban legend, in most cases?

The fact desiring sex for the sake of having sex.

Aren't peeps sexually intimate for reason x,y,z and not for the sake of having sex?

Tele often says that what he really misses is that bond, that feeling of sharing something special, that he had back then with his wife.

I'm not sure about "most cases", but the desire for random sex for the sake of it is not prevalent in, probably, most-ish people? I'm not sure... I have the desire for sex for the sake of having sex, but that's not something everyone understands. And honestly, it's still mostly for the stories/ experience/ risk taking of it all and probably less for the actual sex.

So... you may be onto something here...

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Homer

I have the desire for sex for the sake of having sex, but that's not something everyone understands.

In that case, how much does the other person matter? Like, how they feel, what they like, maybe even who they are? (No idea how to express this differently AND getting my question across - I don't want to sound harsh by any means.)

I already hate myself for derailing this thread.

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Telecaster68

Sex for the sake of having sex doesn't mean a random partner. It just means that what you want from sex *that time* is just a damn good seeing to rather than a profound emotional bonding, and if you're in a relationship it'll probably be with your partner.

Not every fuck is in itself a deep bonding experience, but knowing that there's an extra channel to the relationship which is unique to the two of you, is bonding. It's a shared exclusivity. That's why polyamory doesn't work for a lot of people I guess - it removes the specialness of the primary relationship.

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Telecaster68

I have the desire for sex for the sake of having sex, but that's not something everyone understands.

In that case, how much does the other person matter? Like, how they feel, what they like, maybe even who they are? (No idea how to express this differently AND getting my question across - I don't want to sound harsh by any means.)

I already hate myself for derailing this thread.

You mean how much does what they're like matter?

If you're looking for a one night stand (which is essentially what we're talking about), as long as you're both up for it and the mutual attraction is enough to last the night, not much to be honest. Nobody's looking for anything profound, it's pretty much recreational.

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Float On

don't asexuals have that exact same thing but with masturbation? I honestly don't see it as different. I mean it is obvious that one is solo and the other is partnered - but think about it. if both is a drive to get off, or get pleasure, or whatever, and the asexual likes masturbation, why would they want sex? and the sexual likes sex, why would they want masturbation? it's circular logic to say that wanting sex for the sake of having sex is different from wanting to masturbate for the sake of masturbation. in the end it is the same drive - the memory of something being good, and wanting to do it again.

when I see Tele or other sexual people say they misses the bond. I can't compare that to asexuality with masturbation in any way. to me, his desire for that bond is much more notable of a difference then the silly factoid that people who like masturbation like masturbation and people who like sex like sex.

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skullery

I have the desire for sex for the sake of having sex, but that's not something everyone understands.

In that case, how much does the other person matter? Like, how they feel, what they like, maybe even who they are? (No idea how to express this differently AND getting my question across - I don't want to sound harsh by any means.)

I already hate myself for derailing this thread.

The other person barely matters at all. I've met up with my fair share of random older dudes from Craigslist Casual Encounters.

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Snao Cone

And honestly, it's still mostly for the stories/ experience/ risk taking of it all and probably less for the actual sex.

These are the only reasons I've ever been motivated to have sex with another person. For me it's never been about desiring the sensation or expressing a connection to a person in a physical way.

Linking this back to the original topic, wanting to have a baby with your partner is expressing a connection to a person in a physical way. If producing a child together is very important to a couple, there's something beyond the "I want to be your partner" connection of romantic relationships. It's also different from simply wanting a child to care for.

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skullery

If it wasn't for the fact that I continue to do it - or desire to do it - even though I've had the experiences, taken the risks, told the stories, I'd be right there with ya. Those are my reasons, but I very clearly have an underlying drive.

Whether that underlying drive is based on sexual attraction (spoiler alert: it's not) is another issue.

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Evren

I agree. But people who want to be accepted by the norm need to start by understanding how the norm sees them.

I have no desire to be accepted by the norm ever. I have the desire to have a job and home and some people who like me, the norm can never accept me for all I care.

Skullery: I want to have sex at some point, to see what it's like. I'm curious, even though I have no desire to go out and really have it, if that makes sense. For example in a world where people never had sex, I would never have any desire to have sex, but people have told me it's fun and enjoyable so I want to try it. Like skydiving, except if you gave me the choice between the two, I would pick skydiving (it's expensive :D) I have absolutely no idea how I will arrange this, because going bar hopping and telling a random someone that I am a virgin and just want to have sex for the experience, seems odd. I just wondered if you would classify me as a sexual because of that? I have no problem either way, just curious.

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Del1201

There are many people who would have sex with their partner to make them happy while they themselves still don't feel like it's even a thing. Do you consider that sexual "desire"? Because desire is something that will be with you regardless of situation. You would desire to have sex even if it was not for baby were you a sexual. But asexuals that want baby and to whom sex is nothing different from a boring movie or sumthin like that, they may not mind having sex cuz hey, they want the babies but having sex wont kill them either so they may just feel like yeah, what's wrong with having sex? let's do it. meh. that sorta thing.

So no, it's very illogical to consider that asexuals who have sex are not asexual. Because there could be any number of reasons why they're having it. Or maybe no reason at all. Because though some of us are sex repulsed, lot of us are just sex-meh. Having sex neither pleases them nor makes them unhappy. It's just meh. Like cooking food. You don't have to want or "desire" to cook food in order to cook. Sometime it's just pain in the ass necessity. You could cook because you're hungry or someone else is. Doesn't mean you have to like it or want to do it in order to do it.

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Bezzy-Loo

I love being in new places, and I like having new homes, new spaces to fill. But I hate packing and unpacking. They are merely required to achieve the purpose.

Same here. Wanting sex for the sake of a child isn't an interest in the act of sex, it's simply using it as a means to an end. It's not the sex that is desired, or really even the orgasm, only the final end product.

I'd discourage further attempts to start debates while high. ^^; Wait until you've had time to consider the idea while sober, first.

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