Yet another "my girlfriend is asexual" topic #n

[Tarfeather]

I'd like to say that I was very surprised, if not creeped out, to find threads on this subforum similar to this one. I don't mean that in a negative way toward the people here, I just didn't expect this seemingly unique situation between me and my girlfriend to be a "common trope".

That said, talking to people with similar experiences might be very helpful to us, and the posts I've read so far seemed very mature and reasoned compared to other "love and sexuality" discussion sites I've found.

Thus I'm glad to have found this place, and I feel encouraged to talk about my situation. Note that I'll be sharing a lot of personal details - This is okay for both me and my girlfriend, as long as we retain our anonimity.

What my girlfriend is like
Saying my girlfriend is "asexual" isn't really all that helpful, as that describes a very broad range of things. So let me begin my explaining the ways in which she's unusual:
1. She hasn't fallen in love with anyone thus far. She said she had a very mild crush on someone about five years ago, but that's about it.
2. She apparently has no libido of any kind. No libido, thus no masturbation, sex or other sexual activity. This is also related to a later point.
3. She is socially detached. She has had very few friends, and in the recent years none. She does have a caring family, though. Most of her social contact outside of her family has consisted of teachers and other such persons.
4. She suffers from OCD. Every day she spends over an hour washing her hands, and over half an hour showering. She avoids touching things that she considers dirty, for example money, and once touched she needs to wash again.
5. So far she has also avoided touching people. I have turned into an exception there, as she considers it okay to hug and kiss(to an extent).

While not all these are symptoms of "asexuality", they all seem to be related in one way or another. Particularly, her fear of getting "dirty" seems to be at least one of the causes for her avoiding touch/sexuality.

How we came to be together

As for myself, I have(or had) my own mental issues. In my teens, constant rejection and sexual frustration(related to social phobia) led to a deeply seated feeling of being inferior, which I wasn't able to deal with for many years. Like she, I'm actually a virgin(we're both in our mid-twenties), but for different reasons.

Over the past year, I've been "dealing" with a few things, and managed to greatly improve my feeling of self-worth and confidence. This is what allowed me to approach her. She is actually the first woman I've ever approached in real life, and I am the first man who ever approached her. Our personalities, abnormalities and interests are very compatible, it kinda "clicked". In turn, having a beautiful woman like her not reject me, having her tell me that she wants to be in a relationship with me.. well, it sort of cured me.

In other words, there are some pretty significant reasons for me to love her, which are not related to sex, which explains my posting here. In fact, you could even go as far as saying that her "asexuality" is one of the reasons we got so close to begin with. It's only now that it's making things more difficult between us.

The issue of sexuality
I have a rather strong libido. I can confirm this by recalling my many sexual fantasies before even entering puberty, as well as pointing out that ever since puberty I masturbate.. a lot. My lack of sexual encounters thus far has not been a lack of willingness, but a lack of ability, and this in turn led to aforementioned depression, which I couldn't get over for many years.

With that in mind, I do wish to experience more intimacy with her. An easy mistake here would be to try and deny my desires, as I've done in the past when I tried to be "friends" with a woman. That doesn't work in my experience, and would be the fastest way to destroy the relationship.

On the other hand, though, I've lived many years without sex, and I can't say it's killing me. I believe the more important question is that of feeling valued. Whether it's biological, cultural, psychological, I'm not sure, but I have a desire to be valued by a woman, to put it naively, to be worth having babies with. Objectively, this doesn't mean much, but I think it's something anchored very deeply in my psyche.

These past months have been the happiest of my life, and we've never had sex. I think I can continue this. But saying "We'll never have intimacy, let's give it up", that would still make me unhappy. I don't want to give up pursuing intimacy with her, I don't want her to give up on it, because frankly, it would make me feel like I don't matter.

Is that a stance I can keep? Or is it, ultimately, expecting too much? I don't want to make her feel bad, but I can't make myself feel bad continuously either. Despite our relationship working well in the present, this issue makes me uncomfortable.

[Guest]

Bring them up with her. That is all I can say

[Bad_Mr_Tree]

I'm glad you have come across this resource, I'm sure many of the other forum members, many much more versed and experienced in their understandings of their sexuality and related aspects of their relationship, can give you bits of advice to help you on your way.

As for any advice or suggestions I can give, I think it is invaluable that you have reached this level of understanding so early in your relationship, it gives you a place to build from so I have a lot of hope that you will be successful in finding a way that makes things work, and work great at that.

I've always understood that intimacy can be manifest and nurtured in different ways in different spheres of life: emotional, physical and intellectual to name a few pertinent to myself. And along with intimacy comes the feeling of being valued. Regardless of ones orientation, it is very important for the people involved to explore what makes them feel valued. If the only thing that makes you feel valued in a relationship is a high degree of physical intimacy, i.e. intercourse or other activities that she feels she has no need of, then it will be a very hard road ahead if not impossible.

From the relationship as you've described it, it seems that you feel valued or affirmed in other ways. I suggest exploring these ways that may be common to you both first to the fullest. In doing so you may find your intimacy needs met without taking on the additional burden of mismatched expectations and experiences, and the feelings that often arise in such situations when one partner is trying and it is still insufficient in bringing about an improvement jointly felt by both persons.

It sounds if you are already compromising and this is great. I've found that compromise is the key to any relationship, but it also has to be mixed with a high degree of intimacy for it to work. If you are compromising and feel like you are unable to sustain or further your intimacy with your partner, this compromise will quickly turn into resentment. What you felt was a worthy sacrifice before will soon feel like an unjust expectation. It is best to discuss the compromise and to renegotiate it if you feelings towards it change. Resentment, like envy, is a toxic substance for relationships and should be dealt with as promptly as possible to avoid weakening other aspects of the relationship.

I can't think of anything else to share with you at the moment, but I wish the two of you luck on your shared journey.

take care,

!k

[Blinkin]

Hello Tarfeather and welcome to Aven!

I see your struggles and will try to help you where I can as outsider.

First of all: the 5 points you wrote down don't necessarily have anything to do with asexuality. You said "While not all these are symptoms of "asexuality", they all seem to be related in one way or another. Particularly, her fear of getting "dirty" seems to be at least one of the causes for her avoiding touch/sexuality." Can you explain why you think these might be symptons of asexuality? Becasue to me they can apply to allo-sexuals (all other non-asexual orientations) too.

Note: I'm not saying that those thing aren't asexual related, you're true about that. But they aren't necessarily connected to asexuality.

But lets put that aside. You're here for some sharing of tought and maybe some advice right? Well I totally agree with K.Tree that it's invaluable reaching this level of understanding so early. Communication is very important in every kind of relation. I also think that it's really good that you're trying to care for her as well as caring for yourself. Your looking for what's good for both of you which is something really good (and something you don't always see). :D

Compromises are a great way to deal 'problems' in relations and I think you're heading in the right direction. As long as the compromises come from both persons and don't go far outside each others comfortzone.

I don't really know what 'new' advice to give you. If you would lie to know more about the asexual umbrella let us know.

One more thing: "She hasn't fallen in love with anyone thus far. She said she had a very mild crush on someone about five years ago, but that's about it.". This might actually have something to do with romantic attraction. Although it's up to her if she recognises somerthing about it. You can read about it here: http://www.asexuality.org/wiki/index.php?title=Romantic_orientation

All the best,

Blinkin

[Tarfeather]

Thanks for your reply, k.tree. It was a very interesting read. I agree to most of the things you've said, so I will not comment, except on the one point where I slightly disagree:

I've always understood that intimacy can be manifest and nurtured in different ways in different spheres of life: emotional, physical and intellectual to name a few pertinent to myself.

What you say here makes sense to me, but I think this is more a result of bad wording. When I said "intimacy", I should really have said "sexuality". There are other kinds of intimacy, but the line can easily be blurred between the romantic kind and the kind experienced by friends. For instance, if the relationship were purely intellectual, I would not consider it more than a friendship.

In other words, yes, "intimacy" of many kinds can help sustain a relationship, but in itself will not be a substitute or compensation for those things unique to a romantic/sexual relationship.

First of all: the 5 points you wrote down don't necessarily have anything to do with asexuality.

Yes, four of those points are not necessarily an indicator of asexuality, they're just related. In fact, OCD is a separate cause for avoiding physical contact, so that point actually makes it less likely that she is asexual(because she might be avoiding contact because of that, not due to sexual orientation).

We haven't concluded with certainty that she is asexual, if indeed that is a binary state. We just know that, as I've pointed out, she doesn't have much of a libido.

Regarding romantic orientation, I have difficulty understanding this. There seem to be very many distinctions here, and I'm not sure they're not simply artificial. I can identify "falling in love" by certain hormonal reactions, but wouldn't being asexual entail not having those hormonal reactions? If so, what is the distinction between crush/squish/friendship?

[Guest]

Regarding romantic orientation, I have difficulty understanding this. There seem to be very many distinctions here, and I'm not sure they're not simply artificial. I can identify "falling in love" by certain hormonal reactions, but wouldn't being asexual entail not having those hormonal reactions? If so, what is the distinction between crush/squish/friendship?

*blinks* Why would being asexual stop us from falling in love? Love is not wanting to have sex with someone. Even limerence, which is what media often describes as love, does not require sex. Hormones are perfectly normal within an asexual person, some may have imbalances, but some sexuals do as well. Some aces have crushes quite often, some rarely, just like with sexuals. It varies.

I love my mom, I love my friends, but it's very different from how I love my partner. Some of us are quite romantic and save for sex, everything else about a romantic relationship is very "normal". I have a specific feeling when interacting with my partner that I do not with anyone else. I also have urges to kiss/cuddle etc with him and I do not have those with other people. Some people don't need the physical affection though to feel the romantic love feeling, which is separate from friendship/family feeling.

Now, some asexuals are also aromantic, which means the romantic attraction and sexual attraction does not exist.

It sounds like you think sex is an important and needed part of a romantic relationship, even if it's a very small part. Many people feel this way and it's OK. But, she needs to know how you feel. It's quite possible she may want to never have sex (repulsion is highly likely given her hygiene issues), it's also possible she may agree to have it but not enjoy/want it beyond just to please you - which likely won't make you feel "wanted" sexually, I know I am incapable of making someone feel that way, because the passion is truly not there for it. Be prepared for how you would react to each of those. It's also possible she may be grey-a or something, in which case she may want it also, eventually/occasionally. You can't know without discussing it.

Now, if your interest is truly that she may want to have KIDS one day with you ... well, that's different than sex. Some asexuals, even those repulsed, may be willing to go through with sex for child bearing if they want kids. Again, discuss it. But, figure out exactly WHAT YOU WANT first.

Do you need mutual passion for sex, to feel wanted, for her to initiate? Do you just want to one day have kids together? Do you just want to experience sex one time? What exactly is it you want from her?

If she can't have sex would that be a deal breaker? If she can, but can't make you feel wanted that way would it be a deal breaker (common issue with asexual/sexual relationships, since lack of mutual attraction/desire makes sex less pleasurable for many)? Is it intercourse only you need, or if she was comfortable with some other sexual acts would that be enough?

Personal experience:

I have no libido or sexual attraction. What sex means for me in that case is it's a chore. I do it for my partner and run song lyrics or chore lists through my head. Not trying to make you feel worse, but honestly that is all sex is for me. Something he needs from me to feel connected and content. It isn't pleasurable, it isn't fun, it isn't bonding. But, it isn't painful (usually, sometimes it can be physically painful) or trauma inducing. It really is just like watching a 30m-1hour TV show I don't particularly like because it's his favorite. I have fluid repulsion, so he has to handle his own erm, fluids and keep them away from me though or put up with me going "Ew, ew, ew, ew" and running to the bathroom to scrub myself clean. :lol:

Now, your girl may feel differently. She could enjoy it. She could even enjoy orgasms and such. We don't know. Only she will. But, I gave you my experience just to give an example of something to consider when deciding what it is you want from her and what scenario would make you happy in the future. If it is only mutual connection, attraction and desire for sex, it could possibly be a major problem between you two.

Now, lack of connection during sex doesn't mean we lack connection. We just have a different "love language" of sorts to most. Many people need sex to concrete the bond between romantic partners. That part isn't needed in an asexual relationship, we connect at different levels.. but it can still be a very strong connection and we can still love just as deeply as anyone. We can still value our partners, still desire them in every way possible to us. So, not wanting sex doesn't mean you aren't wanted. Only you can decide if that is enough though, or if you need that extra being wanted sexually.

[flesh-pocket]

I can identify "falling in love" by certain hormonal reactions, but wouldn't being asexual entail not having those hormonal reactions? If so, what is the distinction between crush/squish/friendship?

trying to sort out which hormones cause what intangible feeling is a messy business. Lables like "asexual," "aromantic," or even "homosexual" are less about the physical responses to certain stimuli than they are tools us humans use to sort our feelings into neat little boxes that make sense.

asexuals can love people, romantic asexuals can fall in love with all the same lovey-dovey serotonin-y feelings, we just don't include the sex as part of that. and aromantics who will never "fall in love" with a partner can still love too, they love their families, their friends. theres been no scientific study on asexuals to see if their hormones are firing differently when they see their partners, or porn or what-have-you. and it wouldn't prove anything if there was because trying to diagnose sexual orientation with a doctors note is a slippery slope to go down. for awhile homosexuality was considered a mental disorder, and it was and still a long fight for them to be seen as just another normal aspect of human variation.

a squish is what we call wanting to be friends with someone, "this person is really cool! i wish we could hang out all the time!" im sure many sexuals experience this also, just dont use a single word for it

while with a crush you'er maybe seeing the white picket fence and 2.5 children with them, or wanting to show your brand of love to them: kiss 'em, hold hands, maybe buy them gifts (among other things), and for sexuals, also have sex with them

not everyone on the asexual/aromantic spectrum does see the definite line between between romantic and platonic love, and so we have yet more words for things like a queer-platonic relationship. Ay carumba!

for instance, im female and consider myself gray/asexual, but unlike your girlfriend i have a strong libido, started masturbating wayyyyy before puberty, fantasies and all. but also never so much as been on a date or had a solid crush. i am a bit younger than you, only 20, but i see no dating in my immediate future and sincerely hope that i never have to have sex and im not cut up about it

Her OCD could be related to it, and if shes been formally diagnosed i assume she is being treated? i dont know anything about this but if you want to know for sure if her aversion to sex is purely germ-based dealing with that would be your best bet. however, if she says shes never had a libido, or never wanted to have sex with anyone, i wouldnt expect making sex not a dirty act to make her want to do something shes never felt the need to.

you say she is able to hug and kiss you to some extent already though, so in the mean time all you can do is talk to her about what she feels shes comfortable with, and how you need to feel valued and what that means to you

i wish you both the best!

[Guest]

you don't need to give up on intimacy, and you don't need to have sex to have intimacy!

intimacy can be any number of things, none of which have to involve the removal of both of your underwear :)

My asexual partner and I are deeply intimate, very romantic, and very sensual with each other, we even get very kinky, we just never have sex..

a sensual romantic asexual relationship pretty much looks exactly like a regular healthy sexual romantic relationship, but without actual penetrative sex or oral or anything like that. stil deeply intimate, just minus sexual intercourse :)

I can honestly say I am more emotionally satisfied, feel more loved and respected and.. just.. Happier.. than I ever felt in my previous 5 year long sexual relationship in which I had sex almost every single day (i never wanted it, but believed it was a 'requirement' and because my ex wanted it, I had to give it.. that was before I knew asexuality existed) .

sex is certainly not the be all and end all of intimacy and if one or both partners aren't into it, sex can under some circumstances create a rift as opposed to enhancing intimacy.

From what you have said, I think it sounds like in the future you and your girlfriend could (as you have said she is open to kissing and cuddling) potentially become deeply intimate and sensual with no need for sex at all. and, truthfully, as others have pointed out, she may not even be asexual.. so.. with plenty of communication and caring and understanding, who knows, maybe one day it'll happen for the two of you on its own!

anyway, all the other answers are great and said everything that needs to be said, I just thought I'd add my two cents as well :)

good luck with your relationship!

[Blinkin]

Regarding romantic orientation, I have difficulty understanding this. There seem to be very many distinctions here, and I'm not sure they're not simply artificial. I can identify "falling in love" by certain hormonal reactions, but wouldn't being asexual entail not having those hormonal reactions? If so, what is the distinction between crush/squish/friendship?

I actually was expecting this reaction but please don't take it personal. :P

I could write a whole story to explain why this thought makes me do: O.o But Serran already explained it very well so I'm letting you know i think the same about it.

I've had a crash on two people in my life and the thought about wanting sex was simply never ever involved. In fact I just recently discovered that sexuals do have this feeling/wanting and see it as part of love. I kinda understand it but it's hard because I see sex and love as two different things that seem to go well together.

And I can't really draw a distinct line between crush/squish/friendship, I know there are some differences but they seem to overlap for me. I can cuddle with friends although some people say they only cuddle with their partner. For me there's not really a clear distinction. How do you see this for yourself?

[Tarfeather]

Sorry for not replying, I've read most of the replies yesterday, but I wasn't sure what to say.

It seems I might have a prejudiced understanding of what "asexual" means. I'm pretty sure though that my girlfriend matches the definition I had in mind, though I'll be wanting to talk to her about that in more detail.

I never did say I was only interested in sex, to me that is only one type of sexuality. I can't even say for sure that I'd enjoy penetrative sex, quite possibly I wouldn't. But yes, there are other kinds of physical intimacies, some of which that aren't traditional sex, yet involve genitalia, others that don't involve genitalia at all. I'm not sure whether my girlfriend would enjoy any of them.

One thing I didn't mention: One time I had her over at my place, she explained that she didn't really enjoy kissing if it's too.. uhm.. "sexual"? That is, me kissing her many times, rather than just once or twice. She also said that me touching her e.g. below her shirt made her feel uncomfortable(though on an earlier occasion she said she enjoyed it).

I think that was related to.. well, basically the way I treated her. At that point, I was to a point "living out" my desires, assuming that if she doesn't complain, it's okay for her. That was wrong to assume, and I suspect what made her uncomfortable was that she didn't feel like she was being treated with care. So since then, I've been a lot more careful with what that.

@Blinkin: Yes, I get you, but I'm just not sure whether it's the same thing that I would describe as "in love", but that's because I do define that word purely by physical reactions. Basically, for me being "in love" is a potentially undesirable state, where certain physiological processes spin out of control and make it hard for me to live my daily life. I think somebody here mentioned "limerence", which might be a more accurate term for it(I'm not a native english speaker).

Most essentially, I can be in that state and "retarget" the feeling at whatever I wish.. like e.g. an object. So it's not even really a feeling toward a person, it's just a feeling caused by the desire for a person. It's hard for me to imagine that an asexual would experience that.

Meanwhile, I can have very strong feelings toward my male friends, and I call that "friendship". When I don't like somebody enough to feel emotionally "in touch" with them, I consider them an acquaintance. I have only about 3-4 friends. If they were to disappear, I would feel very lonely indeed, and it would be something I couldn't easily replace. It's also the case that I personally wouldn't mind cuddling/kissing with some of them, but such things are pretty dangerous to bring up among "heterosexual men". =P

So, in other words, possibly I do just cover all my own "asexual", yet "romantic" kinds of feelings under "friendship" and call it a day. That would explain me not understanding the need of separate terms. Then again, given my current relationship, maybe I'll want to learn more about such distinctions.

EDIT: Also, I think I misunderstood what "libido" means, at least going by Ficto-Rex's signature. So many distinctions!

[Tarfeather]

So there are good things to report, and report them I shall.

Basically I don't want to go too much into detail about this, but our relationship had reached a pretty problematic point, for reasons unrelated to sexuality. To be precise, it was our first "quarrel" of sorts.

It led me to understand some things I hadn't been conscious about before. One of those realizations was that, despite having been in a relationship with her for months, she was still having a hard time opening up and "being close". I realized it wasn't that she didn't want proximity in general, it was just that it was hard for her to allow it.

So I made very sure to watch her face and body for how she'd react to my approaches, and avoided kissing or touching her if she didn't like it. At the same time, I didn't stop trying to be close to her.

And in 4 days, we went from "She doesn't want to allow any touch" to the closest we've ever been physically.

In fact, I'm not sure anymore she doesn't experience sexual desire, the way our bodies were in touch at that time. And no, there were no genitalia or naked skin involved. It wasn't needed.

What I took out of this is the following: It's not merely about the *amount* of physical contact. It is also about the *quality* of the contact, and synchronizing your body and sensations with that of your partner. Sexuality isn't twiddling knobs, it's experiencing someone else's body.

It's something I hadn't known, still being a virgin. It's also not something I've ever heard from those with an active sex life. So yeah, kinda had to teach myself there, good thing it didn't cost me the only relationship I'd ever wanted to keep.

[Tarfeather]

Hey guys, it's been a while.

The relationship is still thriving, so for one I'd like to thank everyone here for their replies. Knowing that I'm not alone with this kind of problem helped me quite a bit to accept the situation back then. Fortunately, by now I've mostly gotten over my self-esteem issues. That said, I'm still looking for a compromise that doesn't end up being "no sexuality beyond cuddling whatsoever".

So lately we've been talking a bit more about sexuality and that kind of thing.. And she actually told me that ages ago, before she even brought up the asexuality thing, she'd actually been (genitally) aroused when I did a certain thing to her breasts. She told me that she wasn't sure whether she liked it or not, and that she hadn't known "what to do with the energy".

Now I'm not sure what this means. From what she tells me, she hasn't been aroused by anything else. But I don't know what women would be aroused from to begin with? As a man, you can easily get aroused just from looking at somebody, let alone touching/being touched, but I don't know if this is the case for women.

Another factor in the situation she told me about was that we'd just woken up(we were sleeping in the same bed). I do remember her being a lot less reserved at that time, and actually that situation ended up with me being "on top of her"(like, in a crawling position) and me joking that this would be a pretty nice sex position. She didn't seem to mind so much at that time.

So, stuff like this makes me wonder.. How much of it is her fundamentally not enjoying sex? How much of it is her consciously deciding she doesn't want to want/enjoy sex? Hm..

[Bad_Mr_Tree]

I am the asexual in my relationship.

I have an active libido, but it almost never wants to be satisfied through partnered sex. Self pleasure and kinky fantasies work much better for me, although I generally find libido to be an irritant.

I can have sex, and enjoy it though no where near as much as my sexual partner does. For me it really feels like going for a run: enjoyable but there are numerous other things I'd rather do instead. (eat cake, watch a good film, go for a walk, go out for dinner, etc)

We once went without sex for half a year... and I felt absolutely no loss whatsoever.

[Tarfeather]

Thanks for sharing your experiences, ktree. Unfortunately, I doubt much of this applies to my girlfriend. She doesn't satisfy herself, nor does she(according to her) fantasize. Sometimes I get the feeling she doesn't even have a concept of someone being "attractive". I don't know what sex would feel like to her, but I doubt it would be "boring". Rather, her very strong aversion to it indicates that she feels strongly about it, however in a negative way.

She can go without sex without a problem, that for sure. She could also go without a relationship just fine. She doesn't seem to "need" human contact, friendship, a close family.. It seems to be in her nature that she is very stoic and can endure a lot without even noticing, but that doesn't mean she doesn't care about it.

This just goes to show that there are many things that can lead to some level of "asexuality", though I do start to wonder whether my girlfriend is unusual even by these forums' standard.

[Guest]

"So, stuff like this makes me wonder.. How much of it is her fundamentally not enjoying sex? How much of it is her consciously deciding she doesn't want to want/enjoy sex? Hm.."

(I can't quote properly on my phone, so this reply is to the above quote, plus your latest comment)

I know for me, I have a high (sometimes just average) libido ..and I can be very playful and sensually intimate with my partner and certainly get aroused etc..but I have no fundamental desire for, or any enjoyment of, partnered sex. I'm only pointing this out because I wasn't sure if you were wondering if your girlfriend was *choosing* that she doesn't want/enjoy sex because you can see she might be getting aroused etc.. well I know for me it's not a choice or a decision, I just fundamentally don't desire sex no matter how aroused I am and no amount of arousal can make me enjoy sex when I do have it. I'm not sex repulsed or body repulsed or anything, I just don't have any innate desire for partnered sex and I don't enjoy it when I do have it, and that's that. I was wondering if maybe your girlfriend would be in this category of asexuality as opposed to the "able to enjoy it if she put her mind to it" category.. I think that if it was something she thought maybe she could enjoy, she maybe would have tried already?

I also don't need human contact, a close family or anything.. I have lived in this area of the country since 2009 now and still don't know anyone by name heh.. I do leave the house etc, I just have no desire for human contact or friends or anything, and when people *do* try to befriend me (there were a couple up the road who tried to get me to have coffee with then a few times :o) I intentionally make excuses as to why I can't cone in, why I don't have time to introduce myself etc, and walk as fast as I can in the other direction.. because honestly, I not only have no desire for *friendship* contact, I just can't enjoy it when I do have it.. so I avoid it like the plague. People here often say to me (if the topic comes up) "well you must have childhood friends, everyone has those" but nope, I never made any real friendships growing up either, they were just never important to me. I do have a couple of acquaintances from school who are on my (completely inactive lol) Facebook page, but meh.. I don't think that would count as "childhood friends" they are just people I once knew(ish)

I have a couple of online 'friends', and my asexual partner lives on the opposite side of the globe from me.. I don't think I'll ever meet my online friends in real life and that's fine, meeting them just doesn't matter to me (and doesn't matter to them either). I will meet my partner someday, and am looking forward to that because I have a romantic bond to him, but I don't mind even if that takes years, I'm prepared to wait, and even if we only meet irl for say a week, I could quite happily carry on the rest of my life in this relationship without meeting him again, if it turned out we are unable to meet again due to finances or whatever.. and he is exactly the same as me, so also won't experience significant distress from not being with me in person (we are completely monogamous, we don't seek intimacy or sensual/physical contact outside our relationship because neither of us desire or enjoy those things other than with the person we are in love with)

So anyway, I'm not sure how much like your girlfriend that sounds, but when you described her lack of interest in friendships and family relationships etc, that reminded me quite strongly of my partner and I. We could also both happily go for the rest of our lives without a relationship if we hadn't met each other (here on AVEN) .. I guess some people just don't *need* other people (or animals or anything, my partner and I don't have pets and certainly don't want any lol.. I do have two children from my previous relationship but that was something outside my control and to me they don't count as pets or friends, they are just two beings I have to somehow raise to be functioning adults :P)

Does that sound like your gf (minus the children) or different?

EDIT: hopefully that didn't make me sound like a horrible parent haha.. I'm actually quite a good parent, I'm just a weirdo when it comes to friends and pets etc lol

[Tarfeather]

(Is it just me, or is it really hard to break up quotes..)

I know for me, I have a high (sometimes just average) libido ..and I can be very playful and sensually intimate with my partner and certainly get aroused etc..but I have no fundamental desire for, or any enjoyment of, partnered sex.

Maybe I should stop being lazy. When I said "sex", I was referring to any kind of act where you stimulate your partner to cause arousal. Quite frankly, I have more important things on my mind right now than worrying whether this involves jamming your penis into things.

I was wondering if maybe your girlfriend would be in this category of asexuality as opposed to the "able to enjoy it if she put her mind to it" category.. I think that if it was something she thought maybe she could enjoy, she maybe would have tried already?

Nice. I kinda disagree with your suggestion there, and by thinking about the reason I disagree, I was able to partially answer my own question, or at least to get a better idea of the situation.

Here's the thing: I already know she has good reason not to "try" anything involving genital arousal: She has OCD, her own genitals repulse her due to that whole bodily fluid business.

What I don't know is whether that's all there is to it. If she didn't have that psychological problem, how would she feel about that kind of arousal then? And it is a psychological problem, it has a history, she acknowledges it to be so, and it's something we both would like to work on in the long term.

On the other hand, I don't know how OCD would lead you to not being aroused by looking at attractive men or whatever. So it does seem that whatever the case, she wouldn't experience sexuality the way I do. Still, if there's a way I could sexually stimulate her and she'd actually enjoy it to some degree, I think I'd like that a lot.

I also don't need human contact, a close family or anything.. I have lived in this area of the country since 2009 now and still don't know anyone by name heh.. I do leave the house etc, I just have no desire for human contact or friends or anything, and when people *do* try to befriend me (there were a couple up the road who tried to get me to have coffee with then a few times :o) I intentionally make excuses as to why I can't cone in, why I don't have time to introduce myself etc, and walk as fast as I can in the other direction.. because honestly, I not only have no desire for *friendship* contact, I just can't enjoy it when I do have it.. so I avoid it like the plague. People here often say to me (if the topic comes up) "well you must have childhood friends, everyone has those" but nope, I never made any real friendships growing up either, they were just never important to me. I do have a couple of acquaintances from school who are on my (completely inactive lol) Facebook page, but meh.. I don't think that would count as "childhood friends" they are just people I once knew(ish)

Hm.. Sounds a bit generalized. Like.. do you really loathe all kinds of human contact? Or are you just bored out of your mind talking to most people? I mean, you're talking on here, so.. :P

My girlfriend is very similar. She's never had real friends in her life(except me, yay!) and focuses completely on her career. However, she has no issue talking to people, she just sees no point to it, and she'll never say anything to strangers unless it's related to achieving some goal or she's directly asked. A lot of our "getting to know" phase actually just involved sitting close to eachother without saying a word.

I have a couple of online 'friends', and my asexual partner lives on the opposite side of the globe from me.. I don't think I'll ever meet my online friends in real life and that's fine, meeting them just doesn't matter to me (and doesn't matter to them either). I will meet my partner someday, and am looking forward to that because I have a romantic bond to him, but I don't mind even if that takes years, I'm prepared to wait, and even if we only meet irl for say a week, I could quite happily carry on the rest of my life in this relationship without meeting him again, if it turned out we are unable to meet again due to finances or whatever.. and he is exactly the same as me, so also won't experience significant distress from not being with me in person (we are completely monogamous, we don't seek intimacy or sensual/physical contact outside our relationship because neither of us desire or enjoy those things other than with the person we are in love with)

And here you'd be more similar to me than her. She's not the type for "online relationships", as she's not one to just talk for the enjoyment of talking. Our relationship is very much built around enjoying eachother's physical presence(not touch, just being close to eachother).

Myself, I have at most three or so friends at a time, and most of them online. They are very important to me, though, and I'd dearly miss them if they disappeared. I've often had trouble with female friends, as the level of care, attention and trust I desired from them was something they were only used to in a relationship, when in reality, my relationships with males are just that close.

Err.. I digress.

I'm curious, though, is there a conscious reason you dislike contact to humans? My girlfriend has made some bad experiences in her childhood(it was the cause of her OCD), and at some point she pretty much decided that she didn't want to deal with people who don't respect/acknowledge her as she is. Is there something similar for you?

I do have two children from my previous relationship but that was something outside my control and to me they don't count as pets or friends, they are just two beings I have to somehow raise to be functioning adults

How do you.. outside your control..? You know what, forget I asked.

EDIT: hopefully that didn't make me sound like a horrible parent haha.. I'm actually quite a good parent, I'm just a weirdo when it comes to friends and pets etc lol

Wish my girlfriend had that kind of confidence in herself. She keeps saying she'd be a bad mother, but I think she'd be a great one. >: ( Gotta love how the media advertizes that a good mother must be X Y Z, when in reality just treating your kids in a sane and respectful way already makes you a better than average parent.

[Guest]

I can't break up quotes on my phone but manage okayish on my comp sometimes haha. As I'm on my phone, I won't be doing any quotes, but hopefully this makes some sort of sense!

Yes for me it's ANY form of stimulation of my genitals/arousal inducing stimulation etc, I don't enjoy/desire.. I should have made that clearer. Not just penis,but fingers, mouth.. anything. I have been with men and women in the past (while trying to force myself to be 'normal' - before I knew about asexuality) and no matter how aroused I am, I just have no enjoyment of having my genitals stimulated by another person (that's what I mean by 'partnered sex' .. anything involving someone else stimulating my genitals in any way) I enjoy sensual contact when in love, but all that is is kissing, holding each other close: non-sexual intimacy.. maybe a little biting if I'm feeling kinky haha.. but nothing involving my genitals or anything that is trying to make me aroused or anything, that's just.. meh. I'm not OCD like your girlfriend however (I am actually fascinated by 'adult' body fluids I think they're awesome.. haha) I just have no desire for partnered genital stimulation, and I just can't enjoy something I don't desire if that makes sense? It doesn't matter if I'm in love, or if I'm with someone (man or woman) who is extremely hot to the point of causing me arousal when I look at them, it just doesn't go beyond that.. I can look at them, feel arousal.. and that's enough. No stimulation wanted or required. Anything beyond the kissing and the cuddling (and even that I don't like unless I know and care about the person A LOT, ie my partner) I'm just.. no thanks haha. Its fine until the pants come off, then I just lose all interest and want to get on to more enjoyable things like reading a book or whatever haha. Oh and TMI: I do masturbate to orgasm etc, so my plumbing all works etc heh.. I just have no desire to share that experience with another person and don't personally enjoy the sensations of orgasm etc..they're just "meh" and I only do it to get rid of annoying hormonal arousal. Maybe your girlfriend could feel this severe "meh"ness about kissing and cuddling as well, which is why it's hard to get her to be intimate like that? (I could be totally off the mark, I'm just making random guesses here lol)

So does that make sense? If my partner was sexual,no amount of him "wanting" me to enjoy him stimulating me in any way, could make me enjoy or want it.. because I just can't enjoy or want it :P however, I agree with you that it would be hard to tell if it's just get OCD causing her not to want it, or if it goes deeper than that?

regarding my children, my ex partner was hypersexual, and required sex twice a day every day or he'd treat me like I was a freak of nature, accuse me of cheating on him etc etc.. I didn't know about asexuality then and couldn't work out *why* I couldn't enjoy the sex, so I blamed myself for his treatment of me and figured if I was more like a normal female,he'd treat me better (yes I know I was wrong to think that, but it's *extremely* confusing being an unidentified asexual, and the fact that I do have a libido just confused me even more.. if I could masturbate, *and* could enjoy other forms of intimacy like kissing and cuddling, why couldn't I want or enjoy *any* form of sex? etc etc) .. we were together for 5 years, and even though I was on birth control, when someone is having sex twice a day (minimum) every single day, well.. babies seem to be able to happen regardless (in my case anyway). So yeah, if I had known about asexuality in the first place, I would have known it was fine for me not to have sex, and so wouldnt have been forcing myself to do it, and never would have gotten pregnant.. that's what I meant by out of my control :P I know you said to forget it, but I hate not explaining myself properly haha.

And yes I seriously loath human contact haha. always have! When I was young, if my mum or dad tried to hug me, I'd always stiffen up and grit my teeth until it was over haha. (I went completely off the rails for about 6 years when I hit my late teens and realized something must be 'wrong' with me.. I became promiscuous trying to 'fix' myself, and I drank A LOT -to the point of being diagnosed alcohol dependent- to deal with all the social contact that 'self-forced promiscuity' required) . However, I have been recently researching something called schizoid personality disorder, and I really can relate to a lot of aspects of it; "total apathy towards personal relationships with other people, lives a solitary life, has a rich completely internalized fantasy world" that sort of thing. I never experienced childhood trauma or anything like that (not even repressed memories, I just know for a fact I didnt) so lol.. I guess I'm just a pretty good example of a total weirdo haha. And I talk on here because I know how *awful* it can be, being confused about ones sexuality, not knowing if there's something wrong with one or something, so I feel like because I learned so much on my personal journey, I sort of have a duty to share my opinions and knowledge etc, in the hopes of maybe helping other people even just a little? Also sometimes I just have really strong opinions and feel I need to put them out there, regardless of who reads them or whether or not they agree or disagree haha. I have one online 'friend' (other than my partner) who I talk to regularly (the other 'friend' I barely talk to ever these days because we both are so busy), but it's not emotional or anything. We just watch movies over Skype, that sort of thing.. I went for a couple of months without talking to her (at all) recently and though I felt bad for her (I felt like a bitch being so antisocial) I sometimes just *really* need to be away from people. So I'm not very good friend material if I'm to be perfectly honest heh. I dint experience any distress from having no contact at all.. I actually love the peace.

And yeah I agree with your statement about parenting.. I mean,I don't go to coffee groups with the kids etc because those are more just excuses for mums to meet up and bitch about how hard parenting is etc *shudder* but I take my kids to the nature kindergarten so they can socialize with other kids and do gardening etc. I make sure they are happy, healthy, loved and respected, and really that's what is important. Going to coffee groups, being on parenting committees and all that crap parents are *supposed* to do, that's all secondary to actually raising kids lol. I focus on the raising part and can't be bothered with the whole "socializing with other parents and being on all the parenting committies" part. I think if your kids are happy, safe and loved, that's what makes a good parent.

Aaand that was all rather off topic haha. I have a tendency to go off on long tangents, I apologize

Anyway,annoying not to be able to quote on my phone,but hopefully that made sense.

Oh and, it sounds like you and your girlfriend really love each other a lot, and you're going to a lot effort to try to understand her better etc, so that's awesome