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Asexuality in Vice


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#1 Siggy

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Posted 04 January 2013 - 06:08 PM

Asexuality: The People's Choice for People Who Don't Want Anyone

 

This article focuses a lot on identity politics especially queer inclusion stuff, which strikes me as strange since Vice is a mainstream, not queer, publication.  Judge for yourself.

 

I really like the picture of Gaia with the flag.  Gaia runs AVEN Israel.


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#2 Vyanni Krace

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Posted 04 January 2013 - 06:37 PM

I personally don't see why the asexual community and the LGBT community cant just get along. Its not like we're trying to stop them from having sex or anything-we just want to be united and to support one another in our troubles. ¬_¬


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#3 Eilera

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Posted 04 January 2013 - 06:59 PM

I had no idea that there was this whole argument going on between asexuals and the LGBT community (not everyone, of course, just the few who speak the loudest). The hypocrisy in it all just blows my mind. I don't get what the problem is with us joining in with them. We are all in the minority here, is that not enough to help support each other?

 

Its hard for people to take us seriously when they don't believe that asexuality is a real sexual orientation. They think we're just confused or "seeking attention" or in denial that we're gay or any other number of reasons that people can come up with to explain something different. Its so frustrating sometimes. 

 

I really hope that articles like these encourage more scientific research into asexuality so we can better prove that we exist (since our fairly significant community here on AVEN doesn't seem to be enough for people). In the meantime...I really wanna buy an asexual t-shirt now and wear it proudly, lol!


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#4 Vyanni Krace

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Posted 04 January 2013 - 07:43 PM

We have our own T-shirts; of course we exist! :D ...This needs to go on a t-shirt. ^_^


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It is what it is, except when it isn't, which is most of the time.

 

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#5 Aqua-ace

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Posted 04 January 2013 - 09:03 PM

Keep in mind that 'queer' and 'non-heteronormative' aren't interchangeable, and to use those interchangeably is stepping on some peoples' toes.

All asexuals are non-heteronormative, have the asexual community and are part of the larger GSM community, but 'queer' refers to a specific set of non-heteronormative people-- the LGBT. Asexuality can intersect with LGBT identities, with asexual spectrum individuals who are trans* and/or homo/bi/panromantic (or homo/bi/pan demisexual or Gray-A ) being queer. Those are individuals who could face actual homophobia (or transphobia, with the trans* aces). 'Queer' is still a slur, and that fact needs to be respected. It has only been partially reclaimed.

Integrating asexuals into the LGBT community, and how good or bad of an idea that is, is a tricky issue. Some aces can easily be integrated because they are LGBT. That's not what the dispute is about between the asexual and LGBT communities; it's whether cis-heteroromantic and cis-aromantic aces should be included since they are less likely to have shared experiences with the LGBT.

LGBT and GSM aren't interchangeable either.

From order of more to less specific: LGBT (includes LGBT aces/demis/grays) --> GSM (includes all aces/demis/grays) --> non-heteronormative.

 


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#6 Siggy

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Posted 04 January 2013 - 10:41 PM

I had no idea that there was this whole argument going on between asexuals and the LGBT community (not everyone, of course, just the few who speak the loudest).

 

The whole "argument" mostly happens in the tumblr community (and you might notice that the article quotes several tumblrs).  It's an open question whether tumblr is a window into the sorts of fights that will occur when we raise more asexual awareness, or if tumblr just amplifies this kind of argument.  Sometimes I think the more you read tumblr, the less perspective you have.


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#7 PerfectlyDarkTails

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Posted 04 January 2013 - 10:45 PM

We have our own T-shirts; of course we exist! :D ...This needs to go on a t-shirt. ^_^

We've also got :cake: an essential commodity of aceness! ;)

#8 Vyanni Krace

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Posted 04 January 2013 - 11:02 PM

I never thought I'd ever come up with a quote anywhere near t-shirt worthy of my own. Allow me this moment to grin like an idiot.


It is what it is, except when it isn't, which is most of the time.

 

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#9 Philip027

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Posted 05 January 2013 - 11:34 AM

Keep in mind that 'queer' and 'non-heteronormative' aren't interchangeable, and to use those interchangeably is stepping on some peoples' toes.

 

Is there any particular reason for this aside from (misguided) senses of entitlement?

 

Queer pretty much means "abnormal"; regardless of whatever people want to think it means, it's a fairly broad term.


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#10 Tenebre

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Posted 05 January 2013 - 02:04 PM

That's a good, but painful, article to read. What really strikes me is the hypocrisy in action in this part:

 

"...As he attempts to pass a leaflet to a scantily-clad, presumably gay man, the man tells Jay he “pities his soul"..." 

 

That sounds to me a lot like what LGBT people face(d) on a regular basis so to hear it from a presumed member of their community would really hurt.


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#11 WanderSoul

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Posted 05 January 2013 - 06:03 PM

Reading this has baffled me. To the point I'm not even really sure what I think about it. 

 

Let's first examine the word "gay". This word, initially primarily used as a synonym of "happy", "cheerful", "bright" was adopted by the homosexual community as a term of self-identification. Some people would consider this a ruining of the word "gay". You know, the homophobic bigots that feel the gay community has stolen a perfectly straight word and destroyed it. 

 

Onward! Exhibit B is the word "queer". This word is used to describe something, or someone, that is "peculiar", "strange", "abnormal". "Well that's a queer thing, isn't it?" I assume it also became a way of describing homosexuals because they ARE abnormal within a society were heterosexuality is perceived as normal. I imagined it became a derogatory term of sorts. "Stupid queer." Or maybe it is the words surrounding it or the connotation that the speaker uses that makes such an innocent word derogatory. 

 

Finally there is the word "weird". I pick this word because it is often a term people embrace happily. I find myself saying "I'm weird and proud!" But weird isn't exactly a good word to apply to oneself. At least not historically. Weird: strange - odd - peculiar - quaint - uncanny - bizarre. As I child I remember it an insult to be called weird. "You're weird!" *le gasp*

 

But it seems we have this way of taking words an twisting them into our own. And we also have a way of using derogatory terms affectionately. If you're the right person saying it to the right person. "Nigga, what's up?" <- affectionate. "You are such a flaming faggot. <3" <- affectionate. The affectionate use of the word "bitch." They're still words that can be very very very offensive. And I apologize if the examples offends anyone. 

 

In any case, if asexuals want to adopt the word "queer" and use it in a positive way that is fine. Just like I find "weird" to be complimentary to me. LGBT community does not have a right over "queer" and it is an all encompassing word to describe sexual minorities or people not blatantly heterosexual. So if you're asexy and hetero, be as queer as you'd like!

 

As for asexuals being part of the LGBT community... The politics of this make me sick. I feel that being allies, as a sexual minority and sexually-different community, is a good relationship between Asexies and LGBT. I don't really see the point in forcing the A into the LGBT, even if a large portion of the LGBT community is welcoming to that. But definitely, most definitely, we ought to have an "alliance" and support each other. We're all abnormal here. We're all struggling to understand ourselves and educate the world in tolerance. Some have it harder than others. 


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#12 Vyanni Krace

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Posted 05 January 2013 - 07:43 PM

Yeah its not like LGBT have copyright over the word 'Queer' is it? If they did that'd actually be a little bit weird. :/


It is what it is, except when it isn't, which is most of the time.

 

I would rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not.


#13 Musette

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Posted 05 January 2013 - 08:34 PM

The fact that people want to narrow down the definition of an umbrella term like 'queer' always makes me scratch my head in confusion. I actually find the "almost everybody has something queer about them" mentality to be comforting, but I think people have a knee-jerk reaction when something they claimed for themselves becomes more common. I enjoyed the article though, and it was definitely informative about a pretty frustrating issue.


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#14 23DN4L

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 12:46 AM

I don't really care about LGBT people telling me what I am and/or am not. They should know how that feels and if they take a step back and think for a bit I think they'll notice how contradictory they're being. I don't think  most LGBT people feel that way, but that could be my own naivety and I'm fine with it while I unconsciously stay away from any bigots I could encounter. 


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#15 The Lost Bear

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Posted 13 January 2013 - 11:08 PM

Wow.... I have ALWAYS been a quite vocal and open supporter of LGBT issues, so much that I would bet a large number of people think I am gay....

 

Damn....

 

I never knew this attituide existed out there, maybe because I never discuss my own lack of sexuality publically, people just assume I'm gay and that makes me "ok" for them?

 

Sigh....


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#16 WoodwindWoman

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Posted 14 January 2013 - 04:27 AM

I personally don't see why the asexual community and the LGBT community cant just get along. Its not like we're trying to stop them from having sex or anything-we just want to be united and to support one another in our troubles. ¬_¬

 

We present a much more complicated view of sexuality while they're still trying to get the public to accept simple bi, androphilia and gynephilia. I imagine they're a little peeved at us. XD

 

Also, the early movement of asexuals was pretty anti-sex, so . . . hard to shake off that impression for some people, I suppose.


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#17 ithaca

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Posted 23 January 2013 - 12:11 AM

This was translated into italian too. I think it's a good article, explains the issues with the use of the word "queer" though it seems to focus more on the LGBT side. What I don't like is the title, asexuality is not a choice, as we all know.


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